- 9 hours ago
'Serve Like A Girl' Director Lysa Heslov stopped by the THR offices for a candid conversation.
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00:00Hi, this is Mariah Gullow from The Hollywood Reporter, and I'm here with Lisa Hesloff,
00:06who is the director of the documentary Served Like a Girl.
00:10Hi, Lisa.
00:10Hi.
00:11How are you?
00:11I'm good, how are you?
00:13Good, good.
00:14Served Like a Girl is going to have a theatrical release in August.
00:17Yes, it is.
00:19And it also was at South by Southwest.
00:22Yes, we premiered at South by Southwest.
00:24Yes.
00:25Can you tell me a little bit about why you wanted to make this story?
00:30Um, I was interested in getting back into producing, not directing, and was looking for something, a project that was
00:39interesting to me.
00:40A friend of mine who was a journalist who had spent a lot of time in Afghanistan with veterans told
00:45me about this competition, Miss Veteran America.
00:48And I thought, what a great way to sort of couch this story of these badass warriors in this sort
00:58of competition with, like, pageantry and, you know, all these things going on, because humor is so important to me.
01:06Um, and I didn't want the audience to leave the film not feeling hopeful.
01:13I wanted them to leave the film with sort of a warm, fuzzy feeling and know that they're going to
01:20be okay, but that, yeah, there is a lot of work that we have to do as civilians who haven't
01:27served.
01:29Now, these women were, uh, were a part of the Miss Veteran USA pageant, and it raises awareness and money
01:37for homeless female veterans, correct?
01:40Yeah.
01:40So, you're lucky Jazz isn't here, because you would be on the ground doing 10 push-ups if you, because
01:45if you ever say the word pageant, you have to drop to the floor and immediately do a plethora of
01:52push-ups, and I've done thousands.
01:54Oh, I promise I'll do it off-camera, guys.
01:57So, yeah.
01:59Major Jasmine Booth created Miss Veteran America as a way to raise awareness and money for homeless female veterans who
02:07were suffering.
02:09She served in the military and still serves in the reserves and felt like there was no, um, transitional programming
02:17for female veterans.
02:19Um, there were really no programs set up at the VA, and so she thought, what a great idea, since
02:27these women have spent their lives, you know, dedicated to the military, for them to be able to feel beautiful.
02:36Mm-hmm.
02:37And, um, to, to sort of create this competition where beauty sort of versus brawn, and, um, because in the
02:47military, you know, you're not allowed to wear makeup, fingernail polish, color your hair, have sex on deployment, um, very
02:55difficult when you get your period, um, you know, it's tough for women.
03:01And, um, and, um, so I think that Miss Veteran America is such a great way to bring all the
03:09sisterhood of women together and tell their stories.
03:14Mm-hmm.
03:14One, one of the interesting facts from the documentary is that, uh, vibrators are considered contraband.
03:20Vibrators are considered contraband, um, but they did figure out ways to mail order them to their bunks.
03:27Vibrators are considered contraband, but, um, but, yes.
03:32Um, so, uh, can you tell me a little bit about kind of one, some of the interesting statistics that
03:37you learned about, uh, female veterans, um, from doing the documentary?
03:44I mean, I think I'm a little always afraid of statistics because I know that they're never sort of accurate
03:50and they're ever-changing,
03:51but we were able to sort of cobble together numbers through Final Salute, through the VA, through HUD, through, um,
03:59unemployment, through the Welfare Office.
04:00That at any given day, there are about 55,000 homeless female veterans.
04:04Um, and I don't necessarily mean that they're chronically homeless in that they're, you know, living on the streets, um,
04:1224-7, 365 days a year.
04:14But we don't think a couch is a home, and, um, so, and that number is growing substantially.
04:23Um, and so, uh, I, who didn't know anything about veterans, much less female veterans, when I got involved in
04:34this project,
04:34was kind of horrified to hear that number, um, and so, uh, I think that was sort of part of
04:44what kept me going for two and a half years,
04:47which is, you know, I really need to, to tell their story and get the word out there, um, hopefully
04:54in a really loving and compassionate way.
04:56Mm-hmm. Yeah, I, I feel like the, um, the documentary really, um, it really showed how hard it is
05:08to make things, make ends meet in America
05:11if you're not, you know, doing well and being taken care of and very successful.
05:17If you're just kind of, you know, getting back from your service, you know, you might be having some problems
05:24just, just keeping afloat.
05:26And I, I thought it, you know, it really showed that.
05:29Tell me, um, how you chose your subjects.
05:32Ah, very interesting.
05:35Um, I spent a while casting the top 25, um, talking to them, interviewing them.
05:44Um, it really came down to a couple things for me because I was a first-time director and had
05:49no idea what I was doing.
05:50So, um, it really came down to who was the same on camera as off, who didn't have an edit
05:58button.
05:59You know, um, it came down to their stories.
06:02Um, and then it also came down to, it was a little bit of mirroring.
06:08And I know that sounds weird, but I did see a little bit of myself in each one of the
06:12girls I chose.
06:13Um, so I think it became easier for me to get deeper very quickly with them.
06:22It became easier for them to trust me, which was very difficult in, in the beginning.
06:28And, um, yeah, I think that they were all so diverse and had so many different things that they brought
06:36to the, to the story.
06:38Mm-hmm. Um, can you tell me a little bit about the political issues that are being talked amongst veterans?
06:46Um, what political?
06:49Yeah, like what, uh, the women in your documentary, like what, what were they talking about as far as, you
06:57know, the, what they were experiencing?
07:01In terms of?
07:02Just coming back from Iraq and Afghanistan.
07:04Well, I mean, I think.
07:05It doesn't have to be like super political, but kind of like, what, what were the, the challenges facing them?
07:11Yeah, you know what, it got me started.
07:12Um, I, I think that if you, if you take, um, a group of women and you give them a
07:21three and a half to five month boot camp where you train them how to go into the military,
07:27and you, you are, you are literally making every single decision for them, and you give them a week or
07:36more, or sometimes less, to transition out.
07:39Um, and then all of a sudden, all those decisions that were made for them are now not made for
07:45them.
07:46Um, and it's a very difficult transition, and a lot of them don't make it, and they end up on
07:55welfare, they end up on food stamps.
07:57Um, they end up turning to alcohol, and drugs, and sadly, um, suicide.
08:04Um, so I think that, you know, all the girls in my film do have PTSD.
08:10Um, and I think that transitioning back into society was, and is, very difficult.
08:21Um, when the, the vets, uh, some of the vets in your documentary talked about being sexually assaulted by fellow
08:30soldiers,
08:31um, what, what was your sense on how they deal with that particular aspect of their PTSD?
08:39Um, well, one of our, one of our girls, uh, didn't talk about it for, uh, almost 20 years.
08:47And when she won Miss Veteran America, she felt like she had such a safe space with her sisters in
08:53arms,
08:54that it, it was able to come out, and she was able to talk about it, and not feel shame,
09:00and not feel like a victim.
09:02And, uh, she was able to tell her mom.
09:05And I think that that was really cathartic for her.
09:08Another, um, one of the subjects in the film that was sexually assaulted, um, uh, did EMDR therapy.
09:17She went away to a retreat for a week, um, and she's working on it.
09:23Uh, but I also think that, uh, a majority of the women that I spoke to, that I interviewed,
09:29that even I didn't use in the film, that were sexually assaulted in the military,
09:34and the military also suffered childhood sexual trauma.
09:38So it was sort of like they entered the military as, I would, like, say, you know, low-hanging fruit.
09:47I don't mean to be disrespectful, but that's the only sort of analogy I can come up with.
09:50But they were vulnerable and fragile.
09:53And so, um, it was easier for them.
09:58Did you see a difference in how, uh, female vets are treated as opposed to male vets,
10:04as you were spending your time shadowing them?
10:07Absolutely.
10:08Yeah.
10:08I don't think female veterans, I think this year, actually, I'm seeing a lot of positive change
10:16in terms of how female veterans are treated.
10:20I hope that the film will also shed light on that.
10:23But, um, when I started following the vets, you know, I just noticed that people, we, Americans,
10:33don't really think about, you know, these women that raise their right hand and offer to die for us.
10:39And they go into combat zones every day.
10:43And they're riding the gun.
10:44And they've got, and they're shooting their guns.
10:46And they're in, and they're at war for us.
10:50And no one ever comes up and says, thank you for your service to them.
10:54Hmm.
10:55And, um, but I do feel like, I feel like, and I don't know whether it's, like,
11:02everything that's going on with women, like women in film and women in, in, in, in, in our careers.
11:10But I do feel like in the last year, in terms of women in the military,
11:14I'm starting to see a very nice, subtle, yet positive shift.
11:19Hmm.
11:20And have you kept in touch with your subjects since, uh, the documentary was filmed in 2015?
11:28Yes, 2015, even though we kept filming, um, uh, while we were editing, uh, things would happen
11:35and we would just have to jump on a plane and go film something.
11:38Um, I'm in touch with them almost on a daily basis.
11:41Mm-hmm.
11:42Yeah.
11:43And, um, how are your subjects doing?
11:45Um, they are doing well.
11:51They're doing as well as can be expected for having PTSD, for experiencing what they've gone through.
12:02Um, and a couple of them have made some really positive, um, life changes.
12:09Mm-hmm.
12:10And, um, I think they're doing, I think they're doing well.
12:15Mm-hmm.
12:16Um, so you said before that you, it's so important for you to balance, like, um, these heavier subjects with,
12:23like, lightness and humor.
12:25Yes. Humor is very important to me.
12:27Can you tell me, like, some moments that, like, really stand out to you in the movie that you're, you're
12:32really proud of?
12:33Or a moment that surprised you?
12:34Well, I mean, I just had characters that were just innately and naturally funny.
12:43Mm-hmm.
12:43You know, and Jenny was one that was just, no matter what came out of her mouth, it was just
12:51funny.
12:52And so I was leaving town, actually, and we were just standing outside of her house, like, shooting the shit.
13:01Oh, I'm sorry, I'm not allowed to say that.
13:02No, that's fine.
13:03You're okay.
13:03Um, we were, like, just sitting outside of her house, shooting the shit, and she tells me this story about,
13:07like, having her, a rooster, like, bite her nipple off and eat it.
13:14And I was just, like, oh, my God.
13:17Like, I couldn't believe that we had gotten that on film, and I couldn't believe I'd never met anybody that
13:24that had happened to.
13:25But it's just, her delivery is so funny.
13:29And so there were just those moments that were just, you know, and during the pageant, I'm sorry, see, there
13:38I go.
13:39I should be doing push-ups right now.
13:40So during the competition, there were just such moments of levity, you know, because they were all talking about their
13:48boobs, their boobs, their boobs, their boobs, their boobs, their boobs, their boobs, their boobs.
13:52So it was, like, yeah, I mean, we were just really lucky.
13:57And I do think that, you know, I don't think necessarily when you see a documentary, you, I think you
14:06can walk away with, take actions and, and knowing that we need to do something to make the world a
14:15better place for them.
14:16But you can also walk away and, like, not want to jump off a building, you know, and have a,
14:22and, and laugh, you know.
14:24So, yeah, what has the reaction from the public been since you went to South by Southwest?
14:31It's been shocking, you know, it's been really shocking.
14:37We've been to, we're starting, you know, sort of to do our festival runs and then we have all these
14:43screenings come up.
14:44And, you know, we haven't had a screening where we haven't gotten a standing ovation.
14:48And I sort of look around and I'm like, what are they, who are these people and why are they,
14:54who paid them to do this?
14:57This can't be my film.
14:58But it's been overwhelming and people just from all walks of life really connect with these women and, and it's
15:10their story too.
15:12And they see a little bit of themselves in these women and I think that that's fantastic, you know.
15:19And what's really shocking to me is men love it, you know.
15:25I just see them coming out of the screenings and they're bawling and I'm just like, I never expected to
15:32have a male audience.
15:33I really, truly didn't.
15:35And to see their response is just, it's fantastic.
15:39That's great.
15:40Yeah.
15:41Have you had any politicians or active military reach out to you and give you any response?
15:47We have had a lot of active military in our screenings and they all unanimously love it.
15:57We were in Austin and the mayor saw it and, and I guess was very moved.
16:02And so that day, which I can't even remember that day where we premiered is now sort of like a
16:08girl day.
16:08So we were given a key to the city and our own proclamation.
16:12I have reached out to several politicians that I know personally and I'm going to show it to them when
16:19we do our premiere in DC.
16:23Yeah, we were just, you know, we're just starting out.
16:28Can you tell me a little bit about Linda Perry's involvement in the documentary?
16:33Yeah, so Linda Perry, when I was shooting, came on pretty early on.
16:40We sent her some footage and I knew that I had like less than a 1% chance of having
16:48her write the end song for me.
16:49And she wrote back within five minutes and she just said, whatever I can do, whatever you want me to
16:57do, I'll do.
16:58And she just got more and more involved.
17:00And then she came on as a full producer.
17:03And so, and then she and Pat Benatar wrote this amazing end song for us, which is this fabulous, like,
17:11anthem for women.
17:12And so, it's really cool.
17:15Nice.
17:16So I have a question that I ask a lot of documentarians.
17:20Yeah.
17:20If you could hand deliver this film to one person, who would you choose to give this to?
17:26Make sure they actually see it.
17:32Oh my gosh.
17:38I don't know.
17:41One person.
17:44Gloria Steinem.
17:48Excellent choice.
17:50Badass.
17:52Total badass.
17:55So, do you see, I mean, like I saw this documentary, it gets me, I feel it right here.
18:02Do you see this as something that could be a springboard to, like, perhaps a narrative film?
18:08Yeah.
18:09So, I have had offers from several companies in terms of making it a narrative series.
18:17I mean, today, and I could totally change my thoughts about this, I kind of see it as a docu
18:26-series just because the characters are so good.
18:30And they're so good, and there's a new crop of them every year.
18:35I kind of see it as that today, but I could certainly change my mind.
18:42But I do think that there is a really great future, other than the documentary, for this subject matter.
18:52Wonderful.
18:53Well, Lisa, thank you so much for being with us today.
18:56Thank you so much for having me.
18:58The movie is Served Like a Girl, and it is out in August.
19:03Yes.
19:03A theatrical release.
19:04Come see it!
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