00:00Es historiadora de arte, autora y estratega cultural.
00:15Ha trabajado con coleccionistas privados, instituciones y ciudades en el desarrollo de proyectos artísticos de largo plazo.
00:23Es una figura clave en la gestión y proyección de iniciativas culturales de alto impacto.
00:28La directora artística del Parque de Esculturas en Oslo, Ekeberg Parken, Ina Johansen Dibli, en Milenio Negocios.
00:42Bienvenidos a Milenio Negocios, este programa semanal para entender un poco más los aspectos económicos, financieros y en el mundo de los negocios.
00:51Y el día de hoy me acompaña una invitada muy especial, Ina Johansen Dibli.
00:54Ella es estratega cultural, es de Noruega, lleva trabajando de la mano de coleccionistas, de coleccionistas privados,
01:03pero también instituciones y sobre todo ciudades en proyectos artísticos de largo plazo.
01:09Y la tengo el día de hoy en el programa porque esta semana es la Semana del Arte.
01:13Y hablar del mercado del arte implica una escena artística cultural dentro del mundo de los negocios, la economía y las finanzas.
01:22Thank you so much, Ina, for being here.
01:25In a context of geopolitical uncertainty and a lot of volatility,
01:29it seems that talking or, I mean, start figuring out how to zoom in into art,
01:39it seems like it would be a fragmented picture.
01:42and it will be harder to address it or to even think about it in a world where everything seems
01:48to be more important how do you approach that question i believe that the art market is a very
01:56complex institution in a way uh ecosystem and it's not it's not that sensitive to all these
02:05short-term longer-term currents that change it is an ecosystem that has its own long long line
02:14of of functioning of course you will see volatility in in auction results or sales results here and
02:23there but all in all i think that the the art market is always there maybe the behavior changes
02:29along the way but there's always a curiosity there's always an appetite and as you say that
02:34the art fair is coming up this week the art fair to go to an art fair is always such a beautiful
02:40uh experience and you travel to a city you see something new an atmosphere you meet colleagues
02:46you've seen before met before relations and you cultivate that so the art market is
02:52is always working in a broader picture why are they important not only in uncertain times but in general
02:59especially uh thinking about putting mexico in in an international context
03:07i briefly mentioned auctions auction is a thing it's a result of uh what comes to the market availability
03:14so there you will have the volatility that we talk about so auction is really like a
03:18uh a short moment it's the evening it's it's the build up to an evening the art market in certain
03:27in sense of um uh art fairs and art weeks is completely different because you go there and you
03:33immerse yourself in the whole ecosystem of it and it brings a lot to the city it's it interacts with
03:39everything and it creates ripple effects for hotels and for restaurants and for um transport for everything
03:46for museums everything engages in it and this gives a city an opportunity to really blossom
03:53and show the world what it is about and mexico is an exciting place to come to it has a very unique
04:00atmosphere it's very different from parallel to this you have people going to qatar and to the
04:05middle east yes but that is a very very different experience going to miami is a very different experience
04:11and that is the beauty of how you can engage with the art market when you go to travel to art first
04:16like this you just mentioned the city and you've been working at the oslo park you're going to have
04:21to mention it for me because the name is really complicated but um when you see a city that can evolve
04:30thanks to something that is going on in the art market i think that it it sort of it develops and
04:37you're saying the ripple effect into the development of the city and the economy but also the restaurants
04:45not only it's not only about money it's also about the emotions of the people around it what that sort of
04:51pushes people through and motivates people to keep going in uncertain times and this is called if i'm not
04:58if i'm correctly the bilbao effect um sort of and i wanted you to go a little deeper into what you've
05:04seen in oslo with the park and how that can be transported into this idea of the bilbao effect
05:11but also it can be a little taste of what is going on this week in mexico city i think what you touch
05:18upon there is what i find the most beautiful aspect of the arts living with art i think enriches everyone
05:26in anyone's life interacting with it either as a collector or someone who goes to museums someone who
05:32does philanthropy i think that it enriches life and and through my career i worked with a lot of
05:37different collectors and i have professionals who've had fantastic or people who've had fantastic
05:43professional careers and they say i don't remember anything of it all i remember is the art the
05:48engagement and how it creates something for more than yourself so also i was involved i've been involved
05:55and still am for 15 years in developing a sculpture park we took one of the largest uh city parks and we
06:02totally revitalized it and we added art and this gives the audience the public the opportunity to
06:09go and see it free of charge any time of the day and it creates a lot of attraction
06:16and it gives an easy access it's not like an auction house where maybe not everyone goes
06:23it's where everyone can go here you can meet anyone from any cultural or societal
06:28part of the hierarchy and and everyone engages so we saw the sculpture park engaged it's become one of
06:34the top five in the world we had no idea when we started but we were very determined in what we were
06:39doing then you have new museums coming and all this creates a different atmosphere and a different
06:44identity in the city and it increases the prices that businesses can charge for their services and it also
06:53creates a lot of cultural tourism and cultural tourism pays more and spends more money than other types of
07:01tourism in terms of value and investment we just mentioned economics and the cultural tourism which is
07:07really interesting but it's also about this investment in the long term how should we think about that
07:14today if you're an art collector i normally say you're a custodian of it it's not yours forever
07:22you're just a custodian of our common cultural heritage art interacts with you here and there but it's
07:30also a carrier of different times different periods different lives lived and reading of societies and
07:38and events that happens in society over time or through history and it's a fantastic element to
07:45use for educational purposes it's it's the most rewarding thing you can have i mean to bring
07:51kids the younger generations to bring them to art fairs to museums to sculpture parks and really tell
07:57them because through the art you can open so many questions and so many dialogues things that are
08:03difficult to talk about can become easier in front of an art piece and i've seen this so many times and
08:09i think that's a real value of it where does mexico city fit into this global ecosystem we've
08:17mentioned during this short chat that we've had london and bilbao and dubai and london and oslo but where
08:27does mexico city fit into this and what are you seeing that that surprises you when you're here
08:32in the art market obviously yeah yeah of course of course um i would say that the beauty of the art
08:39fair is when done well when the whole ecosystem works together the museums and the galleries and the
08:44fairs and and the media and and everyone pulls together it really creates a very unique atmosphere
08:50and and the better prepared the city or the place is the more full the experience is for the visitor you
08:57have such a sensitivity and you have a spirituality and you have you have this deep connection with
09:03nature and with the culture that has existed for thousands of years and last year when i was here
09:08in february i was here with marina abramovic and we talked about this and it just feels i mean just
09:13walking down the street and interacting with people you just feel you just feel an energy which is
09:18completely different from other cities now um you just mentioned media why or how is it important
09:26that media participates in this strengthening of the of the cultural ecosystem in general
09:32i think it helps to create an awareness that art is there for everyone anyone can go and experience
09:39it and have a relationship with it you can be a collector on a very very tiny budget you can be a
09:45collector on a larger budget it's not really about that but you can go and see performances you can see
09:50theaters you can go and listen to talks with artists and and curators for example and media supporting
09:58this is extremely important because you have a platform where you reach a lot of people and you
10:04tell them about it and i think what a millennial what under sarah gorrieves what she's done now with
10:09this magazine which is launching today i think is extraordinary because it gives you an insight a meeting
10:16point with artists that you normally wouldn't be able to see and some of these artists have actually
10:20opened up to let them come in and be photographed in the studio and artists don't necessarily do that
10:25which is the case of marina and i know i'll be speaking with sarah tomorrow for for the audience to
10:30know and so we'll be speaking about this a little bit more so time's running out but i'm looking ahead
10:36because i think it's important not only to get stuck in the uncertainty of today and the art market
10:41but looking ahead what has cultural investment art proven over time and and why does it continue to
10:48matter what do you see going on in the next decade i would just say that my recommendation is get people
10:57involved get people to interact be involved in the arts and for cities to really study and research
11:06all the benefits of what it means and what it brings to your uh local and then regional and national and
11:14how it puts you on an international map it's really a way to communicate and also we have to remember that
11:19art very often um has a role of soft soft diplomacy it's very often uh something that opens a dialogue
11:29between countries like now for example i know that the norwegian's museums are collaborating and talking
11:35about bringing frida kahlo to norway which is a great opportunity for norway to also uh get curious
11:42about other aspects of of um mexico and i've seen this before having curated a show that was given as
11:49a gift during a state visit from norway to hungary it was an interaction and it creates a platform also
11:54for business life so it's extremely important to use it because it is has so such a low um it's so easy to
12:03enter and have a conversation with anyone you don't even know we're going to end with that having
12:08better conversations open up to dialogue because i think that's something that we need to do worldwide
12:13and and as you say we can do it through art or begin the conversation through art at least
12:19ina johansen deeply thank you so much for being here with us today gracias a la audiencia por habernos
12:24acompañado nos vemos la siguiente semana en milenio negocios
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