Talking the Patriots RBs, Jones vs Zappe, & more w/ National Scout Damian Parson

CLNS Media Sports Network

Taylor Kyles of CLNS Media welcomes Damian Parson, a nationally recognized scout for The Draft Network, for a comprehensive discussion about the future prospects of the 2023 New England Patriots. They embark on an exploration journey, scrutinizing the Patriots' backfield, evaluating their new draft selections, and drawing comparisons between Mac Jones and Bailey Zappe, amongst many other fascinating topics.  ⏱️ EPISODE TIMELINE ⏱️ 0:00 National Scout Damian Parson joins TK 1:00 Mac vs Zappe 3:38 Parson gives Patriots grade for draft 4:40 Parson: Christian Gonzalez was CLEAR CB1 5:45 Parson: Keion White PERFECT Fit for Bill Belichick and vice versa 7:04 Parson: Best is yet to come for Marte Mapu  7:40 Parson on the rest of the draft (OL + ST) 9:10 Parson on Kayshon Boutte and Demario Douglas picks 11:30 Mac Jones needs more weapons  13:20 Patriots backfield  FanDuel Sportsbook is the exclusive wagering partner of the CLNS Media Network! Visit https://FanDuel.com/BOSTON to get up to TWO HUNDRED DOLLARS in bonus bets! Take your first swing at betting MLB on FanDuel and get TEN TIMES your first bet amount in bonus bets - up to TWO HUNDRED DOLLARS – win or lose.  21+ and present in MA. First online real money wager only. $10 Deposit req. Refund issued as non-withdrawable bonus bets that expire in 14 days. Restrictions apply. See terms at fanduel.com/sportsbook. Hope is here. GamblingHelpLineMA.org or call (800)-327-5050 for 24/7 support. Play it smart from the start! GameSenseMA.com or call 1-800-GAM-1234. FanDuel – Official Partner of Major League Baseball.  Major League Baseball trademarks used with permission.

Transcript

00:00 (upbeat music)

00:02 - What's going on everyone?

00:06 It's Taylor Powell here for CLNS Media.

00:08 And I'm honored to be joined by one of my favorite

00:11 human beings and NFL analyst.

00:14 That's gonna be Damian Parsons.

00:16 You may know him from the Draft Network.

00:17 He does some outstanding work,

00:19 even covered someone for the Patriots,

00:21 which we'll get into.

00:22 And he's also got some excellent work on Locked on Draft,

00:25 Locked on Clemson, and the Scout Room,

00:28 which I'm very excited to check out on YouTube.

00:30 That's budding.

00:31 He's got some great content in the pipeline.

00:34 Dame, thank you so much for coming on, brother.

00:36 - Bro, it's been a long time coming, man.

00:38 We've been boys for a minute.

00:39 So, you know, I'm honored to be on here,

00:42 talk some ball with you and finally get going.

00:45 - Absolutely, man.

00:46 And there was actually a last minute addition to the show,

00:48 'cause you were telling me on Locked on Draft,

00:50 you actually had a debate on Mack Jones versus Bailey Zappi,

00:54 which, you know, it's been hotly talked about.

00:57 I think some of that may have, you know,

00:59 kind of leveled out a bit

01:00 now that we have some practices underway,

01:02 but training camps here,

01:02 this is where things get really competitive.

01:04 So before we get into that,

01:06 tomorrow's the first day of training camp.

01:07 We're recording this on Monday.

01:08 What do you think about that potential camp battle

01:11 and who do you see coming out on top?

01:13 - Man, I think Mack Jones is gonna come out on top of that.

01:16 You know, I feel like skillset-wise, they're very similar,

01:20 which is why, like for me, you know, being in Vegas,

01:23 when that draft pick came through,

01:24 that Bailey Zappi in the fourth round,

01:26 I was taken back 'cause I was like,

01:28 you already have Mack.

01:29 Like, there's no need to bring in another quarterback

01:31 that can do the similar things that Mack does.

01:34 'Cause when I look at Mack,

01:35 I see a kind of a point guard-esque type of quarterback,

01:39 a guy that distributes the ball,

01:41 can get it to his playmakers, you know,

01:42 you work well in the quick game, you know,

01:45 instinctive, high football IQ,

01:47 but the physical tools are, you know,

01:50 average, you know, at best.

01:51 So it's like, all right,

01:53 let me get Mack as many weapons as possible, right?

01:55 You look at, you know, crazy enough,

01:57 yeah, wild enough, Mike,

01:59 the Alabamas had three quarterbacks that very similar,

02:03 like they're high football IQ, you know,

02:06 good passers, accurate,

02:07 but they just lack the physical tools,

02:10 Mack, Tua, and now Bryce Young.

02:12 And we see what Miami, you know,

02:14 bringing in coach Mike McDaniels has done for Tua.

02:19 It's not just, hey, we're gonna run the ball,

02:21 gonna get some improved protection on the line,

02:24 but also let's go get you another,

02:25 get you some more weapons, right?

02:27 And I think that's gonna be the big thing.

02:29 And that's what I wanted to see.

02:30 So when Bailey Zappi became the pick,

02:33 I was like, okay, you know,

02:34 and my guy, my co-host and partner over at TDN,

02:37 Keith was like, they drafted the quarterback

02:40 that has the ability to make this a controversy.

02:42 And we saw a little bit of that

02:44 at the beginning of the season last year

02:46 when Bailey Zappi, the crowds calling for him

02:49 and chanting for him,

02:50 and he's coming in and making the right plays.

02:52 But I do feel like Mack is a better quarterback.

02:55 I feel like Mack instinctively is better.

02:58 And I think he's gonna make more of the right decisions

03:00 with the football.

03:01 But if they make, if this is actually,

03:03 if this becomes a battle,

03:05 I would not be surprised that it's a close one.

03:07 I feel like that Bailey Zappi, again,

03:09 physically is kind of neck and neck

03:12 in terms of like a straightaway race with Mack.

03:15 But I do lean to Mack.

03:16 Mack was, for one, draft capital matters

03:18 a lot of times with teams.

03:20 He was a first round pick.

03:21 He was a top 20 pick.

03:23 And unless Bill Belichick absolutely has no faith in him,

03:26 which I don't foresee that being the case,

03:28 I think that Mack is still gonna get the opportunity

03:31 to go out there and prove that he's the quarterback

03:33 of the future for this team,

03:34 especially heading into a pivotal year three,

03:37 where typically you start to see that either ascension

03:41 or that dissension of a young quarterback.

03:44 - Absolutely.

03:45 So I mentioned your great work on the draft.

03:47 The Patriots this year went pretty defensive heavy early on.

03:50 Now, three guys where you could argue

03:52 you could have gotten,

03:53 like I loved Zay Flowers before the draft.

03:55 Obviously Christian Gonzalez falls to them.

03:56 Then they get Keon White,

03:57 who you did a great write-up on, on the draft network.

04:01 Then they get Marte Mapu,

04:02 who was a low-key guy who I personally loved

04:04 just 'cause he's got so much physical talent.

04:06 He's smart, just came from a smaller program.

04:08 And then rather than kind of stock up on high-name weapons,

04:11 like all the tight ends that were in this draft,

04:13 they went more O-line heavy,

04:15 kind of got themselves a couple kickers,

04:17 and then waited until late rounds

04:19 to get Kayshaun Booty and Demario Douglas.

04:21 So as somebody who covers the draft so well,

04:23 I remember the day after you were tweeting

04:25 that you were gonna do a mock draft

04:26 or study for next year.

04:27 I'm like, bro, like give yourself a minute,

04:29 like treat yourself, but you're a hardworking guy

04:32 and I love that about you.

04:33 So what was your way-too-early grade on the Patriots draft?

04:35 Like I said, didn't get that big-name weapon,

04:37 but it felt like they filled

04:38 a lot of other really crucial holes.

04:41 - I felt like, I think,

04:42 'cause I ended up having to do it for TDOs,

04:44 around a C-plus, I believe,

04:46 they started off really strong.

04:48 Like for whatever reason,

04:49 the NFL allowed Bill Belichick to get Christian Gonzalez.

04:53 Like I feel like that was just a big mistake.

04:56 He was, to me, he was my CB1.

04:59 It wasn't, you know,

05:01 I really love Devin Witherspoon and everything,

05:02 but when you talk about just coverageability,

05:05 there wasn't anybody in this class that was on par

05:09 in terms of just man-to-man coverage as Christian Gonzalez.

05:12 The elite athleticism, like,

05:14 and it's crazy 'cause I was just watching a receiver

05:17 a couple of weeks ago for the 2024 class

05:20 that actually faced off with him.

05:22 I can't remember which, was it Jacob Cowling?

05:24 It was one of those Pac-12 receivers.

05:26 And I'm watching him and I realized,

05:28 I was like, "Who is following him?"

05:30 And it was Christian Gonzalez.

05:31 'Cause I was just like, this dude's in his hip pocket

05:34 like every route, almost.

05:35 And just the transitions, the fluidity,

05:38 just the easiness that he brings to,

05:40 just as a movement, you know,

05:42 when it comes to movement skills.

05:43 So with him, and I love the Keon White thing,

05:46 and I remember telling some of my guys,

05:48 I said, "Listen, Bill Belichick is the perfect guy

05:50 "for Keon White."

05:51 Keon White is a former tight end from Old Dominion

05:54 that transitioned to a defensive end,

05:56 stand-up outside, stand-up edge rusher

05:58 when he got to Georgia Tech,

05:59 but he lost a year due to injury

06:02 after he made the change to the defensive side of the ball.

06:04 So this young man,

06:05 even though I think he's like 24 years old,

06:07 people are like, "Well, he's in age, he's old,

06:09 "but in football, he's still young."

06:11 Especially on the defensive side of the ball,

06:14 he's still young and raw.

06:15 And I feel like Bill Belichick,

06:16 we've seen him get guys like this before, right,

06:19 that are athletic, versatile, they just need coaching up.

06:23 And Bill Belichick's gonna be the right guy

06:25 to get Keon White and put him at advantage of the situation.

06:29 You think about Jamie Collins, you know,

06:31 coming out of, I think it was Southern Mississippi

06:33 or something like that.

06:34 Jamie Collins played linebacker, edge,

06:38 and safety in college.

06:39 He did all of it,

06:41 'cause he was just that type of athlete.

06:42 And when you look at Keon White being 285, 290,

06:46 but a guy that can run with running backs on wheel routes

06:49 down the sideline and rush from the interior as a three tech,

06:53 rush from the outside, got to convert speed to power.

06:57 I think that was just a match made in heaven for him

07:00 to go to a Bill Belichick-led team.

07:02 And then like you said, Marte Mapu,

07:04 like this is a kid that we have not seen the best of yet,

07:07 'cause he's such a athlete, playmaker,

07:11 in terms of being versatile,

07:13 where some teams haven't pegged as a safety,

07:15 some teams haven't pegged as a linebacker,

07:17 and other teams that I remember talking to

07:18 haven't pegged as kind of like a hybrid, just in between.

07:21 And it just depends on the sets that they wanted to run,

07:23 is where he would be, if they draft him,

07:25 where he will be aligned.

07:26 So I'm excited for those three defensive players

07:30 to absolutely, you know,

07:31 just kind of get those opportunities

07:33 with Bill Belichick, you know, calling the plays

07:36 and really coaching them up.

07:37 I think for me, I didn't,

07:40 when it went O-line, like when it started going,

07:42 the run on O-line kind of happened a little early,

07:45 but then not only did it happen early,

07:47 it happened in bunches.

07:48 Like it went center, and then in the forefront,

07:50 'cause they have three forefront picks, it went center.

07:53 The kicker thing threw me off as well,

07:55 and then he went back to back guards.

07:58 With Antonio Moffitt, I'm gonna say this,

07:59 like out of all those guys,

08:01 Jake Andrews, really competitive kid at the senior bowl,

08:04 and everything, I don't,

08:06 I never got a chance to actually watch Sidney Sowell,

08:08 but I heard good things about him.

08:09 But Antonio Moffitt, like that's the one for me.

08:12 Like this kid, strong, physical, like tone setter,

08:17 and if anybody remembers the clip of Quentin Nelson

08:21 coming out of Notre Dame,

08:22 the clip that went viral of him,

08:24 in pass protection, he's uncovered,

08:26 has no one to block, scans and sees a free runner

08:29 all across the formation,

08:30 goes and gives a kill shot and lays the guy out.

08:33 Like I think I tweeted out,

08:35 I think I actually tweeted a play like that for Moffitt,

08:39 where he's kind of uncovered,

08:40 there's somebody looping around,

08:42 and he just kill shots the kid,

08:43 like knocks him on his butt, drops him,

08:45 and he brings that, and that's what you want.

08:47 So you're talking about being a physical team,

08:50 late in the year, cold weather,

08:54 this is what, you know, he's the type of guy.

08:56 So that's the guy,

08:56 out of all these interior offensive linemen,

08:58 that was my favorite pick,

08:59 'cause he fits that Patriot mold.

09:02 Yeah, you play at UCLA, and it's warm over there,

09:05 but his game travels to cold weather situations.

09:08 So I'm excited for that, man.

09:09 And like I said,

09:10 the Kayshaun Boutin and Demario Douglas,

09:12 I liked those picks, especially where they were.

09:14 Demario Douglas was the best weapon from Malik Willis

09:17 on a pretty bad, like Liberty team.

09:19 It wasn't a good team in terms of NFL talent,

09:21 but Demario Douglas is a good slot receiver

09:24 that you can use in a variety of ways.

09:26 You're talking about pre-step motions,

09:28 orbit, return orbit, different things like that,

09:30 ghost and jet motion,

09:32 and really get the ball to him in space.

09:35 Being a space player, manufactured touches,

09:37 but he's a good route runner as well.

09:39 So it's like, you think about adding him,

09:41 and he changes pace really well with his routes,

09:44 tempos them well, good burst and explosiveness

09:47 in terms of athletic ability.

09:49 So I liked that.

09:49 And then of course, Kayshaun Boutin,

09:51 and I think this is the one where,

09:53 yes, he didn't test well and things like that,

09:56 but I always tell people, man,

09:58 there's testing athleticism,

10:00 then there's functional athleticism.

10:01 So with him, you pop on the Georgia tape,

10:05 SEC championship game, right?

10:07 Takes a crossing route and leaves everybody from Georgia

10:10 and their star studded athletic defensive unit in the dust.

10:13 He turns it up and he takes it for a touchdown, right?

10:16 Being able to outrun the Keely Ringo's,

10:18 the Christopher Smith's and Kamari Lassett,

10:20 all those athletic guys in that back end,

10:23 he outran Malakai Stark,

10:24 so none of them could catch him, right?

10:26 So it was like, I don't care what he ran at the combine,

10:29 when you turn on the tape,

10:29 you see a guy that plays with good speed,

10:32 on field speed, in game speed,

10:35 he does a good job of that.

10:36 So he's the one that I'm really looking forward

10:38 to watching in camp,

10:40 'cause I wanna see,

10:41 'cause Coach Arnold talks about him off the field,

10:45 his decision-making and things like that,

10:47 how would that pair well with a Bill Belichick?

10:51 And sometimes a hard, tough coach like that

10:54 is what guys like a Keyshawn Butte actually needs.

10:57 So if this works out,

10:59 this could be one of those kind of game-changing type

11:02 of players and Belichick's known for getting guys

11:05 in this fifth, sixth, and seventh rounds

11:07 throughout his coaching career,

11:09 that everybody else is like,

11:10 "Ah, hard pass, I'm fine, right?

11:12 You know, Tom Brady, I'm fine, I want Tom Brady."

11:14 Julian Alleman, like, he's a quarterback,

11:16 what are we gonna do with that guy?

11:17 Like, you know what I mean?

11:18 And he knows how to turn those guys

11:20 from afterthoughts to ahead of the class,

11:23 and I'm really excited to see what Keyshawn Butte will bring.

11:26 I guess I gave it, I think it was like a C,

11:29 either C, C-plus, 'cause like the run-on offensive lineman

11:32 kind of threw me, 'cause I was like,

11:33 "Man, I would like to get Mac some more weapons,

11:37 some like big-time playmakers,

11:38 and really elevate his game,

11:40 and allow him to walk out of the huddle with confidence

11:44 in what he's surrounded by."

11:47 When you know, like, "Okay, they're playing man-to-man,

11:49 I got a guy that could beat that with ease, you know?

11:51 And like, I'm gonna look for him

11:52 and find that one-on-one matchup with him

11:54 every chance I can, right?"

11:56 Like the Devontae Adams,

11:57 the DeAndre Hopkins of the world,

11:59 like those type of guys, you know, Mac needs one of those.

12:02 He needs one of those guys, now Juju's gonna be big,

12:05 Mike Gusecki, I think is gonna have a big-time role

12:07 in his offense, and he can,

12:08 but that was my biggest gripe with Belichick,

12:11 is like, "I know you haven't had the best luck

12:14 drafting receivers, but man, give Mac some weapons,

12:17 so we can really see how high his ceiling can go

12:21 with more talent around him."

12:23 - Absolutely, I could talk to you about the draft all day.

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13:16 - But we gotta move on real quick to running backs,

13:22 'cause that's, you're my running back guy.

13:24 Anytime I wanna know about a prospect or anybody like that,

13:26 I come to you.

13:27 So the Patriots, you know, we talked about the weapons

13:29 and Mac feeling uncomfortable.

13:31 The running back room is probably the most talented

13:33 in terms of like, if everybody places their potential,

13:36 you can have a really, really good group of players.

13:39 Now, they are still looking for help.

13:41 They worked out Leonard Fournette,

13:42 they worked out Darrell Henderson,

13:44 they've been linked to Dalvin Cook.

13:45 Dalvin Cook, I know he's expecting like $8 million a year,

13:48 and the Jets are saying,

13:49 they seem to be the front runner right now,

13:51 and they're saying,

13:52 "We're probably not gonna get more than six."

13:53 Which of those players do you think fits best

13:55 in their system?

13:56 Obviously, like, they've got different types of skill sets,

13:59 but who do you think would be the best guy,

14:00 considering they've got a Romandre Stevenson,

14:02 who's gonna be your workhorse,

14:04 you're running back 1A at worst,

14:06 and then they still have talented, but unproven guys

14:08 like Kevin Harris and Pierre Strong behind him.

14:10 Who do you think would be the best person

14:11 to bring in around training camp?

14:13 - I think Leonard Fournette, you know,

14:17 of course, Dalvin Cook,

14:18 'cause he's the best back available right now,

14:20 but the money is probably not gonna work in his favor

14:23 to land with the Patriots.

14:25 But I think Leonard Fournette would be a great addition,

14:27 mainly because he doesn't have to play

14:30 RB1 role anymore for you, you know what I mean?

14:33 Where Romandre Stevenson,

14:34 and especially in this Bill O'Brien offense,

14:36 watching, going back to what he ran last year in Alabama,

14:39 when you studied Jameer Gibbs and Jason McClellan

14:42 for the Alabama backfield,

14:45 it was a lot of zone runs.

14:46 So, like, you know, just kind of pressing the outside,

14:49 reading and diagnosing if it's a hard edge,

14:51 is it a soft edge,

14:52 and then making the right cutoff.

14:53 And I think Romandre Stevenson,

14:55 with his processing and quick processing ability,

14:57 his quick feet for, and I'll tell you,

15:01 I was actually, I remember it was like,

15:04 right when he was coming into the draft,

15:06 he went to the senior bowl, he had a great senior bowl,

15:08 he dropped weight and all that good stuff.

15:10 And I remember when I was watching him,

15:12 and I tweeted out, I said,

15:14 "He is what Eddie Lacy was before the weight issues,"

15:17 when he was healthy.

15:18 And I was like, "When you see a big back

15:20 "with this type of speed, foot quickness, power,

15:23 "can catch the ball,

15:25 "do all the things that he can do."

15:27 That was Eddie Lacy.

15:28 And when Eddie Lacy was in his prime,

15:31 health-wise and everything else,

15:32 he was an absolute monster,

15:34 in Alabama and with Green Bay and his short stint there.

15:37 So I think with Romandre, he's gonna be RB1.

15:42 I feel like Leonard Fournette could come in

15:44 and really, for one, keep him healthy,

15:46 keep him fresh, especially throughout the season.

15:49 If you wanna be a run-heavy team,

15:51 at the end of the day,

15:52 you wanna have multiple and capable bodies

15:54 of handling that workload.

15:56 Now, I will say, I think he will be the best price option,

16:00 like I said, 'cause that one could probably

16:01 go out-price himself for the Patriots.

16:03 But on the roster, I think Pierre Estrang

16:06 is the guy that I would look at to being that,

16:09 if they don't bring in another veteran back

16:12 and they roll with Romandre and what's on the roster.

16:15 I liked Kevin Harris,

16:16 like a year before he was draft eligible.

16:20 I was like, he had a strong season in South Carolina

16:22 than his last year.

16:23 It didn't go so well,

16:25 and just offense didn't look great.

16:27 Offensive line was iffy as well.

16:30 But when I look at Pierre Estrang,

16:32 he fits that zone type of scheme.

16:36 He reminded me a lot of Elijah Mitchell,

16:38 who was kind of a standout, went healthy for the 49ers

16:42 after he was drafted.

16:43 And he works well in that zone scheme.

16:45 He understands how to read, leverage,

16:47 and manipulate second-level defenders,

16:50 be patient to press and sell,

16:52 like, hey, I'm going outside of the tackle,

16:54 get those guys to commit and overflow and then cut it up.

16:58 And he had that type of speed that I think, if anything,

17:02 that gives that really good one-two punch,

17:05 'cause you know you're gonna deal with the power

17:07 that is Romandre Stevenson

17:10 and his quickness and speed in general.

17:13 But it always throws a defense off,

17:14 and especially linebackers, when you change the pace

17:18 and you bring in a more explosive, more dynamic guy,

17:20 and now you gotta be a little more quicker to the draw.

17:23 You know what I mean?

17:24 Like an old Western, you gotta be quick to the draw,

17:26 because if you're not, the next thing you know,

17:27 he's cutting back on you and you're flat-footed,

17:29 and now you can't change directions,

17:32 and he's going for six.

17:33 Where, you know, with Romandre Stevenson,

17:35 it's a little bit more calculated.

17:36 You're like, okay, let's kind of corral him in.

17:38 So I think Fournette would be the best veteran choice,

17:42 but on the roster, I would love to see Pierre

17:45 get the opportunity to be that RB, too,

17:47 'cause I think him and Stevenson

17:49 will give them a really good dose,

17:51 one-two punch, kind of thunder, lightning of a sort,

17:54 and he even runs hard himself in terms of,

17:56 and with Pierre, he runs hard, too.

17:58 But especially if Bill O'Brien's gonna keep

18:00 running this zone offense, zone run game,

18:03 I absolutely think Romandre and Pierre

18:06 could be a really good tandem for the Patriots.

18:09 - I actually wanna get more into Bill O'Brien's scheme,

18:11 talk a little bit more about Stevenson and Strong

18:13 a little later, but just to set the tone,

18:15 last year, obviously, the Patriots offense was a mess.

18:17 It was disjointed.

18:19 You don't expect to see a huge amount of carryover

18:21 from what they were doing last year,

18:23 but you did see them have success,

18:24 where usually you see them as more just like a duo team,

18:27 where it's a lot of double teams, counter,

18:29 and they're always gonna be a multiple rushing attack,

18:31 but at the same time, they completely scrapped outside zone

18:34 because Matt Patricia didn't seem to know

18:36 how to really teach it to the way

18:37 that they could execute it at a high level,

18:39 really affected their scheme.

18:40 So from Bill O'Brien's perspective,

18:42 you got Romandre, who's still very good

18:44 on those downhill runs, like a Leonard Fournette.

18:46 He's really good in running duo, counter,

18:49 a lot of those gap schemes, and even Patricia last year,

18:52 he incorporated some RPOs,

18:53 but everything was behind the line of scrimmage.

18:55 There wasn't anything really threatening you

18:57 where linebackers are saying,

18:58 "I'm worried about you throwing it over my head

19:00 "if I freeze in respect to run."

19:02 So not even necessarily compared to Matt Patricia,

19:04 but just compared to what we've seen traditionally

19:06 from the Patriots, what do you think Bill O'Brien's

19:08 gonna bring from that Steve Sarkeesian, Alabama

19:11 kind of hybrid system where he put some of his stuff,

19:14 but also took what they've been doing well,

19:15 and that Matt's familiar with?

19:17 So how do you think that run game's gonna look this season?

19:19 - I think it should still be versatile.

19:21 I think it should.

19:22 It's one of those situations where I can envision it

19:25 being like the Cleveland Browns,

19:27 where the Browns, when they had Nick Chubb

19:30 and Kareem Hunt both healthy,

19:32 you got a double dose of concepts

19:34 where you see Chubb come in and they're running zone,

19:37 then Kareem comes in, they're running gap.

19:39 And it's like, it's so difficult.

19:41 And then they will flip it and they'll run the opposite

19:44 with the other back.

19:45 And it keeps you as a defense on your toes

19:47 because you can't get a hold of tendencies.

19:51 Right?

19:52 And I think that's why reason why I really like Pierre,

19:54 because again, you watch what Bill O'Brien did last year

19:57 with Alabama, he had Jameer Gibbs and Jason McClellan.

20:00 They will stretch you out wide.

20:02 And you could tell the running backs

20:03 were taught to be patient, trust your blocks,

20:06 stretch it out a little bit, and then one cut and go,

20:09 and get up field and get whatever is blocked.

20:11 If it's four yards, get the four yards, right?

20:13 If you can get more, get more,

20:15 but at least get your shoulder squared

20:17 to the line of scrimmage, get it parallel and go forward.

20:20 And then with, you know, and you look,

20:21 even looking at, you know, courtesy of like PFF,

20:24 like last year they have Ramondi Stevenson,

20:28 of course, 107 carries out of gap,

20:30 but he had 82 out of zone.

20:32 So he's not unfamiliar with that, right?

20:34 And he knows how to run it where even, you know,

20:37 same thing with like, you know, Damian Harris,

20:39 it was like a 55, 47, 57, 47 split between gap and zone.

20:44 So I think it will be a similar situation

20:46 where they might lean more on the zone run,

20:50 but still have those moments of gap scheme

20:53 to keep offenses or defenses on their toes

20:57 and allow them to be creative.

20:58 'Cause with that type of stuff, man,

21:00 you can do a lot of different things.

21:01 And talking about creativity,

21:03 where you have like split zone action,

21:06 like I said, duo, you know,

21:08 running the ghost motion, pre-snap,

21:11 and still aim to kind of sell that,

21:13 get guys to move and bump over to the opposite gap

21:16 and then run zone on the opposite side of it,

21:19 which I saw them do with, you know,

21:20 Bill O'Brien do with Jameer Gibbs last year.

21:23 He did a good job of that.

21:24 He understands how to manipulate the box count.

21:27 And that's what's really like,

21:28 at the end of the day,

21:29 everything is a numbers game in the NFL.

21:31 So especially the run game.

21:33 Now you got a couple of guys

21:33 who can still run for a thousand yards

21:35 before, you know, eight, nine men in the box.

21:37 And it's like, like Derrick Henry and Christian McCaffrey,

21:40 but that's not the norm for everybody else.

21:42 When you start loading the box,

21:44 guys start to be less effective.

21:45 So he understands, especially with it,

21:47 even with his sets, you know,

21:49 kind of going to 11 personnel

21:50 and detaching a tight end and moving guys,

21:53 getting bodies outside of the tackle box,

21:55 where it's like, okay,

21:56 now your quarterback and survey is like,

21:58 yep, we're going to stick with this run play

22:00 instead of, you know, kind of all, you know,

22:01 go ahead and audible to a pass

22:03 and you want to stick with what's working.

22:04 So I think with Bill O'Brien,

22:06 he's going to bring enough creativity in the run game.

22:09 He's going to bring spacing in the run game,

22:11 but he's going to be,

22:12 he's going to be balanced in terms of,

22:13 I think you're going to see both zone and gap.

22:16 And that's what I said.

22:17 I'm really excited if they do just go with Pierre

22:20 and, and Ramondrick,

22:21 because I think if he,

22:22 if he sticks to what he did at Bama,

22:24 this run game is going to be really successful.

22:27 - Isn't it so nice to have an offensive coordinator

22:29 who knows what he's doing?

22:30 I'm not trying to dunk on Mattie P, but like, man.

22:32 - I know Mac Jones is happy about it.

22:34 - I know.

22:35 And I know you've been watching the Pats film.

22:36 Like it was not easy to watch just a lot of,

22:39 a lot of not so great.

22:41 I'll leave it at that.

22:42 You know, I keep going for a minute,

22:43 just going off of last year's, to put it nicely,

22:47 catastrophe, but Ramondrick Stevenson.

22:49 Now another, I would say kind of a slight,

22:52 you look at the Madden ratings,

22:53 obviously Madden ratings aren't everything,

22:55 but when you see Ramondrick Stevenson,

22:57 isn't even in the top 20 for running backs,

23:00 that seems a little bit odd to me.

23:01 So I understand that like league wide,

23:03 he may not even be seen as necessarily a top 10 back,

23:06 just, you know, if you ask the average fan.

23:08 I think if you watch the tape,

23:09 you'll see this is a guy who's not only emerging,

23:11 but I think already is kind of like knocking on the door

23:14 that maybe not upper echelon,

23:16 where you're talking like a Chubb or a Henry,

23:17 where it's like, these guys just aren't human.

23:19 Like don't compare anybody to them

23:20 because they are their own person.

23:21 But right under that,

23:22 do you think that Ramondrick could be knocking on the door,

23:25 like a top eight back, like getting into that top 10?

23:28 And how do you think that happens?

23:30 Like, what do you,

23:30 do we see something different from his game?

23:32 Does he just get better

23:33 because the situation around him is better?

23:35 How do you see him in year three?

23:37 - I do think he's knocking on that door.

23:39 This is a talented runner,

23:40 a guy that has for a big body guy,

23:43 typically you see those guys and you think,

23:45 okay, power, power, he's going to try and lean on me,

23:47 fall forward, and then he does those things.

23:49 But there's a level of nuance in terms of patience,

23:53 vision, processing, stop start ability

23:56 to get in and out of exchange gaps, the footwork.

23:59 And that's the,

24:00 I always tell people the big thing with Gap versus Zone,

24:02 the footwork is totally different.

24:04 As you know what I mean?

24:05 It's where, Zone, you're pressing

24:07 and you're stringing the run out,

24:08 then you plant the outside foot and you get squared

24:11 and you get vertical.

24:12 Where in Gap, you're attacking,

24:14 but you have to be able to exchange gaps

24:17 in case something changes.

24:19 That nose tackle picks the gap you're supposed to hit.

24:22 Now you got to slide, you got to jump cut.

24:25 You got to quickly move your feet to then,

24:27 if he wants to displace himself,

24:29 you got to replace him where he left that void.

24:31 And Ramon De Steves does a good job of that.

24:33 He has the open field burst in speed to make you pay

24:38 when you're not able to corral him within that 10 yards.

24:40 I always say that for me, with running backs, yes,

24:43 it'll be great to have running backs

24:44 that consistently run four three.

24:46 I personally don't care because a lot of fastbacks

24:49 don't have the patience.

24:51 And I always use this analogy.

24:53 Yes, it's cool to drive a Lamborghini

24:56 when there's no one on the road,

24:58 but can you navigate through five o'clock traffic?

25:00 - Right. - Right?

25:01 Can you navigate and get into the creases

25:03 and gaps of traffic and then get in front of the pack?

25:05 Okay, now you can let that bad boy open.

25:08 Can you, then you can open it up.

25:09 But when there's a bunch of cars

25:10 and there's a lot of moving parts

25:12 and everything else is kind of chaotic,

25:14 you can't open it up 'cause you're going to wreck.

25:16 So it's like, those are the type of things

25:18 I talk about with running backs.

25:20 And Ramon De Steves understands how to do those things.

25:23 So I think he is knocking on the door.

25:24 And Madden, they don't really watch film.

25:26 So it's just like, it's very, very apparent

25:28 when you look at their rankings.

25:30 It was like, oh, well, you guys

25:31 didn't watch any football last year.

25:33 Great.

25:34 But so I was like, but when I look at him,

25:36 I think for him to really get the,

25:39 I mean, this young man,

25:40 looking at the numbers last year, right?

25:42 210 carries, 1,041 yards, averaging five yards a pop.

25:47 And he had only five touchdowns.

25:50 So you want to see the touchdowns get closer to 10

25:54 and you want to see them,

25:55 if they run them as much,

25:57 you want to see him break a few more big runs, right?

25:59 'Cause that's the highlight reel stuff

26:01 and get up from 1041, let's get up to 1200.

26:04 You know what I mean?

26:05 1200 yards, still averaging four and 4.5,

26:07 four to five yards per carry

26:09 and get up to like 10 Russian touchdowns for the season.

26:12 But also he can catch the football.

26:13 So I want to see them get him more reps in the passing game.

26:16 So people really know what this young man can do.

26:19 'Cause again, if he's a fantasy stud, right?

26:21 If he becomes a true fantasy stud,

26:23 now that whole world knows about him.

26:24 - Everybody knows, exactly, exactly.

26:27 Now, I think the biggest thing,

26:28 seeing him take that jump,

26:30 like last year you saw the receiving and all that stuff,

26:32 but he was the offense.

26:34 It's not good when your runner is both your lead back

26:37 in terms of rushing

26:38 and he's also one of your leading receivers.

26:40 That's not a combination you want,

26:41 especially with someone like his running style.

26:44 So that puts more important on someone like,

26:46 you know, running backs, there's different roles.

26:47 There's really a workhorse,

26:48 a change of pace back and a third down back.

26:51 Ramond Drake was doing all of that last season.

26:52 He was just not sustained.

26:54 Luckily he worked out and got in better shape,

26:56 but that's where, like we talked about it, Peter Strong.

26:58 You'd ideally like to see him as that change of pace back

27:01 and also as your third down back

27:03 because of his explosiveness.

27:04 And you've seen that, you know, in college

27:06 and the Patriots tried it a little bit last season,

27:08 him even going down field on seams and stuff like that.

27:11 But the incumbent is Ty Montgomery.

27:13 Like week one last season, he was the third down back.

27:16 Unfortunately had a really bad knee injury

27:18 and missed the rest of the season,

27:19 but he's been working out like crazy.

27:20 And although he's mostly a slot receiver in camp

27:22 because of depth issues,

27:23 you expect him to be that guy just as the veteran.

27:26 So what does Peter Strong have to do

27:27 to separate himself from Ty Montgomery,

27:29 kind of establish that not only can it be

27:31 a change of pace back,

27:32 but also a guy you rely on on third downs

27:34 and passing situations.

27:36 And if he can't snatch that job from Montgomery,

27:38 what does Ty give you in that role?

27:40 - So first thing Peter is going to have to do, you know,

27:43 'cause a coach like Bill Belichick

27:44 is not going to play with it,

27:45 is protect the quarterback, right?

27:47 You know, be disciplined, square, you know,

27:49 be square, square up your target,

27:52 scan the field, find, if you're uncovered, find work.

27:56 Like you cannot sit back there and just twiddle your thumbs.

27:59 So being reliable and pass protection

28:01 to where if, yeah, you're supposed to go on the route,

28:03 but Mac sees pre-snap that,

28:05 hey man, that nickel's coming.

28:07 And if he comes and you go on this route,

28:09 I'm going to be by myself.

28:11 You're going to be, you know, leaving me hanging.

28:14 So Mac makes the change and Peter Strong can show him that,

28:17 hey, I'm reliable enough to make this happen

28:20 and to take care of it.

28:21 Perfect, right?

28:22 So that, and then, you know,

28:24 if he can line up in a slot, you know,

28:26 and detach from the formation,

28:28 come out of the backfield and be used as a motion player too

28:32 to where you can start running routes with him

28:34 and you find ways to get him matched up on linebackers,

28:36 let that speed take account in open field.

28:39 But also, all right, do you have any,

28:41 do you have just, I would say basic route running

28:43 where we can run some whip routes with you?

28:45 We can run some choice routes with you

28:47 against some linebackers or even some safeties.

28:49 And I think that'll be big.

28:50 But if he can't win the job from Ty,

28:52 that's where you want to see Ty thrive

28:55 because he's a former receiver.

28:56 Ty, we want to move, we don't even,

28:58 yeah, we want you to be reliable in pass protection too,

29:00 but Ty, we want you out in the slot.

29:02 We want to get you up against some of these linebackers.

29:04 If we know, coverage indication, right?

29:06 If we know it's man to man,

29:08 and Mac feels like it's man to man,

29:09 motion Ty out, Mac, and let's see what it is.

29:11 And if they motion that linebacker out there with him,

29:13 you know, that's your hot.

29:14 If they try to send some pressure backside.

29:17 And then that allows you to have that mismatch weapon

29:20 'cause it's all about creating mismatches.

29:22 Locate it, create it, locate it, and exploit it.

29:27 That's the key to it.

29:28 Exploit that mismatch.

29:29 I think Ty can do that,

29:31 but I would love to see if Pierre Strong

29:34 can do the same thing or just to an extent.

29:37 I'm not asking him to go out there

29:38 and be a route running savant.

29:39 Don't, you don't have to be James White.

29:41 You know, that's not what we're asking you to be,

29:43 but just go out there and be functional

29:45 in terms of route runner

29:46 so that we can use you more in the passing game

29:48 and allow your speed.

29:50 'Cause he's probably the fastest back,

29:51 you know, in the backfield in that room.

29:54 And if that's the case, we want that speed on the field,

29:56 Pierre, we want to get you on the field

29:57 and really take over.

29:59 - I love the mess of the mismatches

30:00 'cause that's Bill O'Brien's entire thing.

30:02 It's where can I put you as empty packages?

30:04 It's like, all right, I'm gonna put you

30:05 inside the formation.

30:06 You're good.

30:07 Someone's gonna have a really good matchup,

30:08 whether you're the number three, the number two weak,

30:10 like there's gonna be a linebacker on somebody.

30:12 How can you exploit that?

30:14 - Damn, exceeded my expectations.

30:16 I didn't even know that was possible.

30:18 Obviously we're gonna have to have you back,

30:19 but I have to be conscientious of your time.

30:21 You're a very busy man.

30:22 So if there's anything you'd like to plug,

30:24 let the people know what you've got going on,

30:26 please, the floor is yours.

30:28 - Of course, like, you know, over at the Draft Network,

30:30 I actually just dropped the mock draft today.

30:32 It should be out on Twitter just for early 2024 mock.

30:36 You know, I want to get into the action.

30:37 As well as Locked On NFL Draft.

30:39 You know, we're not just an NFL draft podcast.

30:41 We talk college football, we talk NFL.

30:43 Things of that nature.

30:44 And if you're a Clemson fan and a Patriot fan,

30:47 tap into Locked On Clemson as well.

30:49 And I will be having a Patreon and dis,

30:52 a Patreon account dropping where, you know, you can join,

30:55 especially if you're, you know,

30:57 I'll be doing a lot more film breakdowns for Clemson

31:00 and everything like that on there as well.

31:02 And I'll be tapping into like Carolina Panthers,

31:04 Atlanta Falcon stuff.

31:05 So definitely you want to tap into more NFL stuff in general,

31:08 breaking down football, holla at your boy.

31:11 One of the hardest working men in the business.

31:13 Thank you again, Dame.

31:14 Appreciate you.

31:16 Thank you everybody for tuning in.

31:17 Appreciate you, buddy.

31:19 Take care of yourselves.

31:20 Take care of each other.

31:21 We'll see you next time.

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