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00:00So I have this doubt regarding the entire Vedant model. What do you say Aham Vritti in the Beeta session?
00:07From that comes the thoughts or the logics to justify and then from there comes the actions.
00:11Model is an idea. Vedant asks you to look into the ideator. Who is making the model?
00:19So Vedant says look into the eye. It's not a model. It's who you are.
00:22Just one last thing. Like all the videos that you make, how are you confident that what you are saying is right?
00:29Like when I see Kabir Das and I am just totally blown away because he didn't have that much scientific knowledge.
00:40In fact everyone who comes 2000 years back and so on. So why do we on the path of liberation have to study this much?
00:49How did Darwin gather all these things? Was there a theory of evolution before him?
00:53Yeah, via tour he had that.
00:56Obviously. So he just kept observing all the seas, all the islands, one specific island in particular.
01:03So just as Darwin could know those things by observation, so could all the wise people before him.
01:09So first of all, thank you, sir. It's my first time I'm listening to you. So I have this doubt regarding the entire Vedant model.
01:21Like that I am a restlessness, a Pecheni, what we say. And out of this incompleteness, this restlessness.
01:28All my desires, all my wants comes up. And then from this desires, what you say Aham Vritti in the Vita session, from that comes the thoughts or the logics to justify.
01:39And then from there comes the actions. So it's like a model. It's a complete model.
01:43But then when I listen to Jiddu Krishnamurti ji, then he says that don't rely on any model or theorization, conceptualization, ideas.
01:50Because just like we discussed right now, that all ideas, all logics would have some sort of flaw.
01:56So, and then I also know that, okay, everything ultimately is facts. That means that you see it yourself and then it becomes a fact for you.
02:06But then it becomes very confusing in the sense that you start navigating into the ideas as well.
02:12Like you start navigating into models.
02:15Model is an idea. Vedant asks you to look into the ideator.
02:21Who is making the model?
02:26It's not your creation that you have to be too concerned with.
02:32You have to look at the creator within.
02:35I, I. The I is not a model or is it? It is your living reality.
02:41Yeah.
02:42So Vedant says look into the I. It's not a model. It's who you are.
02:47But like, then like, okay, I asked you a question and then you give me an answer.
02:52That was also even a logical deduction. Like A, then B, then C.
02:57So even that would have some sort of fallacy. Then how do we even reach any sort of definite knowledge?
03:05Answer is just an attempt.
03:08Hmm? Whether you can begin looking at yourself. The answer is obviously not the thing.
03:15It is an attempt at making the thing happen.
03:18A pointer to something.
03:20A pointer to something, an encouragement, whatever you call it.
03:24So it itself does not contain anything because it is.
03:28Oh, it does not. It does not. It's not. And an answer by itself is a very helpless thing.
03:33It cannot do anything by itself.
03:37Hmm? It's just a hope you could say.
03:40It's just a hope that by virtue of the answer, the right thing might happen.
03:44But whether or not it would happen depends totally on the receiver.
03:49Like from which center I am listening?
03:53Whether there is now love strong enough to make things happen.
04:02So like even the entire model, like you taught us that, okay, I am a restlessness.
04:08No, I didn't. I didn't teach you I am a restlessness.
04:11I said you find out whether or not you are restless.
04:14There is a difference between taking it from me and finding it out for yourself.
04:20But like, maybe I am wrong in this, but if you listen it, that okay.
04:25There is a model going on that I am a restlessness and so on.
04:29And then you start observing, maybe you would just unconsciously, like you would force it.
04:34In your things that, okay, see this, I am restlessness.
04:36That's possible. That's possible. That's possible.
04:38So then how will we know that this is a fact?
04:41Because sometimes when you have observed and you realize that, okay, this model is absolutely precise.
04:45It is explaining everything.
04:47But then when the right choice comes, when the time of choice comes and you're like, okay, I have to leave the bed and do the right thing.
04:53That's when the ego gives you logic.
04:56At the end of the long winded answer, there are just these two words.
05:03Look, look at yourself.
05:07Find it out.
05:09See who you are.
05:11So that's the only thing that the answer implores you to do.
05:21The answer does not say, remember the answer.
05:24The answer says, remember who you are.
05:30What if the knowledge itself says that any feeling of superiority or inferiority is to an inferior one?
05:57What if that is the knowledge?
06:00Yeah, right.
06:05To whom is the knowledge?
06:06Who is the knower?
06:07The knower itself is an inferior entity.
06:11Maybe that is the realization.
06:13But yes, I get what you are saying.
06:15What you are saying is, these things must be discovered by oneself.
06:19Yes.
06:20If they are not discovered, they will become motivated.
06:23Very well said and that's a point well made.
06:28These things must be discovered by oneself.
06:31Otherwise, anything coming from any source, any teacher, any book will cease to have any kind of right impact.
06:42I can keep telling you, oh, there is restlessness within.
06:45But have you bothered to pause and see whether there is restlessness within?
06:50Otherwise, you are right.
06:51Just remain a model.
06:52Yeah.
06:53Because it feels like that.
06:56Sometimes I am just like thinking about the model rather than living it.
07:00What do you say?
07:01Like that.
07:02In Bhagavad Gita, Krishnan says to Arjun that, see these people are already dead.
07:08He is dead.
07:09Dreyodhan.
07:10So, that obviously, if someone listens to this particular line without knowing anything, without observing,
07:16they would obviously see that there is a superiority model.
07:18That okay, Arjun, Krishnan, all these are superior people and Dreyodhan are lower people.
07:22So, on what grounds are you saying that this person is lower?
07:24The ground is the 72 verses that come before that.
07:28Gyan Yog.
07:29That's all about knowing yourself.
07:31So, when you know yourself, you also see there is a part of you that is exactly the same as the ones you are fighting.
07:43And you know that part of you is dead.
07:46So, you know the ones you are fighting are dead.
07:48There can be no superiority.
07:50The ones you are fighting are all already present inside you as a part of you.
07:55So, if you call them dead, you are acknowledging that you too are dead and that's okay.
08:01But like shouldn't we give them an opportunity?
08:03That okay, even though these people have some choice left, that maybe they can also come to Hosh.
08:08Some, they can also come to understanding.
08:10Maybe Dreyodhan can come to understand.
08:12Maybe that opportunity was given in ample measure.
08:17If we are to get into the details of the story now rather than the philosophy.
08:24The story says that there was ample opportunity provided.
08:29But those who were being fought refused to avail the opportunity.
08:33Just one last thing.
08:38Like all the videos that you make, how are you confident that what you are saying is right?
08:43Like I am not being rude or something.
08:46I don't care about being right.
08:48All I have is my honesty.
08:54And I speak from there.
08:55And when I am saying something to you, I just don't know whether it is right or wrong.
09:03I have no idea at all about what I am saying.
09:08Like what you say feels like a mathematical statement, like a theorem.
09:16Okay, when you are angry, you are basically angry because you are losing on something.
09:20You want something and hence you are angry.
09:22So this is like a mathematical statement.
09:24If someone is angry, he won't ever say, okay, I want something.
09:27That's why I am angry.
09:28You see, when everything that is happening inside us is a game of atoms and molecules and things.
09:37Obviously, mathematics applies on things.
09:43Right?
09:44If what is happening inside me is a chemical equation, shouldn't it be honestly expressed as a chemical equation?
09:51And all chemical equations deploy mathematics.
09:54So that's okay.
10:02It's like this time quite, like I don't understand this.
10:05I get your concern and I fully ratify it.
10:11You see, even the best of things coming from someone else will remain a bit alien.
10:24You have to go into the process yourself.
10:27And that's the entire point of the one who speaks to you.
10:32He does not want to supplant your inner journey with his words.
10:39He wants to use his words to catalyze your inner journey.
10:44The words cannot be a substitute to self-knowledge.
10:53These are things that you have to know by yourself and for yourself.
10:58And this is for everybody?
11:00Everybody.
11:01Everybody.
11:02Absolutely everybody.
11:03The words, they are not the reality or the truth.
11:06The words are at best an encouragement.
11:09But then it is said now that, like you gave an example in a very old video that I am on my car and the car is not running.
11:17So it's basically the handbrake is pulled down.
11:20So either the guru comes and say, just put the handbrake down or you just know about the car, the engine and everything.
11:27And now you know that.
11:28So this is Jnana Yoga and that is Bhakti Yoga.
11:31So in that particular situation, the person is listening to a guru and then doing the action.
11:36And in this particular situation, I am knowing everything and then I am doing the same thing.
11:41Irrespective of whether you do it or the guru does it, first of all, you must know that the car is revving and not moving.
11:50That is something that you have to individually do, right?
11:53If even that much has not been done, how can any helper help?
12:02You are in a running car and you feel it's all quite smooth.
12:09Will you listen to advice from anywhere?
12:13So first of all, there has to be an inner, honest and purely individual admission of suffering.
12:23After that, it could be your own strive.
12:28I am striving to know what is happening and I want to get rid of all this.
12:35It could be a purely individual thing or you could take help from whatever external sources possible.
12:41But irrespective of whether it's your own journey from there on or you take assistance.
12:48The thing is, first of all, you came to admit that there was something that was missing.
12:56Ah, MS.
12:58There was something that was broken.
13:00And that nobody else can do for you.
13:06That is a thing of your own honest admission.
13:09You know the problem and then you decide that, okay, I will read the biology book or I will go to the doctor.
13:14Something like that.
13:15Yes, yes, well captured.
13:18First of all, but first of all, and in that nobody can impose himself on you.
13:25Nobody can make you do anything.
13:27It is a thing of purely personal volition.
13:32It's a sovereign choice of the consciousness to admit, yes, I am not alright, but I want to be alright.
13:40And there comes the faith as well.
13:44Because consciousness just keeps forgetting that it is diseased.
13:47So, at the time of forgetting, you have to keep faith that, okay, I am diseased.
13:51No, no, no.
13:52More than faith, you need attention.
13:54You might forget that you have disease, but life will remind you.
13:57At that particular moment, you can just give attention and you're like, okay, alright.
14:02Life will give you one tight slab from here or there if you forget your real condition, right?
14:09My eyes are dysfunctional.
14:12I cannot see.
14:13I might forget that I have been blinded.
14:17But then as soon as I stumble, I will be forced to acknowledge that.
14:23So, life serves great reminders.
14:26So, the thing called faith, what is the purpose of it then?
14:32It's not the reminder.
14:35Faith is nothing but, in simple words, a reluctance, a fierce resistance against the finality of your current condition.
14:52I do not know what greatness means.
14:56I do not know what lies in store next.
15:00But what I certainly know is, this is not what I was born for.
15:04This is faith.
15:06A huge, there has to be something else.
15:11I do not know what, but there has to be.
15:13This cannot be the finality.
15:15I resist.
15:16I refuse to accept this as my destiny.
15:19This is faith.
15:20I have various doubts, but I guess many other people must be answered.
15:28You can continue.
15:29I'm enjoying this.
15:30Okay.
15:31So, like, there is faith.
15:34And if you, like, I was observing on this, I was, I don't know what should we say, thinking, observing, what is the right word.
15:39But the ego creates the exact parallel of what is formed when you are in Hosh.
15:46Like, you have faith, and then you have belief.
15:48You have frame, love, compassion, and then you have attachment.
15:51Attachment also just springs up like anything.
15:53Like, when a person falls in love for a girl or something, they say that, okay, it just comes from my inside and all that.
16:01But compassion, too, comes like that only.
16:03It never comes, like, I want this and that's why I'm compassionate.
16:07So both comes without reason.
16:09Same goes like the thought.
16:11When I'm in Hosh, like, when you say that understanding gives you right action.
16:17Understanding also, there are thoughts and they lead to action.
16:21And the same thing is happening when you are in Vicheni and a particular desire gives you thoughts and actions.
16:28So basically, the ego has created exact parallel world so that you just keep remaining.
16:34You just keep remain in that thing, thinking that this is my home.
16:38Like, this is what I have to do.
16:40But there are telltale signs.
16:42There are easy giveaways.
16:44You can know the real thing from the spurious one.
16:49It's not all that difficult.
16:51Because the real thing is the real.
16:53And the false one is basically…
16:55It's not a matter of poetry.
16:57When you look at yourself, you know, not just conceptually, but actually, you know the markers of the wrong thing.
17:15You want to call a thing by a misleading name.
17:21That cannot go too far.
17:24Because what you are calling it as, that too has certain characteristics.
17:30Even if those characteristics are expressed in the negative.
17:34So, if you are honest, then you will know that you have appointed a misleading name to the happening.
17:44It all boils down to your own inner honesty.
17:48You are calling attachment as love.
17:51It won't be too long before you detect violence in attachment.
17:57Now, how can violence go with love?
18:00So, there is a giveaway.
18:06But like the violence thing can also come with the love.
18:09Love as well.
18:10That which is coming with love.
18:13That might appear like violence.
18:15But if you look closely at it, you will know what it is.
18:19Can we say that love gives you some actions?
18:23Attachment also takes you to actions.
18:25But attachment can be known.
18:26It can be known that it is coming from a desire.
18:28But love cannot be known because it is coming from the unknowable.
18:32Love can be known if you probe the presence of desires around it and find nothing.
18:40Then you can be reasonably sure that as of now, the thing is not corrupted.
18:50You cannot detect that which cannot be detected, right?
18:55But you must detect.
18:57So, detect that which is detectable.
18:59Yes.
19:00What is detectable?
19:02Desires are detectable.
19:03Greed is detectable.
19:04Fear is detectable.
19:05So, look for them.
19:07And if you find them, then you must know something is emiss.
19:09One more thing that why like I noticed this that I try to just mathematize everything
19:18like some sort of systematic mistake.
19:20For example, you said desire, greed, everything.
19:23And how I see it that desire is ultimately because of greed.
19:27Sorry, greed is because of desire.
19:29So, why not just use the word?
19:30There is no problem with mathematics.
19:32Mathematics is beautiful.
19:33I am basically a mathematics teacher.
19:34That's perhaps the reason.
19:35Mathematics is absolutely beautiful.
19:36Helps clear the clutter.
19:37Helps put things very precisely.
19:38It's alright.
19:39And mathematics too can have a poeticity to it.
19:40So, when I see Kabir Das and I am totally blown away because he didn't have that much scientific
19:47knowledge.
19:48In fact, everyone who comes 2000 years back and so on.
19:49So, why do we on the path of liberation have to study this much?
19:55And this is coming from the point that I just love knowledge.
19:56It's not that we are studying too much.
20:02If you look at most of the people who ventured and made a name for themselves.
20:03If you look at most of the people who ventured and made a name for themselves.
20:04If you look at most of the people who ventured and made a name for themselves.
20:05in spirituality.
20:06If you look at most of the people who are in spirituality.
20:08They have to study too much.
20:09And, they are going to take the money for their lives.
20:10And they have to take the money for their lives.
20:11And they have to take the money for their lives.
20:12So, why do we on the path of liberation have to study this much?
20:13And this is coming from the point that I am like, I just love knowledge.
20:17It's not that we are studying too much.
20:22If you look at most of the people who ventured and made a name for themselves.
20:32in spirituality. Most of them were very very well read. Today you have a category of books
20:45and scriptures that you read. Then they had their own particular category that they read.
20:54Some of those books or sources that they used have become redundant today. So we don't
21:05acknowledge the hard work that they did. But it's not as if things were happening spontaneously
21:12and effortlessly from for them. And today you have to read a lot and put in some degree
21:19of great effort. No, no, that's not the way. Everybody who has dared to target liberation
21:33has put in mind-blowing effort.
21:40But the effort cannot surpass the scientific development. Now we know that there are genes,
21:45DNA and everything, which was obviously unknown 2000 years back. So how did they understood
21:52the entire thing?
21:53Observation of life, observation. You just observe what is going on and from that certain things
22:02become very clear. It's just that then they could not have expressed it in the language
22:11of science today. Today's jargon was unknown to them. Not that today's science was unknown
22:17to them. They would have never used the expression DNA for example. But they very well knew that
22:30the body of any organism is coming from a certain source, areas certain bondages, operates certain
22:41limits and certain compulsions. And very broadly, that's what DNA is about.
22:47Basically, they have the idea that it is ultimately a machinery going on. Machinery going on, which depends
22:56on its source. A lot about you depends on the source of your body. And what the body is, is basically
23:06a bundle of limitations. So this is something that they could easily observe through just observation.
23:13So by observation, it can be... Obviously, you look at a horse, you look at a mule, you see the difference.
23:23You also see that two horses behave alike and so do two mules. Those things are not difficult to gather.
23:32You are attentive. I mean, how did Darwin gather all these things? Was there a theory of evolution
23:38before him? Yeah, yeah. Obviously. So he just kept observing all the seas, all the islands, one specific
23:47island in particular. So just as Darwin could know those things by observation, so could all the wise
23:53people before him? Just one thing that I have this thing that I'm very curious. So when I listen to anything you say
24:04or any person, I become very curious at how, from where is it coming from? Like the person I'm listening to and what is it
24:11doing to me? Am I instantly believing in it or I'm actually understanding and then I'm seeing it?
24:18But like the curiosity thing sometimes basically it acts as a disturbance. For example, via my understanding, it comes
24:25like I am a YouTuber. I have a YouTube channel and I teach maths for J in that. So my calling, my understanding
24:34says that I should teach mathematics in a way that people start loving it. They see the depth of it.
24:39They start understanding what the world is really. So this is my calling. But sometimes what happens
24:45that some sort of doubt arises and that I should say that it feels like some sort of an existential crisis
24:54that, okay, this entire Vedan thing is, it is like a, it is a lie. It is something that I have just listened.
25:00These, these doubts are probably the best things that can happen because they will help you challenge
25:09the model, the model. Otherwise the model will become the truth.
25:15Yes. I somehow tried, yeah, I somehow tried to just defend the model that, okay, this is the model.
25:23No, no, no, no, no, no, no. The model is not the truth. And therefore there must be these periodic questions
25:31and reminders from life. And the model will be put in its place.
25:40But like this comes so, so firstly that I am not able to do the action. It feels like that, okay, this right,
25:45this right action now becomes a action which was coming from an old understanding. And hence now I don't know if this is right.
25:52The right action is not your responsibility. Your responsibility is just to understand.
25:58Action happens via the system, the physical system, which includes the brain as well.
26:06So action will happen on its own. You don't have to be bothered about it.
26:10You, you must just keep asking yourself, am I satisfied? Do I know?
26:18Is, is, is this all that there is to it? There is, there is a joy in asking that question.
26:29There is also a joy in not receiving any answers to that question. That action happen by itself. One need not worry.
26:48Is this like a constant ticking that okay? Others are waiting as well. And I'm just taking so much time.
26:53So, yeah. So nice talking.
26:56Welcome.
26:59Nice.
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