Killer Grannies - Season 1 Episode 03- Granny's Addiction
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00:00Sweet, loving, the ones you trust most.
00:04Lois Reese, Midwestern grandmother to five kids, seemed no different.
00:10But what if this granny wasn't trustworthy at all?
00:13What if behind that smile was not just a con artist, but a killer?
00:21A 911 call came into the Lee County Sheriff's Office from Marina Village at Snug Harbor.
00:26An innocent woman is found murdered while on vacation in Florida.
00:32The girl I know there said, my God, Barb, didn't you know Pam was murdered?
00:36It just made me sick.
00:38The victim is captured on camera with a suspect that looks just like her.
00:43It showed her with like a female companion or a female friend.
00:48They're walking through the parking lot together, going up the elevator,
00:52walking down the hallway into the unit together.
00:54And from that point forward, I never saw the victim on surveillance footage again.
01:03I never would have thought that this is who my suspect was in this case.
01:07We believe that she was on the run.
01:10Our grandmas are the people that you can go to and be comforted when bad things happen.
01:16She was bad for her grandchildren.
01:20Her grandchildren and my children were the same age, and we took them everywhere together.
01:24You would never in a million years think that she could commit a crime like that.
01:29My biggest fear was, I don't want her to do this again.
01:32You'd never in a million years think that she was on the run.
01:49manage emergency yes it's marina village it's not called a condominium i managed the building
01:56and uh there's a dead body in one of the units lee county investigators rushed to the condo
02:04complex to respond to the incident initially when i made entrance into the unit i did smell
02:12something that was foul i also noticed that the air in the unit was turned down like it was cold
02:18in there i noticed then at the door that separates the bedroom from the master bathroom was closed
02:26but at the base of the door there appeared to be towels jammed at the bottom of it that may
02:31be to keep a smell in or out or to muffle the sound of something and once we go in we find that that's
02:38where the body was the decedent was on the floor feet towards the door
02:49a towel was draped over the decedent's arms and head area we were unable to see any wounds on her
02:56it was hard to see if there was any kind of struggle i was still up in the air with it
03:02when the medical examiner arrives they start lifting the sheets and towels off you could tell that it
03:08was a female there is a pillow near the body with what appears to be a gunshot hole through it there's
03:15some soot on the outside of it that was possibly used to muffle the sound of a gun being shot at close
03:22range the female was older i would say 60s we saw a probable bullet wound we then realized that it
03:32turned into a full-blown homicide that she had been killed
03:35at that point we did not locate a weapon there was no indication of a struggle there was no defensive
03:45marks as far as we could tell on the decedent it looked as if she had just been taken by surprise
03:53marina village at snug harbors the apartment condo complex
03:57it's used as timeshare so it does kind of have a transient occupancy a little bit
04:04we got the name from the complainant of hey this lady is the one who checked in we checked her
04:09driver's license she had checked in as pamela hutchinson but no one felt comfortable enough at
04:16that time at least to make a positive identification because of the decomp to
04:20the face and the bloating and everything i knew i had an elderly female she was supposedly there by
04:26herself i'm thinking to myself maybe someone followed her home tried to rob her it turned bad
04:33i just didn't know at that point with their investigation stretching through the night
04:39detectives hope an autopsy can give them some new information they decide to wait to tell the family
04:47until they can be sure that the body is pam hutchinson it was a small caliber round that killed our
04:53victim possibly a 22 caliber we were able to identify her through dental records the victim in the bathroom
05:03was identified as pamela hutchinson so we start making phone calls to next of kin
05:17i was at a local bar restaurant when pam's cousin-in-law called me to inform me that pam had been murdered
05:26i was devastated i mean you hear about things like that happening every day to somebody else but you
05:36don't think that can ever happen to somebody you know i live in bradenton florida and i met pam hutchinson
05:48in late 2015 she was somebody that would strike up a conversation with anybody pam kind of had that
06:00southern hospitality i felt like he knew her all my life
06:08she was raised down south and her family used to have a peanut stand where they'd sell peanuts along the
06:13road she was from virginia beach her father died when she was real young but she was really close to her
06:22mother then the mother passed away not too long before she came down here seeking a new life after she broke
06:31up with her husband while i was searching for a place to purchase i ran into pam and she said why don't
06:39you move in with me for a while from the start we just clicked we like the same things we like to bake
06:45we both believed in god we both jabbered a lot the detectives reach out to pam's family and friends
06:56to pick up the details about pam's trip to fort myers beach so i was living with pam at the time she
07:04decided that she was going to go to sanibel island at fort myers beach she had come down to the area to
07:11be with a friend whose husband had passed and they were going to scatter his ashes on sanibel island
07:16which is an island in the area we did text when she arrived at fort myers beach yeah i made it okay
07:24good go have a good time just relax life is short and then i didn't hear from her after that
07:34i owned a timeshare at marina village for many years so i called marina village at snug harbor and
07:48i said what's going on the girl i know there said my god barb didn't you know pam was murdered and i'm
07:55just like what it just made me sick i never recalled pam having any enemies that would ever consider doing
08:12her harm she was actually what i considered my best friend at the time it's still hard to get over you
08:24you know
08:32word of pam's death gets around fast but her poor family doesn't have any idea who might have done it
08:39the fort myers detectives keep digging hoping they can find anything that'll point to who's behind
08:45this awful crime the lee county sheriff's office knew that pamela had come down on vacation to help a
08:51friend of hers whose husband had just died shortly before at that point they didn't really have a
08:58suspect they started to look at the surveillance videos to try and see who maybe had been with pamela
09:05at that point when we were collecting all the evidence in the unit we found a receipt for the smoke
09:11and oyster brewery it had a date and time stamp on it we sent detectives to the restaurant and they
09:18collected the video for that time stamp we also made contact with the complainant from marina village at
09:25snug harbor and asked to review her surveillance footage
09:32we were starting to go back to the day that our victim arrived and watching her come in we see what
09:37kind of car she was driving a white acura four-door vehicle
09:59the footage shows that pam is alone at the condo from april
10:043rd to april 5th but what about after that detectives decide to take a gander at the footage
10:11they collected from april 6th at the smoking oyster brewery and that's where we see footage of our victim
10:20but it also showed her with like a female companion or a female friend the female was very talkative very
10:27jovial like easy to get along with um she was talking to everybody that got close to her
10:34so after finishing their meal at smoking oyster brewery they both left the area together
10:42so did pam go back to her condo with her new friend the investigators checked the footage from
10:48the complex to find out about an hour after both of them were seen walking to the room together
10:57they're walking through the parking lot together going up the elevator walking down the hallway into
11:03the unit together a short time later the female which she entered with came out kind of looking
11:12distraught so it was it was concerning at that point it looked as if she was almost talking to
11:18herself she was walking around she was leaning over again it looked like she was upset emotionally
11:24and from that point forward i never saw the victim on surveillance footage again
11:31at that point then we knew who we were looking for a white female i would guesstimate between 50 60
11:37years of age i was surprised i'm thinking wow this reminds me of my grandma
11:43her facade was probably of an innocent lady you can tell something was changing in her
11:54she had a love for the casinos a love for gambling it has become this odd crime spree of the most
12:03unassuming looking grandmother i was concerned about her trying to go to mexico i was like this is a problem
12:11when poor pam hutchinson is discovered shot to death in her fort myers rental investigators sift through
12:27hours and hours of footage looking for one unusual suspect in particular i never would have thought that
12:34this is who my suspect was in this case she had blonde hair she wasn't very tall maybe five five
12:42five six and those again are characteristics that were somewhat similar to our victim
12:48at that point i wasn't sure if it was a friend but to me it appeared as if she had just met this person
12:56it was my belief that the homicide probably had occurred on april 5th just before we saw the suspect
13:04exit the room and appear distraught on surveillance footage on april 6 2018 i no longer see our victim
13:14coming and going i only see our suspect coming and going from the victim's room it appeared as if she
13:20took a lot of evidence from the unit itself she was also adorning herself in the victim's clothing
13:27specifically a hat i remember in sunglasses and it was almost as if she was assuming her identity
13:36and we see her driving away in our victim's car at this point
13:41once we saw her leave with the victim's vehicle and we no longer had her on any surveillance footage
13:48we believed that she was on the run she had a head start from us
13:52from the time we last saw the suspect on surveillance to the time of the 911 call was about four days
14:01we got to figure out where she's at we start looking for our victim's car we're putting license plates
14:09into our license plate reader system flagging them as a homicide suspect at that point we knew of no
14:16witnesses we did an extensive canvas of everyone that was in the building some had already come and
14:22gone again this is spring break
14:29but there's no obvious way that pam and the gray-haired mystery lady would know each other
14:34the only clue the guys have to work with are the two cars caught on tape at the crime scene
14:40pam's acura and the other ladies escalade they check recent police reports to see if anything comes up
14:49before we found the body our units on the beach were provided information to be on the lookout for
14:55lois reese from minnesota because they believed that she had been in the area in her white escalade
15:02lois reese had a warrant for her arrest out of blooming prairie minnesota in reference to a fraud case
15:08now there's an aha moment their suspect was in a white escalade too could it be the same one lois
15:15reese was driving it was just let me just take a chance let me just see i called the local jurisdiction
15:24up in minnesota but this one just kind of took me by surprise they had a murder investigation on going
15:32there lois reese was a person of interest at the time they didn't have charges on her for murder
15:38but her husband david reese was killed so they were looking for her the dodge county sheriff's
15:44office had mentioned that they had secured an arrest warrant for her because she withdrew
15:48approximately 11 000 from david reese's bank account after she had fled the area even though the police
15:56in minnesota figured that lois reese had flipped from kindly grandmother to husband killer they could
16:02only get a warrant for the money she stole from his account i asked them for a photo of the person of
16:09interest that they had up in minnesota and i took that photo i printed it off and as i'm watching the
16:14surveillance footage i put it right up next to the screen and i paused it and i said that's her
16:20i spoke specifically and directly with the detectives involved with the murder investigation
16:28and the grand theft investigation and they relayed the scene that they encountered in that area
16:35they told me they received a call to do a welfare check on david reese
16:39dave's employees had not seen him for almost two weeks and lois had been telling them that he was ill
16:56on the 22nd they saw lois driving out in dave's white escalade the employees said something's up
17:06so they called the local police to come and do a welfare check
17:13blooming prairie police went to the house knocked couldn't get anybody walked around found an open
17:19window in the back which is unusual because it's march in minnesota and they saw a body through the
17:27window that was open they were able to make entry get inside the house made their way to the master bath
17:36and the door was closed things up against the door they found who they believed to be david reese in
17:43the bathroom it did not look like the body had moved it looked like dave laid where he fell after he
17:52got shot twice again covered with the towel according to the dodge county sheriff's office david had been
17:59dead for at least a few days and at that point the lowest was nowhere to be found
18:09it sounded very similar to what i had found in the unit down here
18:14the victim up in minnesota was killed in the bathroom it appeared to be a small caliber round
18:20and then also a towel was draped over the decedent up in minnesota same as down here
18:26the bathroom window was open to again letting cold air again similar to lois dropping the air in the unit
18:33she turned the air down try to keep the smell out i was shocked i would have never just thought
18:41walking down the street oh that lady's responsible for the deaths of two people everything we put out
18:46at that point was she's wanted and she's considered armed and dangerous we needed to find her as soon
18:53as possible because my biggest fear was i don't want her to do this again
18:59i don't want her to do this again i don't want her to do this again i don't want her to do this
19:06investigators in florida find out that their suspect lois reese likely shot her poor husband in minnesota
19:13two weeks before she did the same thing to pam hutchinson they put the word out all over the
19:19state to be on the lookout for lois and then pry into her past to see if they can figure out why she did it
19:26it's a good thing to do it it's a good thing to do it it's a good thing to do it it's a good thing
19:29lois and dave moved to blooming prairie about 2005 or six somewhere in there
19:35dave and lois were really a friendly couple everybody loved to hang out with them and laugh with them
19:42lois was born and raised in rochester minnesota dave also grew up in rochester
19:49lois dropped out of high school as a junior and was already dating dave
19:54they got married and had three children very quickly lois she just had this instant draw she
20:04was just super fun very sweet great laugh and just makes you feel very comfortable
20:12lois for many years while her children were young especially had a daycare in her home
20:17if you went to lois's daycare you were privileged like she everybody wanted lois to watch her kids
20:25she was phenomenal she was a good mom and a good grandmother and did the things that good moms and
20:33grandmas are supposed to do our grandmas are the people that you can go to and and be comforted when
20:40bad things happen lois was bad for her grandchildren her grandchildren and my children were the same age
20:48and we took them everywhere together bringing them to like the zoo and the beach and just doing lots of
20:55fun stuff she's just like the sweetest little grandma dave was a jolly fun guy if you were in a bad mood
21:07sit by dave because he'd have you laughing in a minute he had this infectious deep laugh always
21:13told jokes loved to talk about fishing that was his favorite thing to do dave ran a wax worm business
21:22so he actually grew wax worms from nothing and they would sell them at fisheries bait shops stuff like
21:30that lois seemed very happy so did dave never would have guessed there was like deeper problems involved
21:43i think it wasn't until later on in the years where you can tell something was changing in her
21:49everyone knew that lois and dave liked to go to the casino especially lois it was something that a lot
21:58of the blooming prairie people their age did on the weekends but later on when she would call me
22:07and be like hey can i use you for an excuse i'm going to the casino and i don't want dave to know
22:13that's when i kind of realized that maybe it was getting a little a little too much she had confided
22:22a couple times just exhausted and i said to her i'm like you're going to snap
22:31i panicked because then we find out dave's dead and lois is nowhere to be found she's not answering my
22:39phone calls not texting me back so then i'm like oh my gosh did something happen to her was she kidnapped
22:45was she murdered and taken away like i had no idea
22:54two weeks later lois has managed to avoid minnesota police for killing her husband and florida police for
23:02killing pam and the cops realized that she could already be days and miles ahead of them so while
23:09they look for her they try to figure out what she was up to right before she killed pam so prior to the
23:17homicide we had learned that lois reese was spotted on fort myers beach by a test coster a part-time
23:24resident of florida we were part-time here and part-time in minnesota tess was from blooming prairie
23:33and so she was aware of the murder investigation that was happening up in that area at the time
23:38and knew about lois reese and what she may be wanted for
23:42on april 2nd i was cleaning my garage then i saw this pearl colored cadillac escalade pull up in our
23:57driveway and someone got out looked at the house number and so i stepped out of the garage and said
24:03can i help you and she looked up and just shock was in her eyes and she said wrong house wrong house
24:09and looked down like this and shook her head and went around to her escalade and got in and drove away
24:18well my heart just started started pounding because here was lois reese in my driveway
24:26when she saw the person who she believed to be lois in the driveway it scared her and she wanted to
24:32make you know the sheriff's office aware down here which she did but unfortunately she was able to
24:39stay hidden from us a few days later lois reese killed our victim i'm thinking she was after me
24:48first she got fouled out because i saw her and called 911 on her she had a plan in mind but tests
24:55interrupted that and so instead of moving forward at that point she just took a step back and went
25:01another way the detectives figured that lois switched gears and decided that someone like pam wouldn't
25:09see her coming lois was clearly desperate she was definitely looking for more money and more options
25:19in homicides that i've worked everything has a reason and this reason in my mind was to assume the
25:26identity of the identity of the victim and use it for what she could i think she targeted her because
25:35they were similar someone like-minded similar characteristics skin color hair age she's already
25:43committed two murders and she's still in the wind
25:46we did search warrants on her cell phone we did search warrant on the financial information for lois
25:53but then also for our victim as well she had made several withdrawals from atms using the victim's
26:01information a couple days after the murder we also have her on video up in the ocala area central florida
26:09checking into a hotel under the identity of our victim wearing the same hat that our victim had in
26:14her room however by the time i found this lois had already come and gone we know we have you we just
26:22got to find you and you're assuming the identity of our victim double murdering granny lois reese has
26:34a jump on lee county cops so they cast a wider net across the south to see if they can catch back up
26:42we had tracked her to a casino in louisiana and found out that she hit a jackpot for 1500
26:57she actually used her own name and id to claim the winnings
27:02she did have a gambling addiction and that may very well be a good reason as to why lois used her
27:08own information to collect the winnings she felt proud it made me mad that she just seemed to be
27:16out there enjoying herself and just continuing to live her life knowing that she had committed one
27:22murder in florida and most likely another one in minnesota but lois is slippery she's long gone days
27:32before police get the alert and they're once again left chasing her shadow i was able to present the
27:40case to the state attorney's office and walked a warrant through for the murder at which point then that
27:46went nationwide we alerted everybody that we could federal agencies state law enforcement local agencies
27:55anywhere and everywhere that we think she may be going we made them aware to be on the lookout for one
28:00lois reese herself but then also the vehicle that she was driving it became an all points bullet on
28:06across the united states they put up bulletin boards around lots of different areas texas louisiana florida
28:13with pamela's picture and information on it so it became more than just a florida or a minnesota
28:19story it became a coast to coast story lois became known very well known as the killer grandma
28:25with lois's escape route now crossing state lines the heat gets turned way up the hunt for granny is now nationwide
28:39people wanted answers and people needed to know i mean she knew a lot of people in that town
28:46do you think she's around here do you think she might shoot anybody else
28:49the whole entire community was completely shocked and very sad very sad like i said everybody loved
28:58dave everybody loved lois so it was mad at lois it was sad about dave it was a very crazy dynamic
29:07that was going on there i had to actually turn the tvs off and not let anyone turn them on because my
29:13sons were small and dave and lois were grandma and grandpa to them
29:23my thoughts on seeing lois wearing pam's clothes i can't hardly comprehend it right now because it
29:33really bothers me it's just so abusive
29:36it's just a terrible reminder of what happened to pam i definitely wanted her caught
29:46please god get her before she kills another woman
29:51killer granny lois is just leaving chaos in her wake but the search stretches into another week without
29:58the cops catching up to her however they do catch the news that she's headed south
30:04there were several other license plate reader hits along a route to texas heading south
30:14i had a thought that she would be trying to leave the country
30:19who knows where she's going next but i think we know she could kill someone again because that's
30:24already happened twice we were attracting lois through license plate readers on the victim's car
30:30and eventually it came to south padre island
30:37south padre island texas is very close to the border
30:43on april 19th we received information from the u.s marshal service that she had went into a bar and
30:50restaurant called dirty owls and basically was looking at a menu and the manager there actually
30:56recognized her and called in a tip to the local police department in a marshal service
31:02when the marshals got to south padre they canvassed the area and actually located the vehicle
31:08at a restaurant right adjacent to dirty owls they got the marshals rallied and trooped up
31:15and lois was by then sitting in the bar and yucking it up like she didn't have a care in the world
31:24i was elated she wasn't going to be able to keep this up forever
31:32cops have been looking everywhere for double murdering grandma lois reese but the u.s marshals
31:39finally catch up and she's just sitting there sipping a drink in south padre just a hop skip and
31:45a jump from mexico this cadre of marshals moved in four or five of them and said we're gonna take you
31:54outside don't make a scene there was no resistance from lois and it was very interesting to me how just
32:02calm cool and collected she was she didn't fight she didn't resist she didn't ask a bunch of questions
32:07she got up off her chair and out they went she almost just went willingly with the authorities
32:18i think lois knew that she was caught that it was done there was a bulletin over the associated press
32:26that that she had been arrested when i heard that they had caught her at south padre island
32:33it was really a relief it was like this is one closure they caught her the grandma killer
32:45arrangements were made for us to fly out to south padre island we knew we wanted to speak with her
32:52and we were hoping that she would speak with us i remember her being led from the holding cell into
32:59the interview room and she kind of just looked right through me and so instead of her being the
33:05outgoing jovial person that we see once she was caught her whole demeanor changed she was defeated almost
33:14and without saying another word she said she wanted an attorney
33:20with lois lawyered up there's no way she's going to confess
33:23so it's up to the cops to find some physical evidence that can tie this granny to the two murders
33:32she had secured a hotel room at a motel six just down the street according to hotel receipts
33:40lois checked in on april 9th she lived the good life for 10 days before they caught up to her
33:47we were able to secure search warrants for the motel room where she was staying at and we found two
33:52handguns a nine millimeter and a 22 caliber the 22 caliber specifically we believed to be the murder
34:00weapon we found the victim's clothing and specifically the hat that was shown on surveillance footage
34:09of her wearing at the bank at the hotel after she had committed the murder
34:13also something of note was a black bag kind of like a go bag and inside there was latex gloves
34:20there was duct tape there was our victim's personal information her wallet driver's license
34:30i think that lois in her desperation because she was i'm sure getting antsy wanting to gamble
34:38with this addiction of hers i think she knew that pam had money i think she killed pamela to
34:47get another car and to get more money and so she clearly had a bit of a pattern
34:53so she gets to south padre island she goes and finds herself a spot to sit and kind of blend in and start
35:03hunting we did an extensive canvas and we spoke with numerous people that she came into contact with
35:12we were able to confirm with a lot of witnesses she was just having a great time hanging with people
35:18having drinks at the bar hanging out by the pool she told some people that she was a grandmother she had
35:24kids green kids green kids that she was a widow that her husband died recently her facade was probably
35:32of an innocent lady anybody will talk to her
35:38i came across a lady who said that she interacted often with lois they went to dinner together she
35:45actually invited her at one point back to her own house she had kind of befriended lois
35:51i remember specifically she had different color hair but i also know that in the search warrant at
35:57the motel room there was hair dye that we collected it was a dark color just like the witness out there
36:05and she possibly thought that she might be her next victim
36:11i do think she was planning on killing somebody in south padre also and getting a new identity to go
36:17across the border so between this gal in south padre and myself we're very lucky that we're still here
36:26it was a relief that she'd been caught that this so-called manhunt for the killer grandma was over and
36:32now came a hard part the court case this was a seminal moment for this case
36:39the court proceedings facing here in florida and in minnesota as well
36:49after she led the cops on a many-state wild goose chase killer granny lois reese has to face the music
36:56for killing pam hutchinson in florida and her husband david reese in minnesota
37:01so in florida she was charged with first degree homicide she was also charged in minnesota with
37:09first degree homicide based on the crime death penalty was on the table for her
37:17once lois is locked up and staring down the consequences including the possibility of the death
37:23penalty she suddenly has a change of heart i eventually heard that lois pled guilty to the crime
37:30of murder down here in exchange for the death penalty being taken off the table
37:42i wanted it to go to trial they claimed that they didn't want to put the family through any
37:49extra whatever but i'd have been in court every day i wanted no mercy for her
37:55on december 18th 2019 in lee county court lois pled guilty to murder
38:04it became a huge story major breaking news the so-called killer grandma on fort mayors beach will
38:10spend the rest of her life in prison after pleading guilty once the case was wrapped up in florida she
38:17was then transported up to minnesota where she also entered a plea of guilty up there
38:22all investigators can hope is that lois's statement just shows us all how she went from loving
38:30grandmother to husband killer and everything spiraled from there down a path of fraud and murder
38:40lois's story is that he was mad and they had argued and that he walked into their bedroom and he had a
38:4622-22 in his bedroom handed her the gun and said well why don't you just kill yourself
38:56she claims that that just set her off and she said i aimed right at his heart and i pulled the trigger
39:05i didn't believe that based on where he was in the bathroom i mean if she did have that argument
39:14outside of the bathroom where the guns were kept she's not moving that man into the bathroom
39:19that's why i think she snuck up on him just like she probably did our victim in formars beach everything's
39:26a lie with her lois's addiction from what the authorities in minnesota told me was gambling
39:36she had a love for the casinos a love for gambling and that was part of the problem that she had with
39:43her husband from what i was told the waxworm farm was successful but it was not making money because lois
39:51was spending it all and asking dave for more money and not terribly long before he was killed he said
40:00i'm done i'm cutting her off and i just think that everything caught up with her that's the only thing
40:06i could think of why she would do any of this it's just a legit mental breakdown
40:15she finally reached a breaking point and she chose the most drastic route
40:22in florida she got a life sentence and eventually she got the same in minnesota
40:33it was just so sad that you know to lose a friend and lose dave lose her
40:40and you want to still love them because you're your friend but what she did was so horrible
40:45and to this day it's still crazy to me like i just don't i still can't wrap my head around it
41:00dave was fantastic his laugh was so contagious if you ever heard his laugh you will never forget it
41:07super friendly he'd love to like give hugs and he was just so great
41:16one of my favorite memories of pam when she would come home if i wasn't up she'd wake me up
41:23and we'd sit there and talk for two three hours until i'd finally say pam i've got to go to bed
41:29and we would jabber jabber for hours just talk and laugh and joke she just had a good heart she had a
41:38very good heart
41:40i mean the ripple effects of not only her her murder victims but
41:49people who love them her own children her own grandchildren i mean oh god the pain
41:57i feel like lois kind of tainted the grandmother image for all of us i have 10 grandkids myself
42:04love them all dearly talk about them all the time just like she does
42:07and as a grandmother myself i can't imagine being less than the best example i can be for my
42:14grandchildren and that's how it should be that's just how it should be
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