- 8 minutes ago
In this video, Tom's Guide's Mark Spoonauer and TechRadar's Lance Ulanoff sit down to talk about the foldable phones announced at Galaxy Unpacked with Jay Kim, executive vice president at Samsung. In this exclusive interview, we discuss Samsung's shift to a 3-foldable portfolio (Galaxy Z Fold 8 Ultra, Galaxy Z Fold 8, and Z Flip ), the brand-new wider passport form factor, the leap to silicon-carbon batteries and what Samsung thinks about the long-rumored foldable iPhone gearing up to launch.
Has Samsung’s 7-year head start built an unbreakable lead?
Has Samsung’s 7-year head start built an unbreakable lead?
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TechTranscript
00:00If our market player, you know, player is coming into the market and bringing the Fold type,
00:07then it proves that what I have been thinking and what I've been envisioning and how much of the
00:12effort that we put it in is actually the right direction that we took. The Samsung Galaxy Z Fold
00:188 lineup is now out and it's launched, so there's no better person to talk about that than Jay Kim,
00:24Executive Vice President for Samsung. Then we also have here Lance Yolanoff from TechRadar.
00:29It comes at a great time because another company that shall not be named is going to be entering the
00:34market later this year. We have so many questions about all of these new devices and all the innovations
00:40you're bringing to it and what it means for consumers. First question, all right, so I think
00:44the most interesting phone of the bunch in terms of the foldables is the regular Galaxy Z Fold 8
00:49because it's a completely new form factor. A lot of people up until now have been calling it the
00:53wide, but it's not called that. It's the Fold 8. So why did you come out with this design at
00:59this
00:59time and what went into it and what do you see as the target audience for it?
01:04First of all, thank you for having me. We went through seven generations of foldables and fold and
01:10flip and we learned a lot. We were pushing the boundaries and we were always asking why foldables
01:16for a long, long time. We made a lot of innovation and technology, not just the display but hinges
01:23and everything around the devices. And when we got to the seventh generation, we actually saw the flip
01:32into how consumers are reacting to the device. You know, they were asking about thickness and thinness
01:38was the issue. But now they're actually asking, Oh, actually, I have a phone that actually can be a
01:45tablet. And then that full capability of the phone is not compromising anything against the part type.
01:52So we built, you know, we felt like, okay, now people are really consumer, our consumers are really
01:58understanding why we're pushing the boundary for so long time. And this new form factor that we looked at
02:06it. When we looked at our consumer sort of insight on how people react to the products, almost over 50
02:14%
02:14are focused on media. They consume media, whether on outside, you know, cover screen or the inside,
02:21the main screen, they engage in content. And we thought, why not? And then people who likes flip,
02:28they like pocketability, you know, it's sleek and it's, you know, thin and light, you know, they want both
02:34sides of that world. So we said, why not? Let's look at it. So we studied a lot, put together
02:38the form factor
02:39where the media makes most sense, the content native device, in terms of like, how do you engage with the
02:46device. So basically, we looked at, you know, when you engage with the content, what is the best form factor,
02:52yet not compromising anything on the full bar type.
02:55I'm just kind of curious, how many designs, like different sides did you throw out?
02:59So many. So many. I mean, because you need to have a size for the cover screen, you need to
03:04have a size for
03:05the inside. And, you know, you have to look at the display yield and everything around the technology around it.
03:11And it's a balance between thickness and weight, performance and everything about the product.
03:18And we realized that there's enough segment where consumers are very heavy on media.
03:24Basically, you consume social media, you consume videos, you play a game, and you read books in a
03:31most similar form factor. So basically, we came up with a phone that's actually a very content native device.
03:39And I think it's a timing that we feel like we're confident to add additional lineup. And we feel that
03:45full eight is a sort of our full package lineup that we ever launched in the market. And we're excited
03:53about it.
03:53And I don't know if you saw it, but, you know, looking at the product, I'm really happy how our
04:00hardware and the design team came up with the product,
04:02because it's beautiful. And when we test it with the market for the preview, you know, everybody's asking about when
04:09it's coming to the market.
04:10That's a good sign.
04:11Yeah, it's a very good sign.
04:12Is there anyone who's been polarized by, I feel like when you open it, I definitely get what you're saying
04:17about being better for content consumption,
04:19especially since you don't have like the black bars that are as big above and below when you're watching video.
04:22But on the front, it's definitely a lot wider than let's say, you know, the regular or the Z Fold
04:288 Ultra,
04:30which I think is good in this, especially like when you're typing.
04:33But what about like in terms of one hand use?
04:35What are people telling you about like the wideness of the front display?
04:38And does everyone like that?
04:39No, I think we have tested. So basically, we said we had a lot of prototypes looking at different widths.
04:46But I think what we did was with testing, like, how do people use on a cover screen?
04:51Because most of the time they do is communication.
04:53Yeah.
04:53So you text a lot. It's a text where it's actually pretty good sized for texting.
04:58You get a wider keyboard.
05:00Yeah, wider keyboard and you can actually text it really well.
05:02And then also now a younger generation or, you know, short forms are becoming very popular.
05:09All those medias are going through the short form.
05:12And this is a very good size for flicking through the.
05:16Well, those soap operas, the TikTok soap operas.
05:18It's more of a, you know, before like when you open it up, it's more you're immersed into the content.
05:23But if it's closed, you're actually engaging a lot.
05:27And it's actually pretty good size to be, you know, to be wide.
05:31So it's the official, like, foldable for doom scrolling?
05:34Is that?
05:36I am kind of, so you're kind of, in a way you're explaining this because you're talking about some of
05:40the connective tissue of like how people might use this.
05:43But I am curious about how when you're trying to explain to people why you would choose a device like
05:49this, a folding device over the, over a standard phone.
05:52And then how do you differentiate the marketing between this and say the S26 line?
05:59The industry is moving into where, you know, there's AI, there's videos and games, and there's so many things that
06:06you can do with a phone.
06:07I think most conservative consumers are just happy with the bar type.
06:12They will just continue to use it.
06:13But at the same time, bar type is very confined to the screen size.
06:18So everything has to be squeezed into the side.
06:21But I think there is a more consumer who would love to leverage different size of the display.
06:28You know, we have a size, but you can actually expand it to a bigger screen where you can actually
06:33engage content better, or it could be more productive.
06:35You can actually play a game in a bigger screen.
06:38But I think the only condition is you cannot compromise anything that you have on the bar type.
06:44So on top of what not compromising from the bar type, if you can actually provide additional screen experience, I
06:52think there is a need for the consumers.
06:54It almost sounds like the marketing is you don't know what you're missing, right?
06:59Because you have a single screen you're looking at, but you know, this always has the foldables have the secret
07:04of the bigger screen experience.
07:06But it is sort of like that communication of how you communicate to the consumer, especially because I think that
07:14that fold is in some ways the most consumery fold of the entire line, even more so than the flip.
07:22And I don't know if it's just that I keep saying that the shape is kind of cute.
07:27And so, you know, like, what in your head, if you were thinking about-
07:32Maybe we have a new segmentation with somebody looking for a cute device.
07:35To your point, like if someone's walking into like, let's say a carrier store in the US, you know, where
07:41are the consumers going to gravitate?
07:43Because like now you're giving them more options than ever, right?
07:46So like, where do you feel like people are going to gravitate based on what their needs are?
07:49We're happy for our consumer to make a choice.
07:52You know, we're looking at, we're not asking consumer to make a single choice out of their needs.
07:59There's more needs on where do you spend most time on the phone.
08:03Right.
08:03If you're more towards a productivity, you would like split screens, you want to have two phones side by side
08:10to be very productive, then you go with Ultra.
08:14If you use a lot of media consumption, you read books or you play game.
08:20If that's like your focus area, then you take the Fold8, the all new Fold8.
08:25And then if you are more very expressive and you feel like you want to have a small phone that
08:32in the pocket and you want to be glanceable and then you want to have more of an AI native
08:37type of brand, then you go with a flip.
08:39So we're providing sort of option for consumer to take it based on your needs.
08:45And I think that's very important because I think that shows our confidence on we can actually build various type
08:52of foldables for consumer.
08:54At the same time, we can actually provide the same experience that regular bar type provides.
09:00Just one question on the naming, just because I think it's very interesting that for this, right, this is ostensibly
09:06a replacement, the Z Fold8 Ultra for the Z Fold7.
09:09But now the wide format design gets the Z Fold8 name.
09:15What was the thinking behind that?
09:17Because I think, you know, there might be some confusion on the part of customers because they're like, OK, so
09:21what's the difference between the Ultra and the regular?
09:24How did you land on those names? And I'm just curious about that.
09:27We had a lot of discussion, but, you know, our S series bar type lineups, the Ultra is the highest,
09:33most premium, most advanced technology product.
09:36Fold, we tried a lot of different things, but we see a lot of ultra consumers coming over to Fold,
09:44asking for same similar performance in cameras.
09:48So basically, we put a lot of effort to match that capability, yet actually improving the display size and everything
09:56that we can actually have as a Fold and even making it lighter and even bumping up the battery and
10:03not compromising anything, actually providing more.
10:06So actually putting that in the Ultra.
10:08Which happened first? Did you rename the Z Fold to the Ultra? And then while you were doing all that,
10:17eventually you got to working out the name of this?
10:19I mean, I assume that that was called the Z Fold wide for a long time, but I am curious
10:24about the moment of going, oh, this is really our Ultra device now.
10:29We looked at the most advanced performing product is Ultra, which is the same as what we have on the
10:36bar type.
10:37Now on the foldable, I think this is more of an essence of our Fold, reshaping how consumers interact with
10:44the Fold.
10:45Instead of naming a new, I think we just went back to basic sayings of Fold 8. And you have
10:51a choice to have a most advanced, you know, more productivity driven, and then this is more content, but yet
10:57it's a Fold sort of type.
10:59We'll work with our industry and go through the process to understand why we went through this process to actually
11:05name it, you know, Fold 8.
11:07I think it will be simple. We'll see how market reacts and we'll see.
11:10I mean, simpler is better as opposed to like, you know, Fold wide, you know, so I think instead of
11:15just saying what it looks like, but also like establishing it as the new baseline, you know, also potentially gets
11:22people used to the fact that going into a book style foldable can be more approachable and affordable because this
11:28will be more affordable than the Ultra, right?
11:30Yeah.
11:31So was that part of the thinking also?
11:33We went through a lot of process of thinking, how would market react to this, right?
11:38We have many different reactions to it, but definitely we're getting a lot of attention, whether it's a form factor
11:46or whether it's a name and anything, it's a good sign that we were very happy that consumers and the
11:51market is very interested to get hands on it.
11:55I don't know how your process works for product development, but at some point are you asking, because I'm curious
12:01about the reaction that might have occurred with consumers who got an early look or were maybe shown sort of
12:07like a shape.
12:09Did they reinforce, if that happened, reinforce what you were thinking was going to be the reaction or are you
12:17not doing that and you really don't know how consumers are going to react to this?
12:21No, actually we did a lot of internal testing, different form factors and different sort of usage and how do
12:29you use it.
12:30So we hope the market reacts the way we planned for originally and it's all based on the planning.
12:37When we did our internal testing, I think it was very aligned with our original plan.
12:43So I think we're pretty confident the market reacts to that.
12:46With the Ultra in particular, we talked about why you're naming it, you know, the way you are, but it's
12:52not just about marketing.
12:53There's been like serious improvements because like if you actually see it up against the Z Fold 7, you might
12:58at first glance, you might think that they're kind of just like an iterative like jump.
13:02But there's some like serious like innovations on the inside, like from the titanium that's being used, it's even thinner
13:08than before, especially like the crease is almost gone.
13:13So like do you, like in your mind, like what are like the few upgrades that really justify the jump
13:18to the Ultra name?
13:19A lot of things. We don't just pinpoint one thing to be Ultra. I think it's a combination in the
13:26balance of the experience.
13:28I think definitely the camera is one aspect, performance of the chipset is another.
13:33Yet even the design, how do you unfold and fold, that was one of the biggest sort of feedback we
13:41got from the market.
13:42So we changed that. And then also minimizing the crease, you know, titanium sort of, because that's not just to
13:49make it thinner.
13:50It actually helps you be durable and stable in a way that how you fold and unfold.
13:55So it's a combination of a lot of things coming together, even the hinge and everything, to call it as
14:04a Ultra.
14:06And customers were really happy with Full 7, but we're very confident that once you get hands on the Full
14:138 Ultra, you will love it.
14:16It occurs to me now that, you know, because development cycles and product planning is long.
14:22And so I'm kind of looking, you guys have gotten to 4.1 millimeters thick.
14:29And, you know, you are changing and iterating so many different things, including the hinge.
14:34But you're also reaching a tolerance level, right?
14:37And you probably have looked beyond what's going to happen here.
14:40So the 4.1 millimeters seems to be about the thickness of a USB-C port.
14:46I mean, it just fits.
14:48So what happens after this?
14:50Do you go, have you talked at all about if you wanted to go thinner?
14:54Because you kind of have a good structure underneath and it's almost like you could.
14:57But you'd have to get rid of the port.
15:00Would you consider doing that?
15:02Would you, have you thought a little bit about a full wireless?
15:06Yeah, definitely we look at all the options.
15:10But I think the most important thing is, do you need to make it thinner?
15:15That question is more important.
15:17We made it thinner and lighter because that was the biggest feedback we got for many, many years
15:23throughout the last seven years of into the journey of foldables.
15:26And fold seven, surprisingly, that never came up as a sort of major issue.
15:31So I think now consumers are asking for different things.
15:36So it's more of a looking at the live, you know, market data, consumer feedback, and our technology involvement on
15:45a lot of different components.
15:46And then we will prioritize where to focus.
15:50Our, you know, sort of approach was providing a foldable that's actually not compromising anything on the bar type.
15:59You know, this is even lighter and thinner than bar type.
16:02So you need to get thinner.
16:04I think now consumers will probably ask for different needs.
16:08So we'll probably focus there too.
16:11Like ever bringing back the S-Pen.
16:13S-Pen.
16:15You know I have an S-Pen.
16:16Yes.
16:16I mean, S-Pen is, it's interesting.
16:19In order for us to focus on S-Pen, we had to make sort of trade-offs.
16:23I think that's always it.
16:25It's a layer, right?
16:26It's a digitizer.
16:27It's a layer that you have to pull out.
16:28So basically in order to put that, do you sacrifice thickness or, you know, different aspect.
16:33But I think we wanted to address the most important sort of feedback that we got from the market.
16:38And I think we changed the priority into that.
16:41And definitely we'll not forget your sort of needs.
16:44I'm going to just quick follow up on that.
16:46So would you consider, now that you're kind of expanding the lineup, that we'd have a Galaxy Z Fold 8
16:52artist?
16:53And that would be the one that includes the digitizing layer.
16:56And it would be one millimeter thicker.
16:58Go back to 4.2.
17:00I mean, we'll definitely consider your sort of suggestions.
17:03But where does the S-Pen go in that scenario?
17:05It's on the case.
17:05It's the same as on the 6.
17:07It went on the case.
17:07It was okay.
17:08I did not mind that.
17:10For me, it's like actually like the little details that matter.
17:12Like you were talking about just like how easy it is to open with the Z Fold 8 Ultra versus...
17:18And that's actually one of the few complaints that I have about the Fold 7 is that, especially if you
17:22haven't used it for like a day or so,
17:23sometimes it could take a while just like to, you know, to pry it open.
17:26This is so easy to do.
17:29And yet, I'm sure it wasn't easy to implement.
17:32So how did you do that?
17:33And the other thing is, the other complaint that people had is that it didn't like the Fold 7 didn't
17:37fold like or unfold to be fully flat.
17:40But now it does.
17:41So can you just talk about those two things?
17:43Because I feel like they might seem small, but they're a big deal.
17:47The unfolding and folding, that feedback was one of the most important feedback that we got.
17:53I praise our design team.
17:55They spend days and nights actually figuring out how to change the angles, yet making it a little bit thinner
18:01and then yet making it easy.
18:03So basically, they looked at all the angles of how to grasp the device and then, you know, easy to
18:09actually put your hands between it.
18:11So it's more of a lot of effort from our design team to figure that out.
18:15I think that was the most important part of it.
18:17And then, you know, being flat, I think, you know, we talked about titanium and flex titanium,
18:23and that actually helps to be more stable and being not just make it thinner,
18:29but it actually puts more strength and stability behind our display.
18:34So I think that is the most important sort of technology improvement that actually we made.
18:39I mean, the distance that you've gone.
18:41I've followed the entire journey of the foldable line since the very first one.
18:45The distance you've gone from that first one to this is just remarkable.
18:49I mean, it's a period of, what, nine years?
18:52Nine years that you guys have been doing it roughly?
18:55More than nine years.
18:56More than nine years.
18:56And the hinge was huge and fat and not waterproof.
19:01And it's just, it's really remarkable because you forget that there's not only an OLED panel that's bending, but a
19:09piece of glass as well.
19:11I think it's important that we push the industry.
19:15And it's not just our effort.
19:17We work with our display teams.
19:19We work with the industry.
19:21And we work with, like, all the ecosystem to actually make this work.
19:26And it's a collaborative effort.
19:29And I don't think we could have done it just by ourselves.
19:32It's actually a lot of different companies that are working together to make this possible.
19:37I want to switch gears a little bit and bring sort of the elephant into the room.
19:43We're months away from a big launch by Apple where everyone thinks they're going to enter the market you basically
19:50created.
19:51Right?
19:52You created, you started this foldable market, you've stuck with it for years.
19:55Apple's been nowhere.
19:57But every rumor says that they're about to bring out something that, oddly enough, might be called the iPhone Ultra
20:03or something like that.
20:04So, you know, I know that you will probably say, yeah, sure, competition's great.
20:09But you can, it's just us.
20:11You can just tell us.
20:12How do you really feel?
20:14What do you think?
20:15What do you think the expectation should be?
20:17And what does that do to the market?
20:18Just because of us.
20:21As a planner, like, I plan products.
20:23I look at products and experience throughout all the products.
20:28If I, when we're first coming out with a product, you know, foldables, a lot of people ask why.
20:33At that time, it was why foldables?
20:34But we stick to it.
20:36We believed in it.
20:37We had a vision that this will one day become, it could be a major sort of lineup.
20:42We worked with so many partners to make it work.
20:45And I was really personally happy that when Fold7 came, you know, market reacted very positively.
20:52And that was very hard work.
20:54If our market player, you know, players coming into the market and bringing the fold type, then it proves that
21:02what I have been thinking and what I have been envisioning and what we, how much of the effort that
21:07we put it in is actually the right direction that we took.
21:11If not, they wouldn't really come into the market.
21:14And at the same time, also, there's a lot of things that we have done previously on the hardware and
21:20on form factor, and they come into the market.
21:23And we see at the end of the day, we welcome it because I think the industry will grow, the
21:30value chain will grow, ecosystem will grow.
21:33And then eventually, there's going to be more innovation in the market.
21:37And, you know, at the end, the consumer will have the benefit to that.
21:42I mean, it's, analysts are going to project, right?
21:45But there's some that are saying, I've seen a couple of different reports.
21:48I think one was from IDC that said Apple could have as much as 22% market share in the
21:52first year, which would be pretty amazing.
21:54And then another one that was like 44% market share in North America within the first year.
22:00When you, like, hear those things, do you feel like that that's realistic given all of the momentum and, like,
22:05the history that you've had in, like, the space up until now?
22:08Or do you feel like that that's possible?
22:10Like, in their very first go that they could take up to almost half of the market in the U
22:14.S.? Is that even possible?
22:15It's hard to comment because I don't know what product they're coming up with.
22:19But I'm very confident that our product will be the consumer will appreciate.
22:25We have been studying the product for a long time.
22:28We have a live market data.
22:31Our consumers are already using the product every day in the market.
22:35There's actually about more than 30% are coming back to the foldables now.
22:40They're coming back to the foldables.
22:42So, basically, we have a lot of learning on people coming back to foldables or coming back to flip.
22:47And we know how to react to and what consumer wants.
22:51At the same time, they will look at it and, you know, we'll see how they react to the product.
22:56But unless I see the product, I have the product in the market, it's hard to predict what will come.
23:03Just to follow up on that, so when you kept saying people coming back to the foldables, back to the
23:08flip,
23:09does that mean that there were some people who tried that, weren't quite into it, went back to maybe the
23:14S25 or something like that?
23:16And then with the most recent iteration, obviously not counting this, they returned?
23:21So, I think there's a lot of ultra users coming into the foldables because they hear about it.
23:28They have friends using it.
23:30So, they say, oh, this is very positive.
23:32And then also the cycle where they need to, you know, repurchase the product.
23:36They have been using the fold.
23:38Now they want to go back to the fold.
23:40So, basically, we're seeing returning sort of our customer from based on our Galaxy users.
23:46And if you're using the flip and fold, and then if you're coming back to the flip and fold, then
23:52it means that they're actually happy with the product.
23:55And maybe there'll be a good trade-in for like a flip owner, a previous flip owner to get like
23:59the fold.
24:00Yeah, that would be pretty cool.
24:01And then, you know, there's a new option that you can actually look at it.
24:04Yeah, that's going to be so fascinating to see how this market develops.
24:07The market is actually moving pretty fast and there's a lot of different needs.
24:12And we're trying to adapt to that.
24:14And the product needs to be, you know, consumer should not be adapting to the single sort of size.
24:20We should be providing the option.
24:22I feel like that was a subtle jab.
24:25Because there's only going to be one size for that other company.
24:29That's what we think.
24:31Who knows what they're going to do.
24:32But yeah, I agree.
24:33It's probably going to be the one.
24:35There are external pressures for all tech companies right now.
24:39In particular, the sort of RAM crisis and price hikes.
24:43And how is Samsung navigating that?
24:45And how does it make you think about products?
24:47In particular, maybe these products.
24:48And while you may not be able to talk about the pricing, like,
24:52is it a pressure that you guys are dealing with and are you navigating it?
24:55The sort of cost of the components going up is not only our problem.
25:00It's actually an industry-wide problem.
25:01When we plan a product, we approach in a way that, you know, what is the best optimal sort of
25:08feature that you need, depending on the product.
25:11You have to think about different ways to actually plan a product.
25:15So we also take it pretty seriously and also look at what consumers are asking for.
25:22So we're looking at the balance and we'll see how to adjust based on the market situation.
25:28But it's more of an industry issue and, you know, we're not free from that and we're addressing very actively.
25:34Do you think, just on that note, do you feel like the regular Galaxy Z Fold 8 could potentially bring
25:40more people into the market because of its potentially more affordable pricing?
25:45Probably depends, I think.
25:47I think the consumer will look at the product and they'll make the decision based on what's best for them.
25:54We're looking at the premium segment and, you know, there's a different programs, how you manage the product.
26:01So we need to work with our partners to figure out how to provide this product in different ways.
26:06So we're looking at many different options. How do you bring this product to the market?
26:09Just wanted to segue real quick to AI because it's very important.
26:13You know, Galaxy AI is something you guys have been talking about for years now.
26:16I think what's most interesting to me with the new lineup is how you're talking about AI and how it
26:20evolves the foldable experience.
26:22So in terms of, like, the features that we've seen, the one that really stood out is Now Nudge, right?
26:26So you're looking at, like, a message, something comes in, and then it, like, prompts you, do you want to
26:30open this in your calendar?
26:31And then, boom, it opens up on that, you know, the right side of the display.
26:35So you're combining, you know, the AI with the hardware in that particular case.
26:40So can you just, like, talk us through, like, you know, how you're thinking about AI when it comes to
26:44foldables in particular and how you're evolving that experience?
26:48Yes, I think it's a very important question because we don't want to overwhelm AI to the consumer.
26:54I think now the AI technology is very important.
26:57It's changing how, you know, we deal with software, how we deal with operating system, everything.
27:02It's important.
27:03But I think now throughout many cycles of coming up with the S24 as an AI device and, you know,
27:12S25 as an agentic device,
27:14and we're actually making a lot of progress on how do we bring the AI to the consumer in a
27:19way that it actually makes sense.
27:21You know, a lot of industry focus on AI as a sort of itself, a technology.
27:25But now I think it's shifting, the industry is kind of shifting into technology to benefits.
27:32We're looking at how do you make this meaningful?
27:35How do you make this more easy access?
27:38How do you make this safe?
27:40So we have been studying that.
27:42And now Nudge is a very good example where it actually suits the large screen.
27:47Because you're looking at the screen and then it actually understands what you're looking at.
27:54And then it actually provides the next action.
27:56It suggests your actions.
27:57And then once you look at it, when you press it, then it becomes a split screen.
28:01You know, before you have to go through the step to make that work, but it's instant.
28:05So I think we're trying to provide that information based on how, you know, consumer use our foldables.
28:12And if it's flipped, you know, it's a screen outside, there's a now brief where it actually gives you information
28:18based on the timing.
28:19And, you know, it's actually very glanceable.
28:22And then you use apps based on the screen and it's a quick in and out.
28:26The foldable is more you engage and you have to be productive and get things done.
28:31And we're just trying to help consumer to get things done in a more easy way.
28:36With that now nudge, sort of agentic part of it, what I notice is the subtlety of it, that it's
28:43not, you're not taken to another place.
28:45You're not told that it's really AI, that it's sort of just happening.
28:48I mean, it's got a little of the glow of AI still, but it's definitely, there are two steps that
28:53happen in there very quickly.
28:54One, it's give the nudge.
28:56Two, you've got the ability to just pop it into split screen immediately.
29:00So it all feels very kind of fluid.
29:02Do you envision a time, because I know you talked, you know, some of the demos we've had, we've been
29:06talking about agentic AI.
29:08But do you envision a time where AI really falls to the back and you're really just talking about these
29:14features where things are just happening?
29:17And, you know, how are you navigating that right now?
29:20Because it sounds like it's a little bit of a struggle to sort of know when these products are coming
29:26out.
29:26How much to really talk about that AI is powering these things as opposed to these things are happening.
29:32Look at all the cool features you have.
29:34Even for myself, like, I use AI a lot every day.
29:37It helps me get things done, but a lot of people don't need to think about AI.
29:43You know, it has to be part of the, you know, system, it has to be part of the device.
29:47We're looking at a consumer and we're looking at their, how they behave and how they sort of use a
29:53device.
29:54And, you know, we're looking at the pattern and then, you know, we just want to make sure that they
29:59get what they need at the right timing.
30:02Without sort of thinking about too much, whether it's coming from AI, whether it's coming from a different source and
30:08consumers don't need to know about that.
30:11And I think that's important because the AI is becoming more of a infrastructure in a way.
30:18It's part of the device.
30:20And we're working with, you know, definitely Google to think about how to transform operating system into the intelligent system.
30:28You know, we discussed a lot how to bring that platform into the, you know, device so that it works
30:34on the part type, but also on the, you know, sort of larger screen.
30:38And how do you optimize that against it?
30:41And we did a lot of experiment on how to make that work.
30:46And I think it will be more becoming a infrastructure in a way how the device works as it is.
30:52I do think like when it comes to Ajintic AI, I think we've learned that there's going to be like
30:5650 plus, you know, apps that'll be available to, you know, do things for you on your behalf, maybe in
31:02combination with Gemini.
31:03Do you feel like developers are embracing this like fast enough, you know, in your eyes?
31:10Or do you feel like they're being aggressive enough?
31:11And are you working with them directly or are you going through Google or a little bit of both?
31:16I think we're working together.
31:19We actually, you know, work together to think about how does this work on the platform?
31:25How does it work on different form factors?
31:27How do you work with the partners?
31:29And, you know, it's a collective effort.
31:31It's not just Google and us.
31:33It's actually including the partners.
31:35So when we put, you know, automation in place, it has to work, right?
31:41Consumer needs to understand how it works.
31:43So we're taking one step at a time to say this works on this occasion and then we're expanding that.
31:52And we're not rushing in a way because I think the experience is more important than rushing the experience.
31:59So we'll see how consumers react to it, but it's gradually sort of looking at that consumers are using it
32:07more.
32:07I think part of it, like the issue is the discoverability.
32:09Like people don't necessarily know that like, A, what agentic AI is and B, like, how do you surface it
32:15to users without seeming pushy?
32:17Like, did you know your phone could do this?
32:19Like, how do you sort of like, you know, like walk that tightrope, I guess?
32:22We first sort of announced it as 26.
32:25And then we said this is more of a sort of first step towards becoming an agentic phone.
32:31And then the Google Android team started to have that in Android 17.
32:36And that's expanding into the operating system that actually changing into intelligent system.
32:44And we're actually making that sort of step.
32:47And it takes time because it's not just the device and platform.
32:51It's actually the ecosystem.
32:52So ecosystem needs a time to adopt and gradually get into this environment where they also feel comfortable how the
33:00consumer are interacting with their services.
33:02So, you know, we're taking an approach where, you know, it actually is comfortable for everyone.
33:09So when do you consider this category, the foldable category, a success?
33:15And how do you measure it?
33:17And maybe perhaps you think it is a success already?
33:21Depending on how you define success.
33:23Yeah.
33:23How do you do you see it as a success?
33:26An engineering one, a desirable product?
33:31Absolutely.
33:33From a pure marketing standpoint, no.
33:37It's just a tiny slice.
33:40But see, again, my measurement of true success for a tech product, I think, ultimately, is going to be different
33:46than the people who are building it.
33:49For me, I think it's a little bit of a dichotomy, right?
33:51So I think for the users who have the phones and who are enjoying them, especially those who, like, enjoyed,
33:56like, the leap from, let's say, the 6 to the 7, I think they definitely get it.
34:00Like, there's finally less trade-offs or penalties for owning a foldable phone, right?
34:05So, like, in that way, it's a success.
34:08On the other hand, like, the market share for foldables as an entire category is, like, maybe 4% or
34:135% of the, you know, the entire, you know, market.
34:17So, you know, maybe is it, like, 1 out of every 10 phones being sold?
34:20You know, is that maybe, like, the next threshold for success?
34:23So, like, I sort of think of it in two ways, I guess.
34:26I think you guys made a pretty good statement on the question.
34:30As a product, I think we're getting to the level where we're becoming very confident that our consumer will appreciate
34:37and love and use it every day.
34:39I think we're in a verge where it could actually become a mainstream going forward.
34:44It has a potential because, you know, we had this two form factor for a long time.
34:50Introducing another one is a bold move, actually, because that shows that we're pretty confident on the category.
34:58And they were confident how the market are reacting to it.
35:02So, I'm more excited about what's to come than what we have achieved.
35:08And I'm very happy with our teams built this product.
35:12And, you know, I'm ready to actually see how our market reacts to it.
35:18I would say that if commitment was a measure of success, you are a very big success because you guys
35:24are committed to the foldable category.
35:27We're very excited about the category.
35:29And then we'll probably push forward more.
35:32And I don't know which one is your favorite, but...
35:36Probably still that.
35:38I just love, love now the Ultra.
35:42In terms of multitasking, I think the Ultra.
35:44But I think in terms of like the newness and just like media consumption, I think I might gravitate towards
35:50the regular Fold 8.
35:52As long as you still get the multitasking, and I think you do, of the Ultra.
35:57The question is like, what am I willing to give up?
35:59Like the telephoto zoom, I think, is maybe not something I'd be willing to give up.
36:02So that's my like wish list for the next Fold 9.
36:07Let's put it there.
36:08We're very excited about the foldables and lineup coming.
36:12We also have new watch lineup that's coming together.
36:16We have a new 6R product, glasses product coming in the future.
36:20So a lot of new stuff.
36:22And, you know, this is what we do.
36:24We try to innovate, push boundaries, and try to provide new experiences to the consumer.
36:32And we're not afraid to do that.
36:34And, you know, we'll continue to push.
36:36That's great.
36:37Awesome.
36:38Well, I just wanted to thank you for your time, Jay Kim.
36:40It's been an excellent conversation.
36:41And, you know, if you really like this interview, make sure you follow and subscribe on Tom's Guide.
36:45And stick with TechRadar.com.
36:48And if you want to comment on this or follow our channel, do all of those things.
36:52For Tom's Guide, this is Mark Spoonhour.
36:54Thanks for watching.
36:55Thank you for having me.
36:57And thank you for coming to Suwon.
36:59Yeah, that's great.
36:59Yeah, thank you.
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