00:15Wszelkie prawa zastrzeżone.
00:30Israeli airstrikes.
00:31What is your reaction
00:32and your comments
00:33to this first statement?
00:35Well, it's not like
00:36they didn't try to kill
00:37Israelis and Americans
00:38and people from the EU
00:41and Saudi Arabia
00:42and everywhere else
00:43before that.
00:44This is what they do.
00:45This is, that's the regime.
00:48This is why we've been
00:49telling everybody
00:50this is not a real government.
00:52This is a terror organization
00:53disguised as a regime
00:55that took hostage
00:56an entire country,
00:58a glorious culture,
00:59the Iranian czar,
01:01an ancient culture
01:03that was taken by force
01:04by the people
01:06who are saying
01:06this kind of thing.
01:07So we're not really threatened.
01:09Mr. Lapid,
01:10the US-Israeli war in Iran,
01:12which is now
01:12in its second week,
01:14is arguably this very rare case
01:15in which Israel's opposition
01:17is fully supporting
01:18the government
01:19and there is no disagreement.
01:20Can you explain
01:21why is that?
01:23Well, because it's a just war.
01:24You're right.
01:25I think I've earned the title
01:27the most bitter political rival
01:29of Benjamin Netanyahu.
01:32But here we are fighting
01:34an existential war
01:36against a regime
01:38that has been spreading terror,
01:40that has been trying
01:41to develop nuclear weapons
01:44in order to use them
01:45against Israel,
01:45that was developing
01:47his ballistic missile operation
01:49in order to shower Israel
01:50with missiles.
01:51One of them fell next
01:53to my mom's house.
01:54She's 91 years old.
01:55She's nobody's enemy.
01:57And, of course,
01:58that was suppressing
01:59its own people
02:00in the most brutal way.
02:02So, in the 21st century,
02:05it is not easy
02:06to have a war
02:08with moral clarity.
02:09But here we have
02:10a war with moral clarity.
02:11So, you know,
02:12before being
02:13the opposition leader,
02:14I'm an Israeli patriot
02:15and therefore
02:16I'm supporting
02:18a just war.
02:19This doesn't come to say
02:20that I agree
02:20with everything
02:21Benjamin Netanyahu
02:22is doing or saying
02:23on other issues,
02:24but on this one
02:26we are on the same page.
02:27But there is exactly
02:28the claims
02:29regarding the criticism
02:30of this clarity.
02:32This is not
02:32exactly clear
02:33for everybody
02:34when it comes
02:35to the U.S.
02:36and Israeli war
02:37on Iran.
02:38Why is that?
02:39I mean,
02:40I've heard people
02:40talking about
02:41the international law
02:43on the subject.
02:44If it wasn't so sad,
02:46it would be funny.
02:48The last time
02:49I've checked,
02:50the international law
02:52was there
02:52to protect us
02:53from rogue
02:55terrorist countries
02:56not to protect them.
02:58These are the people
03:00who just killed
03:01more than 32,000
03:03of their own people
03:04last January
03:05when they took
03:06to the streets.
03:06This is the people
03:07who are fueling
03:09Hezbollah and Hamas
03:10and the Iraqi Hezbollah
03:13with weapons and money.
03:14These are the people
03:15who said,
03:17they were outspoken
03:18about this.
03:18They said,
03:19we want to have
03:20nuclear power
03:21because we want to use
03:22nuclear power
03:23against Israel.
03:24Is there anybody
03:24in his right mind
03:25who believes
03:26in the good intentions
03:27of the Iranian regime?
03:29Mr. Lapid,
03:30the critics would
03:31turn this argument
03:33regarding the international
03:34law
03:35because according
03:36to Tehran,
03:37there are also
03:37over 1,200 Iranians
03:40killed since the beginning
03:41of the U.S.-Israeli war.
03:43Yeah,
03:43well,
03:44these are casualties
03:44of war.
03:45Nobody killed them
03:46intentionally.
03:47First of all,
03:47you have to doubt
03:48their numbers.
03:49But still,
03:50nobody is killing
03:51them intentionally.
03:52We are targeting,
03:53the Americans are targeting,
03:53this operation is targeting
03:57strictly military targets.
03:59They are targeting
04:01Israeli and other countries,
04:03civilian targets,
04:04in order to kill
04:05as many civilians
04:06as possible.
04:06I'm not saying
04:07that in every war
04:08there are casualties,
04:09it's heartbreaking,
04:11children should not die
04:12in grown-ups' wars.
04:13But still,
04:14this is a mistake.
04:16What they're doing
04:17is trying,
04:18in purpose,
04:19to kill civilians.
04:20That's exactly
04:21the difference
04:21between the two countries.
04:23What would be
04:23your argument
04:24and your comment
04:25regarding the school
04:26attacked and hit
04:28in Iran?
04:29That this is a terrible,
04:30terrible,
04:31horrible tragedy.
04:32And my heart
04:34goes to the parents.
04:35And again,
04:36this is the kind
04:37of things
04:37that are happening,
04:38it should not happen,
04:39but happening in war.
04:41Nobody wanted
04:41this to happen,
04:42nobody intended
04:43this to happen.
04:44And at the same time,
04:45the Iranians
04:46are targeting,
04:47in purpose,
04:49Israeli schools,
04:50Israeli hospitals,
04:52Israeli civilians.
04:53So this is,
04:54again,
04:55nobody is claiming
04:56that war
04:57is not a horrible thing.
04:58Sometimes even
04:59a just war
04:59is a horrible thing
05:00because there are casualties
05:02and there are
05:02civilian casualties.
05:04And again,
05:04I send my condolences
05:05to the parents
05:06of those children.
05:07What do you see,
05:08what is the clear goal
05:09of the US-Israeli
05:12war on Iran?
05:13Is that the regime change?
05:15I would say
05:16there are three goals.
05:17First is to obliterate
05:19the nuclear program
05:21of Iran.
05:22Second,
05:23to obliterate
05:23the ballistic missile
05:24program of Iran.
05:25and third,
05:27is not to change
05:28the regime
05:28because I'm a very
05:29small believer
05:30in the ability
05:31to change a regime
05:32with airstrikes,
05:33but to create
05:34better conditions
05:35for the Iranian people
05:37to take their fate
05:38and their destiny
05:39into their own hands.
05:41I think
05:42last January
05:43when they took
05:44to the streets
05:44and they were killed
05:45by the thousands,
05:46by the Bastige
05:47and the Revolutionary Guards,
05:49they felt
05:50alone.
05:51And I don't think
05:52they feel alone
05:53right now.
05:53I think the conditions
05:54and the ability
05:55and the probability
05:56of them changing
05:57the regime
05:58has grown significantly.
06:00Now it's up
06:01to the Iranian people.
06:02I don't know
06:03if there will be
06:04an Iranian Nelson Mandela,
06:07an Iranian Gandhi
06:07or an Iranian
06:08Lech Valenza,
06:10but I hope
06:11for their sake,
06:12for the people
06:13of Iran,
06:14there will be
06:14and there will be
06:15a regime change.
06:16But that was already
06:17stated as the goal
06:18as well during
06:19the 12 days war
06:20in June.
06:21And then after
06:22those 12 days
06:22the process went
06:23into negotiations
06:25and now it's been
06:27two weeks back
06:28from negotiations
06:29to the war.
06:30Is that the cycle?
06:31Is it going
06:31from the period
06:33of war
06:34and then negotiations
06:35and back to the war?
06:36Hopefully not.
06:38What happened was
06:39after the 12 days
06:41in June
06:41they have
06:43signed the truth
06:44and then they
06:45wanted negotiations
06:46and then it was
06:47very obvious
06:48that these are
06:49not real negotiations.
06:50What they really did
06:51was trying to stall
06:52and buy time
06:53in order to rebuild
06:54the nuclear program
06:57and ballistic missile program.
06:58It was interesting to me
07:00Stephen Witkoff
07:01the American mediator
07:03told everybody
07:04that during the negotiations
07:06in Oman
07:07the Iranians
07:08told him
07:09proudly
07:10that by now
07:11they accumulated
07:12enough
07:13enriched uranium
07:15to build 11 atomic bombs.
07:17So they were not
07:18really negotiating
07:19what they were really doing
07:21is deceiving
07:22and lying
07:22and buying time
07:23in order to build
07:25weapons of mass destruction.
07:26There are claims
07:27that in fact
07:28it was not the
07:29US president's decision
07:31to attack Iran
07:32and now to continue
07:33two weeks into the war
07:35but that he was
07:36spurred on by Israel.
07:37Do you think
07:38that was the case?
07:38Was Israel
07:39pushing harder
07:40and pushing the United States
07:41into attacking Iran?
07:43Sasha,
07:43does Donald Trump's
07:44strikes you
07:45somebody who can be
07:46pushed around?
07:47I don't think so.
07:48I think,
07:49I mean,
07:49he's the president
07:50of the biggest military army
07:53in the history of humanity.
07:54He's a determined man.
07:56Israel is filled
07:57with gratitude
07:58and admiration
08:00to his courage,
08:01to his moral clarity
08:02on the issue,
08:03to the fact
08:04he decided
08:04to go this war,
08:05understanding
08:06that he's protecting
08:07peace on earth.
08:09So, no,
08:10I don't think
08:11somebody,
08:12there's a person,
08:12maybe with the exception
08:14of Melania,
08:15I don't think
08:15anybody can push
08:17Donald Trump
08:18to do anything
08:18he doesn't want to do.
08:19Let me ask you
08:20about the wider region
08:21because given Iran's
08:23proxy networks
08:24in the region,
08:25do you see them
08:26as part of Israel's
08:27strategy
08:28in the ongoing war
08:29and how to deal
08:31with that?
08:32Because,
08:32for example,
08:33when it comes to Lebanon,
08:34Israel has a long
08:35and rather complicated
08:36history with Lebanon.
08:37and do you think
08:38Israel can defeat
08:40Hezbollah by force?
08:41This is when
08:42the escalation
08:44is getting bigger
08:44and wider.
08:45I agree.
08:46Well,
08:46first of all,
08:47we have to remember
08:47who decided
08:48to make this bigger
08:49and wider.
08:50I mean,
08:51Iran started this war
08:52by bombarding
08:53the EU,
08:55Saudi Arabia,
08:56Kuwait,
08:57Bahrain,
08:58Oman,
08:59all those countries
08:59who's done them
09:00no harm
09:01just because they wanted
09:02to escalate everything.
09:03Part of this escalation
09:05is using the proxies,
09:06you're right,
09:06last night
09:07there were more
09:08than 200 launches
09:10from Hezbollah
09:11towards Israel.
09:12Israel is stronger
09:14than Hezbollah.
09:14We're going to strike back.
09:15We're going to strike back
09:16in a painful way.
09:20It needs to be dealt,
09:22but this is also
09:22a problem
09:23of the Lebanese government.
09:24When I was prime minister,
09:26I signed an agreement
09:27with the Lebanese government
09:29trying to improve
09:30the relationship.
09:31But Lebanon
09:32will not exist
09:33as a country,
09:34as a sovereign country,
09:35if they will let
09:36keep on doing
09:37whatever they want
09:38to do
09:39from Lebanon.
09:41So now we are
09:41hitting Beirut
09:42and we are hitting
09:43southern Lebanon.
09:44But I think
09:45it's in everybody's interest
09:47and first and foremost
09:48Lebanon's interest
09:49to make sure
09:50Hezbollah
09:51doesn't join this
09:52and stop shooting
09:53at Israel
09:54because the price
09:55will be painful.
09:56Lebanese government
09:57said it was willing
09:58to enter direct
09:58negotiations with Israel.
10:00Is that something
10:01that Israel
10:01would be open to?
10:02This is,
10:03well,
10:03if it was up to me,
10:04I would do it.
10:05I think I would do it.
10:06I would use this
10:07like a scissor effect.
10:09I would fight
10:10Hezbollah fiercely.
10:11I would go into
10:12southern Lebanon
10:13if necessary,
10:14making sure Hezbollah
10:16is pushed over
10:16the Litani River
10:17and while doing it,
10:19negotiate with
10:20the Lebanese government
10:21because it's their
10:22problem as well.
10:23Right now,
10:25it's up to the Lebanese
10:26people to determine
10:27whether it's a country
10:29with a terror organization
10:31or a terror organization
10:32with a country.
10:33If Lebanon wants
10:34to be a real country,
10:36then they need to
10:36do much more
10:38in controlling Hezbollah.
10:39Mr. Lupit,
10:40with this war
10:41now in the second war,
10:42entering the third war,
10:44with Hezbollah
10:45joining the escalation
10:48and the whole spillover
10:49over the Gulf region,
10:50is this now
10:51turning into
10:53a bigger
10:54and ultimately
10:55never-ending war?
10:56I don't think so.
10:57I think many of the goals
10:59of the war
11:00are achievable.
11:01I think Iran
11:02made a huge mistake
11:03because what they did
11:05was they thought
11:06that if they will
11:06bomb the neighbors
11:07in the Gulf,
11:09this will create
11:10pressure on Washington
11:11because all those countries
11:12will go to Washington
11:13and say to the president,
11:14listen,
11:14you have to stop the war,
11:15this is killing us.
11:17Instead,
11:17they have,
11:18by their own doing,
11:19created the coalition
11:21they always feared of.
11:23Right now,
11:23we are on the same coalition
11:25with the Saudis,
11:26with the Emirates,
11:26with the Omanis,
11:27with everybody,
11:29opposite Iran's
11:30rogue violence,
11:31opposite their
11:34try to burn
11:36everything and everyone.
11:38And on the long term
11:40and not so long term,
11:42I think this is
11:42going to have
11:43a very,
11:45it's going to have
11:45a rebound effect
11:46against Iran.
11:47So, no,
11:48I don't think
11:48this will be
11:49a never-ending war.
11:50Thank you very much
11:51for your time,
11:52Ray Lapid,
11:52leader of the opposition
11:54in Israel.
11:54Thank you.
11:55Thank you, Sasha.
11:55Thank you, Sasha.
11:57Thank you, Sasha.
11:57Thank you, Sasha.
11:57Thank you, Sasha.
11:58Thank you, Sasha.
11:58Thank you, Sasha.
11:58Thank you, Sasha.
11:58Thank you, Sasha.
11:58Thank you, Sasha.
11:58Thank you, Sasha.
11:59Thank you, Sasha.
11:59Thank you, Sasha.
11:59Thank you, Sasha.
11:59Thank you, Sasha.
11:59Thank you, Sasha.
11:59Thank you, Sasha.
12:00KONIEC
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