Vučić: Serbia open to resuming ammunition sales to Europe after export stop
In a wide-ranging interview with Euronews, Serbian President Vučić approved ammunition sales to EU countries, even if they end up in Ukraine. He also defended his position not to join EU sanctions against Russia, which complicates Serbia’s bid to become an EU member.
READ MORE : http://www.euronews.com/2025/11/05/vucic-serbia-open-to-resuming-ammunition-sales-to-europe-after-export-stop
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00:00Hello and welcome to the Europe Conversation. I'm Stefan Grobe. My guest today is the President
00:13of Serbia, Aleksandar Vucic, a man whose political journey in American News Magazine once described
00:20as from nationalist hawk to devout Europeanist. Mr. President, thank you so much for joining
00:27us today. I'm privileged to be with you here. The article I was referring to was from 2014.
00:34Are you still a devout Europeanist? In the meantime, I became a usual suspect. But as a matter of fact,
00:44I'm pro-European oriented. Now, Serbia is an interesting country. People love Donald Trump
00:52and people are also very fond of Vladimir Putin. I wonder, is there any excitement for Europe or
01:00European leaders? We never see any European flags during the protests. I'm not a leader of protests,
01:08at least, but there is a very rational explanation for that. First of all, Serbs, they have always
01:22been pro-Republican oriented, speaking about United States elections, because we believe that we
01:30suffered a lot from Democratic administration in 1999 and even after that. And that's why people
01:40very much welcomed President Trump's victory. And it's very obvious that he has a very large scale of
01:52popularity in my country. At the same time, Russia has been a traditional ally of Serbia for not many decades,
02:05but for centuries. And that's another reason. Speaking about European leader, people are still very rational
02:14and they think that they think that EU path is the best way and the best path for Serbia in the future. But speaking about the leaders,
02:24I believe that people in my country, they do respect the President Kosta, Ursula von der Leyen as a commissioner leader,
02:37particularly because of different behavior, comparing to all the others, because she was visiting twice or even three times,
02:49not only Belgrade, but the other areas, southern part of Serbia, which is a very rare case. That's what our people
02:56really respect. I cannot make comparison in popularity, but if you ask people, there is a still majority of people
03:06that would like to join the European Union. Do you fear that Serbia becomes another Turkey, dwelling in the European
03:16waiting room forever? Serbia didn't open any single chapter, any single cluster in the last three and a half years.
03:26It very much coincides with the fact that at that time, war in Ukraine started.
03:34And we were the only country that did not impose sanctions against Russia, although we have always been very supportive
03:42to territorial integrity of Ukraine, to UN Charter, to UN resolutions. And we have always been condemning an incursion
03:53and everything that was going on on Ukrainian territory, but it was not enough.
03:58At the same time, I believe that we have to consider all the remarks, all the demands from the European Union.
04:08We need to change the level of our enthusiasm, the level of our energy, to understand what we were doing in a wrong way
04:18and to go much faster. Just to say a few words to your people here, when you say Serbia, it means comparing to Western Balkans,
04:29it is almost 55% of overall Western Balkans export to EU. Serbia is regarding that issue bigger than all the others altogether.
04:39Speaking about FDI attraction, last three years, Serbia was more than 60% of overall in attracting foreign direct investments than all the others in the Western Balkans, much bigger.
04:54And at the same time, yes, I know that we are facing thousands of doubts from different member states because of our relationship with Beijing, with Moscow.
05:10I cannot, and I'm not going to justify myself for talking with someone. I think it's really stupid and I'm not a pupil in an elementary school to tell you the truth.
05:20Because I believe that everybody should talk to each other and I think it's very healing and it doesn't mean that I agree with someone if I speak to someone.
05:32There's a lot to unpack here of what you said and we'll come to that in a minute.
05:36But first, when you travel across Europe, meeting people, meeting your counterparts, how would you rate the support and the excitement within the European Union for a Serbian membership?
05:53It's different. When I speak to Southerners, there is much bigger support. I'm going to meet President Macron in a few days again.
06:08I believe that we have had so far French support, Italian support. I was meeting Giorgio Meloni several times in the last 12 months.
06:16It's pretty much the same with Spain, Portuguese, Greek, and the others. It's a bit different when we go to Benelux countries and it's a bit different when we speak to Baltic countries and Scandinavian countries.
06:33We'll have German Minister of Foreign Affairs very soon in Belgrade, in a few days.
06:38I have spoken recently to Chancellor Merz. We had some good talks and I hope that we'll be able to be hosting him soon in Belgrade, which means January, February next year.
06:49When you were in China earlier this year, you told a Chinese interviewer that you didn't sleep the entire night before your talks with President Xi the next day.
07:02I wonder, do you experience the same sleeplessness before a day of talks with Ursula von der Leyen?
07:09You want to see this?
07:15I'm not a witty person at all. I believe that I'm at least from time to time too serious and very responsible.
07:24Yes, I cannot overcome this type of jitter as never ever and I do a lot of preparations and I was doing a lot of preparations last night for my meeting with Antonio Costa and I do my best to analyze, to scrutinize everything, to learn by heart what is necessary and I'm not ashamed to say this.
07:48From time to time I act as a student, you know, because I believe that I should be well prepared and at least not to be surprised in any kind of discussion I might have and this is not going to be changed.
08:05And I believe in speaking to Chinese president, it's a great opportunity for the leader, small guy from a very proud country that might deliver messages that he needs and it's the same when I speak to Ursula, it's the same when I speak to Antonio.
08:25I know them and I met them more times than I was meeting presidency, but that's how it goes.
08:36Let's talk about foreign policy, a topic you're at loggerheads with the European Union.
08:43You have repeatedly supported Ukraine's territorial integrity, even saying that Crimea and Donbass are and will always be part of Ukraine.
08:53Yet, you oppose the EU's anti-Russian sanctions. Why?
08:58I do not oppose. We are not an EU member state. I cannot do anything on this. I cannot influence it.
09:08But you...
09:09But I can tell you...
09:10Are you saying you would support them once you're in the EU?
09:12No, no, I can tell you, but we are not a member of the EU. But we were not... Nobody asked us about anything.
09:19They just tell us, you have to align with that. We were under sanctions for many years and it actually harmed ordinary people.
09:30It has always been the case and it did not bring the very best result.
09:34And I have some doubts about the outcome of huge sanction packages that were imposed against Russia in the last three and a half or four years, whatever.
09:52But we had no influence on that.
09:58Speaking about Ukrainian territorial integrity, it means that we observe UN Charter, UN resolutions and all the values of international public law.
10:16That's how it goes.
10:17That's the way we protect our territorial integrity.
10:21And also, it's easy to rebook.
10:24It's easy to scold small countries like Serbia, which are not a member of the club.
10:33Because you have a usual suspect, you have always a good culprit for everything.
10:39And even the commissioner was saying, it's not fair, it's not good, it's not nice if he goes to Moscow.
10:45So, I had to go, I had to go, I had to take care of vital issues for my people and for my country.
10:54That was of an utmost super interest of my people and of my country.
10:59But I didn't hear that she was mentioning or anybody else was mentioning many other European leaders.
11:06And I'm not speaking about Viktor Orban.
11:08Many other European leaders that were speaking to Putin in the meantime.
11:12And I went there after three years of war, not before that.
11:18And I wanted to discuss our bilateral issues.
11:22Did not interfere into this big war agenda, big issues, because I know my place, I know the place of my country.
11:31And I think it's a very fair response.
11:34And as you can see, I say what I think to you here.
11:39I say the same in my country.
11:41I say it everywhere.
11:42You said last week in an interview with a German media outlet that Serbia was ready to sell ammunition to EU countries,
11:50even if Ukraine received it.
11:53We were discussing that five years ago.
11:55We were discussing that five and four and three years ago.
11:58And I was saying to them, I was saying to them the following.
12:02Here's the story.
12:03We are able to produce, let's say, 155 to 160,000 of different type of shells.
12:14Motor shells, 60 millimeters, 80, 81, 82 millimeters, both Soviet NATO calibers, 120 millimeters.
12:36which is still equal or a bit more than France.
12:42And I said to them, we have 30,000 people that are dependent on our ability to sell this ammunition to someone.
12:56Now it's a good market.
12:58Whatever we produce, we can sell it.
13:00But when we sell it, then we got, but no one mentioned that here, because it didn't fit to their story.
13:07Today, we got two very strong statements from Russian foreign intelligence against Serbia and myself.
13:17Because they found some shells on Ukrainian side.
13:21Is that why they halted the exports in June?
13:24That was one of the reasons, because we didn't want to arm up any war infections.
13:31But now we have a problem, because we need to sell it to someone, and we'll sell it to whomever we can in order to earn some money.
13:44But we'll try to take care and not to see that ammunition in that war zone.
13:53But it happens from time to time.
13:56At the end, at the end, we'll have to pay our workers.
14:03Okay.
14:04So, we've heard...
14:05Tell me, is there something that is not rational?
14:09No, no, absolutely.
14:10I'm not saying you're irrational.
14:11But I just wonder, what is the change of heart?
14:13When in June, you ban the exports, and now you're saying we're ready to...
14:19It's not a change.
14:20We need to survive.
14:21I'm not saying that we are going to give it to Russians or to Ukrainians.
14:25I say that we need to sell it to someone in the world.
14:28Okay.
14:28Speaking of survival, your country was once seen as a frontrunner in the race of EU membership.
14:34Before the war in Ukraine.
14:36Before the war in Ukraine.
14:37But now the EU Commission is saying there's a backsliding of the rule of law in Serbia, insufficient reform, and no detectable progress.
14:46It's not seen in report.
14:47Now, my question is, is the EU too harsh on Serbia?
14:51I would like to say that, but I promised myself not to do it.
15:00Yes.
15:02I do my best to keep my word.
15:05They asked me to change my narrative, otherwise I would say so.
15:09But I'm not going to do it.
15:13It means that now let me use this great, even Euronews bureaucratic language.
15:21And you can see that I'm still able to learn it.
15:27Serbia is very much committed to its EU path and will take it in a very serious and responsible way.
15:37All the remarks, all the demands from EU partners and considering it will change our attitudes and our stances on different issues.
15:50And we'll improve our behavior in the future.
15:55And we hope that the European Union will notice it.
15:58Thank you very much.
16:03EU Commissioner Kost said that Serbia has too much presidential power.
16:09And that everything about enlargement is done by the president and that's bad.
16:17What do you say?
16:17What do you say to that?
16:18I fully agree with her.
16:20See, I've learned a lesson.
16:26Okay.
16:28Good news is I'm not going to be the president within a year and a month.
16:3513 months.
16:37That's the good news.
16:38Then some other people will do it.
16:40Okay.
16:41I want to talk, one question if I may, sir, about the domestic situation.
16:46We've been seeing protests for a year now.
16:50We've been seeing protests for 11 years in Serbia.
16:56All right.
16:56Following the Novi Sad catastrophe.
16:58My question is, are you worried that things might get out of hand, that there is an escalation of the protests?
17:08And also, if I may, do you think that the country is changing faster than you have thought?
17:16Our country, I'm amazed by the changes that we provided.
17:22You, dear Stefan, come to Belgrade, you wouldn't recognize the city, not from your own experience, but not even from the photos you've seen.
17:34Each time, let's say, my friend Mario David is coming to Belgrade, he has to realize and to acknowledge that he hasn't seen such a big improvement and changes almost in any other country, not only in our region.
17:54According to IMF anticipation, Serbia is going to have the biggest growth rate almost in an entire Europe in the next four years.
18:07Speaking about protests, I was facing protests since I became the Prime Minister in 2014.
18:13Before that, I was Deputy Prime Minister for two years.
18:15Since then, we had maybe altogether six months without protests, but even having in mind all this stuff, we were progressing well with good growth rates.
18:30Also, I need to tell you one thing.
18:32When I became the Prime Minister, public debt, just to see how disciplined we were, public debt to GDP ratio in Serbia was 79%.
18:41Now it's 43%, twice less than average European public debt to GDP ratio.
18:49And for the first time in our history, and the only country in an entire region, we got an investment grade from Fitch, and we are getting it from Standard as well, and I believe within six months from Moody's as well.
19:03It speaks for itself.
19:05Speaking about the reports, you see everything about economy and fiscal and financial stability, great grades, great marks, which is of and utmost importance for the people, for the citizens.
19:21And I really mean, I'll put my jokes aside, I really mean that we need many things to do regarding rule of law, and we're ready to participate in that process, or at least to be helpful to the government.
19:37And I think that Serbia has long legs, and that we can overtake all the frontrunners of today, and that we can join the European Union relatively soon.
19:49Alexander Vujicic, president of Serbia, thank you so much for coming on the show today.
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