- 1 day ago
چگونه از جنگ تجاری با چین جلوگیری کنیم؟ بحث نمایندگان پارلمان اروپا در مورد حلقه
آیا جنگ تجاری با چین در راه است؟ در این نسخه از برنامه بحث هفتگی ما حلقه، ساکیس آرناوتوگلو (S&D) و نیکولاس د لا پارت (EPP) در مورد آنچه می تواند یکی از مهمترین موضوعات در دستور کار سیاسی اتحادیه اروپا باشد بحث می کنند.
لب بیشتر : http://parsi.euronews.com/2026/05/07/chgonh-az-gng-tgari-ba-chin-glogiri-knim-bhth-nmaindgan-parlman-aropa-dr-mord-hlkh
مشترک شوید: یورونیوز به یازده زبان دیگر در دسترس شماست
آیا جنگ تجاری با چین در راه است؟ در این نسخه از برنامه بحث هفتگی ما حلقه، ساکیس آرناوتوگلو (S&D) و نیکولاس د لا پارت (EPP) در مورد آنچه می تواند یکی از مهمترین موضوعات در دستور کار سیاسی اتحادیه اروپا باشد بحث می کنند.
لب بیشتر : http://parsi.euronews.com/2026/05/07/chgonh-az-gng-tgari-ba-chin-glogiri-knim-bhth-nmaindgan-parlman-aropa-dr-mord-hlkh
مشترک شوید: یورونیوز به یازده زبان دیگر در دسترس شماست
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NewsTranscript
00:08Hello and welcome to The Ring, Euronews' weekly debate show broadcasting from the European
00:14Parliament here in Brussels. I'm Stefan Grobe. On The Ring, members of the European Parliament
00:19go face-to-face on some of the biggest issues facing Europe. Today, we want to talk about
00:26EU trade relations with China, which risk becoming so bad that the European economy
00:32may be seriously hit. Luis Alberto has more. Trade tensions between China and the European Union
00:41are escalating after Beijing called on EU member states to revise the bloc's proposed Made in
00:47Europe legislation. The draft proposal of the European Commission seeks to tighten the rules
00:53for foreign companies that want to participate in EU public procurement contracts or benefit
00:58from investment opportunities. The initiative, which aims to bolster Europe's industrial capacity,
01:04was met with criticism by China's commerce ministry, who affirmed that if the EU quote
01:09insists on this punishment and treats China's enterprises in a discriminatory manner, Beijing
01:14would respond with countermeasures. In other words, retaliation. While Europe is trying to
01:20navigate a world of aggressive tariffs by Trump's administration, is it heading toward a full-scale
01:25trade conflict with China? Or can it still strike a balance between protection and cooperation?
01:32A lot to unpack here for our contenders. And here they are.
01:39Sakis Arnautoulou, a Greek MEP from the Socialists and Democrats Group. He's a member of the Delegation for
01:45Relations with the People's Republic of China in the European Parliament. Advocating a pragmatic approach to global
01:50tensions, he cautions against escalation and said, Europe must remain open to cooperation with China,
01:56but it cannot remain naïve. We need a relationship based on fairness, reciprocity and transparency.
02:02The aim is not confrontation.
02:05Nicolás Pascual de la Parte, a Spanish MEP from the Central-Right European People's Party. A career diplomat,
02:11he served as ambassador of Spain to NATO. As an MEP, he's a member of the Committee on Security and
02:16Defense. A strong transatlanticist with a geopolitical outlook, he warns about the global power shift driven by
02:23Beijing, stating, China's export restrictions are an escalation of the weaponization of trade policies.
02:28We have to confront this in a smart way. That means we cannot decouple from China, but we have to
02:34de-risk.
02:36So let me welcome to the ring Sakis Arnautoulou and Nicolás Pascual de la Parte.
02:41Great to see you and thanks for coming on the show. Thanks for having us.
02:46So the aim of the ring is to offer our viewers a glimpse at European Parliament debates.
02:52So you should feel right at home here on set. Are you ready?
02:57Yes, indeed. Okay, let's start with the thing that made headline just a few days ago.
03:03When Brussels presented its made in Europe proposals to strengthen our industrial base,
03:08China reacted with unusual harshness, threatening retaliation. Should we now be scared, Sakis?
03:16Of course not. I mean, what we did was actually the logical thing to do because China started it.
03:22I mean, it started some kind of a weird, let's say unfair competition and unfair trade that we have to
03:28answer back because otherwise we're not going to be able just to defend our industry and defend what we
03:33actually have reached so far. This prosperity that the European Union has, 27 countries together,
03:40this is not something that you can achieve just like that. So we have our methods and so we're going
03:46to defend our methods.
03:47Niklas, this is a proposal coming from the European Commission. Is it dead on arrival after all these
03:55debates we had?
03:56I agree with my colleague. I think that the initial, the initiative from the Commission is based on the
04:01principle of reciprocity. That means that we have to, to relate with China on a real basis and to,
04:10and to demand from them the same treatment as we deliver to them. So far, China has been
04:16taking selectively some norms of the World Trade Organization and disregarding other rules. From now on,
04:22I think that we have to keep with them a fair, transparent relationship based on reciprocity and nothing else.
04:28So the Commission has taken a much more assertive stance towards China recently. Is this the way to go forward?
04:35There is no other way to go forward, because as I said before, and this, it's a critical situation geopolitically
04:43where we also
04:44a lot of new challenges to face. And if we don't find a solution or we won't deal with that
04:51now, because some people and some
04:54would say that Europe has been naive so far. So we had to start at it years ago just to,
05:01to find some kind of a solutions in a way that we're not going to bring us in this difficult
05:06situation.
05:07So it's the only way, I think. That's my opinion.
05:09Tough on China, the right way?
05:11Not tough on China, realistic on China. So far, we have been dealing with them in a way that it
05:16is not any more sustainable.
05:19As I said before, China is disregarding some some rules of the World Trade Organization.
05:23They subscribe to it, but they select pick up selectively what benefit them and disregard those who who doesn't.
05:30China has to get used to deal with the European Union and all the international partners on a basis of
05:36reality and reciprocity.
05:37And what we are trying to do now is to send a clear message to China. We want to engage
05:42with you.
05:42We want not a dependency relation. We want a relation on the same footing. But please be transparent.
05:49Please respect the international law and don't use commerce and trade as a coercive weapon against anybody.
05:55The Chinese have said that that made in Europe is just a vehicle to reduce China's influence. I mean, they're
06:01right here, right?
06:03In a way. I mean, everybody's right from his own position, let's say. But the way they just managed to
06:10do things a little bit secretive and a little bit, you know,
06:14the way they just proceed the whole time is just a way that we cannot let it happen. As I
06:20said,
06:23we're not against China. We have to be clear. We want China as a partner. I'm not saying that we
06:27don't need China and China needs us.
06:30So a huge market. So China needs to also to consider that if it loses us, then it's going to
06:34have problem problems.
06:36Also, we want another China. We don't want another. I mean, it's very difficult to say China is exactly what
06:44it is.
06:44We have to adapt and they have to adapt both sides because the reciprocity is the main thing.
06:51Adapting is a is a nice word, Nicolas, because it's ironic that Chinese are accusing us of doing things, practices
07:00that China does at home or is promoting at home.
07:04For example, restricting access to key industries, limiting public procurement, pursuing aggressive industrial policies that support and finance strategic sectors.
07:17So why should we not hit back? The reality is that the access to the public procurement in China is
07:24nearly zero for European enterprises because there are a lot of obstacles,
07:28a lot of restrictions, legal and non-legal. In addition to this, they use a kind of a state-run
07:33economy in which they have a state-run banks,
07:36which give financing to the enterprises at zero cost, zero financial cost, so that they can dump us out of
07:45the market.
07:46And once they have the monopoly of this product, they increase the prices. They have done many times.
07:51Aluminium, steel, batteries, electric cars. They follow all the same pattern.
07:57They can have a financing at privilege rates, obviously, because all the banks in China are a state-run.
08:04It is the Communist Party who decide where the money goes to.
08:07And once they dump us out because they can they can compete with lower prices, they increase the prices when
08:13they have the monopoly of the market.
08:14It cannot continue like that. So is that what we call de-risking?
08:17The risk, of course. I mean, we cannot depend on we want to have a trade engagement with China.
08:23Yeah. Obviously, in transparent manner, but not to depend on them in strategic inputs.
08:30And so far, we still depend on many sectors on them, mainly on rare earths, critical minerals and so on
08:37and so forth.
08:37We should reduce this dependency in order to have a fair relationship.
08:43Doesn't de-risking mean also protectionism? I mean, we're dealing with a country here.
08:50I mean, we have to deal with a country where we need to play nice.
08:53But the country is not sharing our set of values. Isn't that the poor problem?
08:57It's OK. That's a new era that everybody wants to rule the world in a way.
09:02I mean, as far as the trade is asserted.
09:05But it doesn't mean that Europe has to let it happen the way that some countries want it.
09:12But to protect your values, to protect your principles is not bad, because if you just let China do what
09:18it wants, then there's a huge possibility in the coming years that the cheap products are going to be affordable
09:26for the citizens of Europe, because we're not going to be jobs.
09:28They're not going to be industries in order to produce things.
09:33So we have to face it and we have to see, are we going to let it happen the way
09:37the Chinese want it or are we going to enforce our industry so that the citizens, the European citizens are
09:43going to be able in the long run basis, be able to buy, produce and buy products from wherever they
09:49want.
09:49So if we, as Europeans, as a union, act as a sovereign bloc, the way China acts as a sovereign
09:58country, doesn't that make a trade war inevitable?
10:02Not at all. I think that once we are able to act united vis-à-vis China, we will have
10:10a better standard to deal with them.
10:14I mean, China is always trying to divide us. China prefers to deal with us on a bilateral basis.
10:20And it's fair. They try to get benefit dealing bilaterally with all of us.
10:25We have to offer a common consensual strategy vis-à-vis China, which is not either offensive or defensive.
10:32It is fair. We ask for fairness and to, I mean, we have to be clear in China 30, 40
10:37years ago had no technology at all.
10:39I mean, we Europeans and the Americans, we have been exporting and transferring to them a lot of technology because
10:46it was a request from them.
10:47You could not invest in China. You could not sell in China unless you transfer technology.
10:52And they have benefited from this transfer in order to compete with us, disregarding sometimes the WTO rules.
11:00All right. So let me stop you just here as we're getting warmed up right now.
11:10Now it's time for our viewers to get a real flavor of the European Parliament chamber where members ask each
11:16other questions.
11:17And sometimes it can get heated. That means it's time for you guys to challenge each other directly, just as
11:25you do in the Hemis cycle behind us.
11:27So let's get started. Sakis, fire off.
11:30So I just wanted to ask, Michael, because EPP, I mean, says sometimes all the time, I mean, we have
11:37to enforce interest to which I agree.
11:39But I have the feeling that the citizens, the everyday citizens for EPP is not, you know, is not included
11:47the way that should.
11:48So if the market works so well, why the citizens, the European citizens are complaining still?
11:54Well, because I mean, because the market is working well when the participants in the market wants to play fair.
12:00The Chinese have not played fair so far. Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't.
12:05And the only request we demand from them is that they have to respect all the WTO rules and to
12:12deal with us on a fair basis.
12:13That is all the market normally reassign or we adjust the differences.
12:20But in this time, not because China is not a normal commercial partner.
12:25It is a state capitalism in which the Communist Party take decisions on its own that normally in our countries
12:32is taken by the market.
12:33This is the difference. Follow up, Sakis.
12:36And then what about the wages stagnated? And so there is no prospect that the wages are going to be
12:43to be a reason the way that you sometimes you say in the European Parliament that you are going to
12:50be able to raise wages in a way according to your plan.
12:54But I don't think that it's possible the way that geopolitically is what's going on at the moment.
12:59Well, I think that wages are dependent on the international markets.
13:04I mean, capitals, jobs and wages travel across the world.
13:09And it's very difficult to fix a wage in Europe which is not competitive vis-à-vis China, vis-à
13:14-vis the US.
13:15Nowadays, we have not to compete among ourselves in Europe, as used to be the case.
13:19Now we have to compete internationally very toughly with the US, with China and with other competitors.
13:24The wages will be the result of many factors, as you know.
13:28It's not a question for us Europeans to decide which is the perfect level of wage.
13:33The wage is the result of income, of technology, of the workforce training, of input, of the prices of the
13:41raw materials, of many things.
13:43But it's clear that in an international trade scenario, the competition will be much tougher than before.
13:50And the wages will reflect this reality.
13:52Okay, Nicholas, carry on and ask Sakis a question.
13:56Well, I have a couple of them.
13:59I mean, to what extent can the guliness to engage in dialogue, as you say, with China, be interpreted as
14:07a lack of firmness in the face of unfair trade practices?
14:10You know, we always have to try.
14:12I mean, the dialogue must always be here.
14:14Because otherwise, misunderstandings can crop up in a way that cannot be reversible.
14:20So I think we have to stick on our values.
14:23I have to, I mean, I've been in contact with Chinese people and stuff, and they're also willing to understand.
14:28But we have to make clear that it's not that we have, we're targeting China.
14:35This is absolute, what we should do.
14:39We just want to protect our values within a dialogue that can bring us closer and closer for the benefits
14:47of our nations.
14:48Follow-up?
14:50Yes.
14:50In the European Union, if the European Union does not respond with strong measures towards China, what alternatives do you
14:59propose to prevent the loss of competitiveness in key sectors such as electric vehicles, for instance?
15:05Yes, we're already trying it with Mercosur, for example, just to find some other markets.
15:10But we have to be very careful because EPP is a little bit too open to markets.
15:15But we have to also take into consideration that we have citizens, we have producers that might be affected by
15:23those openings to other markets.
15:25Yes, to opening to other markets, it's necessity, it's necessary, but not with every cost.
15:32All right. Well, we've heard the views from our guests.
15:36Now it's time to bring in a new voice.
15:42For our quote of the week, I would like to bring in Maro Sefkovic, the EU Commissioner for Trade and
15:48Economic Security.
15:49A few days ago, he told Euronews how he believes we should deal with China.
15:54Take a listen.
15:55We are not interested in any trade wars.
15:57And I made it clear from the day one.
16:00And I engaged from the day one with our Chinese counterparts.
16:04I was in Beijing.
16:05We had a meeting with Vice Prime Minister Halifeng.
16:08And I'm in regular contact with my counterpart.
16:10We cannot have a trade deficit of 1 billion euros a day.
16:14We cannot have a deficit of 360 billion a year.
16:18It's simply unsustainable.
16:19I think what we need is indeed strategic patience, lots of courage to deal with the difficult issues,
16:25because the war is easy to declare, but it's very difficult to stop.
16:30And therefore, I think what we need is to have regular structured talk also with China.
16:37I would say crystal clear about that we would fight a tooth and nail for every European job,
16:42for a European company, for every European sector, if we see that they are treated unfairly.
16:47That's our job.
16:48So, we need strategic patience and a lot of courage.
16:52Do you agree with him?
16:53Yes, I do.
16:54The point with China is that they have an overproduction, a yearly overproduction,
16:58and the commissioner has pointed out of around 600,000 million euros a year.
17:03Why?
17:04Because there is no domestic demand, because they don't have a welfare state.
17:09Then the Chinese, they save much more than us, because they don't have any future sustained
17:14by any kind of subsidies coming from the state.
17:17Then they don't spend as much as they could.
17:19They save a lot.
17:20And that's why the national demand doesn't absorb the overcapacity of the China economy.
17:25And this overcapacity is sent abroad, and this imbalance we have to correct.
17:29Sakis, where do you come down on this, hearing the commissioner?
17:33I think our viewers have to understand that patience, of course, is necessary.
17:38But on the other hand, we also, as we said, strategically, we have to go on.
17:43Europe has very many benefits.
17:46But for me, the only mistake that Europe still is doing is to take decisions very slowly.
17:53And we need to just accelerate all this stuff, because otherwise, I mean, United States and
17:58China in that matter, I mean, the decision making is so fast that we cannot follow up.
18:04So I think we need to accelerate everything in order just to cope up with all this situation globally.
18:10The commissioner also said that a trade deficit of 360 billion euros is unsustainable economically and politically.
18:17How can we prevent it from ballooning further?
18:21Is that even possible, Nicholas?
18:23Of course it is.
18:24I mean, they have to open their market.
18:26Not only the private market, but the public procurement market that so far, as I've said before, is nearly closed
18:32because of so many restrictions.
18:33Second, they have to play the game with the same rules.
18:39They cannot have this kind of subsidized help and assistance to the enterprises to compete abroad.
18:46These subsidies have to disappear and they have to compete on the same level of fairness.
18:50And third, they have to not to overproduce things that they cannot consume at home and they have to sell
18:58abroad.
18:58I mean, it's a kind of many factors that we have to balance.
19:01And of course, we have to be more aggressive and more competitive in the Chinese market.
19:06Of course, it is possible if you invest in your industry and you just don't want to have your green
19:11transition only by importing products from abroad, especially from China.
19:16Then you in the end is going to end up outsourcing jobs and having no jobs at all.
19:23But taking all the products, especially from China, this is going to be a huge imbalance.
19:28So we need to be very careful.
19:30And we can change the whole rhythm towards you.
19:34We have to invest in the right industry.
19:36Exactly.
19:37OK, lots of stuff to talk about here.
19:39Let's take a break on The Ring right now.
19:41We'll be back with more after this.
19:43Don't go away.
19:53Welcome back to The Ring, Euronews' weekly debate show from the European Parliament.
19:58I'm Stefan Grobe and I'm joined by Sakis Anautoglou, a socialist from Greece, and Nicolas Delaparte from the European People's
20:05Party from Spain.
20:06At this point, let's remind ourselves how big an economic power China is and how important our trade with that
20:14country is.
20:15So China recorded a 1.2 trillion global trade surplus in 2025.
20:20The EU's trade deficit with China reached roughly 360 billion last year.
20:27China accounts for 560 billion euros in EU goods imports last year, making it the EU's largest import partner.
20:37And EU imports from China increased by 6.5% year on year in 2025.
20:44So calls for rebalancing have for the most part gone unheard, right?
20:50Is that a debt concept, Sakis?
20:53You know, I mean, seeing all this, it's terrifying when you hear all these numbers, because actually, when I read
21:01it and one of the viewers see it, I mean, sometimes it's a huge imbalance in how we're supposed to
21:06cope up with it.
21:07But it is possible, and it is some kind of a way of bringing it back, taking the measures that
21:16we set. Otherwise, it's going to be huger the differences in the next couple of years.
21:24Niklas, to what extent is EU policy towards China being shaped by pressure from the United States? Because this is
21:33a player we cannot forget here.
21:35I think that we have to have our own autonomous foreign policy and trade policy.
21:40I would like to have a kind of common approach with the United States to go hand in hand vis
21:45-à-vis China.
21:45But we have to defend our own interests and our own identity features, hopefully with the United States.
21:52But we have, as I said, to keep our own approach.
21:56That means a couple of things.
21:58We have said before that what is the homework that the Chinese have to carry out.
22:01But we, on our side, we have also our homework to do.
22:04We have to be more competitive in many disruptive technologies in which there is a catching up need for the
22:10European Union,
22:11whether artificial intelligence, counting computing, robotics, the data on the cloud, biotechnology.
22:19It's not only to request the Chinese to trade fairly.
22:22It is also for us to be more competitive.
22:25We need to do our homework.
22:27We need to do our homework.
22:27Is that also signing the U.S. trade deal?
22:31We need to be very careful when voices like today's voice from the other part of the Atlantic, I mean,
22:40send different messages.
22:41OK.
22:42You know, Mr. Trump did one very good thing.
22:45It brought together the European countries more quickly than it happened before.
22:52So I think it's a very nice lesson and it's a huge opportunity just to take advantage of all this.
22:58Do you agree that Trump, I might say Putin as well, are kind of helping us to get unified on
23:07trade policy?
23:07Yes, somehow both of them are external federators.
23:10And we perhaps should set up a monument to both of them because they are reinforcing the unity and the
23:16coherence of the European Union.
23:17When we talk about Trump, be careful what you wish for.
23:20OK.
23:20No, that's the point.
23:21I think that, I mean, the European Union normally reacts before crisis in a way that it doesn't normally do.
23:28The point now is that, as my colleague has said, time is of the essence.
23:32We'll have too much time to react because things are happening at a pace, at a breakneck pace, and we
23:38have to react quickly.
23:40We have to set up a clear strategy towards China, which is not aggressive, which is not defensive.
23:47It is fair.
23:48And we have to demand from them something that we have to do here at home as well.
23:52Time is of the essence.
23:54Yes.
23:54And now it's time to move on to our fifth and final round.
24:02And now I want to do something different.
24:04I'm going to ask you a set of questions and you can only answer whether yes or no.
24:10All right.
24:10So I guess I start with you.
24:12Is access to the Chinese market still essential for Europe's economic growth?
24:16Yes.
24:17Yes, indeed.
24:19OK.
24:20Were the EU's tariffs on Chinese electric vehicles worth the risk of retaliation?
24:27Yes.
24:29Yes, indeed.
24:31But I think the Chinese need to understand that we're not focusing on targeting China.
24:36We just try to protect our values.
24:38OK.
24:39Long yes.
24:41Would you buy a Chinese car if it's considerably cheaper than a European one?
24:46I would.
24:47I mean, I'm not saying no.
24:48But the thing is that because, you know, if you don't have the money, you have to do something.
24:54OK.
24:54But on the other hand, yes, I would.
24:56Yes, you would.
24:57Nicholas.
24:58It depends on the quality, not only on the price.
25:00The quality for me is very important.
25:02Excellent.
25:02And I think that European cars are better.
25:04All right.
25:04Are WTO mechanisms still effective?
25:08Yes and no, in a way.
25:10But we have to let's to reform some because there's some more.
25:14Some of them are old and, you know, things are changing very rapidly.
25:17Right now, mechanisms are effective.
25:19Yes or no?
25:20Not entirely.
25:21OK.
25:22Is the EU's new industrial policy compatible with open trade principles?
25:27Of course.
25:28That is one of our main objectives.
25:30Yes.
25:31Good.
25:32Indeed.
25:32Are bi-European measures a necessary correction?
25:41Yes.
25:42In a way.
25:43It definitely may be, but yes.
25:45OK.
25:46Now, squeezed between Trump's America and China, should Europe become more protectionist?
25:52Not at all.
25:54No, we don't need to bring protectionism.
25:59Stay open, but very careful.
26:01OK.
26:03Can Europe realistically compete with China's state-backed industrial scale without similar
26:10subsidies?
26:11No.
26:12We cannot compete, but we have to force them to abide by the international rules.
26:18Not for us to disregard the international rules.
26:20OK.
26:21Finally, was there anything over the last half hour that you agree with your opponent?
26:26Well, actually, we have agreed on many things most of the time, because we have a very sensitive
26:32approach.
26:33We expect from China fairness, reciprocity, and good governance in international trade.
26:40And we are ready to offer them the same.
26:42That's why we share very much our approach.
26:45I don't think that there is space for disagreement nowadays when we have something in common, just
26:51to protect and save our industry and our European citizens.
26:55So, for me, I've agreed also in many, many things with my colleague.
26:58OK.
26:59So, we have a common ground here between the People's Party and the Socialists.
27:03Fantastic.
27:04Well, it's good for Europe.
27:05That's good for Europe.
27:06Right.
27:06And that final answer brings us to the end of this edition of The Ring.
27:11Thanks again to Sakis, Anna Autoglou, and Nicolas de la Parte for a lively conversation
27:16here from the European Parliament.
27:18Thanks to our audience at home.
27:20If you like, you can continue the conversation by sending us your comments to the ring at
27:26euronews.com.
27:27That's it for today.
27:29I'm Stefan Grobe.
27:30Take care and see you soon on Euronews.
27:32Bye.
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