00:00This is Apropos.
00:04This week saw a major breakthrough for Syria's interim leaders in their efforts to unify
00:09the war-torn country as the Kurdish-led militia that controls the northeast agreed to merge
00:15with the new government.
00:16The deal came after days of violent clashes in a coastal region that left more than 1,000
00:21people dead.
00:22With more on the reaction to that agreement, here's a special report from our team on the
00:27ground in northeastern Syria.
00:34Gunfire echoes throughout the city.
00:36Haseki is celebrating.
00:38By signing a deal, Damascus and the authorities of northeastern Syria have given the population
00:44a spark of hope, after some had feared the outbreak of a new civil war.
00:50Agreement.
00:53Peace is a good thing.
00:54I hope for the best for what's next.
00:56The agreement aims to ensure the political representation of all Syrians, recognize Kurdish
01:02rights and integrate the civilian and military institutions of the northeast into the national
01:08structures, and calls for a ceasefire across the entire territory.
01:18It is welcomed here as an end to years of division.
01:24We are happy to get rid of the civil war and sectarianism and become Syria.
01:28Every nation is one.
01:30This is the best.
01:31It's accomplished.
01:35Syria is tired of 12 to 13 years of fear, displacement and bloodshed.
01:40We are all tired, Arabs and Kurds.
01:47But some of the demonstrators are not happy with the idea that the political and military
01:51authorities, who have controlled the autonomous province for a decade, might lose power.
01:59What we understand from the agreement is that they have an accord.
02:04And they are one now.
02:05We don't accept this.
02:08He is not the only one wary of the deal.
02:10For now, it's an agreement between the two parties.
02:13But the details are still to be negotiated.
02:19We're joined now by Kawa Hassan from the Middle East and North Africa program at the Stimson
02:24Center.
02:25Kawa, thanks so much for being with us on the program this evening.
02:29Firstly, the security situation has remained unstable in Syria since the fall of Bashar
02:35al-Assad.
02:36Just how much of a difference will this deal make, the deal with the Kurdish militia on
02:41the ground in Syria?
02:44Thank you very much.
02:45Good evening.
02:46Thanks for having me.
02:47This deal is indeed a landmark deal to begin with.
02:52And if implemented, it will be really monumental for Syria, for Kurds, and for the region.
02:58So to what extent, to your question, to what extent the security situation will be impacted
03:04by this deal, I mean, it remains to be seen.
03:08Unfortunately, the killing is still going on in coastal areas of Syria against Alawites.
03:17And the number of civilians killed and butchered is rising, even though overall the tensions
03:26in the region is decreasing.
03:28But the overall security situation in the coastal area hasn't changed dramatically.
03:34But what has changed is that this deal will pave the way for, you know, serious discussions
03:44between SDF and between Damascus, the new administration in Damascus, to work out the
03:51details and to be implemented, hopefully, as they have stated in their agreement in
03:56the deal, within nine months.
03:58I personally think, I think it will be difficult to have that implemented in nine months.
04:04But we'll see how much of it will be implemented.
04:08So a landmark deal, the devil is in the detail.
04:13And hopefully, both internal and regional dynamics will allow for its implementation.
04:19And there hasn't been an awful lot of detail released so far, Kawa.
04:25How do you think this is all going to work in practice?
04:27Will the SDF, for example, be allowed to operate as a distinct military bloc within
04:33the armed forces?
04:34Or how exactly is that going to play out?
04:36Good question.
04:37We don't know yet exactly, particularly when, you know, on this particular issue, actually
04:43the, again, the devil is in the detail.
04:47So the deal itself, it says that SDF will be integrated, both the military, you know,
04:54SDF as a military entity, but also all the civilian administrations in northeast Syria,
05:00they will be integrated into the new Syria, Syrian state institutions.
05:06How that will be done, that is something to be, you know, has been left for negotiations
05:12to be negotiated in different committees, you know, committees that will deal with education,
05:19of course, dealing with judiciary, ISIS detainees, the prisons, the issue of economy, the management
05:26of oil and gas fields, the management of border crossing, the airport and other issues.
05:34So all these, you know, important issues, I think they will be, they will be definitely
05:41negotiated in the coming months and committees have to be established.
05:48So about the exact nature of integration of SDF into the new Syrian army, that remains
05:54to be seen.
05:55Will they be, well, can they remain as one block preserving some sort of autonomy within
06:02the northeast or they have to be also, you know, deployed to other parts of Syria?
06:09That actually we don't know yet.
06:11So, you know, I think the coming months hopefully will give us, you know, an answer to these
06:19to this question.
06:20And do you think the deal might help to ease Turkish military pressure on the SDF?
06:25It's deemed by Ankara to be an extension of the PKK.
06:29I think so.
06:30At least for now, the Turkish response has been actually positive.
06:35Turkey has welcomed this deal, which is a very positive development, which is very good
06:42for Syria, for Kurds, for the new administration in Damascus, but also for Turkey and overall
06:47for the regional stability.
06:49So the fact that Turkey has welcomed the deal, that in itself is really a welcome, good news.
06:55And indeed, the hope is that, you know, this deal will decrease the conflict between SDF
07:03and maybe at some point end the conflict, the military conflict between SDF and Syrian
07:08National Army militias, which are supported by Turkey.
07:11But as of now, actually today, there were some clashes still, you know, in Manbij between
07:20SDF and Syrian National Army.
07:22So for the time being, the fighting hasn't stopped.
07:25But the deal itself calls for, and this is important, I think it should be emphasized,
07:30it calls for a ceasefire across the entire Syria.
07:36And I think even if it's not implemented immediately, but in fact, having such a clause
07:42is definitely important to going forward to reach also an agreement with Turkey that at
07:48some point, hopefully, this will lead to end of the conflict between SDF and the Syrian
07:54National Army.
07:55And as well as Turkey, the U.S. was also supporting this deal.
07:59Seemingly it encouraged its Kurdish allies to reach an agreement.
08:03What committee do you think Washington is to retaining a presence in Syria?
08:08Well, first of all, I think the role of the U.S. was more than important.
08:13It was actually pivotal.
08:14So without U.S. pivotal role, I think it would have been impossible to have a deal at this
08:23particular moment of time in Syria.
08:26So the commander of the U.S. Central Command, General Michael Karela, played a pivotal role
08:33in encouraging, indeed, SDF to go ahead with the negotiations.
08:37And they even provided an airplane for General Mazloum Abdi, the general commander of SDF,
08:44to travel to Damascus and finalize the deal with Ahmad al-Sharia.
08:49So U.S. role is absolutely key.
08:52As to the future U.S. presence and role in Syria, again, it's unclear.
08:58But from what we hear right now, at least from Washington and particularly from Pentagon,
09:03sources close to Pentagon, it seems that Pentagon is really developing all kinds of plans, scenarios
09:10for the moment that President Trump may decide to withdraw troops from northeast Syria.
09:16So I think also, according to the Reuters report today, it seems that U.S. is really
09:23playing an important role also to make sure that in the event of a U.S. withdrawal, this
09:29will not lead to chaos and it will not be a chaotic withdrawal, as we have seen in Afghanistan.
09:36So again, also, this is a welcome news for Syria and also for the Kurds.
09:41And Kawa, Kurdish leaders have been negotiating with the interim authorities in Damascus about
09:46the future of their people.
09:48What exactly are they seeking to secure in those talks?
09:52Right.
09:53So SDF and the autonomous administration in northeast Syria for the past 13, 14 years
09:59has actually been calling for decentralization of northeast Syria so that, you know, that
10:05part of Syria would have autonomy to administer its own affairs.
10:10What is interesting is that in the current deal, in the current, you know, version, there
10:16is no mention whatsoever of decentralization to northeast Syria.
10:21But there are other interesting clauses, which, for instance, it calls for a, you know, ensuring
10:30the citizenship and constitutional rights of Kurds.
10:35And it recognizes Kurds for the first time since the establishment of modern Syria as
10:40an authentic community, you know, as part of the Syrian society.
10:45Because as we know, since, you know, 1962, hundreds of thousands of Kurds have been actually,
10:51you know, they haven't had any citizenship rights and they were marginalized within Syria.
10:59So they were basically stateless within Syria.
11:03So this deal, it recognized the political rights of Kurds without going into detail.
11:09So I think, again, this particular issue about how much autonomy northeast Syria will gain,
11:18you know, in Syria, that remains to be seen.
11:22And it will be, you know, fiercely negotiated, I guess, in one of those committees to be
11:28formed in the coming period.
11:30Kawa, we'll have to leave it there for now.
11:32But thank you so much for being with us on the program this evening.
11:34That's Kawa Hassan from the Middle East and North Africa program at the Stimson Center.
11:39Well, that's it from us for now.
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