00:00okay can we just talk about this like the guy who basically invented the image of american
00:04happiness right apple pie perfect families yeah and behind it all he's apparently battling like
00:11crippling anxiety deep depression even suicidal thoughts and borrowing money for a psychiatrist
00:17it's just wow it is the ultimate hollywood scandal totally the ultimate facade and uh
00:24get this he paints one single picture in 1964. just one and it's so controversial people are
00:32crying sending him hate mail death threats it nearly tanks his entire like 50-year career we
00:37are talking norman rockwell welcome everyone you're listening to the latest celebrity gossip
00:42i'm ainsley and i'm steve and today yeah we're diving deep peeling back the layers on america's
00:47favorite painter we're unpacking the whole hidden story of norman rockwell you know
00:51the artist showing everyone this perfect world while his own life was just a mess breakdowns
00:56really rough marriages and then this massive kind of shocking political turn late in life
01:01we've got all the latest reports the secrets he fought so hard to keep under wraps let's get into
01:06it so what's kind of wild is how fast he became huge like the original boy wonder right art editor
01:13for boy's life at 19 that's crazy yeah and then his first saturday evening post cover hits in 19 16.
01:19he's only 22 basically a superstar before he could even you know legally buy a drink but here's the
01:25twist the thing that gets me by 25 he's already saying he's burned out totally he apparently said
01:30something like all i had was the ability to draw which didn't count for much how how can you be that
01:36famous defining the whole country's vibe and feel like like you're nothing that insecurity is just
01:41staggering well that pressure the perfectionism yeah it was toxic definitely it led straight to his first
01:49big crash you mean the nervous breakdown exactly around 1920 still super young and remember those
01:53post covers some took him almost a year a whole year for one painting wow that level of detail
01:59it's psychologically just not sustainable right really and if he's working like that how does he
02:04even function i mean there are whispers right from the reports about stimulants amphetamines maybe
02:10yeah that's what some reports suggest to keep up that pace maintain the whole happy artist image
02:15it's uh the dark side of that kind of success and it gets worse oh yeah that feeling of being a fake
02:22it apparently peaked hard in 1933 he goes to europe sees the old masters and just spirals compares his
02:30stuff to theirs and calls himself a fraud sinks into this really deep depression and the sources say he
02:36actually considered ending things they do it got that dark which really makes you wonder you know yeah like
02:42if painting happiness makes you miserable why keep doing it what's the cost well maybe because he
02:47wasn't really painting reality at all he was painting what he wished was real yeah which uh kind of leads
02:52us to his personal life okay let's spill the tea on the marriages because the art is all happy families
02:58right yeah but the reality sounds like a train wreck twice a total painful contrast yeah first marriage
03:05irene o'connor 1916 super fast and later he admits pretty heartbreakingly after we'd been married a
03:10while i realized she didn't love me ouch but he stayed for 14 years she just dragged it out until
03:17she finally left him for someone else in 1930. okay so messy divorce and then he immediately marries again
03:23mary barstow right right away yeah 1930. but this marriage it was just defined by crisis reports say she had
03:31severe alcoholism really persistent deep depression so his home life was the exact opposite of his paintings
03:38constant stress fear unhappiness miles away from what he was selling america every week it got so bad
03:46actually they moved the whole family just dock bridge massachusetts exactly specifically so mary could be
03:52near the austin rig center which for anyone who doesn't know isn't just some clinic it's like world famous
03:58for serious psychiatric care and she was getting heavy duty treatment there like electroshock in the 1950s
04:03yeah it really shows how severe things were but the therapy that's where the big reveal comes from
04:08right his own therapy with eric erickson his famous psychoanalyst yeah erickson apparently laid it all
04:13bare for him basically told him well this amazing line what was it you paint your happiness but you
04:18don't live it boom right all those worm families perfect towns it was everything he wished he'd had
04:24growing up he felt like an outsider apparently had a cold mother so the paintings were just
04:30wish fulfillment yeah on a massive scale totally it wasn't just art it was deeply personal trying to
04:35paint the life he desperately wanted god the psychological price tag on that and the actual
04:40price tag too right for all that therapy oh yeah and if you connect that internal stuff to the external
04:46chaos you see the secrets pile up like the fire in 1943 unbelievable his whole studio just gone burned to
04:54the ground hundreds of paintings sketches props worth over like 1.5 million dollars today just poof and
05:02there were rumors it wasn't an accident arson yeah there was suspicion he'd apparently been fighting
05:06bitterly with a neighbor over property lines right before it happened so yeah drama and financially yeah he
05:12wasn't rolling in it even being norman rockwell shockingly no that professionism cost a fortune
05:18repainting agonizing over details reports say he often had to borrow from the bank no yeah and when
05:24he died he left behind something like fifty thousand dollars in unpaid therapy bills it's like what two
05:30hundred grand today around that yeah just think about that paying a massive premium for your own anxiety
05:35it's so modern in a weird way you imagine him as this icon but he's drowning in debt from his own
05:43perfectionism and the secrets just keep coming there was that 2013 biography citing his diaries
05:49making claims about hidden erotic drawings maybe even repressed desires possibly towards men wow okay
05:55that adds a whole other layer especially for the guy defining wholesome conservative family values for
06:01america just like his whole life was a performance a carefully built wall maybe and speaking of walls
06:07you know about the breaking home ties painting the one they found hidden behind a fake wall
06:12in some other guy's house in 2004 can you imagine we almost lost a 15 million dollar piece of his
06:17history it's a metaphor for his whole life hidden wall secrets this double existence exactly but even
06:23after all that the biggest professional bombshell was still waiting the really dangerous move the pivot
06:30when he finally snapped pretty much he's almost 70 he's done 47 years 321 covers for the saturday evening
06:37post and he walks why after all that time because they wouldn't let him paint black americans unless
06:44they were you know serving white people in subservient roles he literally said that kind of best of all
06:51possible world stuff was dead now good for him but risky hugely risky so he jumps ship to look magazine
06:59they give him freedom and his first big painting for them 1964 the problem we all live with bam that's the
07:05the ruby bridges painting right the little girl walking to school escorted by u.s marshals yeah
07:10and he didn't shy away from the ugliness there are slurs painted on the wall a splattered tomato
07:15it wasn't nostalgia anymore it was confrontation and people lost their minds instantly readers were
07:20furious thousands canceled their look subscriptions the hate mail was apparently horrific calling him a
07:24race traitor death threats all of it the public felt betrayed the guy who sold them the dream
07:30was now showing them the nightmare the uncomfortable truth it took incredible guts to do that especially
07:35at his age risking everything but he stuck with it he did he didn't back down paintings like murder
07:42in mississippi new kids in the neighborhood they show this real effort to like make amends for earlier
07:48stuff the stereotypes he later regretted it was a real redemption arc you know fueled by all that
07:54internal struggle so what does this all mean for us listening to this it's it's wild the master of american
07:59perfectionism was haunted deeply unhappy anxious but maybe all that chaos the therapy the pressure
08:06it ultimately gave him the strength late in life to risk it all to paint the truth instead of the
08:11fantasy exactly to paint civil rights to paint reality it's kind of a powerful reminder isn't it that
08:16sometimes the people selling the shiniest image are hiding the most turmoil but maybe that turmoil can
08:21also lead to something important necessary change well that's all the tea we have for today
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