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00:00:00Welcome back to the Cycle World Podcast. I'm Mark Hoyer, Editor-in-Chief. I'm with Kevin Kamen, our technical editor.
00:00:06Our technical topic today is getting old junk running. It might be old junk that you parked yourself in your garage
00:00:14and neglected for some period of time to a very long period of time.
00:00:19It could be something you bought that hasn't run and you have no idea about the backstory or the owner was like,
00:00:24yeah, it ran great when we parked it and, you know, I just don't have time or it could run.
00:00:30All the wonderful descriptions and sale ads, you know, great restoration project, easy resto.
00:00:38What does it all mean? It means you got your work cut out for you.
00:00:42Now, this is something that is so close to my heart because it's one of my favorite things in life, is reviving things.
00:00:49The first tune-up is my most excited time with a vehicle that's crusty.
00:00:54I got an 853-mile Ducati a couple years ago and 900 SS.
00:01:01And, yeah, I just bought it and then I opened, I didn't even look in the tank.
00:01:07I opened the fuel cap and horrors of gum and rust.
00:01:12And then I knew carburation for sure, like if you see that in the gas tank.
00:01:16So, anyway, there's so many places that we could start with this, but I always start with the gas cap.
00:01:24That's my first thing is like pull the gas cap before I buy it now.
00:01:28But no matter what, pull the gas cap and then don't stick your nose in it, but take a waft of what that smells like.
00:01:34And if it smells unlike gasoline and has this kind of like, I don't know, old hammy kind of, what does that smell?
00:01:43Well, stale gas.
00:01:44If you smelled it, you know what it smells like.
00:01:47And you know you've got your work cut out for you.
00:01:51Yeah.
00:01:52You've worked on a few things.
00:01:53All your stuff is pristine race bikes though, right?
00:01:56They've never had any problems.
00:01:57Well, every spring I've had to get a tiller going or a mower.
00:02:06So, those are the same problems basically.
00:02:09Not very romantic though.
00:02:11No, they're not romantic.
00:02:12They aren't barn finds and you can't ride them.
00:02:20But this is the terrible thing about a fuel system, which is that gasoline does not consist of one molecular structure.
00:02:31Ethanol, every molecule is the same.
00:02:36Water, every molecule is the same, has the same structure.
00:02:39But in gasoline, you have a range of molecular weights and therefore a range of volatilities.
00:02:47The front end of the gasoline is the volatile part, the part that you smell first.
00:02:55And it is that stuff that lets the engine start when you enrich it with the choke.
00:03:01But when you leave a bike, when a bike is put away wet, as the horsemen say,
00:03:10the fuel in the carburetor gradually begins to evaporate through the float bowl vents if it's a carbureted engine.
00:03:21If it's a fuel injected engine, there is no free surface in the engine or fuel system south of the gas tank
00:03:28from which fuel can evaporate.
00:03:32So you are, to an extent, protected.
00:03:36It just takes longer to go wrong.
00:03:40Yes, because it will go wrong.
00:03:44So as the gasoline evaporates, it becomes increasingly high molecular weight.
00:03:50And finally, what the fuel industry calls
00:03:54existent gum.
00:03:56Heavy molecular weight stuff that somehow got in there.
00:04:01And there are your tiny idle jets submerged normally in the float bowl.
00:04:08You've taken the carburetors off, pulled the float bowls.
00:04:13Precautionary move.
00:04:15And inside is white powder, maybe brown, horrible stuff.
00:04:20And when you pull out the idle jets, whose orifices are quite small,
00:04:27you may not see light through them.
00:04:31And I had a set once that needed to go in the ultrasonic cleaner for hours.
00:04:42Before I had the ultrasonic cleaner, of course, they always tell you, and rightly so,
00:04:46do not poke wires through jets because the end of the wire has been cut off with diagonals.
00:04:54It's created a sharp edge.
00:04:56You're going to poke the inside of the jet.
00:04:59It's not hard.
00:05:02So what I've done in the past is shave a little wood chip
00:05:08and push a wood sliver into the jet if I can.
00:05:16But, of course, the first thing you do when you're interested in getting something going is,
00:05:24does the engine turn?
00:05:27And, of course, Mark is talking about looking in the tank as a diagnostic.
00:05:31Is this a badly abused rust pile?
00:05:36Because that's a branch operation in the program of your work.
00:05:41Is it a rust bucket?
00:05:42If so, next, please.
00:05:44Or if you've just got to bring it back, you can.
00:05:49This is going to be an unintended validation of chemicals and other things that are unsponsored.
00:05:56And this will just be free information and free validation to companies that make chemicals that I adore.
00:06:05And one that I don't, M-E-K.
00:06:07I don't.
00:06:07Methyl ethyl ketone.
00:06:08And so what Kevin was talking about, the scuzz inside the carburetor and clogging the jets,
00:06:14it's changed with ethanol and particularly what we have in California.
00:06:18And it really would bear a phone call to someone at a big oil company to maybe tell us what's changed or why it's so bad.
00:06:24But there's also the green fuzz that comes of ethanol-absorbing water.
00:06:30The things that you can find when you open up a carburetor are horrifying.
00:06:35Worse than they used to be.
00:06:37And I have found that the scuzz that is left behind can be cut by some M-E-K.
00:06:43But I don't like M-E-K.
00:06:45It's not, it's one of your less, I would take tulline, tulline?
00:06:52Tulline?
00:06:53Yeah, tulline.
00:06:54Any day over M-E-K.
00:06:55But sometimes M-E-K is the only thing that will unstick a stuck slide or something like that,
00:07:00where it's just really, really gummed up.
00:07:03But I guess Kevin's direction was more fundamental.
00:07:08Kevin was going to say, does the engine actually turn?
00:07:12Yeah.
00:07:12Because we're really interested in that.
00:07:16Because not all of us are eager and willing to, let's take top end off.
00:07:21Let's pull the pistons off.
00:07:22Let's see what the crank is like.
00:07:24If you're that person, hurrah, excellent.
00:07:29But lots of people are buying used bikes because they want to ride them.
00:07:33And they don't want to pay $25,000 or even $10,000 for new.
00:07:40And we all have financial limits.
00:07:47So, hence, does the engine turn.
00:07:52And is there oil in the engine?
00:07:55As he mentions, take out spark plugs and look at the business end.
00:08:02Because if there has been a blow up, there won't be stuff packed into the end of the spark plug.
00:08:11The electrodes will be hammered flat.
00:08:14I had a few of those in racing.
00:08:16They looked like the piston had detonated away, creating a rain of aluminum particles,
00:08:23which then inhabited the spark plug.
00:08:26It was dreadful.
00:08:28But the chances are that you'll just find spark plugs.
00:08:31And they'll give you some key.
00:08:35If they're uniformly black from edge to edge, a lot of rich running.
00:08:45If they're...
00:08:47Oil control on the way out.
00:08:48Yeah.
00:08:50Bye-bye oil control.
00:08:51And usually, you'll find that they're just a sort of beige-y brown color that says everyday life.
00:09:04So, if you have rotation, you'd next check for compression.
00:09:11Are the spark plugs in place?
00:09:13Yeah, I want to pause on rotation.
00:09:14So, if it's been sitting a long time, you want to find a way to gently discover whether the engine turns for Lee or not.
00:09:25If it has an electric starter, you don't necessarily want to just whack the starter.
00:09:29Because the rings could be stuck in the bore.
00:09:31You can hurt it.
00:09:33So, if I have something that is...
00:09:36I know for sure has been parked a long time.
00:09:39I pull out the plugs.
00:09:40I look at the plugs.
00:09:41If they indicate what Kevin said, like, oh, yeah, maybe it was rich or maybe...
00:09:46As long as they're not smashed, right?
00:09:48Okay, these look pretty good.
00:09:49The gaps are reasonable.
00:09:51The plugs...
00:09:52I just replace plugs typically once I know that, you know, the engine's probably going to be able to run.
00:09:59I found a product called Arrow Croil.
00:10:01I got that from Dale Waxler at Wheels Through Time Museum.
00:10:03So, it's Croil, K-R-O-I-L.
00:10:06But Arrow's in a can.
00:10:07And it's a great penetrating oil.
00:10:10It works great.
00:10:13Freeing up an engine.
00:10:14Stick your bike in the sun.
00:10:15Make it hot.
00:10:16Put that stuff in the cylinders.
00:10:18Let it pool in there.
00:10:19And then just do something gentle.
00:10:21You know, you can get a wrench on the end of the crank if you take off one of the covers.
00:10:26If it's got a Kickstarter, problem solved.
00:10:28If it has a center stand, put it in gear.
00:10:31I usually check for the gears if I can get it up on a center stand.
00:10:35Check to make sure that, you know, it shifts through.
00:10:38Do all that.
00:10:39Get into a tall gear and then just rotate the wheel.
00:10:42And if it starts to turn the engine, hey, great.
00:10:44And if it doesn't, you know, give it some time.
00:10:46Be gentle.
00:10:46Try and get the rings to set free.
00:10:50You know, on a single cylinder bike, you can kick it through if you're going to park it.
00:10:54But no one intends to park it.
00:10:55That's the thing.
00:10:56We could talk about the spiritual side.
00:10:59The ride that never ends.
00:11:01Yeah, but, you know, you park a single, you can kick it through until it's on compression.
00:11:05And your one cylinder, the valves are closed.
00:11:08And so you have a better situation than if the valves are open.
00:11:11You just can't.
00:11:12If you have a V12, like, forget it, right?
00:11:15There's going to be some stuff open.
00:11:16Even on a twin, typically, you're going to have some valves open.
00:11:20So in any case, like, make sure the engine turns freely.
00:11:25And once it does, good to go.
00:11:28And then we can move on from there.
00:11:30Does it have a compression?
00:11:33That is a, you know, I followed my friend Bill.
00:11:37We rode 780 miles on 50s Triumphs.
00:11:41He had a 54 T110 and I had a 58 Triumph Trophy.
00:11:45This is a weekend camping trip to Death Valley in the winter.
00:11:48And we camped off Kell Baker Road.
00:11:52Bill, for years, ran JRC Engineering, which is an aftermarket British parts company.
00:11:59We went out there and did our long trip, camped in the desert.
00:12:04I forgot water.
00:12:05He was a scoutmaster, so he had extra water because he always takes care of his kids.
00:12:09And we got into Death Valley and it was pretty hot.
00:12:14And we're going up a grade toward Stofite Wells.
00:12:18And I'm following him and there's a big puff of gray, that horrible kind of gray that with the smell that's indicated some severe badness as in hold piston or something like that.
00:12:33But we always remain optimistic.
00:12:34And he did.
00:12:35He's like, oh, I think the mag slipped because he came to a full stop and went over.
00:12:39And so he went through and said, okay, I'm going to pull, he pulls the plug and he happened to pull the plug on the good side.
00:12:47And he was checking that the points were opening, just kicking it through.
00:12:51Not, no, no electronic things, nothing, no papers, no timing wheels.
00:12:56Just kick it through to do the points spark when, when they should.
00:13:02And it was roughly in the ballpark.
00:13:04He's done this a long time.
00:13:06He says, okay, go ahead and kick, kick it through.
00:13:09And it was just as easy as could be no compression.
00:13:14So that's even, even just kicking it through or turning the wheel against the plugs.
00:13:19You can have a pretty good idea of what's going on.
00:13:22You don't necessarily need a, you know, a compression tester to thread.
00:13:25Oh, absolutely not.
00:13:26Yeah.
00:13:27Right.
00:13:28And if, if you have a four cylinder and it, it feels sort of weirdly uneven at one point, that could be an indication.
00:13:35How else would you approach it?
00:13:38I mean, we're not trying to diagnose it.
00:13:39We're not going to put oil in the cylinders to see if it's the rings.
00:13:42No, we're just, we're just following a general procedure here.
00:13:49It's not a prelude to a full rebuild.
00:13:52We're just taking a superficial interest in this motorbike to see if we can, how difficult is it going to be to make it run?
00:14:01And of course, if, if there's no compression, it's going to be difficult.
00:14:08But if the compression is a little weak, there are rings, there are valve jobs, but you, as those are marks against, it's not going to be an easy one.
00:14:18But, of course, he spoke about bikes equipped with magnetos.
00:14:28That is 70 years ago, those models.
00:14:34Nowadays, everything requires a battery.
00:14:37So, this brings us to the horrible electrical system.
00:14:44Well, Magneto, I don't know, there's, I mean, our demographic here has probably seen a Magneto, but for folks who haven't, Magneto is a self-generating sparking device.
00:14:57Yes, the full name, the full name is Magneto dynamic generator, meaning that it uses magnets to generate electrical current.
00:15:11And if you were, did things as a young person, as I did, wrap a couple of coils of wire around a compass.
00:15:19And you could generate current with another coil poking a magnet through it, and the compass needle would deflect.
00:15:33So, it's, you know, just a rigorous application of a basic principle.
00:15:39So, the great thing about a Magneto, as long as the shaft turns and the points are reasonably adjusted, it will make sparks.
00:15:47As long as the capacitor is good.
00:15:49Oh, the capacitor, yes.
00:15:52But, so, it's just, it's self-generating.
00:15:54You don't have to worry about a battery.
00:15:57You don't have to worry about a charging system.
00:15:59It just does its own thing.
00:16:00You might not have lights, but you would have spark.
00:16:03And there are also CDI Magnetos.
00:16:05Same principle.
00:16:06As long as the rotor turns and the electronics are good, you have sparks.
00:16:11No battery.
00:16:13But most motorcycles do have battery-dependent systems.
00:16:19So, the battery is one focus of get running.
00:16:25You have to be prepared to supply a battery.
00:16:29So, motor turns.
00:16:31Yep.
00:16:32Compression.
00:16:33Compression.
00:16:34Now we're interested in spark.
00:16:38Yeah.
00:16:38We're going to have to clean.
00:16:39We know we're going to have to clean the carburetor unless, if by some miracle, fuel is getting into the engine.
00:16:45But we'll get to cleaning carburetors.
00:16:47But we have compression.
00:16:49We're looking for spark.
00:16:52Go ahead.
00:16:53So, when you have a good source of current, either the original battery charged, which means it's not terribly old,
00:17:05or a fresh battery that you've brought for the purpose, you can make a check for, does it run?
00:17:14And this sort of sends us back in a recursive function to the carburetors.
00:17:24If everything looked pretty good, and we do get the engine started using some source of current, what if the engine won't run down below just above idle?
00:17:39Well, that is a diagnostic for blocked idle jets.
00:17:45And my pregnant wife and I drove to Daytona in 1980 in her Volkswagen.
00:17:52And the whole road was frozen solid south of Richmond, Virginia.
00:17:58So, all this jolting freed up the sediment in the fuel tank and blocked up the idle system completely.
00:18:07So, we had this car that wouldn't run under 2,000 RPM.
00:18:12So, when we got a hotel room, I took the carburetor off, cleaned it up, good running again.
00:18:20Now, many people are going to hear this and say, oh, well, I'm not really comfortable with all this mechanical work.
00:18:29If you're going to mess with motorbikes a good deal, you're going to learn this someday.
00:18:35Why not now?
00:18:38Just plunge in.
00:18:41Because it's a used machine.
00:18:44You're not destroying your daily driver.
00:18:48You're learning.
00:18:50And you get the manual or you get another instructive source.
00:18:55And have at it.
00:18:57Because, as I'm fond of saying, this is a great period because tools are not expensive now.
00:19:05And there are rebuild kits for carburetors that come with the flow bowl gasket or O-ring, replacement jets, all the parts you need.
00:19:15And it's hard to go wrong with that kind of forethought from the manufacturer.
00:19:24And it's a good skill to have.
00:19:27So, now, if you have a decently carbureting engine and it does run, you can hook your thumbs in your armpits and say, job well done up to that point.
00:19:46So, there are lots of little details.
00:19:52For example, when you remove the carburetors, you may find that after you've taken the carburetor off of its mounting studs, that it doesn't hang down from the fuel line because the fuel lines have turned solid.
00:20:08So, this is particularly true of older British bikes, which had that transparent fuel line that gradually becomes more and more brown until it finally turns into solid, hard plastic.
00:20:23And you can't get it off without destroying it.
00:20:27Yeah, the old Italian stuff was sort of blue-green and it would do the same thing.
00:20:30It would kind of shrink and it would become rock hard.
00:20:34Yeah.
00:20:34Bellmetric, folks, if you need 7mm fuel line, Bellmetric in the Northeast, they've got all kinds of different fuel line.
00:20:45When I was redoing my Ducati, I needed submergible.
00:20:48I wanted to get the right rubber hose that could live inside a gas tank and they sell that stuff.
00:20:56BELmetric.
00:20:57It's a great resource.
00:20:59So, another thing to bear in mind is spark plugs.
00:21:07Nobody sees spark plugs anymore because they're down inside a tube between the camshafts under a single cover.
00:21:17And there on top of the spark plug is an ignition coil.
00:21:22So, they're invisible.
00:21:26Nobody takes the spark plugs out.
00:21:28In racing, nobody takes the spark plugs out.
00:21:31We used to because on the business end of the spark plug was evidence from the combustion chamber itself that you could look at that gave insight into how the engine was running.
00:21:43But there are right and wrong spark plugs.
00:21:49So, this is another point at which a manual is good.
00:21:52It will tell you the heat range of spark plug that this engine should have.
00:21:58And I have seen people go out into practice at a road race with number seven NGK plugs in and just wreck their engines.
00:22:14Now, they put those plugs in to warm the engine up or what have you.
00:22:18It wouldn't run well on B10 ENs.
00:22:21But if the end of the spark plug, let me begin again here.
00:22:27Spark plug heat range is a measure of how hot the spark plug electrodes will be in the running condition.
00:22:41Some of them have quite a long center insulator with the wire poking, the center wire poking out of it.
00:22:48And some, the center insulator is quite stumpy.
00:22:51That's a colder spark plug.
00:22:53It runs colder in the engine.
00:22:57And so, it's good to know that you have the right heat range spark plug in so that you don't have a misfortune.
00:23:06Well, don't assume.
00:23:07I guess what that brings up to me is don't assume what's on the bike is correct.
00:23:11Yeah.
00:23:12You got to go back to some, you know, form of truth.
00:23:15And if you can, if you can find a paper manual, they are great to have.
00:23:20If you can cut through the signal to noise ratio on YouTube, et cetera, forums, finding, finding that diamond among all the other stuff is can be, can be difficult.
00:23:32But there are a lot of times you got to spend a little time on a forum.
00:23:35You'll find that person who actually knows what they're talking about often.
00:23:41And sometimes you just have to average everything that you would get off of a forum or I'd say the level of how to on YouTube has elevated spectacularly.
00:23:52And, you know, something very specific, like timing your Yamaha XS 650, if it has points, the original points ignition, what are the problems that would have, you know, you would have in that type of ignition and how to solve them.
00:24:07There's a lot of great information that way, but don't assume that what you have is correct.
00:24:16I've had cars I bought.
00:24:18This is your dream is you want to go find that MGB that will not run and it misfires and you buy it for very little because it doesn't run.
00:24:28And when you diagnose it, somebody put the distributor in 180 degrees out.
00:24:34And so you turn the distributor around and then the compression's perfect.
00:24:38You clean the carburetors and you got a car.
00:24:40You do that with a motorcycle.
00:24:41XS 650, I had a free one out of San Francisco.
00:24:48Said to have run when parked.
00:24:49So we did a program on the Motorcyclist YouTube channel, ran when parked on this XS 650.
00:24:54And I got really lucky with that bike.
00:24:56It had, it's, you know, the plug showed a little bit of oil, lack of oil control, but not bad, like pretty good.
00:25:04Compression was good.
00:25:06Carburetors, you know, somebody had put some love into it.
00:25:08The ignition system, I never checked the timing on that bike.
00:25:12I just started the process.
00:25:15So my process would be, here's a bike that doesn't run.
00:25:18In the case of the XS, it's got a kickstarter and an electric starter and a center stand.
00:25:27So I open the gas cap.
00:25:29Yeah.
00:25:29I open the gas cap.
00:25:31I smell the fuel and it smells horrible.
00:25:33I'm like, okay, this is old gas.
00:25:34I'm expecting problems, but it's not rusty in the tank.
00:25:38So like, okay, this is a great start because I don't have to worry about the particulates in the rusty fuel tank.
00:25:45This is a plug here.
00:25:47If you do have a rusty fuel tank, like I had on my Ducati, EvapoRust is this product.
00:25:52It's amazing.
00:25:53It's pretty benign.
00:25:54Like, I don't leave it on my paint, but it's not like putting acid in to etch the tank, which people will do.
00:26:02Or you'll put, you know, you can do it with vinegar.
00:26:03You can use vinegar and washers and shake it and do all this stuff.
00:26:07But EvapoRust, it's kind of expensive, you know, 28 bucks a gallon, I think.
00:26:13But I just sucked it up because it's an original paint, beautiful Ducati tank.
00:26:17And I filled it with that stuff.
00:26:20And I left it, you put it in the sun, it works a little bit faster, but I left it in for about a week.
00:26:25And it's just pure gray metal.
00:26:28It's converted.
00:26:29It was amazing.
00:26:30And then you just hose it out, and then I just hit it with, you know, WD-40 or any, pick your MPPL, Motion Pro, plug to Motion Pro for motorcycle-specific products.
00:26:42Hose it off in the inside of the tank.
00:26:44So anyway, back to the XS, though.
00:26:47XS, ooh, smells bad.
00:26:48Okay, I know I'm going to deal with fuel system.
00:26:51Is the motor stuck?
00:26:52It wasn't stuck, but I still pull the plugs, put some oil in there just to make the process that much smoother.
00:27:00I take off ignition cover maybe, but I show up with a jump box and starting fluid.
00:27:07Now, starting fluid is pretty harsh stuff.
00:27:10But what I wanted to find out was, would it pop?
00:27:15That was it.
00:27:16And it did.
00:27:21It would make noise on starting fluid, and I could keep it going.
00:27:25And now, that's kind of a hard way to go.
00:27:27Starting fluid is a wash your bores off kind of proposition, which brings me to the fuel that I would use, which is typically I try to find non-ethanol.
00:27:39You know, go to your aftermarket race fuel guys.
00:27:41They'll sell you non-ethanol.
00:27:42Now, for those of you fortunate to live in a part of the country where you can get 93 at the pump with no ethanol, good on you.
00:27:49Can't get that here.
00:27:50Not in California.
00:27:53But I try to use non-ethanol, and I mix a little two-stroke oil in, or you can buy that.
00:27:58You can buy stuff from the auto parts store that's already pre-mixed.
00:28:02You want 50 to 1 or something.
00:28:04You just want a little bit of oil in there to kind of help it out.
00:28:07The reason for this, the need for being helped out is that when you put your motorcycle, you park your motorcycle overnight, and you go out and ride it the following day, oil has drained from working parts.
00:28:23But there are additives in the oil that seat to it, that enough remains, that it's good.
00:28:30It starts, it runs, it doesn't damage itself.
00:28:33But if it's been sitting for years, have sympathy for all those moving parts, which may be devoid of oil.
00:28:46You may remember a few years ago that there was a great scandal over a particular motorcycle that wiped out its cams because it took so long for oil pressure to reach a particular part of one of the cams after startup.
00:29:00So pre-oiling of the kind that Mark is talking about is a really good idea for something that's been sitting for a while.
00:29:10Yeah, so the gum that gets inside your carburetor, you can also have residue on the valves.
00:29:15And so you can have an intake valve that might have some scuzz on it that would be a little sticky.
00:29:20And putting some oil and fuel can assist with making sure everything spins around.
00:29:26I'll go ahead and say it because I know you guys are thirsty, but on a Velocet, I have the oil feed to the rocker, as many people do, has a section of clear hose.
00:29:38And it takes about 50 kicks on a Velocet oiling system to get oil to show up in that tube.
00:29:44So if it hasn't run in a long time, A, it'll have wet sumped.
00:29:47So I'll have to, if it's a dry sump, you know, you have a tank up here and it's meant not to be in the engine, it's in the tank.
00:29:55There's a scavenge pump that puts it back in the tank and it hopefully rests while it's running, gets a little cooler and then goes back into service through the engine.
00:30:02And with the Velo, you know, you make sure the pump is primed and all that.
00:30:07But I kick that thing through for exercise.
00:30:10Feel good.
00:30:11Get that right leg back in shape because you're going to need it.
00:30:16And you kick it until oil goes up into the rocker feed.
00:30:19XS 650, same thing, man.
00:30:22I'm going to kick that thing through a zillion times to make sure that there's oil circulating.
00:30:27You could go crazy and pull rockers off and put some oil up top.
00:30:31If you had something truly exotic with parts that are hard to find and it wasn't sort of a work-a-day motorcycle like an XS 650 or something,
00:30:39you're going to want to go to great lengths to make sure you don't break something.
00:30:43But in the general terms.
00:30:47I want to back up a little bit and talk about old gas because it's tempting to,
00:30:56well, it's got three quarters of a tank.
00:31:00No.
00:31:02And I want to tell you why.
00:31:04Because if you live in a suburban community and there is a town dump,
00:31:10every spring when people are looking for lawnmowers,
00:31:13you'll find that the dump super has a row of quite recent model-looking lawnmowers for sale at attractive prices.
00:31:24How does he get them?
00:31:25And people throw away lawnmowers that don't start in the spring.
00:31:32My mother's lawnmower didn't start in the spring.
00:31:35I said to her, what did you do?
00:31:37She said, I put it in the sun.
00:31:41And after it had been in the sun three hours of a warm afternoon, it started right up.
00:31:46Now, here's the reason.
00:31:47Earlier I said gasoline consists of a range of molecular weights.
00:31:54The first part to evaporate is the very part you need for cold starting, the so-called front end of the fuel.
00:32:02And gradually, gradually, what's left over is sort of the lamp oil part of the gasoline,
00:32:12which in a volatility test may not come off until 400 degrees Fahrenheit.
00:32:18So, engine's not going to start on that stuff.
00:32:23This is why fresh gas often solves problems with machines that have been down for a while.
00:32:30The other thing, of course, that those dump supers know, a fresh spark plug may do the job just as well.
00:32:40Because they've, the owner has fouled the spark plug somehow, and they get even by taking a $300 mower to the dump.
00:32:52So, that's my lecture on fresh fuel.
00:32:56I think it's a good idea to start an engine that is being revived and get running.
00:33:03It's a good idea to provide it with fresh fuel right from the start.
00:33:08100%.
00:33:08You might be lucky.
00:33:12Don't count on it.
00:33:14Yeah.
00:33:15I did get lucky with the Yamaha.
00:33:17I didn't have to get too deep in the carburetors.
00:33:19I pulled the float bowls and cleaned them out eventually.
00:33:23But the rest of it was pretty good.
00:33:25The fuel lines had gone rock hard and crusty and just sort of, well, one of them actually swelled up.
00:33:32The rubber had swollen, and it was the crossover between the carburetors.
00:33:36It swelled up, and it was just, it was this black, whatever it was, it was this black gummy stuff that was not the right, wasn't good fuel hose.
00:33:44So, I got good fuel hose on it.
00:33:45Sonic cleaner is a good investment, as Kevin was saying.
00:33:50You can put the whole carburetor in there.
00:33:53I bought one that's, you know, like kind of big, so I could put a large carburetor in it.
00:33:57And I use the aerospace or aircraft simple green with a dilution of water and then cook those.
00:34:08It tends, I didn't do that the first time I did some carburetors.
00:34:13I used regular simple green in a lot of heat, and I let go a long time, and it turned the aluminum black.
00:34:20And what I discovered through reading was that the aircraft stuff has a different chemical makeup, and it tends to do that less.
00:34:27You don't want to do it forever, but you'd be shocked at what comes out of there.
00:34:31So, get an air compressor, blow out your passages.
00:34:40I often wish we had compressed air in the kitchen.
00:34:43Yeah.
00:34:47Yeah, air compressor is good.
00:34:49What Kevin said about poking, particularly your idle jets, because they're so small, is that you can make a difference in the performance of the jet by scratching the little,
00:35:01orifice.
00:35:02Nonetheless, sometimes I have used the finest guitar string, because it's very straight.
00:35:14I would cut it in an angle, but I would be incredibly careful about getting the hole started.
00:35:20Yeah.
00:35:21And then take it from there, because sometimes, what Kevin said, using a sliver of wood, it's possible.
00:35:25My luck would be that I would clog the hole with the wood, and then I would have to get tweezers or something to get it down.
00:35:30I would have another problem there.
00:35:34But you want that stuff to be immaculately clean and beautiful.
00:35:38Throttle shaft seals.
00:35:39You know, if you have a bike that has throttle shaft seals, some exotic Webbers use sealed bearings for their throttle shafts.
00:35:49I mean, my goodness.
00:35:50Most of what we're dealing with is a brass shaft and an aluminum body with maybe an insert, a bearing-type insert on it.
00:36:00That problem went all the way to the top.
00:36:03In the war, the 3350s on B-29s were converted to rolling bearings on the throttle shafts, because they had troubles with it.
00:36:14But then you're going to move along down the driveline.
00:36:19Does the clutch release?
00:36:20And if you have a center stand, you can put the thing in an upper gear and see if you could pull the clutch, have someone pull the clutch while you try to turn the rear wheel.
00:36:37And you can increase the severity of this method by rolling the bike through its backlash to see if you can break the clutch plates loose.
00:36:49And there was a friend of mine who regularly had the plates of his older Triumph stick.
00:36:56He lived on a hill.
00:36:59He put the thing in an upper gear and he pulled the clutch, rolled down the hill, and then clunked it into gear.
00:37:13So, each morning.
00:37:16I had an old Kawasaki that did that.
00:37:18I think it was a KU-100.
00:37:20And I actually had to get it running and hammer it with the clutch pulled in until it finally broke free.
00:37:31And then it worked fine.
00:37:33I was sort of surprised.
00:37:34I had no idea.
00:37:35I mean, I'd never taken apart a clutch at that point.
00:37:37So, I was just trying to solve the problem without peering into the dark places.
00:37:43Into the dark places.
00:37:44Speaking of which, one of the things that I learned as a novice would-be racer was that if you have to service the clutch, remove the fairing, lay the motorcycle on its non-clutch side.
00:38:00And this way, you don't have to drain and refill the oil.
00:38:04You can pull all the screws, lift the clutch cover, do whatever you have to do in there.
00:38:09And incidentally, when you look at a clutch, you will probably notice that it has plate separators.
00:38:14Sometimes they are a steel wave spring that is put between each pair of friction discs.
00:38:22Or it may be a rubber piece.
00:38:26But the purpose is that when you lift the clutch, that those flexible elements will pull the plates apart for you.
00:38:38That's what they're for.
00:38:40That's the old dirtbiker's trick, kicking it on its side.
00:38:45That's what's great about a dirt bike.
00:38:46You just lay her down.
00:38:47But you're probably going to want to drain the oil.
00:38:49If you just got this thing out of the shed, you want to drain the oil.
00:38:52Yeah.
00:38:53On this Yamaha, why was the oil so thin?
00:38:57Because carbs had stuck and fuel dripped into the cylinders and got past the rings.
00:39:05And diluted the oil.
00:39:06The oil in this thing was like pond water.
00:39:08Black, brackish, very thin.
00:39:10And it smelled like gas.
00:39:11It was very clear.
00:39:13What had happened?
00:39:15So I did a short run.
00:39:16This, you know, an XS has a sump plate.
00:39:18You take off the sump plate.
00:39:19It's a big square piece.
00:39:20And you can get your finger up there and just rake out any scuzz in there.
00:39:26Old oil, I've found, can have a very high wax component.
00:39:33I don't know how it happened.
00:39:34I don't know what, I don't know when my 58 Triumph last ran when I got it.
00:39:39But I would bet it was 40 years.
00:39:43And the bottom of the oil tank was a solid mass of gunge.
00:39:49It was terrible.
00:39:50Yeah.
00:39:51I found out I got very lucky with that.
00:39:53I didn't know what I was doing.
00:39:54Didn't know what I didn't know.
00:39:55So I got that bike running, did the top end.
00:39:59I actually got it running without doing the top end.
00:40:01It had incredibly what I thought was a very high compression.
00:40:05And it did.
00:40:05It ended up having like 11 to 1 pistons in it with a 10 thou clearance, turns out.
00:40:14But before all of that, I was like, oh, yeah, ran when parked.
00:40:19And I kicked through and it had compression.
00:40:20I was like, wow, that's, I've never felt that.
00:40:22But I will try and get it running.
00:40:24So gas tank was in good shape.
00:40:26I didn't ever, didn't take the carburetor apart, put fuel in it, didn't drool out.
00:40:30It's like, hey, this is pretty cool.
00:40:32Just see, see if it starts.
00:40:33Did, you know, did my fresh gas, a little bit of oil in the cylinders and all that.
00:40:37And, um, it was very hard to kick and it kicked back, man, did it kick back through my shoe off of my foot in the yard.
00:40:49So, it would pop though.
00:40:54I'm like, I'm going to make this thing run.
00:40:56This is real high compression.
00:40:57I got it running and it was blowing back out the carburetor.
00:41:02There was mixture coming out and then going back in the, in the carburetor.
00:41:06And it made this horrific sound.
00:41:09And I'm like, I shut it down.
00:41:11I'm like, what is going on here?
00:41:12I had never pulled the valve caps off.
00:41:15I was just excited.
00:41:16So I pulled off the valve caps.
00:41:18The push rod on the right side had come out.
00:41:22And so it was not opening the exhaust valve.
00:41:26I got it to run and it was, I mean, it had the other piston helping it, but it was cycling through the intake valve and it still ran.
00:41:36Yeah.
00:41:36It did the top end.
00:41:37But what I, what I didn't know is I got this thing running and I took it on the Hanson dam ride that the Norton club puts on every year.
00:41:45And I ran into a guy, Mike Haney.
00:41:47It's where I also, where I first met Phil Getty of JRC engineering.
00:41:51And, um, they were like, man, I can't believe this bike.
00:41:56Cause it was really original.
00:41:57It was a 58 triumph trophy.
00:41:58And, and, um, that it still had the quick disconnect headlight.
00:42:02So back in the day they had a QD headlight with a big plug so that when you, you rode to your race.
00:42:08Class C.
00:42:10Yep.
00:42:10You could take off your headlight.
00:42:12You just unplugged it.
00:42:13It still had the QD plug.
00:42:14And they were like, I can't believe that it had all the washers in the right places and everything.
00:42:18And I wrote it.
00:42:19I wrote it to the Hanson dam ride, which is probably like an 80 mile ride from, from down south where our office is.
00:42:26And Mike Haney asked me like, Oh, did you clean the sludge trap?
00:42:29And I'm like, what are you talking about?
00:42:31Cause I had no idea what a sludge trap was, but inside the crank, there's a sludge trap.
00:42:34And sometimes they're so full and then you get the bike running, you re-oil it, you do all this stuff.
00:42:41It goes out and it seizes in the connecting rods.
00:42:46It stops the engine from turning.
00:42:47And I said, Oh no, did I do it wrong?
00:42:50He's like, no, no, it's running.
00:42:51I said, yeah.
00:42:52He's like, you're fine.
00:42:52But there is a, there is a lot you don't know.
00:42:57And I guess the encouragement that I have is like, I've always kept my eyes on the prize of wanting to ride something so bad, wanting that experience, like with the Bella set, with my Norton commando.
00:43:09So I don't know.
00:43:12I just gotta is what is that?
00:43:14I just gotta like it, that motivation to want to get that feeling and hear the sounds and experience the experience that's always driven me to buy the tool when I needed it.
00:43:25Or if I could afford it to make the tool, if I could make the tool, like highly motivating to me, for me to want to get on the bike and hear the sounds and have that experience.
00:43:36And that's what drives me.
00:43:37But don't give up, you know, take your notes.
00:43:41We're so fortunate now with cell phones and limitless photographs, video, video, the daylights out of it.
00:43:51I got this Ford F two 50, 89, bought it used from the original owner is pretty beat down.
00:43:57I'd never worked on this era of Ford pickup truck.
00:44:01I didn't know anything about it.
00:44:03I took a zillion photographs.
00:44:04I walked around and video things, videoed it.
00:44:07So I had a reference.
00:44:09If I start a specific job, I do that.
00:44:11I still write notes.
00:44:13You put all that stuff together and, and then you build your understanding.
00:44:17And what is like pulling a cylinder head?
00:44:21And it was such a huge deal to me, not on the truck, but, you know, years ago, it was such a huge deal to me to pull the cylinder head off of something.
00:44:29And now it's just like, yeah, pull, let's pull the head.
00:44:32Yes.
00:44:33No, let's just pull the head.
00:44:34When guys, when guys were, uh, when the Norton Manx was, uh, the privateers ride in three 50 and 500 CCs, it was normal to pull the head after Isle of Man practice, because then you could see the whole piston crown.
00:44:51And it was a trivial job to do it, because, um, you could have the head off in, in just a few minutes, make your examination and put it all back and make sure that it's properly timed and start the engine to be doubly sure.
00:45:08So it's, it does seem like a tremendous, uh, mountain to climb when you, when you first do it, but for so many people, it's routine.
00:45:22I met these guys who were running, I think there were three of them.
00:45:25They were running a 600 super sport engine and they'd been doing really quite well.
00:45:30And I said, what are you guys doing here?
00:45:32He said, well, we found that the engine lost a lot of power after it had run for a couple of hours.
00:45:38So, uh, we freshen up the top end every weekend, just pop cylinder head off, uh, reseat the valves, check everything out, put it back together, time it.
00:45:51Um, and then they basically had a fresh end engine at every start.
00:45:57Makes you long for the days of two strokes.
00:45:59You're going to have to mess with those stupid valves.
00:46:01Yeah.
00:46:01You know, but that's, that's something that, well, there's this, um, I remember two guys who needed a crank change.
00:46:13One guy had just come in from practice at Thompson, Connecticut, and he's pushing his bike.
00:46:19And he said, as he pushed by huffing and puffing crankshaft, uh, under an hour later, here he came back with a fresh crank in his motor running.
00:46:30And this was an RD 350.
00:46:33So this was a job he'd done several times.
00:46:36He was good at it.
00:46:37He could do it, um, in a jiffy.
00:46:41Two fellows called me up on the phone and said, would you be willing to receive calls from us answering questions while we changed the crank in our RD?
00:46:51It took them two weeks.
00:46:52It took them two weeks.
00:46:54But they did a fine job.
00:46:56Their motor ran.
00:46:57They were very pleased with it.
00:46:59And I was pleased to help because they, they climbed the mountain.
00:47:04Um, and, uh, a lot of people moan about all the little parts in the carburetor.
00:47:13Buy yourself one of those trays that has 50 little places in it to put all the parts and don't let the cat walk in it.
00:47:21Um, just to keep everything where you know what it is rather than saying, well, what's this, what's this thing?
00:47:32You'll know after you've been through the job once and you'll never forget.
00:47:36But, but that first time, give yourself every assistance.
00:47:42Yeah.
00:47:42Don't mix your carburetor parts with one carburetor to another, you know, SUs, AMOs, like the slide lives in the carburetor.
00:47:50Don't mix them up.
00:47:51Yeah.
00:47:52So, especially if it's used, I mean, if you're replacing the slide in the body or something like that, whatever.
00:47:57But I always use, um, I use trays per carburetor, cooking trays, stainless, like stainless little.
00:48:06Kitchen trays.
00:48:07Mm-hmm.
00:48:08And then, uh, Sharpie on it.
00:48:11Oh, sure.
00:48:12As long as I'm not putting solvent in there, you know, but grouping the parts, laying them out in the order they came out, things like that.
00:48:19Making note of what's the number on the needle.
00:48:23That's the other great thing is like, look at these glasses, right?
00:48:25These are great glasses.
00:48:26I'm 20-20.
00:48:27I could read down here.
00:48:28I could see Kevin.
00:48:29I could see off into, I see the moon.
00:48:32But I can't read a carburetor jet, even with these sometimes.
00:48:36But you can, uh, use your phone and zoom that camera in.
00:48:41It's, I have a hundred pictures of jets with their numbers.
00:48:47Um, I guess assuming, you know, here's, here's the thing about assuming what you're taking apart is what it purports to be, is that my XS650 had racked carburetors on it.
00:48:59So they were not, this is a 1972, it's an XS2.
00:49:03They were not racked.
00:49:04Yeah.
00:49:05They had a dual throttle cable.
00:49:08This bike had, in a good way, been converted to racked later carburetors.
00:49:12The jet kit I bought was wrong.
00:49:15Yeah.
00:49:15And so I ordered, I had to, I had to go through that, the forensic research of reading and reading and like, what's different?
00:49:22I'm like, oh, this is a 72.
00:49:24These are racked.
00:49:25Oh my goodness.
00:49:26And someone also pointed that out in comments on the video, uh, watching it.
00:49:30Oh, you, you've got, you've been upgraded to later carburetors.
00:49:33This is why we don't assume everything is as it was, you know?
00:49:36After the clutch release test, uh, you're going to check for gearbox speeds and you probably won't find any difficulty there, but it's a good thing to check.
00:49:50Uh, the next thing along, oh, another point of course is, is there leakage from the gearbox output seal?
00:49:57Uh, some people are going to do something for their, for their older bike and put modern synthetic gear oil in, for example, into a two stroke with a separate gearbox lubricant.
00:50:12And it causes the seals to shrink away from the thing they're sealing against and drip, drip begins to leak.
00:50:21So, have no fear, drain out the modern, highly recommended synthetic lubricant and refill with ordinary old, uh, lubricant and the seal will perform like new.
00:50:36So, the chains and sprockets, uh, is the chain a filthy mess, rusty?
00:50:43Look at the front sprocket in particular to see if the, if the teeth of that front sprocket are symmetrical or whether they are hooked over.
00:50:55As the sprocket, uh, wears, it wears on one side of each tooth so that gradually the, the tooth begins to look like it's hooked over.
00:51:05It's worth replacing sprockets on an older machine if there's any question about it.
00:51:11Um, nice to start with a new chain, but if the chain that's there is, uh, flexible and seems serviceable, well, you could re, uh, re-operate it as the Pratt & Whitney manual said.
00:51:29But it's a good thing also to check installation torque on rear sprocket bolts.
00:51:35Now, uh, my middle son is doing a jet running update on a 1988 GSX-R.
00:51:49It was ridden intensively by its owner for a period of time, but the tires on it, he looked up the codes.
00:51:56They are 24 years old.
00:51:58Uh, so that's something to bear in mind.
00:52:03Tires may look fine, but chemical change goes on inside the rubber.
00:52:09Fighting against that chemical change is a legion of anti-oxidizing soldiers who are fighting against the hardening of the rubber.
00:52:19I have some old race tires that, uh, takeoffs from years ago up in the shop.
00:52:27They are hard.
00:52:31So good idea.
00:52:33Um, you know, starting fresh with oil, starting fresh with fuel, starting fresh with rubber.
00:52:39Uh, chain and sprockets.
00:52:47The sum of all of these changes is not expensive.
00:52:51If you compare it with having someone do it at over a hundred dollars an hour.
00:53:00Learning not to pay a hundred dollars an hour.
00:53:02Or 200.
00:53:04Yes, or 200.
00:53:05You can go to a dealer, you can go to dealers and sell in California, about 200 bucks an hour.
00:53:10Yeah.
00:53:11Great.
00:53:12But you get that satisfaction of also knowing your machine.
00:53:15Uh, I, I would do, I didn't, I was lucky with the XS650.
00:53:19I did not have to change the chain and sprockets.
00:53:22I would like to, because it is geared on the short side.
00:53:24I'd like to give it more legs, but, um, it's perfectly fine.
00:53:29It's an old diamond chain.
00:53:32Oh, an old diamond.
00:53:33Yeah.
00:53:33Big old honking diamond chain.
00:53:35Very big for a 650, to be honest, but, uh, it's doing the job.
00:53:40I lube it frequently because it's an auto ring chain, but it's one of the things that I love
00:53:44about the XS650 is that it has a drum brake, which you don't have to mess with brake fluid
00:53:50because it's a mechanical drum brake.
00:53:52That's why I like vintage British so much.
00:53:55Fifties, sixties, British.
00:53:57Yep.
00:53:57Cable brakes, no hydraulics.
00:54:00I mean, hydraulic brakes are vastly superior, but you, so often you got to rebuild them.
00:54:07You're checking for leakage and, you know, they're pretty reliable, but there's a point
00:54:12where the master turns into white powder and.
00:54:14Yes.
00:54:15Or, or, or unidentifiable semi-solid substance.
00:54:20Um, this 88 GSXR had a front brake line that was blocked solid.
00:54:25Air pressure wouldn't touch it.
00:54:30Well, they swell on the inside sometimes and they can form.
00:54:33This is a really interesting thing I learned on an Austin Healey many years ago.
00:54:37The brake line turned into a check valve.
00:54:40Ah, yes.
00:54:41Because it had swelled on the inside.
00:54:43So you would apply the brake and you could force fluid through, but guess what?
00:54:46It wouldn't come out and the wheel locked.
00:54:49Well, one, one year Suzuki were having their, their panicky fuel stops at Daytona.
00:54:58And this is back in the days of overhead refuelers, not a dump can.
00:55:03And it turned out that what was happening.
00:55:06Oh, the bikes came in and they clicked the fueler in and the guy puts the air release
00:55:11fitting in and they're, they're counting off the seconds.
00:55:14The engine's running there moment of tension.
00:55:18The rider roars off, then runs out of gas.
00:55:22Then they ran the next rider out of gas.
00:55:25It wasn't delivering any fuel because a section of the liner in this, uh, three inch hose had
00:55:33come loose and was like a, a free agent tongue in one direction.
00:55:40It was a check valve and, and in the other direction it delivered.
00:55:45So, um, no fuel what came down into these bikes.
00:55:50So this is why the 88 GSX-R has new brake lines because the notion of, oh, we're going to be
00:56:00lucky this time.
00:56:01No.
00:56:02Correct it correctly.
00:56:07And the oldest tires don't have date codes on them.
00:56:13Often brake lines will have a date on them.
00:56:16Not always, but there's often a date on them.
00:56:19Oh, uh, the DOT number, it'll have, uh, like a 43 12 and that'd be the 43rd week of 2012.
00:56:26It's usually an oval pellet shaped thing on the side of the tire and you can find out
00:56:32how old it is.
00:56:33Um, the brake lines on my pickup truck were so old that, uh, the rubber was turning to
00:56:40kind of a black chalk and you could see the fabric weave that was once covered by black
00:56:45rubber.
00:56:46Yes.
00:56:46And the fellow was driving around with those brakes.
00:56:48Can you believe it?
00:56:496,000 pounds.
00:56:50Uh, one of the things about, um, brake service, of course, is you may need some snap ring pliers
00:56:59and you must remember that no brake, uh, rubber part can touch hydrocarbon solvents.
00:57:10So if you're cleaning, clean in brake fluid or isopropyl alcohol, because it is EPDM rubber,
00:57:18which stands for ethylene propylene, uh, diene monomer.
00:57:26And, uh, it's horribly, it swells horribly in petroleum solvents.
00:57:32So, um, if you're throwing all the parts away and starting new, uh, the temptation to try
00:57:39to wash up bad parts is no longer present and the rebuild kits are, uh, a lot cheaper than
00:57:48running into something because your brakes didn't work.
00:57:51So, um, sometimes you'll find things like one piston in a caliper, the brakes work, but
00:58:02only one caliper piston is working.
00:58:04The other one's stuck.
00:58:06So it's a good idea to bear that in mind when looking at such parts.
00:58:12Yeah.
00:58:13Getting out, getting out stuck pistons, boy.
00:58:16Um, oh, so sometimes in my early days, I was like, I'm going to get out of the
00:58:21and I was like, well, use compressed air and, um, there's a lot of dynamic energy in compressed
00:58:27air because it re-compresses.
00:58:29It comes out of your compressor and you stick it in and if it's really stuck, you can build
00:58:34up a hundred PSI in a heartbeat and then the piston has a hundred PSI behind it and let's
00:58:38go.
00:58:40Not a good situation.
00:58:41So what I, uh, knowing I'm going to rebuild something and I got to get the caliper apart,
00:58:46I got to get the pistons out, I will, uh, I will use a grease gun, a hand pump grease gun
00:58:53and I'll pump grease into the piston.
00:58:55And then that way you get a slow, uh, a slow push out knowing I'm going to replace the rubber
00:59:01parts and all that.
00:59:02And I'm going to clean.
00:59:02There's nothing springy inside to expand suddenly and send the piston across the shop.
00:59:08So yes, good, good suggestion.
00:59:12I, I think it's also useful to, uh, do the, um, the Ray Plum test on the suspension, which
00:59:22is, uh, sit on the bike, hold the front brake on and push up and down.
00:59:28It should go down easily and come up with some restraint indicating that the rebound damping
00:59:35function is present.
00:59:37I took a part of fork on a 1967 bike and found that the check valve in one fork leg was upside
00:59:47down.
00:59:50Um, so I think that it's, it's useful to test some things without the spring.
00:59:59Um, if you're taking the front fork legs out, um, there are all sorts of tests that you can
01:00:04do, but of course now we're getting into the realm of assembly and that's not our subject
01:00:10at the moment.
01:00:11Our subject is checking.
01:00:13Yeah.
01:00:13Checking the front end.
01:00:14I mean, I had a neighbor, uh, with a whole monster, like a six 20 monster, 35, 40,000 miles.
01:00:26And he had a host of, of difficulties that I was helping him with.
01:00:31But I was like, dude, your tires are ancient.
01:00:36We gotta, you gotta get some tires on this thing.
01:00:38So we ordered tires and I was helping him with the tires and, uh, I compressed the front
01:00:46end and it went down and stayed.
01:00:52Yes.
01:00:52And then I pulled it and it came back.
01:00:55I was like, huh?
01:00:57I said, well, my friend, this is, this is a weird situation.
01:01:00This is not good.
01:01:01You rode this here.
01:01:02Yeah.
01:01:03Okay.
01:01:04Let's just take, we're going to get in here and take it apart.
01:01:08We've got to take the wheel off.
01:01:09Um, there was a bit of a pop taking the axle out and it was highly friction, highly frictionable.
01:01:19So ideally your axle would just go in without too much trouble.
01:01:23Like if you support the wheel, so there's not bearing gravity down it, you can pull the
01:01:28axle out.
01:01:29Yes.
01:01:30It should slide out.
01:01:31Maybe in the pinch bolts, it's a little tight, but you do undo the pinch bolts.
01:01:34It really, it, it shouldn't go and it was doing that and I was like, check this out.
01:01:39So I undid the lower triple clamp bolts and I did it and it went pop and the fork had been
01:01:48twisted and it, who knows how long this kid had been riding that bike and he doesn't know
01:01:52any different.
01:01:53He's a newer rider.
01:01:54He just doesn't know.
01:01:56Um, so there's that, there's the steering head bearings.
01:02:00I just make it a rule to take steering heads apart.
01:02:03I just, because of being picky and, um, I used to say I was a snob, but then my friend
01:02:10said, no, you're an elitist, you know, you, an elitist appreciates the finer things.
01:02:18The snob just wants them because they're fine.
01:02:20I'm like, ah, fair enough.
01:02:22Um, but yeah, so I, um, I change, you know, like on, on a Yamaha XS, Valisette, you can
01:02:30get tapered roller bearing conversions because they typically have uncaptured balls, a lot
01:02:36of the old bikes.
01:02:37And if you change your seats to tapered roller bearings, man, you get a, it's like a changed
01:02:43motorcycle.
01:02:44And what they would.
01:02:45It's like a railroad wheel, wheel bearing.
01:02:48Yeah.
01:02:49So you get, you know, you get a flat roller on a tapered service.
01:02:53And, and, uh, when you adjust that correctly, that's the other thing is you're going to,
01:02:56you want to check for play.
01:02:57Any kind of click.
01:02:58If you feel a click when you apply the brakes and you know that your steering head may
01:03:02be.
01:03:02Or you can stand in front of the bike with the wheel between your knees, put the brake
01:03:06on and pull it toward you.
01:03:07If there's looseness, you'll feel that clicking.
01:03:09This is, this is the tech inspection.
01:03:13Yeah.
01:03:13These are kneel, kneel to the side of both front and rear wheels, grasp the top or the
01:03:19fender and go.
01:03:21If there are loose spokes, loose bearings, um, wrong spacer in place, you'll feel it.
01:03:29Yeah.
01:03:30The Yamaha just, I keep saying Yamaha, is this a drinking game?
01:03:33I don't know, but it's just the recent thing that I revived.
01:03:36So it's top of mind, but it has all the problems, plastic swing arm bushes.
01:03:41That's what they came with from the factory.
01:03:43And so I'm like, okay, it's on the center stand that I'm doing the wheels.
01:03:47So I pull, you know, I'm going to pull the wheels, but I do what Kevin said.
01:03:52Bike's on the, on the lift, hold the seat, hold the frame, grab the back of the rear
01:03:57wheel at the very rear works great on a Norton commando for ice elastics as well.
01:04:03And you go, and I think the spec was like.
01:04:06Two millimeters.
01:04:07And it was probably like five or 10.
01:04:08I mean, it was a lot.
01:04:10And so, yeah.
01:04:11Okay.
01:04:12We got to do swing arm bushes.
01:04:13You know, that's a, you, you don't want this movement on your back wheel.
01:04:18You don't want that thing wagging around.
01:04:20Because it's competing with your steering.
01:04:22Yep.
01:04:23It has its own opinion about where the bike should go.
01:04:26And on a bike like that, like I did with my RD 350 tapered, uh, head bearings and bronze
01:04:33bushes.
01:04:34Cause you can buy those, put them in the freezer, moderately warm up your swing arm with like
01:04:39a propane torch.
01:04:40Don't burn the paint off, but man, they just slide right in, grease them up, put it back
01:04:45together.
01:04:45You wouldn't believe the difference in your motorcycle.
01:04:48When, when I was doing AMA tech, uh, I encountered two motorcycles that had had aftermarket swing
01:04:58arms put on them.
01:04:59And the owner has not put any bearings in them.
01:05:04They were really loose.
01:05:06Oh, geez.
01:05:08So, uh, these are reasonable checks to make.
01:05:13Yep.
01:05:14Everybody has different standards.
01:05:16It's shocking, you know, why I use it when I go to the airport, you know, I go to the general
01:05:21aviation airport.
01:05:22My son's taking flying lessons.
01:05:24We just go to the restaurant, we eat, and then we walk around and look at planes.
01:05:27And, uh, you think, huh, this guy's flying that.
01:05:32I mean, front knuckle of the tricycle landing gear covered in dirt.
01:05:39Yeah.
01:05:40Every pivot covered in dirt.
01:05:42The, a lot of the planes have a generator or alternator that's run off of a wheel on
01:05:47the propeller.
01:05:48And so the fan belt, basically it's a V belt and goes over to a generator and it makes
01:05:53the electric power.
01:05:54And you can see that you can see them because they're in the front of the cowling.
01:05:58And you look at this rubber belt and you're like, Ooh, I wouldn't, I wouldn't trust that
01:06:03on my board.
01:06:06I wouldn't, I wouldn't drive with that.
01:06:08And here's someone going up in the air and flying with it.
01:06:11There's just people who are like that, who, it'll be fine.
01:06:14That's good.
01:06:15It's worked before or whatever.
01:06:17I don't know what the thinking is.
01:06:18So it's, everyone has different standards.
01:06:20That's why when you buy a bike, sometimes people say like, Oh no, it's great.
01:06:23It's really fun to ride.
01:06:24And then you get it and the swing arm bushings are shot and it's terrifying to ride or, or
01:06:30they don't ride it hard.
01:06:32And if you do, if you want to go, okay.
01:06:35You know, it might be fine at a lot of things are, are just fine at 60%, even brand new bikes.
01:06:42You know, when we go to test a motorcycle, 60, 80% motor, virtually everything, especially
01:06:48brand new is, is great.
01:06:50It's when you take it up to that, you know, 99% that you begin to see the problems.
01:06:56We had a test bike years ago.
01:06:58Um, really fun bike, pretty comfortable on the street, got it on the track, front end
01:07:04chatter, like deadly front end chatter.
01:07:07Wow.
01:07:09Not designed to do this, I guess there were no problems.
01:07:12But even, even prepped motorcycles, prepped motorcycles for magazine testing, they generally
01:07:19put a lot of effort into that.
01:07:20You know, we're going to test the bike and we're going to, we're making the defining statement
01:07:24about the motorcycle in a road test.
01:07:27We use tools.
01:07:28We measure, we dyno, we go to the drag strip, we do all this stuff.
01:07:33You'd think they'd be perfect and they are perfect or not.
01:07:37Uh, front wheels mounted backwards, tires mounted backwards.
01:07:42On front wheels facing the correct direction.
01:07:45Um, things not torqued, loose, loose brake calipers has happened.
01:07:50You know, they put new tires on it and went through the whole thing, torqued the axle and
01:07:55did not torque the bolts for the calipers.
01:07:57Here's something that I strongly recommend.
01:08:00And that is, uh, go over a motorcycle with a cloth and clean things because this will cause
01:08:11you to look at everything.
01:08:13And it is remarkable how many, uh, negatives you can find.
01:08:20I used to find, see so many cracked exhaust systems on race bikes.
01:08:24People would say, don't come near my bike.
01:08:27Just, just get away from here.
01:08:29Because, uh, I would see cracks even at a distance.
01:08:34And it's a good idea to have your eye on such things because cracked parts can let you down.
01:08:44Firm believer in, in cleaning your bike for sure.
01:08:47And not so much to, out of fastidiousness as a means of disciplining yourself to look at everything.
01:08:58Ting the spokes.
01:08:59If you, if you've got an older bike that you're looking at, uh, get the wheel off the ground,
01:09:07give it a spin and ting the spokes with a metal tool.
01:09:12So, are they dull, are they irregular, or do they nicely sing a nearly constant song?
01:09:21Uh, gives you some insight into whether this is a, a badly neglected wheel.
01:09:27You can also, when you spin the wheel, see if it's turning straight or if it's doing a, a, uh, shimmy, shimmy, cocoa bop.
01:09:37Yeah, it's nice.
01:09:38That's, that's a good thing to look at.
01:09:40I, I guess my description of what I do with a wheel on a used bike is I make love to the wheel.
01:09:45So if I'm, if it's in my shop already and I'm going to work on it, I take the wheel off.
01:09:51I spin it as Kevin describes.
01:09:53I spin it.
01:09:53I stick my finger on the swing arm and I'll spin it or a screwdriver and just look at the deviation, whatever there is.
01:09:59As, as my sort of truing stand, uh, makeshift truing stand and on a bike like the XS, it's got a non-o-ring chain and a drum brake and you spin that rear wheel and it just, it just goes on and on.
01:10:13Whereas with an o-ring chain, there's a little bit of drag.
01:10:15It kind of wants to push through.
01:10:17If I do that, then pull the axle off, note all the spacers, do all that stuff, get the wheel out, check the wheel bearings, just stick your finger in there and spin the wheel bearing like this.
01:10:28Is it perfectly smooth or does it go, and if it does that, you're probably going to want to replace that wheel bearing and it's not hard.
01:10:35You know, it's a little bit of coldness, a little bit of warmth, it goes right in.
01:10:40Don't worry about it, but it will make such a difference.
01:10:43Wheel bearings, swing arm pivot, steering head bearings, motor mounts.
01:10:49All pivots.
01:10:50Yeah, all pivots.
01:10:52Check for existence of engine bolts.
01:10:54Again, in tech inspection, I found numerous motorcycles that had fewer than all engine bolts fitted.
01:11:03And these were people who were frantically trying to get their bike ready for an event.
01:11:10And they just, they took a call or the wife said, this is, I'm throwing the dinner away if you don't eat it.
01:11:21The engine bolts were never all installed and torqued.
01:11:25So, these are things that you will discover if you go over a motorcycle in fine detail, which I strongly recommend.
01:11:34It is a way of getting to know it, quite literally.
01:11:38These problems, one of the things that I discovered to my amusement, Kawasaki's H1R, which was a 500cc triple two-stroke production racer, had a reputation for terrible handling.
01:12:03So, I bought one that had come out of a field among tall corn.
01:12:12And I decided to take the springs off the rear shocks.
01:12:18One rear shock went, it just went up and down without resistance.
01:12:24Had no lubricant, had no damping oil in it.
01:12:27And when I took the, it was a threaded together type of damper.
01:12:31And when I put a hook spanner on the top plug and unscrewed it, I found that the O-ring had evidently been put in dry.
01:12:43And the last tightening had caused it to do this, to become a D-ring.
01:12:49And the first several strokes of the suspension pumped the oil out.
01:12:55The other damper was normal.
01:12:58Goes down, compresses easily, and rebounds slowly, which is normal.
01:13:07So, this is why I recommend the no spring test, both front and rear.
01:13:13And as Mark has noted, it's possible that fork tubes may have been bent and straightened, or the whole thing may have been put together a little off.
01:13:27And when you compress the front suspension, it stays down.
01:13:31I just read the other day that Les Graham was in his, in the first ride of the season on an MV factory bike that it stuck down.
01:13:44And he was, he was killed.
01:13:49So, these are not casual matters.
01:13:54You want things to be functional as they're intended to be.
01:13:58So, that, you have a good ride.
01:14:04Yeah.
01:14:06A quick, quick vote for the GIS screwdriver, Japanese industrial standard.
01:14:11If you're working on Japanese bikes, the screws like that have a little dot on them.
01:14:15But sometimes they don't.
01:14:17Looks like a Phillips, but it's not a Phillips.
01:14:19The angles and everything are different.
01:14:22You can cheat it with a Phillips, but you'll recognize the screws that have been cheated,
01:14:26because they'll be hogged out horribly.
01:14:28GIS, when you, in a new GIS screw with a new GIS screwdriver, the fit is beautiful.
01:14:35It's a solid drive.
01:14:37It's so wonderful.
01:14:38It's great.
01:14:39So, GIS screwdriver.
01:14:41I wanted to talk about the actual physical battery.
01:14:45Some vintage bikes, charging systems.
01:14:47Some vintage bikes have mechanical voltage regulators, which after 50 years could work, or they could stick,
01:14:54and you could rev your bike up, and you could have 21 volts, and then a misfire happened on my RD.
01:15:00The XS650 seemed to be working okay, but I thought, you know, we have regulator rectifiers that are solid state, and they're wonderful.
01:15:10So, let's just go ahead and use a brand new solid state one, and it was a little challenging to figure out the wiring,
01:15:18but the company that I used had a good tech resource, and I rearranged the plugs and got everything going again,
01:15:26and now it charges reliably at about 14.2 volts.
01:15:33Battery types.
01:15:34I'm a big fan of the AGM lead-acid sealed battery, AGM absorbed glass mat.
01:15:41They are more expensive.
01:15:44There's brands that have an Odyssey battery in my Ducati that's an AGM battery.
01:15:50It's eight years old, and it's going strong.
01:15:53It could be as much as double the price or more of a flooded lead-acid battery,
01:16:00so that's, like, your typical plates, little plugs in the top.
01:16:05You buy it dry-charged, and you get a tub of acid, and you fill up each one of the things.
01:16:11You leave the cells.
01:16:12You leave the caps out.
01:16:14You let it settle.
01:16:16Put a little more in so that the heights are correct.
01:16:18Then you have a vent tube, and the part number of the battery will describe where the terminals are.
01:16:25It'll describe the voltage.
01:16:26It'll describe the amp hour, and it'll also describe the orientation of the vent
01:16:30if it is a vented lead-acid battery.
01:16:34Perfectly acceptable.
01:16:35I put one on the Yamaha vented lead-acid UASA.
01:16:39It's fine.
01:16:40They just tend to make corrosive gas,
01:16:42and if you have a situation where you overcharge the battery or something happens,
01:16:46that's why the tube is there.
01:16:48You want to try and run that below the bike,
01:16:50but the tubes always fall off or, you know, take whatever happens,
01:16:53and then that's why that very same bike has acid etching on the chrome of the exhaust pipe,
01:17:01and the paint is damaged on the frame.
01:17:04You just have to know that going in, that if you're buying a vented lead-acid battery,
01:17:09particularly when they get old, they can make more gas,
01:17:12and they can corrode the terminals faster, things like that.
01:17:15When you get a sealed AGM, it's all inside the battery.
01:17:19It's its own kind of, like, weather system, I guess.
01:17:22Like, it's designed to take care of whatever's happening with hydrogen and moisture
01:17:27and all the things that go on inside chemically,
01:17:30and you can orient them in any way.
01:17:33They do not spill.
01:17:34So I spend, if I really love the bike, I spend the money.
01:17:39On older bikes, you can sometimes be challenged on finding the battery in the parts finder.
01:17:45Like, you go to a battery manufacturer, and it doesn't go back to 1972,
01:17:49or it doesn't go back to 58, or whatever you're trying to do.
01:17:53Assuming that the battery fits well, that's on the bike,
01:17:57like, if you open it up, and it's got correct hold-downs,
01:18:00or it's got a bungee cord, and it looks like it's in the right spot,
01:18:04and the positive is on the correct corner of the battery,
01:18:08and the negative is on the correct corner of the battery,
01:18:09and the wires are oriented in a nice way,
01:18:12you can take that battery and say, here's the plus, here's the minus,
01:18:16here's the dimensions, and you can go,
01:18:19and you can find the battery's dimensions and get close.
01:18:22It's better to buy one a little shorter
01:18:24and put something under it to buff it up
01:18:27than to stick one that's in too tall, and then close your seat.
01:18:31Have a surprise.
01:18:32Weld the terminals together.
01:18:33The moment I was telling our shop guy a couple years ago
01:18:39about what not to do with the modern lithium battery
01:18:46and electronic ignition and stuff,
01:18:49it's like, you don't want to shock this.
01:18:51You take this negative off first,
01:18:53because then if you touch the positive,
01:18:56when you're undoing the positive,
01:18:58if you touch the frame or some ground,
01:19:00if the negative's already undone,
01:19:02that's where you just undo the negative.
01:19:04You can touch the wrench to the negative in the chassis,
01:19:06because it's already connected.
01:19:08But you don't want to do that to the positive,
01:19:09because you make a spark.
01:19:10And I told him, this is how you do this with a battery,
01:19:14and then he takes the wrench,
01:19:15and he fumbles it and drops it,
01:19:17and it goes across the terminals and goes,
01:19:19and shoots off.
01:19:23Lithium batteries, love them for their lightweight.
01:19:26Their self-discharge rate is much slower
01:19:28than a lead-acid battery.
01:19:30You're looking at like maybe 1% per month or something.
01:19:34So they can go between charges for, you know,
01:19:37practically ever.
01:19:39But if you invest in a lithium battery,
01:19:41you want to have a charging system
01:19:43that's designed to work with a lithium battery,
01:19:44which is generally at a lower charge rate.
01:19:48A lot of lithium batteries have circuitry
01:19:51inside the top of the battery
01:19:53that helps balance the charge.
01:19:55You need to use a charger,
01:19:57like I've got a battery-tendered Junior
01:20:00trickle charger, or not trickle charger,
01:20:02smart charger,
01:20:04and it has a button to change the lithium,
01:20:05because I believe it'll lower the voltage going in.
01:20:08So you don't want to just take
01:20:10your mechanically voltage-regulated Yamaha XS650
01:20:13and go, yeah, man,
01:20:15I'm putting a lithium battery in there.
01:20:17I'm going to save nine pounds,
01:20:18or whatever you're going to save out of it.
01:20:20You could also overcharge the battery,
01:20:23or do something like that.
01:20:24So good old lead acid is great.
01:20:26If you have an application
01:20:27that is designed for lithium,
01:20:30like they're selling, you know,
01:20:31lithium iron is a nice, safe chemistry,
01:20:33and lots of new bikes are coming with those
01:20:38because they are lighter,
01:20:39and they have such a tremendous amount
01:20:40of energy in them.
01:20:42But it's got to be,
01:20:44you can put it in an Avenger bike
01:20:45if you get a voltage regulator rectifier
01:20:47that's smart, MOSFET's nice,
01:20:50and then also it's specifically
01:20:54stayed into work with lithium.
01:20:57I'm remembering that in classical times,
01:21:01the 1960s and 70s,
01:21:03you could always identify the setup kid
01:21:06in a shop because of the holes in his T-shirt,
01:21:10which resulted from acid spills
01:21:13when filling new batteries.
01:21:16Yeah, nasty business.
01:21:22Well, I think we'll call it, Kevin.
01:21:24Okay.
01:21:25I hope your bike is running.
01:21:30You can see some of this process
01:21:31in the Ran When Parked episode
01:21:33on the Motorcyclist YouTube channel.
01:21:34I did that.
01:21:35I did two episodes.
01:21:36We did another one on a XT500,
01:21:39and there's more to come there.
01:21:40I love working on old stuff.
01:21:43I appreciate your perspective, Kevin,
01:21:45and made a few things run in your day.
01:21:50I always feel good
01:21:51when I've looked into the dark place,
01:21:53and that which was baffling
01:21:55and terrifying is no longer.
01:21:59And I love the confidence
01:22:01of putting something together
01:22:02and knowing and not wondering
01:22:03if I got it right,
01:22:06knowing I got it right,
01:22:06and having the judgment built
01:22:08by doing it over and over
01:22:09and making all the mistakes.
01:22:12It's your quote from many years ago,
01:22:15basically, that the view,
01:22:17what is it,
01:22:18something like the view I've established
01:22:20is due to me standing
01:22:21on the mountain of broken parts
01:22:23that I've been associated with.
01:22:26And it's true.
01:22:27You just try things.
01:22:30My dad said to me
01:22:32with skepticism in his voice,
01:22:34what makes you think
01:22:35that when you put
01:22:36all these pieces together
01:22:38that this thing
01:22:39can never run again?
01:22:42And I said,
01:22:43I hope mildly to him,
01:22:46if it has compression,
01:22:49fuel, spark,
01:22:51and timing,
01:22:52it has no choice.
01:22:54It has to run.
01:22:57And when you get it right,
01:22:59when you make sure
01:23:00that you have those things,
01:23:01it will run.
01:23:03It's not an opportunity
01:23:07for caprice.
01:23:10You will find exceptions,
01:23:12but you will also become adept
01:23:14in diagnosing and correcting them.
01:23:17Good times.
01:23:23Get out there,
01:23:24work on it.
01:23:25And then ride it.
01:23:27Throw a light in a dark place
01:23:28and then feel that freedom.
01:23:30Is there anything better
01:23:31than a bike
01:23:31that starts on first kick
01:23:32after you work on it?
01:23:34That's true.
01:23:36Starts, runs.
01:23:38That's good.
01:23:39Yep.
01:23:40Ignition,
01:23:40advanced springs.
01:23:43Lubrication of things
01:23:44that have not been lubricated.
01:23:45And then it just runs.
01:23:48So nice.
01:23:49Well, thanks for listening, folks.
01:23:51We'll catch you next time.
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