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00:08This was a cold and calculated murder.
00:16There's always a breaking point in an investigation.
00:24The timeline of events didn't add up.
00:32It was crucial we supported our family contact.
00:44I just felt boom, boom on my face.
00:47And I remember just being so still.
00:50And I felt it three times.
00:53And then I heard the doctor say he's gone.
00:56What struck us was it's the fact that all the people involved from the victim to the suspects are under
01:02the age of 18.
01:03Nobody wins in these situations.
01:06The family of the deceased, Chiron, will suffer forever.
01:11It's very sad that all you take back from Manchester is a cardboard box with your son's belongings in it.
01:24I first met the Webb family when I was tasked to support them, following the tragic news that their son,
01:31Chiron Webb, aged 15, had been stabbed.
01:35From that moment, I became their point of contact in a murder investigation.
01:40My name is Sarah Marsden, and I'm a family liaison officer, referred to as a FLO.
01:46And I was the family liaison officer in the case of Chiron Webb.
01:51Family liaison officer is the person specially trained to be the link person between a major incident team who is
01:59involved in a murder or a manslaughter.
02:01So you support the family through the process of the investigation and then the judicial system at the end.
02:08My job primarily is a police officer, so I am there to investigate.
02:13But I'm also there to support the family through this crisis.
02:18It's a death, it's somebody's loved one, and it's still traumatic.
02:30On the 18th of October, I came on duty and I was informed that a young 15-year-old boy
02:36had been stabbed.
02:40My name is Stuart Wilkinson.
02:41In 2017, I was a senior investigating officer with Greater Manchester Police, also known as an SIO.
02:48I was responsible for leading the investigation into the murder of Chiron Webb.
02:54He got called in on the 999 call by one of the residents on the housing estates in Mostyn, which
02:59is a town within the suburbs of Greater Manchester.
03:02Responding to the 999 call, response officers would have got the blue lights on and got there as soon as
03:07possible to see if any medical treatment would be required.
03:12The 999 call would have been diverted to the ambulance staff as well to ensure that they can get on
03:16scene as soon as possible.
03:19The 999 call would have been diverted to the hospital.
03:20Kyron Webb was found on the floor, unconscious, on the junction of Whistler Avenue in Mostyn.
03:25Quite a built-up area, lots of houses, and not too far from a main arterial route into Manchester.
03:32The police officers straightaway saved life and limb to start with, treated the victim.
03:36He had a stab wound to his chest.
03:39He also had a stab wound to his back.
03:43Kyron was driven to Manchester Hall Infirmary.
03:45Very quickly, more patrols came.
03:48They would have recognised the fact that they really need to cordon the scene off to try and make it
03:52as sterile as possible.
03:53It was on the junction of a housing estate, so difficult to manage because they had to cordon off busy
03:59roads and the junction itself.
04:02We need to ensure that we can preserve that evidence so that we get those forensics which may assist us
04:07in the investigation.
04:09After I picked the investigation up, I went to the City of Manchester Division for a briefing around half past
04:16nine to get a better prognosis of the 15-year-old's condition.
04:19I was informed that Kyron was very ill and more than likely to die because he'd had 60 minutes of
04:27oxygen starved to his brain.
04:28That's why, albeit he hadn't died at the time, we treated this investigation as a murder investigation.
04:35A family lasing house is one of the first resources that we request.
04:38We definitely need them on day one of the investigation because one of the main focuses is to try and
04:43find out who the victim is.
04:44I once found out, we need to go and speak to the family to try and get as much information
04:49as we can about the victim.
04:52I deployed the family lasing officer, which was Sarah.
04:55Hello, PC Sarah Marsden.
04:57Yes, yes.
04:59The 15-year-old, Moston Lane, to stabbing.
05:02Yeah, OK, I'll go and meet the family at the hospital.
05:10On the 18th of October, I had gone on shift, my normal duty.
05:17I was on call as a family lasing officer, which meant that you were on standby for any incidents coming
05:22in overnight.
05:24I'd arrived in work probably about half past six.
05:27I put my uniform on.
05:28That particular morning, I was having a new student officer come to work with me.
05:33So I was preparing myself for the first day.
05:37I got a phone call, which basically just tells me very few facts.
05:42A 15-year-old boy had been stabbed overnight, and he was on the coronary care heart unit at Manchester
05:49Royal Infirmary.
05:50I was asked to go and meet the family, introduce myself, and take it from there.
05:54I have to change out of my uniform, because family as an officer's tend to work in plain clothes.
06:01It breaks down barriers, and it's more appropriate.
06:05So I go to the hospital.
06:08My job primarily is a police officer, so I am there to investigate, but I'm also there to support the
06:17family through this crisis.
06:19And my ability is, due to my nursing background, I can differentiate between the two and offer support.
06:31Chiron was on a ventilator.
06:33He effectively, at that point, was brain dead.
06:38Whilst I'm at the hospital, the investigation team, the major incident team, are continuing with the inquiries.
06:45The crime scene, it was outside people's houses.
06:48We wanted to do some house-to-house, because clearly it's all about identifying witnesses who may have seen the
06:53incident.
06:54We identified people who had heard a commotion outside the homes.
06:58One of the residents described how Chiron was lent up against the fence and seemed to be struggling from some
07:04injuries.
07:05There were witnesses that had heard something, but nobody had actually directly seen the attack.
07:13And there's a whole host of different resources that are required.
07:16My team is full of detectives.
07:18They'll be allocated out different roles, mainly for outside inquiries to start with,
07:22so we can understand and gather as much evidence as possible, such as through house-to-house and CCTV.
07:28And I liaised with the crime scene manager.
07:30We discussed together some of the forensic testing that we needed to consider,
07:34that there was cars in the street, had the suspect touched the car,
07:38and was there going to be a fingerprint there or DNA transfer.
07:41The knife had been used, and one of the main things that we wanted to focus on was
07:45how we could actually see if we could find that knife.
07:48We then deployed specialist search teams to look in gardens, grids,
07:53all different areas that potentially a knife could have been discarded.
07:57They found that.
07:58That could have some key DNA or forensics on it that could link the suspect to the scene,
08:03and if it had blood of Chiron.
08:05But, yeah, it's been to numerous scenes where we've had to make some fast-track decisions
08:10to get an understanding and a grip of the investigation.
08:14An incident like this in the middle of a built-up area
08:17clearly causes shockwaves within the community.
08:19Nobody wants to see any kind of violent incident in the community such as this.
08:25But I do think the fact that this was a 15-year-old lad did have a particular impact.
08:37I was having cheesy chips and beans, and then my eldest son called me and said,
08:45Oh, mum, dad said, you should call him.
08:48Kyren's in trouble.
08:50My name is Rachel Webb, and I'm the proud mother of Kyren Webb.
08:54I'm a mother of six.
08:56I have four boys and two girls.
08:58I was born and raised, and we spent the majority of our life living in London.
09:04I met Kyren's dad when we were quite young.
09:08We got married in April 2020, but through the years, we didn't seem to be going on the
09:14same pathway in the same way.
09:16So he moved to Manchester, and we co-parented Kyren and his dad.
09:21They were really close, and he had asked if he could spend some time at his dad's
09:26in the holidays and things, and then be with me as well.
09:29So we kind of split it like that.
09:30Kyren's parents, though they were separated, they seemed to have a good relationship.
09:35I called his dad, and I just heard, like, they've stabbed him up.
09:41Kyren's dead.
09:41And I'm looking at the phone thinking, is this real?
09:44Is this...
09:44Or am I actually in a dream?
09:47Second pop came.
09:48I put the phone back to my ear, and I said, where's my son?
09:51Put my son on the phone.
09:53And he said that Kyren was in hospital, Manchester Royal Infirmary.
09:58At that point, a private number call was now coming through to my phone.
10:03It was a male police officer, and he said to me that there'd been an incident, and that
10:08Kyren had been hurt, and that he had sustained life-threatening injuries.
10:14And they said to me, we know I'm in London, and if they are to arrange a police escort to
10:20Blue like me to Manchester, could I come?
10:23And she said, yeah.
10:25And he asked me if a doctor or a nurse had spoken to me yet, and I said no.
10:30And they put somebody on the phone, and she reiterated that, you know, he had sustained
10:36life-threatening injuries.
10:38He was currently in theatre, and they were working on him.
10:41Now, I probably was in shock.
10:43There was nothing connecting my emotions or my brain and my words together at the time.
10:49I called a friend.
10:51I said, Tyren, I need someone to come and get me now.
10:53I need to go to Manchester.
10:54I gave him my address, and he said, I'm going to be there in 15 minutes.
10:58We met with the police, and the police were blue-lighting me.
11:01My friend, Tyren, continued to follow the police car, and he was coming with me.
11:06When we got to the hospital, there was a plainclothes policeman and woman waiting for me.
11:13Now, I know something serious is happening, and she said to me that Tyren had been stabbed.
11:18And I remember asking her, where?
11:21And she said, he's hot.
11:22A siren noise came in my head.
11:25I felt someone touch my arm, and it's like when it brought me back into the moment, there
11:31was a doctor standing by me.
11:32I don't know where he came from or how he even got there.
11:35And he was talking, and I heard him say that Tyren only had a 1% chance of surviving.
11:47And I heard a scream.
11:53It was a noise of just gut-wrenching pain and sorrow, and it was coming from me.
12:09But when I looked at the doctor's eyes, they were so sad and teary.
12:15He said to me that he did everything that he could, but it was of his medical opinion
12:22that Tyren was brain dead.
12:27They were effectively keeping him alive so that allow family time to be with him.
12:36Tyren's parents were in complete shock.
12:39It ranged from sort of complete disbelief to moments of almost despair, collapsing corridors,
12:49lots of crying.
12:50The trauma was intense.
12:52The first time meeting Sarah, I just remember her offering that emotional support.
13:01My mental health nursing comes into play because people are going through the most traumatic
13:06experience they're going to ever experience in their lives.
13:09For me, it's just having an awareness of where they might be at.
13:13At that time, I didn't really know what a family liaison officer was or what they did,
13:17but it was somebody there that I was told would be my point of call during the process
13:23of what was happening.
13:26There was a plan set by the doctors.
13:28They would have to do brainstem tests, and they would be completed by two separate doctors.
13:33Once they were complete and they were quite certain that there was no brain activity,
13:37they would have that discussion with the family.
13:39Now, I know something serious is happening, but I still am not able to retain it, but
13:45I'm panicking because I'm scared.
13:46My nursing background helps me to be able to maybe put it into different words that they
13:51can understand to just repeat what's been said.
13:56Sarah would set that anchor cell just to help me to stay still, to give me that grounding.
14:01I attended the meeting with the doctor when they were telling them that they were going
14:07to do the brainstem tests.
14:10Sarah supported me in all meetings.
14:12She would have the notes, and then she would go over things with me, and just to make sure
14:15that I fully understood what had been said.
14:18You know, they're numbed by the shock, and they are trying to listen to the information
14:22that's been given to them because it's extremely important information, but it's overwhelming,
14:27and it's a matter of just going through the process, really.
14:31They have to carry out some tests.
14:35They shine light in his eyes.
14:38They do things looking for responses and reflexes, and there was no response.
14:43So they proclaim that he's brain dead.
14:45There was no chance of Kyron surviving his injuries.
14:50It was very sad.
14:51As family liaison officers, we can't promise anything, but what we can do is guide the family
14:56into saying that we will do our absolute utmost to find who's responsible for this crime,
15:01and we will hopefully do our utmost to bring them to justice.
15:04Also, during that time, it's just to get a small family tree going so that I understand
15:08who everybody is, important information, contact numbers, addresses, things like that.
15:13Really, it's just to gain information so that I've got that information to take back to the
15:18incident room.
15:18It's a really tough job on the first day for a family liaison officer because everybody
15:23reacts to these kind of things differently.
15:26You really do need to have resilience, flexibility, and get trust within the family so they can
15:32start to work with us and help us with the investigation.
15:38The crime scene was in place for three days while we did the full examination and the
15:43searches.
15:44One common thing that happens at a crime scene is that the suspects often will attend and
15:50speak to police officers at the scene just to try and get some information of what's going
15:54on and see if the police officer will disclose anything just to get an idea of if there's
16:00any lines of inquiry.
16:01On this occasion, a male did approach a police officer, a detective on one of my teams, asking
16:07questions about details.
16:09Sarah informed me somebody had kept visiting the site and asking questions and so forth
16:15with different officers and so they looked into it.
16:19And it was established that that person had actually given false details to the detective.
16:23It became another line of inquiry.
16:26Day two, I met the family in the afternoon at Manchester Royal Infirmary.
16:30Sarah, the family liaison officer, had arranged for the meeting and we went down together.
16:36Kyron was still on the life support machine at the time.
16:39Stuart was very, very informative and very open and transparent.
16:43I always felt I was part of that investigation and part of the process as opposed to being a
16:49spectator of the process that was going on around me.
16:55Stuart explained to me that when they had found Kyron, that at the scene he had a bag and
17:01inside the bag was a knife.
17:03It was completely sealed in a wrapper.
17:05At that point, I wasn't told much about it, so I didn't know what sort of knife.
17:11Was it Kyron's knife?
17:12Was he going to use the knife?
17:13Well, you know, there wasn't much that they could give me.
17:15Nobody seemed to understand or know why that was there.
17:18This is probably information they didn't want to hear, but it's information I had to tell
17:21them because I don't want them to have any surprises I hear of anybody else.
17:25To hear that, that was absolutely devastating.
17:28It brought to the focus how serious the situation was and how serious things were.
17:37What on earth was going on?
17:39What was happening for Kyron?
17:40Why was he so scared that he thought he needed to carry a knife?
17:43Like, who are these people?
17:45Who are these people to Kyron?
17:58Kyron lived with Rachel and his other siblings in London.
18:04For me, being a mum is probably one of the best jobs or the most important and meaningful
18:10role I've ever played in my whole entire life.
18:14Kyron was a very loving child and he was very attached to me.
18:19He would scream and always want to be with me and around me.
18:23He was very, very loyal and he loved hard.
18:26He liked to be involved.
18:28He liked to interact.
18:29But there was also a quiet part of Kyron as well.
18:32Sometimes he would take himself away from that really heightened environment and crowd
18:37and just sit in his room, maybe go on his console.
18:39And that was his time to recharge his batteries.
18:43When Kyron was about 13, he had started to get into some trouble at school for, like,
18:49was minor behaviours, like, you know, just not concentrating in the class.
18:53That's when the school started to do, like, referrals to speech and language and things
18:58like that to have assessments carried out.
19:01Kyron is the only child that I had that had struggles, self-regulating emotions.
19:07And, you know, that got quite overwhelmed in heightened environments and would sometimes
19:15need intervention to help him to co-regulate and to calm down.
19:19Kyron was easily influenced in the sense that he didn't really perceive, he couldn't really
19:24see the risk or understand.
19:26Kyron was getting himself in a little bit of trouble at London.
19:29The suggestion was put forward that he goes to live with his dad in the Manchester area.
19:33His dad didn't have any other children at the home living with him, so it was more of
19:38a calmer, quiet environment.
19:40Kyron was quite looking forward to it and initially embraced it and got on very well,
19:45started school, was progressing extremely well and enjoying living with that.
19:49Came home to visit mum and his siblings when he could.
19:51He had an aim in life to become an architect.
19:56He had vision of where he wanted to go in life.
19:59He was able to re-engage back into school and he made a small group of friends down there
20:05and he was doing really well.
20:07I felt it was a better environment for Kyron to be able to develop and reach that full potential.
20:15So at Greater Manchester, we have a dedicated specialist CCTV team.
20:19I sat down with them and we worked out parameters around the housing estate of where they should
20:24actually concentrate their efforts to try and locate more CCTV to help us understand what
20:29had happened at the scene.
20:30That was a major line of inquiry for us.
20:33There was a CCTV camera that actually captured it right over the top of the actual attack.
20:39That gave us a very good understanding of the kind of attack that had taken place.
20:43That was shown from a CCTV footage that they'd managed to retrieve from a local house.
20:48It appears that Kyron, he'd been with two boys.
20:51You can tell from the CCTV the way they're interacting.
20:54It looks like he knows them.
20:56It looks like a pre-arranged meet.
20:58They'd been seen talking for some time.
21:00The way the demeanour is between the two lads and Kyron does tend to suggest that there is
21:05some sort of disagreement going on.
21:06That conversation went on for probably about 20 minutes and then it suddenly decided walking
21:13up the road and then for some reason, for reasons I don't know, all of a sudden that
21:17escalated that conversation where one of the boys pulled an eye, stabbed Kyron in the chest
21:23and then the two males ran away.
21:29And then 30 seconds later, one of them returned and delivered another stab wound to the back of
21:35Kyron.
21:42The main things that a family liaison officer has got to have is really good people skills.
21:47Luckily for me, he got a very experienced police officer to support me in dealing with
21:53the family.
21:54The role of a family liaison officer, I think sometimes can be underestimated and it's absolutely
21:59crucial to the SIO.
22:01They're the eyes and ears for the SIO to start with.
22:03I would be distracted on the first day with numerous other inquiries.
22:07You've got to be really resilient and be prepared to not only give tough messages, but obviously
22:15soak up a lot of emotion.
22:22We get called into a meeting with the doctor and I saw a tear hit the desk and the doctor
22:32is sad and his head is down.
22:36The doctor's asking us about turning off the life support machine and I'm looking around
22:43the room and everybody's looking at me because I think, how can you ask me to kill my son?
22:49I came alive when I became a mum.
22:51How can you ask me to kill him?
22:54This is a decision I do not want to make.
22:56And the doctor had said that if we didn't turn off the life support machine, that Kyron would
23:01remain in a vegetative state until his body then passes away.
23:06It was an impossible situation.
23:08She didn't want to part from her beloved son, but she also had to make the decision that
23:14she didn't want him to live a life where he was not going to come back to being the son
23:20that she remembered.
23:21And I thought, Rachel, it would be so selfish of you to keep him here for your own gain and
23:28benefit because this would not be what Kyron would want.
23:32I stood up and I said, turn it off.
23:38I was present at that time, yes, when the machines were switched off.
23:42It was very quiet and very sombre.
23:44I held his hand and I closed my eyes and I put my head on his chest.
23:50And, you know, when people say that when you die or when you're going to die or in that
23:55situation, like your life kind of plays out in front of you.
23:58That's what it was like.
23:59It was like a showreel.
24:01I saw myself pregnant.
24:02I saw myself giving birth.
24:05I saw his little gummy grins and his dribbles as he's drooling as a baby.
24:09I saw him dancing.
24:10I saw him laughing.
24:12I saw his smile.
24:13I could hear him saying, Mum.
24:14I felt his hugs.
24:16I could just see it and it was just there and I could hear him singing in my head.
24:20And then I just felt boom, boom on my face.
24:23And I remember just being so still.
24:26And I felt it three times.
24:29And then I heard the doctor say, he's gone.
24:37Normally the identification will need to be done so I'll escort them to the hospital, usually
24:42the Royal Oldham Hospital where the postmortems take place.
24:45I would take a very brief statement from them to say who that person was so that that information
24:52can then be continuity for the coroner.
24:54The process with Chiron was slightly different.
24:57I got Rachel to do that at the bedside.
25:00So she was able to inform me that it was Chiron, his full name and his date of birth.
25:05And the statement was taken.
25:06She signed it.
25:12The whole process within itself is so traumatic.
25:16It's really difficult.
25:18It's hard to understand.
25:20You know, you want to just lay in bed and cry and shut yourself from the world and just
25:25give up.
25:28The role of Sarah was what helped me to stay afloat.
25:33I was made aware that other family members had turned up and wanted to see him.
25:37So I was able to enable that process to take place, support them through their obvious grief.
25:44Sarah helped and prepared me for having to do the tribute the following day after Chiron's
25:49passing.
25:50And she explained that, you know, the tribute would go out in the Manchester Evening News.
25:56She talked to me, explained to me what it was, what the expectation was and what would
25:59happen and supported me through the writing of it.
26:05One of the main lines of inquiry we wanted to develop was an intelligence picture around
26:10Chiron.
26:10Chiron had a knife on him.
26:13It might actually give me some understanding and mindset of Chiron at the time, whether he's
26:17going through some bullying or he's had an altercation with anybody, the kind of people
26:21he was dealing with.
26:23It gives us another line of inquiry for the investigation.
26:26They went to Manchester Academy, so that was an obvious place for us to visit to see if
26:29we could locate any friends or associates that his family were unaware of.
26:34We spoke to various people.
26:36And some of the information we got back was that Chiron was involved in some sort of drug
26:41debt.
26:41It did sort of give us a little bit of a picture that this could be a reason why Chiron
26:48had
26:48met up with these two lads.
26:50And it could be a motive for why he'd been attacked and why he'd been murdered on that
26:57night.
26:57I was going to an event at work and Chiron called me and asked me if I could give him
27:05the sum of money, around £90.
27:09I didn't have it at the time and said that I would send it to him at the end of
27:13the week,
27:14like nearer towards my payday.
27:15And he said he wanted to get a PlayStation 3.
27:18And it was a bit mind-boggling to me because I'd just purchased him the PlayStation 4 for Christmas.
27:25So I didn't understand why he wanted to buy a different model.
27:30A few weeks after, when I was speaking to his dad, his dad had given Chiron the resources
27:38to buy it.
27:41The CCTV was the most key evidence that we'd managed to obtain.
27:46We did get a breakthrough where the CCTV specialist that we'd used on the investigation found some
27:52footage, which fit the time of the murder, of two people running across a main road in the
27:58distance on the CCTV into Scarborough Street.
28:01That was significant for us because Scarborough Street was a cul-de-sac with no way of getting
28:07out at the bottom.
28:08My thoughts were, if they were the suspects, that they either lived in Scarborough Street
28:14or had associates in Scarborough Street.
28:17So that was something that we dealt with as a positive line of inquiry.
28:23On the assumption that the two people running across the street could be our attackers, what
28:30we did with that was to research all 34 houses on Scarborough Street.
28:34It was established that a lad called Michael Eidehan lived in one of the houses.
28:39So Michael Eidehan was a 17-year-old man who was known to the police for knife crime.
28:45He had been convicted for some knife crime offences in the past.
28:49That was of interest to me.
28:50In the office, we were doing some background searches.
28:54It was on our police systems.
28:55And another detective on my team saw Michael's picture and recognised him to be someone who
29:01had approached the crime scene the day before, asking for information of what had happened.
29:07There was a picture building around Michael Eidehan that definitely came of interest to us.
29:13Whilst we were doing background searches on Eidehan, we also started to look at Kyren's
29:18phone data.
29:19We found it was linked to Michael Eidehan's brother.
29:22So there was a direct link there between Kyren and Eidehan's.
29:26The CCTV footage was quite grainy and didn't give a definitive identification of Michael.
29:32It is someone that clearly could have fitted the description, same build, similar features.
29:37That was enough then for me to arrest Michael for the murder of Kyren Webb.
29:49We executed, I think it was three warrants on the morning of the 20th.
29:53We arrested Michael at his home address at Scarborough Street.
29:57Locked his house down as a crime scene.
29:59At the arrest, his mum was present and she was asked questions about Michael's whereabouts on the night of the
30:07murder.
30:08She confirmed that Michael had got home just after seven, which again fitted in with the CCTV of two males
30:16running down Scarborough Street.
30:17She provided a statement for the investigation to that effect, probably at the time not understanding its relevance.
30:24That was key evidence for us.
30:25We did other arrests as well because we knew Michael had a number of associates.
30:30The second male who was with him at the time, we still didn't know their identity.
30:33We thought that potentially one of the associates we arrested at the same time as Michael could have been the
30:39second man.
30:43On the day of the arrest, we interviewed Michael and his associates and we managed to eliminate the other two
30:49people who were arrested.
30:50During the day, another name came into the inquiry and he was on our system, but we didn't have actual
30:56picture of him.
30:57The CCTV officers, they had expended their CCTV search to before the murder and located Michael and some friends on
31:07a bus who had just arrived in Mostyn.
31:09On the bus was a young lad who was wearing a jacket that looked very similar to the jacket that
31:16was worn by the second male in the CCTV.
31:18At the scene of the attack, I tasked out two detectives to go to this male's house.
31:26The 16-year-old lad was located there.
31:29He looked like the man on the bus who was with Michael at the time and he was arrested.
31:33The fact that we were so young, it does make you bring home to you.
31:37This really is the consequences of young people carrying knives and I don't think people realise at that age what
31:47heartache it can bring.
31:48One of the key things for the family as an officer is to make contact with the family as soon
31:55as possible after the arrest to confirm that there is some positive news, progress has been made.
32:00And I was able to give that information to Rachel.
32:03She'd shared with me the news that the two young men had been arrested and said that because we were
32:12so upset the day before, they'd actually been arrested the day before.
32:15But she just wanted to give me a time to come to terms with everything that had gone on.
32:20That's probably hard to hear after you've just, you know, switched off the life support for your son.
32:25It's been difficult because obviously she's still grieving and will be grieving for a long time.
32:30But it's some relief.
32:32We have to do something for Chiron now for his memory and we have to get justice for him.
32:37So it is nice to be able to say that we've actually secured an arrest.
32:42Rachel had no knowledge of who these two boys were.
32:52There's always an autopsy when there's a sudden death of some of any description.
32:58But when it's a murder, there is a home office pathologist will be action to come and do the autopsy.
33:07The autopsy is part of the case.
33:11You wouldn't be able to proceed at trial if you didn't have the full cause of death.
33:15Chiron had the stab wound to his chest which had entered his heart.
33:20He also had a stab wound to his back and he also had a head injury which was determined by
33:28a fall.
33:30After the autopsy takes place, I am given the information by the SAO what information I can give to the
33:37family.
33:38I will be that person that gives them the information.
33:41To try and explain to the family what the whole home office post-mortem is all about,
33:47it is a really difficult conversation to have at a time when there are so many different emotions going on.
33:53The cause of death was the knife used went seven centimetres into Chiron's heart
34:00and seven centimetres, the knife wound to his back, punctured the lung.
34:06Chiron, he had significant internal bleeding.
34:10He suffocated in his own blood.
34:12His brain had been stabbed in Oxford for 60 minutes at the scene.
34:21When interviewing suspects for murders, I usually have an interview advisor to monitor the interviews
34:26so they can actually see what each suspect is saying in case one starts playing the other one off.
34:31On this occasion, we use what we call stage disclosure,
34:35where we don't tell the suspects everything because we want to get an unbiased and open account from them.
34:42Eventually, Michael admitted that he was the man in the CCTV.
34:45He admitted being the person who stabbed Chiron.
34:50There was a number of different reasons why Michael said he stabbed Chiron,
34:55which gave some unreliability to his account.
34:59The first one was that he said he was in self-defence.
35:01We really need to scrutinise the CCTV to negate that.
35:07We're obviously aware that Chiron's got a knife in his bag,
35:09so we had to go back all the way through the footage from the minute they met
35:14all the way up to the actual stabbing
35:16just to make sure that Chiron didn't draw the knife or there was any threats.
35:22We painstakingly went through it with a fine-tooth comb.
35:25We were more than satisfied that at no time did Chiron threaten Michael with a knife
35:30or certainly didn't do anything that caused a good self-defence for Michael to rely on.
35:43There was another account to say that Chiron had been disrespectful to a rap video.
35:47He said there was a disagreement over a song
35:51that Michael had performed and uploaded to YouTube.
35:55We've never, ever been able to obtain details of the interaction,
36:01so it's never been proven indefinitely, you know, without doubt that that was the reason.
36:11Both Michael and the other male involved,
36:14they both accepted that they were the people on CCTV at the altercation.
36:19I would suggest that Michael was quite naive in some of his responses.
36:24The fact that he's admitted that he was a man on the CCTV
36:27was a massive help to the investigation.
36:30And on the 21st of October 2017,
36:33Michael Aydon and another male were both charged with murder.
36:36I made the family aware that two suspects had been charged
36:41with the murder of Chiron,
36:44and that was greeted with some relief.
36:47And positive news as well for them that we've got the killers in custody.
36:54Most trials are usually between one and two weeks.
36:58You prepare yourself for being present
37:01and just being there for them each day.
37:04It's unknown territory for families.
37:06They don't know.
37:06They've never been through the justice system.
37:09Leading up to the trial,
37:09I had not got a scooby on what I was going to experience.
37:14Sarah was that navigator through the whole criminal proceedings
37:19around the murder trial.
37:24I always explain to families before trial a little bit about courtrooms.
37:29And also if something be said about Chiron
37:32or something about the way they perceived he lived his life,
37:36you cannot comment at the time.
37:38You have to remain silent.
37:39You have to sort of listen to the information
37:41and just be respectful in the courtroom.
37:45I was really nervous, really, really nervous.
37:48And I was so scared that the part-time stage
37:51was going to be something really sinister and bad.
37:54And I didn't really want to hear it.
37:56A lot of that information is quite hard to hear,
38:00but it's good to know before their families get into the courtroom
38:03and allowing them to vent any concerns that they have
38:06prior to reaching that point.
38:16We went up to Manchester for the trial in April.
38:20And Sarah was with us every day.
38:22Crown Court's a big building in Manchester.
38:25It's quite overwhelming.
38:26You get security checks as you enter the building.
38:29You then escorted to courtroom,
38:32which may, at short notice, change.
38:35When we got to the courts,
38:36we were taken into a room
38:38by Stephen and Sarah.
38:42And they showed us the CCTV footage
38:46before it was played in court
38:49just to prepare me for what was going to be seen.
38:56I hadn't seen Chiron alive
38:59for five and a bit months.
39:03So it was lovely seeing him alive.
39:05It was lovely seeing him walk.
39:08It was lovely seeing his clothes
39:09filled with a person inside them.
39:12It was lovely seeing the bag on him whole.
39:17It was lovely seeing the bandana with no stains.
39:19It was just nice.
39:25I wanted to just lean into the screen
39:27and pull him out.
39:28I wanted to kiss the lips that were smiling.
39:31I wanted to hold his hands that was in his pocket.
39:34I just wanted to hug him.
39:35There was no sound on the CCTV
39:37and I was just dying to hear his voice.
39:40And then as he gets up to the Barclays Bank
39:42where Michael and the accomplice are seated
39:45and seeing that interaction,
39:49it was hard because
39:52there weren't any visual anger that I could see.
39:57I don't think Chiron,
39:58one, he didn't know he was in danger.
40:00Two, he didn't understand the severity
40:02of what was going on.
40:03He would have seen the knife
40:04before the knife came down on him.
40:06Michael must have said something.
40:07There must have been some menace or anger in his words.
40:12But in the silence of this vision,
40:16it just, just wasn't there.
40:20When they stabbed him,
40:22because he probably was absolutely petrified,
40:25when I saw him stagger,
40:27I struggled
40:28because then I thought,
40:30my baby boy is hurt.
40:32When I saw him lean on the wall
40:33and he was pulling at his coat,
40:35I thought, he's having an asthma attack.
40:36He can't breathe.
40:37I didn't even need to get him in his inhalers.
40:38Then when he leant back
40:39and pulled up his trousers,
40:41I thought,
40:41I keep telling this boy to put on a belt.
40:43And then when they stabbed him again
40:45and he dropped down,
40:46he jumped back up and I said,
40:46there's my boy, there's his fire.
40:48He's a roaring lion,
40:49there's his fire.
40:51And then I see him walk around the corner.
40:53And then I knew
40:56that he took that final fall
40:58and he was never going to get up.
40:59When they were playing the CCTV footage
41:02in the court,
41:03his dad wasn't able to sit in the courtroom.
41:07He found it too difficult.
41:11The family area,
41:14Manchester Crown Court,
41:15is sort of a side-on situation
41:18with the defendants being in the middle.
41:20We were all sat down in the pew.
41:22I remember hearing chains.
41:24Then when we sat down
41:25to the right of me,
41:28Michael was just standing there.
41:31I...
41:33I think I was stunned.
41:38And I remember looking at him thinking,
41:40you look like a child,
41:42but because they pled guilty,
41:44it meant that they didn't need
41:46to give any further explanation
41:48to what had happened and why.
41:50It really annoyed me
41:52because I wanted to know
41:54what happened and why it happened.
41:57And I wanted them to explain to me
41:58what on earth Kyron did to them
42:00that they felt warranted
42:02his life being taken.
42:07The knife that killed Kyron
42:10was not found.
42:11The sentence was,
42:13for Michael Iverhearne,
42:14was 15 years.
42:16Not having the murder weapon
42:17would have been a serious challenge
42:19if we hadn't got
42:21the clear CCTV footage that we had.
42:24Due to the strength of the CCTV,
42:27the evidence in this case,
42:28both males pleaded guilty.
42:30Michael pleaded guilty
42:31to the murder of Kyron,
42:34where the other male pleaded guilty
42:35of a manslaughter.
42:36He ended up with two years.
42:38I felt when we got a result
42:40and someone convicted at court,
42:42I felt it was a very rewarding role
42:44that fulfilled me,
42:45the fact that we'd made a difference
42:46to the families who had gone
42:47through such a traumatic time.
42:49That time wasn't significant, really,
42:52and quite probably difficult
42:53to deal with for the family.
42:54I still feel disappointed.
42:57There are times when I get really angry.
43:00Our past catches up with us
43:02all of the time,
43:03and I think
43:06he has a 15-year sentence in prison,
43:10but he also has,
43:12as I do,
43:13a lifetime sentence
43:15of murder.
43:21Oh, my word, how are you?
43:23That was joyful.
43:31I remember you
43:33as being
43:35just a lovely person,
43:37just somebody that was approachable,
43:38even in all this trauma
43:40and this turmoil.
43:41Even though
43:43you didn't know me,
43:44you had a smile on your face,
43:45and you put me at ease
43:48from that moment I met you.
43:49I just remember you
43:51just being there
43:52all the time.
43:54So whenever I felt
43:56completely overwhelmed
43:57and completely choked up
43:58and you could see
43:59she's going to have a breakdown,
44:00she needs me,
44:01and you were just there.
44:02You always had a hug waiting.
44:03I was this
44:05smashed up pavement,
44:06and you just seemed to know
44:09where all the cracks were,
44:10and then your support
44:11was like cement.
44:12You made me
44:13and all my family
44:14feel that we belonged,
44:16and you went above
44:18and beyond
44:18the call of duty.
44:20I absolutely adore you,
44:21and so do the kids.
44:22We adore you.
44:23We talk about you at home
44:24like you're my mum.
44:25Like, honestly.
44:27But no,
44:28it is amazing.
44:30You are absolutely amazing.
44:32Thank you for all those words.
44:34I mean,
44:35well,
44:36I feel honoured
44:37to have met you,
44:38and I'm sorry
44:38it's under those circumstances
44:40because you are truly
44:41a lovely lady
44:42who, you know,
44:44has put a lot
44:44into her family,
44:46and the loss of Chiron
44:48is huge,
44:50but I think the way
44:51you have handled everything
44:54and taken everything
44:55on board,
44:55you've had to step up
44:58and do.
44:59You've done it
45:01so well.
45:02You know,
45:02you'll never
45:04get over the loss
45:05of Chiron,
45:05but how you manage it
45:07and how you deal with it
45:08and how you move on
45:09your life
45:09will be so different
45:10by how you'll dealt with
45:12on that first day.
45:12And for me,
45:14that's what it's about
45:14and that's why
45:15I do this job.
45:16Just knowing
45:18that I had somebody
45:19there who understood
45:21the experience
45:21and was able
45:23to prepare me for it
45:24and then offer
45:25the aftercare support
45:26and, you know,
45:27just that
45:28more greater understanding,
45:30I think that helped
45:32me get through that.
45:33And look at you now
45:34and look at the kids now.
45:35They're all thriving.
45:36They're all doing.
45:38They're all going off
45:38to new adventures
45:40in their lives,
45:40aren't they?
45:41And Chiron will always
45:43be there.
45:43Yeah.
45:44He's always there
45:45in the background.
45:46He's never gone.
46:16He's always there
46:16and, if they were
46:16You
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