00:00Well, Joachim Bisselec is a former German ambassador to NATO. Thank you so much for being with us today.
00:06Do you see this as a serious strategic American retreat from Europe or political posturing?
00:11This is, what, 5,000 troops out of some 36,000?
00:15Well, it has foreseen. It has been foreseen to reduce the American troops in Germany,
00:22and therefore it's not a surprise.
00:24Perhaps for a moment now, published or, let's say, communicated by Donald Trump
00:30as a sort, let's say, of answer. Let's call it answer, first answer.
00:36Some people may call it vengeance of Donald Trump against Friedrich Merz,
00:41who has been criticizing a bit the American intervention in Iran,
00:45especially with regard to, let's say, the strategy.
00:49Not to the basics, but to the strategy at the end of the day.
00:53But it's, let's say, it was foreseen, and these American troops will leave, by the way,
01:03Italy and Spain, too, in Europe.
01:07And it has, when you look at the new strategy of the American administration,
01:12it's clear they will reduce their presence in Europe,
01:16and they are waiting for the Europeans to take in more responsibility for their defence.
01:23What effect could that have with cuts across Europe?
01:27Will that weaken NATO deterrence?
01:31Well, it's clear, the Europeans have to take up more responsibility,
01:37and in the sense of a strategic autonomy of the Europeans,
01:42I think we are on track towards, let's say, improving our capabilities in Europe, it's clear,
01:50especially with regards to Germany,
01:53because Germany has been, let's say, underfinancing its army during more than 20 years,
02:00in the sense of, let's say, this strange belief in the eternal peace on European soil.
02:07We have a war on European soil since 22 in Ukraine,
02:14and therefore the Germans are waking up, but this needs a certain time,
02:19to rearm Germany and to get, again, let's say, an army which is able to fulfil its tasking.
02:28And, Mr. Ambassador, what kind of practical change would this mean for Germany?
02:33How can it adjust to cover the functions currently performed by American forces in Germany?
02:38How would it affect those communities,
02:39and what would a serious German response look like in terms of increased defence spending, perhaps?
02:46The Germans will have to look with their European allies,
02:51together with the British, with the French,
02:53probably with the Italians and the Spaniards and Poland,
03:00what should be, let's say, the taskings within NATO defence,
03:06that the Europeans could easily, or in the next years, take over from the Americans?
03:13And I think it's a normal step towards a European defence,
03:19but it's not a step forward to replace NATO at the end of the day, no.
03:25It will be another NATO, a new NATO, if you want,
03:29but we will see probably, let's say, in three, five years existing,
03:34where the Europeans take a serious role within it,
03:38and the Germans will have to do this with their European allies,
03:43especially with the French, with Poland,
03:46and even today we see first steps towards this,
03:50for example, the Germans are,
03:53the German air force is participating in the defence of the eastern airspace in NATO,
03:59Germany is building up a whole brigade in Lithuania,
04:05it's something new, never seen before in Germany,
04:08and don't forget, the Germans have elaborated for the first time
04:13since the existence of the Federal Republic a real military strategy.
04:19It's a new paper since April now,
04:23public, partly public, let's say, let's tell it, let's take it like this,
04:29partly public,
04:30and it's a new step in order to underline
04:34that the Germans are taking seriously their responsibility within NATO
04:40and with regard to Europe and their European allies.
04:44Indeed.
04:45So, very grateful for your insights today,
04:47Joachim Bithalik, a former German ambassador to NATO.
04:50Thank you very much indeed.
04:51Thank you very much indeed.
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