- 2 weeks ago
A New Orleans-born multidisciplinary artist whose vivid, vibrant paintings capture the texture of everyday Black life, Courtney "Ceaux" Buckley has built a body of work that is as culturally rooted as the city that made him. In this conversation, Buckley speaks on his creative journey and the stories behind the art
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00:00Essence Festival, what's going on?
00:02Welcome back to the Sway Men's Lounge.
00:06My name is Oakley Jones.
00:07I am the senior entertainment editor here for Essence,
00:10and I have an amazing conversation for you all today.
00:13Art has the power to preserve history,
00:15celebrate culture, and tell stories
00:17that words sometimes cannot.
00:19Today, Courtney Cole Buckley shares his inspiration
00:23behind his work, his creative journey,
00:25and how art can shape the way that we see ourselves
00:27and our communities.
00:28I want y'all to get loud,
00:30and please welcome Mr. Courtney Cole Buckley.
00:46Y'all get up for Cole.
00:51How you doing today, man?
00:52Doing pretty good today.
00:53I'm good, I'm good.
00:55So your work is instantly recognizable, man.
00:57Tell us about your journey or your introduction to the art world
01:00and what inspired you to become an artist.
01:04I'm inspired by everyday stuff.
01:06Like, I've always been an artist.
01:09It never was a moment where it happened.
01:12Like, it always was there, like, it always was there.
01:14It always was there.
01:15You know?
01:16Like, grade school, drawing ninja turtles, cartoons,
01:20like, the normal stuff young boys draw.
01:23Then, you know, my teachers kind of started making a big deal about what was happening,
01:29recognizing what was going on, and put me in talented art programs.
01:33And I eventually went to NOCO when I was in high school.
01:36So, you know, it all was pretty organic to me.
01:39It never was, like, a hard choice of, like, this is what I'm going to do.
01:43So when did tattooing come into play, man?
01:48I graduated high school, and I started tattooing the very next year.
01:52So that was, like, the second thing that I did.
01:55The first thing was spray-painting and airbrushing clothes for dance groups.
02:01Because I'm from the East, so it was a lot of dance groups at that time.
02:05So I was the one decorating clothes, putting your name on your jackets,
02:10uniform, shirts, and stuff like that.
02:12What you mean, clothing?
02:13I remember that, you know?
02:16So I wanted to talk about, in terms of medium, you know,
02:19what's the difference between art on skin as opposed to art on canvas?
02:24What are some of the challenges that you face regarding both?
02:29It all comes from the same place.
02:32The main difference is tattooing is more collaborative.
02:36So I'm taking ideas from the client and working it into a piece
02:41that they can really appreciate.
02:42When I'm doing paintings, it's really just all my imagination,
02:46the stuff I'm representing to the public.
02:49Different ideas.
02:50Like, I can take paintings way further than I can, you know.
02:54I'm lucky because some people let me do pretty much whatever I want with tattooing.
02:59I would say about six out of every ten people I do trust me enough to go with a style.
03:06Like, people call it a cold piece.
03:09Like, you know, like, as long as they got something that kind of represents
03:12the broadscape of what I do, they just let me go.
03:16So do you do a lot of commissions, you know, in terms of painting?
03:20I do a lot of commissions.
03:23I try to do the ones that really count, like the large ones.
03:27The smaller ones, like, I kind of stay away from because it takes me too far away from what I
03:35want to be doing
03:36because commissions, like tattooing, is collaborative too.
03:40Like, people hiring me to develop and manifest ideas that they have.
03:45So it pulls me a little further away than I'd like to be from the artwork.
03:50So I always rather work on my own series and stuff when it comes to paintings.
03:55So as far as the collaborative process, man, how do you work through, I guess,
03:59the challenges when your vision may differ from the person that's commissioning the piece?
04:03Like, how do you work past that?
04:05It's pretty easy.
04:07Like, I'm not an egotistical artist, so I trust the fact that people trust me with the ideas.
04:13So I really try my best to make a solid piece, make something that they're going to fall in love
04:18with,
04:18especially tattooing because it's forever, you know.
04:21You've got to walk around with it for the rest of your life.
04:23So I try my best to make sure that we're really getting something solid down.
04:29Like, I move out the way and just allow your vision to come.
04:34You trust me to really take it to the next step.
04:38So your artwork, your artwork celebrates everyday black life, especially in New Orleans too, man.
04:44Why is it important for you to tell these stories through your art?
04:49Honestly, because it started because I don't have pictures of myself.
04:56Like, I lost all my pictures, all my school stuff, everything in, you know, floor waters and stuff.
05:02So as I get older, I still remember things almost photographically, but the details start to slip.
05:13You know, like, I've got to, like, really, like, recollect what's happening.
05:19So I try my best, even if it's a personal experience, what I learned is a lot of us share
05:26those experiences.
05:26So I might be painting something that I think is very specific to me.
05:32Then when it comes time to exhibit the work, 9, 10, 11 people come up to me with the same
05:38reaction.
05:39And I'm like, I didn't do it for that, but I'm glad that they received it the same way.
05:43So that kind of pushed me into almost feeling like media, like I'm recording an actual feeling that people could
05:52revisit over time.
05:55So talk to me about New Orleans and how New Orleans inspires you to stay creative, man.
06:02It's easy. It's easy, because we are very proud people, you know, can be very aggressive when it comes to
06:10representing what we love.
06:12So just seeing the pride that everybody takes, it just makes me make sure I'm covering what I need to
06:19cover, you know.
06:20Because I feel like I represent a very specific lane when it comes to culture, you know, like the last
06:29high school generation before Katrina, like I graduated in 2002.
06:36So it's like I was a child, Katrina happened, then I was an adult.
06:42Like I was 21, then I was 22.
06:44It's like a very hard line, so it's easy for me to kind of decipher what I want to remember,
06:52what feels nostalgic, because the timeline is very specific for me.
06:58So, you know, I really, it's funny, like, thinking about it because it's hard to explain.
07:10Like, like, I remember things as they happen.
07:14Some stuff is still kind of hard to do because it can be triggering.
07:20Like, I don't know how this might feel, like, stuff I ain't talked about yet.
07:24Because in the past, I kept stuff pretty light, pretty colorful, you know, just enough of people to receive it,
07:30you know.
07:31But with these series I'm working on now, like, I'm diving a little bit deeper, like, addressing some of the
07:37traumas in it, you know.
07:38So, like, not enough to trigger people, but just to let people know that those things exist also.
07:44I understand, too, brother, because I graduated in 2004.
07:47I went up to school my sophomore year, came back, and, you know, everything was gone.
07:53So I wanted to talk to you about the transition from tattooing to a full-time fine artist, man.
08:01When did that transition take place, and why did you decide to make that jump?
08:07I'm going to try to stay on track with this one.
08:11I've been kind of phasing out of tattooing because it's so time-constricted.
08:18Like, I have to collaborate with client schedules and stuff like that.
08:23So it really pulls me away from the work that I want to do every day.
08:29But the thing that jump-started it was COVID because once everybody had to sit down, it's just, like, the
08:37pain inside of my career, it really took off.
08:41Because people sitting in offices, studios, the spaces, and they're looking around.
08:46Like, I started doing a lot more murals.
08:48People started buying prints, started buying, like, original artwork.
08:53And 2020 was the first time in my career that I made more from paintings and murals than I did
09:00from tattooing.
09:01So once I saw it was possible, you know, it just, it was easy to start pushing more in that
09:07direction, like, invite more work, collaborating with corporate brands.
09:11And I started getting, you know, collab deals to design products and stuff like that.
09:17So once I saw that it was really sustainable, I felt safe, like, really, like, taking the journey away from
09:24tattooing.
09:25Even though I never left it, I still tattoo, like, twice, two, three times a week, you know.
09:30So, yeah, so it's there.
09:31It's there.
09:32Like, I got a core clientele that I could never, like, walk away from.
09:35But I just stopped booking new sessions.
09:38But I'm always in practice.
09:40Like, it's always there.
09:41Like, I really float in between all the mediums, you know.
09:45Like, I try to stay as fluid as possible.
09:47I need one from you, man.
09:48I got you.
09:50So talk to me about your gallery.
09:52When did your gallery come into play, man?
09:55I work at Axiom Gallery.
09:58Axiom Gallery officially opened August 2014.
10:03You know, it started as a collective space, you know, workshop, studio.
10:11Like, gallery.
10:12But over time, like, the paintings, the exhibits, just, they just became more common.
10:17So it just, it's all gallery now, you know.
10:20Like, we still working there every day, you know, producing the work.
10:25And we could just bring the work right to the front.
10:27Like, literally.
10:27Like, you could walk.
10:29You could still see us painting.
10:31Like, I'm painting in the gallery at least three, four hours every single day.
10:35You know, every single day.
10:37So this is a broad question, man.
10:40I hope you can answer it.
10:41But do you have a painting, a series of work that is your favorite, that it means the most to
10:46you?
10:48I don't.
10:49They all feel the same to me.
10:51It's like the way I treat paintings, it's like you having a conversation with yourself.
10:57Like, all the decisions that I made while I'm working on something, seeing what works, seeing what don't work, I
11:06might like this texture and I try it more.
11:09It's just like, you really like going back and forth with yourself when it comes to the painting.
11:17So the moment I'm finished, I'm immediately detached from it.
11:21You know, like, I don't even hang my own work.
11:26And, no, like, it goes to the exhibit floor.
11:29Like, the moment I'm done, the moment I sign it, it's ready for somebody to come take it.
11:34You know, I'm never attached to the finished work.
11:37I keep my series flowing pretty well.
11:40So one good idea might turn into six paintings, you know, because they're all cohesive.
11:47Something that worked good with the first painting, I make sure I do it throughout the rest of them.
11:51So, like, I'm just used to working on so many different things, so it's hard to get attached to just
11:58one of them.
12:00So, again, I've been familiar with you for a long time, man, from music to clothing to art to tattooing
12:05and everything like that.
12:06But how do you think, as your career has grown, how has your definition of success evolved?
12:12Like, what do you feel is success, you know, at this point in your career?
12:16At this point, it's when you're at peace.
12:20Like, people look at success as how much you accomplish.
12:25I look at it as how you feel as you accomplish those things.
12:31Because I don't just want to just be doing stuff just to say that I do it.
12:36And, like, I try to take the projects that feel good, you know, like I can share with other people
12:42that I can work with other people on.
12:44Like, the things that really travel well, that people enjoy, you know, just as much or maybe even more than
12:51I enjoy.
12:51So, you know, I just try to keep the work moving.
12:59And what advice would you give a young artist who wants to get into the art game?
13:04It's actually going to be two questions, but you can answer that one for me first.
13:06Like, what advice would you give to a young artist that's trying to get into the art game?
13:10The advice I would give is to know who you are.
13:15Like, find out who you are before somebody tries to tell you what you are.
13:21You know, like, know what it is you want to accomplish.
13:25Like, you don't have to, like, carve it in stone.
13:28Just have a loose idea that you want to follow so you know how to stay on track.
13:34And you know when you set certain goals, you know when you sway away from them.
13:38And it's, you have to stay disciplined, you know.
13:42Like, I need to take my own advice, Moe, but you really got to see projects through.
13:49Like, if it was a good idea then, I mean, if it was a good idea now, it would be
13:54a good idea later.
13:55Like, as you're creating work, like, a lot of artists I know, we tend to abandon work if it's not
14:02working out at the time.
14:03But it's really just a chance to step back, kind of, you know, reevaluate how you want to approach it.
14:10If that approach don't work, you have to find a way to see it through.
14:13But that's the only way you can really clear your head to move to the next project, you know.
14:17So really stay consistent, stay disciplined enough to follow through with your ideas.
14:23And then now I kind of want to talk about, I guess, the business aspect.
14:26You know, I hate this phrase, but, you know, the phrase, starving artists, they say.
14:31So what advice would you give someone that wants to create authentic work while still building a sustainable career and
14:37making money off their work?
14:39I don't believe in starving artists.
14:41Like, I get paid well.
14:43I sought out to get paid well from jump.
14:46So that's really just a trick for the industry to control what you do.
14:53You know, they, even that, that's kind of an outdated concept, too, because, like, we, we pretty much control, like,
15:02we know all the aspects of the business.
15:04And it's easy for us to learn, to research, or talk to somebody.
15:08Like, it wasn't that easy in the past.
15:10So it's just, you know, just, you really got to be intentional about what you're doing.
15:16You know, like, learn everything you can.
15:18Like, I still, I research every day like I don't know anything, because I might know one way to do
15:24it.
15:24I research nine different ways and try to find two ways out of the remaining eight, take what I like
15:31from that, or go move and search for something else.
15:34Like, I just try to learn as much as I could, because I know what I'm capable of, but I
15:39love to see what other people are doing as far as what's possible.
15:45Like, how were you able to take it there?
15:47Because when you see something can be done, you just figure out what you're going to apply from yourself to
15:54get those same things done.
15:56So I've spoken to a lot of artists in the past, and this question has always intrigued me, too.
16:01So I'm waiting for your answer on this, man.
16:04But how do you know when a piece is finished?
16:05When do you decide when something is done?
16:08When it's paid for.
16:13Yeah.
16:14Okay.
16:15All right, so before, you know, the money came into play, when did you know when the piece was done?
16:22Um, it depends.
16:24Well, my pieces, that's, for me, they're never done.
16:29Like, but when it comes to commissioning and doing work for other people, just business-wise, you talk about budgets,
16:38you know, how much time it's going to take us to turn around when I'm doing work for other people.
16:43You know, even corporate work, um, contracts is involved, so it's done on a date.
16:48Whatever, whatever date I sign that's on the paper, that's when it's done, you know.
16:53And how do you decide which artists to highlight in your gallery, man?
16:55How does that process work?
16:59It's not a real process.
17:00It's as natural as it could go.
17:02So, with that, I try to stay as, like, I like to stay fluid with that because I meet a
17:11lot of artists and artists pitch so much stuff.
17:13Like, I don't ever want to get trapped in the gallery system.
17:17Like, I had to go through, so, like, I, it's me, it's Compton, it's, uh, Jamal, it's Dariah, Ojo.
17:26Like, we all treat this, like, teamwork.
17:29So, you know, somebody might come up in a discussion that we both, you know, me and whoever I'm talking
17:36to at the moment, if we, if they both, if they call both our attention,
17:39or if more than one of us pay attention to the same thing, that's usually a good cue to know,
17:46okay, this person is, you know, just follow them, you know, see what shows they're working on and just, just
17:53meet, just.
17:54I see some artists that I get, you know, they'll come across, let's say, if I go to a show.
18:03If I don't know them personally, I might just watch, follow, just kind of pay attention to the work.
18:08It might be a year or two before I actually, like, approach them to see, you know, what's possible, you
18:15know, like, representation, or, uh, it's, it's, it's real loose, it's organic.
18:20I try to keep it as organic as possible, not like a recruiting system, uh, it's, it's, it's nothing, uh,
18:27structural like that, you know.
18:28And then who was some of the artists that inspired you growing up?
18:34Um, I'ma just name names.
18:36Um, Trey, who, tattooed, Terrence Osborne, Brian Brown, Lynelle Milton, that's like, my close inner circle, like, yeah, like, because
18:50Terrence, Lynelle, Trey, they was the ones who, who kind of saw, they saw, like, I saw what they accomplished.
19:00And the fact that I approached them with so many questions, they looking like, like, you really want to know
19:06this stuff.
19:06So from day one, I'm talking about anything I needed to know, they was there to the point.
19:14They'll call and check up on me.
19:16And that's when I knew it was real, like, okay, like, they taking it serious because they know that I'm
19:20taking it serious.
19:21And they saw I was willing to do the work to try to get as much accomplished on my own
19:25as possible.
19:26So when you see somebody working like that, it's easy to help because you know your advice and your time
19:31not going in vain, you know, so.
19:34So why do you think it's important and critical that we continue to promote and help sustain black art and
19:40black artists?
19:44Because it's a lot of times we don't control the narrative of what's going on.
19:49Like, we trying to fit in certain boxes that people putting us in, trying to stay in the lane that
19:57people are creating for us.
19:59And I feel like we don't really get a chance to tell the stories how they're supposed to be told.
20:03Like, you know, when they see you raw, they try to clean you up, polish you up to present you
20:11to their crowd, which is fine, you know, because they know what works in their system.
20:15I feel like we don't have enough systems yet to really stand on what we want to do 100%
20:21to the point where we could teach each other how this is supposed to go.
20:26Like, we don't have to wonder, like, how did you do this or how did you do that?
20:29Like, the more we control the narratives and build the systems around us as black artists, it'll be easier to
20:37navigate through everything.
20:39Like, we'll be able to control the system from top to bottom.
20:42And I know art is subjective and it can be perceived by the person's experience, whoever's looking at them like
20:49that.
20:49But in your perfect world, if someone could take something from your work, what legacy would you want your work
20:55to leave with people and viewers, man?
21:04I would want to be looked at as a fearless artist.
21:11Like, somebody who knew what they stood for and who was intentional about representing those ideas to everybody to the
21:20point it's digestible enough for you, but it's still true enough to me to you could see what I had
21:28to contribute to the bigger picture.
21:30Because for the most part, we paint a lot of the same stuff, a lot of family, like, things that
21:37we grew up in and are proud of.
21:38So, I want my own experiences to be represented in that so you can clearly see my contributions to those
21:47same things in, like, the bigger program that we all are a part of.
21:53So, Cole, we really appreciate you, man.
21:55Thank you so much for this conversation.
21:57Y'all give another round of applause for Mr. Courtney Buckley, man.
22:02We appreciate you, brother.
22:05Thank you, man.
22:12Thank you, man.
22:12Thank you, man.
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