00:00You resigned on February 2, 2024.
00:05Yes.
00:06And this was the time when Ijaz-ul-Ahsan had also resigned.
00:10During this time, Mazar-e-Naqvi had also resigned.
00:14So there was a lot of debate about what had happened.
00:17And your poetry added fuel to that debate.
00:20The poems that you wrote, the poems of Iqbal, Ghulam, Mehkoom.
00:24I remember Teep-o-Sultan.
00:26After reading the first part, I thought of Azad-e-Qa'an, Mehkoom.
00:29One day's life of a poet is better than a hundred years of life of a poet.
00:33What were the pressures due to which you resigned?
00:37First of all, I wanted to resign before him.
00:44So when Mazar-e-Naqvi and Ijaz-ul-Ahsan resigned,
00:51I penned my resignation.
00:55So that I don't get counted with him.
01:00And I was advised by my friends.
01:02I had already told them that I was resigning.
01:05I had been planning to resign for 2-3 months.
01:09So the reason was completely different from the one that came from the Supreme Court.
01:16Yes, it was completely different from that.
01:19People use the word pressure.
01:24There was no such pressure, no external pressure.
01:27The system had become so rigid.
01:33The way our High Court was being run,
01:37and the way we were being questioned outside.
01:43Even my family, my children,
01:46used to sit in the living room and ask me,
01:48Baba, what is happening?
01:50What kind of decisions are being made?
01:52So you can't justify it.
01:55But this happened during the time of one Chief Justice.
01:58Because I remember this debate started
02:01when six judges wrote a letter.
02:03Fawzi Faisal was talking about internal pressures.
02:06The other judge, Khasro Sanatan Mianullah Sahib,
02:08used to talk in the context of that letter.
02:11How the judges of Islamabad High Court had cameras.
02:14How their families were arrested.
02:17So that was one pressure.
02:18But Faisal Sahib used to talk about internal pressures.
02:21You are talking about the internal pressure
02:23that exists within the court.
02:26Look, the way I understand pressure is that
02:32somebody pressurizes you
02:34that you should make this decision
02:36and not make this decision.
02:38There is no such thing, Alhamdulillah.
02:40I never took any such...
02:43First of all, no one ever approached me,
02:45I speak for myself, for this work.
02:48If someone tacitly comes to you as a law officer
02:51and says something,
02:52tells you about the compulsion of the government,
02:54that you should look into this and that.
02:56Or someone indirectly approaches you
02:59through your relative.
03:01Those incidents keep happening.
03:03You know, being a judge, how to tackle that.
03:06But it is not a pressure.
03:07So there are more pressures through relatives, right?
03:09Yes, through relatives.
03:10Because after the letter of Islamabad High Court
03:12we came to know that relatives are approached.
03:14In fact, the judge of Sargodha said
03:16that my family is sent questionnaires about me.
03:19Absolutely, they are approached.
03:21I was listening to the case of sugar.
03:24When a sugar scam happened,
03:28I got the case.
03:30I made a whole mechanism for price fixation.
03:34And our law was an essential commodities law of 1958.
03:39It was in the government.
03:41It was also of the province.
03:43So I made rules in it.
03:45And made a whole mechanism for it.
03:47So from there,
03:49at that time,
03:50I don't want to take your name on national TV.
03:54Things will become more controversial.
03:56Right from the top,
03:58man's relative,
04:00who may be my relative,
04:02may not be, definitely is.
04:04So he called my mother.
04:08He called my younger brother.
04:10I went to meet my mother on the weekend.
04:12He asked me to take his name.
04:14What is his issue?
04:16Listen to him.
04:17You don't even listen to his phone.
04:19So he was one of the tycoon of sugar mills.
04:25He wanted to...
04:26Tell me his name, sir.
04:27I think,
04:28keep it for later.
04:30Who can be the tycoon of sugar mills?
04:32Is he from a decent family?
04:34Is he from Mr. Jangeet Reen?
04:36Your...
04:37Okay, from Mr. Jangeet Reen.
04:39Okay.
04:40So they try to approach you in this way.
04:44There are many ways.
04:46So they keep coming.
04:48This is nothing new.
04:50Our...
04:51Brother Kashif,
04:52I have seen it sitting there.
04:54Our social fabric,
04:56of this nation,
04:58has become so bad that
05:00nobody believes in merit.
05:02If you tell someone
05:04that your case is correct
05:06and
05:07if you argue with a good lawyer,
05:09it will be done.
05:11Nobody believes.
05:12Today I have come out.
05:14Many people,
05:15again,
05:16a big business group
05:18approached me
05:20for my legal services.
05:22And after approaching me,
05:24what happens internally is that
05:28my colleagues are sitting in the Supreme Court.
05:32If a case is filed there,
05:34in a particular place,
05:36I somehow influence it
05:38and give them relief.
05:39So far,
05:40all the Supreme Court
05:41and other High Courts' cases
05:43have come to me.
05:44I answer that,
05:45if I had to do this work,
05:47why would I leave my 4 years?
05:49I would have done it sitting inside.
05:51I would have got constitutional protection.
05:53So now I have come out
05:54to do this work.
05:56If you want to make money,
05:57you can do it from inside.
05:58It is more comfortable there
06:00to make money.
06:01My identity is Lahore High Court.
06:04I am a lawyer
06:05or a judge.
06:06If the name of Lahore High Court
06:08is getting ruined,
06:10then I am in pain.
06:11And this was the pain.
06:12People are telling me,
06:13that I…
06:14You have called them slaves, right?
06:17I call the whole nation slaves.
06:20Slavery doesn't mean
06:21that you are handcuffed,
06:23you have shackles on your feet.
06:25Slavery means
06:26your mental slavery.
06:28I want to give one message
06:30through my resignation,
06:32which I have given.
06:33Whether I have reached further or not,
06:35that's another thing.
06:36You will not end your life
06:38by leaving this government job.
06:41Only the people who open doors for me,
06:44who salute me,
06:45will not be there.
06:47Monetarily,
06:48I will be a lawyer,
06:49I have more money.
06:50And we need judges like this.
06:53I am sorry…
06:54What kind of judges are there now?
06:56I will tell you the second thing.
06:58I think these 6 judges
07:00who have written this letter,
07:02I will come to that.
07:04Each one of them,
07:06institution requires them,
07:09they don't require this.
07:12I will say job,
07:13he has this constitutional right.
07:15Today, they will come out,
07:17they will be well off,
07:18they will have cases,
07:19their practice will work.
07:21When we bring such people,
07:23who are afraid of jobs,
07:25not only in judiciary,
07:28everywhere.
07:29There are two types of people,
07:31which I have observed.
07:33One is those who are sitting
07:35on the lucrative post or main post,
07:38and they don't speak the truth
07:40because their job will be lost.
07:42One is those people,
07:43who are aspiring for those jobs
07:45and are sitting outside.
07:47They don't speak the truth
07:48because we can't elevate there.
07:51It's not for the judiciary.
07:52So you are saying that
07:53the judges of Islamabad High Court,
07:54they don't need jobs,
07:55they are strong people.
07:56And we need judges like this.
08:01You don't want slaves.
08:03We don't want mental slaves.
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