"The President Is Now a King Above the Law" Supreme Court Ruling Sparks Legal Maneuvering by Trump

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00:00It has now proven to get even better for them, because today the judge who oversaw Donald

00:05Trump's hush money trial here in New York has now delayed the sentencing to decide whether

00:10or not the Supreme Court's immunity ruling imperils that conviction.

00:14The sentencing was supposed to be here next week.

00:16It is now going to take place September 18th.

00:19And that, I'm quoting the judge now, is if such is still necessary.

00:23I want to break this down with all of our legal sources.

00:27And Judge, I want to start with you, because when I saw that quote, if it's still necessary,

00:32is there a real chance here where this New York conviction, they're overturned or they

00:36ask for a new trial because of the Supreme Court's ruling?

00:40They will ask for a new trial.

00:42There is a chance that that happens, depending upon what the papers say.

00:46But if you look at the Supreme Court decision, it talks about core constitutional responsibilities.

00:51I don't think that arranging to pay off a porn star has anything to do with core constitutional

00:57responsibility.

00:58So I imagine at the end of the day, there could be grounds to deny that.

01:02But Judge Michon did the right thing, because you have to hear out what the parties have

01:07to say.

01:08You have to, you may have to do a hearing, but you could decide it on the papers.

01:11But he did the cautious thing.

01:12And if he then set it down and said sentences this, this particular day, he's tipped his

01:17hand to say, I'm denying it.

01:19He's not going to do that.

01:20He was cautious.

01:21There's a sentence.

01:22That's when it will be.

01:23I mean, Ellie, it's pretty remarkable, though, to see the immediate aftermath of that ruling

01:27that we got just 36 hours ago.

01:29I reread this today, slowly this time.

01:32And I brought a prop.

01:33This is it.

01:34Let me tell you, that's the Supreme Court rule.

01:36This is the Supreme Court ruling, 36 hours old.

01:39This thing is a disaster for prosecutors.

01:42This opinion is a godsend from heaven for Donald Trump.

01:46The way that the Supreme Court defines official act is astonishingly broad on the one hand,

01:52and it might even include some of the conduct in the hush money case.

01:55But at the same time, it's also so vague that it's going to be almost impossible for Judge

01:59Mershawn, for Judge Chutkan to apply it.

02:02And there's been plenty of academic debate.

02:04I've been engaged in some of it.

02:05Good decision.

02:06Bad decision.

02:07Smart.

02:08Unwise.

02:09Doesn't matter because this is now the law, according to the Supreme Court.

02:12And Judge Mershawn and Judge Chutkan are going to have to apply this first.

02:15They may get results they don't like.

02:17They're going to have to live with them.

02:18And if they don't, it's going back to the Supreme Court.

02:21I mean, how does a godsend, as Ellie described it, feels like Trump gets a lot of those on

02:25the legal front.

02:27It really does.

02:28His attorneys would acknowledge that, too.

02:29And I'm going to tell you what else.

02:31I think this, no matter what the judge does in connection with this case, talking about

02:35Juan Mershawn, guess where it may end up?

02:37The Supreme Court of the United States.

02:39How and why?

02:40We're talking about a state case.

02:41I'll tell you how.

02:42What happens is, is that the judge, very brightly, I do agree with Jill in this interview,

02:45in this instance, because he set a motion schedule.

02:48That means attorneys submit your argument, right?

02:51The defense will submit their argument, and, of course, prosecutor will respond, and he

02:55will then weigh in on it.

02:56If they hear it's necessary, he'll do what he does.

02:58But no matter what he does, guess what happens then?

03:00It gets appealed.

03:01New York, we have departments.

03:02It'll get appealed to the first department.

03:04Thereafter, we have this other court, the High Court Court of Appeals.

03:07And then after that, Caitlin, it is likely, because it involves a federal question, to

03:12go to that very court.

03:13And so, last point, although the issues, you can argue, don't relate to official conduct,

03:19it's private conduct, it's a porn star, the issue's going to be, was evidence admitted

03:23in the case, and did it affect the outcome of the case?

03:26And that's going to be the question the judge will ask.

03:28And I'm watching pages just be ripped off a calendar, like in a movie, in my mind, as

03:32you're saying that.

03:33But even if there was some conduct while he was in the White House that's arguably official,

03:39and I don't really see that, there's still harmless error analysis.

03:41Exactly right.

03:43Meaning, even if it was wrong, it didn't affect or infect the verdict here.

03:48Because there was so much other overwhelming evidence.

03:51That's right.

03:52And it's really limited to Hope Hicks and a conversation she had, and Pecker, when he

03:54was in the White House.

03:55Let me say two things about that, though.

03:57This decision, the Supreme Court says, the motivation of the person, of the president,

04:01doesn't matter.

04:02So if he's talking to his comms director, Hope Hicks, that's all they're going to look

04:05at.

04:06The second thing is, Donald Trump's team is going to use the DA's own words against them.

04:10Donald Trump's team is going to say, that Hope Hicks piece of evidence, you know what

04:12the DA told the jury?

04:13Devastating.

04:14This is devastating, powerful evidence of guilt.

04:16The forms that Trump had to fill out, the disclosure forms of a new U.K. president,

04:20the DA stood in front of the jury and said, powerful, overwhelming evidence of guilt.

04:24Right.

04:25But I have to, I just have to say that although that they did say devastating, that's argument,

04:28it's not necessarily, you know, any evidence before them.

04:31And motivation is very important.

04:33Because if you look at what the president argued at this trial, it was, I was not trying

04:39to infect the election.

04:42I was trying to protect my wife and my family, which means it is not official.

04:46You're making, that was the argument for why that evidence was important, which is why

04:49it's going to be error if it was let in.

04:51I totally disagree.

04:52I totally disagree.

04:53It's fascinating to see all of this.

04:54I love a good disagreement.

04:55It's fascinating to see all this is, you know, today we're learning Rudy Giuliani was disbarred

04:59here in New York.

05:00You know, as Trump is getting all of these, these good luck streaks from, from the courts,

05:05saying Rudy Giuliani be disbarred.

05:06Great to have you all here.

05:07Thank you very much for that coming up here as president.

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