- 8 months ago
Tonight, we examine U.S. President Donald Trump's speech at the World Economic Forum in Davos with analyst Kamles Kumar from Asia Group Advisors to understand the posturing made by the leader.
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00:00One of the main things that everyone is looking at is, of course, Greenland, where U.S. President Donald Trump repeated his demand for control of the territory, claiming only the United States can secure it.
00:12However, he reassures that he would not use force to claim it.
00:17He also criticizes Denmark, calling it ungrateful for refusing to give up Greenland.
00:21After the war, we gave Greenland back to Denmark.
00:28How stupid were we to do that?
00:31But we did it.
00:33But we gave it back.
00:35But how ungrateful are they now?
00:37But every NATO ally has an obligation to be able to defend their own territory.
00:42And the fact is, no nation or group of nations is in any position to be able to secure Greenland other than the United States.
00:51We're a great power, much greater than people even understand.
00:55I think they found that out two weeks ago in Venezuela.
01:00So with me tonight, we will attempt to peel back the layers of Trump's speeches.
01:06Kamlas Kumar is the Associate Director and Country Lead for Malaysia at the Asia Group of Advisors, a strategic advisory firm specializing in market entry, government affairs and public policy here in this region.
01:19So it's quite a speech if we were to start it off.
01:26But I think I want to start with the first thing.
01:29I'll start with a quote, right?
01:31He said, I want Europe to do good, but I'm afraid it is not heading in the right direction.
01:38You even heard an excerpt from what he said about Europe.
01:41What do you make with all this posturing when it comes to Europe?
01:45Thank you, Hafiz, for inviting me.
01:48So I think one of the things that Trump is saying is that he's posturing that U.S. is just going to be the big brother.
01:54And I think that is what he has done in the past two years.
01:56He has essentially gone around the world, essentially arm-twisting everyone and trying to make people fall in line and essentially seeing the world through his eyes and through his lens and what he calls is diplomacy.
02:09Yeah, I think other than that also, because as we were sitting here listening to what he said, I heard the word Green New Scam, you know, being mentioned.
02:20Another salvo on, you know, climate initiatives and policy.
02:24And other things that he also said was we need to make money from energy and not lose it.
02:29But there are vibes of alternative facts swirling around here.
02:37But he's saying it at, I say, one of the most integral platform when it comes to business leaders, world leaders, policy, you know, people who is involved in policymaking.
02:50What does it signal to this bunch of very, very influential people?
02:56I think one of the things is that when Trump came into power, especially with the second term around, he has not given the normal diplomacy ties a chance.
03:07He has rewrote diplomacy in his own view.
03:11And I think like now appearing in World Economic Forum and Davos and speaking to capital market leaders, CEOs and leaders of the economic world,
03:19he's actually telling them that you should pressure your respective governments, you should pressure your respective policymakers to make policies that are in line with the free market.
03:29And I think Trump, what Trump is saying that this is economies and he's using economy to essentially curtail people and make them fall in line towards US.
03:38Well, the way you're describing, if I were to use a school setting, that sounds like a bully, right, in one way.
03:49But I think this framing of Greenland as, I know he described it during the speech as a big piece of ice, you know, you should give it to us, you know, as in US.
04:02As, how should we understand Trump's framing of Greenland as an imperative for national and world security?
04:09Because he's talking about installing Golden Dome, and you can correct me if I'm wrong, based on what he said.
04:15Is this really rooted in genuine security concerns or is it just symbolic political posturing?
04:24I think it's a little bit of both.
04:26I think there is a genuine rooted in security concerns.
04:29I think one of the things that Trump wants to leave behind as a legacy is the Golden Dome.
04:35And I think that is part of his, essentially, I think what he wants in Greenland is not really the piece of the resistance,
04:42but I think Greenland is the sonar to his essential security.
04:48So if he conquers Greenland, he has a big security point there, and essentially he waits off his enemies.
04:55And I think what he's implying is that there are threats from, like, Russia, China, and essentially he's trying to play the big brother role.
05:02And he's like, hey, you know what?
05:04I'm trying to privatise world peace.
05:06I'm trying to, you know, essentially protect everyone in the world.
05:09So please do fall under my wing and I will provide you guys protection.
05:13So I think what today in his speech, even at the World Economic Forum, was not so much about force.
05:18And I don't think even when he said it, yeah, I'm not going to take Greenland by force.
05:22But essentially he has sternly reminded NATO that I will remember what your actions are after this.
05:29I mean, you brought up NATO, and I know he said it and you said it, not using force.
05:34And force here comes in the form of perhaps missiles or rockets.
05:40But you and I both know that, I mean, that's not the only way.
05:45He's practically, in a way, strong-arming these countries to, hey, you listen to me, otherwise we are going to, you know, 10%, 25% derives.
05:55That's pretty much a kind of force.
06:00What do you think of that?
06:01Well, where Trump sees it, I think Trump sees things very literally.
06:05And I think he sees things in black and white.
06:08And I think what he means by using force is I'm not coming at you with guns and weapons.
06:13Not with an army.
06:13Yeah, not with an army.
06:14But I think what he is actually doing is, you know, conquering people economically.
06:18And I think what he has done around the world successfully, I think, in a year, has gone around saying, hey, I put a tariff on you, I put a tariff on you, I put a tariff on you.
06:27Hey, you give me incentives, you give me this.
06:30Like I think even for Malaysia and for a few other Southeast Asian countries, he has put in a high number of tariffs, even though we don't really have not been under his purview or kind of fallen in his life.
06:40And another thing that should come in mind as we hear his speech is, of course, about NATO's cohesion.
06:52And of course, when we talk about him putting on tariff threats on member nations, there's a risk of fragmenting them, right?
06:59Like, how real is that risk?
07:03And are we, is there a sense of inevitability?
07:06And I know there's some references to Thanos there here.
07:10But is there a sense of inevitability when it comes to, you know, succumbing to what he wants?
07:18Because otherwise, I don't think, I'm sure, I mean, right now, even he, he described US as a great power and everything.
07:25Not many, not many countries have the luxury of standing up to that sort of mind.
07:32And I think one of the things that he has gotten away with it is that essentially, I think he has forced people into thinking that US is a power to be reckoned with.
07:41And I, and he has pitted them against, especially in Asia, right, he has pitted them against US or China.
07:49You pick.
07:49Who are you, who you want to lie in bed with?
07:51Who are you, do you want to do business with?
07:53Who do you want to work together with?
07:56So essentially, he has pointed a gun and said, pick.
07:59And I think even in NATO, eventually there will be a point among the member countries where they will start fragmentizing and they will start picking alliances.
08:08And I think he has done that.
08:10And essentially with Trump in power, his foreign diplomacy policies are very radical, very right wing and very forceful.
08:19So it's yet to be seen how America handles him post-Trump era.
08:24But for now, I think America is on a wall, but on foreign diplomacy.
08:28And does this whole Greenland episode signal a broader turn where people are moving away or other countries are moving away from multilateralism and towards a more loose transactional or, you know, more block, you know, like ASEAN, you know, ASEAN Plus.
08:49Is that what we're leading towards with this sort of world situation that we are facing right now?
08:56I think one of the things that when Trump came into power and I think when Trump proposed these tariffs and it kind of shed light into how fragile these alliances were or how realistic and how actually the actual work.
09:14And I think the biggest clear cut reason I think we've seen for this few months was ASEAN.
09:19When ASEAN came together, they had an economic prowess.
09:22They all meted together.
09:23But eventually they ended up going their 10 separate ways and they made their own individual deals with the U.S. instead of collectively doing as a block.
09:32And I think this is also will be the same case with NATO.
09:36And I think in this way, yes, answering your question, it has become very transactional.
09:41The economy is the one that pushes policies, is the one that pushes waves, and especially now.
09:50Yeah, Mark Carney has alluded to the rupture in the world order.
09:55So, I know it's an unfair question to ask you because I'm sure none of us have the answers.
10:02I'm sure even the UN, but how do you envision a, what kind of world order are we looking at 2026 onwards?
10:13Because I think, I don't know if this word is even legit, Trumpism has created, has opened a new level of thinking on foreign policy or foreign diplomacy
10:25that is quite unprecedented in every country around the world.
10:29So, what does a workable model look like, in your opinion?
10:35I think we cannot look at it in isolation.
10:38I think especially when technology improves and especially now you can work anywhere around the world,
10:43you can trade from anywhere around the world, and especially when globalism comes into light.
10:48I think there needs to be new lines that are drawn around alliances and around order.
10:55And even to have any sort of economic cohesion.
11:00And I think like what Trump has shown, I think there is people that are willing enough to cut their own ties
11:08and essentially make deals, essentially to have their own backyard surviving,
11:13instead of thinking about the bigger picture or even the region as a whole, right?
11:17If, and I think that has actually happened and countries, leaders are selfish.
11:26That's one way to put it.
11:28I think another thing, I think Trump, and this was not just from his speech, but also from an earlier report
11:37where he said that he doubts Europe would pull back investment commitments even if he acts on Greenland.
11:44Does this emblematic of a situation where Europe lacks meaningful leverage?
11:53Or is Washington or Trump underestimating Europe's power or influence as a bloc?
12:02I think there's a little bit of both.
12:03I guess over the years, I mean, you have seen that the EU parliament and the EU has kind of lost a little bit of bite
12:11and a little bit of grip overall.
12:13And I think now, especially Trump forcing them, and he is, like what you earlier mentioned,
12:19he's playing the big bully, right?
12:21He's essentially bullying Europe into cozying up with him, essentially getting into his way
12:27and getting things his way.
12:29And it shows how fragile it is because if Europe doesn't have a strong backing
12:34and if they don't take a strong stance, he will get his way.
12:37And there will be concessions actually made in this little ambit that he's playing.
12:43So, I'm sure, I think the speech was about an hour long and it goes everywhere.
12:49And when I say everywhere, it means everywhere.
12:51It went all the way back to the history and even now, and he keeps making.
12:56What other things that you find interesting or surprise you?
13:01Of course, it's unfair to us, any analyst about, to be surprised because I think every time he takes on to the stage,
13:09there's something unexpected that he announced.
13:12But what else do you find intriguing or interesting from the speech?
13:17I think one of the reasons, right, how it was hyped up before this was that he would go
13:21and the speech that he would make in Davos would be a make or break for Greenland, right?
13:25And I think what caught everyone by surprise was how not hard his stance was.
13:32And when he was like...
13:33It's pretty much more of the same.
13:34Yes.
13:35And I was like, it was very surprising when he was supposed to attack.
13:39And I think one of the things that I think, it was a bit of a carrot and stick game, right?
13:44Because he was like, on one hand, he was praising Europe,
13:47but on the other hand, he was kind of taking Denmark to task
13:50and saying that Denmark was ungrateful and all that.
13:52So it was a little bit of, what is he trying to do?
13:56And I think what he wants, I think, in a way, Trump realises that in this stage,
14:00he's open to negotiations.
14:01And I think that is the key.
14:03And even when you have seen the tariff talks and all,
14:06he has never shut anyone's door.
14:08He's open to negotiations.
14:09He will negotiate and he will get the best deals.
14:12And I think that's what he is here for.
14:14I think he can even negotiate from a 1% tariff.
14:17Yes.
14:18To that point, right?
14:19So another thing that has also grabbed headlines in Davos,
14:24and of course, you can see from the reports that he has scheduled many meetings.
14:30In fact, during the address, he also said he's scheduled to meet President Zelenskyy of Ukraine
14:35and so President Putin of Russia to discuss about the Ukraine war.
14:40Another thing, of course, is the Board of Peace.
14:42Well, invitations are going everywhere around the world.
14:47We've heard about the mechanics of the board.
14:52What do you think will happen this week?
14:54Will we finalise the members?
14:58Where is Trump going with this Board of Peace?
15:02Because you use, interestingly, the word privatising world peace.
15:08Sometimes truth is indeed stranger than fiction.
15:11So what do you make of this?
15:13So I think one of the things that he's trying to do, and it's clear, right,
15:17he has gone around and think, especially in his second term,
15:21is that he wanted to be a leader known for bringing world peace.
15:26Evident from his messages with the Norwegian Prime.
15:31Like how he listed down, even though whether it's true or not,
15:34he listed down several countries where he has helped brokered world peace and achieve.
15:38And I think what he's trying to do with this peace accord is essentially
15:41he's trying to form like a justice league of countries and say that,
15:46hey, you know what, let us all sit on this table
15:48and now we will decide where we can extend our favours to
15:52and where we can help protect the situation
15:57and essentially make better the situation around the world.
16:00So, and all this depends on whether you follow my lead
16:05and I am the one that will dictate this little table or this little council.
16:10But there is a price of admission, you know, there's a price tag there.
16:14And I know, I'm sure, UN Secretary General Antonio Guterres looking at this
16:21and I don't know, whatever, right?
16:24But how will these mechanics work in the current system?
16:30Because we have the UN, we have the Security Council.
16:33Is he replacing it?
16:35Is he making it redundant?
16:39What is it?
16:39I don't think he even has an idea on how it works, right?
16:41This is as much as, this is classic Trump.
16:45Wherever he just talks first and then acts later.
16:48He doesn't have the details.
16:50He will ask you to figure out the details then.
16:52But he'll make all these sweeping statements.
16:53He'll make all these gung-ho lines.
16:56And he'll say, and essentially this is what, right?
16:58He wants the headlines.
16:59He wants that million-dollar mugshot of all this country standing with him
17:03and taking a picture and then he putting thumbs up.
17:06And essentially this is one of his biggest applications
17:08to become a Nobel Peace Prize winner, which essentially is what...
17:13So for 2026.
17:15What can we expect?
17:18Because he's heading for midterms also by the end of the year.
17:24I think if we were to look back on 2025,
17:28no one could have expected it.
17:31Even though we all know going into 2025,
17:34we're facing DJT as in his second term.
17:39What can we expect?
17:41And how will countries operate in this new era
17:45or rather the second year of the Trump's second term?
17:50I think one of the things that he's going to do this year
17:53is to ramp up his efforts.
17:56Essentially, he wants to recreate US as an economy powerhouse,
18:01clearly with the speech just now, right?
18:04And I think he's going to go on this world tour
18:08to get people to fall in line, to get countries,
18:12and essentially he's taking people to task like Switzerland,
18:15who has had deficits.
18:16And I think there will be more countries
18:18that he'll train his eyes on,
18:20and I think there will be essentially a shoring up.
18:22And before his midterm elections,
18:26I think he's going to go on a nationwide tour
18:28and say that this is essentially a report cut
18:30of what he has achieved in this past year, right?
18:33And even today, he was so proud of the fact
18:36that this is one year on on his inauguration,
18:38and he has done so much, and he has reduced so much,
18:41and he has been throwing numbers.
18:42And I think people need to fact-check his numbers
18:46because one of the things, even, I'm not calling out a number,
18:49but one of the things that he pointed out
18:51which was actually reninously wrong
18:53was that China doesn't have wind farms.
18:56And China has a lot of wind farms,
18:58and China is one of the biggest wind farms.
19:01And I think that was false,
19:03and I think those are the kind of things.
19:04And that was a fact reported by Forbes,
19:06if I'm not mistaken.
19:08Yeah, and that puts a lot of pressure on everyone
19:11to actually listen and fact-check
19:13and separating truth from fiction.
19:17Moving on from his speech in Davos,
19:20and I'm sure we'll have a very interesting rest of the week,
19:23the future of the region, the future of Malaysia,
19:25and what do you see for Malaysia and ASEAN
19:29as we go into, because it's far more fragmented these days,
19:35we need to diversify in terms of trade,
19:39in terms of over-reliance on certain countries,
19:42or big powers for that matter.
19:44What do you see for us in this year?
19:47I think one of the most growing regions around,
19:52especially in the past 5 to 10 years,
19:54has been Asia.
19:55And I think one of the things that ASEAN
19:57is very lucky enough that we have markets that are growing,
20:00and I think essentially we need to focus inwards
20:02and essentially doing trade among the regions
20:05and among ourselves.
20:07But that is a very far fact from reality,
20:11and most of the Asian countries also co-dependent
20:16on large superpowers and also market deals
20:18with large superpowers.
20:19So essentially there needs to be a weaning of that,
20:22there needs to be a more centralised ASEAN.
20:24And I think what Anwar Ibrahim, our Prime Minister,
20:26did in 2025 was actually a very good stance
20:29with the economic integration with ASEAN,
20:32which is suggested.
20:33And I think with Philippines now having the helm
20:35of the ASEAN chairmanship,
20:37I think if they actually embark on this
20:39and if there is sustained conversations
20:42and sustained for the past few years,
20:45I think this will become a reality.
20:47That's good.
20:48And you brought up China as well.
20:50And I think President Xi will,
20:55how will he look at this?
20:57And I'm not asking you to postulate foreign policy,
21:01but it does open up spaces for cooperation.
21:05And you can see the kind of tone that President Xi takes
21:09when dealing with countries,
21:11whether he visits in Africa or Latin America
21:14or anywhere across the world.
21:17How will China look at what Donald Trump is doing right now
21:23and how will they cooperate with the rest of the world?
21:26I think Donald Trump's way of diplomacy
21:30either annoys people to a certain extent
21:34or rubs people off the really wrong way.
21:38And I think those who are really rubbed off
21:40to a really wrong way
21:41will actually eventually re-look at their stance
21:43and essentially if China is being cooperative
21:46and if China wants to do business,
21:47I think they would either look at the China corporation
21:50or do business.
21:51And I think there is a way.
21:52And even in this past five to ten years,
21:55I think China has established itself
21:57as a major superpower in the world.
21:58And essentially when it comes to technology,
22:01I mean, you can see the effects around the world,
22:04especially even when it comes to EV
22:06and all these industries where China is a leader.
22:09And I think those things cannot be taken too lightly for.
22:13And I think that those are the kind of avenues
22:15that China will provide.
22:16And I think there will be a choice
22:18that countries or economies need to make.
22:20Or even like, even in Malaysia
22:22where we work to a certain extent
22:25well with both China and US.
22:28Lastly, before we wrap this up,
22:31if, you know, for any of the Malaysian policymakers
22:34listening to this conversation,
22:35what would be like the main thing
22:38that we need to get right this year, right?
22:41We can't afford to do anything wrong.
22:44What would be the thing
22:45that we need to definitely do right this year
22:48if we were to navigate this very treacherous power play
22:53that's happening across the world?
22:55One of the things that I think Malaysia needs to do
22:57is the diversification of our markets.
23:00And I think we need to diversify
23:02and we need to put our eggs in multiple baskets
23:05so that we don't get crushed by either two superpowers.
23:09Because technically, we are a very small nation
23:11and we are a trading nation.
23:13So essentially, we need to hedge our bets,
23:16we need to place our eggs in various baskets
23:18and essentially hope for the best.
23:20Thank you very much.
23:21That was Asia Group Advisors,
23:25Kamles Kumar,
23:27wrapping things up for the special edition
23:30of Awani International tonight
23:32on the post-Trump speech at Davos.
23:36That's all from me.
23:37I'm Hafiz Mazuki.
23:37Thanks for watching and good night.
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