- 1 year ago
During debate over the Stop Illegal Entry Act in the House Judiciary Committee last week, Rep. Pramila Jayapal put forward and defended an amendment to require due process for deported illegal immigrants like Kilmar Abrego Garcia, which ultimately failed to pass.
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00:00Amendment to the amendment.
00:01Objection, the mail will be considered as read.
00:03The gentlelady is recognized to explain the amendment.
00:07Mr. Chairman, my amendment addresses a current urgent situation of the Trump administration
00:15ignoring judges' orders, ignoring the provision of due process, and wrongfully deporting people
00:24to other countries despite judges' orders.
00:27My amendment simply states that this bill will not go into effect until the Trump administration
00:33is able to return all the people who it admits it has deported in error.
00:38It is a stain on our country that this list of people wrongfully deported continues to
00:44grow.
00:46And I will just say that this amendment, I'm going to give you a number of examples, but
00:50it is especially important now as it appears that once again the Trump administration has
00:56openly defied a court order has just unlawfully removed immigrants to South Sudan.
01:03And the administration will continue breaking the law and wrongfully deporting people until
01:07they're finally held accountable.
01:08So I hope we can do that today in a bipartisan way.
01:11I ask unanimous consent to enter into the record.
01:14An article from CNN dated May 20th, federal judge says Trump administration must maintain
01:20custody of migrants allegedly sent to South Sudan.
01:24That's just- Without objection, so ordered.
01:26So we all know about Kilmar Abrego Garcia.
01:28This is a father, a husband to an American citizen who had what is called withholding of removal.
01:35This is a legal immigration status that specifically blocked him from being removed to El Salvador.
01:42And he won that status during the first Trump administration in 2019 by proving that he posed
01:49absolutely no threat to public safety and that he had a well-founded fear of persecution from
01:54gangs back in El Salvador.
01:55The first Trump administration never appealed that decision.
01:58Now the Trump administration has violated the court decision, kidnapped him in front of
02:05his five-year-old son, and shipped him off to El Salvador, the one place in the world that
02:11they were legally barred from sending him.
02:14They sent him to be locked up in a foreign gulag with the very gang members that he had just
02:18escaped.
02:19They were using our taxpayer dollars, all of our money to pay for him to be imprisoned over
02:27there.
02:28Now the administration didn't deny that they deported him in error.
02:31They admitted that they deported him in error, and in a normal world, they would have tried
02:37to bring him back.
02:38And if they really thought he was a danger to the community, they should have gone through
02:41the legal process of presenting that information to a court to try to strip him of his legal protections.
02:48But that's not at all what they did.
02:49They doubled down.
02:50They insisted without any new evidence that he was an MS-13 gang member.
02:55They went as far as to hold up a photoshopped picture of his tattoos.
02:59This is desperation.
03:02When you don't have real evidence, you photoshop things.
03:06Meanwhile, every single court that has looked at this case, including the Supreme Court, found
03:11that the administration was in the wrong, and the Supreme Court ruled unanimously, 9-0, that
03:17the administration needed to facilitate the return of Mr. Abrego Garcia.
03:23There are at least two other cases similarly.
03:26Daniel Lozano Camargo, who is a Venezuelan man, was deported to El Salvador in March despite
03:32a court-approved settlement requiring the administration to adjudicate his asylum claim first.
03:39And again, the Trump-appointed judge ordered that the administration facilitate Mr. Lozano
03:46Camargo's return, and the Trump administration has not done so.
03:51A Guatemalan man sued the Trump administration in March for deporting him to Mexico despite
03:56a fear of persecution.
03:58And immigration officials initially said that the man told him themselves that he was not
04:03afraid to be sent there, but in a court filing on Friday, the administration acknowledged
04:08that their claim was based on erroneous information.
04:12So my, you know, these are just the beginnings of these wrongful deportations.
04:18And I think every U.S. citizen out there wants the Trump administration, every person in
04:24this country wants the Trump administration to abide by the courts and by judges' decisions.
04:30And they are willfully defying that and deporting people, including people who have legal status.
04:36This is not about going after the worst of the worst that the bills keep bringing up over
04:41and over again.
04:42This has nothing to do with the campaign promises that Trump made.
04:45This is about deporting wrongfully people, sending them to other countries, and refusing
04:50to obey even the Supreme Court.
04:53And I will tell you, I don't think Americans want that.
04:56I don't think they believe that that is what should happen.
04:58And I would like for the other side to vote on this amendment that says nothing in this
05:03bill goes into effect until you return those wrongfully deported people and you obey the
05:09Supreme Court and judges across this country, including those appointed by Donald Trump, in
05:14their rulings to return these people to the United States.
05:18I yield back.
05:19Mr. Chairman, notwithstanding that this is overly broad and outside the scope of this bill,
05:28I will withdraw my reserve.
05:30The point of order is withdrawn.
05:31The gentleman from North Carolina is recognized.
05:34I move to strike the last word, Mr. Chairman.
05:35The gentleman is recognized.
05:36Well, just a few points of correction and clarification.
05:39In regards to the statement saying that Mr. Kilmar Garcia was not a threat to public safety, I have to strongly disagree.
05:46Mr. Chairman, having prosecuted organized criminals for almost a decade.
05:50Would the gentleman yield?
05:51No, ma'am.
05:52After over a decade, the evidence is overwhelming, both officially on the record.
05:55Why don't you present it in court?
05:56I'm speaking, ma'am.
05:57I belong to the gentleman from North Carolina.
05:59The evidence is overwhelming that he was engaged in nefarious conduct, that he was part of terrorist
06:03organizations, and he was working actively to further his criminal objectives here on American soil.
06:08His domestic partner or wife, whichever one she is, she took out paperwork with a court saying that he was abusive to her.
06:16He was stopped in Tennessee with, I believe, eight women in a van trafficking them around the country.
06:22This is not the person that we need to be taking up our arms for.
06:26But in regards to the gentlelady's concerns about due process, this bill protects due process.
06:31If someone is here illegally and they do not get convicted of a felony,
06:36it does not trigger this law.
06:39For someone to be convicted of a felony, they have to be charged with probable cause by a grand jury.
06:43They have to be arrested or otherwise apprehended.
06:46They have to be given counsel at your expense.
06:49They enter into a plea negotiation or a jury trial where they either admit to criminal conduct under oath
06:56or they're convicted by a jury of their peers.
07:00Once that happens, this law is triggered.
07:03Due process is protected.
07:05If you are convicted of felonious conduct in the United States and you are here illegally,
07:10these penalties come into play.
07:12If you're here illegally and you do not commit any crime, this law does not touch you.
07:16It targets the worst of the worst.
07:18It targets those who come back here illegally time and again to prey upon my children,
07:23my neighborhoods, people in your district, ma'am, and the time for allowing that is over.
07:28This bill gives law enforcement the tools to attack the committed criminals from around the world who come here illegally.
07:35Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
07:37Will the gentleman yield just for one quick question on that point?
07:39Will the gentleman yield?
07:41Am I reading the statute wrongly to say that a person could be put in prison for a longer period for no other crime other than reentry?
07:52Well, there's two answers to that.
07:56First, it elevates the sentence from zero to two years to zero to ten.
08:00In two years, it can take 24 months to resolve a case in two years, 24 months.
08:05And if it takes 21 months to resolve a case, there's only three months of active time that you can bestow.
08:10So it elevates it to ten years.
08:12But secondly, the mandatory time only is initiated if someone has been convicted of a felony here in the United States and then returns illegally.
08:24Does that make sense?
08:25Yeah, but the initial entry itself is a felony, right?
08:30So I guess what I'm getting at is you don't need to have murdered somebody or assaulted somebody or robbed somebody.
08:36Your crime could just have been an extra reentry.
08:41Illegal reentry with a felony conviction.
08:43Yeah.
08:43And again, I will state for the record, there is nothing that compels prosecutors to have to charge that.
08:48But if the felony is sufficiently serious, if they're sufficiently dangerous, et cetera, and they come back illegally, that hammer exists to be used.
08:55Would you entertain one other question, Mr. Ryan?
08:58Absolutely.
08:58So, but I guess this was back more on Ms. Jayapal's point, this relating to the Abreu-Garcia case and her amendment, which obviously is a kind of a preface to your bill.
09:17She's saying, before we go down this road, let's see that we're complying with the court orders that exist now for the return of people who've been unlawfully deported in an administrative era, right?
09:29And then the answer to that was, you know, this is a terrible guy, he's MS-13, he's a terrorist and so on.
09:36He's not been charged with any of that and he hasn't been convicted of any of that.
09:39And so are you saying the Supreme Court got it wrong in saying that there should be, you know, facilitation of his return to the country and that these people should be returning the country and they can be charged with anything at that point?
09:54I mean, maybe they're the worst person in the world, maybe they're not, but that's what due process is all about.
09:58I'm not talking about taking a position on the Supreme Court's opinion.
10:02I'm not taking a position on the executive branch's position.
10:08I trust that they have stated repeatedly they are working to effectuate the court's order.
10:12But in regards to this particular amendment, I think it's irrelevant to the bill.
10:17This bill targets those who are around the world that want to come here to profit through crime.
10:22It's obviously a need.
10:25We look at the effects all around the country and elevating the penalties, elevating the focus on illegal re-entry.
10:33That's the focus.
10:34And again, there is no compulsion to charge mandatory minimums.
10:37Those are only reserved.
10:38It's just one added layer of ability that law enforcement will have to target this class.
10:45Gentleman yields back.
10:47Gentleman from California is next.
10:50Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
10:52My friend from North Carolina, I think we're all in agreement here.
10:56Nobody wants violent criminals in our communities.
11:00Whether it's without documents, citizens or not, we don't want those individuals in our communities.
11:06Your focus on re-entry.
11:07That's an interesting one.
11:10You want to reduce undocumented entries into this country.
11:13I think you have it a little bit off target because if you really want to go after undocumented workers, you need to go after the employers, the people that provide them with jobs.
11:26Go after the small businesses, the farmers, the dairies, the home builders, the manufacturers.
11:34In California, manufacturing is big.
11:40Seventy percent of those workers are undocumented.
11:42The employer is a key.
11:47People come back to this country to work.
11:50And that's who you want to keep.
11:51So if you want to keep them out, just tell the employers don't hire people.
11:56Will the gentleman yield?
11:57Not yet.
11:58I will, but let me finish here.
11:59This is a Wall Street Journal article from two days ago.
12:04I'm going to read it to you.
12:05It says, President Trump's mass deportation push has caused widespread fear among immigrants.
12:14What it has not done is stop them from showing up to work.
12:18As of April, there were 32 million foreign workers.
12:2232 million foreign workers in the U.S. up 4.4 percent from January of last year.
12:33So they're still being hired.
12:36So here's the situation, sir.
12:40Make it illegal.
12:42Penalize employers.
12:43Triple down on the penalties.
12:46Time in jail.
12:48You're going to give employers a choice.
12:50You follow the law.
12:52Fire your undocumented workers.
12:55And you go out of business.
12:56Or you ignore the law.
12:59Keep your undocumented workers.
13:01And stay in business.
13:02That's a choice you're going to have the employers decide on.
13:06I'm going to give you, mention a couple more articles.
13:11This one is from the National Milk Producers Federation.
13:1751 percent of the workers in the dairy business are immigrants.
13:22Not enough H-2A visas.
13:25Well, those are temporary workers.
13:26They need year-on workers.
13:28Wisconsin Examiner.
13:30Nowhere would mass deportations have a bigger impact than on Wisconsin's dairy farms, where about 70 percent of the workforce is made up of immigrants from Mexico and Central America.
13:47I've got one more article for you.
13:49I've got one more article for you.
13:50Nebraska Public Media.
13:52Dairy farms are vulnerable to Trump's mass deportations.
13:56The industry hopes to get a pass.
13:58So, we're trying to slow down undocumented workers.
14:04The problem is not penalizing workers or employers.
14:10We've got to have immigration reform.
14:13Give an opportunity for an employer to hire a worker legally.
14:18These workers from the U.S. are children.
14:22We are not going to work in farms, dairies, or manufacturing plants.
14:29So, you know, this is essentially a charade.
14:33You're telling people that are starving, don't come to the U.S.
14:38You're telling employers that need the workers, don't hire them.
14:43The Wall Street Journal tells you clearly since January, employment of undocumented in this country is going up.
14:51So, let's figure out immigration reform.
14:57And, sir, I would welcome the opportunity to work with you to come up with a solution to this problem.
15:04It's not about undocumented.
15:05It's not about employers.
15:07It's about the American economy and keeping it growing and keeping us as the greatest economy in the world.
15:15I got 38 seconds.
15:16I'll yield to you.
15:17Thank you for the clarification, sir.
15:19And just a point of further discussion, I will say I'm not going after the dairy worker.
15:25I'm not going after the construction worker.
15:27This bill targets the individual who comes back into the country.
15:30If I may, a lot of those come back as reentries.
15:33With a felony.
15:34If the dairy worker does not get convicted of a felony, he is not under this law.
15:38If he comes in again to the U.S.?
15:40Illegally.
15:41Illegally.
15:41If you get deported.
15:42Yes.
15:43These are illegal workers.
15:44If you get deported, don't come back illegally.
15:46Come back legally.
15:47They will come back because the job is there for them.
15:50And again, more than happy.
15:53Again, this bill targets convicted felons who want to come back into the country.
15:58A second, third.
15:59Mr. Chairman, I'd like to submit these articles.
16:01Without objection.
16:03They'll be entered into the record.
16:06I'll claim time and I'll yield to the gentleman from North Carolina.
16:09But just let me say, I believe the focus of the gentleman's legislation or Ms. Spice's legislation that Mr. Knott has worked so hard on is really what he said in his opening statement.
16:19It's the guy who's part of the cartel, part of the terrorist organization, who keeps coming back because he's making money from the cartel, giving drugs that have killed thousands of Americans.
16:31And if he does get caught, goes through the process, felony conviction, they send him back.
16:37You come back again.
16:38And, oh, the judge is going to be able to put you away for a lot longer time because we want to stop that guy who's bringing the fentanyl.
16:45That's the focus.
16:46Not on people who have a visa who are here working.
16:49It's on that individual.
16:51And I would yield to the gentleman from North Carolina.
16:52That's exactly right, Mr. Chairman.
16:55And in regards to how this bill would work, again, from what I saw in my firsthand experience, there were people who will come back repeatedly to inflict harm on this country through crime.
17:09And this bill will make it more efficient to identify, prosecute, and remove those individuals from circulation, from our society.
17:17Again, if you are here illegally and you do not get convicted of a crime and you do not reenter the country illegally, this bill does not touch you.
17:27Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
17:32Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
17:39You know, I think I just want to kind of distill down what my colleague, Ms. Jayapal, is talking about.
17:45And I am definitely going to yield some time to her.
17:48I think our concern is that because somebody says something, that doesn't make it evidence.
17:54And right now what we have is people saying, well, we have evidence.
17:59As attorneys, we know that that evidence has to be tested in court.
18:04And that is what due process really looks like.
18:07It's not just saying that somebody is MS-13.
18:10It is a matter of a judge determining whether or not that evidence would be admissible and having the ability to look at the credibility of the witness offering that evidence, such as when we're talking about Kilmer.
18:26If we look at that, it says there's a, I've got a couple of articles.
18:31There's an article that says government's case against Abrego Garcia is based on PG County cop who was on the SA's do not call list because he was not a credible witness.
18:44The only person that said that he was MS-13 is a cop that ended up being, I don't think he got fired, but he definitely, oh, okay, nevermind.
18:54He did get fired.
18:55So we're going to say that we're going to base our entire case, so to speak.
19:00This is why we have courts.
19:02This is why we are talking about due process because that's what it looks like.
19:06It looks like more than somebody, listen, I can't tell you how many lies are made up by MAGA followers about me.
19:15I done been all kinds of things and none of it is true just because they put it out there on social media.
19:21That is the problem that we're having right now in this country is that it seems like nobody cares about the truth anymore.
19:27And what we're trying to do is say we have a fact finding and let me be clear, I am not saying that the criminal justice system or any other justice system has ever always been perfect.
19:40I am not trying to say that, but we do have a system and that system is supposed to be based upon the Constitution.
19:49And right now, like literally due process comes from the Constitution.
19:53This should be the highest protections that one can have in the land.
19:57And right now, it seems like y'all don't care about the Constitution unless it's the Second Amendment and that's misinterpreted as well.
20:05OK, there's other amendments to the Constitution and we don't get to just change it because our fearless leader says that he doesn't like certain parts of the Constitution.
20:16We have a process, again, to get amendments.
20:20Right. There are people that don't like the fact that there was an amendment so that women could vote.
20:25And guess what? We ended up with something like the SAVE Act because we don't want women to vote like literally.
20:32But I'm I'm getting off track. So I'm going to go back because I know that Miss Jayapal wanted some time.
20:36So I will yield my time to the gentle lady from Washington.
20:39Thank you so much, Representative Crockett. Look, I I I want to go back to the amendment, which says nothing in this bill can be enacted until we follow the courts and return these wrongfully detained deported people to the United States.
20:57And I would thank the sponsor of the bill for at least ensuring that there's a conviction in this bill.
21:01A lot of the bills around immigration that have been brought up to the floor of the House do not require a conviction.
21:09And so I appreciate that you put a conviction in.
21:11Not too late to co-sponsor.
21:13I believe that that is an important threshold that should be.
21:17And I hope that maybe you voted against all those bills.
21:19I'm going to go back and check. I don't think so.
21:21But maybe you voted against all those bills that didn't have a conviction because we voted on a lot of them and they don't have convictions.
21:28So I appreciate that you put in a conviction here.
21:32Here's the problem.
21:34I think you believe in due process.
21:36You were you said you have experience arguing in courts.
21:39I assume that you respect court decisions.
21:42But I have not heard a single person on your side speak out and say that the administration must return Kilmar Abrego Garcia to this country when the president of the United States said he had the power to do that.
21:57And when you say to me, oh, there's all this information on Mr. Garcia, Abrego Garcia, and he's this and he's that, I guess I'm surprised at that.
22:06Because if you really believe in due process in the court system, and I believe you do, I'm going to give you that benefit of the doubt, then why not present that information in court?
22:17The Trump administration has refused to present information in court.
22:22And the judges, when they've looked at the things that are there, they're saying, nope, not good enough, doesn't meet the standard.
22:31So why don't you all say, issue a statement from the Judiciary Committee Republicans, happy to co-sponsor it with you if you'd like,
22:40that says that you believe that the Trump administration should follow the ruling of the Supreme Court of the United States
22:49and any judge that rules, including those judges who were appointed by Donald Trump, to return these wrongfully deported individuals to the United States?
22:57Because it is undermining everything that you've done in your career, everything that we stand for on this committee,
23:04to not speak out about it and to act like somehow this is okay.
23:08I think whatever you believe about Mr. Abrego Garcia, you should be able to say that he should have due process
23:16and that he should, and that the Trump administration should follow the Supreme Court.
23:21So if you're, and I think that this is relevant to this bill.
23:25And so I hope that we can do that together.
23:27I doubt it, but I hope we can do that.
23:28More than expired.
23:28And Mr. Chairman, I have two.
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