00:00Ilmari from Finland. Pranam Achaira Ji. There has been a lot of talk on veganism in the
00:16MAC group lately. I have also watched many of your videos relating to this topic. I would
00:23like to know your take on teaching veganism to children. I know that veganism has to be
00:30a thing of the heart and that just forcing dry ideology isn't good for anyone. As a
00:36vegan parent, I'm not concerned about my ability to show compassion but rather about
00:42the choices I sometimes have to make for the sake of my daughter's physical well-being.
00:47She's very choosy towards vegan protein sources and that's why we sometimes have to
00:53buy dairy products for her. Every time I have to do that, I feel bad.
00:58So there is this conflict between my responsibility to provide her with nutritionally balanced diet
01:04and with my heartfelt refusal to take part in the exploitation of other living beings.
01:09I wonder if there is any right or wrong in this. Thank you for your guidance Ilmari.
01:15Ilmari we are neither Prakritic beings nor do we live in truthfully. If you look at the
01:43birds and animals in the jungle, they live totally by Prakriti. If you look at saints, they live totally by the heart. In the industrialized world, man lives neither as a Prakritic being nor as a Prakritic being.
02:11And nor as a being of truth. We live by the mind. We live by the intellect.
02:21The intellect has created all these problems that we are facing. Veganism is a response to the problems created by intellect.
02:49We don't have to teach veganism. We don't have to teach veganism to animals. Neither do we have to teach veganism to saints.
02:58Animals don't need veganism. Saints too don't need veganism.
03:09Man in this modern postmodern world needs veganism. The man who is a creation of his intellect needs this veganism.
03:23If you look at man today, he is neither a creation of the jungle nor is he a creation of God. He is a creation of his own mind.
03:38Majorly. Majorly. If you look at him very closely, then you will realize he is similar to the ones who live in the jungle.
03:48And you will have to look at a million human beings to come across a few who will make you realize that man probably came from God.
04:02If you look at the bulk of human beings from a distance, you will neither feel that they come from jungle nor would you feel that they come from God.
04:20Man comes neither from jungle nor from God. Today's man comes from the factory. We are products of our intellect. We are products of the human factory.
04:33And our problems, I said two are problems arising from the human intellect. But that has become our centre. We will operate from our centre. Won't we?
04:45Intellect is the centre of today's man. If that be so, why not use the same intellect in a godly way?
05:02In a godly way? If intellect is what we are identified with, why not surrender this same intellect to the service of God?
05:18Why not, for example, use the intellect to create sources of vitamin B12 and proteins and many other vitamins and minerals that are not
05:47exploitative towards animals? If you say that you must provide your daughter with a protein-rich diet, why does the protein have to come from dairy?
06:10When everything in your life? When everything in your life is anyway factory produced, why not use factory produced protein as well?
06:21People say, oh, but that would be unnatural. Hello? If you want to be fully natural, then live on the trees. Is it natural to live in houses? Is it natural to wear clothes? Is it natural to go to schools? By nature, you mean Prakriti, right? Do all these things happen in the jungle? But when you live in the house, then you do not say, oh, it is unnatural.
06:49When you live in the house, do you say, oh, it is unnatural? I will not do it. Now, man has come out of the jungle. He is anyway no more Prakritic. His center is not Prakriti, neither is his center Atma. His center is Buddhi.
07:16It is a very strange situation. It is a very strange situation that man is in. What is the center of an animal? What is the center of the saint? What is the center of today's man?
07:30So, use this same Buddhi in the service of truth. You live in an industrialized, heavily industrialized Western country, Ilmari.
07:45How is it not possible to have artificial sources of vitamin C, D, A, B, B12? How is it not possible to manufacture proteins just as you manufacture everything else?
08:05Why is it necessary? Why is it necessary that the protein molecule must come from an animal's body?
08:13Why is it necessary?
08:14On one hand, we pride ourselves in factory producing everything.
08:26Can't we factory produce protein?
08:31Must you kill to have protein?
08:32some people even say veganism is unnatural and their biggest argument is vitamin b12
08:41they say this vitamin can come only from an animal source and human body requires this
08:51so this is the proof that veganism is unnatural they mean a prakritic i agree
08:59veganism is not prakritic but then why must it be prakritic is man prakritic anymore
09:06if you want to be prakritic then i say go back and live in the jungle you have come out of the
09:14jungle is marriage prakritic are there marriages in the jungle so marriage is the first thing that
09:20is unnatural is language prakritic are there languages in the jungle are there clothes in
09:29the jungle are there countries in the jungle are there constitutions in the jungle are there
09:34vehicles in the jungle but then to all these things you do not say oh these are unnatural
09:39to all these things you are happily amenable
09:43but the moment it is discovered that vitamin b12 cannot be found
09:50except in an animal source you rejoice and say you see now veganism is ticked off because it is proven
10:06that veganism is unnatural yes of course veganism is unnatural and just as you choose so many things
10:14choose veganism as well do not choose it because it is natural do not choose it choose it because it is coming from compassion
10:35do not choose it because of prakriti choose it because of karuna and these are two very very different arguments
10:46there are the naturalists who say that you should choose what is there in prakriti i strongly deny that
10:53i am not a naturalist i do not say that you should live as prakriti lives
10:59in prakriti all creatures or rather most creatures except the nocturnal ones
11:05sleep at night i conduct my sessions after midnight
11:11am i prakritic am i
11:15so i am not at all a supporter of prakriti
11:20in fact all spirituality
11:22is about transcending prakriti
11:25so i am not a naturalist i stand for transcendence of physical nature which you call as prakriti
11:31but in transcending prakriti i do not want to stop at buddhi or intellect
11:40in transcending prakriti i want to reach the atma or truth where compassion resides
11:47get the difference please
11:48usually people think that spirituality and naturalism go together
11:55they think you know if you are a spiritual man
12:00then you would love fruits and all kinds of animal products
12:06and these two often are seen together
12:10the moment a person picks up some spiritual text
12:16he also starts eating more raw food
12:23it is often a combination
12:24it is seen that spiritual people go to the jungles
12:33so somehow
12:37a correlation has been established in the mind that spirituality
12:41and prakriti go together
12:44no wrong
12:45spirituality is transcendence of prakriti
12:49and when you transcend prakriti
12:52then you can really love prakriti
12:53it is a
12:55it is a thing that you have to appreciate
12:58those who do not transcend prakriti
13:00remain attached with prakriti
13:02and if you remain attached with prakriti
13:04you will consume prakriti
13:06for example
13:07if you remain attached to your own body
13:10then you will kill somebody's body to feed your own body
13:13if you are attached to prakriti
13:15you will rape prakriti
13:17but the saint goes beyond prakriti
13:21from there he can just lovingly witness and watch prakriti
13:26then he doesn't interfere with prakriti
13:29or consume it or rape it
13:30are you getting it
13:33in fact a lot of damage to prakriti is being brought about by prakriti lovers as well
13:42so they would say
13:45you know we require
13:47a particular type of fruit
13:50now for that type of fruit to be grown
13:54all other species of trees are being cut off
13:57if you are
14:05standing at the intellect
14:07as you are
14:09use the intellect
14:11find out where in the world
14:14from where in the world
14:17can you get
14:20all nutrients
14:29that are not animal sourced
14:34let industries come up
14:40if it is required that artificial meat be made
14:47in order to satisfy people
14:51who necessarily want to have meat
14:53I am all in favor of
14:56more technological research
14:59to produce
15:00more artificial meat
15:03that closely resembles animal meat
15:05this is compassion
15:08because this is going to save
15:10billions of animals every day
15:12let
15:15technological prowess be used
15:17to produce artificial meat
15:19because the fellow is now addicted to meat
15:23he will eat meat
15:25and if you will not give him artificial meat
15:26he will slaughter the animal
15:27so use intellect
15:33use research
15:37use technology
15:37what is all your scientific knowledge for
15:39you can't even produce
15:41a protein molecule in the factory
15:44and then we sing so much about
15:48man's scientific advancements
15:50are you getting it?
15:57man cannot go back to the jungle
16:00so even if you want to protect the jungle now
16:06intellect is the answer
16:08man can neither go back to the jungle
16:16nor can man give up the intellect
16:19but the jungle has to be protected
16:22so the intellect is the answer
16:24use the mind
16:26use the mind
16:28in service
16:31to the
16:32truth
16:33if intellect is what you have
16:36devote the intellect
16:38to the service of the truth
16:39to the service of compassion
16:45you
17:00you
17:00You
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