00:00And joining me now is a very special guest. I'm joined by the Israeli Foreign Minister Gideon Saar.
00:06He joins me from the Soroka Hospital, which was hit by an Iranian missile early this morning.
00:12Appreciate your joining us, Mr. Saar, in these very tough times.
00:17Just wanted to know from you first, you're at the hospital where an Iranian missile struck earlier today.
00:24Civilian casualties, it appears, could be mounting.
00:26Is that a major concern now, the fact that even hospitals are being struck?
00:31Iranians are claiming hospitals in their country are being struck, and now one has been struck in Israel.
00:39No, we don't attack hospitals, and it's not surprising that Iran is doing it,
00:45because what they are doing from the beginning of this campaign,
00:50they are only targeting civilians and only targeting civilian population centers.
00:57And today it's a hospital, it's a civil hospital.
01:01The building that was hit is the surgery building,
01:04when usually medical teams and doctors are battling to save people's life.
01:11And then here Iran wanted to take human life.
01:15So it is clearly a war crime, but it demonstrates their approach in general.
01:21And while we are attacking military objectives, nuclear program objectives, missiles objectives,
01:31they are deliberately attacking only civilians.
01:34So how will you respond to those who will say Iran has officially confirmed that 450 Iranians have died
01:41since Israel started their strikes six days ago,
01:44and they claim that many of them are civilians,
01:47that this is not just military establishments in Iran which have been struck,
01:52but civilians have also lost their lives.
01:54So there seems to be almost this civilians getting caught in the crossfire.
01:59You know that we took out the leadership of their military establishment,
02:08almost every one of them.
02:10We took out the establishment, the leaders of the weaponization process of the Iranian nuclear program.
02:19And we took them, you know, in a specific targeted operations.
02:26Of course, when you target a specific person, they might be collateral damage,
02:34but it is very minimal.
02:36And while we are working in, for example, in a civilian neighborhood,
02:41we are declaring time ahead and there is an evacuation of this neighborhood.
02:45And we are consistently working in order to keep human life, civilian life, which are not involved.
02:53There is a difference in the rules of war between targeting civilians and targeting military objectives.
03:00Sometimes when you target military objectives, there might be a collateral damage,
03:05but it is not to target civilians.
03:07It is totally different.
03:08And what they are doing, they are violating the rules of law and they are committing war crimes.
03:13You know, you're calling it war crimes, Mr. Foreign Minister.
03:17You know that Israel has also been questioned, even by the United Nations,
03:22about what's been happening in Gaza, where thousands of innocents have died,
03:25many of them children, when hospitals, schools have been targeted.
03:29So in a war, it seems, the worst affected are always the civilians.
03:34You can't say Israel is suffering for war crimes
03:38and what happens in Gaza and Iran is any different, isn't it, Mr. Foreign Minister?
03:43Civilians are civilians, whether in Gaza, Iran or Israel.
03:47Totally different.
03:49And as a journalist that mediates the information, you know it very well,
03:54because Hamas is operating from hospitals, from schools, from unary installations and facilities.
04:03Here in this hospital, you wouldn't find any military activity.
04:08It's a civilian hospital.
04:11So what must be brought to the attention of your viewers
04:15is the huge difference between targeting civilians
04:19or targeting terrorists that might be hiding after civilians
04:26or taking use of a civilian facility.
04:29This is very bad, but then you must act because they cannot have immunity, these terrorists.
04:34But it is totally different to target civilians,
04:38to target a hospital without any excuse, any military reason.
04:44And this is what Iran is doing.
04:46Let me push you one more time on that.
04:48If there were any Palestinians watching this program
04:50or indeed those concerned about human rights across the world
04:53and what happens during war, what will you tell them,
04:55given the thousands who've already died in Gaza because of Israeli strikes?
04:59or indeed are dying today in Iran.
05:01What will you tell those who are saying Israel also will have much to answer for?
05:06I will tell him very simply.
05:08Hamas began with this war on October 7.
05:13Hamas is the only one that's responsible for its continuation
05:17because they are still holding our hostages.
05:20They are still refusing to disarm.
05:22So the suffering of Israelis and Palestinians alike are totally on the shoulders of these terrorists.
05:30And with regard to Iran, they are those who attacked Israel with missiles two times during 2024.
05:37They are those who said, you know, the leader, Khamenei, time and again said it,
05:43that their objective is to eliminate the state of Israel.
05:48And he didn't only said that, he acted in order to do that
05:52by building these proxies of terrorists and terrorist states around Israel
05:56and by developing these catastrophical weapons.
06:01So it is a totally self-defense operation in the context of a wider military conflict
06:11between us and them that they initiated.
06:15But the fact is, this particular operation that started last Friday was initiated by Israel.
06:21You struck Iran first.
06:24So I want to understand why and what prompted you to strike Iran now.
06:29And therefore, when Iranians say,
06:30Israeli started it and we also have a right to self-defense,
06:34how will you respond?
06:35Thank God we initiated that because otherwise we would have just waited
06:41for the time that they can eliminate us with an atomic bomb.
06:47This is something which we will not agree to do.
06:50So we took the initiative as any other country under existential threat would have done.
06:57And we took it in the last minute.
06:59We took it when the nuclear program was very advanced already.
07:05We assessed it is about six months from having an atomic bomb, maybe less.
07:12And this is a time when you must act to prevent your enemy to fulfill its objective.
07:19And their objective is the elimination of the state of Israel.
07:22You're saying that you believe Iran was six months away from becoming a full nuclear power.
07:28Well, you will recall, Mr. Foreign Minister, then when America struck Iraq and Saddam Hussein,
07:35then the argument was Saddam was developing weapons of mass destruction.
07:39Now that turned out to be false.
07:40What proof evidence do you have, Mr. Foreign Minister,
07:43that Iran was actually weeks or months away from developing a full nuclear arsenal
07:48that you believe would target Israel?
07:52We have very good intelligence.
07:54And we demonstrated it because without such an intelligence,
07:59we couldn't find in Tehran all their military commanders
08:04and all the people who were involved and led their weaponization of the nuclear program.
08:12We demonstrated we have a very good intelligence.
08:16And also here we have a good intelligence.
08:18But I tell you more than that, it is not us only, but the IAEA that must inspect just brought two weeks ago
08:27a very severe report against the Iranian breaches of their commitments.
08:33And they said they are in a position of noncompliance.
08:36And how Iran reacted to that?
08:38Iran just mocked at it and said, well, we're going to open a new enrichment facility.
08:45So Iran has a record of deceiving and cheating the international community
08:53and getting very close to nuclear weapons.
08:58If it was not our life, we wouldn't act.
09:01But it is our existential, our existence that was here on stake.
09:09And therefore, we must act.
09:11And we acted in the last possible minutes.
09:13You know, I spoke to an Iranian guest, Mr. Foreign Minister, and he said,
09:17while Israel claims they have an existential threat,
09:20we also do not want Israel to have a nuclear monopoly in the Middle East.
09:25They claim that Israel has a nuclear umbrella.
09:28Why should Israel get away with it?
09:30And what is wrong if Iran develops its nuclear weapons,
09:33which they claim is only for civilian purposes?
09:36First of all, we declare time and again we will not be the first to enter nuclear to the Middle East.
09:48That's one.
09:49I repeat that now.
09:51Second, and it is very important, it's what the type of the regime,
09:57when you are speaking about the most extremist regime on Earth with a fanatic,
10:05with a very extremist ideology to have the most dangerous weapon,
10:10it is very dangerous, by the way, not only to Israel.
10:14For us, it's existential, but I believe that all the region feels the same.
10:18And I think that if they would have got existential, if they would have got nuclear weapons,
10:28that would create a nuclear race in the Middle East.
10:32We have an history of preventing enemies from getting nuclear weapons.
10:38We did it with Iraq in 1981.
10:41We did it with Syria in 2007.
10:45And we had to do it again because, unfortunately,
10:49all negotiations and agreements and diplomatic work
10:53hadn't achieved the dismantling of their nuclear program.
10:58You know, Mr. Saar, you're making it very clear that this is about
11:01ensuring that Iraq doesn't have a fully weaponized nuclear program.
11:06But your defense minister today says,
11:08Khamenei is a modern-day Hitler cannot continue to exist.
11:11So is this Operation Rising Lion about dismantling Iraq's nuclear arsenal,
11:17or is it about regime change?
11:18Is it about now targeting Khamenei and the entire leadership of Iran?
11:22It is about to remove two existential threats,
11:29the nuclear program and the ballistic program.
11:34These are the objectives of the war.
11:38Both are in the context of Iranian plan to eliminate the state of Israel.
11:44This is the cause.
11:46This is the objectives.
11:48The security cabinet...
11:50No, so is the...
11:52At least until now.
11:53Let me put you...
11:54The security cabinet, at least until now,
11:58hadn't decided anything on the regime thing
12:02to put it as an objective to this operation.
12:05So how do I interpret, sir, the defense minister saying,
12:11Khamenei is a modern Hitler cannot continue to exist.
12:14Is the aim to get to effect a regime change, sir?
12:18I repeat my question.
12:21This is your work to interpret.
12:24My work as a foreign minister is to present Israeli position.
12:31This is what I'm doing in this interview.
12:33Let me then come to the big question.
12:35America, sir.
12:36Do you expect Donald Trump and America to get fully involved?
12:39The belief is that unless you have American support
12:43in terms of their B-2 bombers,
12:44you will not be able to reach the Israeli...
12:48the Iranian underground nuclear facilities in places like Fadov.
12:52Do you expect America to join you now directly in this operation
12:57or is this only going to be an Israeli operation, sir?
12:59We went to this operation by ourselves to do whatever we can do
13:08to confront these challenges,
13:10these two existential threats, which I mentioned.
13:13We're thankful for the U.S.
13:15for supporting Israel in defense
13:18and defending the sky of Israel.
13:21But other things or other decisions will be taken solely by President Trump
13:28and according to the Americans' interests.
13:35And this is their decisions.
13:38They will take these decisions.
13:39Are you worried, though, sir, that this could become a wider conflict?
13:44Are you worried that this could become...
13:45The more it continues, it could widen across the region
13:48that we could have more and more countries being asked to get involved
13:54in some way or the other?
13:55Does that worry you at all?
13:58I think what we are doing during the last year and a half
14:01is we are gradually taking care of this axis led by Iran
14:05with Hamas, with Hezbollah.
14:09This is the thing that worried us,
14:12that there is an axis that its aim was to eliminate the state of Israel,
14:17and we take care of that,
14:19and we are preventing them to fulfill their wish.
14:23I don't think that other states in the region wants to join this war.
14:29There might be other organizations connected to Iran,
14:33like Hezbollah, or like Shiite militias in Iraq,
14:37or like the Houthis in Yemen,
14:39that already attacked Israel during this last year and a half,
14:42that would like to attack us again.
14:44This is something that we took into consideration
14:47when we went into this operation.
14:50My final question, sir,
14:52what role do you expect India to play?
14:55India so far has been seen to be,
15:00without saying it in so many words,
15:02supporting Israel.
15:04What exactly do you expect,
15:06kind of role do you expect India to play?
15:11Well, India is not involved.
15:15India, but I think that India always looked at stability
15:20in the Middle East is something which is very important.
15:25I spoke with Jason Carr and my colleague,
15:30India foreign minister.
15:32My prime minister spoke with Mr. Modi,
15:36prime minister of India,
15:37and we are connecting,
15:39and we are updating what we are doing.
15:42And I believe that after this operation will be over,
15:46we will have a more stable Middle East.
15:49And this is something that is very important,
15:52also to have a progress towards connectivity,
15:58towards prosperity,
16:00from India to Europe,
16:03to have this vision implemented of connectivity.
16:06But it's very tough to do it
16:09while radicals are all around,
16:13and we must have a different Middle East.
16:14I believe that we are,
16:16we will be able to create a different Middle East,
16:19a more peaceful Middle East,
16:21a more stable Middle East.
16:22Are you not worried that this could become
16:24a prolonged conflict, though?
16:26The longer it,
16:26do you really believe it can be a short,
16:28swift conflict?
16:29Are you not worried that Israel is not,
16:31Iran is not Hezbollah?
16:32Iran is not Hamas.
16:34They're a sovereign country,
16:35which will strike back,
16:36as you've seen today in the hospital.
16:38Therefore, we could be in for a prolonged conflict.
16:40Does that not worry you?
16:41And that Israel is dragging,
16:43in a way,
16:43the Middle East into a more unstable situation?
16:48First of all, sir,
16:49you gave a speech,
16:51not a question.
16:53Secondly, sir,
16:54you said that your previous question
16:56is the last question.
16:58So we can conclude the interview right now.
17:01Okay, sir.
17:01I appreciate Foreign Minister Saur
17:04for joining me.
17:05Thank you so much.
17:06You're welcome.
17:07You're welcome.
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