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00:09Grog, how many pubs have we been in in the East End, would you reckon?
00:12All of them, wouldn't we?
00:13We've probably thrown out of most of them.
00:15And out of all those places of refreshing, which would you say are the tastiest bars?
00:19Oh, no competition, Phil. That place in Woolford. The Queen something.
00:23Yeah, the Queen, Dick. Of the rest of my case.
00:27but I'd rather you arrest 2.20 on the bar.
00:29So, Phila and Grant are archetypal East End brothers.
00:36They were obviously originally based on the Cray brothers,
00:39so nothing will come between them, you know?
00:44The only person that comes between them is their mum,
00:47and they're told to do what their mum does
00:49in that true East End tradition.
00:53And Grant falls for Sharon.
00:55He works behind the bar.
00:57He does have issues.
00:59No-one's going to deny that,
01:00but so do a lot of people that exist in Albert Square.
01:05Grant goes to prison.
01:06There's a relationship formed between his brother and his wife.
01:11You're a lovely bloke, Phila.
01:13He'll never tell you that.
01:15Yeah, all the time.
01:16You know what I mean? You're really sweet.
01:18Thanks.
01:36Phil!
01:38And so what happens is that Michelle, who is Sharon's best friend...
01:45Sharon is in the triangle, obviously.
01:47She is doing a thesis about relationships,
01:51and she records, as people did in the old days before mobile phones,
01:55on a cassette recorder.
01:56I think it may have been working-class women and their relationships.
02:00Wide subject.
02:01But inside that interview, they get drunk.
02:04They have a couple of glasses and bottles of wine,
02:06and Sharon, the recorder's going,
02:10and Sharon tells Michelle
02:11that she's had an affair with Grant's brother, Phil.
02:15That cassette gets lost.
02:17It turns up in Grant's car.
02:20Grant pulls it out to play a tune,
02:22and suddenly he's listening to his wife,
02:24who he's smiling about, listening to her talking to Michelle
02:26about being young and then being friends together.
02:28All you see is what he shows everyone else.
02:31But he's different with me.
02:33Gentleman.
02:34If you say so.
02:35Way to go, Michelle.
02:36I do.
02:38He's my darling.
02:40And you're my darling too, sweetheart.
02:43And all of a sudden, she starts telling Michelle
02:45about how she has slept with his brother.
02:50Pure soap.
03:02What about Phil?
03:05That him.
03:06You slept with him, remember?
03:11Phil was different.
03:12Why?
03:13He just was.
03:15I didn't know that the first time.
03:18In one minute, I was looking at him,
03:19in the next, ripping each other's clothes off.
03:23And after?
03:25Well, it was like Phil was a nice side of Grant,
03:29without the other stuff.
03:31I think that's why I fell in love with him.
03:32I didn't need Tearstick to get into that state.
03:35Because the emotions and the people that you're working with,
03:38you're close with them.
03:39And you get rhythms.
03:41I mean, you start working with a new actor on a job,
03:44you take time to feel how you pass the ball to each other.
03:48Whereas Steve and I, it was just natural.
03:52And it felt like two brothers.
03:54And many people today still think we are brothers.
03:58I had screen tested for a part in the bill.
04:01I tried to drive a vehicle off with a cameraman still in the back,
04:05attached to the leads to a scanner.
04:07So that went against me.
04:10And I realised it wasn't going too well.
04:12And the next day, I had to put handcuffs on someone.
04:14So I was practising.
04:16And as I was absentmindedly snapping the cuffs on,
04:19I actually cuffed my wrist.
04:21And when I went to the props guys to get a key,
04:24they wouldn't give it to me,
04:25because I tried to kill a cameraman the day before.
04:29So I had to do the whole scene with my hand behind my back,
04:31a bit like Napoleon.
04:33Funnily enough, didn't get the part.
04:34But they thought of me for the part of Grant.
04:38So I think there was like hundreds of us to start with.
04:41But I got down to the last date.
04:42We screen tested on set at EastEnders.
04:46There were four Grants, four Phil's.
04:48I didn't actually screen test with Steve.
04:50Next day, I got the phone call.
04:52And within a week, I was on set.
05:00Sorry, girls.
05:01Didn't mean to scare you.
05:03See you down at Mecca next Monday.
05:06By the second year, I think they'd given us a year with a year option.
05:09And you could, obviously, there was 52 weeks a year.
05:12So 84 shows a year.
05:15And I think I was in 90.
05:17So it kicked.
05:18And within a year, Steve and I had suddenly just taken off inside the show.
05:23And that was that.
05:26We were lucky that the writers, in particular, Tony Jordan and Tony McHale, liked the characters.
05:34You know, Steve and I were not long out of drama school.
05:36We looked very similar.
05:38We both were classically trained actors who were very, maybe overly interested in the method, where a lot of actors
05:49have got used to doing it in a very kind of easier way.
05:52We went, you know, if we were doing a scene in the Vic, when you walk in the doors, and
05:56we know that we knew that about two weeks before, when you shoot the outside stuff out of continuity, that
06:02we were chasing down the road after someone.
06:03We wouldn't walk in like we just had a cup of tea.
06:05We'd do press-ups outside and we'd jog on the spot.
06:08So he came in hot and sweaty.
06:10And I think that, you know, I think I understand when people are in a long-running show, those things
06:15don't necessarily are important unless the director tells you to do it.
06:19But we were already on it.
06:20And I think we took it maybe too seriously in places.
06:24But I think that also paid off.
06:26You know, the Mitchell brothers have stood the test of time.
06:31Look, whatever I said, it was taken out of context.
06:33You know what the police are like.
06:34They'll take things anywhere they want.
06:35I bet you loved putting a finger on Frank, didn't you?
06:37Look, all I said was he's a bit skint right now.
06:39It's hardly a criminal offence, is it?
06:40Oh, you're brain-dead, eh?
06:41If you kept your big mouth shut, Frank would be in the clear right now, wouldn't he?
06:43Instead of having a filth crawling all over him.
06:45Do you know, I never knew you two were so committed to the brotherhood of man.
06:47You're looking worse for yourself!
06:49Grant!
06:49Grant!
06:50Leave it!
06:51This doesn't concern you.
06:52I'm not having this in the Vic.
06:53Join me, I'm not having it.
06:54Like I said, it doesn't concern you.
06:55You'd better have a damn good explanation.
06:58Letitia Dean has always been a powerhouse.
07:02I think of all the people that have been in that show,
07:05you've got to look to Tish and Steve
07:08for still carrying a lot of the heavy storylines.
07:13Call them heavy lifters, that's their nickname.
07:16And I would say Jilly, Talforth and Adam Woodjot.
07:20Over the years, and Jilly and Adam being originals,
07:25and Tish being an original course,
07:27and Steve and I joined like five years into the show's journey.
07:32So I think, you know,
07:36Tish, for me, out of all of them,
07:38even all four of them, dare I say it,
07:40has probably had the biggest storylines
07:42over 40 years of EastEnders.
07:44And still does so.
07:47And still pulls it off.
07:49God knows how, but she does.
07:51I'd better go and find Graham.
07:53No.
07:55I can't leave him on his own, not after all this, can I?
07:57No, I know what he's like.
07:58He'll be walking around brooding on it,
08:00churning it over, then he'll go into one.
08:01Oh, look, she's worried about you.
08:03He'll kill him, and me too, probably.
08:05Couldn't happen to two nicer people.
08:08Won't come back here, would he?
08:09Someone described him as having toxic masculinity.
08:12I don't think anyone knew what toxic masculinity was.
08:15And for me, you know, Grant's a veteran.
08:18Grant served in the army.
08:20He was in the Falklands when he was very, very young.
08:23And I researched, you know, PTSD, you know,
08:26when people weren't even talking about it.
08:28And having been out to Afghanistan on a regular basis,
08:31you know, I've seen PTSD.
08:33PTSD, and I know what effect it can have on people in so many different ways.
08:38And PTSD is one word for numerous, you know, mental health issues.
08:44So, you know, I've never seen Grant as anything but someone who has many issues.
08:50As many people in these tenders have many issues,
08:52because issues create drama, and it is a big drama.
08:56No one goes into the cap and just orders a cheese sandwich.
09:01They order a cheese sandwich!
09:04And if you think you're doing that, that's why I take my hat off, if I have one,
09:08to all the people that have been in the show for a very long time,
09:11because it's an emotional drain.
09:14No, no, you're not, you know, you're not working in casualty,
09:18and, you know, you're not a police officer,
09:21and you're not dealing with life and death situations,
09:24but you're expected to act what it's like to be in a life and death situation
09:29on a regular basis.
09:38And that can scoop you out at the end of the day,
09:40and it's a bit of a roller coaster.
09:42I've been worried about it.
09:43Stay away from me!
09:45You come anywhere near me, I swear to God, I'll kill you!
09:54I had to keep thinking of sad thoughts for about five hours.
09:58It was freezing, and I refused to wear any kind of, like, you know, undergarment,
10:05because I wanted to feel like I was there in the moment.
10:07So I was pretty cold.
10:09I was trying to think of very sad thoughts to make my eyes continue to stream,
10:13and my nose continued to snort, and it carried on snotting.
10:16I don't know why it did, but it did, maybe because it was so cold.
10:20Move out of my way.
10:21Oh.
10:23But you can't go, not like this, are we?
10:26Give it time, you're hurting now.
10:27Hurting?
10:30I can feel every stroke.
10:34You may as well have had a knife in your hand.
10:37Some of the lines, you know, I can feel every stroke, you may as well have had a knife in
10:41your hand.
10:427.30, Watershed, you know, not many people get away with saying things like that,
10:48and I think, you know, Grant could in that situation, and I think audiences wanted him to say something,
10:55wanted to feel that pain that he was feeling.
10:58And, you know, testament to Steve's acting ability to be able to play off that.
11:03Hit me.
11:06Go on, that's what I want, I deserve it.
11:09Come on.
11:10I want it over with and out of the way.
11:12Move.
11:13No.
11:16Come on.
11:18Come on.
11:20Think about what I did, eh?
11:21Come on, I want it out of the way!
11:23Steve and I could both look after ourselves to a certain extent, and we wanted it to be as real
11:29as possible,
11:29so it was pretty real.
11:31I mean, apart from, you know, him landing in the pit,
11:37I shoved him into those paint cans as hard as I possibly could,
11:42and he pushed me backwards as hard as he could, and that's why it looks real.
11:45Do you know why?
11:46Because it was real.
11:47But we were both, in those days, particularly rough and tough enough to be able to look after ourselves.
11:51Come on over with!
11:53Come on over with!
11:58Come on over with!
12:01I remember just at the end of it, you know, you don't normally get applauses because we're moving on.
12:07And we got all the actors that were in the scene got a round of applause, which was nice.
12:12Because we'd all pulled it together, we'd all worked really hard.
12:15And I think, you know, the great thing about the crews were, we knew that this was a biggie.
12:20And we all felt, you feel that kind of, this isn't a cheese sandwich scene and an egg and bacon
12:26in the calf.
12:27This is, for opera, big stuff.
12:29This is a combination of a year's storyline.
12:33Tony Jordan's writing was absolutely superb.
12:35He was, he's a very talented writer, but he was particularly on fire when he wrote those and came up
12:40with that full storyline.
12:45People loved it.
12:46Millions of people tuned into that.
12:49Big storylines in those days.
12:50I mean, the big one is obviously Den and Angie.
12:52That was 30 million.
12:53But, you know, 25 million people, you know, that's, that was a massive part of the population at that time.
13:02I think we were about 65 million.
13:04So you're approaching nearly half the country tuned in to watch it.
13:08I think it was the best storyline.
13:10I had some very good storylines with Steve.
13:13But I spoke to Tish and she, I think she believes that was the biggest storyline.
13:18The one that she's most proud of.
13:19Yeah, I have to say, in terms of the numbers as well, the people that tuned in.
13:24And it was a slow burner.
13:26So that storyline went for over a year.
13:30And that's something that EastEnders is very clever at and very good at in terms of planting something and letting
13:35it grow and grow and grow and grow and grow and grow.
13:38And right at the moment, right moment, exploding it on screen.
13:42And then all the ripples that come off that create other storylines.
13:47My first feelings about watching it, and I haven't watched it obviously in 25 years, something like that, is to
13:54think, do you know what, that was quite good.
13:56And all the actors were good.
14:02And the quality of the shooting, you know, it doesn't look that dated.
14:07It goes to show, you know, just what an achievement everybody attached to that show managed to pull off.
14:16Because if you look at other programmes out there today being made, I would suggest that the quality on that
14:21show is probably higher than some of the stuff, a lot of the stuff that you're seeing on other channels.
14:25It goes to show, you guys.
14:25It goes to showال.
14:27It goes to show to characters, and they're just...
14:35it goes to show how huge people we were with them.
14:35Oh, thanks for taking part time to show their stuff, would you be very happy with us?