During a Senate Armed Services Committee hearing last week, Sen. Tammy Duckworth (D-IL) spoke about Sec. Pete Hegseth removing gender-differentiation in military fitness tests.
00:04First, I want to thank you both for very productive conversations you had with me prior to this hearing.
00:09Mr. Obodal, given this week's announcements on Army transformation, I want to start with you first.
00:13We had a great conversation.
00:15It's no secret that I am deeply committed to our Army and its future.
00:19I support Army modernization, but we must balance modernization with readiness today.
00:25To be clear, I'm encouraged by parts of the Army's proposed reforms.
00:28However, I am concerned about the impacts of some proposed cuts through the Joint Forces sustainment and supply enterprise.
00:34And we discussed this a little bit.
00:36For one, I worry how the proposed integration of Joint Munitions Command and Army Sustainment Command
00:42may impact their two critical mission sets, including managing complex ecosystems required to deliver munitions to warfighters,
00:50both for the Army but also for the Joint Force.
00:53And then also, as the Army considers replacing the Humvee, I urge the Army to consider impacts to medical evacuation capabilities,
01:00because the Humvee is really the main source of the Army's ambulances platforms.
01:10Mr. Obodal, will you commit to engaging with me and this committee early, before final decisions are made,
01:15so that we can fully communicate and help the Army address the far-reaching impacts of cuts like these?
01:21Absolutely, Senator. And thank you for the time that you spent with me on the phone.
01:24Thank you. I look forward to working with you.
01:26Mr. O'Keefe, turning to you.
01:28If confirmed, you will be a key advisor to Secretary Heck Seth on the review he directed to ensure physical standards among the services are sex-neutral.
01:36His words.
01:37As you know, every service member does take a physical fitness test, at least annually.
01:41It's required for your continued service and your promotion.
01:44I took one every year for 23 years and some years more than once.
01:49On top of that, specific combat military occupational specialties, like Army Rangers, for example,
01:55already have added physical standards.
01:58The services have combat job-specific physical testing, which is actually what makes our forces capable of carrying out the full range of types of combat roles.
02:07Do you acknowledge that the military already has uniform physical standards specific to different occupational specialties
02:14that is the same for both male and female troops?
02:17Senator, I don't know the details of every physical fitness requirement for every occupational specialty.
02:26I have been informed that many of them do at least, so I don't know every job.
02:32Understood.
02:33But the combat roles, especially the Rangers, SEALs, those all have one standard that are not gender differentiated.
02:42Again, I don't know the details of every position in those units.
02:46I do believe that many of them do.
02:48Okay.
02:49Not all combat roles are the same.
02:51The physical and mental requirements to operate an attack helicopter, like Mr. O'Barao did, which makes Black Hawk pilots like myself shudder,
02:58are different than the strength needed to lift a motor tube or different than endurance required of a scout sniper, for example.
03:06The fact of the matter is that the services already test to the most applicable physical requirements for a specific combat role.
03:13For example, the Marines have military occupational specialty specific physical standards, which are mission-specific,
03:20and both men and women have to meet the same standard, and the Army also has sex-neutral standards for every occupational specialty.
03:28If combat jobs already have gender-neutral physical qualifications, what change is Secretary Hexeth actually making?
03:36He has his sights on creating a, and again, his words, gender-neutral combat standard for the annual fitness assessments.
03:44These are tests that were ensured to make sure that we have a baseline physical fitness across the United States military.
03:51They're not job-specific.
03:53They're just making sure that you can stay in the military, and those are differentiated based on gender and age.
03:59But if Secretary Hexeth logic is to have one combat fitness standard to rule them all, why would we stop at gender?
04:06Mr. O'Keefe, would you support holding all service members in combat roles, regardless of age, to the same fitness standards,
04:13if you're going to get rid of the gender-specific standards?
04:16Senator, I think that the fitness requirements for combat roles should be whether it's the fitness test,
04:23and I appreciate the distinction between a fitness test and the occupational requirements.
04:27I think that's important to note.
04:29But certainly the occupational standards, I believe, should be consistent, regardless of who's performing the job.
04:34Okay, so would you agree with me that if we are going to get rid of the gender differentiation,
04:40we should also get rid of the age differentiation?
04:43Because it's supposed to be for the job.
04:44Senator, as I say, I think any requirement for a particular job should be agnostic about,
04:50as long as the requirements are set in a realistic way and are determined to be relevant for the position,
04:56it's my view that those should be consistent.
05:00So both gender and age-neutral?
05:02Anyone performing the role, yes, yes, Senator.
05:04Okay.
05:06I think that President Hexeth should eliminate age-based scaling for annual fitness test scoring and standards,
05:11then, if he's going to get rid of the gender scaling.
05:14Would you agree with that?
05:16Again, Senator, I think there's a, and you noted the distinction between the fitness tests and the occupational requirements.
05:23I think that those are different conversations.
05:27They've been muddied somewhat over the years, I grant you.
05:30But I do think there's a distinction there between the two.
05:33Well, he's bringing it up.
05:34He wants to get rid of the gender differentiation for the annual fitness test.
05:38If he's going to do that, would you agree with me that he should, that we should also then get rid of the age differentiation for the annual fitness test?
05:45If you're going to get rid of the gender differentiation, then you should get rid of the age differentiation.
05:49Certainly, Senator, I've confirmed.
05:51I don't know the details of the, I know there's an effort in the department going through all of that right now.
05:56And we just had a meeting with the Army about a week ago on their test.
06:00But certainly, if confirmed, that would be, I think, an area where I'd look forward to providing some insight and advice to the Secretary on that one.
