00:00Political parties need money to campaign, employ staff and reach voters.
00:05But the source and size of that money can become politically contentious.
00:11The debate has been sharpened by Reform UK's record donations.
00:16But the funding question reaches across the system,
00:19from wealthy individuals and businesses
00:22to Labour's long-standing financial relationship with affiliated trade unions.
00:29This is a really interesting question.
00:31It's one which has been sort of kicking about for a number of years.
00:34Why do you sort of give political donations to a party?
00:38Well, of course, the assumption always is that you want some sort of influence
00:41or you want them to sort of do things which suit your particular agenda.
00:45So you're not going to do something which, of course, they're going to be against you, as it were.
00:49Although, of course, we sort of see this, you know, people sort of switch party allegiances
00:52depending upon what they think is going to be the outcome of the election.
00:55Anyway, nonetheless, Reform getting sort of two lots of £37 million,
01:00so £74 million in total.
01:04Yeah, that's a lot of money, you know, to sort of have in one sort of go.
01:07And, of course, what it will allow the Reform to do,
01:09which, of course, let's face it, is still a relatively new party led by Nigel Farage.
01:14So, of course, and, of course, it's built in his lineage, as it were,
01:17is to have sort of people sort of campaigning in every constituency.
01:21So, of course, this is clearly sort of a war chest which is going to allow them
01:24sort of a distinct advantage come the next general election, whenever it may be.
01:29And, of course, there are rumours it might be sooner rather than later.
01:31But, hey, let's part that for the moment because we don't know.
01:34And, of course, you know, they are still hoping, of course,
01:37that despite the sort of the travails over the summer
01:38and Nigel Farage is sort of hissy fit and sort of standing for re-election again.
01:43And, of course, that was also about sort of money he received
01:46and didn't sort of account for.
01:47This technically seems to be sort of within the limits.
01:50And, of course, the present government are talking about outlawing it
01:53because, of course, it doesn't perhaps suit them.
01:56But, of course, then the Labour Party, they get money from the trade unions.
01:59Under current rules, a donor can give any amount if they are legally permissible.
02:04That includes registered voters, most UK companies and registered trade unions.
02:11Labour has a formal link with 11 affiliated unions,
02:14which pay affiliation fees based on member numbers
02:18and can also donate separately.
02:21Reform UK's two £36 million gifts have intensified debate
02:27over whether any one donor should be able to give so much.
02:31The government is pursuing a £100,000 annual cap for overseas contributors,
02:38alongside residency tests and retrospective provisions.
02:43A wider cap, if introduced, could affect several parties,
02:47depending on how it treated individuals, companies and trade unions.
02:52What we've got to remember also, most importantly,
02:56Bendelo and Christopher Harbourn, cryptocurrency billionaires.
03:00Now, of course, how they sort of made their money is their business, as it were.
03:03But, you know, that shows you how things sort of moved.
03:06You know, we weren't talking about cryptocurrency, you know, 10, 15 years ago
03:09and not the way we are now.
03:11And of course, not even sort of domiciled in the UK.
03:14Why is it they want to sort of change the sort of the political system
03:17and give reform such an advantage?
03:20Well, of course, we'd have to ask them about that.
03:21If he becomes the largest party in Parliament, then he could sort of form a minority government.
03:26And of course, all that goes with that.
03:28And of course, there is a big question.
03:29Is this the right man that we want in Parliament?
03:32And of course, I'm sort of letting other people judge that.
03:34But of course, there is the whole sort of issue of sort of the people who are sort of behind
03:37it
03:37and the sort of the shadowy people and what they want in return.
03:41What we're coming towards is an American system where money talks in the sense that
03:47if you have huge amounts of money coming in, you can sort of win sort of the presidential election.
03:51Of course, you know, that's how sort of Donald Trump got in.
03:54Although, of course, there is a certain zeitgeist.
03:56So it's not good.
03:58What's the alternative?
03:59Well, of course, you ban all donations.
04:01But of course, that sort of makes it very difficult for any party to fight any election.
04:04There is a sort of view that maybe there should be state funding.
04:07But of course, that would sort of bring in its own sort of complexities
04:10and difficulties than sort of who gets what?
04:13Would it be like a sort of a Formula One type system where you get money
04:17according to how high up the grid you finish and so on and so forth?
04:21So it's a really difficult one.
04:23But nonetheless, you know, getting sort of £74 million, you know, it's a sort of it's unprecedented.
04:30And it really is giving us a lot of head scratching.
04:33And I think it cannot be good for sort of democracy.
04:36But of course, until we invent a better system, it's what we've got at the moment.
04:40And as I say, I think there's going to be some really sort of a difficult sort of decision to
04:45be made
04:46as to how to sort of deal with it.
04:48The argument now reaches beyond one party to the rules governing them all.
04:54Parliament is considering tighter limits for some overseas-linked donations,
04:59while broader caps remain a political choice.
05:02Any wider reform would have to decide how individuals, companies and trade unions should be treated
05:09and how parties would replace any income that they had lost.
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