- 2 days ago
- #thefutureisfemale
We often talk about preparing girls for the future but between social media and the pressures of growing up today, many are learning to navigate far more difficult challenges than we realise. Can we create space for girls to find their footing on their own terms? On this episode of #TheFutureIsFemale Melisa Idris speaks with Hannah Tan, Founder & Head Coach of Miss Teaspoon Enterprise.
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00:08Hello and good evening. I'm Melissa Idris. Welcome to The Future is Female. This is the show where we
00:14find the extraordinary in every woman. Now, we often talk about preparing girls or empowering
00:19girls for their future, but less about what they're going through or they're navigating
00:25through right now. Between social media and shifting expectations and the pressures of
00:31growing up and coming of age, many young girls are learning to manage far more than we realise.
00:38And today on the show, we're going to discuss or look at further at what it means to create a
00:44safe
00:45space for girls to find their footing on their own terms. Joining me on the show to discuss this
00:50weather is Hannah Tan, who's the founder and head coach of Miss Teaspoon Enterprise. Hannah,
00:56welcome to the show. Thank you so much for joining me. So tell me a little bit about Miss Teaspoon
01:02Enterprise. What a sweet name. That's so darling. Miss Teaspoon Enterprise. And tell me why, what it
01:08is, why you started it up and how you ended up with this idea and this reality, this new reality
01:15now.
01:15Yep. Okay. Thank you for having me. Nice to meet you, Melissa. So Miss Teaspoon is a place for girls
01:22to really connect, to build social emotional learning, as well as discover the joys and challenges of
01:31growing up as a girl into a woman. And that's really exciting, but also really challenging for,
01:37you know, us growing up when we've been through it as well. So how I got into this is because
01:44I really,
01:45really wanted to fill in that gap. Being a young adult at that moment, I had just stepped into
01:52adulthood and that whole challenge kind of just swept away, just had some clarity build up. And so
02:00I felt like, okay, now's my turn to, you know, give back a voice for the girls. And I realized
02:06that
02:07there's a lot of support for the early years, six and below. But the moment that they hit primary,
02:13secondary, secondary, you know, the play is gone. You know, that there's, there's less talk about
02:18having fun, you know, having friends and focus on friends. We're very focused more on
02:25achievements and academics. Yeah. Okay. So, so that's so interesting. So Miss Teaspoon looks at the
02:32seven to 17 years. The idea of course, is that during that period, girls would be in school
02:40and have the support in the network of friends and teachers and that they're adults in schools. So
02:48why do you say that that was a gap that at seven to 17, we're not focusing on building social,
02:56emotional learning? Okay. So to understand the development of a child is, is very simply the
03:04five things, which is P-I-L-E-S. So physical, intellectual, language, social, and emotional,
03:11emotional, or emotional and social. And usually the last two are the ones that are kind of in the
03:16sidelines where we're not really talking about it. Yeah. So usually schools, they have a nurse or
03:22a head, you know, consultant or counselor that comes and talks to the children, but there's not
03:28a time where they really set aside to understand what it is to be, to have social skills, to have
03:35communication skills, to, to face bullies or talk about bullies. There's no space for that. And
03:41children rarely go to the counselor unless there's something that comes up. So what we really need
03:47is just 30 minutes in a week or one hour in a week to just, you know, have a box
03:53where everyone's
03:54anonymous and just put in your ideas and talk about it. Cause that's what we do in class. You know,
03:59we, we have an anonymous box, so nobody gets named and you talk about the situations that happen
04:04and when the situations come up, that's when you can talk about it. And the, the way learning about
04:10social and emotional skills has to be that way. There's no textbook because it's not a linear
04:16development and your experiences and my experiences are going to be so different. So we can't say
04:22it's going to be this way. We're going to come with case studies, let them talk. And then the adults
04:27fill in the spaces of like, okay, this is right. This is cool, but this is not cool.
04:32Some guidance. Yes. Okay. So, so it's a structured class. How, how would you describe
04:37these settings, these spaces that you talk about? You mean my, my space that I run? Okay.
04:43What Ms. Teaspoon provides? Yep. So understanding emotions is one, understanding the skills is
04:51another. So usually we pick up social skills when we are growing up is by observation. Right.
04:56We watch how our parents behave, our friends behave. And then we pick up and think, okay,
05:02this is right. I think this is right. But in a setting of a classroom, you can immediately
05:07pinpoint and say, okay, this, this thing, this thing that you said, we can be a bit more tactful.
05:13Or if we talk about feelings like, or, or, or understanding the concept of trust is such a big word,
05:19like love. How do you explain love? Right. How do you explain trust? So you can't say trust definition
05:25is la la la. They're not going to get it. They understand head knowledge, but they don't feel
05:31it. It's an, it's a feeling lesson, right? So I get them to feel trust. Blindfolds, for example,
05:37trust a friend, you know, hold my hand when I'm blindfolded. And then that feeling of like,
05:42ah, do I trust you? Do I not trust you? Then I'll, I'll say, Hey, that, that's the feeling of
05:47trust
05:47that you have there. It's, they remember the feeling and then you go, okay, next time, remember that
05:52feeling. Do you trust the person or not? Right. It's about experience, you know, you have to
05:59experience it, then you remember it. Yeah. Not, not the textbook. Okay. Okay. Yeah. So this is
06:05really fascinating. And I think, um, I'm curious to know why it's important that we have it in that,
06:10in that, um, in that format almost, because I, I, and I'm sure many people didn't have,
06:17or wasn't lucky enough to have that kind of, um, structured social emotional learning. We only
06:23figured it out as we got along. Um, are there children or young girls who, uh, benefit from this?
06:31How do they benefit from having that kind of structured learning more so than if they did it
06:36without any kind of guidance or a structure? Hmm. So if, if when a girl goes to my lessons,
06:43for example, we, because we communicate and we talk about it. So being heard is also very beneficial
06:49for them. Or for example, if they have both have brothers, you know, and they're like, yeah,
06:55my brother does this, my brother does that. It's the support and knowing that I have someone like me.
07:01And then, you know, you bicker and banter a little bit and that's healthy, you know, and then,
07:06and it, that kind of sharing helps each other problem solve. You know, when, when she shares about
07:13her cases of being bullied by a friend or another friend standing up for each other. So that, that's
07:19the, the support that they need from each other that makes them feel stronger. And that's where the
07:25confidence comes from. It's from the inside because I got a friend, you know, like, Hey,
07:29so it's less serious. Um, and it's just a feeling of peer learning, peer, peer, peer, peer learning
07:39is very important for this age. Yeah. So parents' roles are just as important. It's not that they're
07:44not, but the parents sets the boundaries, but the children just play. Social learning is play.
07:51It's play for learning. It's, yeah, it is play. It's, it's, it's play for the, the, the primary,
07:56secondary school. It's, it's a sort of play, you know, which is not emphasized in a structured
08:02school day. Yeah. When I, I can't remember when we were just allowed to play when we were
08:08in school. Yeah. So if you look at the early years, for example, when your babies, they play
08:12on their own. So that's solitary play. I have a toy. I play it on my own, right? And then
08:17you move to parallel play, which you and I, you have a toy. I have a toy. I play my
08:22own toy
08:22and you play with your own toy. Then three years old onwards is cooperative play. We
08:26have one toy we play together. So that's a kind of, it's actually a social aspect. Yeah.
08:31Because we learn to share, we learn to, you know, accommodate. That's a form of social
08:36learning. And it goes on to primary where you like Kuromi, I like Kuromi too. You know,
08:42it's like, um, we huddle, we like the same things. And that's the group peer learning
08:48kind of thing. Like we like the same things. Then when you move to secondary, it's like
08:52I'm finding my own identity and I want to be special now. I don't want to be like you.
08:57You know, I'll be my own person. So it's, it's, it's a development. It's stages. Yes. Yes.
09:02It's, it's, it's growing and, um, becoming right. Like we are still becoming our own person
09:08and they are too. And I think we should just, just stop and pause and recognize that they are
09:14going through that as well. Hannah, how did you, uh, become so passionate about this? You spoke
09:21earlier about recognizing a gap, but we see gaps every day in our social fabric in our communities,
09:28but very few people act on it or do something about it. You clearly have so much passion about
09:34this. What, what's your, um, how did you get there to the point where you said, I'm going
09:39to do something about it for the, for the girls in my community at least? Well, um, I took a
09:46gap year
09:46and the gap year I spent in Australia really helped me see the support that they have there.
09:51That's one. The other thing is I grew up with a family of educators. Okay. Yeah. And, um, when I
10:00started studying early childhood, then I, I, you know, they, they, they brought so much amusement to
10:06me because of how the human behaves, how humans learn, how humans attach to the mother. And, and
10:12all those things are very, very interesting about understanding about our human race, you know, how
10:17we behave. Um, so that thought process brought me back to how I grew up as well. And it just,
10:22just
10:23snowballed and just went on. And, and because I was studying it, I, I was teaching and then I saw
10:29the
10:29gap, you know, I was, I was so inspired when I finished my studies, but when I started teaching,
10:36I was very shocked at how rigid it was. You were teaching in kindergarten. Yes. I was teaching
10:41in kindergarten. Then I was a principal. And, um, so then there's, there's only so much that
10:46you can kind of work with sometimes because there are parents that, you know, they want
10:50like ABCs. But then when you meet the more Western parents, they're like, I don't want to
10:54learn ABCs. I want my, my, my child to make friends, you know, how are they making friends?
11:00You know, their requirements are very different. Yeah. That's a really great point. Talk to me
11:05about how you work with, um, families. Yeah. Uh, open sharing, you know, sharing is really
11:12important and we have to build that trust, right? It's a relationship as well. So I trust
11:19you, you trust me and, and we don't cross, um, certain lines as well. So I, I, I support
11:25the parents. For me, my role is, you know, the parents planted the seeds, they grow the child,
11:30they've done all they can sometimes. And it's, it's just my role to kind of just, you know,
11:36water it and encourage them to like, okay, maybe you can also do this and do that. And
11:41at the same time at the side, talk to the girl, you know, and sometimes they need their
11:45friends to talk to them, not me, you know, so very sensitive issues do come up when we, we put
11:52in an anonymous box. And, um, when I add in the questions as well, it's a prompt actually
12:00from the parents. Sometimes it's like, Oh, my daughter doesn't want, uh, gets upset when
12:05she doesn't get her boba tea, you know, put in and then other girls will chime in and like,
12:10yeah, no big deal. You know, then if I or the parents say no big deal, she will probably
12:15have another outburst. But if her friend says, yeah, no big deal. Then she'll like, oh yeah,
12:20no big deal. Okay. Okay. You need to hear it from a friend sometimes. Yes. So adults
12:25sometimes need to step back. Has there been situations where it's difficult to do that?
12:30I can imagine that for a generation of parents who grew up very differently from the young
12:37girls, from their daughters, it might be difficult to understand some of the challenges that they're
12:43navigating through in this day and age. Um, and it could be, well, I did it. Why can't
12:48you, uh, how do you navigate those generational differences, uh, from, from parents?
12:53That's, that's a tricky one. Um, I, I hold back a lot of times. Okay. Yeah. Because
12:59I, I need to respect the journey that the parent is taking the child through as well.
13:03That's true. And again, I'm just here to support and I can give my, my advice or my thoughts,
13:11but it is up to the parent to decide how they want to take it. So you're not there to
13:16give
13:16parenting advice. No, no. You're there to support the girls. Yeah. I'm a teacher and I'm supporting
13:21the girls through their learning and bringing the parents along with it because they helped
13:26me paint a bigger picture sometimes of what's happening and we need that, you know. So even
13:31in, in schools, if, if the child is sick, sometimes they, they act out. And, um, if you don't know
13:37that they're sick, you might expect more from them. Like, why are you, you know, lying on the table,
13:42you know, but if you realize, oh, they're sick, then you're like, okay, you let it go a little bit.
13:46So understanding what's happening at home, moving house, new sibling, all these kinds of things do
13:51add to the stress to the child as well. So there's a lot of layers that we do not see
13:56that sometimes
13:57the parent paints a picture for us to see much better. And, um, it helps to bring up, um, be,
14:03be more
14:04specific and intentional about how we want to talk about things. Yeah. But also that, that girl,
14:09the child herself will be, oh, empathy is modeled to me. You know, people don't know what I'm going
14:16through, but there's empathy on the tape at the table. Um, can you talk to me about what you've
14:20observed with your girls? What, um, what, what are they grappling with today? What are the challenges
14:27they're navigating? Um, I'm just trying to make sense of what a young girl say 10 years old, 11 years
14:33old, 12 years old. What is she going through in this day and age? Oh, a lot. She's going through
14:39a lot. Yes. So we just a very simple example of bullying. If bullying, bullying happens in school
14:49in our time, it stays in school and it doesn't follow you home. Now you have the phone and bullying
14:55can happen in chat groups, can happen in comment sections. Um, it can go on and it's kind of
15:03hovering over them. And if they're checking, it's going to affect how they think, how they feel about
15:08themselves. Um, so that's a very big part about self perception and their self esteem. And there's
15:14so much, so much, um, noise, you know, so many influences that they want to be. And they are looking
15:21for role models at this age because they're also finding their identity and absorbing whatever
15:25that's around them. So, oh, I want to be this. I want to be that. And, and it's very, um,
15:31overwhelming.
15:32It is very overwhelming. So it's a lot. And one of the challenges is that, um, the lack of connection,
15:39you know, so I, if you compare a group of girls, both have phones, but one group is really close.
15:46They play chess. This is a real group. They, they play chess. They play Rubik's cube. They came
15:51for camp together. There's about 10 of them and they, they tease each other. They have this healthy
15:56banter, but there's another group that they don't have a strong support group, but they all have
16:01phones. It's very different between how they, how they see themselves and, and how they behave,
16:07you know, and how they react to, um, teasing. It's also very different. One is, it's not as sensitive.
16:14One is like, oh, you know, I, I don't know what to do. Yeah. So it's, that's why I say
16:20they need to
16:21be together to have that rubbing off each other to know like, that's all right. You know, I will
16:27brush this off. This is no big deal. There's a lot of, um, concepts going out and the children are
16:35watching and listening. So for example, the word trauma is getting thrown so easily. Oh, it's so traumatic,
16:41traumatic, traumatic, but sometimes it's just a setback. You know, it's, it's, it's like, oh,
16:46I just didn't get it. I'm going to try harder. It's a setback. It's not trauma. Wow. Yeah. So
16:51a lot of these ideas that we're seeing on social media is feeding to them, but they don't really
16:57understand what it is. They're just like, oh yeah, I'm going through this terrible time. And sometimes
17:03it may just keep them there. You know, it's hard to break out of it. So this is a very,
17:07very
17:08complex situation. Yeah. And we have to remember at that age, they're also going through puberty
17:12and all the changes of, you know, into adolescence, right? So the changes of the body. Um, so they're,
17:20they're also more emotional because that's just how their development is biologically. They're,
17:25they're just more emotional right now. Their limbic system is, is, uh, forming and, and the prefrontal
17:31cortex, which is the reasoning part is not quite developed yet. So they are very impulsive,
17:37you know, and so the parent comes into, that's why the boundaries come in, you know, they need
17:41to kind of like, okay, you, you can play around this area, but you need the boundaries. Hannah,
17:46can you tell me, um, maybe a story about, um, uh, a child or a family that you've worked with
17:52where you've seen real positive development, where you invest in social emotional learning?
17:57There was a girl who followed me for two years and she was, um, when she came in, she was
18:06quite reserved. Uh, she, she would often answer, I don't know. You know, that's a very common answer
18:12that the girls would like to say, like, I don't know, you know, you, you tell me, you give me
18:15the
18:16answer. Um, or she would just not raise her hand, you know, when we had sharing, but when I brought
18:22her into the camps and she was assisting and supporting other girls and that's when she
18:27started to see, like, her role, how she can contribute, how she can help. Two years later,
18:33she's one of the leaders in her school and I was so proud of her, you know, but it doesn't
18:38come just from me, you know, it's also from the friends and the parents of driving them
18:42around. You got to see the time and the effort that they put in and I really respect that.
18:46I love that you gave an example of a girl who is more quiet, more reserved because often
18:52we tend to overlook those children and boys and girls who are more introverted, more quiet.
18:59Um, in your work, when you do work with girls like that, how, how do you define confidence?
19:07How do you build what, what they would define as confidence? Because sometimes confidence we
19:12think is being very loud, very out there. Yes, yes. I like that you brought that up because
19:16yes, introversion and extroversion is such a big topic, right? And I think that there
19:22is a bias to it's extroversion. Everyone's like, yeah, you got to be extrovert. You got
19:27to be loud and, and, um, be out there to make things happen. But the thing is the ones that
19:32are quiet, the introverts are also the deep thinkers, the ones that are observing, the ones
19:37that just, you know, staying in the moment as well. Um, I think that there's a lot of strength
19:42to that. You know, I'm a major introvert and, and it doesn't mean that I'm an introvert
19:47that I cannot be expressive, that I don't have thoughts. It's just that sometimes the
19:51introverts have, um, overthink a lot more so they don't speak out as much, but there
19:56is quiet confidence that can happen. You know, quiet confidence is about knowing where you
20:02are, knowing where you stand. And when you enter the room is like, I'm okay. I'm happy with
20:07who I am. I don't have to be loud to take up space. I'm taking my own space when I
20:12enter.
20:12So when a reserved and quiet girl comes in, it's about reassuring her that, Hey, I really
20:19like this part of how you were thinking. That's very intuitive. I see the strength in how you
20:25are, you know, writing this down, you know, so give them time because they all need that
20:31time. Yeah. And I, I, I often look at it as like, you know, the self-help book section
20:37for children. Oh, we have that for adults too, right?
20:41We do.
20:41Such a huge segment, you know, like ikigai and all these kinds of things. Adults are also
20:47going through and learning it, but we're just making it more accessible to the younger children.
20:52Do you think that part, that's almost the self-help, self-empowerment part, it, it, it,
21:01that's almost a gray area. Where does it fall? Is it the, you know, is it in the home with
21:05the parents? Is it in the school with the formal education? I do wonder who's prioritising
21:12this? And if, if you could see positive change for the future, once, you know, when we recognise
21:19how important it is to empower our children with social emotional learning, where would
21:24you like to see it happen the most, where it can be most impactful for our kids?
21:28So at home, they have their parents as a role model, but like I mentioned, because it's a
21:35peer learning stage, they are also looking to their friends, right? And where they see
21:39their friends the most is also in schools. So it's hard to say, oh, let's change everything.
21:44But I think the easiest entry is for teachers to start building connections. And how? It's
21:53just by the teachers talking about themselves.
21:56Oh, you know, when you, when you go to school last time, you know, the teacher will come in,
22:00Sajara teacher, I am Puan Sajara Tudu. That's it. That's all you know about her. Wow, interesting
22:06name. And then you, you wonder whether she has children, how many children, how old is she?
22:10Yeah. You look about how, what she's dressing, her nails and everything, but you don't know
22:15about the teacher at all. So how do you go to a teacher for help? If you have no idea
22:20who the
22:20teacher is, if the teacher is not connecting, if the teacher is not accessible, that is the person
22:26that needs to connect with the children. And that is the open door for safety, for connection,
22:31for her to, you know, when the children have problems, they will come to her because they have
22:36someone that they are comfortable with. Right. So yeah, I think that's very, the very easiest step
22:42is the teacher to start talking about herself.
22:45That's wonderful. It's such a simple solution, but it also creates an emotional connection.
22:52Yes. Right. Yes.
22:53I also remember reading that you once described your approach, not as coaching, but as mentorship.
23:02Yes. Can you explain to me why that's an important distinction to make?
23:06I, I, I think that coaching really gives you a lot of structure and steps to how you achieve
23:13something. Mentoring is, it's more like, I see where you are going. Let me guide you along
23:19the way. You know, I'm, I'm helping you. I'm holding your hand to get you there. Coaching is
23:23like, come to me, you know, mentor is like, let me take you with you, but it doesn't, I don't
23:29know where you want to go yet, but you know, we'll get there together in your time. There
23:33is no big aim that we want to like aim for, you know, so it's coming to the level of
23:40the
23:40child more. And it's a longer term relationship, isn't it? It's not a, once you've achieved
23:46it, you move on to the next thing.
23:48Yes. Yeah. Even like carpentry in the past or art, you know, there will always be an apprentice
23:53and a master. So if you look at it that way, it's kind of like that where an apprentice is
23:58sitting with the master and watching and learning, but also having her own journey.
24:03What do you hope for these girls? You know, they, in 10 years, 15 years, 20 years, even as they
24:09become women, they move from girlhood to womanhood. What kind of women do you hope these girls will
24:16grow into? And I have to add, what kind of world would you like to see meet them?
24:23I think with AI and tech and everything that's moving really fast, we're always, we're coming
24:29back to the simple things that matter, which is connection. I always talk about connection
24:34and it's about having stronger groups, having more spaces for the girls to meet, you know,
24:40and I think there's more and more coming up for women nowadays that, you know, women groups
24:43coming to sit around. People are coming back to the hobbies, you know, like knitting, sewing.
24:50Yeah. And doing it together. Doing it together. Yeah. And there's this saying that I saw recently,
24:56it's like, women like to just have coffee with each other and chit chat. That's how they spend
25:01their day, you know, and just do that. Make space and time for each other. And I think that would
25:06be,
25:08that would be it, you know. If we prioritize connection, right? Yeah. And this social fabric
25:13of what we lost when technology came into the picture. Hannah, thank you so much. I really
25:19appreciate you coming on the show. And I so enjoy talking to you about what young girls are going
25:24through today. We really should, I guess, invest more in their social emotional learning. Thank you.
25:31Thank you so much for having me. That's all the time we have for you on this episode of
25:34The Future's Female. I'm Melissa Idris signing off for the evening. Thank you so much for watching
25:38and good night.
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