00:00Forget the Soviet Union. I mean, what we did was in our national interest. At that time we were facing, we were boxed in by a US-China-Pakistan triangle. We had to find a way out of it. You don't approach the world about being fair and equitable when it comes to your national interest. On our national interest, our national interest prevails.
00:21Even today we are sometimes pressed by countries to take positions saying some great principle of international relations is involved. I asked them where were you when that principle applied to me. In the final analysis, national interest trumps everything else.
00:37The last issue, the comprehensive national power, bipolar, are we being agnostic or independent? Look, to some extent being agnostic is part of being independent. Because if you are not agnostic then you get pulled in by one side.
00:53But I do think that, I mean, I would argue that even in the past, the, the, you know, if we, I mean, you referred for example to the, to the Indo-Soviet relationship.
01:09I mean, even with the benefit of Indo-Soviet relationship, forget the Soviet Union. I mean, what we did was in our national interest. At that time we were facing, we were boxed in by a US-China-Pakistan triangle.
01:23We had to find a way out of it. This was not a time to say, oh, let me be neutral and this side has as much value as that side. There was only one side, that was our side.
01:33And that side dictated that whatever we had to do in our national interest, you don't approach the world about being fair and equitable when it comes to your national interest.
01:45On our national interest, our national interest prevails. So, the point there was, we took what was the right decision at that time in the midst of an acute national security crisis.
01:57And over the years, today, you know, we will take positions. Even today we are sometimes pressed by countries to take positions saying some great principle of international relations is involved.
02:12I asked them where were you when that principle applied to me. So, finally, you know, I'm not, you know, it is not my case that norms, rules, principles don't matter. They do. It is part of a stable management of the world.
02:30But in the final analysis, national interest trumps everything else. And to my mind, that should be the final test of foreign policy making.
02:43I mean, it has to be obviously explained and projected to different audiences in the best possible manner. But, you know, again, because you mentioned it's a bipolar world, I would urge you to look at projections.
03:02You know, the theme of this Aravalli conference is preparing for 2047. Please do look at what are fairly objective studies where India could be and should be by 2047. It doesn't look very bipolar to me. Thank you.
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