Louis and Tonya are old friends. Over time, they fall for each other and marry, but Louis heads down a dark and violent path, ending in a brutal murder. Now, Louis claims to be a new man. His daughter wants to believe him, but his wife isn’t convinced.
Category
📚
LearningTranscript
00:00Oh, my God.
00:10It killed my fingers.
00:12I snapped.
00:14I just snapped.
00:17She did grab a kitchen knife.
00:19Can't feel a friend.
00:21Can't have to go on the ground.
00:23Let's try to put my body dead.
00:25I have it next.
00:26What kind of reaction do you have seeing that?
00:40Big tears.
00:42As soon as I start listening to this, the way he cries is not his cry.
00:51I just, I didn't, it was a performance.
01:05I know my husband.
01:07I believe that rage, that evil person could come out of him again.
01:14If I were to ask him about what happened, would he tell me the truth?
01:20I'm not sure if he would tell you the truth, but he claims to be a changed, reformed man.
01:28I do believe he's very good at manipulating.
01:33He'll manipulate you in certain ways.
01:36It's just him.
01:38It comes natural.
01:40I think he manipulates my daughter in certain ways.
01:46This interview is important to me because my dad is a completely different person today than he was when he committed the crimes.
01:54Like, he is better and he's a better person.
01:56And I feel like I'm the only one that can say it now.
01:58Tanya wants to know why she and the kids weren't good enough for you to stay on a straight path, for you to get sober.
02:22Why weren't they good enough?
02:23I think that's a poor me question.
02:27That's a boo-hoo question.
02:28They were good enough.
02:30Never said they wasn't.
02:32Tell her, grow up.
02:34Tell her that.
02:35Grow up.
02:35And honestly, I'm not feeling too comfortable with being attacked with all these questions from a woman who claims to be my wife when it benefits her, but has yet to be on my visitation list and come see me in prison and ask me herself.
02:52She waits for a camera crew to come in here and ask me those questions.
02:57Stop being a coward.
02:58Answer your phone and ask me yourself.
03:00Tell her, give her.
03:19Tell her, give her up.
03:25Tell her, give her up.
03:28I grew up in Wern, Ohio.
03:41Louis still lived next door.
03:43I was six and he was four when we first met each other.
03:48We hung out a lot when we were kids until, I think, my teenage years.
03:54Louis was always a joker.
03:57You know, always making a laugh.
04:00His dad was a truck driver and his mom worked a lot.
04:04So he was with us a lot.
04:07He became, like, one of the family.
04:27You know, when he got a little bit older, that's when Louis started smoking weed, taking pills.
04:36He wasn't afraid to get in trouble, I don't believe.
04:39He liked the adrenaline of it.
04:45My dad told me, I don't want you hanging out with him right now.
04:49He's doing things I don't want you to do.
04:52He was becoming a hoodlum.
04:56Louis did not graduate.
04:58I think he left school when he was 17.
05:02And I came by his house and he was packing the car.
05:10He's like, I got to move to Kentucky.
05:13And I'm like, huh?
05:18And the reason why he had to leave is Louis started smoking crack.
05:25And Louis robbed the crack dealer.
05:29And he was out looking for him.
05:38I was just really, really shocked that Louis would do that.
05:41And then him have me leave because somebody's after him.
05:45I mean, I was worried.
05:46I was scared for him.
05:48So, of course, I was like, go.
05:52But, I mean, I was upset.
05:54You know, like, oh, my God, are you leaving?
05:57Like, it hurt.
05:59I wasn't used to that, you know?
06:02I'm used to him always being around.
06:08But I was genuinely, like, upset.
06:11I didn't know he was coming back.
06:27My first husband, we split.
06:32We got a divorce.
06:34And that's when Louis stepped in.
06:37When Louis came back from Kentucky,
06:41he was around me a lot.
06:44He just started telling me how he felt.
06:47You know, telling me all these years,
06:50he's like, I've always wanted to be with you.
06:53I've loved you since I can't remember.
06:55You know, all that stuff.
06:58And, like, he was really sincere.
07:01And, you know, I could see it.
07:04He was always, like, a protector to me
07:07all throughout my life.
07:09I don't know.
07:15I truly loved him.
07:18You know, I loved him before we got together.
07:21So, you know, I was like, we can try.
07:24See how this works.
07:26And the first night he stayed with me
07:29was the first night I was able to sleep the whole night.
07:31Louis had an angry sign all our lives.
07:51One time, my two oldest children
07:55went to stay with our father for the weekend.
07:58So, him and I decided that we were going to go out
08:02with our friends.
08:05We do that.
08:06We're having a good time.
08:08And we're getting ready to go home.
08:11And I tell him, well, I want to stop and talk to the kids.
08:17And he did not like that at all.
08:22Because he knew I had to talk to my ex-husband.
08:25And he didn't want me to do that.
08:29So, it caused a big fight.
08:32It just went further and further.
08:36And next thing I know, we're putting hands on each other.
08:41I'm smacking him crazy.
08:43And next thing I know, he punched me back.
08:54I don't remember much after that.
08:57But he hit me hard enough for me to, like,
09:00wobble into the car and see stars, like, whack me out.
09:05Somebody had called the police.
09:12And they ended up taking Louis to jail for domestic.
09:20And he only did a couple days in there.
09:24I was shocked, I was hurt, and I was angry.
09:30Like, I can't believe you did this to me.
09:35Like, what the hell?
09:37But then he apologized, you know, so much.
09:43And, oh, it won't ever, ever happen again.
09:45I felt okay staying because I don't believe that he would have did it sober.
09:55I wanted to work things out.
09:57My kids loved him.
09:59I wanted them to have a dad.
10:01And, you know, have that living home.
10:04I think the aggression started when he was younger.
10:09And it just kept building and building.
10:12And when he was older, if he wanted, you know, to fight you, he would.
10:18If he wanted to hurt you, he would.
10:20Because he believed that he could.
10:23They would just walk in the bar and pick people.
10:26And next thing I know, everybody's fighting.
10:29And they're ruining a good night.
10:31And I thought things would get better.
10:36And things never got better.
10:39Things just continue to get worse.
10:49Louis and I had Elizabeth the first week of July.
10:55And then shortly after, in September, we got married.
10:59When I tell his mom, she's like, oh, my God, you know.
11:05I've never seen that woman so happy.
11:09She always wanted that little girl.
11:14He was really happy.
11:16Elizabeth had him wrapped around her finger.
11:20She was everything to him.
11:24That was his baby girl.
11:28You know, she was daddy's girl.
11:30She was always with him, if possible.
11:33This is my dad standing with me and my sister on a merry-go-round.
11:46And in the background, it looks like we're at some sort of fair.
11:50But I don't really have a lot of memories of, like, going to, like, fairs with my dad.
11:58But, like, he did always find himself, like, the one doing the stuff with us.
12:05Like, I remember him coaching one of my softball games, like, before he had gone to county.
12:10And I remember on the trampoline, um, he would just, like, try and, like, bounce us as high up as we could, because we were just so small.
12:21He definitely was a fun dad.
12:24But they were using, like, my dad, just, like, looking at him.
12:31Like, I can, like, point out pictures of them, like, where they look high.
12:36And in this picture, like, he doesn't, I don't know, he doesn't really look.
12:41Like, he's fully, like, all the way there.
12:43I know there were times when, like, my parents would fight, and then we would go sit at my grandparents' house.
13:04I don't know if they would go somewhere, because something related to drugs.
13:10And they just needed someone to watch me.
13:13But I was my grandma's first biological grandchild.
13:17And I think she wanted a girl.
13:19And I was the girl that she got that she'd been wanting for so long.
13:25I have a lot of good memories at my grandparents' house.
13:28I remember staying with my grandma and waking up in the morning, she'd make me breakfast.
13:33And then she'd watch me ride my bike at 7 in the morning.
13:37And I remember doing this all the time.
13:39I remember baking with her and, like, decorating cookies.
13:42I remember doing word searches with her, like, sitting with her in her chair.
13:48I don't really know if my dad had a good relationship with his parents when I was that young.
13:54It seemed, like, hostile, or, like, maybe they just got done arguing, or maybe I was walking in the middle of an argument.
14:03So I never seen their relationship as, like, a good one.
14:06It always just seemed, like, it was all negative that I've heard.
14:11But my dad's parents were, like, my comfort people, I would say.
14:16I gotta take care of, like, would I walk it out?
14:17I want to do that.
14:19I want to gather the drinks back and do I walk over the things, like, word supposed toings you.
14:22I want to give out the dark for me and don't состоs, like it's the exact thing.
14:24Why?
14:26I want to give out the right to my father, on how to live it's actually, like, the heart of this today.
14:28I don't know what I've ever heard of.
14:30I want to get you, like, look...
14:31And now, like, in ancient history, we've never seen a real life before my mom who's been there.
14:32Saturday, October 1st, 2011, Louis came to visit me in jail.
14:44I noticed that he was driving his parents' car.
14:55Driving his parents' car was a big red flag because he is not allowed to drive his parents'
15:02car.
15:03I'm talking to him between the glass.
15:08I notice he has scratch marks on his hand, like three of them, you know, deep nail marks.
15:17And I'm like, where's your mom and dad?
15:22Where's mom and dad?
15:23Like, what is going on?
15:26Something's not right.
15:28He gets a pen and he writes on the paper, mom, dad, gone.
15:41And I'm like, what do you mean, gone?
15:48And he was like, gone, Tom.
15:52Like, gone.
15:53He wouldn't say it over the phones because they are recorded.
15:58Basically, he's telling me they're dead, that he killed them.
16:13I was worried that after visit, that he could kill someone else.
16:20I was afraid that, you know, he would kill my parents and take the kids and leave.
16:27Talk to me!
16:28I didn't know how to protect them, but to tell them.
16:33So that's what I told my mom.
16:35They check on my in-laws, but don't take my kids there.
16:41I guess her and my uncle, when they went over to my in-laws' house, they looked in the window.
16:47And that's when my mom called the police.
17:06Two detectives came up to the pod, and they asked me, what was the make and model of the car he's in?
17:15And what does he have on?
17:17And where would he go?
17:19Things like that.
17:20I told him, like, he's probably parked somewhere in a motel, you know, and waiting for you guys to find him.
17:31Our camera's rolling as Warren and Howland officers take a bare-chested and handcuffed Lewis Mann into custody.
17:37This yellow Cadillac is the car police put an alert out for after finding an elderly couple dead inside this home
17:44on Jefferson Street.
17:46You look like hell.
17:48I've never seen him that small.
17:51And then he plays stupid, of course.
17:54What's going on? What do you mean?
17:56How do you kill somebody?
18:10And you know he had that rush.
18:13The adrenaline was going.
18:17I don't understand.
18:19You know, he had that much rage and he was just upset.
18:23Yes, I could understand him lashing out on the streets to someone, but I don't understand the parents thing.
18:36I mean, when he was angry, yeah, he would tell me he hated his parents.
18:42Supposedly, his mom, Fran, was upset and wanted, you know, our child, Elizabeth, because, you know, he just got out of jail.
18:54I want to know what's the real reason that you killed your parents.
19:03Why?
19:04Why?
19:05Why?
19:07Why, why do it?
19:09Why go to that extreme?
19:11If he's a reformed man, like he says he is, of God, then he might tell you.
19:32This is a picture of my grandma and my grandpa, and I'm pretty sure this was Easter morning.
19:40But they look happy.
19:43How is it that your dad was capable of something so horrific to two people that you loved?
19:53I think my dad was only able to do this because he wasn't thinking about how I was going to feel.
20:02He wasn't thinking about the after.
20:04He was just in the moment.
20:06I don't think he thought about how I was going to live without him and my grandparents.
20:12He just did it.
20:13I really think, like, just when you're using in general, like when you're on drugs in general, you're a selfish person.
20:24So my dad had taken a clothing line that you would use to dry clothes outside, and he strangled her with it.
20:43And then my grandpa heard everything, came in with his gun.
20:49My dad took the flashlight, and it was a big, heavy-duty one, like, it was pretty big.
20:55And he hit my grandpa in the head with it, and then took the gun and shot my grandpa.
21:02Does it take an evil person to do what he did?
21:14I wouldn't ever say that my dad was evil.
21:17I think he was going through his own stuff, and he made it his parents' problem.
21:29I think he was hurting, and he was angry.
21:34But the way he is now, and the person who he's, like, become and turned into, I wouldn't, like, evil would never even be on my mind to describe my dad to somebody.
22:04Why did you want to do this interview?
22:18To get my side of the story out.
22:21Going through the trial, the media doesn't really post anything about my cares or desires or wants.
22:28It was all the crime, how brutal it was, and how bad of a person I was.
22:33I'm completely different now. That's not me.
22:36I don't believe that I'm evil. I don't think I'm evil at all.
22:39There was a Bible in every room in my house growing up.
22:43There was also abuse, physical, mental, sexual, all kinds.
22:48Honestly, I don't care what anybody else thinks, you know?
22:52Killer, murderer, psycho, monster, that's not me.
22:56That really wasn't me, you know?
23:03I'm the exact opposite of what society has labeled me as.
23:12God is not something that I just found in prison.
23:15I am a believer. I do believe.
23:18But of course, yeah, I fear God. I know God. I have a relationship with the Lord.
23:24Would you mind taking me through the details of the day that you murdered your parents?
23:33It was cold outside. I was actually sleeping in my van in their driveway.
23:44I wasn't allowed to stay in their house. I wasn't the best person in the world.
23:48You know, I was addicted to drugs for a while, and so I wasn't trusted.
23:54I made that bed for myself, so I ended up laying it.
23:57Later on that evening, me and my mother were kind of in an argument about the custody of my daughter.
24:04They wanted me to sign over custody of her to them for the wrong reasons.
24:09I got into an argument about it. I told her that the way that I was treated when I was a child,
24:14if they ever treated my daughter like that, that I'd kill somebody.
24:18I would kill whoever treated my daughter that bad.
24:21Just go!
24:23You did this to me!
24:24You don't have to let go of your daughter!
24:26You're gonna fall!
24:28And the next thing she said was she asked me if I was gonna kill her and my father.
24:33And somewhere in my twisted mind, full of emotions, I lost control and assumed that she said something happened to my daughter.
24:42I just, I lost it. I lost control.
24:45What happened next?
24:48I murdered her, strangled her to death, went and knocked on the bedroom door and told my father that my mother needed him.
24:57She was in the kitchen.
24:59And then, uh, he walked out, seen her on the floor.
25:08And I beat him to death with a flashlight.
25:21Did he come out with a gun?
25:23No.
25:24Never come out with a gun.
25:26I lied about six or seven different times.
25:28Uh, he never come out with a gun.
25:30I went and knocked on the door.
25:31I told him she was in there.
25:32She needed him.
25:33And he walked by me.
25:35I followed him in there.
25:36And as soon as he turned around and looked at me, I just, I took off on him.
25:43It was over.
25:44But then you ended up shooting him?
25:45I did.
25:46Um, after I was done, I felt that he had enough.
25:51I'm still making noises.
25:52He was dead.
25:53But, uh, his heart was still pumping, so he was still functioning.
25:56I kind of shot him just to put him out of his misery.
26:11After your mother was on the floor, you could have walked away.
26:14You could have left the house.
26:16Why did you go get your father?
26:18I don't know.
26:19I don't know.
26:20Um, not that they deserved it, but if I had to pick one, I would have to say he would have
26:27deserved it.
26:28So, after her, there was, there was no stopping that.
26:31He was next.
26:32He was the one that put me through the abuse that I went through as a kid.
26:35You know?
26:36Uh, so.
26:37What did you do after your parents were dead?
26:41Oh, man.
26:42Um, I went in their bedroom and I took a full bottle of Xanax and opened it up and started
26:50chewing on them like M&Ms.
26:51And, uh, then I, I was gone.
26:55I took my father's debit card.
26:56I took their car.
26:57I took some weed that I found.
26:59And, and I was gone.
27:01What was your thought process doing?
27:04There was no thought process.
27:06There was no thought process at all.
27:08You know what?
27:09I don't, I don't really know.
27:10What are you supposed to do?
27:11I tell you what, when they get together and write a book and say what to do after you
27:15murder somebody, let me read it.
27:17And I would love to see the answers to that.
27:19Cause I don't, I don't know what the protocol is for that.
27:22I don't know what normal operation is after you murder somebody.
27:26I don't know what you're supposed to do.
27:28I, I knew I was going to prison.
27:31After that, there's only one of two things, prison or death.
27:35I knew something was coming.
27:37When my mom told me what happened, I don't remember saying anything.
27:48I just remember standing up and then turning to her parents.
27:53And I just remember crying, just being seven year old me.
27:57I'm just like, I'm never going to see them again.
27:59Like I just lost three people.
28:01I lost my dad, my grandma and my grandpa.
28:06And like, I was just crying.
28:08Like I just felt the loss of all three of them all at once.
28:12As a kid, I don't think I did process it.
28:15Like even talking about my grandparents now, like I can feel like I'm getting shaky.
28:20I can feel like I'm going to start tearing up.
28:22Like I could cry about it.
28:23I can like feel the exact same feeling I had when I was like laying in my bed, crying myself to sleep at night.
28:30Like knowing that they're gone and like, I'm not getting them back.
28:33I do forgive my dad for everything that's happened.
28:43I forgive him for what he did to my grandparents.
28:46And it's mainly because if he hadn't gone to prison, I don't believe he'd be alive right now.
28:51I don't think he ever would have gotten sober.
28:54I blame the drugs for almost all of his behavior.
28:57I don't want to give him a pass because he was on drugs.
29:00A lot of people are on drugs.
29:02I mean, it's obviously a problem in this world, but not everybody is killing their parents.
29:09So, yes, my dad was the one that did, he did kill my grandma.
29:13He killed my grandpa.
29:15He took my favorite people away from me.
29:18But like I really want to know like if he thinks if he wasn't using drugs that day, if he was sober that day.
29:24Like I want to know like how he would have reacted differently.
29:27Liz wants to know if you weren't on drugs that day, would you have been capable of killing them?
29:36If I weren't on drugs that day, I wasn't on drugs that day.
29:41I don't understand.
29:43She thinks that you were on drugs that day.
29:46Oh, I was not.
29:48Not at the time.
29:49I was sober.
29:51Not at the time.
29:52I did not do what I did because I was high.
30:09Do you believe Lewis when he says his parents abused him?
30:16I don't believe he was abused.
30:23But if you were abused for years and at a very young age, why would you put anybody around them that you care about, that you love?
30:44It just doesn't make sense to me.
30:48I guess my question would be to him about that.
30:53Why would you let our children go there, spend the night or the whole weekend by ourselves?
31:08Knowing that this happened to you and letting our child spend time with them by herself.
31:17I don't know if I believe it.
31:21Tanya wants to know, why would you trust your parents that abused you to take Liz for overnight visits and to have them keep her if they did such horrible things to you?
31:38I can't answer that.
31:41I don't know.
31:42I have no idea.
31:46I just buried it.
31:48I buried everything.
31:49You know?
31:50Why do wives let their husbands beat the brakes off of them and keep going home and cooking dinner for them every day until she gets so fed up with it that she blows his brains out when he's taking a nap on the couch one night?
32:02I don't know.
32:03I don't know.
32:04I've been asked that question.
32:05It was like a monster that just kept eating and getting bigger and bigger and bigger.
32:09A lot of kids have been abused in their life, horrible abuse, but they don't end up killing someone.
32:22You're absolutely right.
32:23A lot of them grow up and become successful.
32:26Good husbands, good fathers.
32:29Some of them end up living in their guilt and their shame, and they end up being homeless, struggling to find a place to live.
32:39They stay junkies.
32:41Some of them end up taking the path that I took.
32:44I just made bad choices, and my bad choices were way worse than a lot of other people's bad choices.
32:59I don't know.
33:00I don't know.
33:01Liz wants to know if you weren't on drugs that day, would you have been capable of killing them?
33:11Elizabeth, I was not high when I did what I did, you know?
33:16I don't...
33:18And how words that you were capable of killing them if you can't use the I was high as an excuse?
33:25I think she wants to know, how does that happen?
33:30Loss of self-control, no control, anger, rage, fear, fear.
33:46Selfishness.
33:47It was selfishness.
33:49I honestly feel like I just made my own little thing up in my head to, like...
33:59I don't know if it was to make me feel better at the time.
34:02Thinking about, like, my dad and, like, how could he do this?
34:05Like, if he was high, that's probably what I did.
34:10Because I feel like I've done it for more, like, memories that I have.
34:14Does it change your perspective of him now?
34:17Like, knowing that he was capable of killing his parents completely sober?
34:21It doesn't change my perspective on him now, because he's a different person now.
34:25I murdered her, strangled her to death.
34:36Went and, uh, knocked on the bedroom door, told my father that my mother needed him.
34:43She was in the kitchen.
34:44And then, uh, he walked out, seen her on the floor.
34:49And, uh, I beat him to death.
34:52With a flashlight.
34:53A mag light.
34:55Did he come out with a gun?
34:57No.
34:58Never come out with a gun.
35:00Uh, police report, confession.
35:04I lied about six or seven different times.
35:06And, uh, he was making noises, gargling.
35:09And, uh, I kind of shot him just to put him out of his misery.
35:23I feel like I've heard the version of, like, my grandpa coming out with a gun and my dad taking it from him.
35:30But, um, I don't know if I've, like, heard that one.
35:37Does that make you change your mind about him at all?
35:42No.
35:43Nothing from any of the videos I've watched changes my mind about my dad.
35:51I feel like you're, like, a little bit, like, these are your grandparents.
35:54You loved your grandmother.
35:55And he took them away.
35:56And he's telling you right now the gruesome details of taking their lives.
36:02I know.
36:03And it's, I'm, I think, just in my head.
36:08I think since I was young, since everything happened, like, I can't process stuff well because of everything.
36:14And I wasn't taught how to.
36:15So, I think I'm just, I'm separating him.
36:18And, like, yeah, he's saying it.
36:19And, like, right now, like, I'm shaking.
36:21Like, I'm, like, I'm upset by it.
36:23But I'm not upset with him.
36:28I don't know, like, like, I know he did awful things.
36:31But, like, I think I've forgiven him for it.
36:36So, I'm, it's not like I'm looking past it.
36:38It's just, that's not who he is.
36:42And I know that.
36:43So, he's just, that's not him.
36:45That's the other person.
36:51So, now, Tanya wants to know, did you love her or did you love the drugs more?
37:03Oh, man.
37:04I loved her.
37:06I've known her since I was a child.
37:08You know, we were just together for all the wrong reasons.
37:12Our life, our life together was built on, if this makes any sense, blind necessity.
37:19You know, she needed somebody in her life.
37:22I needed somebody in mine.
37:23And we knew each other, so we thought it was going to work.
37:25It's like two friends in the prison system.
37:28Hey, you want to be my celly?
37:29We're great buddies.
37:30We get along great.
37:31Sure.
37:32And then they move in and it's a disaster.
37:35You know, that's what that was.
37:37We were both immature.
37:39Neither one of us really wanted to be responsible.
37:42We liked the idea.
37:44You know?
37:45Yeah.
37:46I loved her more than I loved the drugs.
38:00That clip made me a little emotional.
38:03And I didn't know what he would say on that one.
38:14You know?
38:15Because, you know, lately we just don't get along.
38:19He's been in my life for so long.
38:22And every time we talk on the phone, we're at each other's throats.
38:29And it's been like that for 11 years on and off.
38:33Because I'm angry, he's angry.
38:35And I just figured he hated me.
38:40Thinking about my childhood now, it's not much like, oh my God, I can't believe this all happened to me.
38:58Like, I feel like everything that happened, like, in my childhood, like, with my dad, with my mom, everything I'd gone through, everything I've witnessed, been around, I feel like it all made me, like, who I am.
39:14My relationship with my dad today is really good.
39:19He's just always been, like, understanding.
39:21And he's always been the one that's, like, had my back.
39:24So I feel like I've always done the same for him.
39:30I think if my dad didn't go to prison, he would have been shot and killed.
39:34He would have overdosed.
39:35Or he would have put us all in a situation that, like, you couldn't come back from.
39:40So I do think prison saved my dad.
40:04His eyes.
40:11They look hollow.
40:13He has no expression.
40:15He looks cocky.
40:20He looks like, don't with me.
40:24It was like he had no remorse.
40:27He looks very zombified in this picture.
40:31If he was reformed, a man of God, why does he look so mad?
40:46He can't be out here and be free and be normal.
40:52Because he was really never too normal.
40:56You know?
40:57He should have spent the rest of his life in prison.
41:01I thought I knew who my brother was.
41:05As soon as I stabbed him, my drizzling went all the way up.
41:08I just started going through the house looking for people.
41:11That's not my brother.
41:13I lost my brother a long time ago.
41:15I won't, don't go.
41:26I lost my brother a long time ago.