Crown Court - A Public Mischief (1973) - video Dailymotion

Jezza

Crown Court: the gripping courtroom drama from the 1970s and 1980s.  Town Hall corruption is exposed in this case, as two employees of Fulchester Borough Council are charged with fraudulently purchasing land which was at the centre of a planning permission wrangle.  Reginald Marsh (Coronation Street, Terry & June) and Beth Harris (Within These Walls) appear as the defendants.

Transcript

00:00:00Carwood High Street is a notorious bottleneck for traffic entering Fulchester.

00:00:16For some time, the Council have been considering possible routes for a motorway to bypass it.

00:00:21Compulsory purchase orders were made some time ago,

00:00:24acquiring for the Council land that lay along the proposed motorway route,

00:00:28including the major part of a nursery and market garden, owned by Mr James Dobson.

00:00:34A Council survey later revealed, however, that old mine workings beneath the area

00:00:39presented a danger of subsidence, and consequently the Council reversed its earlier decision

00:00:44and decided on an alternative route for the motorway.

00:00:47The Council voted to sell back to the former owners all the property compulsorily purchased

00:00:52in the now abandoned area.

00:00:54It was then discovered that the remaining portion of the nursery

00:00:58was no longer owned by Mr Dobson, but by a Miss Margaret Crawley.

00:01:03It has since transpired that there has been a second change of ownership

00:01:06and that nearly all of the property is now owned by Charles Baker,

00:01:10a well-known local builder and a member of the City Council,

00:01:13for whom Miss Crawley once worked.

00:01:15This land, bought cheaply when the motorway plans were in progress,

00:01:20is now obviously worth many times that price since the plans were changed.

00:01:25The inference is town hall corruption,

00:01:27and Baker and Crawley stand in court today,

00:01:29charged with forming a conspiracy to commit a public mischief.

00:01:34Both have pleaded not guilty.

00:01:35Mr Jonathan Fryk, you see, is presenting the case for the Crown.

00:01:39And until that date, Mr Dobson, you were a market gardener?

00:02:03No, I was just a nurseryman then.

00:02:05There's some difference?

00:02:07Aye, I was growing bedding plants and so on to sell direct.

00:02:12A market gardener would be selling food, lettuce and toms and such.

00:02:16But that was not your profession.

00:02:18Well, not then.

00:02:19I used to do both, but I didn't have enough land left, you see,

00:02:22not after Council forced me to sell.

00:02:24Is that why you ceased the market gardening side of your activities?

00:02:27Well, like I said, you need a lot more land to grow food on

00:02:30than you do ornamentals, bedding plants and such like.

00:02:33And if you want early crops to beat the market,

00:02:36you need a lot of glass, too.

00:02:38Now, when the Council...

00:02:39When the Council purchased some of your land...

00:02:41Aye, well, then there weren't enough room,

00:02:44so I gave up the market garden side

00:02:46and concentrated on the nursery end of it.

00:02:48So now you're retired, is that right?

00:02:50I wouldn't say that.

00:02:51I mean, I'm still considering looking round like it.

00:02:53No, I wouldn't say I was retired.

00:02:55I see.

00:02:56Now, if the Council had not placed a compulsory purchase order

00:02:58on the major part of your land,

00:03:00would you still be a nurseryman and a market gardener?

00:03:02I don't see why I should have stopped.

00:03:04Well, let's move on a little, shall we?

00:03:05Would you tell the jury, in your own words,

00:03:07how the compulsory purchase order came about?

00:03:10They had plans to build a motorway.

00:03:12They?

00:03:13The Council.

00:03:15Well, there were these two plans, you see,

00:03:16and one of them went slacked through my land.

00:03:19And I'd like to take it one step at a time.

00:03:20You say that there were two plans.

00:03:22Aye.

00:03:23The one was up round beyond Carwood.

00:03:26That would be the farthest side from you.

00:03:27Aye, that's right.

00:03:28The northern side.

00:03:29Yeah.

00:03:29And the other?

00:03:30Well, it went slacked through my big field.

00:03:33And the Council couldn't make up their mind.

00:03:35For a while, then they plumped for this one.

00:03:37There were a lot of boutique papers.

00:03:39You were directly affected by this?

00:03:40Ah, say I was.

00:03:41They put a compulsory purchase order on me.

00:03:44The Council?

00:03:44Aye.

00:03:45On what?

00:03:45On my land.

00:03:46On the whole of your land?

00:03:48Well, the bit they wanted for the motorway,

00:03:50the seven acre and a bit more.

00:03:51Seven acres and a bit more.

00:03:53I wonder if at this point we could look at the map.

00:03:56Exhibit 1, Lord, an agreed document.

00:03:58Now, Mr Dobson, I wonder if you would explain to the jury,

00:04:00so that they can follow it on their copies,

00:04:02the exact part of your land which was compulsorily purchased by the Council.

00:04:06The seven acres and a bit more.

00:04:08Is that the area ringed in red?

00:04:10Aye, that's right.

00:04:11Yes.

00:04:12And how much did that leave you?

00:04:13Well, just the small field.

00:04:15Anything else?

00:04:16The cottage and the greenhouses.

00:04:18The area marked in blue on the map, in fact.

00:04:20That's right.

00:04:21And what acreage would that be?

00:04:22About an acre and a half.

00:04:23Which, as you've already explained,

00:04:25was not sufficient for you to continue

00:04:27with what until then had been a very successful nursery business.

00:04:31Did you get a good price for the seven acres and a bit more?

00:04:33I wouldn't say it was a good price.

00:04:35Well, what sort of price would you say it was?

00:04:37Well, it was just the price of the land, if you see what I mean.

00:04:40Well, I think I see what you mean, Mr Dobson.

00:04:42But I'm afraid we've got to make it quite clear to the jury what you mean.

00:04:45Are you saying that the Council paid you for your land

00:04:47at the price for agricultural land?

00:04:50Oh, that's right.

00:04:51As opposed to what?

00:04:53Housing land.

00:04:54Which would be at a premium in that part of the town.

00:04:55I'd say it would.

00:04:56It's something terrible.

00:04:57So the Council placed a compulsory purchase order

00:04:59on the major part of your land

00:05:01and paid you for it at the going rate for agricultural land.

00:05:05Is that right?

00:05:06And what rate would that be?

00:05:07£200 an acre.

00:05:09So that you received from the Council £1,400?

00:05:13£1,500.

00:05:14They were that bit of the other field as well.

00:05:15And what do you think it might have got as housing land?

00:05:17With respect, my lord, I cannot say that the witness has the knowledge

00:05:20or the competence to answer such a question.

00:05:22Right so, Mr Dealey.

00:05:23Mr Dobson is not an estate agent or a valuer of any sort.

00:05:27I'll put it another way, my lord.

00:05:29Do you know of any other land in that area

00:05:31that's been sold for housing purposes?

00:05:33Well, there isn't that much land left now.

00:05:34I mean, it's getting that built up.

00:05:36So that land such as yours would be very much in demand?

00:05:38I'll say.

00:05:39Well, can you think of any that's been sold recently?

00:05:41Well, there was that derelict bit,

00:05:44about half an acre or so up against the garage.

00:05:47Yes.

00:05:47That fetched a lot of money.

00:05:48And how much did it fetch?

00:05:49Well, I don't rightly know, but about £10,000, I think.

00:05:53So that if that is the proper market figure for your land as housing land,

00:05:57the part sold under compulsory purchase order to the Council for £1,500

00:06:00would now be worth £140,000.

00:06:05Aye.

00:06:07And you were left with one and a half acres?

00:06:09I was.

00:06:10Which was not enough to carry on your business?

00:06:12Well, I thought it might be if I concentrated just on the nursery side,

00:06:15but it didn't work out,

00:06:17so I thought I may as well off for sale like the rest.

00:06:20As a going concern?

00:06:22No, no, I couldn't do that.

00:06:23I mean, it wasn't doing well enough.

00:06:24So I applied for permission to put some houses on it,

00:06:27and I was going to sell it as building land.

00:06:28Well, let me see if I understand you.

00:06:29You found that after the Council had placed a compulsory purchase order

00:06:33on the major part of your land,

00:06:34the remaining one and a half acres was not sufficient

00:06:36to pursue your business as a nurseryman,

00:06:38so you applied for, and were granted,

00:06:40permission to develop the housing, the land for housing.

00:06:42Is that right?

00:06:43Well, I had to.

00:06:43I mean, nobody was interested in it for agricultural land.

00:06:46There weren't enough of it, were there?

00:06:47Uh-huh.

00:06:47And what was your next step?

00:06:49I tried to sell it.

00:06:51To Miss Crawley?

00:06:52No, no, no.

00:06:53That was much later on.

00:06:55Well, let me make this quite clear.

00:06:57You tried for some land, for some time,

00:06:59to sell your land with the planning permission on it,

00:07:01which was an advantage, but you were not successful.

00:07:03Now, that seems very odd.

00:07:04Can you think of any reason why?

00:07:06Well, it's obvious, isn't it?

00:07:07It was because of the motorway.

00:07:08What about the motorway?

00:07:09Well, nobody was going to put houses on land

00:07:12with a main road going right past their front doors,

00:07:15all their stink and fumes day and night.

00:07:17So the planning permission didn't, in fact,

00:07:18turn out to be a very great advantage, did you?

00:07:20You can say that.

00:07:21And how long did the land remain on the market?

00:07:23Until she came along.

00:07:24Until who came along?

00:07:25Oh, Miss Crawley.

00:07:27The lady you see in the dock.

00:07:28Oh, that's right.

00:07:29And how long was that?

00:07:30Oh, near enough eight months, it'd be.

00:07:32So after all that time,

00:07:34when the land had been publicly advertised for sale,

00:07:36Miss Crawley suddenly came along

00:07:38and made some sort of offer for the land.

00:07:40My lord.

00:07:40Well, what's your point, Mr. Sissons?

00:07:43The word suddenly, my lord.

00:07:46I see the objection to the word suddenly.

00:07:48Do let's get on, as your lordship wishes.

00:07:51Can you tell the jury in your own words

00:07:52how Miss Crawley came to acquire the property?

00:07:55She came along in August,

00:07:56pretending she were looking for a place to put her horses.

00:08:00Last August?

00:08:01No, August 1971.

00:08:02And was she asking to buy the land or simply to rent it?

00:08:04She wanted to rent it.

00:08:06And what was your reply?

00:08:07I wasn't interested.

00:08:08I mean, I'm always getting people making inquiries

00:08:11of Monday, somewhere to put their kids' ponies.

00:08:14But she went on and on about it.

00:08:15And, well, I wasn't using the land,

00:08:17so I thought I might as well rent it to her.

00:08:19But I told her that the minute I sold it,

00:08:21she'd have to get her horses off and no trouble.

00:08:23And what was her reaction to that?

00:08:25Oh, she said,

00:08:26Oh, it's for sale, is it?

00:08:28All innocent line.

00:08:30The next thing,

00:08:30I'll get a letter from her solicitors making an offer.

00:08:34She said it was just ideal for her.

00:08:36If you were living in digs any road

00:08:38and looking for someone,

00:08:39the cottage would be just right.

00:08:41And maybe she could start a little riding school

00:08:43like she'd always wanted to.

00:08:44Oh, you'd have thought butter wouldn't have melted in her mouth.

00:08:47Mr. Dobson, I want you to be very clear

00:08:48in your answer to my next question.

00:08:50Did Miss Crawley on that afternoon

00:08:52or at any other time

00:08:53say what her job was

00:08:55or the name of her employer?

00:08:57No, no, she didn't.

00:08:58So she came along to you ostensibly

00:09:00to rent a small piece of land for her horse

00:09:02and then bought the whole lot.

00:09:04Didn't that seem very odd to you?

00:09:06Very odd indeed.

00:09:07And how long did this take to go through?

00:09:09Well, she seemed in a bit of an orry light,

00:09:11saying that her holiday was due

00:09:13and she liked to get it settled before she went away.

00:09:15I don't remember exactly how long.

00:09:17Well, was it a month, two months, more?

00:09:18Oh, much less than that.

00:09:20A couple of weeks, I'd say.

00:09:21Two weeks?

00:09:23She comes to you to rent a field,

00:09:25decides to buy

00:09:25and then the whole thing is settled

00:09:27in a matter of two weeks?

00:09:29And at what price, may I ask?

00:09:31£12,000.

00:09:33Did you tell her about the planning permission?

00:09:34I did.

00:09:35She said that didn't matter to her.

00:09:37She wanted the cottage for herself,

00:09:39the fill for her horses and that were that.

00:09:41Thank you, Mr. Dobson.

00:09:43That will be all.

00:09:45Mr. Dobson, I appear for Miss Crawley.

00:09:47There is just one matter I should like you to make clear,

00:09:49a matter which will be referred to later in the case.

00:09:52You ran your business as a limited company, I believe.

00:09:56Yes, but the solicitor said...

00:09:57A company which was still in existence

00:09:59after the compulsory purchase order

00:10:00took away seven acres of your land.

00:10:02Well, I never got around to winding the whole thing up, you see.

00:10:04I am merely concerned with making it clear to the court

00:10:07that Miss Crawley bought your company from me

00:10:08when she bought your land.

00:10:10Is that not correct, Mr. Dobson?

00:10:11This is all legal talk.

00:10:12I mean, I never understood half of what was going on.

00:10:15Miss Crawley bought the shares in your company

00:10:17along with the sale of the one and a half acres.

00:10:19Is that not so, Mr. Dobson?

00:10:20I suppose so.

00:10:22Members of the jury, this matter is important,

00:10:24as you will hear later in the case.

00:10:26Now, Mr. Dobson, you have told us

00:10:27that your land and cottage were on the market

00:10:28for some eight months before Miss Crawley came along.

00:10:31Why had you not been able to sell?

00:10:33Well, it was obvious it was because of the motorway.

00:10:36Yes, but surely you received some offers.

00:10:38Yes, but...

00:10:39But they weren't enough.

00:10:41Perhaps you would tell the court

00:10:42what was the highest offer you received

00:10:44before Miss Crawley?

00:10:47I don't remember.

00:10:49Oh, come now, Mr. Dobson.

00:10:51Was it perhaps, um, ten thousand pounds?

00:10:55Well, it might have been, but I don't remember.

00:10:58Was it ten thousand pounds or was it not?

00:11:02Yes, it was ten thousand pounds.

00:11:04But you didn't sell because you wanted more.

00:11:06Now, what price did you want for the land and cottage?

00:11:09Twelve thousand pounds?

00:11:10Was that the asking price?

00:11:13Or did you perhaps want even more than that?

00:11:15You must answer the question, Mr. Dobson.

00:11:19I was asking fifteen thousand pounds.

00:11:22Fifteen thousand?

00:11:23I see.

00:11:24And Miss Crawley only paid you twelve thousand pounds,

00:11:26rather less than the price you wanted.

00:11:29Well, that's what she offered,

00:11:30and I thought about it

00:11:31and decided I might as well take it.

00:11:33And isn't it the truth that it was you yourself

00:11:35who were in a hurry and not Miss Crawley,

00:11:36because you feared she might change her mind

00:11:38because of the motorway plans?

00:11:40She must have known about those.

00:11:41I mean, it was in all the papers all the time.

00:11:43Yes, I dare say it was,

00:11:44but you never mentioned it to her yourself, did you?

00:11:46Why should I?

00:11:47She had her own solicitor.

00:11:48And it was you that wanted the sale completed

00:11:50within two weeks?

00:11:52No, it was her.

00:11:53Do you know where Miss Crawley is living now?

00:11:57Of course I do, in the cottage.

00:11:59Have you seen it lately?

00:12:01I passed by.

00:12:02Much improved, isn't it?

00:12:04You'd hardly recognise it as the broken-down place you sold her.

00:12:07It suited me.

00:12:09And it's only because she got all that money

00:12:11that they should have come to me, by rights.

00:12:13And her horses, are they there in the field?

00:12:17Aye, they are.

00:12:18So, in fact, Miss Crawley has done exactly

00:12:20what she said she would do.

00:12:21Live in the cottage and keep her horses in the field.

00:12:24And it was you, in your haste,

00:12:25hurried the sale through,

00:12:27lest she change her mind.

00:12:28Is that not so?

00:12:29No.

00:12:32Thank you, Mr. Dolson.

00:12:33Mr. Dobson, you've been very patient

00:12:58and I hope I won't have to keep you much longer.

00:13:00But I should like to ask you one or two questions

00:13:02on behalf of my client, Councillor Baker.

00:13:04Now, do you see Councillor Baker in court?

00:13:07Aye, that's him up there, next to her.

00:13:09So you've met him before, then?

00:13:11In the newspapers, always getting his picture in.

00:13:14Doesn't answer my question, Mr. Dobson.

00:13:16Aye, but it was a long time ago.

00:13:18I see.

00:13:20Now, I think you said that you gave up your business

00:13:21because you no longer had enough land to make it viable.

00:13:25That is to say,

00:13:26you could no longer make a proper living from it.

00:13:28Could you explain why, then?

00:13:30For a considerable length of time

00:13:31before the Council placed a compulsory purchase order

00:13:33on a part of your land

00:13:35and long before even the motorway was considered,

00:13:38your business was neglected

00:13:39and the land not used in any way.

00:13:42That's not true.

00:13:43Well, let's go into that a little, shall we, Mr. Dobson?

00:13:46Do you remember that in May 1969

00:13:48there were some complaints

00:13:50about the state of your property?

00:13:52There weren't complaints to me,

00:13:53there were complaints to Fullchester News.

00:13:56Yes, the Carwood Residents Association

00:13:58complained about the state of your property.

00:13:59Overgrown, fences in a state of collapse,

00:14:02greenhouses falling down, etc.

00:14:04Now, is that right?

00:14:05And the Residents Association

00:14:07wanted to have you clear up the property

00:14:09or alternatively to have the Council

00:14:11purchase it outright

00:14:12and make it into some sort of public space.

00:14:15But nothing to do with them.

00:14:17Nevertheless, the business,

00:14:19that is the land,

00:14:19had been neglected, had it not.

00:14:22Now, why was this?

00:14:24Was it because you had already decided in 1969

00:14:26to try and build on that land?

00:14:29No, things were a bit difficult.

00:14:32My chief hand had been off-heeled for a long while.

00:14:35But not so difficult

00:14:36that you could have made some attempt

00:14:37to run your business correctly.

00:14:39Now, when did you first apply

00:14:41for planning permission

00:14:42to develop the whole of your land

00:14:44for housing, Mr. Dobson?

00:14:45I said already after the Council

00:14:47had taken most of it away

00:14:48and made the rest useless.

00:14:49Not before.

00:14:50Are you sure?

00:14:52I don't remember exactly when.

00:14:54Well, shall I refresh your memory?

00:14:56I have here your application

00:14:57for planning permission

00:14:58to develop the whole of your land

00:14:59as housing, Mr. Dobson,

00:15:01and it is dated June 1969.

00:15:04That is to say,

00:15:05long before any motorway plans

00:15:07were put forward

00:15:08and certainly long before

00:15:09any compulsory purchase order

00:15:10was placed on it.

00:15:11Now, is that true?

00:15:12You must let Mr. Dobson

00:15:14see that copy, Mr. Dealey.

00:15:15Lord.

00:15:21Now, Mr. Dobson,

00:15:22is that a copy of your application?

00:15:25Yes, it is, Lord.

00:15:26Well, it's dated June 69.

00:15:29And far from having difficulty

00:15:31in running your business,

00:15:32I suggest that you deliberately

00:15:33allowed it to go to pieces

00:15:34because you believed

00:15:36that if you could prove

00:15:37it was not viable,

00:15:38then it would bolster your case

00:15:39for having the whole of it

00:15:40re-designated as housing land.

00:15:42I couldn't get anybody

00:15:44as good as old Harry

00:15:44to help me.

00:15:46Not that cheeky bits of lads

00:15:47that didn't last

00:15:47ten minutes or more.

00:15:49Now, I don't seem to have

00:15:49made a note of this,

00:15:50but when did you first

00:15:52meet my client,

00:15:53Councillor Baker?

00:15:54Could that also have been

00:15:55in 1969,

00:15:56in August of that year?

00:15:58It could have been.

00:15:59Round about the same time

00:16:00that you were applying

00:16:01for planning permission.

00:16:03Now, what was the nature

00:16:04of your meeting

00:16:05with Councillor Baker?

00:16:06I was doing some work

00:16:07for his firm,

00:16:09providing some topsoil

00:16:10for some houses

00:16:11he were building.

00:16:11And can you remember

00:16:12any conversation

00:16:13that took place

00:16:13at that time?

00:16:15No.

00:16:16Well, you must have had one

00:16:18about how much soil,

00:16:19how much it was going

00:16:20to cost, etc.?

00:16:21Oh, aye.

00:16:22Well, you will discuss

00:16:23the price, all right.

00:16:25And did you not also put

00:16:26to Councillor Baker

00:16:26the suggestion

00:16:27that if he could see

00:16:28your application

00:16:29through the planning committee,

00:16:31there would, amongst other things,

00:16:32be no charge

00:16:33for that topsoil?

00:16:34No, I didn't.

00:16:35I suggest that you did,

00:16:37Mr. Dobson.

00:16:38And that Councillor Baker

00:16:38had nothing to do

00:16:39with your suggestion.

00:16:40Now, you were paid

00:16:40for that topsoil,

00:16:41were you not?

00:16:42Well, of course I were paid.

00:16:43And planning permission

00:16:44was turned down

00:16:44pending the overall consideration

00:16:47of the development.

00:16:49That's what they said.

00:16:51So your petty little scheme

00:16:52to corrupt a leading figure

00:16:54fell down, didn't it,

00:16:55when Councillor Baker

00:16:56refused to cooperate?

00:16:57It never happened!

00:16:58The jury can make their minds

00:17:00up about that, Mr. Dobson.

00:17:03You've never seen

00:17:04Councillor Baker since?

00:17:06I've said that

00:17:06in the newspapers,

00:17:07all of us getting

00:17:08his picture in.

00:17:09Naturally.

00:17:10In view of his service

00:17:11to the community.

00:17:14Now, you allege

00:17:15that Miss Crawley

00:17:15did not mention

00:17:16who her employer was.

00:17:18No.

00:17:19Did you ask her

00:17:20who her employer was

00:17:20or what her job was?

00:17:21She'd have kept that

00:17:22to herself, wouldn't she?

00:17:24Let me put this question

00:17:25another way.

00:17:26I am concerned

00:17:27with the suggestion

00:17:28that Miss Crawley

00:17:29was deliberately trying

00:17:30to conceal the name

00:17:31of her employer

00:17:31from you.

00:17:33Now, did you

00:17:33or did you not

00:17:34ask her

00:17:35who her employer was?

00:17:37Well, no.

00:17:38I think we can do

00:17:39a little better than that,

00:17:40Mr. Dobson,

00:17:40because far from concealing

00:17:41the name of her employer

00:17:42from you,

00:17:43Miss Crawley told you

00:17:44quite openly

00:17:45that she would be able

00:17:46to get hold

00:17:46of a mortgage

00:17:47through the good offices

00:17:48of her former employer,

00:17:49Councillor Baker.

00:17:50Now, isn't that the truth

00:17:50of the situation?

00:17:51No, sir.

00:17:53Thank you, Mr. Dobson.

00:17:54I have no further questions.

00:17:56Mr. Fry.

00:17:57No more questions, my lord?

00:17:59Will you may stand down,

00:18:01Mr. Dobson?

00:18:02I call Alan Fairley.

00:18:04Mr. Alan Fairley.

00:18:06Yes, Fairley.

00:18:07What is your religion?

00:18:19Church of England.

00:18:20Take the testament

00:18:21in your right hand

00:18:22and read aloud

00:18:23the words on this card.

00:18:26I swear by almighty God

00:18:27that the evidence

00:18:28I shall give

00:18:28shall be the truth,

00:18:29the whole truth

00:18:30and nothing but the truth.

00:18:33You are Councillor

00:18:34Alan Fairley?

00:18:35Yes.

00:18:36Where do you live,

00:18:37Councillor Fairley?

00:18:3842 Holcroft Gardens,

00:18:39Carwood, Fullchester.

00:18:41Will you tell the court

00:18:41in your own words

00:18:42how you became aware

00:18:43that the nursery property

00:18:44originally sold by Mr. Dobson

00:18:45to Miss Crawley

00:18:46had again changed hands

00:18:47and been sold by her

00:18:48to her former employer,

00:18:50Councillor Baker?

00:18:51I received a complaint

00:18:52from some of my constituents

00:18:53who are members

00:18:54of the Carwood Residents Association

00:18:56of which I am the chairman

00:18:58that the nursery site,

00:19:01some trees were being felled

00:19:03on the nursery site,

00:19:04contrary to a tree preservation order

00:19:07that I'd been responsible

00:19:08for seeing through the council.

00:19:09And what did you do

00:19:10in response to this complaint?

00:19:11Well, I went down to the site.

00:19:13I was very surprised

00:19:14to see Councillor Baker there.

00:19:16Why?

00:19:17Well, I thought he must be there

00:19:18because of the tree preservation order

00:19:19and I was very surprised

00:19:21because it's not the kind of thing

00:19:22he'd be interested in.

00:19:24And then I asked the foreman

00:19:25whether the boss was there

00:19:27and he indicated Councillor Baker.

00:19:29Which no doubt surprised you even more.

00:19:31It did.

00:19:32Did you speak to him?

00:19:34Yes.

00:19:35He said the men were simply

00:19:36cutting out trees

00:19:37that were in a dangerous condition

00:19:38and I pointed out to him

00:19:40that they clearly were not.

00:19:42And at what point exactly

00:19:43did you find out

00:19:43that Councillor Baker

00:19:44was now the owner of the land?

00:19:47Well, I don't remember exactly.

00:19:49The discussion got a bit heated

00:19:51and then at some point

00:19:53he told me to get off his land.

00:19:56And?

00:19:57I think I said,

00:19:59what do you mean, your land?

00:20:01He said,

00:20:02I mean what I say.

00:20:03Get off my land.

00:20:05Did he say how long

00:20:05it had been, his land?

00:20:07Well, I believe it was mentioned

00:20:08but we both lost our tempers.

00:20:09Things became somewhat confused.

00:20:11I think he said

00:20:13a matter of weeks.

00:20:15It's true to say then

00:20:15that you didn't part

00:20:16on the best of terms.

00:20:18Well, we've never really been

00:20:20on the best of terms.

00:20:21I take it this encounter

00:20:22was not long after

00:20:23a meeting of the Council

00:20:24which granted planning permission

00:20:25for the land to be developed for housing.

00:20:27About six weeks.

00:20:28Now, when a matter is placed

00:20:29before the Council

00:20:30and an individual

00:20:31Councillor stands to gain

00:20:33or lose by the Council's decision

00:20:34he must declare an interest

00:20:37and abstain from voting.

00:20:38Isn't that the case?

00:20:39That is correct.

00:20:41And did Councillor Baker

00:20:42declare an interest

00:20:42at that meeting?

00:20:43No.

00:20:44You're sure of that?

00:20:44Very.

00:20:45You're sure that at the meeting

00:20:46of the Council

00:20:46on the 5th of July 1972

00:20:49Councillor Baker

00:20:50did not declare an interest?

00:20:51It's not something

00:20:52I'd be likely to forget.

00:20:53That piece of land

00:20:54has been a great interest

00:20:55to me over the years

00:20:56as a chairman

00:20:57of the Residents Association.

00:20:59Do you remember

00:20:59who was named

00:21:00as the owner of the land?

00:21:01Miss Crawley.

00:21:03And did Councillor Baker

00:21:04declare that she was

00:21:05in fact

00:21:05his former private secretary?

00:21:07No.

00:21:08He did not.

00:21:08The case of the Queen

00:21:27versus Baker and Crawley

00:21:29will be resumed tomorrow

00:21:30in the Crown Court.

00:21:31Charles Baker,

00:21:59a prominent member

00:22:00of Fulchester Borough Council

00:22:02and his former secretary

00:22:03Miss Margaret Crawley

00:22:04have pleaded not guilty

00:22:06to a charge of conspiring

00:22:07to commit a public mischief.

00:22:10The Crown alleges

00:22:11that between them

00:22:11they formed a scheme

00:22:12to purchase land

00:22:13and property cheaply

00:22:14from a market gardener

00:22:16James Dobson.

00:22:17The land was threatened

00:22:18by plans for a motorway

00:22:20but the prosecution claim

00:22:22that Baker knew

00:22:23before anybody else

00:22:24that survey reports

00:22:25would cause the council

00:22:26eventually

00:22:27to alter the motorway route

00:22:28to another area

00:22:29and open the land

00:22:31for building

00:22:31making it immensely

00:22:33more valuable.

00:22:34Miss Crawley

00:22:35bought the land

00:22:36and then sold it

00:22:37to Councillor Baker.

00:22:39Mr Dealey

00:22:39counsel for Baker

00:22:40has alleged that this

00:22:41was an innocent purchase

00:22:43on the part of Miss Crawley

00:22:44but Alan Fairley

00:22:45another member

00:22:46of Fulchester Council

00:22:47who first revealed

00:22:48Baker's involvement

00:22:49in the transactions

00:22:50has told the court

00:22:51that at the council meeting

00:22:53at which Miss Crawley's

00:22:54application for planning

00:22:55permission was granted

00:22:56Baker made no attempt

00:22:58to declare his connection

00:22:59with her.

00:23:00Mr Jonathan Fry QC

00:23:02counsel for the prosecution

00:23:03is continuing his questioning

00:23:05of Councillor Fairley.

00:23:06Councillor Fairley

00:23:28what was your reaction

00:23:29to Miss Crawley's application

00:23:30for planning permission?

00:23:32I voted against

00:23:33but the council

00:23:34were very much in favour.

00:23:35Do you remember

00:23:36how Councillor Baker voted?

00:23:37There was only

00:23:38one other vote against

00:23:40and that was not

00:23:40Councillor Baker's.

00:23:41Perhaps Councillor Baker

00:23:42would abstend.

00:23:43There were no abstentions.

00:23:45And did anything else happen

00:23:46that you feel

00:23:46might be of interest to us?

00:23:49Miss Crawley's application

00:23:50for a 75% improvement grant

00:23:53for her cottage

00:23:53was approved.

00:23:55At the same meeting

00:23:55her application

00:23:56for planning permission

00:23:57was also approved?

00:23:58Yes.

00:23:59All without Councillor Baker

00:24:01declaring his connection

00:24:02with Miss Crawley?

00:24:03He never mentioned it.

00:24:04And yet six weeks later

00:24:05he told you that

00:24:06he'd been the owner

00:24:07of the land

00:24:07for some weeks

00:24:08I believe you said.

00:24:10Indeed the site

00:24:11was already being prepared

00:24:12for building.

00:24:13Weren't you surprised at this?

00:24:14Well I was more than surprised.

00:24:17Well now Councillor Fairley

00:24:17I wonder whether you could

00:24:18tell us something

00:24:19about the change of plans

00:24:21for the motorway.

00:24:21Were you present at the meeting

00:24:22when this was discussed?

00:24:23It was fully discussed

00:24:26at a planning committee meeting

00:24:28early in September 1971

00:24:31and then by the full council

00:24:33a week later.

00:24:34And what took place

00:24:35at those meetings?

00:24:37Well a report

00:24:38about the possibility

00:24:39of subsidence

00:24:40a mining subsidence

00:24:42along the line

00:24:42of the original motorway route

00:24:44was considered

00:24:45and in the light of it

00:24:46the council decided

00:24:47to opt for an alternative route

00:24:49that wouldn't pass

00:24:50through Dobson's nursery.

00:24:51And was there some discussion

00:24:52and perhaps a vote

00:24:53taken on this?

00:24:54Well there was a great deal

00:24:55of discussion as you'd expect

00:24:56but I don't think

00:24:57there were any objections.

00:24:59You didn't question

00:25:00the substance of the report?

00:25:01No I wouldn't be likely to

00:25:03as it supported

00:25:04my point of view.

00:25:05Do you know

00:25:06who prepared that report?

00:25:08An outside firm

00:25:09Soil and Land Surveys Limited.

00:25:12Are you aware

00:25:12of the name of the chairman

00:25:13of that firm?

00:25:14Sam Dixon.

00:25:15Councillor Samuel Dixon?

00:25:16Yes.

00:25:17Now Councillor Dixon

00:25:18is by profession

00:25:18a civil engineer

00:25:19and the councillor

00:25:20thought it right

00:25:21to ward his firm

00:25:21the contract

00:25:22for the investigating

00:25:23the possibility

00:25:24of subsidence

00:25:24along the motorway route.

00:25:26Yes.

00:25:27Now then

00:25:28I presume he declared

00:25:30an interest at that meeting.

00:25:32Oh yes he did.

00:25:33And when he was awarded

00:25:35the contract

00:25:36he's a member

00:25:36of the planning committee

00:25:37isn't he?

00:25:38He is

00:25:38and his interest

00:25:39in that company

00:25:40was declared

00:25:41when the site investigation

00:25:44contract was awarded.

00:25:45And how were

00:25:46the contracts awarded?

00:25:48Well it wasn't

00:25:49a very big item

00:25:49of expenditure

00:25:50it would go

00:25:50to the small works

00:25:52subcommittee.

00:25:53And who are the members

00:25:54of that subcommittee?

00:25:55Councillor Dixon

00:25:56and Councillor Baker.

00:25:57So since Councillor Dixon

00:25:58had already declared

00:25:59an interest

00:25:59it was left

00:26:00to Councillor Baker

00:26:01to award

00:26:02his firm the contract?

00:26:03Well more or less.

00:26:04It would still have to go

00:26:04to the planning committee

00:26:05for approval.

00:26:06Nevertheless

00:26:07that would be

00:26:07purely formal.

00:26:08Yes.

00:26:09There do seem

00:26:10to be a lot of fingers

00:26:11in the pie

00:26:11don't there?

00:26:13Still

00:26:13the annual budget

00:26:14of the Fultchester Town

00:26:15Council is a very

00:26:16large pie

00:26:17and no doubt

00:26:18there's enough

00:26:18to satisfy everybody.

00:26:21Well I won't

00:26:21keep you much longer

00:26:22Councillor Fairley

00:26:22but there's one

00:26:23other matter

00:26:23of interest to us.

00:26:24I believe it is the case

00:26:25that when the Council

00:26:26decided to alter

00:26:26the route of the motorway

00:26:27certain other decisions

00:26:28were taken.

00:26:29I wonder if you could

00:26:29tell us something

00:26:30about those.

00:26:31Well it was decided

00:26:32as a result

00:26:33of the change of plans

00:26:34that any land

00:26:36the Council

00:26:36had acquired

00:26:37under compulsory

00:26:37purchase orders

00:26:38should be offered

00:26:39back to its original

00:26:40owners

00:26:41at the price

00:26:42paid by the Council.

00:26:43It was felt that

00:26:44this would be

00:26:44a reasonable

00:26:45thing to do.

00:26:46I should have

00:26:47thought it was

00:26:47very reasonable.

00:26:48I mean these

00:26:49compulsory purchase

00:26:50matters they create

00:26:50great bitterness

00:26:51in the public.

00:26:52And who was entrusted

00:26:53with these resales?

00:26:54The Estates Department.

00:26:56They were not in the

00:26:56hands of Council

00:26:57members as such.

00:26:58Did you find anything

00:26:59odd about the Council

00:26:59selling Dobson's land

00:27:01back to Miss Crawley?

00:27:03Well yes I suppose so

00:27:04but these compulsory

00:27:05purchase orders

00:27:06they create difficulties

00:27:07for Councils.

00:27:08I'm sure they do

00:27:09Council Fairley.

00:27:10Nevertheless it is

00:27:11the case that the

00:27:11Council sold the land

00:27:12very cheap

00:27:13plea to Miss Crawley

00:27:14and that she later

00:27:15obtained planning

00:27:15permission from the

00:27:16same Council

00:27:17which caused the

00:27:18land to multiply

00:27:19greatly in value.

00:27:20Yes.

00:27:21Thank you Council

00:27:22Fairley that is warm.

00:27:23Mr Sissons.

00:27:25Council Fairley

00:27:26just a couple of

00:27:27matters you can help

00:27:27me clear up.

00:27:29Firstly you are aware

00:27:30that Miss Crawley

00:27:30bought Mr Dobson's

00:27:31limited company when

00:27:32she bought his land.

00:27:33Yes.

00:27:34So when the

00:27:35compulsory purchase

00:27:36order took away

00:27:36his seven acres

00:27:38and the compulsory

00:27:39purchase order was

00:27:39reversed there was

00:27:40nothing sinister

00:27:41in the fact that

00:27:42the land was

00:27:43offered back to

00:27:43Miss Crawley

00:27:44and not Mr Dobson.

00:27:46Well it's a moot

00:27:46point.

00:27:47Oh really why?

00:27:49Well the land was

00:27:50bought from Mr Dobson

00:27:51limited company or

00:27:52not.

00:27:53The Estates Department

00:27:54should have offered it

00:27:55back to him as the

00:27:56original owner.

00:27:57A court of law might

00:27:58judge differently

00:27:59Councilor Fairley.

00:28:01Well let's continue.

00:28:03Putting the rest of the

00:28:04property aside for the

00:28:05moment you are aware

00:28:06that the cottage is

00:28:07still occupied by Miss

00:28:07Crawley.

00:28:08I have heard that.

00:28:09And that in fact she

00:28:09still lives there.

00:28:10Yes.

00:28:11Is there any reason at

00:28:12all then why she should

00:28:13not have been awarded

00:28:13an improvement grant?

00:28:15It would have cleared

00:28:16the air if Councillor

00:28:17Baker had declared his

00:28:18interest to the

00:28:19council.

00:28:20But he doesn't own the

00:28:21cottage and never did.

00:28:23Miss Crawley is not a

00:28:24relative of his.

00:28:25Nor indeed is she any

00:28:26longer even an employee.

00:28:29I presume there are

00:28:30guidelines laid down for

00:28:31the award of these

00:28:32grants.

00:28:33Yes.

00:28:34Did Miss Crawley's

00:28:34application fail to meet

00:28:36these in any way?

00:28:36Not to my knowledge.

00:28:38Then there is no reason

00:28:39at all why Councillor

00:28:40Baker should have

00:28:41declared an interest.

00:28:42Nor why Miss Crawley's

00:28:43application should not

00:28:44have been accepted on

00:28:45its own merit.

00:28:45If an interest had been

00:28:47declared the matter

00:28:48would have been looked

00:28:48at more carefully.

00:28:50But you see there was

00:28:51no interest to declare

00:28:52was there?

00:28:54Thank you Councillor Fairley.

00:28:56Now when you went up

00:28:59to the nursery site

00:29:00you say you were told

00:29:00to get off the land

00:29:01because it belonged

00:29:02to Councillor Baker.

00:29:04Is that all there was

00:29:05to it?

00:29:06I'm not sure what you

00:29:07mean.

00:29:08Well isn't the reason

00:29:08you were told to get

00:29:09off the land the fact

00:29:10that you were extremely

00:29:10abusive and threatened

00:29:11Councillor Baker?

00:29:13No.

00:29:13But you picked up a

00:29:14felling axe didn't you?

00:29:16Well yes but that was

00:29:19because it was being

00:29:19used to cut down the

00:29:20trees.

00:29:21I picked it up just to

00:29:22show it to Councillor Baker.

00:29:23Just to show it to

00:29:24Councillor Baker?

00:29:24Yes.

00:29:25And you did not

00:29:25intend to threaten

00:29:26him with it?

00:29:27No.

00:29:28See.

00:29:30Now as to the earlier

00:29:31matter you said that

00:29:32Councillor Baker

00:29:32declared no interest

00:29:34in the application

00:29:34for planning permission.

00:29:35Now this was quite

00:29:36natural wasn't it?

00:29:37After all the land

00:29:38was not his.

00:29:39Well he knew it

00:29:39was going to be.

00:29:41That is for the jury

00:29:42to decide.

00:29:43And I suggest that

00:29:44you had no reason

00:29:45for thinking that.

00:29:47It was his soon

00:29:47enough wasn't it?

00:29:48But not at that

00:29:49time.

00:29:50And the reason why

00:29:50he declared no interest

00:29:52was that he had

00:29:52none.

00:29:55Now this mining

00:29:56subsidence report.

00:29:58I don't seem to have

00:29:59noted this but I don't

00:29:59believe you made any

00:30:00suggestion that

00:30:01Councillor Baker

00:30:01could have known of

00:30:03the contents of this

00:30:04report in advance.

00:30:05He could have easily

00:30:06known in advance from

00:30:07Councillor Dixon.

00:30:08They sit on several

00:30:09committees together.

00:30:11Then so do you.

00:30:12Don't you?

00:30:14Did you know of the

00:30:15contents of this report

00:30:16in advance?

00:30:18No.

00:30:19No I didn't.

00:30:20Thank you Councillor

00:30:21Fairley.

00:30:22I'm sorry there is

00:30:24just one other matter.

00:30:26I believe you said

00:30:27that for councillors to

00:30:28declare an interest in

00:30:29matters before council

00:30:30is quite a common

00:30:31event.

00:30:32Yes.

00:30:33Now what is your

00:30:34profession Councillor

00:30:35Fairley?

00:30:36I'm a supplier of

00:30:38office equipment and

00:30:39furniture.

00:30:40And have you ever

00:30:40declared a financial

00:30:41interest in matters

00:30:42before council?

00:30:45Yes.

00:30:45Frequently?

00:30:46I don't know what

00:30:47you mean by that.

00:30:49Well let me help

00:30:49you understand.

00:30:51Would it be correct

00:30:52to say that about

00:30:5360% of your turnover

00:30:54in the last financial

00:30:56year was in

00:30:57connection with

00:30:57contracts awarded

00:30:58by Fulchester

00:30:59Council?

00:31:02Is that right

00:31:02Mr Fairley?

00:31:04I can't give an

00:31:06exact figure.

00:31:07Would 60% be

00:31:09about right?

00:31:11Well yes but I

00:31:12don't see what

00:31:12you're getting at.

00:31:13Then I shall spell

00:31:14it out for you.

00:31:15I am suggesting

00:31:16that far from there

00:31:17being a straightforward

00:31:18declaration of interest

00:31:19followed by a

00:31:20consideration of a

00:31:21contract on its

00:31:22merits a considerable

00:31:23amount of what might

00:31:24be described as

00:31:25lobbying goes on

00:31:26before each meeting

00:31:27to ensure that the

00:31:28interested members

00:31:29get no more and no

00:31:31less than their share

00:31:32of this pie.

00:31:33That's not true at

00:31:34all.

00:31:34A dealer's ring I think

00:31:35it is called.

00:31:36And as my learned

00:31:37friend for the

00:31:37prosecution has

00:31:38pointed out it's a

00:31:39very large pie and

00:31:40everyone has their

00:31:40finger in it.

00:31:41You've no right to

00:31:42accuse the council of

00:31:43that.

00:31:43Everyone that is

00:31:44except Councillor

00:31:44Baker.

00:31:45And I put it to

00:31:45you that he's in

00:31:46that dock today

00:31:47because he's always

00:31:47refused to have

00:31:48anything to do with

00:31:49this chicanery.

00:31:50Now isn't that the

00:31:50truth of the

00:31:51situation?

00:31:51No!

00:31:52How dare you make

00:31:52insinuations like

00:31:53that!

00:31:54Councillor Dixon

00:32:22what is your

00:32:23profession?

00:32:24Civil engineer.

00:32:25Was it your firm

00:32:26which prepared the

00:32:27report on subsidence

00:32:28in the cardboard

00:32:29area?

00:32:30It was.

00:32:30And when was this

00:32:31report commissioned?

00:32:32In the spring of

00:32:331971.

00:32:34And when was it

00:32:34completed?

00:32:35It took about three

00:32:36months towards the

00:32:37end of July.

00:32:38Shortly before Miss

00:32:39Crawley made her

00:32:40somewhat hurried

00:32:40purchase of Mr.

00:32:41Dobson's land in

00:32:42fact.

00:32:42Oh I was unaware

00:32:44of when that was.

00:32:45Mr. Fry I just

00:32:46want to make sure I

00:32:47got these dates

00:32:47correct.

00:32:49In August 1971

00:32:51Miss Crawley bought

00:32:53land from Mr.

00:32:54Dobson.

00:32:56In September

00:32:56Mr. Dixon's firm's

00:32:58report was submitted

00:32:59to the council and

00:33:00the motorway was

00:33:02rerouted.

00:33:03Now sometime before

00:33:05July 1972

00:33:06the council sells

00:33:08seven acres of Mr.

00:33:10Dobson's land to

00:33:11Miss Crawley.

00:33:12And in July 72

00:33:14she's given planning

00:33:15permission.

00:33:17And within six weeks

00:33:18it's found that

00:33:19Mr. Baker owns that

00:33:21land.

00:33:21Is that correct?

00:33:23Yes that's right

00:33:23my lord.

00:33:25And Councillor

00:33:26Dixon do you know

00:33:26Miss Crawley?

00:33:27We have met socially.

00:33:29When she was working

00:33:29for Councillor Baker?

00:33:30Yes.

00:33:31Do you know well?

00:33:32Not really.

00:33:33Does your firm have a

00:33:34good deal of business

00:33:35with that of Councillor

00:33:35Baker?

00:33:36A fair amount.

00:33:38Baker's is one of the

00:33:38most substantial building

00:33:39contractors in the town.

00:33:41And as we are civil

00:33:41engineers naturally we're

00:33:42frequently dealing with

00:33:43each other.

00:33:44Outside of business and

00:33:45council connections do you

00:33:46meet Councillor Baker

00:33:47fairly often?

00:33:47Yes.

00:33:48Did you at any of those

00:33:49meetings discuss the

00:33:50subsidence report with him?

00:33:51It must have cropped up

00:33:52from time to time.

00:33:53It was a matter of great

00:33:54public interest.

00:33:55Can you remember any of

00:33:56these occasions specifically?

00:33:58I'm not sure.

00:33:59Well I wonder if you look

00:34:00at a cutting from the

00:34:01Forchester News for the

00:34:0117th of July 1971

00:34:03Exhibit 3 my lord

00:34:04an agreed document.

00:34:06There's a photograph

00:34:07there Councillor Dixon.

00:34:09Do you recognise anybody

00:34:10in the photograph?

00:34:11Oh yes myself and

00:34:12Councillor Baker.

00:34:12And when was that

00:34:13taken?

00:34:14On the occasion of the

00:34:14annual dinner of the

00:34:15Forchester Golf Club.

00:34:16We're committee members.

00:34:18Short of before Miss

00:34:18Crawley purchased

00:34:19Dobson's land in fact.

00:34:20Did you discuss the

00:34:21report with Councillor

00:34:22Baker on that occasion?

00:34:23I must have done

00:34:24obviously.

00:34:24I think you can do

00:34:25better than that

00:34:26Councillor Dixon.

00:34:27Did you or did you

00:34:28not talk about the

00:34:29report?

00:34:30To the best of my

00:34:31recollection?

00:34:32Yes.

00:34:33And what was

00:34:33Councillor Baker's

00:34:34attitude?

00:34:37Well.

00:34:38You are under oath

00:34:39Councillor Dixon.

00:34:43Well.

00:34:43He seemed very keen

00:34:47to know the details

00:34:48and which way I

00:34:50thought it might go.

00:34:51And what did you

00:34:52tell him?

00:34:53It was very much

00:34:54in the balance.

00:34:55Very much in the

00:34:56balance.

00:34:57How did you expect

00:34:58Councillor Baker to

00:34:59interpret that?

00:35:00Well it wasn't in the

00:35:01balance before was it?

00:35:03I thought the

00:35:03Councillor would be

00:35:04damn fools to stick

00:35:05willy-nilly to the

00:35:06original plans.

00:35:07And you told him

00:35:07that?

00:35:08Yes I think so.

00:35:09Yes yes I did.

00:35:10Can we talk about the

00:35:11council meeting at

00:35:12which the report was

00:35:12finally approved and

00:35:13the motorway route

00:35:14changed?

00:35:15This was in September?

00:35:17Yes.

00:35:18Is that not the case?

00:35:20Now do you remember

00:35:21anything about

00:35:21Councillor Baker's

00:35:22behaviour on that

00:35:23occasion?

00:35:23He asked me which way

00:35:25I was going to vote.

00:35:26And what did you tell

00:35:27him?

00:35:27I told him I would

00:35:28probably abstain.

00:35:30In view of the fact

00:35:30that it was my firm

00:35:31that had drawn up the

00:35:32report.

00:35:33In the event as we

00:35:34know a vote was taken

00:35:35and the motorway route

00:35:36was changed.

00:35:37And afterwards?

00:35:39Baker seemed quite

00:35:39pleased about it.

00:35:41He insisted that we

00:35:41have a drink together.

00:35:43Thank you Councillor

00:35:44Dixon.

00:35:45Mr Sisson?

00:35:47I have no questions

00:35:48my lord.

00:35:50Mr Dealey?

00:35:53Councillor Dixon

00:35:54you said that on the

00:35:56occasion of the

00:35:56annual dinner of the

00:35:58Fulchester Golf Club

00:35:59Councillor Baker and

00:36:00yourself discussed

00:36:01this subsidence report

00:36:02that your firm had

00:36:03prepared.

00:36:04Yes.

00:36:04Who first raised the

00:36:05topic?

00:36:07I'm not sure I remember.

00:36:08But it could have been

00:36:09you.

00:36:10No.

00:36:13I'm not sure.

00:36:14Isn't it a fact that it

00:36:15was you who first raised

00:36:16the topic?

00:36:18No.

00:36:19It was not.

00:36:21A moment ago you

00:36:22couldn't remember.

00:36:24Can you remember very

00:36:25much about the council

00:36:26meeting at which your

00:36:27report was presented?

00:36:29Excuse me.

00:36:30The one before which you

00:36:31allege that Councillor

00:36:32Baker asked you which

00:36:33way you were going to

00:36:34vote?

00:36:35Of course I do.

00:36:36Then I have no need to

00:36:37remind you of the speech

00:36:39you made concerning that

00:36:40report.

00:36:40I was asked for my

00:36:41opinion.

00:36:43I see.

00:36:43It was a matter of

00:36:44opinion was it rather

00:36:45than fact.

00:36:46I've already said these

00:36:47things are never very

00:36:48certain.

00:36:50I thought there was

00:36:50about a 10% chance of

00:36:52running into serious

00:36:53trouble if the first

00:36:54route for the motorway

00:36:55was followed.

00:36:57Councillor Dixon I

00:36:57suggest to you that the

00:36:58speech you made to that

00:36:59meeting was in fact

00:37:00heavily loaded towards

00:37:01convincing the council in

00:37:02favour of the alternative

00:37:03route.

00:37:04That is a matter of

00:37:06opinion.

00:37:06Now you said this

00:37:07didn't you and I

00:37:08quote gentlemen the

00:37:11facts speak for

00:37:12themselves and what

00:37:13they say is that no

00:37:14one without a callous

00:37:16disregard for engineering

00:37:17principles could

00:37:18possibly do other than

00:37:19recommend than this

00:37:20route be abandoned.

00:37:22Now did you say that?

00:37:23Yes yes I did.

00:37:25Well that was

00:37:26exaggerating the 10%

00:37:27risk of running into

00:37:28serious trouble was it

00:37:29not?

00:37:29You must answer

00:37:34Councillor Dixon.

00:37:36Baker he said the way

00:37:39I put things the way I

00:37:42put the case might make

00:37:44a difference to a lot

00:37:45of things.

00:37:45Such as?

00:37:48He didn't specify.

00:37:50Now if he did say that

00:37:51and I suggest that he did

00:37:52not couldn't he have been

00:37:54referring to your interests

00:37:55rather than his own?

00:37:57Now why was that route

00:37:58favoured in the first

00:37:59place?

00:38:00I think that was quite

00:38:01clear.

00:38:02The terrain of the first

00:38:04route was much easier

00:38:05and there were fewer

00:38:06interchange points.

00:38:07And the alternative route

00:38:09the one at present

00:38:09adopted as a result of

00:38:10your firm's report?

00:38:12The present route is in

00:38:12fact much more complex.

00:38:15There are cuttings and

00:38:16embankments to be made

00:38:17and a variety of

00:38:18underpasses and bridges.

00:38:21In fact what you're

00:38:21saying is that the

00:38:22present route is much

00:38:23more expensive because it

00:38:24requires more complex

00:38:25feats of civil engineering.

00:38:27That is the case.

00:38:28In other words a firm

00:38:29such as yours if

00:38:31awarded the contracts

00:38:32would find the new route

00:38:33much more profitable

00:38:34than the one

00:38:34originally favoured.

00:38:36That has nothing to do

00:38:37with it.

00:38:37I suggest that it has

00:38:38everything to do with

00:38:39it Councillor Dixon

00:38:40and that Councillor Baker

00:38:41made no suggestions to you

00:38:43at the beginning of that

00:38:44meeting and the reason

00:38:45why you weighted your

00:38:46words in favour of the

00:38:47new route was quite

00:38:48simple.

00:38:49Your own personal

00:38:50self-interest.

00:38:51That is absolutely

00:38:52untrue.

00:38:52and all that did

00:38:53happen before that

00:38:54meeting was that

00:38:55Councillor Baker

00:38:55asked you which way

00:38:56you thought the

00:38:57decision would go

00:38:57and you said

00:38:59don't worry about

00:39:00that.

00:39:01No.

00:39:02He said the way

00:39:04I put things might

00:39:05make a lot of

00:39:06difference.

00:39:08No further questions

00:39:09Councillor Dixon.

00:39:10Mr Fry.

00:39:12No more questions

00:39:13my lord.

00:39:13That concludes the

00:39:14case with the

00:39:14prosecution.

00:39:14You may stand down

00:39:18Councillor Dixon.

00:39:21My lord I call

00:39:23with your permission

00:39:26my lord if I may be

00:39:27granted a few moments.

00:39:35Mr Sissons.

00:39:38My lord I will not be

00:39:39calling any evidence.

00:39:40Very well.

00:39:42Mr Dealey.

00:39:43I should like to call

00:39:44Councillor Baker.

00:39:49When did Miss

00:39:49Crawley finish

00:39:50working for you

00:39:51and for how long

00:39:51had she been in

00:39:52your employment?

00:39:54She finished

00:39:55working for me

00:39:56about the beginning

00:39:56of 1971

00:39:57and she'd been

00:40:00working for me

00:40:01for about 12

00:40:02to 15 years.

00:40:03And why did she

00:40:04leave?

00:40:05The reasons

00:40:06weren't very clear.

00:40:07I think she felt

00:40:08she needed a change.

00:40:10She had some idea

00:40:11of starting an

00:40:12independent business

00:40:13on her own.

00:40:14She'd accumulated

00:40:15a fair amount

00:40:15of capital

00:40:16over the years.

00:40:17And after she

00:40:17had left

00:40:18you still kept

00:40:18in touch?

00:40:19Yes.

00:40:20And you knew

00:40:20of her business

00:40:21affairs?

00:40:22Well it was

00:40:23only natural

00:40:23she should come

00:40:24to me if she

00:40:24needed any advice.

00:40:26Did she discuss

00:40:26the purchase

00:40:27of Dobson's

00:40:27property with you?

00:40:28Yes she did.

00:40:29Was this before

00:40:30or after she'd

00:40:31been along to see

00:40:31Mr Dobson

00:40:32about renting

00:40:32the field?

00:40:33It must have

00:40:34been afterwards

00:40:34because she told

00:40:35me that she'd

00:40:36already spoken

00:40:36to Dobson

00:40:37and I knew

00:40:38nothing about

00:40:38it up until

00:40:39that point.

00:40:40Now did you

00:40:41suggest to Mr Crawley

00:40:43that she should

00:40:43acquire this property?

00:40:45No I told her

00:40:46I wouldn't touch it

00:40:47but I did give her

00:40:48some advice

00:40:49as to its value.

00:40:50What sort of advice?

00:40:51Well I told her

00:40:52that the planning

00:40:54permission was

00:40:54worthless with the

00:40:55motorway route

00:40:56going right through it

00:40:57and that she

00:40:58shouldn't pay

00:40:58more than

00:40:59£10,000.

00:41:00And do you know

00:41:01how much she did pay?

00:41:01Yes £12,000.

00:41:03More than you'd advised?

00:41:04Oh well she's got

00:41:05a mind of her own.

00:41:06At the time you advised her

00:41:07did you know

00:41:09of the contents

00:41:09of the subsidence report?

00:41:11Now you've heard

00:41:11Councillor Dixon's evidence.

00:41:13Yes well like he said

00:41:14we discussed it

00:41:15at the golf club dinner.

00:41:17Why?

00:41:18Well it seemed

00:41:19a natural thing to do

00:41:20I mean I knew

00:41:20the report was

00:41:21near enough ready

00:41:22to present

00:41:22and there were

00:41:23quite a lot of things

00:41:24it was going to affect.

00:41:26You see

00:41:26my company

00:41:27had got a contract

00:41:29to do some

00:41:29industrial building

00:41:31over near

00:41:32where the new route

00:41:33would be

00:41:33and that would suffer

00:41:34if the motorway route

00:41:35were changed.

00:41:36So what you're saying

00:41:37is that it would be

00:41:38to your disadvantage

00:41:39if the report

00:41:40would have persuaded

00:41:41the council

00:41:41to alter the motorway route?

00:41:43In a way yes

00:41:44it would have certainly

00:41:44made us look at

00:41:45one or two things again.

00:41:46And what impression

00:41:47did you get

00:41:48from Councillor Dixon?

00:41:51Well the way

00:41:51I interpreted

00:41:52what he said

00:41:53was that the possibility

00:41:54of subsidence

00:41:55wasn't very serious.

00:41:56Did you talk about

00:41:57how it might affect

00:41:58the nursery site?

00:41:59Well it was just

00:42:00a casual conversation

00:42:01we didn't go into

00:42:01any detail.

00:42:02So you're saying

00:42:03that when you advised

00:42:04Miss Crawley

00:42:04on the purchase

00:42:05of the paddock

00:42:05and the cottage

00:42:06you believed

00:42:07at the time

00:42:08that the motorway

00:42:08was still due

00:42:09to pass nearby?

00:42:10As far as I knew

00:42:11yes.

00:42:12Did you play any part

00:42:13in the purchase?

00:42:15Well I fixed her up

00:42:15with the mortgage.

00:42:16And how much

00:42:17did that involve?

00:42:18I lent her £6,000

00:42:19towards the purchase price

00:42:20and she put up

00:42:21the other £6,000.

00:42:22You see I was anxious

00:42:23that she should keep

00:42:24most of her capital

00:42:25intact.

00:42:25She could have had

00:42:26more if she'd wanted it.

00:42:28And then came

00:42:29the council meeting

00:42:30at which the motorway

00:42:30route was changed.

00:42:32Now can you tell us

00:42:33about that please?

00:42:35Yes well I'd read

00:42:36Dixon's firm's report

00:42:38of course

00:42:38and to me

00:42:40it didn't seem

00:42:41to say much

00:42:41either way.

00:42:42So I asked him

00:42:43which way

00:42:44he thought it would go.

00:42:46And what did he say?

00:42:47Well he just smiled

00:42:50and he said

00:42:51don't worry

00:42:52about that.

00:42:54And what did you

00:42:55make of that remark?

00:42:56I didn't know

00:42:56what to make of it.

00:42:57I thought he must

00:42:57be up to something.

00:42:59As I have it

00:42:59of talking in riddles

00:43:00to Sam Dixon.

00:43:01You and he

00:43:02were in fact

00:43:03the subcommittee

00:43:03that had awarded

00:43:04his firm

00:43:05the survey contract.

00:43:06No, no, no.

00:43:08No we recommended

00:43:09it to the planning

00:43:09committee.

00:43:10We didn't award it

00:43:10direct.

00:43:11But nevertheless

00:43:11you set matters

00:43:12in motion.

00:43:13Yes well he declared

00:43:14an interest

00:43:15and his firm's

00:43:15tender was the law

00:43:16I saw it was

00:43:17nothing wrong

00:43:17with that.

00:43:18Now what actually

00:43:19happened at the

00:43:20council meeting

00:43:20to which we're

00:43:21referring after

00:43:22you'd spoken to

00:43:23Dixon?

00:43:24Well I was a bit

00:43:25taken aback

00:43:25because he was

00:43:26asked to give

00:43:27his opinion

00:43:27and he got up

00:43:28and just went

00:43:29hammer and tongs

00:43:29against the old

00:43:30route.

00:43:32So naturally

00:43:32everybody recommended

00:43:34the new route

00:43:35and it was all

00:43:35agreed.

00:43:36And this was the

00:43:37meeting that went

00:43:37on to recommend

00:43:38that properties

00:43:39compulsorily purchased

00:43:40by the council

00:43:41should be offered

00:43:42back to their

00:43:42original owners.

00:43:43Yes that's right.

00:43:44And did you have

00:43:44any part in that?

00:43:45No that didn't

00:43:46go to the vote

00:43:46everybody agreed

00:43:48and it just went

00:43:48through all the nod.

00:43:49And who proposed

00:43:50it do you remember?

00:43:50Oh Sam Dixon.

00:43:51Did it cross your

00:43:52mind?

00:43:52No no I'm sorry

00:43:53no no it was

00:43:54councillor Fairley

00:43:55who proposed it

00:43:56and Dixon seconded

00:43:58the motion.

00:43:59Did it cross your

00:44:00mind at the time

00:44:00that Miss Crawley

00:44:01might gain by this?

00:44:02No.

00:44:03Why not?

00:44:04Well for the

00:44:05simple reason that

00:44:06I thought when

00:44:07we decided to

00:44:08hand the land

00:44:09back to the

00:44:09original owners

00:44:10that meant

00:44:11original owners

00:44:12not people who

00:44:13have come into

00:44:13the property

00:44:14since then.

00:44:15So there is

00:44:15no question

00:44:16of your doing

00:44:16anything at that

00:44:17council meeting

00:44:18or later

00:44:18corruptly to

00:44:20further the

00:44:20interests of

00:44:21your former

00:44:21employee?

00:44:22Definitely not

00:44:23sir.

00:44:24Now do you

00:44:24consider that

00:44:26you or Miss

00:44:27Crawley have

00:44:27acted corruptly

00:44:28in these matters?

00:44:30Has there been

00:44:31any corruption

00:44:32on your or Miss

00:44:33Crawley's part

00:44:34Mr Baker?

00:44:35Not on my

00:44:36part no sir.

00:44:37The case of

00:44:56the Queen

00:44:56versus Baker

00:44:57and Crawley

00:44:58will be resumed

00:44:59tomorrow in the

00:45:00Crown Court.

00:45:00The trial of

00:45:28Councillor Charles

00:45:29Baker and his

00:45:30former private

00:45:31secretary Margaret

00:45:31Crawley took a

00:45:33surprising turn

00:45:33yesterday when

00:45:34Miss Crawley

00:45:35declined to

00:45:36enter the

00:45:36witness box to

00:45:37give evidence in

00:45:38her own defence.

00:45:39The two are

00:45:40jointly charged

00:45:41with forming a

00:45:42conspiracy to

00:45:42commit a public

00:45:43mischief by the

00:45:44purchase of a

00:45:45derelict market

00:45:46garden.

00:45:47Baker as a

00:45:48councillor knew

00:45:49before anyone else

00:45:49that plans to

00:45:50build a motorway

00:45:51over this land

00:45:52had been shelved

00:45:53thus releasing the

00:45:54land for housing

00:45:55development.

00:45:57Earlier the

00:45:57court heard from

00:45:58another member of

00:45:59Fulchester Council

00:46:00Councillor Samuel

00:46:01Dixon how he had

00:46:02discussed with Baker

00:46:03a confidential report

00:46:05on mining subsidence

00:46:06that might cause the

00:46:07council to alter the

00:46:09motorway route.

00:46:10This discussion took

00:46:11place shortly before

00:46:13Baker advised Miss

00:46:14Crawley on the

00:46:15purchase of the

00:46:16market garden.

00:46:17He has maintained

00:46:17that he did nothing

00:46:19to further the

00:46:19interests of his

00:46:20former employee through

00:46:22his position on the

00:46:23council.

00:46:24He has however

00:46:24admitted giving Miss

00:46:26Crawley an interest-free

00:46:27loan of £6,000 to

00:46:29assist her in buying

00:46:30the land.

00:46:31Mr. Dealey is

00:46:32continuing to question

00:46:33Councillor Baker.

00:46:34Mr. Baker, I asked if

00:46:58in your view you consider

00:46:59whether Miss Crawley or

00:47:01yourself have acted

00:47:02corruptly in these matters

00:47:03before the court.

00:47:05And I answered on my

00:47:06behalf I cannot be

00:47:08qualified to answer for

00:47:09Miss Crawley.

00:47:10However, I would trust

00:47:12her to behave with

00:47:14complete integrity at

00:47:16all times.

00:47:17Now, would you tell the

00:47:19court how you came to

00:47:20purchase this land which

00:47:21had just been granted

00:47:22planning permission by the

00:47:23council?

00:47:24Yes.

00:47:25Miss Crawley came to see

00:47:26me and I think that she'd

00:47:29come to realise that

00:47:30working on your own with

00:47:32your own money is very

00:47:33different from doing the

00:47:34same sort of thing with

00:47:35somebody else's and that

00:47:36she'd bitten off more than

00:47:37she could chew.

00:47:38So she offered me the

00:47:39land and I agreed to buy

00:47:40it.

00:47:41And before that date,

00:47:43some four weeks after

00:47:44planning permission had

00:47:44been granted by the

00:47:45council, the idea of

00:47:46purchasing this land from

00:47:48Miss Crawley or any other

00:47:49land had never crossed

00:47:50your mind?

00:47:51Well, I'll be perfectly

00:47:52honest.

00:47:52Yes, it had because I'm

00:47:53always interested in buying

00:47:54building land, but I

00:47:55certainly hadn't discussed

00:47:56it with Miss Crawley and I

00:47:57had not gone through all

00:47:59this palaver of scheming

00:48:01and planning and all this

00:48:03nonsense just to get my

00:48:04hands on a few acres of

00:48:05land.

00:48:07Thank you, Councillor

00:48:08Baker.

00:48:11Councillor Baker, does your

00:48:12firm normally provide

00:48:14interest-free mortgages?

00:48:16No, of course not.

00:48:17But you offered one to

00:48:18Miss Crawley?

00:48:20Oh, well, I look after

00:48:20the people who work for

00:48:21me.

00:48:22Isn't it the case that the

00:48:22loan was interest-free because

00:48:23it was in fact no kind of

00:48:24mortgage at all?

00:48:25No, it is not the case.

00:48:26I suggest that it was a

00:48:28bribe to Miss Crawley to

00:48:29enter into an illicit

00:48:30partnership with you, that

00:48:31she purchased the land on

00:48:32your behalf and that the

00:48:33whole scheme was carefully

00:48:34worked out from beginning to

00:48:35end as soon as you knew the

00:48:36details of the subsidence

00:48:37report.

00:48:38No, that's not true.

00:48:39Then why did Miss Crawley

00:48:40push the purchase through in

00:48:41such a hurry?

00:48:41She didn't.

00:48:43It was Dobson who did the

00:48:43pushing.

00:48:45You spoke to Councillor

00:48:46Dixon before the meeting at

00:48:47which the motorway route was

00:48:48changed, didn't you?

00:48:49I've said we talked about it

00:48:51at the golf club dinner.

00:48:52And you asked him to make the

00:48:53most of the possibility of

00:48:54subsidence.

00:48:55No, I did not.

00:48:56Then why did you say, let me

00:48:57see now, what was it, that he

00:48:59told you there was nothing to

00:49:01worry about?

00:49:02Well, I've said I thought it

00:49:04must be something of his own

00:49:05that he was up to.

00:49:06I put it to you that what you

00:49:07really said to Councillor Dixon

00:49:08was that if the motorway route

00:49:09were changed, you'd see to it

00:49:11that his firm stood a good

00:49:12chance of gaining the civil

00:49:14engineering contract.

00:49:15That is not true.

00:49:16and that you had carefully

00:49:17schemed to ensure that your

00:49:18partner in this crooked

00:49:19venture would be offered by the

00:49:21council seven acres of prime

00:49:23building land at the incredibly

00:49:24low price of £1,500, the

00:49:26original price paid to the

00:49:27unfortunate Mr. Dobson.

00:49:29Now look, all this has got

00:49:30nothing to do with me.

00:49:32When I thought that land was

00:49:33going to be handed back to the

00:49:35original owner, I thought that

00:49:37meant Dobson.

00:49:39Now all I gave to Miss Crawley

00:49:40was a loan and some advice and

00:49:43nothing else.

00:49:44Was the advice that she should

00:49:46buy the shares in Dobson's

00:49:47nurseries?

00:49:48Yes.

00:49:49It has been established that the

00:49:51Estates Department handled the

00:49:52return of property to the

00:49:53original owners, hasn't it?

00:49:55Yes.

00:49:56This means that through their

00:49:57solicitors they would give the

00:49:58land back to Dobson's Nurseries

00:50:01Limited.

00:50:02Yes.

00:50:03All the shares in which at this

00:50:04point were owned by Miss Crawley.

00:50:06Ah.

00:50:07And yet you ask us to believe that

00:50:08you thought that the land would

00:50:09go back to Dobson.

00:50:11Well you can't hold me responsible

00:50:13for decisions made by the

00:50:15Estates Department, can you?

00:50:17Councillor Baker, what really

00:50:18persuaded Miss Crawley to sell

00:50:19her land to you the minute she

00:50:20got planning permission?

00:50:21I've told you.

00:50:22She thought she'd bitten off more

00:50:24than she could chew.

00:50:24And what price did you pay for

00:50:26this land?

00:50:27£14,000.

00:50:28Nearly ten times the amount she'd

00:50:30just paid to the council.

00:50:32And how did you arrive at that

00:50:33figure?

00:50:35We didn't arrive at it.

00:50:37We just sat down and agreed a

00:50:39price.

00:50:40So she recouped all her costs and

00:50:42became the owner of a much

00:50:43improved cottage and paddock.

00:50:45All of £15,000 worth.

00:50:47And how did you pay her for this?

00:50:48Did you pay her in cash?

00:50:50Oh, don't be ridiculous.

00:50:51I'm a builder.

00:50:52I'm not a scrap metal merchant.

00:50:53Well, then how did you pay her?

00:50:55Well, I knocked off what she

00:50:56owed me on the mortgage and I

00:50:57paid her the rest.

00:50:58Yes, but how, Councillor Baker?

00:51:00How?

00:51:01By cheque?

00:51:01By postal order?

00:51:02In shares.

00:51:03Shares in what?

00:51:05Shares in Baker Build.

00:51:07Baker Build.

00:51:08Your own firm.

00:51:08Well, why didn't you give her money?

00:51:12Because she didn't need the money.

00:51:16Anyway, she'd already got shares in

00:51:17the company, so it was a perfectly

00:51:19natural thing to do.

00:51:21Now, you've said that while she worked

00:51:23for you, your relationship with Miss

00:51:25Crawley became fairly close.

00:51:28Oh, well, you don't work with somebody

00:51:29that long without forming some kind of

00:51:31bond.

00:51:31And what kind of bond did you form?

00:51:35I don't know what you're getting at.

00:51:36Well, I'll tell you what I'm getting at.

00:51:37What I'm getting at is that she was

00:51:39and is, to put it bluntly,

00:51:40your mistress, and that that is

00:51:42the relationship, isn't it?

00:51:43No, it isn't.

00:51:44And if it was...

00:51:44No!

00:51:45I would remind you that you're on oath.

00:51:58Oh, well, all right.

00:51:59Yes, maybe there...

00:52:02Maybe there was something more to it

00:52:06than what I've said, but that all

00:52:07ended a long time ago.

00:52:08How long ago?

00:52:11About two years.

00:52:13That's the...

00:52:14That's the reason she stopped working

00:52:16for me.

00:52:16Since when you've continued to meet

00:52:18and, as you claim, advisor?

00:52:20Yes.

00:52:20So, during the time that we're

00:52:22talking about, the relationship was,

00:52:24what shall we say, platonic?

00:52:28Fatherly?

00:52:29We had been very close

00:52:33and we have a great respect

00:52:36for each other.

00:52:38Are you still living with your wife,

00:52:40Count of the Baker?

00:52:42No, I don't see what that's got to do with it.

00:52:43The jury may feel

00:52:44it has a good deal to do with it.

00:52:50No, we parted sometime since.

00:52:52I, uh...

00:52:55I went back to her

00:52:57after Margaret left me,

00:52:59but it didn't work out.

00:53:02Did you know that Miss Crawley

00:53:03spent her holiday

00:53:05at the Highland Lodge

00:53:06in Tulloch?

00:53:08Yes.

00:53:09Now, I wonder if you'd look

00:53:10at this photostat.

00:53:11This is exhibit formal order,

00:53:12an agreed document.

00:53:13Now, this, Councillor Baker,

00:53:14is a photostat of the hotel register

00:53:16at the Highland Lodge in Tulloch

00:53:17for the period

00:53:18that you say Miss Crawley

00:53:19was on holiday, dear.

00:53:20Would you take a look at that?

00:53:22You see the name Crawley

00:53:23anywhere on there?

00:53:27No.

00:53:27The name Crawley

00:53:28does not appear.

00:53:30No.

00:53:31Do you see any other name

00:53:32that you do recognise?

00:53:35No.

00:53:36Now, would you look

00:53:37at the fifth line

00:53:37from the bottom, please?

00:53:39What name do you see there?

00:53:44It says Mr and Mrs Charles Baker,

00:53:46doesn't it?

00:53:49But I wasn't there.

00:53:50Now, do you see anything else

00:53:52written alongside that entry?

00:53:55Ah, there's a car number.

00:53:57Yes.

00:53:58The Highland Lodge

00:53:59is in fact a motel

00:53:59and requires its guests

00:54:00to enter the registration number

00:54:01of the car

00:54:02as well as their address.

00:54:04Do you recognise

00:54:04that car number,

00:54:05Councillor Baker?

00:54:08Yes.

00:54:08I'm sorry,

00:54:09I don't think the jury

00:54:09quite heard that.

00:54:10I said yes!

00:54:12Would you care to tell the jury

00:54:13whose car it is?

00:54:15Yes, it's Margaret.

00:54:17It's Miss Crawley.

00:54:17But look, I wasn't there!

00:54:19This was all over

00:54:20a long time before

00:54:21I was not there!

00:54:25Thank you, Councillor Baker.

00:54:28Mr Sissons,

00:54:29do you want to ask any question?

00:54:31No, my lord.

00:54:33Any re-examination,

00:54:34Mr Dealey?

00:54:36No, my lord.

00:54:37That is my evidence.

00:54:39You may stand down,

00:54:41Mr Baker.

00:54:49My lord,

00:54:50with your permission,

00:54:51I wish to call evidence after all.

00:54:52I wish to call my client.

00:54:57Now, Miss Crawley,

00:54:58you have heard all the evidence

00:54:59that has been put before the court

00:55:00and I realise

00:55:01that you've been under

00:55:02considerable strain.

00:55:03so there are just one or two points

00:55:05I would like you to clear up

00:55:05for the jury.

00:55:07Firstly,

00:55:08did you devise any prior scheme

00:55:10to purchase Dobson's property

00:55:11before you made your casual call

00:55:13that afternoon

00:55:14to inquire about grazing your horses?

00:55:15There was no scheme.

00:55:17It all happened quite by chance.

00:55:20I was passing the nursery

00:55:21and I went in

00:55:21in the spare of the moment.

00:55:23The land had been lying fallow

00:55:25and I'd been meaning

00:55:26to ask about it for ages.

00:55:28Did you hurry Dobson in any way?

00:55:30For holiday reasons or otherwise?

00:55:32Not at all.

00:55:33If anything,

00:55:33it was the other way around.

00:55:36Now,

00:55:36with regard to the sale

00:55:37of the seven acres

00:55:38to Councillor Baker,

00:55:39was that part of the scheme

00:55:41or another casual impulse?

00:55:43Or was there perhaps

00:55:44some other reason for it?

00:55:45Oh, no.

00:55:46No, that wasn't sudden at all.

00:55:48I'd thought about that

00:55:49for some time.

00:55:51Are you saying, in fact,

00:55:53that you had been planning

00:55:54to transfer the land

00:55:55to Councillor Baker

00:55:56some time before?

00:55:57No, that's not what I meant.

00:55:59Well, it's just that

00:56:00everyone talks as though I...

00:56:02I walked in

00:56:03and got planning permission

00:56:04and a couple of weeks later

00:56:05changed my mind

00:56:06and sold the land

00:56:06to Councillor Baker.

00:56:07It wasn't like that.

00:56:09What was it like, Miss Crawley?

00:56:11Well, I was in

00:56:13some doubt

00:56:15as to whether I could see

00:56:16the project through,

00:56:17but, well,

00:56:19I hadn't resolved

00:56:19this out in any way,

00:56:20so, well,

00:56:22I let the application proceed.

00:56:24And then, finally,

00:56:26I decided that,

00:56:28well, I couldn't go through

00:56:29with it

00:56:29all on my own.

00:56:31So I asked Charles,

00:56:34Councillor Baker,

00:56:35if he'd be prepared

00:56:36to buy the land from me

00:56:37after planning permission

00:56:40had been given.

00:56:41I understand perfectly.

00:56:44Miss Crawley,

00:56:44I'm aware that this

00:56:45may be rather painful for you,

00:56:47but as you know,

00:56:48we have heard serious

00:56:49allegations made

00:56:49concerning your relationship

00:56:50with Councillor Baker.

00:56:52Is there any truth in them?

00:56:56I'm afraid I must ask you

00:56:57to answer.

00:56:58I'm quite sure that the

00:56:59court will understand

00:57:00if you take your time.

00:57:02Yes, but it all finished

00:57:04a long time ago,

00:57:05before I left the firm.

00:57:06Miss Crawley,

00:57:09can you suggest

00:57:09any explanation

00:57:10as to how the names

00:57:11Mr. and Mrs. Charles Baker

00:57:13came to appear

00:57:14in the register

00:57:15of the Highland Lodge

00:57:15Motel Tullock,

00:57:17opposite the registration

00:57:18number of your car?

00:57:21I entered them.

00:57:24Now, why did you do that?

00:57:26Well, it wasn't quite

00:57:27as Charles

00:57:28Councillor Baker

00:57:31described.

00:57:33We were very close

00:57:35for a long time,

00:57:36but it wasn't me

00:57:38who broke it off.

00:57:39He broke it off

00:57:40and went back

00:57:41to his wife,

00:57:42but I'm afraid

00:57:43I still,

00:57:45oh, I still hoped.

00:57:48And then,

00:57:49when it didn't work

00:57:50with his wife,

00:57:50I thought we might still.

00:57:54Oh, it is.

00:57:55It's very difficult

00:57:57to explain.

00:57:58Please, take your time.

00:58:02Well, the truth

00:58:02of the matter is

00:58:03that I wanted him

00:58:04to come with me

00:58:04to Tullock

00:58:05to see if it

00:58:07would work out again.

00:58:10But he refused

00:58:11and,

00:58:14well, I couldn't

00:58:15really bring myself

00:58:16to believe it

00:58:17and, er,

00:58:18when I got

00:58:19to the motel,

00:58:20we'd,

00:58:21we'd been there

00:58:22before together

00:58:23a long time ago

00:58:24and,

00:58:26well, I told them

00:58:27that my husband

00:58:27had been slightly delayed

00:58:29but that he'd be

00:58:30arriving later

00:58:31and I wanted

00:58:33to book a double room

00:58:33for us.

00:58:36It was me

00:58:37who signed

00:58:37Mr and Mrs Baker

00:58:38in the register.

00:58:41Did Councillor Baker,

00:58:42in fact,

00:58:43stay at the motel

00:58:44on that occasion?

00:58:45No, er,

00:58:47I,

00:58:48I phoned him

00:58:49and phoned him

00:58:49but he wouldn't

00:58:50change his mind

00:58:51and the hotel

00:58:53I felt

00:58:54as if they all

00:58:54knew.

00:58:56I didn't know

00:58:57what to say.

00:58:57I just said

00:58:58that something

00:58:59had come up

00:59:00and he wouldn't

00:59:02be arriving

00:59:03after all.

00:59:06Thank you,

00:59:06Miss Crawley.

00:59:15Miss Crawley,

00:59:15you insist,

00:59:17do you,

00:59:18that Councillor Baker

00:59:19did not stay

00:59:19with you

00:59:20at the Highland Lodge

00:59:21Motel?

00:59:21I was on my own

00:59:23the whole time.

00:59:25Nevertheless,

00:59:25you yourself

00:59:26are still sufficiently

00:59:27interested to want

00:59:27the relationship

00:59:28to continue.

00:59:30Yes.

00:59:31Yet you still

00:59:32want us to believe

00:59:32that at no time

00:59:33did Councillor Baker

00:59:34tell you about

00:59:35the probability

00:59:35of the motorway

00:59:36being rerouted.

00:59:37He couldn't have

00:59:38told me

00:59:39for the simple reason

00:59:39he didn't know

00:59:40it was going

00:59:40to be rerouted.

00:59:42But you heard

00:59:43Councillor Dixon's

00:59:44evidence.

00:59:45Yes.

00:59:46Are you then

00:59:47suggesting that

00:59:47Councillor Dixon

00:59:48was lying

00:59:49when he says

00:59:49that he told

00:59:50Councillor Baker

00:59:51that the motorway

00:59:52route would have

00:59:52to be changed?

00:59:53Yes.

00:59:54But why should

00:59:54you make up

00:59:55such a story?

00:59:56Oh, I don't know.

00:59:59So,

00:59:59you're saying

01:00:00that Councillor Dixon

01:00:01went into that

01:00:02witness box

01:00:03and made up

01:00:03a pack of lies

01:00:04for no reason

01:00:05whatsoever?

01:00:07Oh, come now,

01:00:07Miss Crawley.

01:00:08Well, it's obvious,

01:00:09isn't it?

01:00:09His firm stuns

01:00:10the game more than anyone.

01:00:11It's sheer spite.

01:00:13I'm sorry,

01:00:13I didn't quite catch that

01:00:14and I'm sure

01:00:15the jury will wish

01:00:15to hear it.

01:00:17I said

01:00:18sheer spite.

01:00:20Why did you say that?

01:00:21Because he fancies himself.

01:00:23Because the moment

01:00:24he thought that

01:00:25Charles and I

01:00:25weren't seeing each other,

01:00:26he thought...

01:00:30Harry made

01:00:30some suggestions

01:00:31to me.

01:00:32Which you,

01:00:33of course,

01:00:34refused?

01:00:34Of course.

01:00:35Very proper.

01:00:37Not the kind of thing

01:00:38for a lady like yourself.

01:00:39My lord,

01:00:39that was unwarranted.

01:00:40Please refrain

01:00:41from comment,

01:00:42Mr Fry.

01:00:43Now, Miss Crawley,

01:00:44after you bought

01:00:45the cottage

01:00:45and the paddock,

01:00:46you went on

01:00:47to buy Mr Dobson's

01:00:48business from him.

01:00:50And then,

01:00:50you say that you

01:00:51discovered to your surprise

01:00:52that the motorway route

01:00:53was being changed.

01:00:54After which,

01:00:55when the council

01:00:56offered you

01:00:56a further seven acres

01:00:57at a knockdown price,

01:00:59you bought it

01:00:59and promptly applied

01:01:00for planning permission.

01:01:01Is that right?

01:01:02I told Mr Dobson

01:01:03I wanted the paddock

01:01:04for my horses

01:01:05and I had no intention

01:01:06of taking up

01:01:06the planning permission.

01:01:08But I didn't need

01:01:09another seven acres

01:01:09just for two horses.

01:01:11So I put in

01:01:12the application for that.

01:01:13And yet you ask us

01:01:14to believe that

01:01:15no more than two weeks

01:01:16after that,

01:01:16you abandoned

01:01:17the whole scheme

01:01:18and sold out

01:01:18to Councillor Baker.

01:01:19And this,

01:01:20after he had just

01:01:21spurned your

01:01:21continued advances.

01:01:24Isn't it the case

01:01:25that the whole thing

01:01:26was planned

01:01:27from beginning to end,

01:01:28Miss Crawley?

01:01:29Planned by you

01:01:29and Baker?

01:01:30No, it is not.

01:01:31Sir Sissons,

01:01:36do you want to

01:01:37re-examine?

01:01:39No, my lord.

01:01:40Well, then you may

01:01:41stand down,

01:01:42Miss Crawley.

01:02:01You have heard

01:02:09Mr. Dobson's evidence

01:02:09that Miss Crawley

01:02:10was in a hurry

01:02:11to push through

01:02:11the purchase of the land

01:02:12because she said

01:02:13she wanted to go

01:02:14on holiday.

01:02:15Now, is it likely

01:02:16that Mr. Dobson

01:02:17is lying in this matter?

01:02:19He has nothing

01:02:20to gain by lying.

01:02:21Nothing that this court

01:02:22decides today

01:02:23will ever return

01:02:24his now valuable

01:02:25property to him.

01:02:27Now, I think we have

01:02:28to accept his version

01:02:28of the truth

01:02:29and consider

01:02:30why Miss Crawley

01:02:31acted with such

01:02:32unseemly haste.

01:02:34Now, was it not

01:02:34because she knew

01:02:35from Councillor Baker

01:02:36that the report

01:02:37prepared by Councillor

01:02:38Dixon's firm

01:02:39would be bound

01:02:40to cause a change

01:02:41in the motorway route

01:02:42and that she and Baker

01:02:43had formed a partnership

01:02:44to profit from Baker's

01:02:46privileged information

01:02:47as a Councillor,

01:02:48a partnership

01:02:49which was the first act

01:02:50in a cleverly engineered

01:02:51conspiracy to purchase

01:02:52Dobson's land

01:02:53before it increased

01:02:55dramatically

01:02:56in value.

01:02:58And what was

01:02:59the second act?

01:03:00The council

01:03:00through its offices

01:03:01returned the land

01:03:02not to Mr. Dobson

01:03:03but to Miss Crawley

01:03:04who by this time

01:03:05had bought the business

01:03:06from him

01:03:06though she clearly

01:03:07had no intention

01:03:08of running it

01:03:08as a business.

01:03:10Now, is it likely

01:03:11that Councillor Baker

01:03:11sitting as he did

01:03:12on committee

01:03:13after committee

01:03:14did nothing to further

01:03:15this somewhat

01:03:16odd transaction?

01:03:19Now, what was

01:03:19to stop him

01:03:20from minuting

01:03:20his relationship

01:03:21with Miss Crawley

01:03:22for all to see?

01:03:23He would at least

01:03:23have made his position

01:03:24clear but he didn't

01:03:25do that.

01:03:26And was, I suggest,

01:03:27instrumental in seeing

01:03:28her various applications

01:03:29through the council.

01:03:31Now, it is noteworthy

01:03:32in this connection

01:03:33that when Mr. Dobson

01:03:34originally applied

01:03:35for planning permission

01:03:36for his seven acres

01:03:37it was refused.

01:03:39But after the land

01:03:40had been sold back

01:03:41to Miss Crawley

01:03:41she applied for

01:03:42planning permission

01:03:43and it was granted.

01:03:46And what then?

01:03:48No sooner was this achieved

01:03:49than she sold the land.

01:03:50Oh, not in a normal

01:03:51business-like way

01:03:52on the open market.

01:03:53Oh, no.

01:03:54She offered it privately

01:03:55to Councillor Baker

01:03:56and they agreed

01:03:57a price on the spot.

01:04:00Wasn't it this

01:04:01the final act

01:04:01in the conspiracy

01:04:02that gave Councillor Baker

01:04:04the possession

01:04:05of seven acres

01:04:05of prime building land

01:04:07in return for a block

01:04:08of shares in his own firm

01:04:09Baker Build

01:04:10and gave Miss Crawley

01:04:11in addition to those shares

01:04:13a much improved house

01:04:15and paddock

01:04:15worth all of 15,000 pounds

01:04:17at no expenditure

01:04:19to herself whatever.

01:04:21Ladies and gentlemen

01:04:23of the jury

01:04:23I submit that you

01:04:24have no choice

01:04:24but to find

01:04:25both the defendants

01:04:26guilty.

01:04:30Mr. Dealey

01:04:31since we seem

01:04:33to have reversed

01:04:34the batting order

01:04:35during the trial

01:04:36perhaps you'd like

01:04:37to begin?

01:04:39My Lord?

01:04:44Now the prosecution's case

01:04:46when you boil it down

01:04:47rests upon the evidence

01:04:48of one man

01:04:49that of Councillor

01:04:50Samuel Dixon.

01:04:52Now what did

01:04:53Councillor Dixon say?

01:04:55We have heard

01:04:55how he gave the impression

01:04:56to Mr. Baker

01:04:57that his firm subsidence report

01:05:00was in the balance

01:05:01and a decision

01:05:02could go either way.

01:05:04Why then members

01:05:05of the jury

01:05:05did he make a speech

01:05:06at that meeting

01:05:07expounding his opinions

01:05:09in such strong terms

01:05:10that the council

01:05:11were persuaded

01:05:12to alter

01:05:13the motorway route?

01:05:15Now you may think

01:05:15that he made this speech

01:05:16in order to further

01:05:18his own business interests.

01:05:20In any event

01:05:21whichever way

01:05:22the council was to vote

01:05:23on the subsidence report

01:05:24Councillor Baker

01:05:26believed that he could

01:05:27not benefit in any way

01:05:28because

01:05:29if the original route

01:05:31was to be maintained

01:05:32Miss Crawley's land

01:05:33would be worthless

01:05:34by virtue of the fact

01:05:36that the motorway

01:05:37was going to cut

01:05:37right across it

01:05:38and if the alternative route

01:05:40was to be adopted

01:05:41Mr. Baker believed

01:05:43that the council

01:05:44was going to offer

01:05:45the land back

01:05:45to its original owner

01:05:46that is to say

01:05:47Mr. Dobson.

01:05:50Now there is no evidence

01:05:51to show

01:05:52that Mr. Baker

01:05:52coerced the council

01:05:53in their decision

01:05:54to offer the land back

01:05:55to Miss Crawley.

01:05:56In fact

01:05:56this was the responsibility

01:05:58of the estates department.

01:06:00It is my contention

01:06:01members of the jury

01:06:02that the prosecution

01:06:02have no case

01:06:03and that Councillor Baker

01:06:05did not conspire

01:06:07to commit a criminal act

01:06:08neither is he guilty

01:06:10of abusing

01:06:11his position

01:06:12as a councillor

01:06:12to corrupt

01:06:13the legal workings

01:06:14of the council.

01:06:15I trust therefore

01:06:16members of the jury

01:06:17that you will find him

01:06:18not guilty

01:06:19of the charges

01:06:20against him.

01:06:25Your task

01:06:26is to consider

01:06:27whether the Crown

01:06:28has shown beyond

01:06:29reasonable doubt

01:06:30that Margaret Crawley

01:06:32formed a deliberate

01:06:33and corrupt partnership

01:06:35with her former employer.

01:06:37As my learned colleague

01:06:38has quite rightly pointed out

01:06:39the crux of the matter

01:06:40lies in the evidence

01:06:41of Councillor Dixon

01:06:42a man whose credibility

01:06:43you may well doubt

01:06:44but even if every word

01:06:46that Dixon has said

01:06:47is completely

01:06:47and utterly true

01:06:48it is still insufficient

01:06:50to prove the case

01:06:51for the Crown

01:06:51for under no circumstances

01:06:53could the information

01:06:55provided by Councillor Dixon

01:06:56to Councillor Baker

01:06:57add up to an advanced

01:06:59knowledge of the

01:07:00rerouting of the motorway.

01:07:01It was in his own words

01:07:03all a matter of opinion.

01:07:06With regard to later events

01:07:08I think you must agree

01:07:08that Councillor Baker's

01:07:09position on the planning committee

01:07:10in no way affected

01:07:11my client's application.

01:07:13The councillors knew

01:07:14who she was.

01:07:15Councillor Dixon

01:07:16has affirmed that

01:07:17despite the denial

01:07:18of Councillor Fairley.

01:07:21Furthermore

01:07:21there is not a shred

01:07:22of evidence

01:07:22that the sale

01:07:23to Councillor Baker

01:07:24was pre-arranged.

01:07:25Impulsive, yes

01:07:26but not pre-arranged.

01:07:29My client has admitted

01:07:30in open court

01:07:31the nature of her relationship

01:07:32with Charles Baker

01:07:34and indeed

01:07:35may well suffer

01:07:36as a result.

01:07:36but impulsiveness

01:07:38is not a crime

01:07:39nor is engaging

01:07:40in an adulterous relationship.

01:07:43That being so

01:07:44I do not think

01:07:45that you can find

01:07:45Margaret Crawley

01:07:46guilty

01:07:47of the present charge.

01:07:50As I have said

01:07:52ladies and gentlemen

01:07:53you are here

01:07:55as judges

01:07:56of the facts

01:07:57and the facts alone

01:07:59and it is for the Crown

01:08:01to establish

01:08:02these facts

01:08:03to your satisfaction

01:08:04beyond reasonable doubt.

01:08:07The Crown

01:08:07has briefly

01:08:08to prove two things

01:08:10to your satisfaction.

01:08:12First

01:08:12that Baker

01:08:13armed with information

01:08:15gleaned from

01:08:16Councillor Dixon

01:08:17formed with Crawley

01:08:19a scheme

01:08:21to profit

01:08:22by Baker's

01:08:23privileged position

01:08:24on the Fulchester Council.

01:08:26Secondly

01:08:26it is for you

01:08:27to decide

01:08:28whether such a scheme

01:08:30if it exists

01:08:31is a public mischief

01:08:32in the sense

01:08:34of being corrupt

01:08:35and against

01:08:36the interests

01:08:37of the public

01:08:38as a whole.

01:08:39Now if you think

01:08:40they were involved

01:08:41in such a scheme

01:08:42then you must find

01:08:44them guilty.

01:08:46But remember

01:08:47if you have

01:08:48any reasonable doubt

01:08:49then you must acquit

01:08:51the two accused.

01:08:55Ladies and gentlemen

01:08:56of the jury

01:08:56you will now adjourn

01:08:58to consider

01:09:00your verdict.

01:09:00Members of the jury

01:09:05will your foreman

01:09:06please stand.

01:09:08Just answer

01:09:09this question

01:09:10yes or no.

01:09:11Have you reached

01:09:11a verdict upon

01:09:12which you are

01:09:12all agreed?

01:09:13Yes.

01:09:15On the charge

01:09:16of conspiring

01:09:17to commit

01:09:17a public mischief

01:09:18do you find

01:09:18the defendants

01:09:19Charles Baker

01:09:20and Margaret Crawley

01:09:21guilty or not guilty?

01:09:23Not guilty.

01:09:26Very well.

01:09:29Miss Crawley

01:09:30Mr. Baker

01:09:30you are free

01:09:32to leave the court.

01:09:33The court will rise.

01:09:34next week

01:09:54a chance for you

01:09:54to join another jury

01:09:55in assessing the facts

01:09:56when our cameras return

01:09:58to watch another

01:09:58leading case

01:09:59in the Crown Court.

01:10:00August

01:10:03The court will rise

01:10:03in the H

Crown Court - A Public Mischief (1973)

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