00:00 (upbeat music)
00:02 - Let's finish this week's show just by discussing.
00:06 So a topic that crops up every so often,
00:09 that's the 3 p.m. blackout across football in the UK.
00:13 I want to just kind of get your opinions.
00:16 Is this still something that has a place
00:18 in Scottish football or in UK-wide football?
00:21 Or is it something that we really need to consider scrapping
00:25 the next time the TV deal comes around?
00:27 - Because the thing that brought it to my attention
00:31 was that when a couple of Fridays back for Rafe Rovers
00:34 against Dundee United,
00:36 and that was obviously a Friday night,
00:38 it wasn't a Saturday game.
00:40 That game was live on the TV and 8,000 people
00:43 were at Stark Spark for that game.
00:45 I believe that was Rafe's biggest attendance
00:47 in quite a significant number of years.
00:50 Evidence like that would kind of suggest
00:54 that just because you make the game available on TV,
00:57 that doesn't mean supporters are suddenly gonna stop
01:00 going to the matches.
01:02 And that always seemed to be the thing
01:04 at the forefront of this debate
01:06 as to why we needed the blackout.
01:08 What do you think, Ben?
01:09 - I think, without wanting to make it too simplistic,
01:14 I think sometimes it can be game by game.
01:16 Like Rafe Rovers, Dundee United,
01:18 there's all Rafe Rovers and I have been in the top flight.
01:22 I don't think in my lifetime,
01:23 I don't think Rafe Rovers have been in the top flight.
01:26 Certainly not for a wee while anyway.
01:27 And big game against their closest rivals
01:31 and things like that really need to win the game.
01:33 If you're a Rafe Rovers fan,
01:35 they're gonna probably turn out in numbers,
01:37 no matter whether that was being broadcast
01:39 on the moon or wherever.
01:42 Whereas you maybe look at Livingston
01:44 versus Motherwell on Sky.
01:46 How many Motherwell fans, for example,
01:50 are gonna travel through Livingston on a Wednesday night
01:52 to watch a game that's probably gonna not,
01:54 I mean, you're gonna be wearing crash helmets
01:56 probably watching that,
01:57 in terms of balls being up near and things like that.
01:59 How many Motherwell fans are gonna want to travel through
02:02 and watch that in Livingston
02:03 when you can sit at the house and watch it?
02:06 I think sometimes you need to view it game by game.
02:08 But I think generally speaking,
02:10 I think as football moves forward,
02:12 I just, I can't see how the blackout stays.
02:16 You see it down south, I mean,
02:17 dodgy streams and things like that.
02:18 People will just put them on the fire stick.
02:21 I think there's probably revenue to be found
02:23 in sort of these additional games
02:25 that could have on the TV as well,
02:26 in terms of the Sky deal.
02:28 Probably for people of me to be discussing
02:31 those type of things.
02:32 But I think by football's evolution in the modern world,
02:37 that eventually it's gonna go at some point,
02:39 whether it's a good thing or a bad thing.
02:42 I think what we need to work out
02:43 is when it probably gets to that point,
02:45 how is Scottish football best ready to capitalise
02:49 on the potential revenue that could come with that?
02:51 Or on the flip side of that,
02:53 if it's actually gonna be an egghell thing,
02:54 how do they safeguard the clubs and things like that?
02:56 Ticket revenue, 'cause that is still the main driver
02:59 in Scottish football.
03:00 We're not England with a massive TV deal.
03:02 Fans through the gate for pretty much 90% of clubs
03:06 is still the main revenue driver.
03:08 So how do you protect that
03:10 if that is gonna have an impact on it?
03:12 - Yeah, I would say it's a separate debate
03:16 how much sort of faith we have in the powers that be
03:19 to sort of maximise revenue in this game.
03:21 But just quickly, Barry,
03:24 on just kind of along the lines of what Ben was saying,
03:26 where do you stand?
03:27 Do you take a similar view
03:29 or do you maybe have an opposing opinion
03:30 on the 3pm blackout?
03:31 - Yeah, I do think it'll go sooner rather than later.
03:36 I think you probably need a kind of hybrid arrangement,
03:38 whether it's game by game or whatever,
03:39 but you do need certain games that you would say,
03:41 right, we can show that at three o'clock,
03:43 but no, we're not gonna show that one
03:44 for obviously if it's a huge game
03:45 and it might prevent people from going along
03:47 to another game further down the league.
03:49 So I think it's the smaller clubs
03:51 that you probably need to look out for.
03:52 I don't just mean smaller premiership clubs,
03:53 I mean further down the chain,
03:54 League One, League Two, even Lowland League
03:57 and the clubs at the bottom of the pyramid
04:00 in the West of Scotland, East of Scotland League,
04:01 that sort of thing.
04:03 We need to look out for them as well
04:04 because they will lose fans,
04:06 fans that they really need on a Saturday afternoon
04:11 if there's too many big games
04:12 getting shown at three o'clock.
04:14 - Yeah, no, actually I think that's a fair point
04:16 and it might be slightly overlooked.
04:18 We are obviously saying if a game's on TV,
04:22 well, fans of that club not go,
04:25 but like you say, but does it stack up?
04:28 Because I think across English football,
04:30 attendances in general are actually really positive.
04:34 I don't know the exact figures,
04:35 but I've certainly not seen anything to suggest
04:37 that they're kind of dropping down.
04:40 And obviously, like Ben said,
04:42 there are less than legal ways of accessing these games.
04:46 We're not gonna promote them,
04:47 but we know they exist out there.
04:48 So like if you're a fan of a National League North team
04:52 down in England or whatever,
04:53 you do have the choice to watch your Man City's
04:55 and your Chelsea's even though they are playing
04:57 at three o'clock, but still,
05:00 people are going out and supporting their local teams.
05:03 So I don't actually know how much of an impact,
05:05 but then again, as we know,
05:07 Scottish football's its own kettle of fish
05:09 and suddenly if you're able to watch
05:11 every Rangers and Celtic match with ease,
05:15 that actually could potentially have an impact
05:18 on clubs further down the chain,
05:20 sort of Highland, Lowland League and below.
05:23 So there is definitely merits to both sides.
05:26 We're a wee while away before the next TV deal's up
05:29 and I think it's not gonna be something
05:31 that Scottish football sticks its neck out on.
05:33 It's going to be, I think, a UK-wide sort of agreement
05:36 if it is something we decide to scrap.
05:38 And I think we do need something,
05:41 it's had its time and it does need to go,
05:42 but there does need to be something that does replace it
05:46 just to ensure that extra bit of protection.
05:49 (ROCK MUSIC)
05:52 (MUSIC FADES)
05:55 (MUSIC FADES)
05:58 [BLANK_AUDIO]
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