- 8 months ago
Virat Kohli stunned many in the cricketing world by announcing his immediate retirement when he was just 770 runs short of reaching the 10,000-run milestone in Test cricket. Now, the big debate is who will be India’s next Test captain. Will it be Jasprit Bumrah? Or will the baton be passed to Shubman Gill?
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00:00Rohit is gone. Virat Kohli is gone. Shammi is gone. Oh no, Shammi isn't gone. Shammi has said that he is not gone.
00:07And it is not Virat Kohli's loss that he is not playing Test Cricket. It is going to be Test Cricket's loss that Virat Kohli will not be donning the whites for India and playing the Red Chagi again.
00:15It reminded me of Sachin in his days where he used to come on an Australian tour and it was always Sachin versus the rest of the Aussie pace attack.
00:24Someone who has lost a historic Test Series at home to New Zealand and then hammered in Australia for the first time in 10 years.
00:31Gambhir should be the last person to be allowed to make decisions is what I think.
00:3420 years down the line when you want to remember Virat Kohli, I wouldn't personally remember any of his 100s, any of his double 100s.
00:41And I personally believe if you are making a Test Captain, it should either be Bumrah. If not Bumrah, it should be Panth. He is the most deserving guy. He has given you everything.
00:50The only problem is, does he hold the blessings of Khush Gambhir?
00:53No.
00:54That is the only problem.
00:55That is where it all comes down to.
01:02We are back in the Sledging Room after things have gotten back to normal with me, Saurabh and Alan.
01:08You know what, before we start this episode, I want to remember one person, Saurabh, Alan.
01:13The surprise factor might be missing because we have shot this again. We are doing this again.
01:19Like I said, it is Ayush Badoni.
01:24Who would have thought that Ayush Badoni would be Virat Kohli's last Red Ball Captain?
01:31We have seen people like Anil Kumble, Sachin Tendulkar and Saurabh Ganguly.
01:35Saurabh Ganguly in his last Test had a beautiful moment.
01:38MS Dhoni handed him the Captaincy for the last session, I think.
01:42And we won that Test against Australia.
01:45But Kohli, unfortunately, hasn't had that privilege to go out on a high.
01:52A Test career of that sort, ending with that Scott Bolan episode in Sydney.
01:59I still don't know. Will you guys be interested in watching the India Tour of England? Let me start asking that.
02:06Rohit is gone, to give a little bit of context to our viewers.
02:12Rohit is gone, Virat Kohli is gone, Shammi is gone. Oh no, Shammi isn't gone.
02:18Shammi has said that he is not gone.
02:21But the transition period that we were talking about over the last one year, one and a half years, has kind of hastened.
02:29It's kind of gone into a... It's here. We are not going to anticipate it anymore. It's here.
02:36Rohit is gone, Virat is gone. Let's keep Rohit aside for a while.
02:40Yes, like you mentioned before the start of the episode, that he is a bonafide white ball great.
02:46But in Test cricket, okay, he has retired along with Virat Kohli.
02:50And we have written pieces saying, oh, we will miss Rohit and Kohli.
02:53But that man, Virat Kohli, will you guys be interested in watching India Tour of England?
02:59If you were not working for India Today Sports, if you were probably sitting in a Dharamsala cafe
03:06with your girlfriends or with your partners, would you have still watched India Tour of England?
03:12That is starting on June 20.
03:14So, let me answer it this way, that I have been watching cricket for last 20 years.
03:19So, when I started watching cricket, my first heroes were Sachin, Dravid, Ganguly, Lakshman.
03:25So, if I am watching cricket now, when they have retired 10 years back, I will again, I will watch whatever comes.
03:33Even if Virat Kohli is not there.
03:35So, you are a fan of Indian cricket?
03:37I am a fan of cricket.
03:38Cricket.
03:39Yeah. I am a fan of cricket and I am a die-hard Indian cricket supporter.
03:42Supporter.
03:43But if you talk about Virat Kohli, it will definitely feel odd that whenever you play a Test match in England
03:52and you see that red cherry and you see those conditions and you realize, oh, no, Virat Kohli.
03:58He has retired from Test cricket. And how?
04:02I mean, this retirement, the way it came, it completely shook me.
04:07Because a day before his retirement came, there were reports coming out that he has informed BCI
04:14about his intention to retire from Test cricket.
04:17But the BCI is looking to convince him for the England Tour.
04:21And I was the man who did the copy in office.
04:23Then, day after that, I was off, I was sleeping and I get a call from Kingshuk.
04:29Did you see what happened?
04:31I am like, what happened?
04:32He is like, Virat Kohli retired.
04:34I said, come on, don't joke, let me sleep.
04:36He is like, no, Virat Kohli has retired.
04:38And then I checked the stories, I checked the tweets, I still can't believe, I still can't fathom the fact
04:43that the man who actually gave Test cricket a different purpose in this era of T20 cricket
04:49will not be playing Test cricket anymore.
04:51So, yes, I will be watching cricket, but it will be a huge, huge miss for Indian cricket, Test cricket
04:57and all the fans of Test cricket across the globe.
05:00When Virat Kohli is not there, wherever India plays.
05:02How long did it take you for writing that copy that you sent that day?
05:07So, it nearly took me around one half hour.
05:11Because for the first half an hour, I was still trying to understand, accept the fact that
05:17Virat Kohli has retired from Test cricket.
05:19And it's not just Test cricket now, Virat Kohli has retired from two different formats in last two years.
05:25So, the end might be near.
05:27So, I was very, very shaken by the fact.
05:29And I am not a Virat Kohli fan, but Virat Kohli in Test cricket, I mean, who would not like it?
05:34If you love Test cricket, if you love cricket, if you love cricket in its purest form,
05:38you will love Virat Kohli.
05:39Everything that he did, with the bat and with the field, in the field, his captaincy,
05:44India's most successful captain and everything that he did.
05:47So, it took me around one half hour and I tried to pour in every feeling that I had for him
05:52as a fan of Test cricket, as a fan of Virat Kohli in Test cricket.
05:55Anil, what about you? Will you watch or not?
05:58See, obviously, I will, like how Saurabh said, I will watch.
06:02Just to see the fact that what this Indian team is going to be.
06:06After, I have written in my pieces that these two guys were like Batman and Superman.
06:11Not always against each other, but you know, they were like, you know, those forces that was protecting this team
06:18and building up the superstars for the next generation.
06:22I remember very, you know, in I think that 2014, when he had scored 200 in one test against Australia.
06:30I was going through a very bad phase in my life at that point in time.
06:34And I was just sitting there and watching this guy go about and, you know,
06:39just genuinely fight against an Australian team, almost at times on his own.
06:44Kind of gave me, you know, made me remind, it reminded me of Sachin in his days
06:50where he used to come on an Australian tour and it was always Sachin versus the rest of the Aussie pace attack.
06:56I wrote it in my copy as well, that sometimes it felt like that.
07:00And that was the kind of thrill that Virat Kohli brought into Test cricket.
07:05And his captaincy, again, before we started the show, I said that I watched that
07:10Mohamed Siraj over to Ollie Robinson. You had 8-9 people going in England and bullying England.
07:16That was proper bullying. It was nothing like roughing them up.
07:20He was properly bullying a guy who tried to bully one of his players.
07:24So, that kind of intensity, that kind of, you know, that flavor of Test cricket was changed under Virat Kohli.
07:31So, that is something I will genuinely miss. Unless like you get a captain who is of the same, you know,
07:38vigour and the same intent, which is going to be a big task.
07:43Will you watch, Akshay?
07:45As in like, I asked that question because, you know, as in like, it's too, there have been so many flag bearers of Test cricket.
07:54In this period also, in this era of Virat, there was Rahane, there was Pujara who played a brand of cricket that made us all fall in love with Test cricket.
08:04And even Ben Stokes, Steve Smith, Joe Root. But the impact that Virat had, right, with so many Instagram followers,
08:12someone saying that, okay, I value the whites more to this generation.
08:17Had he not been there, had one Virat Kohli not been there in Test cricket, had that firebrand cricket not been there,
08:24what would have happened to Test cricket in the era of T20s?
08:29Maybe four-day Tests would have been a reality by now.
08:32Because I remember Virat himself spoke about not having, he's not a fan of four-day Tests.
08:37And time and again for someone to say that this is the ultimate format, this is the ultimate format.
08:42Because he had so much impact on not just, you know, the general public, but the cricketers who, you know, who grew up after his generation.
08:51Like someone like Ayush Badoni, whom we started with.
08:54So many people, Rehan Parag, all of them now, if you ask them, okay, IPL is okay, IPL gives me money.
09:00But I want a flavor of that whites, you know.
09:03And that beautiful headline from Indian Express, whites lose color.
09:07That was some fine, fine headline.
09:10And even Sidh Monga for the ESPN.
09:12Apart from all the other pieces that we have read and we have produced, I thought they kind of got the emotions, you know.
09:20We all, as in we need to read more, we need to listen to him more.
09:24I just hope, I just hope, as in like this is not going to happen.
09:28But I just hope that he makes this U-turn.
09:31He does a Shahid Afridi for one time and comes back and plays at least one series in England.
09:37You know, there was a couple of free series also, West Indies, Bangladesh coming.
09:41As in I am not saying, I am not disrespecting, but relatively easier series at home.
09:45You could have easily scored those 10,000.
09:47But it's not about runs and hundreds when you talk about Virat Kohli, right.
09:5120 years down the line, when you, so many people, somebody might cross 10,000.
09:56Shubman might do it, Yashashree might do it, provided they play Test cricket for that long.
10:01And provided Test cricket is a sustainable format for that long.
10:05But 20 years down the line, when you want to remember Virat Kohli, I wouldn't personally remember any of his hundreds, any of his double hundreds.
10:14Probably that, you know, that bouncer that Mitchell Johnson bowled.
10:17Right after that tragic incident of Phil Hughes.
10:20All of us thought Australia would not use the bouncer.
10:22But they, being Australia, they tested Virat.
10:25And then the way he gave it back in that series.
10:28And that Adelaide, you know, that reported conversation with MS.
10:32Without trying, how would we know?
10:34So, that 360, 360-odd chasing on the last day.
10:37Virat had given a fiery dressing room talk, it seems.
10:41That we will go for it.
10:42And then MS asked him in the team bus, on the final, as in like before the final day or something.
10:47Virat, you will be able to do that.
10:49You will be able to be one of the batters who can score 100 or 150.
10:52But do you think the entire team will be able to gel together and do it?
10:56He reportedly said that, MS, without doing, without doing, without trying it, how would we know if we will be able to do it or not?
11:04So, that set the tone.
11:06Like many people say that, okay, it started from 2016 when he started dominating the home.
11:11But the 2014 series was unforgettable for me.
11:13For many reasons, as in MS was facing out.
11:16MS gave up captaincy.
11:18And that Adelaide test told us that we are going to see a different band of cricket.
11:23After what we had seen in the last few, in the previous few years.
11:26Where we get whacked 4-0, 4-0.
11:29We will be, we will have the opposition 50 for 6.
11:32And then Brendan McCullum will score a double 100, triple 100.
11:34Those things were, you know, very difficult to watch.
11:37Had we continued in that fashion, I don't think many people would have been fans of Indian Test team at least.
11:42Not at all.
11:43Ashes would have been a big, big tournament.
11:45But that India-Australia, India-England, that fight, even in India-South Africa, very underrated rivalry.
11:51Especially when it happens in South Africa.
11:53And the 2018 tour, where India unleashed Bumrah.
11:57A lot of credit at this time should go to Ravi Shastri and his group of coaching setup also.
12:02For believing in someone like Virat.
12:04You know, not asking him to tone down.
12:06I still remember a lot of headlines at that, say, India won but Viratism needs to be reviewed and all that.
12:11In Test cricket especially.
12:13That's 2A.
12:15I just hope that there is one more chapter of Test cricket left in him.
12:19I don't know how that is possible.
12:21But, like many people are saying, even Krish Srikant, while speaking to us said,
12:26I would have made him the captain for the next 1-1.5 years.
12:29Because like you said, like both of you pointed out, this young setup needs a mentor figure.
12:35Yes, Bumrah is a very good mentor.
12:37Jadeja has been an experienced person.
12:39Shami is there. Siraj is there.
12:41But that energy that he brings, you know, that ESPN article wrote one line,
12:46which we have all understood, we have all seen.
12:50Before the catch is taken in the slips, Virat is already near the batter celebrating the catch.
12:57Intimidating and giving it back.
12:59It was fitting. In a way, it was fitting because on the last day, on the last Test match also,
13:06he needled a youngster.
13:08That's how he has to go.
13:10Not just the youngster, I think he riled up the whole Australian crowd by emptying his pockets.
13:17So, like you said, that is something that I thought,
13:20who are the frontrunners right now?
13:22We have got the names like Shubman Gill and Rishabh Pant.
13:25We all know how Rishabh Pant is.
13:27He is a very animated character.
13:29Shubman Gill has been, yes, he has shown those flashes of aggression.
13:34But probably it's down to the fact that a lot of people have said,
13:38hey, you are going to be the next Virat Kohli.
13:40So, you need to start showing that off.
13:42You need to be a little more expressive on the field.
13:46You have to show that, you have to command that authority.
13:50And he has done well. He has done well in the IPL.
13:52He liked his captaincy. Last year was not that great.
13:55But I still feel a guy like him could have just bounced out ideas from a Virat Kohli.
14:01Those two were very close in the slipcord also.
14:04And maybe like you said, if it's a very tough chase,
14:09he could probably look to a Virat Kohli and ask, should we go for it?
14:13And a Kohli would have said, yeah, definitely.
14:15You have the skills. I have the skill.
14:17Yashaswi has the skill. Rishabh Pant can change the game on its own.
14:21So, why are you fearing? Let's go for it.
14:23You need someone at those points in time.
14:26MS was there for Virat Kohli most of the time in ODIs when he was the captain.
14:31Always there as the Dhoni review system, as you could say.
14:35Maybe a Kohli system would have been there in place to help with the transition.
14:39Kohli sledging system.
14:41Spoke the opposition.
14:43And to be very honest, I think I have seen a lot of people say it also that
14:48Virat at least had two more years of Test cricket in him.
14:51I personally believe that.
14:53He could have completed this cycle of WTC and then he could have just gone off.
14:57That is what I feel.
14:58But Saurabh, what do you think changed in three months?
15:01Delhi's coach Sarandip Singh, while talking to the broadcasters,
15:05said that Virat was talking about going to England and even playing with India for practice.
15:13And he played the Ranji match which we are obviously talking about.
15:16What would have changed in those three months?
15:18We have been hearing that there were mixed signals from the selectors and the team management.
15:23He was once even told in Australia after the first test or second test
15:27that be ready, you might be asked to lead the team on a temporary basis.
15:32But then again he was told after that series loss,
15:36that probably you will also be judged like any other person.
15:41Like how supposed to be reported that.
15:43But what would have changed?
15:45Someone who epitomized Test cricket, who made Test cricket his priority,
15:49why did he give up?
15:51You know, the things which you mentioned
15:54and the amount of things we have read in the last one week or so,
15:58it certainly does not seem that it was just Virat Kohli's idea that he wanted to go out of Test cricket.
16:04Because I believe the passion which Virat Kohli had for Test cricket,
16:07if you read his last retirement note, the way he says it,
16:11it's not easy but I feel it's the right time.
16:14Unlike that one line statement, bye, I am not playing Test cricket.
16:18Yeah, so if you look at that, because I always felt,
16:22and I had told you also if I remember,
16:24that for Virat Kohli I thought that if he had to go out,
16:27Test cricket will be the last format where he goes out.
16:29Even I thought so.
16:30Yeah, because Virat Kohli and Test cricket, they go hand in hand.
16:33You look at what Michael Vaughan has said,
16:36that in the last 30 years or so, nobody has done more for Test cricket than Virat Kohli.
16:42And it is not Virat Kohli's loss that he is not playing Test cricket.
16:45It is going to be Test cricket's loss that Virat Kohli will not be donning the whites for India
16:49and playing that Red Chagia game.
16:51So it just does not make sense to me that it was Virat Kohli who wanted to move out.
16:55And all those media reports which first came out that BCCI wanted to convince,
16:59I think it's the other way around.
17:01I think it was a message from the management,
17:04maybe the coach, maybe the selector, maybe the BCI secretary or BCI president,
17:08that look, last cycle we failed miserably.
17:11We lost a home series against New Zealand.
17:13We were whitewashed.
17:14We lost to Australia.
17:15We gave you chances.
17:16Your runs are not coming at all.
17:18And it is pretty evident that we need to look forward.
17:22And maybe because the new WTC cycle is on,
17:25they opted for a completely new team.
17:28Where they could, from the start itself, they could go and say,
17:31okay, we might not have the experience of Virat or Rohit,
17:36but we will build a team.
17:37Like when Dhoni retired, they built a young team.
17:40And for me, it's going to be, you know, like Alan said about the captaincy options.
17:45You know, I firmly believe whoever becomes the captain is not going to matter.
17:49Because the first time in Indian cricket history, in last 20-25 years,
17:53I think it's going to be the coach who is going to be the main man.
17:56It is going to be Gautam Gambhir's side.
17:58Whoever becomes the captain, he is going to walk on the path which Gambhir chose him.
18:05So, I think Gautam Gambhir, Ajit Agarkar and B. Sai had a very, very important role
18:09in Virat Kohli announcing his retirement.
18:11Because it would not have looked nice that they would have dropped Virat Kohli from a series midway.
18:16Imagine the name Virat Kohli in the squad for England series.
18:19He goes there, fails to perform in the first switches, then he gets dropped.
18:23That would have been embarrassing for everyone.
18:26And that would have created more controversy than this retirement statement has.
18:30So, maybe it was this team management and Virat, being Virat,
18:34he said, okay, if you want me out, I will not say anything, I will be out.
18:38And he is out.
18:39What about the form?
18:41Keeping motions aside, all of us have spoken about,
18:44yes, Virat took test cricket, yes, he has made a significant contribution.
18:49Like he said, in the last 30 years,
18:51in the last 30 years, if Michael Vaughan is saying that,
18:54it means that Sachin, Ponting, Lara included.
18:58Because of the cultural impact that probably he made for that format.
19:02For that format, especially in this era of T20 dominance.
19:05But what about the form? Was it irreversible?
19:08Like, could he have gone to England and scored runs?
19:11See, 3 months ago, we were only calling for their heads, right?
19:15Virat and Rohit, they are not scoring runs.
19:17How could it have changed in England? Had he gone there?
19:20I think, one of the things about Kohli,
19:23if you look at his career, has been the fact that
19:26he is someone who always evolves with time.
19:29If you look at his, that interview where he was saying that,
19:32you know, how he changed his fitness.
19:35How he changed his fitness, he was a bit of a chubby guy when he came in.
19:40He saw himself on the mirror and he was like,
19:42no, this is not how a cricketer should look like.
19:44So, he was always changing. He was always a guy who found a solution to problems.
19:49Yes, he had a problem. He had a weakness.
19:52And I think, whenever we have a weakness,
19:55we try to either mask it or try to improve on it.
19:58We don't let it be a weakness for all the time.
20:01Yes, a couple of times you might fall trap to that weakness.
20:05As, like, more than a couple of times he did in Australia.
20:08But I don't think that would have been a problem in England.
20:12He would have been coming with a fresher mind.
20:15He had just come out of an IPL season.
20:17Probably after winning the IPL.
20:19Maybe. You never know. At the end of the day, you never know.
20:23He would have come out feeling a better person having had got some runs in his kitty.
20:28He would have gone to the England conditions with the India A side.
20:32Played a few matches. Got some game time.
20:35Maybe he would have gotten outside of.
20:38We would have still written stories. We would have still said the same things.
20:41But then once the series starts, he might have found the groove.
20:44He would have found it and he would have started scoring runs.
20:47You never know. You never know at the end of the day.
20:50Because, I think, probably like how Saurabh said,
20:53the management decided that enough of chances.
20:56It's time that we start a new cycle.
20:58Now, let these guys fail. That is upon them.
21:01But let's just stop this and let's just have all the former players who were there.
21:08The former, from the old guard.
21:11Let the old guard move away. Let the new ones come in.
21:14And I think that is it. Because at the end, we will never know what would have happened.
21:19Saurabh, what about you? Could you have?
21:21See, personally speaking, I think Kohli can correct.
21:26We are no one to tell Kohli can't correct this thing.
21:29Kohli can't correct that thing.
21:31But the evidence in the last 3-4 years shows us that probably he was trying a bit too much.
21:37Probably all that criticism, all that outside noise he talks about.
21:40He says that I don't care about outside noise.
21:43But everyone, let's be frank.
21:46Everyone cares about what is being said about them.
21:49At least hears it.
21:51And that pressure of doing this, doing that.
21:54Winning the T20 World Cup, winning the Champions Trophy.
21:57I think it released something out of him.
21:59And that is what probably I think.
22:01In Australia, it was not like he worked with Sanjay Bangar before he went to Australia.
22:06He tried a hell lot of things.
22:09But nothing worked.
22:10And it was not like Kohli didn't know that Boland will bowl that day.
22:14I think it was something more mental than technical.
22:18And at 36, at this stage where probably he is looking at maybe living a life,
22:24living a more settled, more peaceful life.
22:27I don't think it would have been wise to prolong the career.
22:31Maybe the timing was right.
22:33Like in that, again I am quoting that piece.
22:35Like he said, test cricket, Virat wouldn't commit to test cricket
22:38if he was not sure that he would be able to give his 100%.
22:41Maybe he knew that I will not be my best version if I go to England.
22:46Maybe that's the reason.
22:48You know, I can agree with you.
22:50I can disagree with you.
22:52But yes, Virat was not scoring runs.
22:54Okay.
22:55And apart from that, the biggest factor being
22:58that Virat Kohli was India's best chess batter.
23:01When was India's best chess batter last?
23:03When do you remember it?
23:042019, 2020.
23:05Okay.
23:06Since that pandemic happened, and after the pandemic,
23:09I think that BCI and Virat Kohli brawl happened
23:12where he was stripped of the ODI captaincy with the press release
23:16where he was not even mentioned.
23:17Rohit Sharma was named the captain.
23:19Then it took up on his ego and he relinquished the test captaincy.
23:22Since then, I think Virat Kohli had thought,
23:27and it was lurking there,
23:29that all that intensity that he has been carrying for the team
23:32since 2012, 2014, wherever you see.
23:36In the last 10 years, he gave everything that he could.
23:39Every ounce of it.
23:40And now it was taking a toll on him.
23:43And he came out in public and said that how Anushka, his wife,
23:46helped him cope with this mental outside pressure.
23:50And now, you know, I can agree with you that
23:54he might not score runs even if he goes to England.
23:56But still, I would have loved to see him play the test matches.
24:00Because Virat Kohli, as you said,
24:02even I will not remember his 100s.
24:05But I will remember his attitude on the field.
24:08The way he used to uplift the mood of the bowlers.
24:10His fielding changes.
24:11The way he used to rile up the crowds.
24:13The opposition used to fear, okay, Virat Kohli is standing in the slips.
24:16You just have to be very careful when you are playing as an Indian team
24:19with Virat Kohli inside it.
24:21Australians will still market him as the greatest overseas player
24:26to play the Australian way.
24:27But stats also tell you that, isn't it?
24:297, 8, 100s there.
24:30And I am telling you, I think now Virat and Rohit will only play ODIs.
24:34The next ODI tour of India is in Australia.
24:36When he goes there, you see how Australians market it.
24:39When India went to Australia,
24:41you see every front page of Australian newspaper
24:44had Hindi, Punjabi and English front headlines
24:46with Virat Kohli as the cover pic.
24:48That is Virat Kohli for you.
24:49It's not just the runs he made.
24:51The impact he had with the field.
24:53His decisions and his statements.
24:55It was also touching to see the
24:59Lethal Colonel, DRDO Chief
25:03mentioning Virat on that day.
25:06Indian DGMO mentioned him.
25:08And he said that Virat Kohli, like many other Indians,
25:11Virat Kohli is my favourite cricketer.
25:13And used a beautiful analogy also.
25:16It is fun, but at this stage,
25:18Rohit is not going to be there, let's accept.
25:21Virat is also not going to be there.
25:24Who to lead?
25:25Whom should be the leader of the next gen?
25:28Will you be okay appointing a stopgap arrangement now?
25:33Or are you going to back someone?
25:35Say that even if you fail in a couple of series,
25:38you take the lead and you go forward.
25:40I think, see, hands down, I feel it's going to be Shubham Gill.
25:43And the signs were very clear.
25:45The moment that Hardik Pandya was kind of, you know,
25:48thrown out of that leadership.
25:51In limited overs.
25:52In limited overs format.
25:54And suddenly out of the blue you saw Shubham Gill being made vice captain.
25:58I think he got the blessings from the seniors also.
26:01I feel a guy like Rohit Sharma and probably a guy like Virat Kohli would have endorsed him.
26:05No, but Rohit, I think, made it very clear during that last tour of Australia
26:10that let these guys earn captaincy.
26:12What have they done?
26:13As in like, let these guys earn captaincy.
26:16And he only mentioned Bumrah.
26:18He did not even say that, okay, Bumrah has done really well and all that.
26:22But he was very dismissive of the youngsters coming into that role.
26:26As in at least it looked like it.
26:28Because he said, let these guys earn it.
26:30We, Virat, me and even Bumrah have worked so hard to get to this position.
26:35As in like, let's not discount.
26:36Rohit might not have had a terrific test career.
26:39But he was India's best batsman from that phase, 2019 to 2022-23.
26:43And he, as in like, for all that he achieved in white ball cricket,
26:47maybe probably Ganguly, former VCCI president, told him,
26:51the president told him that, okay, take it in tests also.
26:54And he did a decent job, except for that home series and the Bodo Gavaskar trophy.
26:58I think, but like I said, those things might not matter to this current management.
27:05The current management is seeing that, okay, the project is going to be Shubman Gill.
27:09He seems to be like a guy who can come into his own and take Indian cricket forward.
27:17And I think that is where the decision comes at the end of the day.
27:20They see that, okay, this guy is able to do it.
27:23I like Shubman in the sense that last season in the IPL, he flopped.
27:26His team also flopped.
27:28But this season, they have been simply sensational.
27:32He has also probably, maybe the MR of bat influence, I guess, like Virat Kohli,
27:37started scoring runs.
27:39He has been leading from the front.
27:41His team is sitting at the top of the table, just followed by maybe RCB.
27:46So, he is doing everything right.
27:48He is making those decisions right.
27:50Except for scoring runs in Test cricket.
27:52Maybe.
27:53Overseas.
27:54Overseas, yeah.
27:55But this is like, okay, I remember that…
27:58I wouldn't agree with that.
27:59As in like, scoring runs, Virat has been scoring runs every season in the IPL.
28:02Yeah, I understand.
28:03But he, matter of his caliber, couldn't go and score runs there.
28:07I am not saying, okay, Shubman Gill doesn't deserve captaincy.
28:10But why do you want to give it to him when he still hasn't, you know, cemented a place in the level?
28:15Your argument about a youngster earning the role.
28:19If you all remember, the time when Graeme Smith became South African captain,
28:24South Africa were going through a very bad phase.
28:26They had just lost a home World Cup.
28:28They did not even qualify from the groups.
28:30You had a guy like Sean Pollock being thrown out of captaincy.
28:34And a relatively unknown Graeme Smith, 22 years old, was given the captaincy.
28:39And the first ODI match that Graeme Smith had, if I remember correctly, it was against India.
28:45And India slammed them that game.
28:48But still, they stuck with him.
28:50And then, he went to England.
28:52I remember that series that he had in England where he scored, I think, 275 odd runs.
28:57He stepped up. So, at the end of the day, sometimes, it's like this.
29:01You give a person captaincy, okay. You lead the thing. You perish, you perish.
29:06Otherwise, you succeed. That was done probably with most of the captains of our generation.
29:13And the same thing is happening with Shubman Gill. Whether he likes it or not.
29:17Whether we like it or not.
29:19The fact of the matter remains that this team management, maybe probably Gambhir,
29:23sees the fact that, okay, this guy I know is going to be here for another 10 years.
29:29He is going to be the heir apparent.
29:31He is already being called the prince of Indian cricket.
29:33See, all that you can call. All that you can call.
29:36Yeah, I understand that.
29:37But my point is, when you have not scored a 50 plus score overseas in Sena countries and West Indies
29:44since that Gaba test of 2021, why would you…
29:51See, do you want Shubman Gill, the batter, to be there?
29:53Or do you want a leader who is still struggling to score runs overseas?
29:58I, at this point, wouldn't give Shubman Gill.
30:00Like you said, he is 24, 25. Let him earn it at 27.
30:032 years score runs. Virat didn't earn it when he was scoring 50 odds or 40 odds.
30:09He was already an established cricketer.
30:12MS, again, he was scoring runs before he got test captaincy.
30:16And it's not like that you don't have alternatives.
30:18This narrative of Shubman Gill is the only guy there is a little baffling for me.
30:23The prince and all that is, okay, white ball you have done well, you earn it there.
30:26IPL you have done there, you earn it there.
30:28But test cricket is not something like, okay, I will try, you know, I will give a dolly to this guy.
30:33When you haven't…
30:34See, if Shubman doesn't score in the first two tests in England,
30:39his place in the XI is not certain.
30:41Do you think we don't have a better No. 3?
30:43Then apply the same logic.
30:45Sai Sudarshan has scored so many runs.
30:47Give him No. 3 and tell him, I see 10 years in you.
30:51How can you see 10 years in Shubman when he has not scored runs?
30:54And what wrong has Bumrah done?
30:56Bumrah's whole thing has been the fact that he is not being able to guarantee 5 tests.
31:03That is what the whole argument is coming down.
31:07See, if you want Bumrah to guarantee 5 tests, make him work like Pat Cummins.
31:12Give him the freedom to opt out of T20 leagues, to opt out of ODI series.
31:16Give him that freedom.
31:18If you want to prioritize test cricket or get someone like Rishabh or KL as the vice-captain
31:23and ask them to lead whenever they are there.
31:25I see no problem in that.
31:27But Bumrah, the way he led in Australia, this is my opinion.
31:30I am not saying that you guys are right, I am right.
31:33But Bumrah, the way he led in Australia, I saw shades of Virat.
31:36And he is as aggressive as that.
31:38He is somewhat like Rahane.
31:40He doesn't, you know, go and sledge the opposition.
31:42But every move he does, every plan that he plots are inch perfect.
31:48But, Akshay, you need to understand one thing.
31:51At the end of the day, even if you ask me, do you think that Shubman Gill is good as a T20I player?
31:57No.
31:58Not yet.
31:59No. Not at all. But he is still the vice-captain.
32:01Right.
32:02As an ODI player, yes.
32:04Phenomenal.
32:05Phenomenal.
32:06As a test player, like you said, he is still testing his waters.
32:09He is still finding his feet.
32:11After 35 tests.
32:13After 35 tests, it's still a question.
32:15Very few people are that lucky. KL Rahul was that lucky.
32:17KL Rahul was lucky.
32:18And Shubman Gill, after 35 tests, we are still sitting here and saying, oh, he will play for another 10 years.
32:24He is still testing his waters.
32:26But that is the whole point.
32:28I have, like, if I was a selector, yes.
32:32I would have convinced Bumrah that, listen, you don't need to play all these leagues or all these ODI series.
32:38Pick and choose whatever you want to play.
32:40Please remain fit. We will take care of you. We will do whatever is needed.
32:44But we need you as a captain.
32:46Now that he has said, oh, I cannot be there for 5 tests.
32:50Whoever is in the management is like, okay, let him be the normal bowler that it is.
32:55We are going to select somebody else.
32:57And probably it might have been Shubman Gill who might have been there or might have just walked into the room at that point in time
33:04where they said, oh, let him be the captain.
33:07I have no other explanation towards it.
33:11But the fact is, Indian cricket is now investing in Shubman Gill.
33:16Whether we like it or not, they are going to go hell for leather with this guy up front.
33:23He fails, he fails. Whatever happens, he is going to have that protection.
33:28It's almost like, correct me if I am wrong.
33:32I think in Mahabharata, you give Arjun who had that special bow to kill so and so person.
33:40So, that same thing has been given to Shubman Gill.
33:44That, okay, you are given captaincy. You will be protected.
33:49Like how Krishna stepped in to be the chariot driver for Arjun.
33:54Same way Gautam Kambir is like, I am going to be leading. But you will be by Arjun.
33:58See, Gautam Kambir, if he loses England, his future as a tennis coach will be ruined.
34:03See, this is all…
34:04Is this KKR bias? I don't know.
34:07No. Seriously. Gautam Kambir, ex-KKR coach. Shubman Gill, ex-KKR player.
34:11See, I have been sad. I have been cribbing over the fact that we lost Shubman for years right now.
34:16But the fact is, he has grown as a player.
34:19I do feel that once this responsibility does come on to him, he will be a better man.
34:25That is what… It's all based on trust.
34:28It's all based on trust and belief.
34:30So, why will an out of form player…
34:33One says, I am going out of form for like 2 years. Give me captaincy. After that, I will score runs.
34:39It's as simple as that.
34:42Saurabh, you have been keeping quiet, watching us sledge for so long.
34:45What is your verdict on this? Shubman or someone else?
34:48See, by all my heart, I wanted Bumrah to lead the Indian Test side.
34:52But if Bumrah does not want to lead…
34:55If the selectors and the management feels that Bumrah will not be fit enough to lead in every Test match,
35:00then my option will be Rishabh Pant.
35:02He might have failed in Australia, but listen to me.
35:06He has been your best Test batter wherever you have gone.
35:09He came from… How many? One year he was out due to that unfortunate accident.
35:14He comes back and hits a 100.
35:16And then, you know, I will again say that he failed in Australia series because there was no role clarity.
35:23It was management's failure. It was not just Rishabh Pant's failure.
35:27And more than Rishabh Pant's failure, you know, Rishabh Pant is a player, is a travesty kind of player.
35:32Where you need him to shield for the first 40-50 overs.
35:36Your top-order has to be there.
35:38Even if they are not… Like, Pant survived because Pujara used to score runs.
35:42Pujara used to weather that first session, second session.
35:45Now, this top-order failed.
35:47Shubman Gill, I don't know if he is going to bat at No. 3.
35:50Because I don't think… You know, you are talking about captaincy.
35:53I don't see Shubman Gill as a long-term No. 3 batting option for India.
35:57Why not give a Sai Soshan option?
36:00Bring in Karun Nair. Give him a chance.
36:03Why not try Shreyas Iyer?
36:04Obviously, you have given 35 tests to Shubman Gill.
36:07Give another player a chance.
36:08For me, you know, if you ask me, I believe Shubman and Jaiswal should open.
36:12And Kale should bat at No. 4.
36:14At No. 3, you should give someone like Karun, someone like Sai, someone like Sai Soshan.
36:19Any of these three players.
36:20Because Kale has the technical ability to bat at No. 4.
36:23Your technically most able player has to bat at No. 4.
36:26You have seen in history also.
36:27See, if Kale gets a secured spot, then the funda of fun is not there.
36:32One match he will open. One match he will play at No. 6.
36:35One match he will play at No. 7.
36:37And for captaincy also.
36:38Kale was given captaincy.
36:39Then he was suddenly out of the plans.
36:41And now Gambhir does not trust him as a captain.
36:43Gambhir wants him to play as a free-fall batter.
36:47Now my single question to Gautam Gambhir and the management is
36:51How and why are you giving Shubman Gill that captaincy role if he is getting that?
36:56It's just reports.
36:57There is no confirmation about it.
36:59If he is getting it.
37:00Because we have seen.
37:02Like Allal mentioned, I agree with you about the Green's point.
37:06But you know, South African cricket and Indian cricket, these are two very different things.
37:10The pressure which you carry in India is completely different.
37:13South Africa has not won any IC tournament, if I am not wrong.
37:16India, on the other hand, you did not win an IC tournament for 10 years.
37:20And there was so much hullabaloo.
37:21Virat Kohli was asked to move on.
37:23Rohit Sharma became the captain.
37:24The coach was changed.
37:25There were questions on Zahul Dravid's coaching abilities.
37:28So there are two different things.
37:29And I personally believe, if you are making a captain, test captain, it should either be Bumrah.
37:35If not Bumrah, it should be Panth.
37:36He is the most deserving guy.
37:38He has given you everything.
37:39The only problem is, does he hold the blessings of Coach Gambhir?
37:43No.
37:45That is the only problem.
37:46That is where it all comes down to.
37:48Like I agree to every single logical point that you are making.
37:52For me, Bumrah should be the captain.
37:54End of discussion.
37:56The moment that you heard that Rohit Sharma is retiring, everybody said, oh Bumrah has to be the next captain.
38:01There is no need for a discussion for it.
38:03But it all comes down to the man who…
38:07Like how Saurabh said, for the first time in Indian cricket, you are going to have an Indian coach leading the team.
38:13And the captain does not matter.
38:14In that point, when it comes to that…
38:19If that is going to be the case, if you are going to give so much veto power to Gambhir, I don't agree with that.
38:24You are playing test cricket.
38:26Exactly.
38:27I have always been of the belief that a team management comprises of the coaches and the captain coming together.
38:34I felt that feeling when Rohit Sharma and Rahul Dravid was there.
38:37Ravi Shastri and Virat Kohli was there.
38:39You always had that feeling that these two guys along with the rest of the management makes the calls.
38:45Honestly, I don't want that power to always be with Gautam Gambhir.
38:50You need to have other people around you.
38:53You need to have a strong captain who is there, who can…
38:57You know, like go… I am not saying go against Gambhir.
39:01But just say that, hey, why don't we try this, a different method.
39:06Who can hold a healthy conversation with it.
39:10But I don't see that with Shubman Gill and Gambhir happening.
39:14And probably that is the main reason why Gill is being given the captaincy.
39:19Oh yes.
39:20Could be.
39:21It's a wild point.
39:22For someone, you know, as in like, at this stage,
39:25for someone who has lost a historic test series at home to New Zealand
39:30and then hammered in Australia for the first time in 10 years,
39:33Gambhir should be the last person who would be allowed to make decisions is what I think.
39:37For Test cricket.
39:38For Test cricket, yes.
39:39For one days, yes, he has had plans and all that.
39:41But there is another way of looking at it.
39:44If Gambhir had said, okay, I want a restart, then I will prove myself with this young team.
39:49Give me a couple of series.
39:50We are not going to expect results in England.
39:52No, nobody.
39:53So even a number four spot, even the opening spot,
39:56it will take a couple of series to figure out who is there, who is what.
39:59If Shubman is made the captain and he says, I want to bat at four,
40:02then if he gets that and number three, we might have to go for a couple of series.
40:07If Gambhir has said that, maybe give me time.
40:10I want a young set up.
40:12Now he will have no one to blame.
40:14Can't blame Rohit Sharma.
40:17The blame will seriously come to you.
40:20But at the same time, if these youngsters can step up, let's be optimistic.
40:25If these youngsters can step up.
40:27So what did Virat score in that Australia series?
40:29190 runs in five tests.
40:31Rohit 36 runs in three tests.
40:34Three tests.
40:35Five innings.
40:36So even if any two of them score more than that in England,
40:40it would be a welcome change.
40:42Let's be honest.
40:43So there are two ways of looking at it.
40:45Gambhir right now can't blame anyone.
40:47But at the same time, if he has taken up that responsibility,
40:51let me show that even if we lose, we will fight and lose.
40:55Even if we will challenge England.
40:57England or not Australia, let's put it that way at the end of the day.
41:02They are beatable.
41:03It's not like they are unbeatable.
41:05They have built a fortress there.
41:07West Indies comes there, smashes them.
41:09Sri Lanka goes there, smashes them.
41:11India nearly won that series.
41:132022, the rescheduled series had Indian players not run for IPL.
41:19We could have won that test in Manchester is what I thought.
41:22So it's going to be a very interesting phase.
41:26It's going to be a very interesting phase.
41:27There are multiple ways to look at things.
41:29Our opinion hardly matters.
41:31The man sitting there, Ajit Agarkar, the BCCI bigwigs.
41:35And if the IC chairman wants to give his thoughts.
41:39And also, like you said, the head coach and his troop.
41:43I hope it's a wise decision at the end of the day.
41:46Because the legacy that we have had in Test cricket,
41:49the last cycle did not reflect it.
41:52And we are good enough.
41:54It's not like India doesn't have talent.
41:56It's not like if Virat and Rohit are gone,
41:58India can't play Test cricket, win Test matches.
42:00There is an abundance of talent.
42:03There is good work done by so many coaches across the country
42:06who are not Gautam Gambhir,
42:08who are not as popular as Gautam Gambhir,
42:11as popular as Chandrakanth Pandey.
42:12But there are coaches who are giving us the Suryavanshis and all of them.
42:16So I think whatever it is, India is capable of it.
42:21But it's a big decision that needs to be made
42:24in the next few weeks is what we think.
42:27Quick prediction as in what will happen to these two of us.
42:32Who will be the captain?
42:34Who will be the captain?
42:35I'm not asking who do you want to see as the captain?
42:38Who will be the captain and what is your series scoreline?
42:41Very early prediction, but let's do it before...
42:43So if I trust all the media reports and what Alan is saying,
42:46it has to be Shubman Gill.
42:48But there were a couple of conflicting reports that came out last night,
42:52on Thursday night, Wednesday night,
42:55saying that there might be some change.
42:57And Gautam Gambhir also visited the Siddhi Vinayak temple,
43:00maybe to clear his mind.
43:04And how many tests are you playing? Five tests, right?
43:06Five.
43:07I believe it will be 2-2 draw.
43:09Over optimistic I am, but I will back my youngsters.
43:13Because Indian youngsters are pretty much capable
43:16of beating this English side at their own backyard.
43:192-2 for me. One draw test.
43:21I would actually say India 2-1.
43:23India 2-1.
43:24A little bit more adventurous.
43:26Because I feel if you bring out, take out guys like...
43:30Non-performing seniors, you can always win.
43:33You bring in Sai Sudarshan, guys who have had experience playing in England.
43:37You have those KL Rahul's who can, you know, just frustrate baseball.
43:42Just like, I feel Sai Sudarshan is a kind of player who can do that.
43:45And maybe he might be your new No. 3 or an opener.
43:49Those guys will just wear down this attack.
43:52They can do it.
43:54They can get those runs.
43:55And if that is the case, England are going to fold.
43:58That is what we have seen with this approach that they have.
44:02They are no superpower, let's be very honest.
44:05So, I genuinely am going a little optimistic here.
44:08A little adventurous as well.
44:112-1 to India.
44:12And who, captain? You made it clear, Subban.
44:15Yeah, I personally feel it's going to be...
44:17Because the signs are already there.
44:19And I just feel he is going to be that guy.
44:22Unfortunately, who opened the door first and came inside.
44:25He was made the class monitor.
44:27And the rest is history, as I said.
44:30For me, probably Ajinkya Rahane.
44:33Have you guys called him? Asked him?
44:35He is not retired.
44:37I am not saying he is retired.
44:39Are you coming to KKR?
44:41Next season, we have a spot.
44:43For me, see, you went out of the way to ask Rohit and Virat
44:47whether they will play, whether they will not play.
44:49That saga continued for six months.
44:50For me, Pooji at No. 3, Rahane at No. 4.
44:52Rahane, captain.
44:54For another two years.
44:56Absolutely wild prediction.
44:57And India winning 3-2.
44:59See, that might be a joke, but India winning this series
45:02is something that is not beyond imagination.
45:06So, let's be optimistic.
45:08And it's going to be fun over the next few days.
45:10IPL is resuming on Saturday, May 17.
45:12The last two weeks will be fun there as well.
45:15Let's see how it pans out, how it all pans out.
45:17And I think this is the right time to ask our listeners and viewers
45:21their thoughts on who should be India's next test captain
45:24and what they think will be the squad composition for the Tour of England.
45:28You can send in your thoughts on 8588-966-996.
45:31If you are listening to us on Spotify and Apple Podcasts,
45:34please rate us.
45:35And like we always say, if you are watching us on YouTube,
45:38please leave your comment.
45:39We'll be more than happy to learn your feedback.
45:41Thank you. Have a great weekend.
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