00:00The rising coaching star on the offensive side of the ball for the Dallas Cowboys,
00:06friend of the show at the Combine in Indianapolis, Clayton Adams,
00:09says it's the little things with George Pickens.
00:11I was kind of going through the Instagram reels of y'all's show yesterday without me,
00:16and I was like, oh God, oh God, why are y'all talking about George Pickens' availability and compensation?
00:21Why is this coming up again? Because this is not going to be popular on social media.
00:26Because it's the topic with the National Insider still.
00:30Who said what? Tom Pellicero and James Palmer both talked about Pickens on the same day.
00:36Pellicero talked specifically about he had said that when he was asked by that Cowboys fan producer of Rich Eisen's,
00:44he was like, hey, you know, just tell me Pickens is going to be here in 2026.
00:47He's like, I can't. He's like, I assume he is.
00:50He's like, but as of now, he would be, but things can always change.
00:54He's like, Dallas would trade him if they could get the right compensation.
00:57There's nobody's willing to give it to him, basically, is what he said.
01:00And James was saying that he thinks there's essentially no chance that he signs an extension here.
01:05Not because he doesn't want to, but just they're not going to get something done.
01:09And so...
01:10What's amazing about that, if true,
01:14Jerry Jones is like the definition of,
01:18you can change and we can put up with some mess for the amazing production.
01:23But now we're taking this hard line stance, if it's the case.
01:26I'm still hoping and thinking if George Pickens goes out, balls out, and is a Boy Scout,
01:31he can sign here long term.
01:33It's just amazing they're drawing this ethical teammate locker room line
01:38with George Pickens after all the crap that's happened around here for decades.
01:43Well, has Brian Schottenheimer been running it for decades?
01:46No.
01:47And he's got his standards.
01:49You got to meet his culture standards.
01:51And it was funny.
01:52We talked to Clayton Adams.
01:53Do you seriously think that that is a major factor?
01:55I think part of it, yeah.
01:57I think a big part of it is.
01:58But Brian's the one who is fawning over George every time in front of the mic.
02:02He just loves football.
02:04He loves football so much.
02:05Oh, yeah.
02:06No, I think he...
02:07Right there.
02:07I think he believes all those things.
02:09I think that's why it's like,
02:10Yeah, can we just get you to do this little bit of extra?
02:14Can we get you to...
02:14Clayton Adams is the same way.
02:15Clayton Adams told us how much he loved him.
02:17But when we were in Indy and you had said,
02:20You know, we're always trying to figure out George Pickens.
02:22Before you could even finish the question,
02:24Clayton Adams said, Me too.
02:25And it's like, okay.
02:26That sounded almost exhausted.
02:28And again, I hate the...
02:31If you are one of the people out there on social media
02:34who will later quote tweet this segment and go,
02:37They're out here stirring it up again.
02:39This is the discussion out there.
02:41I'm sorry that we're taking part.
02:42You can put your head in the sand, cover yours,
02:44do everything you want like you did with Micah
02:46and be an uninformed jackass for five months
02:49leading up to it like you were.
02:50And then go, What?
02:52You got traded or you can deal with it now.
02:54We prefer to deal with the things now
02:56that are actual topics of discussion.
02:58What we do know is he gauged his trade market
03:01as recently as like a month ago.
03:02I think that's fairly significant.
03:04And we know the Cowboys just have not been willing
03:06to give him a long-term extension at this point.
03:07But all this is important and relevant.
03:10And Clayton Adams was talking to...
03:12It was Judy Bautista and Ian Rappaport
03:15at a league function where he's part of the accelerated program
03:18that kind of elevates assistants
03:20and gets them in front of general managers
03:21and allows people a chance to kind of be...
03:24have the spotlight on them a little bit
03:26and boost candidates who the NFL thinks are really strong.
03:30So he got a chance to do that.
03:31And in the process,
03:32they had asked him a couple different Cowboys questions.
03:34And I thought the split in the way he addressed two people
03:38was very interesting.
03:39And the first clip is going to be on George Pickens.
03:41And this is cut 23.
03:43How can a full off-season of George Pickens unlock even more?
03:48Yeah, I think the familiarity with what we're doing,
03:51you know, can improve.
03:53And the detail of what we're doing can always improve.
03:56But the biggest thing that I've learned
03:58from having two elite playmakers on the outside
04:01is the effect that you can draw
04:03to all the other parts of your offense.
04:04I think we're just scratching the surface there
04:07of, you know, what opportunities does it give you
04:09in the run game?
04:10And what opportunities does it give you
04:12on first and second down
04:13to really blend and marry what you're doing?
04:16Those are all things that we are very, very excited to get into.
04:19That is, first off, definitely a running game kind of guy.
04:23They go, well, what can Pickens really do for you?
04:25You're like, help us run the ball more.
04:26That'd be awesome.
04:27But it's a very little thing.
04:29But when he goes, yeah, understanding what we do more
04:35can always improve than going, details can always improve.
04:39Those are two areas where it's like, okay,
04:41maybe that's coach speak.
04:42Maybe that's just the way he talks about everybody.
04:44Like, yeah, you know, we really drill down on the details.
04:46We want to do better.
04:47Okay, well, the very next question was,
04:49what can Dak still unlock then?
04:52I think that, you know, there's probably been a lot of years
04:55where, you know, people would say what he's done
04:58has been good enough.
04:59I mean, I think that the ultimate goal for him is
05:00he's got to play really high-level football every single week.
05:04He's done that a lot throughout his career.
05:06We've got to make up, you know, for the other areas
05:09that maybe have failed him in the past.
05:11And so I don't think it's about Dak trying to be Superman.
05:14I think it's about Dak being the best version of himself
05:16and us finding ways to make the rest of the offense
05:18and the rest of the team better.
05:19So the split on those two players was essentially,
05:23what can Dak get better at?
05:24Dak can get better at just accepting us helping
05:27and doing our part better because it's us who fail him.
05:30And then on George, it's, well, details,
05:33and understanding what we do,
05:35which is code for he's got to stop freelancing.
05:38I'm going to need a new sounder at some point in time,
05:42Peyton, for a Bobby Tism.
05:45I knew you were coming with this.
05:46It was a Bobby Tism, a Bobby blatant overreaction
05:50as I went and listened to Clayton Adams
05:52in the commercial breaks of the Western Conference Finals game.
05:56And I was like, this is the inner workings of Bobby's brain
05:58and the wires are crossing to make something out of absolutely nothing.
06:02It is nothing.
06:03I'm going to start keeping track of all the times
06:06that you guys are saying my wires are getting crossed
06:08and it's been right.
06:09I give you credit and I give you props
06:11when you end up being right.
06:12You are, I mean, this is just over.
06:15It's overanalyzing.
06:17Why haven't they paid pick-ins?
06:20Like, did you know?
06:21Because a couple of reasons.
06:22Has everybody not looked at it, though,
06:24and gone, like, there's something missing.
06:26There's something, they're behaving differently
06:28than what he, things are not matching here.
06:30I don't know if it's, in my opinion,
06:33and you know more than me, about this.
06:36About this.
06:37I cannot stress that enough.
06:38I cannot stress that enough.
06:40To me, it's, you gotta,
06:42you gotta be a great teammate for another year.
06:45Yeah, this whole thing about
06:46we haven't had him in the building long enough,
06:48I do believe that is true with them.
06:50That would be my concern and my worry.
06:54Look, man, this guy had the third most yard.
06:57To me, Clayton Adams is saying,
06:58that was year one.
06:59Year two, becoming even more familiar.
07:02Jerry said something the other day,
07:04I don't know if y'all covered it yesterday,
07:05where he's like,
07:06Jory Epstein saved it from the owners' meetings,
07:09and he's like,
07:09we expect more from Pickens early.
07:13Yeah, and he said,
07:14this is that,
07:14he listed some things,
07:15he goes,
07:16this is a great opportunity for him
07:17to answer all those questions.
07:19Which is,
07:20again, I think,
07:21you have to,
07:22especially with them.
07:23I just have a hard time with,
07:24the guy had the year that he did,
07:26the production that he did,
07:27and then let's,
07:28let's pick him apart.
07:29To me, if I hear,
07:31like,
07:32I want to see more effort with route running,
07:35like,
07:35a lot of great players,
07:36a lot of people freelance.
07:38Yeah,
07:38like,
07:38if he's going to freelance
07:39and have that kind of year,
07:40then I want him to freelance.
07:42No,
07:42no,
07:42no,
07:42no,
07:43no,
07:43no,
07:43no,
07:43we were standing there
07:43in training camp a couple years ago,
07:45and when Princeton Fant ran a 13-yard out,
07:48and Dak went,
07:48get back here,
07:49and he goes,
07:49that's 12.
07:50He goes,
07:50get back here,
07:51run it again,
07:51that's a 12-yard route.
07:52That's,
07:52okay,
07:53now,
07:53that's the precision they're talking about.
07:55There's a timing,
07:56I understand that.
07:57Part of what makes George,
07:58what makes George great,
08:00is these elite athletic catches.
08:03Not necessarily always in timing.
08:07Yeah,
08:07you got to have the timing,
08:08you got to have your numbers that good,
08:09because Dak's throwing to a spot,
08:10I get it.
08:12But part of what makes George great,
08:14is that there's a unique ability to improvise.
08:17What I would like you to compare it to,
08:18Bobby,
08:18when I think freelancing,
08:20I immediately,
08:22I go to digs.
08:24Or Micah.
08:25Or Micah.
08:26Yeah,
08:26where he says,
08:26I'm going to do whatever I want.
08:27How would we compare what you think Clayton could be referring to here,
08:31to those?
08:32I think he's talking about,
08:33complete route precision,
08:35like precision,
08:35like,
08:36little sloppy with the steps.
08:37And I think at times,
08:39It's not like,
08:39I'm going to go run this different route.
08:42No,
08:42no,
08:43no,
08:43no,
08:43I think it's more just,
08:45when he says,
08:46an understanding of what we do,
08:47it's more again about,
08:49he needs to be more detailed,
08:51and understand like,
08:53the details,
08:54in terms of how that impacts,
08:55the broader concepts,
08:57we're trying to execute.
08:58So when he says,
08:58more familiar with what we do,
08:59and the details can always be better,
09:01it's like,
09:01okay,
09:01well,
09:02he's got to understand that the reason why these steps matter is because the broader concepts we're trying to execute,
09:06and he's saying the same thing with both descriptions.
09:09But in general,
09:10it's,
09:11he needs to tighten it up.
09:12It's not,
09:12it's not as precise as it needs to be.
09:15And isn't that understandable after one year?
09:17Yeah.
09:18No,
09:18no,
09:18but well,
09:19I don't think precision,
09:20I don't think it should be a character assassination.
09:21No,
09:21I don't think,
09:22I don't think precision,
09:23I think,
09:24I think precision in your route running,
09:27I think that essentially what's being said there is like,
09:31are you always doing things to the fullest effort with your route running?
09:36Right.
09:36And that's a,
09:37that's,
09:38that is an indictment,
09:39and they would view that as a football character indictment of like,
09:42Detroit,
09:43I don't need you running the route a yard short because you're like,
09:46I don't want to get mixed up in the,
09:48in the press.
09:48I mean,
09:49to me,
09:49the,
09:49the,
09:49the top three Pickens problems last year were the lions game,
09:54the CD incident,
09:55and being late to meetings.
09:57That's what we know of.
09:59That's what we know of.
10:00Those are the three things.
10:01And it's like,
10:01before I give you 35,
10:0338 million dollars,
10:04and we commit all this to two wide outs and a quarterback need to make sure,
10:10because we have been burned by extensions and,
10:13and,
10:13and big deals.
10:14Right.
10:14And the Cowboys,
10:15I give them credit.
10:16I,
10:16I,
10:17I didn't think they would win.
10:18out on this.
10:20They guessed that the rest of the market would not be clamoring for him as
10:24much as you and I thought that the market would.
10:27And they ended up winning this franchise tag battle.
10:30When I thought it was a definite L,
10:32I thought it was a locked in loss that Mully getta and Pickens would have
10:36their way and force their way out of here.
10:39And we get Mike at 2.0,
10:40the Cowboys for now won.
10:43They won this.
10:43They won this move.
10:44They won from the trade standpoint.
10:46I still think on the open market,
10:47because they won from the,
10:48they won from the franchise tag standpoint too.
10:50What they would have get,
10:51what somebody would have,
10:52like nobody was,
10:53I think if George was an understood free agent,
10:55someone's given him 35,
10:5740 million.
10:58I would guess that too.
11:00Now,
11:00when you factor in the trades situation,
11:02the compensation that you got to give up,
11:05but somebody would give him 40 million,
11:09but would not give him 35,
11:10but would not,
11:10well,
11:10he said,
11:11yeah,
11:11he said 35,
11:1135 even,
11:13but they wouldn't give 27 and draft capital.
11:1627.
11:16Yeah.
11:17I mean,
11:17like the fact that he's signed to the franchise tag.
11:19Now somebody could offer a first and a third and get him and they're not
11:22taking how much.
11:23Yeah.
11:23That like,
11:24it doesn't have to be two first,
11:25right?
11:26No,
11:26no,
11:26it doesn't have to be now that he signed.
11:27I mean,
11:28if somebody called and said a first,
11:28because in one year you're going to have to decide to give him 40.
11:34Right.
11:34Which means you're not comfortable doing it right now.
11:37Like the league is not comfortable paying him 35,
11:3940 right now with a first and a third,
11:42which is in.
11:43Yeah.
11:44But I'm just saying now you're paying less than that though.
11:46I'm just saying it's a decision.
11:47It's like trading for somebody on a,
11:49on a cheaper deal and they just,
11:51they don't want to do that.
11:52Do you agree with us that someone would have given him 35 per?
11:56No compensation going the other way.
11:59I think he probably would have to settle under CD,
12:02probably like 32,
12:0333.
12:04Okay.
12:04Something like that.
12:06Yeah.
12:07Like,
12:07cause I mean,
12:07if you're,
12:08if you're looking at it from a,
12:09like the,
12:09the type of guy you want is,
12:11are we not going to go backwards to the right?
12:15RKG type people.
12:17Why is it the right kind of guy?
12:19Well,
12:19because we,
12:19we said we don't,
12:20we're,
12:20we're done with the RKG.
12:22If you think of RKG as boy scout,
12:24sure.
12:24They don't think of it as boys.
12:25They think of it as football character.
12:27Ezekiel Elliott was not a boy scout off the field.
12:28They viewed Ezekiel Elliott as the right kind of guy as a,
12:31as football character.
12:32And so they,
12:33they want guys who was like,
12:34yeah,
12:34we want hard practicers.
12:35We want guys who are big culture builders.
12:37Like,
12:37all right.
12:37If he gets into some trouble off the field,
12:39as long as when he's at work,
12:40he is a culture builder,
12:41then that's the right kind of guy.
12:43So he did have one more clip here.
12:45Clayton Adams.
12:46This was him talking about areas where the offense as a whole can improve.
12:49Well,
12:49I think,
12:50you know,
12:50one of the biggest thing is we,
12:51we want to take care of the football better than we did a year ago.
12:55We want to protect the quarterback better than we did a year ago.
12:59We want to be better in the red zone than,
13:02than we were a year ago.
13:03And so a lot of those things were not just things that we needed to answer
13:07going into the off season.
13:08And it's like,
13:09how do you dig into this and what,
13:10what is the root of some of these issues?
13:12And then how do we solve those problems?
13:14And,
13:14and I feel really good about the process that we've gone through in the
13:17off season with our staff of really attacking those problems.
13:20And rather than just saying,
13:22Hey,
13:22we're going to get better at this.
13:23Like,
13:23how are we going to get better at that?
13:24Boom,
13:25boom,
13:25boom.
13:25One,
13:26two,
13:26three,
13:26those things he listed out.
13:27That's exactly the three things we talked about the other day of just like,
13:30could the offense still max out?
13:32And it was all that red zones got to be better.
13:34They've got to be better,
13:35you know,
13:35with their past protection and they probably need to be better in terms of
13:38turning the ball over.
13:39Cause they were one of the teams that turned the ball over at a slightly
13:42higher rate inside the star here with our insider,
13:44Bobby belt on Sean and RJ.
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