At a House Judiciary Committee hearing, Rep. Jamie Raskin (D-MD) slammed an amendment from Rep. Harriet Hageman (R-WY) defining male and female to the Protect Children's Innocence Act, a law to block children from receiving gender-affirming care.
03:33Again, we haven't had any hearing on this, but this doesn't seem to be incompatible with there being transgender people,
03:39which obviously there are.
03:40There seem to be more than a million of them in the country.
03:42This is simply, this is the definition of male and female included in the bill.
03:50Well, again, is there any scientific basis for this, or did you just offer this one?
03:55Well, it's so obvious that so many times the Democrats are unable to define men and women.
04:01And so that's what we've done.
04:02We've defined male and female.
04:03Well, if you're the expert, you tell us where you got this information.
04:06We've defined it in this bill.
04:09Okay.
04:10So, in other words, it's a creation of the GOP staff of the Judiciary Committee?
04:15I think that this is a biological definition of male and female.
04:19From where?
04:21Yeah, it already says biological.
04:23Right.
04:24Physician would be...
04:25You're amending a bill which already has the language of the biological definition.
04:29It says the term biological sex means the indication of male or female sex by reproductive potential or capacity.
04:35Sex, chromosomes, and naturally occurring sex hormones, gonads, or internal or external genitalia present at birth.
04:42I mean, what is your problem with that definition?
04:46I'm not necessarily opposed to yours.
04:47Yours seems to be much more embracing of the transgender idea than the other one does.
04:52But I'm just curious where it comes from if we're going to proceed on the basis of science.
04:57This was what I was provided as far as the amendment for the bill.
05:01All right.
05:02Well, thank you for that inquiry that you made into it.
05:05And, you know, look, I think that people's privates should be private.
05:14I'm a little embarrassed by a lot of the conversation today.
05:16And I think all of this is unnecessary.
05:19And all of it is a massive intrusion into the private family life of the patient's state's power to regulate medicine and the medical associations that have actually worked on this.
05:33So I'm not quite sure which of these two definitions is superior to the other.
05:37I'd be interested to know whether anybody has any scientific basis for it.
05:41I mean, I'm happy to yield to anybody.
05:44Perhaps Ms. Valiant could help me out.
05:46Oh, well, I just a question that I had is that I noticed that what the what my colleague has brought forward does not acknowledge at all.
05:55The fact that there are intersex people who are born with sex characteristics that do not fit typical binary notions of male or female.
06:03And any doctor who is worth their salt will tell you that that is the reality, that there are intersex people living across this country that do not exactly fit your definition.
06:15So I want to know, where do they fit in?
06:17Do they not exist?
06:20This bill isn't directed to that.
06:22This bill is the mutilation of children.
06:24We're reclaiming my time.
06:25Let me reclaim my time.
06:26Allegedly.
06:27Mr. Raskin.
06:28Would the gentleman do?
06:29Mr. Chairman, look, the gentleman lady from Vermont makes a very important point, which is there are people who are born with intersex genitalia.
06:40And she asked, where does this fit into this definition?
06:45Again, nobody has really clarified why this definition is superior to the one that is already in the bill.
06:54You know, from my perspective, all of it is a massive invasion of privacy.
06:58And I'm just surprised that none of my colleagues has mentioned the word parent or mother or father today.
07:03You know, we're talking about vaccines for children.
07:06I think everybody would say that should be up to the parents.
07:08Why have the parents completely disappeared from the picture here?
07:12Is nobody interested in the parents?
07:15I mean, shouldn't we be trusting them to love their children a little bit more than Marjorie Taylor Greene loves them?
07:21The gentleman's time has expired.
07:23Is there further discussion?
07:24Mr. Onder.
07:28Yes.
07:28Will the ranking member yield?
07:34Yes, by all means.
07:35I believe, and I was just handed this definition myself, I believe that this definition covers a couple of things.
07:43I think it does cover the issue of intersex individuals who have congenital anomalies.
07:50Also, the part about congenital anomalies could also include genetic abnormalities like Klinefelder syndrome,
08:03which is a male with YO chromosomes who are sterile.
08:10And, of course, Turner syndrome, which is exo, which individuals who are also female but sterile.
08:18So, I believe that's the purpose of this definition.
08:23Mr. Onder, would you yield?
08:27Yes.
08:28For further clarification, this is the definition that was included in Dr. Marshall's Senate File 977
08:36in the bill that he introduced, which was to prohibit taxpayer-funded gender transition procedures
08:43and for other purposes.
08:51Does the gentleman yield back?
08:56Could I answer?
08:58Well, Mr. Onder controls the time.
09:01Mr. Onder?
09:02Mr. Onder, will you yield for a question?
09:03Yes, I yield.
09:04Yes, I yield.
09:04So, your question is a strong one, and it raises for me, how are we going to interpret
09:13and apply these definitions?
09:15In other words, let's say a person presents themselves to you, what would you do in order
09:21to determine whether they have gone through the congenital anomaly or historical accident
09:27or intentional or unintentional disruption and so on to qualify as a male or as a female?
09:32In other words, how does this improve upon asking someone, are you male or female?
09:40Right, yeah, that's my question.
09:46Well, I think the point is that sex, male or female, is a biological reality.
09:51It's not a social construct or a psychological construct.
09:54It's not a sex is sex, there are males and females, and that is what this law, folks who are intersex or male or female, they have congenital anomalies, but they are one of the other.
10:12Will you yield for a question, Mr. Onder?
10:13I will yield.
10:14I'm sorry.
10:16So, in good faith there, I'm trying to engage with you in a colloquy, because I do not understand.
10:23So, you're saying there are intersex people, they have sex characteristics of both male and female,
10:30and the question goes to the heart of, who is deciding that?
10:34Who is deciding how they are presenting?
10:36So, you're going to tell.
10:37It's usually decided by genotype most often, and again, then there are abnormal genotypes.
10:43No, no, no, no, I'm saying, no, no, no, no, if I could, I want to get back to, I'm asking you a serious question here.
10:49I'm asking you a serious question.
10:50I'm giving you a serious answer.
10:51Who, but is that person who is presenting with both characteristics, do they get to decide how they are presenting in the world?
11:00Well, if I decide tomorrow that I am a woman, I'm still a man, because I meet this definition.
11:08I'm talking about intersex individuals.
11:10I'm talking about intersex individuals.
11:12That's what I'm talking about here.
11:14Are you deciding for them?
11:16No.
11:16Who's deciding?
11:17There is a biological reality that this definition would recognize.
11:23Well, I disagree, but I appreciate you attending.
11:26If the gentleman would yield for one follow-up on that.
11:27Yes.
11:28So I accept your position that it's a biological reality, although that departs from the language here,
11:37which talks about historical accident or intentional or unintentional disruption, which doesn't seem to relate to biological condition.
11:44No, the historical accident would mean, for instance, if someone suffered a tragic accident, they rendered them infertile.
11:51If that happened to a man, if it happened to me, I would be rendered infertile.
11:57I got you.
11:58I'd still be male.
11:58So my question remains, though, say, in the case of an intersex individual or somebody who is born infertile for different reasons,
12:07who makes the decision, who applies what you're describing as the biological standard?
12:14Who decides that?
12:15Is it the person and their family and their doctor, or is it the U.S. Attorney General, the U.S. Attorney for the district?
12:21Well, I think what you're getting at it, you're trying to get me to embrace your idea of this term, sex assigned at birth.
12:29But there is a biological reality that the baby born is male or is female.
12:36They may have this baby may unfortunately have a genetic abnormality like Turner's and BXO genotype or Klinefelder's XXY genotype
12:45or maybe have other testicular feminization, various other birth defects.
12:53But that doesn't change the fact that that individual is male or female.
12:58And I think that's what this definition covers.
13:00Gentleman's, excuse me, gentleman's time has expired.
13:07Who seeks recognition?
13:09It's an amendment, right?
13:10The question occurs on the amendment offered by the gentlelady from Wyoming.
13:15All those in favor say aye.
13:16Aye.
13:17Those opposed, no.
13:18No.
13:19In the opinion of the chair, the ayes have it, and the amendment is adopted.
13:24The question now is, who seeks recognition?
13:29Gentlelady from North Carolina.
13:32Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
13:34And this has been kind of a mind-blowing conversation today.
13:39But I just wanted to share something that this bill and so many of the other bills targeting the transgender community,
13:51the effect that it has been having on our children.
13:53So I had a roundtable to talk about nutrition assistance and small businesses a couple weeks ago in my district.
14:03And it was just people sitting around talking about how to get more money for the food bank and for school nutrition
14:10and how to support our small businesses.
14:12And after we finished the roundtable, a woman came up to me with tears in her eyes and asked if she could talk to me.
14:23And I said, of course.
14:24And she told me that what is going on in Congress and with our president and the lack of any compassion for people who are transgender
14:41has caused her child so much distress that her child is thinking about leaving this country.
14:51And her child is transgender.
14:53And it feels like ever, ever since this Congress has been in session and this president has been really exploiting that child's entire being,
15:12that they're not safe in this country.
15:14And then I started to cry and I hugged her and I said, I will go back to Washington and share your story.
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