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00:00Well, when I was at school, when I was very young, I went to Hebrew classes, but I've forgotten it
00:06all.
00:08Yeah, my brother speaks Hebrew very well for four years, but I've forgotten it all.
00:14But I think if I stayed here for maybe two or three months, it's quite easy.
00:17This is your first visit to Israel?
00:19No, I've been here plenty of times.
00:21About, yeah, I'd say six times, maybe.
00:24John Moss, in Israel.
00:26He was here in the past year.
00:27He was one of them.
00:28He's a Jewish leader of the culture club.
00:31And he'll come back in the summer, again, in the park in Tel Aviv.
00:37We've managed to achieve an eye on it in Tel Aviv.
00:41And we're going to play a part of the story with John Moss.
00:44But in the beginning, let's remember, in the first sentence,
00:47The first one of the law of the military.
00:50Do you really want to hurt me?
00:51Do you really want to hurt me?
00:54Do you want to hurt me?
00:55Do you want to hurt me?
00:55Do you want to hurt me?
00:56Do you want to hurt me?
00:57Do you want to hurt me?
00:59Actually, Culture Club is a kind of all religion, all race.
01:04That's right.
01:05Well, that was originally the meaning of the name, you see,
01:08because George is Catholic, and Roy, the guitarist, is a Christian,
01:13white English Christian boy.
01:15The bass player, Mikey, is Black, from Jamaica, and I'm Jewish, you see.
01:19Also, George is from South London, I'm from North London.
01:24The guitarist is from East, and Mikey, the bass player, is from West London.
01:28So really, we're completely different.
01:30And it's quite a coincidence.
01:32And so this is how Culture Club came around.
01:34It started actually with you and Boy George getting together.
01:38Well, it actually started with Mikey.
01:40See, Boy George had been with Bow Wow Wow.
01:43Yes.
01:43Call me Annabelle, that group.
01:45And he didn't get on with Malcolm McLaren at all, so he left.
01:50And Mikey saw his picture in the paper, and he said,
01:52Oh, it looks very interesting.
01:54So he met George in a club one night and said,
01:56Do you want to start a group, you see?
01:57And George said, Yeah, okay, then why not?
02:00But they didn't have any experience, and Mikey was a bit lazy.
02:04You know, he didn't want to do much.
02:06So they decided to look for a drummer.
02:08And it's very strange, because when I first met George,
02:12they were like no songs, nothing, just a lot of talent, you know?
02:16Like, Mikey and George were very keen, but they didn't know what to do.
02:19And George used to write poetry.
02:21You know, he'd write loads of poetry.
02:22And I used to look at it and say, like, you need a verse and a chorus.
02:26And slowly, what I did was, like, organise him.
02:30Because George had the talent, and he had the voice.
02:33But he's so creative, he was going all over the place, everywhere, everywhere.
02:36And he needed someone to take him and push him in the direction.
02:40You were the most experienced, really, among the members of the group.
02:43Yeah, seven years of failure.
02:45The best experience.
02:47But in good company, though.
02:48Very good.
02:49Yeah, I was with The Clash.
02:50But I left them, because they were, um, they had very strong political views,
02:55which I didn't agree with.
02:56But Mick Jones in The Clash is Jewish.
02:59Right?
02:59It's very strange.
03:00In spite of his views.
03:01Yeah, that's why they never used the swastika, you know?
03:03You know, the Sex Pistols use the swastika.
03:06The one thing I liked about The Clash, I said, listen, if I, you know, play with you,
03:10there's no way I'm going to wear this, you know?
03:12No way.
03:12And they said, no, he's Jewish, you know?
03:14I said, okay.
03:15But, um, I had to leave The Clash, because I, I, if someone has a political view,
03:19it's okay if they believe in it.
03:22But they didn't believe in it, you know?
03:23They went on to become rich, and they didn't give their money away.
03:26So what was it?
03:27Just a kind of a commercial pose?
03:29No, I think, actually, they were sort of naive.
03:32Even though they weren't very young, they actually believed in very socialist ideas,
03:36and they thought if they got successful, they'd give their money away.
03:39But I don't think they really believed they would ever get successful.
03:42Right?
03:43There's a joke in Russia, where they say to a guy, he said, if you had two houses, would
03:47you give one to the state?
03:49Right?
03:49And the guy says, yes.
03:51He says, good.
03:51He said, if you had two cars, would you give one to the state?
03:54He goes, of course, yes.
03:56He said, if you had two cows?
03:57He said, no.
03:58Right?
03:59Because he has two cows, you see?
04:00And it was the same with The Clash.
04:03So anyway, so I left them, and then I went to The Damned.
04:06Yes.
04:06And then The Damned split up.
04:08I had an accident, car crash, you know.
04:10And so I had to leave, and they split up, you know.
04:13The scars that you have on your teeth?
04:14Some of these.
04:14This is different.
04:15I'm always having accidents, you know.
04:17When I was younger, I was very, really crazy.
04:19So I quietened down a little bit.
04:21I was always having accidents, you know.
04:23You've got cuts everywhere.
04:27Anyway, The Damned split up, because everybody was drinking, and it was too many, everything.
04:31Bad news, right?
04:32Sure.
04:33So then I went to Stiff Records, and my group, The Edge, became like a Motown band for Stiff.
04:39But they bring in, like, Jonah Louis, Kirstie McCall, Jane Eyre, and we'd be the group.
04:44So we'd be sitting in the studio, we look at the song, write some music, play it, thank you very
04:49much, and go.
04:50Then that fell apart.
04:52And then Adam, from Adam and the Ants, came to me, and he said, I'd like you to play with
04:57me,
04:57and show me how to do two drums together.
05:00And I worked with him on two singles, but he was too demanding.
05:06You know, he wanted all the ideas, but he wouldn't let you.
05:09What, express yourself?
05:10Well, yeah, you know, he wanted to be very much the boss.
05:13You see, the thing about George is that he knows I need him, and he needs me.
05:17And we respect that with each other, so it works.
05:19But without him, it was a bit like him, and, you know, you do what you're told.
05:23A very nice guy, but not for me.
05:25I was actually wondering who writes the songs for Culture Club, because you always get, all of you get the
05:32credit for it.
05:33But how does it usually work out?
05:35Well, George writes all the lyrics.
05:38He won't sing anybody else's lyrics.
05:40You know, George is very personal, his lyrics.
05:42And he has to sing them, otherwise he can't express them properly, you know, artist.
05:46So what happens is George will write the lyrics and have a melody.
05:50He doesn't play piano, he just, like, out of thin air.
05:52He makes up a tune.
05:54Yeah, he's incredible.
05:55Very talented.
05:56Very good with words.
05:56Typical Irishman, you know, very good with words.
05:59And then he'll bring it in.
06:00We all go in the studio like this, which is drums, guitar, piano, bass.
06:04And, um, Roy, who's, like, very musical, very good piano player.
06:08If George sings like, calma, calma, calma, calma, he'll go.
06:13Right, so he has the notes.
06:14Then he plays the chords.
06:16And then me and Mikey supply, like, a beat.
06:19You know, the beat is the most important thing.
06:23Not just because I'm a drummer, right?
06:24But the beat and the melody is important because the drum beat makes the song happen.
06:29And then when George wrote Calma Chameleon, we were singing harmonies.
06:33And the guitarist, Roy, you know, and the pianist, he didn't like it at all.
06:37He said, I don't like it, I don't know what to do with it, I don't like this song.
06:40So I said, after, like, a month, I said, look, this is really stupid, it's a great song.
06:46Try it like a rockabilly.
06:47Like Elvis Presley, like, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.
06:50And everybody's going, nah, shut up, John, you're stupid, you know.
06:53So I tried it, and it worked.
06:57Culture Club is actually going through a slow period right now.
07:03Yeah.
07:03I mean, your last LP, the third album, didn't do as well as the previous two.
07:10Does it scare you at all?
07:12No, with me, it's funny, it might sound terrible, but I was quite pleased in a way, because when you're
07:17very, very successful, fairly quickly, over two or three years, you begin to lose the impetus, you begin to lose
07:24the desire.
07:26And a little bit of, you know, non-success is good for you, because it makes you re-evaluate, and
07:32also it makes you realize that maybe you're getting a little bit lazy, and a little bit conceited.
07:36So, a lot of bands have it, you know, The Police, their third album, was like, didn't do so well.
07:42People were saying, oh, you know, they're finished, and everything. Duran Duran, Seven and the Ragged Tiger, is a terrible
07:46album.
07:47You know, and they know, they know it's not a very good album.
07:50So what is it, the kind of a natural phase that every group has to go through?
07:54I think a lot of groups do go through it, yes. All groups have a, sort of, a barren period.
07:59That's why now we've changed producers, we're with Arif Mardin now, who does Chaka Khan and Green, Skritti Pility.
08:05Um, you can get lazy, and it's very difficult when you're in a group to know when to change.
08:10If you change too early, it's not good. And if you change too late, it's not good either.
08:15So, every group goes through a period where they go down a little bit.
08:19And it's very important that you either stay together, and come back up, or you split up, you know.
08:24Do you personally feel that the third album is not as good as the previous ones?
08:29No, it's not as good as Color By Numbers, or Kissing to be clever. It's a good album.
08:32But, um, we need to spend more time on the next album.
08:36You know, I think it's not a bad album. I mean, compared to other people's albums, it's still, I still
08:40think it's fantastic.
08:41The songs are great. But I think it, we could have made it better.
08:45You know, it's very good, but it's not up to our standards.
08:48I happen to like your third album a lot, actually, more than the previous two.
08:52Well, that's good. We sold seven million copies. So, you know, it's doing pretty well.
08:56And I was wondering, maybe it has, I mean, the fact that it's less successful has less to do with
09:04the record itself, and more with the image of the group and by George.
09:08Yeah, George has had a lot, too much exposure. You see, he's, um, he went through a stage in England
09:15where he was going out, you know, to a concert, maybe, and getting really dressed up.
09:20You know, and I said, like, well, you know, you're asking for it. You're making news for yourself all the
09:24time.
09:25And I don't think he really, really realized that maybe, um, it could work badly for him.
09:32Because, you know, the press used to love George. They said, hey, he's fantastic.
09:35Then one day, he got bad press. And he said, like, what's happened? He couldn't believe it, you know, but
09:40I knew.
09:41And I tried to tell him, but you can't, you know, he's not a baby. You have to let people
09:45learn.
09:46Um, and people can get bored of it, you know, if you've got a very strong image.
09:51John Moss, metofef, moadante.
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