Why do men lead women's fashion?

FRANCE 24 English

With Paris Fashion Week upon us, we look at an industry that while largely targeting women, is rarely led by them. This year, just two women have been appointed as new creative directors of major fashion houses despite an incredible shake-up in the industry. So how is it that in 2025, men are still in charge of women's fashion? Annette Young is joined by Dana Thomas, a fashion journalist and Emilie Hammen, a fashion historian and the new director of Palais Galliera, to discuss the unstitching of progress in the industry. We also report on how body positivity, where models of all sizes, ages and colour took to the runway, now seems to be out of fashion.  Visit our website: http://www.france24.com  Like us on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/FRANCE24.English  Follow us on Twitter: https://twitter.com/France24_en

Transcript

00:00Hello, I'm Annette Young and welcome to The 51 Percent, a show about women reshaping

00:15our world.

00:16With Fashion Week upon us here in Paris, we're taking a look at an industry that, while largely

00:21targets women, is rarely led by them.

00:24This year, just two women have been appointed as new creative directors of major fashion

00:30houses.

00:31This despite an incredible shake-up in the industry.

00:35It seems progress on diversity is disappointing.

00:38Only 10 out of the 33 creative director roles are currently held by women, and just two

00:44of them are women of colour.

00:46For instance, female creative director Maria Grazia Curie for Dior and Virginie Viard at

00:51Chanel were replaced by Jonathan Anderson at Dior and Mathieu Blaise at Chanel.

00:57So how is it in 2025 that men are still in charge of women's fashion?

01:03With me to discuss this is Dana Thomas, a fashion journalist, and Emily Hamann, a fashion historian

01:09and the new director of Palais Galleria, a fashion museum here in Paris.

01:14Thank you to both of you for coming in.

01:17Let me start with you, Dana.

01:19Should we be alarmed by this significant drop in women leading fashion houses?

01:25We should absolutely be alarmed.

01:27And for me, covering the industry now for 40 years, I find it alarming that I'm writing

01:32less about women than I did even 15 or 20 years ago.

01:36I think it's really heartbreaking for women as customers.

01:42It's a problem for women as customers that we have only men telling us what we should

01:46be wearing, that there are very few women.

01:48There's Stella McCartney, thank goodness, at her own house.

01:51And there's Phoebe Filo at her own brand.

01:54There have been opportunities where this could have been rectified, and it hasn't been.

01:57The biggest misstep for me was Chanel, a house founded by a woman, and it now has a global

02:02CEO who is a woman.

02:04And yet they went ahead and hired a man for that job, when there were plenty of women who

02:08could have done a very good job at it.

02:10Emily, your thoughts?

02:12I agree.

02:13I find it very alarming.

02:15I find it's an interesting and rather troubling moment to be considering women in fashion.

02:23And I would argue that, as Dan said, they're there.

02:27They're not very visible, but there are many very talented women who deserve a chance and

02:32probably more visibility.

02:33Why do you think this is happening, especially given the high number of women entering the

02:39industry?

02:40Oh, it's simple, because the business is still run in C-suites by men, mostly white men.

02:46I think it's pretty fair to say only white men.

02:50I can't think of any men of colour at the top in the C-suites, top, top, top echelons

02:56of caring LVMH or Richemul.

02:59So they're the ones ultimately making the decisions, and they like to hire the same as

03:03they know.

03:04Emily, what are the major barriers to women working in this industry?

03:08There are many, I think, pertaining to fashion and more generally pertaining to any professional

03:15careers.

03:16You have to go through all the different steps.

03:19You have to work hard, of course.

03:21But there's definitely here, I guess, in the industry of fashion, this necessity of committing

03:27so much of your life, so many working hours to your work.

03:31I don't know if this explains everything, but it is indeed a very demanding industry.

03:35And perhaps, I mean, this is definitely something to debate, possibly a moment when women maybe

03:41don't want to work as much, or at least have the same work-life balance as some, perhaps,

03:47of the most ambitious men that are in the industry.

03:50But again, I feel this is the case of fashion, but can possibly be applied to many other industries.

03:56Jaina, what do you think are the major barriers for women?

04:00There are loads of women in the fashion business, but they're going off and starting their own business

04:04because they can't get these big brand jobs.

04:07There's Maureen Sayre, who's greatly talented, who won the LVMH award, and she has her own

04:11company.

04:12She would have been a genius fit at Chanel.

04:13I've seen them interviewing women, and then I see them not hiring the women.

04:18I've actually been in, you know, in the room and listened to them talking about and batting

04:22around and talking to some of these women, and then they don't hire them.

04:26They hire the man.

04:27Do you think it's part of the global backlash that we're now witnessing against women's

04:32rights and it's playing out in this industry as well?

04:34No, I think it's just short-sightedness and tunnel vision.

04:37Emily, we've seen what happens when women are in charge.

04:40I mean, under Maria Grazia Curi's leadership at Dior, female empowerment clearly became

04:47a guiding principle and brand sales jumped from reportedly US$2.7 billion in 2018 to more

04:56than US$9 billion by 2023.

04:59Stella McCartney, we've got the Olsen sisters at the row.

05:02I mean, these are all incredible brands and clearly women, when they're in charge, those

05:08brands are successful, aren't they?

05:11Absolutely.

05:12And to think as a historian, I have to also stress that throughout history, throughout

05:16the centuries, female leadership and entrepreneurship has been extremely successful.

05:23And I think this is not then a valid perspective to think that putting a woman in a position

05:29of power, putting a woman in charge in terms of finance, in terms of strategy, we have so

05:35many examples of when it works, when it works in terms of numbers, not just of critical

05:40success.

05:41And we can go back as far as the 18th century and see a lot of women building their businesses

05:46with incredible success.

05:47I mean, we think about the 1920s and 30s with Elsa Schiaparelli, Coco Chanel, Madame Grey,

05:54you know, these were really fantastic women.

05:57And at these brands now, they're run by men.

05:59Let's just pause there to talk about the demise of yet another key fashion trend.

06:04Body positivity was making inroads in recent years, promoting healthier, more inclusive

06:09representations of beauty.

06:11But it seems to have taken very much a backseat in 2025, as Olivia Salazar-Windsphere explains.

06:20Ultra Skinny is now back in vogue if the latest runway shows are anything to go by.

06:26Plus size models like Ashley Graham were walking for Dolce & Gabbana, Christian Siriano and

06:32Michael Kors in previous seasons, and French pin-up Leslie Sidura fronted lucrative ready-to-wear

06:38campaigns just a couple of years ago.

06:41But the body positivity movement has been conspicuous by its absence in recent collections.

06:47Vogue Business reports that larger models only accounted for 0.8% of figures on the catwalks

06:53for the spring-summer 2025 collections, a dip compared to five years ago.

06:58Even established models are now seeing their bookings evaporate.

07:02We all know each other, we see each other's work, we pass each other, you know, like we

07:07know each other.

07:08And, and you know the girls that are working the most, and you know it's bad when those

07:14girls aren't working and those girls are messaging you and being like, me too.

07:18I'm serving again, I'm doing this.

07:21All of these brands that recently launched plus size extended sizes, they're discontinuing

07:25them.

07:26Old Navy launched up to size 30 in store, and within a year they've eliminated almost all

07:31plus sizes in store.

07:34The shift back towards size zero models has also seen celebrities and influencers following

07:39suit, with actress Lily Collins modelling a Calvin Klein outfit in recent photos and prompting

07:44concerns over her strikingly thin physique.

07:48The trend's been taken up on social media, with a subculture known as skinny talk, videos

07:53encouraging extreme dieting and even eating disorders, something medical professionals

07:58and parents have flagged up and urged TikTok to regulate.

08:03While potentially fatal conditions like anorexia are not new, the availability of drugs that work

08:08as appetite suppressants has had a major effect on body image, according to some experts.

08:15They say the arrival of GLP-1 drugs like Ozempic has changed the landscape, with high-profile

08:20figures endorsing their use.

08:22Yes, I'm on row.

08:27They say GLP-1s for weight loss is a shortcut.

08:31It's not.

08:31It's science.

08:32After kids.

08:34Alice Rebel Wilson has spoken about using the drugs to maintain her new weight, as well

08:39as Oprah Winfrey.

08:41Many others are rumoured to have reshaped their bodies using medication initially developed

08:45to treat diabetes.

08:47Yet the larger question of representation in fashion is still a key factor, in an industry

08:52where image is everything, and not all bodies seem to be celebrated as much as others.

09:03Watching that report with me is Dana Thomas, a fashion journalist, and Emily Hammond, a fashion

09:08historian and new director of Palais Galleria, a fashion museum here in Paris.

09:13Dana, yet another highly disturbing U-turn in an industry when it comes to women and the

09:21representation of women, and the fact that we've seen all sizes and all ages now on the

09:28runway parade for quite a few years.

09:31So what is behind this trend?

09:32Is it casting agents, the designers themselves, or do we have to thank Ozempic?

09:37It's a bit of everything.

09:40The biggest U-turn came when Edward Enninful was asked to leave or left British Vogue because

09:48he had three pillars at the magazine, diversity, inclusivity, and sustainability.

09:54So diversity and inclusivity meant that he put on the cover all shapes, all sizes, and all

10:00colors.

10:01And once he was gone, Anna Wintour back in charge of British Vogue, and therefore all

10:07the Vogues, and she herself is what we used to call a social X-ray, extremely thin.

10:12You know, it starts from the top down.

10:13And so when she says, this is what we care about, then that's what everybody who works

10:18for her or works adjacent cares about.

10:21Now I'm going to throw you a funny curveball you didn't see coming.

10:23I was a model back in the 80s.

10:26And I knew, I experienced this back then where they would make a stand on a scale or you got

10:30sent home if you'd put on two kilos.

10:32And you had to, you know, and the agent would watch what you ate and everyone take you out

10:36to lunch and dinner for a week to make sure you shed those two kilos.

10:39I went through that.

10:39It's very controlling and it can, and I saw girls who suffered from eating disorders in

10:44the business really badly.

10:46Do you see my hip bones and things like that?

10:48So it's, it's damaging, but it's been damaging for a long time.

10:52And fashion revolves around that.

10:54They just want human hangers to show off these clothes.

10:57John Galliano used to complain the worst thing about designing for curvy women was that

11:02their boobs and their hips got in the way.

11:04I want to ask the both of you at this point, I mean, because it is a rather depressing note

11:10in terms of what we're witnessing with this industry, which seems to be going backwards

11:14as opposed to going forward.

11:16Are there any young, bright women fashion designers on the scene that we should be taking notice

11:23of?

11:24Emily, you first.

11:25I was quite excited because she was a former coworker, but an extremely talented designer.

11:31One of the only women to be put in the position of creative director at a brand over the past

11:38few months was Meryl Roeg, a Belgium designer, extremely talented.

11:43And I'm extremely happy for her.

11:45And I'm sure the brand will benefit greatly from her vision, from her passion.

11:49Diana?

11:50This designer out of Sweden, Hoda Kova, is really interesting.

11:54And she does a lot of upcycling and blending the arts.

11:58She goes, you know, to flea markets and finds things and uses some recycling furs and so

12:02on.

12:03So we shouldn't give up hope.

12:04Don't give up hope.

12:05It's all about hope.

12:06I want to thank both my guests, Emily Hammond from Palais Galleria and fashion journalist

12:12Dana Thomas.

12:13Thank you so much.

12:14That's it for this edition.

12:15So until our next show, bye for now.

Category

Transcript

Be the first to comment

Recommended