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00:00You know, I think it was the great French director, Jean Renoir, who said,

00:07a director makes the same film his entire life.

00:10He just breaks it into little pieces and remakes it.

00:12My guiding principle is, what's a film that I want to race out to see on a Friday night?

00:18That's what determines what I write and direct.

00:21You want to know why I did what I did?

00:36Sir, I guess it's just a meanness in this world.

00:51I think we got that.

01:18Oh, yeah, we got that one.

01:21So this song got a name?

01:27I was going to call it Starkweather.

01:32But now I'm thinking Nebraska.

01:35Welcome to Behind the Lens.

01:37Today, he's made so many great movies.

01:39As a director, he started as an actor.

01:42But in 2009, Crazy Heart won two Oscars, including for Best Actor, Jeff Bridges, and Song.

01:49And he's gone strong ever since.

01:52His latest film, Springsteen, Delivered Me From Nowhere, is a terrific film.

01:56This is Scott Cooper.

01:57Welcome.

01:58Thank you, Pete.

01:59Such an honor to be here with you, man.

02:00I mentioned you started as an actor.

02:02Yes.

02:02And worked with my friend Ron Maxwell's movie, Gods and Generals.

02:08I love Ron.

02:09Which is where I met Robert Duvall, who really changed my life because he became a mentor in my life.

02:17I was married on his farm in Virginia.

02:20Oh, wow.

02:20He produced my first film, Crazy Heart.

02:23Mr. Duvall would read every script that I would write.

02:29He would look at cuts of my films.

02:31And his last film was my film, The Pale Blue Eye.

02:38So it came full circle.

02:40Wow.

02:40Yes.

02:41That's great.

02:42You know, yeah.

02:43So what made that transition for you?

02:46And you've done it so successfully, but not everybody can.

02:50But I know you studied with Strasburg and everything else.

02:53Yeah.

02:53Thank you, Pete.

02:54Well, it's, you know, for an actor who had an unremarkable career, who, you know, would screen

02:59test for a lot of major roles and then end up losing them to actors of my generation who

03:04were really great.

03:06That's what motivated me to write Crazy Heart.

03:09And I sent the screenplay to Robert Duvall, who loved it.

03:13And he said, whom do you want to start it?

03:15And I said, well, I wrote this for Jeff Bridges.

03:18Of course, I didn't know Jeff.

03:19I wrote Jeff a very long letter.

03:21It took Jeff about a year to read it.

03:24And then when he said yes, that changed my life.

03:27And I can remember day one, day two, when I'm on this side of the camera watching Jeff

03:34Bridges, watching Robert Duvall, watching Maggie Gyllenhaal, Colin Farrell.

03:38I knew I would never go back on that side.

03:41Because when you watch Jeff Bridges do what he does, it was very clear that I was never

03:46going to be that kind of an actor.

03:48Oh, wow.

03:48So I've decided to stay on this side.

03:51And I adore actors.

03:53I hope that I'm an actor's director.

03:56I spend a great deal on performance.

03:59Yeah.

03:59I work with a lot of the same actors.

04:00And for me, it just brings me so much more joy to be able to express myself both as a

04:07writer and as a director, as opposed to just being an actor.

04:10Yeah.

04:11It's interesting to me, too, when you look at your filmography, which is getting quite

04:15significant now, you really go for interesting subjects and things.

04:21It's hard to pinpoint you.

04:23Like some directors, you can say, oh, I know that's it.

04:25Oh, good.

04:26You know, yours is more like Howard Hawks to me.

04:29But, you know.

04:30One of my favorite directors, by the way.

04:31Oh, really?

04:32Oh, yeah.

04:32Well, he could do anything and did, you know.

04:36He sure did.

04:37And that was it.

04:37But with Black Mass, which is the Whitey Bulger story.

04:40And, of course, Out of the Furnace.

04:42And Hostiles, which is a Western.

04:45Pale Blue Eye, which is about the young Edgar Allan Poe.

04:48I mean, you're all.

04:49Got the horror.

04:49Yeah.

04:50Antlers, which is the horror film.

04:52Yes.

04:53Well, interestingly, my guiding principle is, what's a film that I want to race out to

05:00see on a Friday night?

05:01Yeah.

05:01That's what determines what I write and direct.

05:07You know, I think it was the great French director, Jean Renoir, who said, a director makes

05:12the same film his entire life.

05:14He just breaks it into little pieces and remakes it.

05:17And I've made a concerted effort to try to make films in genres that I love.

05:23The problem with that is, you're also playing in the arena with the greatest films ever made.

05:28So when you make a gangster movie, you know, you're in the wake of Jean-Pierre Melville

05:36and, of course, Mr. Scorsese and Francis Coppola and Jacques Goriat.

05:41So that's hard.

05:43And then when you make a movie in the Western genre, it's Hawks and it's John Ford and Clint

05:49Eastwood and Leone.

05:51So I haven't made it easy for myself.

05:53But those are genres that I love and that I really want to explore.

05:57And hopefully I come at it at a, you know, with a little bit of a different angle or unexpected,

06:01which is what I've tried to do with Springsteen and certainly with Crazy Heart, because music

06:07was my first love to be able to tell these two stories.

06:10But I try to mix it up as much as possible, not in terms of a concerted effort, so much

06:17as to what interests me and how can I improve as a director.

06:23Sure.

06:23What, Crazy Heart was your first movie as a director, and that was in the musical vein.

06:29Like I mentioned, it even won an Oscar for a song.

06:33And Jeff Bridges playing a kind of down and out country singer.

06:37So there's that.

06:38I would think after that, because it was very successful, you know, won Academy Awards,

06:44that's for your first film, that they would offer you similar kinds of things and say,

06:49okay, you did that, now try 12 more music movies.

06:53And they did, Pete.

06:55If I've learned anything about Hollywood, it's they want you to continue-

06:58Whatever you did.

06:59Whatever it was that was successful.

07:02Miles Davis, Chet Baker, The Grateful Dead, Elvis.

07:07Wow.

07:08Many others.

07:09And I felt like, gosh, if I do that, all I'm ever going to make is music films, which

07:13is why I then wrote the kind of searing family drama, Out of the Furnace, which was my first

07:18film of three with Christian Bale.

07:22But there are a couple of, I suppose, other either bands or musicians that I would like

07:31to explore that I haven't.

07:33And if I were ever going to make a film about Elvis Presley, it would be the last day in

07:38the life of Elvis Presley.

07:39Wow.

07:40You know, when Elvis is playing racquetball at 3 a.m. or visiting the dentist, you know,

07:45or watching old musical performances of his, those sort of things.

07:50That'd be wild.

07:51Yes.

07:52And I was always fascinated by Gay Talisa's article about Frank Sinatra.

07:58Frank Sinatra has a cold.

07:59Like, that's something I would love to make.

08:01You know, something that feels a little bit outside the box.

08:04Scorsese's been trying to do Sinatra forever.

08:06Oh, well.

08:07And they won't let him.

08:08Is that right?

08:09His estate, Tina Sinatra, that's you, Tina, will not give him permission.

08:14So he's finally pretty much given up on it, at least for now, unless they change their tune.

08:20I didn't know that.

08:20That's terrible.

08:21Unless they change their tune and give them those songs.

08:23Huh.

08:23Yeah, well, that's, that's, come on, Tina.

08:27Please, it's Mr. Scorsese.

08:29So that brings us to, okay, so Crazy Hearts, now you're back in a music mode here, obviously,

08:35with Springsteen, Deliver Me From Nowhere.

08:39So what was the impetus?

08:41Because this, to me, is obvious, it's not a biopic.

08:45No.

08:45I called it in my review the anti-biopic.

08:48That's what it is, essentially.

08:50This is really taking a slice of his life after he's a huge star and after huge success

08:57and on the cover of Time and Newsweek and all of that happened and watching a man going

09:03through severe emotional and everything, other kind of trauma in his life.

09:09Yeah.

09:10Well, you know, it's, it's kind of lore in my circles that Bruce Springsteen has said

09:14no to every film about his life since 1986.

09:17Yeah.

09:18Bruce is a cinephile.

09:19He loves movies.

09:20Seen all of mine and some of them he's said a couple of times.

09:23My father introduced my musical tastes at a very young age, introduced me to, to jazz

09:31and bluegrass and, and, um, uh, classic country music.

09:37Right.

09:38And my introduction to Bruce Springsteen through my father was the album Nebraska.

09:45Oh, yeah.

09:45And, uh, as a disaffected 18 year old who wasn't quite sure of his place in the world,

09:50um, that album came to me at the, at the right time.

09:55So when I read Warren Zanes's wonderful, uh, telling of, of Bruce's making Nebraska, the

10:00book delivering me from nowhere, um, I said, I can make that film because it isn't a biopic.

10:07It's about a very narrow and intimate and specific time in Bruce's life, the most painful chapter

10:12in Bruce's life where he's at his personal low suffering through what became clinically

10:20diagnosed as depression, which you didn't know that.

10:22Right.

10:23While also at his creative best, because not only is he writing what I think is one of

10:27the, the best albums of the last 50 years in Nebraska, he's concurrently writing what

10:34would become born in the USA.

10:37Yeah.

10:37His largest selling album at 30 million units.

10:41Right.

10:42So I thought, how can I tell a story about a man who, when you go into the cinema, you

10:50think this is a film about Bruce Springsteen.

10:52And when you leave, you're saying, I hope this is a story about me because we all suffer

10:59through, uh, mental health struggles.

11:02Yeah.

11:03I think for those of us who work in the arts, you're always saying to yourself, how can I

11:10be as honest as possible in my work, as truthful in my work, as personal in my work, how can

11:17I defy expectations, which in your, uh, questions, exactly what Bruce did, you expect Bruce to,

11:23to continue to chase the roar of arenas and hit songs, but he has the courage to look inward.

11:28Yeah.

11:29And retreat into a, a bedroom in his rental house in Clutchneck, New Jersey.

11:33No backup band, nothing.

11:35No.

11:35So, so I thought, how can I really make a psychological drama about the art of creation?

11:42Right.

11:42And truly it's a film about a neglected soul who repairs himself through music.

11:50Um, it just so happens to be about Bruce Springsteen.

11:53There you go.

11:54Yeah.

11:54So, so I hope folks, um, uh, uh, come into, you know, into this film.

12:01Look, Bruce Springsteen is, is a legend.

12:03He's an icon.

12:04I strip away the iconography and the mythology.

12:07Yeah.

12:08But people have real ownership over Bruce.

12:10I've seen it at his shows.

12:11I've, I've, I've seen it through this process.

12:13So I hope is that they come in with no preconceived notions and just give themselves over to the

12:18film as opposed to wanting a different film.

12:20Yeah.

12:21But we'll see how that plays out.

12:23Uh, thankfully, you know, the people who've seen it really, uh, seem to respond to it.

12:27And most importantly for me, um, Bruce Springsteen has seen the movie now 12 times.

12:3312 times.

12:34And he was on the set all the time, right?

12:36And he really loves the movie.

12:37So that's, that's my, that's, that's most gratifying to me.

12:40Yeah.

12:41I mean, when you're doing something about a living person, there are all kinds of minefields

12:47that you could walk on.

12:49I can't imagine.

12:51And, you know, somebody like him, but you know, uh, they did it with Coal Miner's Daughter

12:55with Loretta Lynn.

12:56One of the best of all time.

12:57Yeah.

12:58And she was there.

12:59And, and similarly to this, your lead performer, in that case, Sissy Spacek, in this case, Jeremy

13:04Ella White, did all the, the songs.

13:08Yes.

13:08You know, so it's not, we're not seeing, you know, Bohemian Rhapsody in other words here.

13:13No, um, no, uh, Jeremy White, uh, it's, it's kind of shocking.

13:19Like when I cast him, I knew that I would get the quiet intensity, the vulnerability.

13:25Yeah.

13:25He has this kind of blue collar, uh, physicality that Bruce has.

13:29Yeah.

13:29Um, he has the humility that Bruce has.

13:32He, he clearly has the swagger.

13:34Right.

13:34You know, they don't teach in acting school.

13:36Yeah.

13:36You have that or you don't.

13:38What I did not know was how well he could sing.

13:41Yeah.

13:42And he went through seven months of very, of a very humbling process of becoming Bruce

13:47Springsteen.

13:48And we didn't want mimicry or imitation.

13:50Yeah.

13:50Cosplay as you see in, in so many of these.

13:53Yeah.

13:53I wanted somebody who could capture the, the emotional truth of Bruce, the essence, the

13:58spirit.

13:58I just didn't realize he was going to sing and play and guitar and play harmonica and move

14:03like Bruce.

14:03I mean, it's, it's a shocking transformation and, uh, I, I can't speak highly enough about

14:09his performance and, and, and, and Bruce and John Landau, who's, who's Bruce's long time

14:14manager.

14:15Yeah.

14:1550 years played by Jeremy Strong.

14:17When he came to the city, Scott, he said, Scott, this is uncanny.

14:20Yeah.

14:21I can't believe this, what I'm seeing.

14:23Yeah.

14:23So that's really heartening.

14:24It's amazing.

14:25I love the relationship between John Landau and Bruce Springsteen, you know.

14:29Unrivaled.

14:30Yeah.

14:30That, that, that manager, very protective, you know, the gatekeeper.

14:35I do remember years ago when I worked on entertainment tonight, I was shared an office with a guy

14:40named Doug Herzog, who was our music producer and I was the movie producer and I heard him

14:46on the phone talking to John Landau one day.

14:50That's probably around 1984, maybe.

14:53So that's born in the USA when that was released.

14:55Yeah.

14:55And he's, he's doing something and he says, and you know, and he's going like, so great.

14:59So we'll come and shoot a little bit of it and all of that.

15:01Because Bruce was very interview shy, he says, maybe we can get a few minutes with Bruce,

15:06you know, just before.

15:07I saw him sheepishly asking him and they got it.

15:11And I'm thinking to myself, oh my God, you know, you got through the gatekeeper here.

15:16That was a real triumph for us at that time.

15:19Well, John was, was, was the first rock critic at Rolling Stone.

15:24Yeah.

15:24He was a movie critic.

15:25Yeah.

15:26He was, uh, for a short time married to Janet Maslin, the great, uh, New York times.

15:30Oh yeah.

15:30Don't critic.

15:31Yeah.

15:31He knows movies, but I'll tell you this, I've never seen someone who protects his artist

15:39like he has.

15:40Right.

15:40And as you see in the film, he's much more than a manager.

15:43He's an artistic collaborator.

15:45He's a protector.

15:46He's a father figure.

15:48Yeah.

15:49And most importantly, he's a part-time therapist because of getting Bruce into therapy saved

15:55his life.

15:56Yeah.

15:57And, and I've seen Bruce now, uh, touring countless times and Bruce comes off stage and

16:03the first person who meets him as though it's the first time he's seen him is John Landau.

16:09And John, of course, wrote in 1973 in the famous essay, he said, I've seen the future

16:13of rock and roll and his name is Bruce Springsteen.

16:16Yeah.

16:17And 50 years later long, he's still with him.

16:19It's amazing.

16:20It's incredible.

16:20You know, that there's-

16:21It's a one of one relationship in all of rock music.

16:24Yeah.

16:24And Jeremy's great in, in, you know, the scene-

16:27Jeremy Strong.

16:28Yeah.

16:29It's fabulous.

16:30Both Jeremy's, but yeah, Jeremy.

16:31Well, because Jeremy Strong normally is, you know, the, the American in the world, uh,

16:36populist has seen Jeremy Strong play Kendall Roy.

16:39Right.

16:39He's seen him play Trump's fixer, Roy Cohn.

16:42Right.

16:42Men who were callous and venal and cold and calculating.

16:46Yeah.

16:46You know, Jeremy's a longtime friend of mine.

16:49He was, he was cut out, but he was in my film, Black Mass.

16:52And I wanted to give audiences a different look at Jeremy.

16:57Someone who's warm, compassionate, very caring and loving, but also a fierce protector.

17:02Yeah.

17:03A man of high emotional intelligence and intellect and erudite.

17:09And I think he's very tender and is very restrained and a wonderful performance.

17:13Why was he cut out of Black Mass?

17:16He wasn't very good.

17:18No, I'm just kidding.

17:19He was amazing.

17:20No, no.

17:21That, Jeremy's amazing.

17:22That, the, the, the sequence just didn't, uh, the sequence just didn't fit into the,

17:26uh, the narrative because towards the end as I was truncating the story.

17:29Right.

17:29Actually, Jeremy's really quite good in that movie.

17:31That was, that was tough.

17:32Yeah.

17:32But, uh, no, Jeremy's, I mean, he's one of the best actors working.

17:36How hard is that to, you get your movie, you have it in your script, you shoot these

17:40scenes and then you go, what is good for the movie versus, you know, what you had envisioned?

17:46Yeah, well, it's, it's always hard because you, you know, if you write your movies like

17:50I do, you, you, you write the film and you rewrite it when you shoot it and then you rewrite

17:55it yet again when you're cutting it.

17:57Right.

17:57And the movie very often will tell you what it should be in terms of its running time,

18:02in terms of, of, of, of its story.

18:04And, um, when my father was at the University of Virginia, his English teacher was William

18:10Faulkner.

18:11Right.

18:11And Faulkner said to my father, as he said, so publicly and famously that you have to kill

18:17your darlings in order to determine if a story is really good.

18:21Yeah.

18:21And that for me is one of the hardest things to do in, in filmmaking process.

18:27Um, but ultimately a film will tell you what it wants.

18:30You also have to think about, I, I do how audiences today, they interpret and receive films differently.

18:38Right.

18:38Because we are constantly bombarded with stimuli, we're overloaded with content and I, it feels

18:47like we're living life in 15 and 20 second increments.

18:52Oh yeah.

18:53On our phones.

18:54Yeah.

18:54So if you sit somebody down in front of a buried Linden.

18:57Right.

18:57Or Tarkovsky's stalker.

19:00I mean, you know, you'll get some walkouts or people who are just bored because people

19:04are so accustomed to watching things while also doing this.

19:07So they're double screening it.

19:08Yep.

19:09And sometimes at the same time.

19:11Oh no, they are.

19:12Annoyingly.

19:13Oh no.

19:13Yeah.

19:14So, so, you know, all of those things sort of come into, into play, but it's really about

19:18telling this story in this purest sense.

19:21The movie will tell you what it needs, what should be excluded and you just hope you get

19:26it right.

19:27Yeah.

19:27How do we get that generation that, who spend their life looking at a screen?

19:32I do walks every day by the ocean.

19:34I live down by the beach and, you know, beautiful ocean, everything there.

19:38And they're walking by and they're always looking like this.

19:41Like not even paying attention.

19:42Not even paying attention.

19:43You know, I don't know what kind of generations.

19:48Thankfully, my daughters, um, really love cinema from a young age.

19:53They've loved movies.

19:54They've loved the inappropriate movie night at the Coopers from young ages.

19:59So I think because our lives are so heavily filtered and so heavily curated where everyone's

20:06trying to put forth, you know, the best version of themselves.

20:10Yeah.

20:10My hope is that people kind of do what Bruce did in the film, which is to live a very

20:14analog, very truthful, uh, uh, sense of their life, put down their phones and reconnect.

20:19Yeah.

20:20Because it's, I think it's leading to great division.

20:22Right.

20:23Obviously.

20:23Yeah.

20:24Uh, there's a loneliness epidemic.

20:26I mean, when was the last time you were, were in the airport and you saw somebody reading

20:30a novel?

20:31I mean, so often you go to the airport and you see a family of four, they aren't even

20:35interacting.

20:35They're just all doing this.

20:36Yeah.

20:37You know, of course I'm guilty of, of, uh, you know, a news junkie, but, but I, I try

20:41to be, for someone who has no social media presence at all, I try to be incredibly present

20:46and, you know, because my livelihood depends on people actually leaving their house to come

20:53to a cinema.

20:54Yeah.

20:55You think to yourself, how can you get people out to, to come see movies that may transport

21:00you, uh, which as they did to me, which is why I became the filmmaker, in ways that you

21:05can't get from your telephone.

21:06Right.

21:07Exactly.

21:08And, uh, that's hopefully what, what this movie will do, because right now it's very

21:13hard post, uh, pandemic, post, uh, Hollywood strikes, post everything that's gone on, uh,

21:20to get people back in the, the habit that they once seemed to have.

21:25If it's not a sequel or, or prequel or raining glass and concrete.

21:29If it's original.

21:30Yeah.

21:31Yeah.

21:31It's, it's hard.

21:32Um, Pete and, and my fear is that if, if people don't come back to the cinema, then, uh, we're

21:38going to have fewer films because studios aren't going to want to invest in that.

21:41Um, and I think our culture, generally speaking, we'll all be lesser for it because cinema has,

21:47has changed my life.

21:49Um, uh, just, uh, this week I was in, uh, Lyon, France at the Lumiere festival where, where

21:57cinema began.

21:58Yeah.

21:58You know, in a city where it's, it's, it's, it embodies the soul of cinema and it just reminds

22:03you of how much movies play such an important and integral part of our lives.

22:08Yeah.

22:09Um, and, and, and, and I'm not disparaging television in any way, but there's something

22:13about being in a darkened cinema surrounded by strangers watching people bring to life

22:21things that, that, that make us human.

22:24Yeah.

22:25And that connect us.

22:26And I don't understand why that's not something that's as, as important as it once was.

22:30And I, I just think we're worse for it.

22:32I, I do too.

22:33And you don't get that sound at home, you know, you sit on your couch.

22:36Oh, I don't care how good your system is.

22:37It's never going to be the same as watching.

22:39It's never going to be like that, you know, all of that.

22:41Yeah.

22:41I'm a big, uh, uh, fan of cinema, obviously.

22:44And I'm, I'm hopeful, you know, that.

22:46Yeah, me too.

22:47Because my daughter's generation, they, I noticed they're putting these down and they

22:51want the human connection.

22:52They love going to the movies.

22:54My girls would go to the movies every weekend if there were movies, enough movies for them.

22:58Right.

22:58Yeah.

22:58I love it.

22:59I, I know, you know, but hopefully this one.

23:02Now, as I recall, certainly when it was, uh, in production, it was just called Deliver

23:08Me From Nowhere.

23:09Yes.

23:10Based on Warren's book.

23:11Based on the book.

23:12And then they tacked on the name Springsteen.

23:14Is that because, why is that?

23:16Well, my very first draft, um, was titled Simply Springsteen.

23:22Ah.

23:22And then, and then underneath it, subtitled Deliver Me From Nowhere, As You See It.

23:26Yeah.

23:27Interestingly, as I, uh, as the movie was playing out last year, the, uh, Bob Dylan picture

23:33by James Mangold, A Complete Unknown.

23:35Yeah.

23:36I noticed that people would always say to me, hey, have you seen the Dylan movie?

23:39Or what do you think of the Dylan movie?

23:40I said, you mean A Complete Unknown?

23:42Yeah.

23:42The title.

23:43And, uh, I noticed that, that, uh, uh, that, that I, I imagined people might do the same

23:50thing.

23:51Um, what, what's the, the Springsteen movie?

23:53Yeah.

23:53Deliver Me From Nowhere, which is a lyric in State Trooper.

23:57Right.

23:57The record, Nebraska.

23:58So I, I simplified it, simply Springsteen.

24:02But I, here's why I did it.

24:03Yeah.

24:03Because even though this is not a cradle to present day, uh, narrative.

24:08Right.

24:08I said to Bruce, if people can understand that during this most formative time in your

24:14life, the lowest time, the most painful chapter in your life, if they understand this about

24:19you, what you've endured in terms of, uh, uh, dealing with all and facing this, this

24:24unresolved trauma, they will gain an understanding of exactly who Bruce Springsteen is in a way

24:30that will speak to what came before Nebraska, what came after Nebraska, and a much bigger,

24:36bigger aperture of who brings Bruce Springsteen is.

24:40Yeah.

24:40So just to have the title, Springsteen, Deliver Me From Nowhere.

24:43Yeah.

24:44And, uh, you know, and I, hopefully, hopefully it works, you know.

24:48Well, we'll see you on Friday.

24:49On the right, on the right way, it should work.

24:51Yeah.

24:52No, I think so.

24:52I hope so.

24:53I mean, I, I'm, I'm incredibly heartened by, um, by the response.

24:57The movie debuted in Telluride, and what I love about that festival is you can intervene

25:02with, with, uh, the film audience in ways you can't at other festivals.

25:07Yeah.

25:07And the amount of people who came to me just on the street to say, you know, Scott, the

25:11movie really touched me in a very human and personal way.

25:14Yeah.

25:15Um, my father never told me he loved me.

25:17Right.

25:18My father never told me he was proud of me.

25:20Yeah.

25:20Um, you know, had my father seen this film, it might've removed the stigma of mental, uh,

25:27illness and, and men dealing with it because men of a certain era, Bruce Springsteen's

25:32era and before, as we've seen his father played so beautifully by Stephen Graham.

25:36Yeah.

25:37These men are afraid to give voice to their pain.

25:40They're afraid, uh, they are, they don't know how, uh, they would rather just deal internally

25:45with this depression.

25:46And, and, and that leads to some incredibly severe consequences for themselves, for the

25:50families, people they interact with.

25:52So I, I, I'm hopeful that, that people will see the film and say to themselves, if Bruce

25:58Springsteen, who outwardly should have everything in his life, yet still deals with this, and

26:04in, in a very low and dark time in his life is able to get the help and transcend and continue

26:10to leave a rich and full life that maybe they can too, Pete.

26:13Yeah.

26:13And I'm glad you made the decision to film all those scenes with Stephen Graham and the young

26:18actor who plays the younger Springsteen in black and white.

26:22Well, thank you.

26:23I'll tell you why, because when I, when I, when I said to Bruce, I said, Bruce, tell me

26:26about how you, in 1982, imagine accessing this time, your father who was very cold and

26:35dispassionate towards you.

26:37And he said, Scott, I always saw him in black and white.

26:39All of the images, he said, that's why the cover of Nebraska is in black and white.

26:45That's why all the images inside the liner notes of me are in black and white.

26:50Wow.

26:51And I said, well, Bruce, that's how I wanted to reimagine your relationship to your father.

26:57And he says, Scott, I think it's the only way.

26:59And that's why I did it.

27:01It's perfect.

27:01Yeah.

27:01And I contrasted that with the more kind of, you know, garage rock aesthetic of 1982,

27:07where there's more movement in the camera because Bruce is in such disequilibrium.

27:11And I wanted the audience to, to kind of subconsciously feel that as opposed to the

27:16very formalist black and white, uh, imagery from, uh, Bruce's, uh, life at seven and eight

27:21years old.

27:22So I'm glad you liked that.

27:24It was something.

27:25Thank you, man.

27:25And when you made this movie, you yourself went through some severe family trauma would

27:32be the word, I think.

27:33Uh, can you talk about that in the scheme of making a movie and having this stuff happen

27:40to you?

27:41Yeah.

27:41This was, uh, along with many people who live in the Los, greater Los Angeles area,

27:46the toughest year of my life, as I mentioned earlier, my father introduced me to Bruce Springsteen

27:51in Nebraska.

27:52Yeah.

27:52And the day before I started shooting the movie, my father died.

27:55Uh-huh.

27:55And, uh, his spirit kind of carried me through production until we got to the last week of

28:03production where I was, uh, directing the big concert scene of Born to Run as, as well

28:09as the final reconciliation scene with, um, Bruce and his father backstage.

28:15Yeah.

28:15And I get the devastating news that, uh, like so many others, my house in the Pacific

28:21Palisades has burned.

28:23Yeah.

28:24So I took a few minutes, made certain that my wife and, and daughters and dogs were,

28:29were, uh, safely, uh, sequestered in a hotel and, and went over into a corner and, and

28:35in a dark corner and thought, you know, how can I get through this lowest, uh, moment of

28:40my life?

28:40And Bruce comes to me who happened to be there on that day.

28:44And he said, look, Scott, take the girls and the dogs, move them into my house in Los

28:49Angeles and live there until you get on your feet, which we did.

28:53Wow.

28:53My younger daughter, Stella's guitar burned.

28:56What does Bruce Springsteen do?

28:58He sends her one of his.

29:00And from Jeremy White to Jeremy Strong, Stephen Graham, Odessa Young, the entire, uh, crew

29:08cast, uh, 20th century studios, Bob Iger, David Greenbaum, Alan Bergman, these men really supported

29:18me at my lowest.

29:19And, uh, thankfully I have this film after such a hard year.

29:24Yeah.

29:24And I hope that it touches people.

29:26Uh, I also hope Pete that I never have to go through something like that again.

29:30Oh, no, but man, look what came out of it is really extraordinary here too.

29:37Well, I'm, I'm glad the movie's touching people.

29:39Yeah.

29:40I'm glad that Bruce and John Landau love the movie as much as they do.

29:43As I mentioned, Bruce has seen it 12 times, I think John 11th and that's, that's really

29:48the gift for me and, and, and I hope people come out to see it because, you know, at some

29:53point it, it will be your last film.

29:55I hope this is not it, you know, I hope that people come out to see the movie.

29:58Oh, I, that, that's my last question to ask you here.

30:01What is your next film?

30:03Cause I know this isn't your last film.

30:05Well.

30:06It isn't.

30:08Um, you know, I've, I've, I've been lucky in my career that I've had, uh, four other

30:13directors produce my movies.

30:15Uh, Robert Duvall.

30:17Oh yeah.

30:17Many films produced Crazy Heart.

30:19Uh, Ridley and his brother, Tony Scott produced Out of the Furnace.

30:22Ah, yeah.

30:23Guillermo del Toro produced, uh, Antlers.

30:25Antlers.

30:25And Michael Mann, who has been a, uh, a mentor of mine who, who really loves this film, who

30:32comes in and sees my movies and, and offers me lots of suggestions, uh, has, has come to

30:39me to direct, uh, uh, one of his longtime passion projects that he wrote with the great Eric

30:48Roth in the film.

30:49Oh.

30:50Who I just ran into yesterday.

30:51Oh.

30:52Wonderful writer.

30:53Legend like yourself.

30:54Yeah.

30:55Eric Roth's 80 years old now.

30:56He's an amazing guy.

30:57Yeah.

30:58He's remarkable.

30:59Yeah.

31:00And Michael has asked me to direct a project called Comanche.

31:04Oh, okay.

31:05It's about the Cynthia Ann Parker kidnapping, young, uh, white girl in Texas who was kidnapped

31:12at eight years old and became assimilated into Comanche life and, um, gave birth to the

31:19great, uh, Comanche, uh, warrior, Quanah Parker.

31:22And then she's rescued.

31:24Right.

31:25And upon her rescue, she wants to have nothing to do with, um, white American life in Texas,

31:35but wants to re-assimilate back into Comanche life.

31:38Oh, okay.

31:39And the screenplay is extraordinary as you might expect from Michael Mann and Eric Roth.

31:45Yeah.

31:45And it's also the basis for the John Ford movie, The Searchers.

31:50Yeah.

31:50It definitely sounds like that.

31:52Yeah.

31:52So for Michael to come to me, to ask me to direct that is, uh, one of the great gifts

31:58and highlights for me.

31:59Um, so I hope Pete, at some point we can pull that one together.

32:04Oh, that would be great.

32:06I would love to see that.

32:07So would I.

32:08And, uh, just keep turning them out, man.

32:10Oh, thank you.

32:11It gets harder and harder, but I'm so thankful that, that, uh, that I'm able to work with such

32:16a wonderful crew and, and, and the studio in 20th century, um, and have people like Michael

32:21Mann and Terrence Malick and, you know, directors from, uh, a different, uh, generation who have

32:28long supported me, uh, William Friedkin and Cimino before they passed.

32:32Uh, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm incredibly lucky at Ridley.

32:36Um, it's, it's, it's nice.

32:38It feels like, uh, they're, they're kind of, uh, not only handing down a lot of great advice

32:44and wisdom, but passing, uh, you know, mantle in some, in, in some small way.

32:50100%.

32:51Scott Cooper.

32:52Thanks for joining us.

32:53Pete.

32:53I love being with you.

32:54I love being with you.

Scott Cooper | Behind The Lens

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