'Do You Think Our Country Spends Too Much On Scientific Research?': John Hickenlooper Grills RFK Jr.

Forbes Breaking News

At Wednesday's Senate Health Committee hearing, Sen. John Hickenlooper (D-CO) questioned HHS Sec. Robert F. Kennedy Jr.

Transcript

00:00Chair, thank you, Mr. Secretary, for taking the time and for your willingness to come

00:03into the public sector. I'm not going to try and play gotcha, but it is an opportunity

00:08to spend a little bit of philosophical time. And I guess one question is, do you think

00:12our country spends too much on scientific research?

00:15No. Okay. And so, obviously, you know the NIH

00:19is the largest, in terms of biomedical research, there's the Howard Hughes Institute, but the

00:2370% of the world. Exactly, 70% of the world.

00:26And I guess, when you look at the level of cuts that we're facing

00:31over there, and I recognize that a lot of these cuts are imposed upon you.

00:36But there's a gap in basic fundamental

00:40research that's going to have to be filled somehow. And have you got any

00:43ideas of how we can do that, given the scale,

00:48the dimension of the loss that we're facing? Well, you know,

00:51first of all, my job is to support the President on this, and

00:55support OMB. But, you know, like, the reality is that, as I've said,

01:00no agency head wants to see cuts to his agency. And I

01:03love scientific research, so I want to do as much as possible.

01:08But I think because of the,

01:11we are very, very aggressively

01:14implementing AI, and I think we're going to do it faster

01:17and better than anybody else in government, any other agency. We brought

01:21very, very high-quality caliber people from Silicon Valley.

01:26Yeah, yeah. I get that. And that will accelerate and help us do more research.

01:28That's right. If we can shorten clinical trials, we can

01:31get rid of animal trials, which we're already doing.

01:34I'm in support of all that. We've talked about that for years.

01:37And we can do, and we can now digitize...

01:39The research I'm talking about is not that so much as the

01:42fundamental scientific, basic science research.

01:45Like bench science or epidemiological studies or whatever.

01:48And I think we can do a lot of that stuff quicker.

01:52You know, I'll take as much money as you give me, and I'll spend it well.

01:55Well, I just want to make sure to urge you to be a fighter

01:57for more of that research, because there's

02:00a questioning of science right now

02:03within many in the White House. Not everyone,

02:07but many in the White House. It really needs to be pushed back.

02:12And Senator Hawley, I'll sign on to that bill as well.

02:15The second question I've got, we have a lot of issues around wildfires

02:23in Colorado right now, and this is back to the NIOSH,

02:28the National Institute of Occupational Safety Health.

02:34You mentioned that they kept them in Cleveland and I think somewhere

02:38in Pennsylvania. Pretty much everyone's laid off in Colorado.

02:42In Oregonstown, yeah.

02:43Yeah. Everyone's laid off in Colorado, and

02:46the question really, and I think a couple have been

02:50in order to be reinstated, but all the West is dealing with these,

02:54I mean, thousands, tens of thousands, probably hundreds of thousands

02:58of people out fighting fires. These are people risking their lives,

03:02you know, walking away from their families every day.

03:04The basic research that needs to be done, I don't think the replacements are

03:11going to be, in many cases, they're new onto the job.

03:14They're not going to be sufficient to address and really make sure the specific

03:19health needs of these workers, these outdoor workers, are addressed.

03:23So the question is, how can we, how can you make sure that folks in Colorado,

03:27like firefighters, are able to do their jobs safely?

03:30You know, there, I think a lot of the cuts that we're implementing now are painful cuts

03:37and that, that they, you know, there are cuts that are going to, are going to be difficult.

03:44But I think the president's position is that we're spending $2 trillion that we don't have,

03:52that we are taking from our children. And we've got to protect their rights to prosperity,

03:58to enrichment, to dignity, to choice. And, you know, so...

04:04I get, I've heard that argument and I appreciate it. And I'm a great frugal,

04:10a voice of frugality, at least in my office, and try to push it around the,

04:15the Senate where, where it's allowed.

04:18But we're looking at a budget that's going to increase the deficit by,

04:22who knows how much, $4 to $5 trillion.

04:26To take things like this that we know are successful, and not just for Colorado,

04:30but for most, almost every Western state essential, and we're cutting,

04:34you're saving such a small amount of money for something that's so important.

04:37I just hope that you can push back on that a little bit.

04:41And someone's got to take a stand for these things that are minor financial benefits,

04:46but significant losses to how we provide safety for workers and our citizens.

04:51I'm happy to work with you on that, Senator.

04:54Okay, great. I yield back to the chair.

Category

Transcript

Recommended