- 5 months ago
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00:00Are you so afraid of that that that's got your mind locked up?
00:05No, I'm so, I don't understand.
00:07Go over to the morgue and look at all them dead people.
00:09Just explain to me though, I'm not dumb, explain to me simply why that house that night, why they went there.
00:15Which house, which night?
00:17The house on Chelo Drive, the Tate House, why did they go there that night?
00:21Because Tex had been there before and he went to a familiar place.
00:26And why did they kill people that night?
00:28What did they think they were doing for you?
00:30Because they freaked out, man.
00:31Tex was stoned.
00:32You know, he got, everybody was loaded, man.
00:35He said he wasn't.
00:35He said he was coming off an LASD trip.
00:38He had a little speed.
00:40A little speed.
00:40Well, not around me he didn't have no speed because I wouldn't allow no speed on that ranch.
00:44I'd kick ass over there.
00:46I don't allow that stuff around me.
00:49I'd take a little grasp, a little LASD, but under that it was destructive.
00:53You can ask any of them other girls that'll tell you that.
00:56The other side of this game, I don't play, I don't play drugs.
01:00I play, I play light, light, you know, light, dibby-dabby, chippy-in, but I don't really get down heavy with it.
01:07What did they think they were doing?
01:08Are we ready here, man?
01:09Yeah, we're ready.
01:09We're ready.
01:10We're ready here.
01:11Okay, ready.
01:12War.
01:12What did they think they were doing?
01:13We are at war now.
01:15But what did they think they were doing for you?
01:17They weren't doing anything for me.
01:18What did they think they were doing for you?
01:20Okay, okay.
01:21If you are me and I am you, everything you do is for you is for me, too.
01:25So what did they think they were achieving for you?
01:27I am you and you are me and we are all together.
01:30And then who's responsible for a calm together over me right now?
01:34It's all his fault.
01:36Oh, no, no, it's his fault.
01:37No, we put another false face on it.
01:38It's Halloween.
01:39It's your fault.
01:39So, now, wait a minute.
01:42Criminal behavior is the same.
01:44It's mundane in most minds.
01:47Criminal will always go to a familiar place.
01:50Tex had been to that house.
01:52Tex went back to that house.
01:54Here's the conversation.
01:56Indian Mesa.
01:57We got four campfires.
01:59We got four queens on a motorcycle gang, a motorcycle group that rides SS motorcycles out of Venice, Santa Monica.
02:07So we're riding motorcycles and we're all up there and we got these fires going.
02:11We got this big problem that came up.
02:14I had to go shoot somebody for Tex.
02:17Bobby's in prison.
02:18My brother's in jail.
02:20Now, understand my mind.
02:21All my life I've been in jail because I didn't have no one to get me out of jail.
02:24I didn't have no brother outside.
02:26So I spent years and years and years and years just because nobody would come and sign their name and get me out of jail.
02:32And the jail couldn't let me out because I didn't have no place to go.
02:34So I spent 22 years in prison because I didn't have nobody outside.
02:38I can't let somebody that's with me stay in jail.
02:41It just ain't, you know, it's not in my makeup, man.
02:43I got to get my brother out of jail.
02:45So you needed money to do that.
02:46Well, here's the division between your mind and my mind.
02:50Here's where the chamber opens up.
02:52When you get in trouble, you go to your mother.
02:54You call up mother.
02:54I ain't got no mother to call.
02:56Well, you go to the bank, draw some money, pay a lawyer.
02:58I ain't got no money.
02:59I can't go to no lawyer.
03:00I go to the lawyer.
03:01I ain't got enough money.
03:02I got a little money.
03:03And anytime anybody knows anything about lawyers, when you got a little money, they're just taking that.
03:07They'll take the little money unless you sue them in court.
03:09You dig?
03:09In other words, like, I don't have enough money to go to the lawyer to get Bobby out.
03:13So everybody's standing around.
03:14I said, pay me.
03:17Pay me what you owe me now.
03:19And they said, well, how do we do that?
03:20I said, get my brother out of jail.
03:23He said, how do we do it?
03:23I said, I don't know how you do it.
03:25I don't care how you do it.
03:26Do it now.
03:27Do it.
03:28And they said, how do we do it?
03:29I said, don't ask me how to do it.
03:31I don't want to be no part of no conspiracy.
03:33But however you do it, do it and get it done now.
03:36And they said, well, we don't know what to do.
03:38We'll get a lawyer.
03:38And then, here, Leslie and Patty, they said, if we get a lawyer, all they're going to do is lie and take our money anyway.
03:48Anyway, now, system, blame it on your lawyers.
03:54If your lawyers ain't lying and taking the money of the poor people, then the poor people got a court to stand on.
03:59And they got rights as individuals with a revolution they fought in 1776 that guarantees rights to a common, ordinary farmer, poor man on the street like me, a rebel.
04:09I got my rights in the 76 courtroom.
04:11If you don't give me my rights in the courtroom, then I become King George.
04:15And I got all the rights then.
04:17And when I stand on the mountain and I say, do it, it gets done.
04:21If it don't get done, then I'll move on it.
04:24And that's the last thing in the world you want me to do because I got that Confederate sword in the kitchen.
04:30Don't invoke me.
04:32Do it.
04:33Get it done.
04:34How do we do it?
04:34I don't know.
04:35I don't want to be involved in it.
04:38I keep a close watch on this heart of mine.
04:43In Japan, they call it ninja.
04:46I don't get involved in violence.
04:49I'm not a violent human being.
04:52Did you tell the women to do their witchy things?
04:55I said, if you're going to do something, leave something witchy.
04:59Just like I would tell you, if you're going to do something, do it well.
05:07And leave something witchy.
05:08Leave a sign to let the world know that you were there.
05:11Have a good day.
05:13Did you tell them which words?
05:15No.
05:15Pig?
05:16No.
05:16Helter Skelter?
05:17No.
05:17Arise?
05:18No.
05:19That's not my vocabulary.
05:21That's not my generation.
05:22I keep telling you that.
05:23Leslie said, in the car on the way to the LaBianca house, you said, this time, make sure they're
05:33not scared like last night.
05:36Oh, no.
05:37It may have been something like this.
05:43Yeah.
05:44I remember something like that, but I don't remember exactly the right words.
05:47I don't remember exactly the right words, but that's a simple philosophy from China.
05:53That's a Chinese philosophy.
05:55If you're going to go to war and you're fighting your enemy and you kill him when he's afraid,
06:04it's a bad omen.
06:05It's bad.
06:06It's bad.
06:07So you try to absorb the fear with, I think the Hindus use that word, karma.
06:15It's a balance of karma.
06:15And that's why you reassured Mr. LaBianca?
06:19No, no.
06:20I mentioned that in a conversation about something.
06:23You know, what it was about, I don't know.
06:26You know, but I remember the conversation.
06:29Look.
06:33Listen.
06:36My words.
06:38I live and die by my words.
06:40I've lived and died by my words all my life.
06:43For 45 years in prison.
06:44Listen, I keep my word.
06:47My word is my bond.
06:48I walk on my word.
06:50I live on my word.
06:51Do you want the world to let you alone and turn away?
06:53Listen.
06:54I broke no law.
06:58Try to understand that.
07:00I broke no law.
07:01I didn't step out of line with God and I didn't step out of line with the man.
07:07I did not break the law.
07:10Now, I told those people the same thing that the United States president would tell them.
07:16The only way that you can dispensate life and death is you have to be willing to give yourself to that cause.
07:26You can't fight a revolution.
07:28You can't do anything unless you're willing to submit yourself to that cause.
07:33In other words, that's what you learn in the military.
07:37Did you tell them to mutilate so that it would be memorable, so that people would know something was going on?
07:44Did you tell them to do it in a memorable way?
07:47Hey, I told you what I told them.
07:50If you're going to move and you're going to do something, do it with your soul and your heart.
07:54Do it right, man.
07:55Don't half step on it.
07:57Did they do it right?
07:58I don't know.
07:59That's up to them.
08:00They live with that.
08:02They're responsible for their actions.
08:04I'm responsible for my actions.
08:06You think the world's going to forget about you?
08:08Which world?
08:08Every person in here is a world.
08:10This united world of America.
08:13You think it's going to forget about you now and move on?
08:16Forget, forget, forgot.
08:17Forget, forgot.
08:18That's a bit of battle in the middle of the minute.
08:21Boom.
08:22Boom.
08:23We're trying to unify Germany now.
08:25Look here.
08:27See, here's another thing you guys don't understand.
08:29You've got an underworld and an overworld.
08:31You guys live in the overworld.
08:33I live in the underworld.
08:34You know?
08:35It's like you think the Second World War is over.
08:38Second World War is not over.
08:41You understand what I'm telling you?
08:43The Second World War is not over.
08:46Is Charlie Manson crazy?
08:48Whatever that means.
08:49Sure.
08:50He's crazy.
08:50He's mad as a hatter.
08:51What difference does it make?
08:52You know, a long time ago, being crazy meant something.
08:55Nowadays, everybody's crazy.
08:56So, I mean, you know, like, you know, synonymous.
08:59I mean, it's an irony, man.
09:01It's a paradox.
09:01I mean, are you crazy?
09:03Dressed in black?
09:04You think I don't know everything that goes with that black you're dressed in?
09:06Yeah.
09:10Where's your black gloves?
09:12You got your rings.
09:13You think, I don't understand your blue rings and your yellow best skin.
09:16You think there's anything wrong.
09:18Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
09:20Yeah, and then behind that, then, you know, there's a...
09:23What do you think about all day long?
09:27I try not to think.
09:28I try to clear my mind.
09:30Are you a changed man?
09:31They say they're changed women.
09:32Changed.
09:32I was a changed man when I got out last time.
09:36I learned.
09:36I learned.
09:37I learned my lesson well.
09:41What's the lesson you've learned from all this?
09:43I don't exist in your world.
09:45I'm only what is, what it is.
09:50It is what it is.
09:53Do you think they were uniquely children of those times,
09:58or you think kids would do the same thing again?
09:59I think those kids were beautiful.
10:01And do you think kids today would do the same thing for you?
10:04I think, now, see, if I say that, you're going to put me in another conspiracy?
10:10Now, everything that derives from this is going to be all my fault.
10:12I'm coming back because, ooh, you know, I know.
10:15It's, you know, like, where does the buck stop?
10:18You know, like.
10:19Do you want to come back?
10:21Come back where?
10:22With more followers.
10:24Oh, come on.
10:24More followers.
10:25Ain't it just a ball of boom boom baby bucks on brand?
10:28You said you were the heart of the place.
10:32I had no followers.
10:33You said you were the energy of the place.
10:35I was the energy of the place only because I was there.
10:37I didn't even realize I was the energy of the place.
10:40You know, I didn't know everybody out there was dead.
10:42I really didn't.
10:43You know, I really honestly didn't know that everybody was running on what someone else said.
10:48You know, they said, they said the kids come up and they said, what can we do?
10:51I said, do whatever you want to do.
10:52They said, you can't tell the children to do whatever they want to do.
10:55How did you learn what they'd done?
10:56But over the period of years, I, you know, I figured it all out.
10:59I went through my mind to figure out how things happen, you know.
11:03But how did you learn what had happened those two nights?
11:06The next day and then the day?
11:07Oh, no.
11:07Each morning after?
11:08It took years, man.
11:09I've been going through a lot of changes in here.
11:10I was on cell 13 and death row walking back and forth and saying, how did I end up here?
11:15I was headed for, I was going to San Diego.
11:17What did I do here?
11:18You know, in other words, like, wow, this is not, I didn't pick this trip.
11:21I didn't ask for this hand.
11:23That's what I said.
11:23We'll hold you on the table and we'll deal this hand to you.
11:26Hey, you got a hippie cult leader?
11:27I'm not a hippie cult leader.
11:28I never was a hippie.
11:29I don't know what a hippie was, man.
11:30But I come back one more time.
11:31I want to ask this one more time.
11:34You were not a shocked man when they came back.
11:37All right, I'll put it to you this way.
11:39Would you do me a favor when you leave?
11:41Talk to this lieutenant and ask him if he's shocked by what goes on in here every day.
11:48I see blood in here every day.
11:51Every day someone's getting shot, someone's getting cut, someone's getting beat.
11:54I've lived in that all my life, woman.
11:56That don't wrinkle up my forehead.
11:59You can pile up the hundred dead bodies up in front of my cell and it don't set me to do nothing.
12:06You know, my mind is not set like that.
12:10I don't, you know, I don't work like that.
12:14Let me say this.
12:15I feel bad.
12:17If anybody feels bad, I don't like to see any negative happen to anyone.
12:23I don't like to see children die.
12:25I don't like to see automobile accidents.
12:28I don't like to see people hurting each other.
12:29I don't like none of that.
12:31I don't get a thrill out of that.
12:33You dig?
12:33But I'm not going to sit here and tell you a bunch of malarkey.
12:36I'm not going to fill you up with bunk.
12:38If I can't fill you up with right, I'm not going to fill you up with nothing.
12:41So I'm filling you up with this.
12:43I tell you.
12:44And I tell you right up until the highest peak of your understanding.
12:47I did not break the law.
12:48It's that simple.
12:50I did not break the law.
12:51Now, all my life, you told me, system, society, ignorance of the law is no excuse.
12:56Now, if you don't know the law, that's sad.
12:59But why don't you, why don't you take a, when you think about that woman and her eight and
13:05a half month old baby.
13:06Oh, my goodness.
13:07Here we go.
13:08Let's bleed hearts.
13:10Let's bleed.
13:10Why don't we just cut ourselves and just die because we feel so bad?
13:13We don't feel bad.
13:14What about them other people?
13:15What about them poor people starving their death over in the Appalachians?
13:18Do you think about that?
13:20What about the boat people that, and all the other people that died over there?
13:23Well, what about that little girl that ran through Mai Ling and all them people you shot
13:27and killed over there?
13:27Did you feel bad about that?
13:29Did you feel bad about the Second World War when you piled bodies up to the sky?
13:32Come on, man.
13:33Don't even put all that feel bad on me.
13:35You're the one that's feeling bad about it.
13:37If you're feeling bad about it, why don't you write a book or something and make some money?
13:42So what's the word for these two women today?
13:45What's the word?
13:46Yeah.
13:46What do you want to ask them?
13:47What's your word to them?
13:56How much time we got?
13:59Time enough for you to say.
14:01Okay.
14:01Let me go to the restroom.
14:02And then, and then, and then, no, I'm sure, you know.
14:11Do we have time for him to, no, you got to answer and then go because this is it.
14:15Well, if there isn't anything, it can't be explained in time if we had the time to explain it.
14:19Just give me a question for them.
14:21They got to, they got to pose something to you.
14:25What do you want to pose to them?
14:26Okay.
14:27All right.
14:28All right.
14:29If, and that's a big word because I don't probably ever use those words like if and maybe.
14:35I'm not insecure about anything, but if you have a thought in your mind about what I'm thinking.
14:43Is that what I'm thinking or is that what you're thinking I'm thinking?
14:48Everyone says, we know what you were doing with all those women.
14:55I said, no, you know what you would have been doing with all those women and you think that's what I would be doing with all those women because that's what you need to think.
15:03Now, you've spent all this time over there in that women's prison listening to all the particulars of what women do in and out of criminology and crime.
15:15Judges and robes, have I ever lied to you about anything?
15:26Have I ever lied about anyone to anybody about anything?
15:33Is there any time and all the time you've known me, have I ever told you anything that wasn't right or true?
15:40What's the first word that comes to mind when you think of those two women?
15:43Leslie, don't know me.
15:47Leslie was only at that ranch a couple of minutes.
15:49But today?
15:50Patty, I'm surprised.
15:52Patty has picked up a lot of suffering.
15:56Now, here's the thing.
15:57You stand for a cause and that cause begins to crumble.
16:00And you crumble with the cause because you don't have to hold on.
16:03You don't have nothing to hold on.
16:04You fall up underneath everybody else's opinion.
16:07And you're turned around by what they think because you're looking back off in society.
16:11And she's not been to jail long enough to know that society that she's thinking about is not the society that's really going on.
16:18The society 25 years ago that she has in her mind is gone.
16:21That society moved on.
16:23There's another back window on this trip.
16:25So the word for them?
16:26Word?
16:27Yeah.
16:27What are they?
16:28Give me a word.
16:29You are your faith.
16:30Lose it and you're not.
16:32We are done.
16:37Is that right or wrong?
16:39It's true.
16:40Yeah.
16:41If they lost faith in what they did, that's on them.
16:45I didn't lose faith.
16:48Have a good day.
16:51Hold on.
16:51I'll stand up.
16:52There's a wireless mic here.
16:55Think of all the questions I expected you to ask them.
16:57Can I go to the bathroom?
16:58It was not the one that would have come to mind.
17:00Hey, hey, look here, man.
17:02Hey, hey.
17:02Are you going to send me a copy of that?
17:04Sure.
17:06Oh, the still pictures?
17:07Yeah.
17:08Still pictures.
17:08I've been trying to get a still one for a long time, man.
17:11Well, I don't know.
17:13We got to ask the prison, but we'll ask them.
17:16You don't have to ask the mailroom.
17:17They do things like that.
17:19Excuse me.
17:20Hold on.
17:22Charlie, they probably want to get their picture taken with them.
17:24Let me look serious.
17:25Are you going to look serious?
17:26You can get it.
17:28Yeah.
17:28Are you taking one for public?
17:31I'm trying to, yeah.
17:32I mean, hopefully one of these will work.
17:34Yeah, get one with Diane.
17:41Let me get out of there.
17:45Let's see.
17:46Yeah.
17:46That's fine.
17:48If you're so close, that would be the story that I never learned.
17:55Over here.
17:55Kentucky.
17:56What part?
17:57He was born in the South, near Tennessee, and grew up in Louisville.
18:03Here we go.
18:03One, two, three.
18:05My uncle, Wormy, died in Louisville.
18:09Just take a couple.
18:10Trying to save the atmosphere.
18:12When the Tennessee Valley Authority came in, we started CC camps back then.
18:16My grandfather started CC camps before the Second World War.
18:19And then when the Second World War came on, they forgot CC camps.
18:23Now when you introduce Red, when you talk to Red, Red started to CC camp back.
18:30I'm telling you, those children did right.
18:34It's just sad that there wasn't more of them.
18:35The world's coming to an end.
18:40You were born in Ohio, right?
18:41Your atmosphere's dying.
18:42My mother ran off from Ashland, Kentucky, and went to Ohio.
18:46Oh, sorry.
18:47Did I put my hand in the baby?
18:48No.
18:49That's okay.
18:50Click, click, click.
18:51You know, everybody likes this evil.
18:52Everybody wants a picture of you.
18:53Everybody likes that evil character they created.
18:55You know, that guy with the eyes.
18:58Who's got lost?
18:58It's done.
18:59You got to realize, man, all them guys you've been creating now are not really real in real life, man.
19:05All right.
19:07Hold on, just one second.
19:08Don't forget me on those pictures, gentlemen.
19:11Just one.
19:12Just one.
19:13Just one.
19:14Little one.
19:14Little one.
19:14You want to stand or stand?
19:15That's fine.
19:16That's fine.
19:17That's fine.
19:20And let me give you all another thing.
19:22Will you please?
19:23Yeah.
19:23Everybody says I'm five foot two.
19:26When I was arrested, I was five foot seven.
19:28Then I went down to five foot six.
19:30Then I went down to five foot.
19:31Then I went to four feet.
19:32Now I'm down to five foot two.
19:34First, I'll be five feet.
19:34By the time that you all die, I'll be about three feet tall.
19:38So how tall are you, Charlie?
19:40Five six.
19:41Okay.
19:41And three quarters.
19:49Charlie, you were real nice.
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