00:00Secretary Raimondo, so nice to have you here with Emily and myself. I want to get right to it because
00:05I feel like every conversation we talk about artificial intelligence, the build out, the spend, but increasingly about the impact
00:12on the labor force globally and here in the United States.
00:15You recently responded to a comment on X by Meta Platform's Vice Chairman Dina Powell. She was announcing Meta's launch
00:22of a program to provide paid training, certification, and a job for Americans of all backgrounds to be part of
00:28building American leadership in the world.
00:30Your response, you say many Americans face a catch-22. They need training to get a new higher-paying job,
00:36but they can't go without pay to attend a training course, and that this initiative aims to solve this problem
00:42with paid apprenticeships and credentials that lead to actual available goods, good jobs, I should say.
00:49When it comes to AI and the impact on jobs, how do you see it, and is Meta on the
00:54right track?
00:56Yeah, well, first of all, good afternoon, and thank you for having me.
01:01I am an AI-forward person. I think that the U.S. does and needs to continue to lead in
01:09this global AI competition, and that means, of course, being ahead with the technology, but it also means having a
01:16strategy for people, right?
01:18I mean, we're not going to win the global AI race if we have great technology and sky-high unemployment,
01:22and so I think it's time for the country to get very serious about changing the way we
01:29support people when they change jobs and the way we train people, and the thing that I like about, because
01:36we have to bring all Americans along.
01:39This cannot just be AI for the big tech and not bring everyone along, and so with this announcement, as
01:46I understand, you know, what Meta's doing here,
01:49the thing I really liked about it was they're paying people while they do the training, and I know from
01:56when I was governor, I was a leader in a lot of these apprenticeship and training programs.
02:02People can't afford to do a six-week or six-month training program and not get paid, right?
02:11They're not going to finish that training program, so to the extent I've heard about this, like you said, I
02:17read about it yesterday.
02:18I think it's, first of all, I think it's good that companies in America are stepping up to say, let's
02:24get innovative and try to support workers,
02:26but I think it's important to say, we're going to pay you while you get trained, and if you graduate
02:32and if you get your credential,
02:34there will be a job at the end of that training.
02:36Secretary, you wrote a guest essay for the New York Times earlier this year.
02:40It was entitled, America Cannot Withstand the Economic Shock That's Coming.
02:45What do you think the country, the Trump administration, and lawmakers from both parties really need to do to address
02:52this very much feared economic and labor disruption that AI is expected to unleash?
03:01We have to prepare for it.
03:03I think it is a transition.
03:05I do believe AI will create new jobs.
03:09Every technology has created disruption and job loss, but over time, new jobs, new industries, many, many, many, many millions
03:20of jobs in our economy today did not exist even 20, 30 years ago.
03:26So I think we're going to get to that place.
03:28However, there will be a transition, and I worry that during that transition, if we're not thoughtful and purposeful, too
03:37many Americans could be on the losing end of that transition.
03:40And so we need to get very serious right now and create new training initiatives like the one we're talking
03:47about.
03:48But that is not enough.
03:49Training is not enough.
03:51We need new incentives for companies to redeploy people.
03:55We need new, you know, like a new safety net to help people transition from one job to the next.
04:01And so I think this calls for some pretty urgent action with the government, with employers, you know, it's an
04:08all-hands-on-deck moment to create a people strategy to get us through this transition.
04:14You know, it's a U.S. race.
04:16It's a global race.
04:17And I think about what China is doing.
04:19They made some steps today in terms of being all in, and they do things differently, as we know, in
04:24China, Secretary Mondo.
04:26So I'm just curious, if we don't get this right in terms of how we are approaching it and protecting
04:32our labor force, but at the same time making sure that we are making the right investments and moves when
04:36it comes to AI, when you've got China and the government in their deep pocket, will that put potentially the
04:43U.S. at a disadvantage in many ways?
04:46Yes, it will.
04:47Well, I've spent as much time as anyone thinking about how to protect America from China and how to compete
04:56with China technologically, economically, militarily, and we need to do both.
05:02I personally oppose, you know, over-regulating AI or regulating the technology to a point that it would stifle innovation.
05:12Again, I want America to lead.
05:16However, I also would oppose putting our blinders on and letting AI out into the world without a plan for
05:24our workforce, because truthfully, if we do that, and if we wound up with extremely high unemployment, we won't win
05:33the AI race with China.
05:35We won't.
05:36We will then have political unrest, economic unrest, deep recession, and frankly, a regulatory backlash.
05:44So I see no other alternative than to do both, to win on the technology, to innovate on the workforce
05:55models and the transition models and the support models.
05:59We can do it.
06:00America has consistently risen to the challenge in the face of these big challenges before, and if everybody works together,
06:07we can do it again.
06:09You talk about America leading when it comes to AI.
06:12That means we need really great leadership.
06:14Boston Globe today reporting that you are no longer considering running for president in 2028.
06:19What do you want to see from a presidential candidate, and could you possibly reconsider your own omissions?
06:25I'm smiling because no matter what interview I do, it inevitably gets to that question.
06:31People have said to me they want a leader like you when it comes to the difference.
06:34Well, that's very kind.
06:37That is, you know, years away, which in politics might as well be decades.
06:42Look, since I've been out of government, this is the issue I've been focused on.
06:45I am fortunate to have the credibility in the business community.
06:52I was the secretary of commerce when chat GPT was released, so I have, you know, great credibility with all
07:00the tech leaders.
07:01I believe in bipartisanship.
07:03I work with Republicans and Democrats.
07:05So, what I'm focused on is how do I work really at the state level where things can happen with
07:12governors of both parties, you know, with companies?
07:16Like, listen, it's in no company's interest to have a deep recession and 15% unemployment.
07:23So, any CEO, a CEO today has to do two things, implement AI and get in the boat to figure
07:32out a people transition.
07:33And so, that's what I'm devoting my time and attention to because I think it's what the country needs and
07:38I think I'm well positioned to work on that issue.
07:40We know you have to run 20 seconds then.
07:42What do you think we need, though, in a presidential candidate considering the AI backdrop and all that's facing us?
07:46Real quickly.
07:48A serious person, a serious person who can work with anyone, will work with anyone, go anywhere, do whatever it
07:55takes to solve Americans' problems, rebuild the middle class and revive the American dream, which is work hard, get ahead,
08:04including in business.
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