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00:00look they keep playing teams that are at least they're equal and it are they a bit of a bully
00:05who if you stand up to them in the postseason they go down by the way that doesn't sound like
00:10a very nice thing that the yankees would like said about them that they've been like bullies
00:14for the last eight years hello welcome to the pinstripe post my name is ryan sampson i'm the
00:20host and producer the show he's the star of the show joel sherman today is tuesday february 24th
00:24the yankees are in the midst of spring training and we haven't catched up with joel in a little
00:27bit here and joel is somewhere in florida i don't know where he is right now but i know he's
00:31somewhere in florida he's out covering all the baseball world right now he's been going from
00:35mets to yankees camp uh he's doing it all for us at the new york post and we appreciate him
00:39as always
00:39for making some time for us joel how you doing man yeah i'm uh in my hotel room in tampa
00:45i just got
00:46back from uh dunedin uh the yankees played against the toronto blue jays the yankees sent a lot of
00:53their a players to play today position wise uh the blue jays did not uh counter with their a group
01:00uh the yankees are getting a lot of guys ready for the wbc they leave in the next few days
01:04uh guys
01:05like judge and goldschmidt and caballero and jazz chisholm are all uh all played today uh all played
01:12for various teams in the wbc so they've heightened some guys uh workload early the position player
01:19of workload early this spring uh just to get them prepared to play games uh that count at least for
01:27the wbc in our country or other countries in jazz chisholm case he's playing for great britain
01:32caballero uh is uh is playing uh is caballero i forget now if he's venezuela or the dominican but
01:39um he's playing for uh venezuelan right yes i believe he's from team venezuela uh and uh yeah
01:46they've got david bednar is going to the u.s harrison cohen who's a prospect is going to team
01:51israel they're losing a couple of coaches brad osmus tanner swanson so they're very involved in
01:58this and they're they're position players again a lot of them are involved and uh mark de rosa was on
02:03our pot on uh the podcast two weeks ago and he talked about the one that got away was uh
02:09cody
02:09bellinger he very badly wanted him because of the same reason that teams wanted him notably the yankees
02:14is he's such a swiss army knife and in a short tournament so easy to put him into a variety
02:19of
02:20positions and feel like you'll get good results yeah and we even heard judges comments about why
02:24he didn't participate in the previous world baseball classic because he was trying to make
02:28that free agent decision so i wonder if bellinger maybe was like in that same mindset like hey let
02:33me focus on my so scott boris was on our uh podcast with uh john hayman and myself yesterday and
02:39he said that uh he had had plantar fasciitis last year uh uh bellinger and he's working on some like
02:46new orthotics uh and felt like he didn't want to go from zero to 50 quite as quickly as he
02:51would have
02:51had to especially and wanted to honor the idea he was doing a new contract with the team and decided
02:57that that combination new contract wanting to kind of get it off well and some foot issues last year
03:03that he wants to test out for how he moves in his footwear uh kind of like kept him from
03:08making that
03:09like he would have almost been a final positional guy who would have been added to the roster
03:16and real quick uh cozy caballero is actually from panama so i think you were playing for team
03:20incorrect but he is uh leaving so you know your double play combination if you're the yankees uh caballero
03:28and jazz are uh both leaving both new york teams have interesting issues with double play combination
03:34things because uh lindor can't do a lot right now because of his hammock bone surgery uh the yankees
03:40have two players who are about to uh leave uh for the tournament but remember some of these teams i
03:45mean
03:46you never know who will get through but i'm suspecting like great britain might not get through or
03:51panama might not get through to the next round so they might be back in a few days whereas some
03:55of the
03:55players on the japan dominican u.s teams are that are likely to make it into the later round uh
04:02probably will be they're they're gone back gone very quickly so look joel what's fascinating to me
04:08about the spring training is there's always and you've told me this before it's like ryan you know
04:13spring training you can't really take much from in terms of you know like where this team is projected
04:18to be you can't really say hey this is a team that's going to be a world series contender or
04:22not
04:23but you can you can notice things about how a team is being formulated construction wise and
04:28and where they're going from your sense right now we know that the yankees by all the uh the betting
04:33books and whatnot they're projected to be the best team in the american league are up there to be one
04:37of the best teams in the american league just from being around them a couple days now and seeing
04:40what's what's being put together for this yankees roster and running back majority of what that team
04:46was in the playoffs from last year into this year with a few additions and ryan weathers
04:49and some bullpen pieces uh what is your sense on this yankee squad going into this season even even
04:56where it's at right now do you feel like this is truly has the potential to be a special team
05:02yeah uh garrett cole also in that list of players who didn't play last year who have a chance to
05:08be
05:08on that and that's one of the early good stories from this camp uh i was there when he threw
05:12his first
05:13live batting practice i believe he had a bullpen today while the rest of us were away in dunedin
05:19and uh right now like it's a little bit of whoa whoa uh he kept saying i'm gonna follow the
05:25science
05:25and the science is 14 to 18 months uh march 11th will be 12 months so play it out the
05:31earliest is
05:32may 11th uh and uh more than likely i would think if the yankees need the roster spot he'll go
05:39on the
05:3960 day il which means may 24th is the first day he could come back and look the back end
05:45of that
05:45is 14 to 18 months you know the difference is between coming back may 11th or september 11th
05:51and that's having three quarters of the season left or about a quarter of a season left or even less
05:57so
05:57uh you know when he comes back is uh it will be interesting but uh the yankees were blown away
06:04by the precision on his pitches which is always a big deal coming back from tommy johnny only he threw
06:0920 pitches it was all fastballs uh it was crisp it was 40 94 to 97 uh he feels like
06:16there's going to
06:16be more there as he goes along um you know the guys who batted against him namely aaron judge thought
06:22it looked a lot like garrett cole uh i asked max freed a question i said what would it mean
06:29to to your
06:29point to get him back and he chuckled a little bit he said my whole answer is he's garrett cole
06:37and so like that's a big deal right if they get him back look ryan i understand uh i did
06:43the podcast
06:43yesterday and i think as you know i don't um i don't do um like look at mentions on social
06:50media
06:50i don't read my email i don't listen to talk radio i don't think any of it's good but you
06:55know if you do
06:56what i do uh things will get to your ear and i guess there was uh disappointment or furor to
07:04some
07:04degree that i said i think the yankees are going to be good uh this year who gave you who
07:09gave you
07:09flat for that well you know it's interesting there was an executive who works for a non-new york team
07:14who's from new york and he said uh and he just sends me sent me a text and said oh
07:20i see you're
07:21getting beat up and i said i don't like i do so many things i do the podcast i do
07:26the webcast i do tv
07:27i i write for our online i write for the newspaper i said which thing and he said oh that
07:33that you
07:34said uh you know john john said that he was disappointed the yankees didn't do more and i
07:39was like i don't know like all the betting markets really like the yankees i kind of like the yankees
07:43i don't buy the narrative that they um uh didn't do anything this offseason because again like i think
07:51having jose caballero for a whole season having ryan mcmahon for a whole season having david bednar for a
07:56whole season jake bird pitched today again it's spring training it's the layup line portion but
08:01he looked good and remember he was a borderline all-star when they got him last year you know
08:05daval's been in this camp they brought back ahmad rosario cole weathers like i think they've done
08:11real stuff i think cohesion matters uh like like their best teams when they were a dynasty hardly ever
08:18changed uh and and by the way when they added outside stars the kind of players uh that that fans
08:25like
08:26giambi a-rod randy johnson gary sheffield they stopped winning championships uh you know it was
08:32like a a unit that stayed together and uh you know what always bothers me is like you're always judged
08:38by the last thing you say or wrote as if we're never critical say in this forum like i spent
08:42most of the
08:43first two years we did this show talking about how terrible they were as a fundamental team and uh
08:49like i don't i don't think that anybody who works for the yankees would think that that's like
08:54some level of homerism i've certainly talked about moves i haven't liked over the years and
08:58including players who are still on the team who i'm not big fans of but i am like i i
09:05watched
09:06i don't want to be poisoned by what i tell you not to be poisoned by which is like little
09:11snippets
09:12here and there but i am somebody who does like to watch the drills even this late into my career
09:18the yankees did a bunt defense drill like three days ago ryan and i thought it was as crisp energetic
09:29enthusiastic well-run drill as i've seen the yankees do on that kind of thing in a long time
09:33now some of that has to do with cohesion like you don't have to do a lot of talking about
09:38where are
09:38you going to be like they've been together in the way that derrick jeter used to look at scott
09:43brocious he didn't have to ask him where he was going to be they played together a lot
09:46and i do think partially the other day you know i think ahmad rosario is a really good veteran to
09:53have on a team uh he brought such energy to that drill the other guy who brought it was max
10:00freed
10:00who's you know just a great athlete and was very very much not only into his rounds but into everyone's
10:08and i thought that you know if i were watching that i said i would say there goes a veteran
10:13team
10:13that's good knows it's good and is getting ready for the baseball season and getting better at some
10:18of the things that we've been very critical about them for multiple years and i do think that the
10:23yankees of the latter stages of last season were better at those things ryan i thought they were
10:29a much better team over the last two months than over the first four months i think a lot of
10:33that had
10:34to do with ryan mcmahon another executive who i talked to today said like like i understand when
10:40you're a self-hating fan you could sometimes look at a guy and be like well he hits 200 and
10:44strikes
10:45out a lot and i'm telling you an executive from another team in the american league said that trade
10:49was really transformative for them last year not me not me saying that that's a executive in the in
10:55the league a top executive said that was a killer for them because you need to be able to really
10:59feel
11:00that position and they weren't doing it well they had a huge hole with their base right like that was
11:04that was something that was glaring even in spring training last year right it was something that you
11:08had brought up repeatedly i brought up i'm like joe what the heck are they doing a third what's what
11:12is the corpse of dj lemay you are they going with a three-man rotation there they ended up going
11:17with
11:17peraza to start a little bit like it was just it was a it was a mess so the fact
11:21that they got it
11:22solved in the trade deadline last year it helped and i agree with you i think even aaron boone said
11:28it
11:28going into the playoffs he really they really liked their team going into the playoffs like they thought
11:32they were healthy they were playing well and they were more well-rounded than they had been
11:37a lot of a lot of life is like who's in front of you right like we're just about to
11:42get to the ncaa
11:43tournament and everybody will care about what bracket they're in and the yankees were in a very
11:48favorable bracket in 2024 they played two al central teams that they are were much better than and got to
11:56the world series last year they played the blue jays uh who were at least they're equal if not better
12:01they both finished with 94 wins uh and they lost to them in the first round and i i i
12:07think it was a
12:07much better team than the team that went to the world series by the way so do the yankee people
12:12think
12:12that so do their rivals so i will bring up i i wrote about this a little because they were
12:18in
12:18dunedin today against the blue jays so i'll give you a little preview of the column for that will be
12:23posted at some point on tuesday and in wednesday's newspaper and that was like so you're playing
12:30toronto and toronto became the latest team in the aaron boone era they have played 14 postseason
12:37series in eight years they made the playoffs in seven of eight years they played 14 postseason
12:41series in six of them ryan they had the better regular season record than their opponent they are
12:48six and oh in those series they have played eight other series and in those series the teams either
12:56had the same record boston and toronto over the time or a better record during the regular season
13:04in those the yankees are one in seven they were eliminated seven of the eight times the one
13:09was a coveted year where they had 33 wins and cleveland had 35 so it wasn't even a full season
13:16so i've i i i ended up talking to executives today and i have no peace because i was like
13:24look they keep playing teams that are at least they're equal and it are they a bit of a bully
13:29who if you stand up to them in the postseason they go down by the way that doesn't sound like
13:34a very
13:34nice thing that the yankees would like said about them that they've been like bullies for the last
13:39eight years the last time they pulled kind of an upset in the postseason is division series
13:432017 they're down 2-0 to 100 plus win cleveland team that had gone to game seven of the world
13:50series the year before was the best team in the american league that year and they came back and
13:54under joe girardi won three games to two lost to the sign stealing astros in seven games in the next
14:01and they haven't really pulled a quote-unquote upset since then where they've met their thing
14:06but i would dare say ryan because i was asking other executives this question like if you were trying
14:12to avoid that what would you do like is there some magic player out there like i i'll point out
14:19two
14:19players who i thought were key to them losing to toronto last year one was max freed he pitched very
14:26very poorly in his game it was such an important swing game i believe it was game two right uh
14:31and he
14:32just was terrible in his game well would you not have signed max freed who pitched one of the most
14:38important games in the history of the braves and won and uh was it a top five i think for
14:44the
14:44cy young last year and had a great year and incredible for them last year it's incredible
14:48so he started his game the other guy is like no matter if they had won or lost in the
14:54previous
14:55years john carlos stanton had really hit and then in those four games i think he hit the ball well
15:00but
15:00just didn't get hits i mean would you not have john carlos stanton start those games based especially on
15:06his previous postseason so i i always say it is not a complete crapshoot in the playoffs but there
15:13are many crapshoot elements to a short series and like one of them is as great as we think the
15:20dodgers
15:20are these last two years and they are the best team they have played four elimination games and
15:28they're four and oh like if you played four elimination games against the white socks the white
15:33socks would probably win one of them that's just the way baseball is the dodgers are four and oh
15:37not included in that four and oh ryan is the orion kirkering game where he throws the ball away
15:43uh for the phillies the team they feared the most because of their starting pitching you know the
15:48phillies are close to winning that game it's then it's a toss-up game in game five you never know
15:53as
15:53bet it's a five game series the yankees literally lost two games to the dodgers as opposed to the
16:01dodgers like out and out winning games like that should have been more of a series so the dodgers
16:06are very much a team to me which is they have two ways to win they're so good they're going
16:11to win a
16:11lot of games and they're just competent and if you lose they'll win the game you've got to play
16:18clean and beat them and so i think that the answer to some of this for me ryan is the
16:25yankees have to
16:25get to that point where they're a clean play like i think you take away some of the crapshoot if
16:30you
16:31make october about we might lose but that's because you're better and you win right that we lose and i
16:41think the yankees have done like when they lost to the rays in uh i believe that was a kobe
16:47that was
16:47the coveted year yeah yeah like when they lost the rays i thought they as much lost that series as
16:52the
16:53rays wanted they tried outsmarting the rays remember right but they also didn't play well no they didn't
16:59play well and i don't mean they didn't hit it's hard to hit this is the best pitchers in the
17:05world
17:05at the biggest pressure times they didn't play clean and i think some of the answer there is that
17:10and so do i think they're getting closer to a team that can play clean baseball i think they're
17:17better than they've been these last few years will that last six months will it matter when they play
17:24whoever the stand up to the bully guy is in october i don't know but if i were thinking about
17:30ways that
17:31they could be a better team i i don't know if it's a specific player i don't think there's a
17:36magic
17:36bullet player out there the i've in 40 years yeah if you told me last year ernie clement was going
17:43to
17:43kill the yankees and be this awesome postseason hero for the blue jays i've been like what do you
17:48want joel what are you smoking like what do you know about ernie and you also know ryan that like
17:52like if the blue jays get back to the playoffs this year ernie clement could go two for 24
17:56and that that there's and i i've done this for 40 years and i think i've seen very very few
18:02cheat codes
18:03in october i literally covered the whole career of the greatest cheat code of all time in the
18:09postseason and that was mariano rivera he was if you had him your championship odds went up and i
18:15remember that was at a moment of early analytics where people like well anyone could do this i'm
18:21like not like him they can't not at this time of year not for two innings over and over again
18:26like
18:27this i thought he was a cheat code i thought orlando hernandez was a bit of a cheat code if
18:32you had a big
18:32game to pitch so they had some guys in the past but if i opened up the whole sport to
18:38you now
18:39and said take your cheat code i'm not even sure like the answer is otani who's been all right but
18:46hasn't even been great in the postseason uh like the closest thing to a cheat code freddie freeman
18:51has had huge huge hits for multiple teams is he a cheat code well they had a shot at him
18:56maybe that's
18:57part of the answer they should have done whatever they can though i don't think freddie freeman and
19:01his family wanted to play in new york so i'm not sure that it would have mattered it's interesting
19:06so i guess there's a number that makes you come right right it you always have to pay it feels
19:11like
19:11that new york tax sometimes uh if you want to convince some of these players but with that being
19:15said joel i i do agree with you the reason the yankees feel good about this roster is because like
19:21you said they felt strong heading into the postseason last year that they had a team that
19:26solidified itself defensively finally you could argue it's one of the best defensive outfields you can
19:30have with a healthy judge so long as that elbow and forearm are all good to go in from right
19:35with
19:35grishman center and bellinger and left and then you have an infield right now while caballero i think
19:42might be a slight upgrade considering volpe was a tough watch at shortstop we knew he was dealing with
19:48the shoulder injury it's an upgrade it's it's an upgrade right and then because i watched him play
19:52shortstop again and he just you know it's like one of these things is i never pretend to be a
19:57scout
19:57but i've watched thousands and thousands of games now and my mind's eye goes to what guys look like
20:03at a position so like if i was a met fan and again it was the first week of a
20:07new thing
20:08i don't think beau bichette looked like a third baseman when i was watching him early now he's got
20:13a but he's a dedicated guy a talented guy and he's got a bunch of weeks to do it better
20:18i don't think
20:19jaz chisholm ever looked like a third baseman he was so quick twitch that he made some spectacular
20:25plays there but it never was the movements of a third baseman ryan mcmahon moves like a third
20:30baseman jose caballero looks like a shortstop like like the way that volpe has to be full force to
20:36get every ball across the diamond it's easy for caballero he has such an easy shortstop arm now
20:43can jose caballero play 140 games at shortstop where you don't feel like the more you see it
20:49the less you like it i'd be curious about that uh he was not an expensive player he was a
20:56very
20:56talented player he was worth a couple of wins above replacement every year and the rays who should be
21:01loving that kind of player said why don't you take him and so maybe the rays have made bad trades
21:07like
21:08they don't get them all right and so maybe they gave the yankees somebody who's really going to help
21:12them over a full season but i am curious to see it uh and i think he's going to play
21:17the first 30 40
21:18games of the season uh at shortstop we'll see if he could consistently do that for a first division
21:25team in a market like our market right yeah and and i think it's something yankees fans forget about
21:31joel is just how important defense was for the yankees last year and improving it and it's something
21:37you touched on when they first made their pivot from juan soto it's like well now we're getting
21:41judging right field so that's an upgrade defensively trent grisham they believe in center field wise we saw
21:45he can play center field well defensively even though we have questions about effort and whatnot
21:49loathing on some fly balls but he's still considered mostly as a good center fielder bellinger you could
21:55put him anywhere but left field he showed he can handle that the yankees improved from 2024 to 2025
22:01defensively that wasn't a question mark it felt like joel really much for the yankees in 2025 so
22:06carrying that over into 2026 it's going to be i think that stabilizing force that you're talking about
22:12where it's not so much a question of we're running the same lineup out there we feel good
22:16defensively though no matter who's on the mound i gotta see more of it i i would be uncomfortable
22:21with ben rice at first base okay so like i have not you know he slept wrong early in camp
22:27and
22:28yesterday monday he got into a game for the first time but only as a dh i saw him uh
22:35that morning and
22:36i was just uh chit-chatting with him he didn't know yet the first day he's going to play the
22:39field but
22:39he's certainly doing the drills every day the yankees believe he could get to major league
22:44average because they believe in the work ethic and the players so much we'll see like that's a big
22:49issue now goldschmidt's around to play the late innings if they want to go that way and ryan i just
22:55think the place they have and there's a lot of uh um volatility here but to me the place that
23:04they
23:04could be almost as good or as good or better than anyone is the rotation there is a pathway to
23:13a
23:13top five rotation in the major leagues will they get on that pathway i don't know but like i think
23:22max freed is in his prime and is a you know top 15 pitcher in the sport if garrett cole
23:29is healthy and
23:3090 percent of garrett cole he's a top 20 pitcher starting pitcher in the sport cam schlittler what
23:38we saw for a third of the season last year could he do that for a full season right louise
23:44heel for
23:45the first half of the 2024 season was one of the better pitchers in baseball ryan weathers is a
23:52is a interesting interesting piece to sculpt because there's so much there can they get it out of him
23:59and i haven't even mentioned carlos rodan who for the past two years has been a top 25 starter in
24:06the major leagues and to his gritty um compliment for a guy we had some real questions about especially
24:13after that first year he couldn't even straighten his arm last year by the end of the year and he
24:18pitched through the end of their season as best he could he was another guy who didn't pitch well in
24:23the postseason but he kept taking the ball and i think he's now proven like he can handle new york
24:29and if you're suddenly asking carlos rodan if schlittler cole and freed are a one two three at
24:34a high level and carlos rodan is your number four starter well i i just think they have a shot
24:41now
24:41will they get there i don't know rodan's coming off of elbow surgery they think they're going to get
24:45him back about the third week of april maybe the first of may we'll see uh cole's coming back from
24:52tommy john some people come back like justin verlander who won the cy young award after missing a whole
24:58season and some people come back like sandy alcantara who had a five plus era last year after
25:03missing a whole season who will cole be i don't know i believe in that guy i believe in his
25:08passion
25:08and his baseball brain uh to be able to make up some things that other people maybe can't in the
25:15way that verlander did like i would believe in his baseball passion and brain does cole do it does
25:21clark schmidt come back in the second season max freed had a big workload last year so did schlittler
25:26so did warren you know louis heel hasn't looked like that first half 2024 guy now for more than a
25:32year who can get back there was that an aberration or was that a guy who's in there and can
25:39they get
25:39back to that he was starting world series games two years ago and so they have a lot of and
25:45and by the
25:46way they really love legron hay and they really love elmer rodriguez who are kind of like locked and
25:53loaded as sometime probably after june one if they need another guy can they go get them
26:00you're always kidding yourself if you think you have starting pitching depth because you're always
26:05just remember at this time last year we were doing shows on however what are they going to do about
26:09stroman he's the sixth starter and he turned out to be like the third starter by the time they started
26:14the season because they had to put three guys on the il the braves have some trouble already they
26:18have two key guys they already had some guys on the il they've added to this spring training
26:23you're a bad week away from going from too much to way too little but i do think they have
26:30right now
26:30a pretty good quantity of quality potential and if i and if there was a road from here to the
26:38canyon
26:38heroes a way to win that series that they haven't won to beat the dodgers if that's the last team
26:46standing in the national league it's going to be because to me they're able to start free cole
26:51schlittler rodan and feel like sure you want to start yamamolo glasnow otani you know like name your
26:58four the yankees would feel good about that against anybody if those guys are right is the chance of that
27:06two and ten three and ten it's not great but they have a lot to throw at the wall and
27:12it's mostly
27:14i would say aside from will warren it's all potentially very high end and warren might be
27:21a valuable guy again just making third who pitched today against the blue jays he just might be a
27:26valuable guy again to have a four and a half era and make a lot of starts i was going
27:30to say who's
27:31to say will warren can't improve from last year and be a better pitcher this year change the side
27:35he's pitching from from the mound to try to do better against lefties they've talked a lot to him
27:40about the psychology that he failed out last year which was to shut down beginnings to accept one or
27:45two runs and but get out of it keep giving your team a chance to so you know what it
27:51is it's the
27:52better teams beat him up lefties beat him up beginnings got him like those six or seven starts
27:57that really messed him up last year would have messed up what was an impressive first full season
28:02for him just for its durability like he has gone to school on it and you know like if he
28:08got 10 percent
28:09better which is certainly within reason he's a really really good number four starter yeah and
28:17he was so valuable for them being able to take that ball every fifth day like you said last year
28:21uh joel i just can i just repeat that but like like the chances that it all goes well
28:28is way under 50 you're talking about that reach that true potential for the for the starting you know
28:34that's that's like you know rodan comes back may 1st cole comes back june 1st they're both really
28:40good freed gets through another injury free season schlittler's the guy for four for six months what he
28:46was for two months like if that's what they are on october 1st going into the playoffs i mean i
28:52think
28:52they're going to be the favorites to get to and maybe even win the world series but like will that
28:58happen i don't know is that two out of ten three out of ten for those who can't do math
29:01that's it i'm
29:01saying it's eight out of ten or seven out of ten it doesn't happen but it's better to not be
29:07looking
29:08for high-end guys at this time of year and it's better not to be looking for quantity at this
29:13time
29:13of year today and again this could go away quickly today they have some quantity because i haven't even
29:20mentioned yarborough and black no who are going to get folded into the bullpen if everyone's healthy
29:26but can start major league games as legitimate number six like good number six and seven starters
29:32which means not great but like better than most teams sixth and seventh options or seventh and eighth
29:38options joel it feels like so much and i and i i know we're changing subjects here because i think
29:44the rotation will be important it's something we're going to pay attention to and especially with getting
29:47those key guys back and seeing how their impact is but going back to the lineup feels like so much
29:53of
29:53this yankees lineup is going to be based upon if trent grisham can be even 80 to 85 percent of
30:00trent grisham from last year because he's going to be the leadoff guy by all intents and purposes you
30:04would say especially versus good right handers right hand right hand throwers am i crazy to think like
30:10listen you gave him the the game the the idea to to tender him the one-year deal and he
30:17accepted it the
30:18qualifying offer and now it's a matter of can he go out there and show that he can do it
30:23again
30:23and the yankees lineup needs him to be at least 80 to 85 percent of trent grisham from last year
30:30yeah though if he's not that's where you might see jason dominguez or spencer jones
30:36get a shot i still think there's a 2020 player in jason dominguez and if his nickname wasn't the
30:44martian and the yankees had a prospect who you could literally see being a 2020 guy how many 2020
30:51guys have they produced over the last 20 years especially outfielders who are not named aaron
30:56judge it's not a long list i think that's within his capabilities he just turned 23 a couple of weeks
31:03ago he's still young so like i think they do it and again ryan one of the things i always
31:07try to point
31:07out is and i always say it so that people know i'm not like cribbing the work of others i
31:12try to talk
31:13to a lot of scouts and executives who are not yankee employees so that you get like like it's
31:20a little bit like when yankee fans are like oh this sucks to something like you know like every
31:26uh project project model online or by a casino as you pointed out has the yankees right there either
31:33number one or two or three with seattle and toronto in a very small bucket for the best teams in
31:38american
31:38league none of those are yankee employees none of them cover the yankees they kind of are like they
31:43need to be as unbiased as possible and look they get them wrong like the blue jays were picked to
31:47finish last in the al east last year they did finish last in the al east the year before in
31:532024 they made
31:54a stunning reversal uh that the markets didn't see and that will happen again there'll be teams we think
32:01are good like we thought the mets were good last year who won't be uh and there'll be teams that
32:06we
32:06don't think are good who will make a run towards 85 or more wins but these markets think the yankees
32:12are good and every and the reason i bring up is executives i talk to about the yankees do their
32:19offense as a given they're like the yankees gonna be a top five offense they're gonna score among the
32:24five most runs in baseball now part of that is if you have aaron judge it's hard not to
32:30right and and if you keep now you add ballinger now if they're you know the more days stanton is
32:37healthy and like he's healthy right now how many you get there there's big belief that ben rice is a
32:43legit guy well that's four middle of the order guys uh that's probably about 140 homers right there
32:51or more than certain teams will have this year uh with those four guys relatively healthy so i think
32:56that like could the difference between extra extra good and really good be that trent grisham
33:05is repeatable sure yeah like i guess i guess the reason i asked too is because and i think again
33:12this
33:13is yankees fantasy land we always live in is like ah trent grisham we're bringing it back you know this
33:17guy never lived up he only had that one year wonder i think yankees fans forget trent grisham was really
33:23good late in games too for the yankees i remember him having a lot of clutch a lot of big
33:28clutch hits
33:28for them you know he you know like we just watched frambor valdez have a lot of trouble uh getting
33:36a
33:36contract commensurate with a guy who whose track record looked a lot like max freed who got the most
33:43ever for a left-hand pitcher over eight years uh valdez didn't one of them was trent grisham hit a
33:49grand slam off of him and then the next pitch frambor valdez to all intents and purpose seemed
33:55to purposely uh cross up his catcher and hit him in the chest that if i remember that was a
34:00huge home
34:01run against the team they always had trouble beating against one of the best pitchers in the
34:06sport i remember he had a huge one late against atlanta in my mind's eye like he had big hits
34:12last
34:13year and ryan we've done a lot of shows together now you know this is not my favorite player like
34:19this is not a guy i would be like anxious to start a franchise with right centerfield is very hard
34:26to
34:26find uh guys who do hit for power with good walk rate you know this guy had like one of
34:33the best
34:33walk rates i think it was like 11th in the major leagues last year walk rate in the whole sport
34:39you
34:39know if you could play centerfield hit homers and draw walks that's really good it's really good
34:44there's very few perfect players uh the ones who do it all like bobby witt you see how they get
34:51treated how they get paid aaron judge bobby witt like gunner henderson there's not guys who do
34:59everything you know you gotta live i if i've told this story before forgive me but it was very
35:05formative one time uh i won't tell you the reporter except for to tell you that in his time covering
35:12the yankee uh in his time managing the yankees i thought joe tory truly disliked two people who
35:18covered the team with some regularity this is joe's notebook by the way everyone this is what i want to
35:23hear so uh joe if he liked you would begin an answer by saying ryan like he'd use your name
35:32if he
35:33didn't use your name it was like a tell in po at a poker table i'm gonna go back and
35:38watch some
35:38joe girardi uh pressers to figure out who this could be so uh somebody who covered the team
35:45who was kind of a self-hating yankee fan decided to go after bernie williams which was a mistake
35:51when it came to tory to tory and it was just me this person and tory in his office and
35:58this was a guy
35:59he didn't like and the guy goes well you know uh you know bernie he's fast but he can't steal
36:06bases
36:07and he makes mistakes on the bases and you know like he wins gold gloves but he doesn't really
36:12throw well and he you know like he doesn't get the greatest reads and jumps and you know like that
36:17kind of thing and joe let him go let him go give the whole thing and joe's entire answer to
36:23it was
36:23yeah if it was any worse all he'd be would be the cleanup hitter on a dynasty
36:29and i was like right and joe used to say to me all the time you don't get perfect players
36:36you get
36:37the players you get and then if your job as a manager is to maximize what they do well position
36:45them to use it well and protect them from what they can't do well because even the best players like
36:50there are places in the strike zone there are pitchers like aaron judge has to play every day
36:54but i bet you there's days where where aaron boone and the hitting guys go this isn't a great matchup
36:59for even aaron judge right like so you can imagine everyone who's not aaron judge or juan soto or bobby
37:09witt or like that handful of great players like everyone has foibles where it's like well you know
37:14this guy hits for a low average right but he could defend and he could run and like like
37:19very few people have all five tools then also five tools and durability they play a lot and then
37:25five tools and durability and a high baseball iq to make the five tools really play and the ability
37:30to be good in a clubhouse and like etc etc the guys who do make hundreds of millions of dollars
37:36and so part of the art of this it's like when people beat up like if you say i really
37:41think ryan
37:42mcmahon helped the yankees people look the self-hating yankee fans do the well he hits 200 and strikes out
37:48too much and i'm like well if he didn't he'd make 55 million dollars a year right because he's got
37:54real power he draws walks and he's as good a third baseman as there is in the sport like if
37:59he did at
38:00all he wouldn't make 15 million he'd make 55 and the idea is the yankees have to protect him against
38:07the lefties he certainly can hit uh work with him as they are to try to narrow the gap from
38:14like
38:14striking out 30 percent of the time to striking out 27 percent of the time and what would that
38:19mean for his power at yankee stadium because he's got real power like can they get there i doubt it
38:23he's far into his career this is probably who he is but to their credit and his credit they're trying
38:28but there are very very few hey man they could do it all players and uh i it's one of
38:37the problems like
38:38the martian has which is he's not he doesn't hit well right-handed he doesn't defend well
38:43can he get to major league averages defender i watch him trying every day he is a he's a pretty
38:49good worker uh he attached himself to ahmad rosario who's a great worker uh and so that was a smart
38:56play
38:56by him to do that he's out there working if he could get to major league average that's pretty good
39:01because
39:01he's really good at reading a ball and strike from both sides of the plate i think he's got real
39:05power
39:06from the left side and if you ever watch batting practice from the right side it's his natural side
39:10it isn't like the ball stays in the ballpark from the right side he could really run uh he has
39:16some
39:16feel for running the bases stealing bases like there so can you use him and this is the one that
39:24will drive it man there are qualities of anthony volpi that are really good like we've seen like
39:33when he's good he could steal some bases he could hit some homers he was defending well a lot of
39:39that
39:39went away so maybe whatever and i would say that the way that the worst that happened to jason
39:45dominguez was being called the martian the worst happened to anthony volpi was that spring where he
39:50made the team to some degree because the feeling was aha the new jeter or whatever and it was like
39:55let's pump the brakes there's one jeter uh who also did things wrong but was like
40:02fewer than most in the history of the game uh volpi has some real holes in his game but i
40:09think
40:09used to his best and i think they've made a mistake how they used him like he should not play
40:15fully
40:15healthy 155 games this is where having caballero i think is the benefit that right hand pitcher with that
40:23great breaking ball he should not start against until he proves that he has closed that hole
40:27so maybe like if he came back this year and he was a guy who played four out of six
40:33games instead of
40:34five or six out of six games you'd go oh i'm protecting him from what he doesn't do well and
40:40you see more of the good stuff and suddenly if i don't have him against the hard pitchers does his
40:45ops tick up into like 7 25 probably not but it's not impossible and i do think there are qualities
40:54you know who else does other teams think there are qualities of anthony volpi most think he's a
40:59second baseman but they're there trust me there are teams sitting around waiting for the day the
41:05yankees give up on anthony volpi so that they could jump in make him a second baseman who hits eighth
41:10and
41:11plays 135 games why not make him the second baseman next year when josh isn't walking and by the way
41:16they might let's see if if if a caballero can handle this or b george lombard begins to really close
41:22the
41:22gap between where he is now in the major leagues but then the problem will be lombard will have his
41:28warts like he's the 40th best prospect in baseball he's not connor griffin he's not kevin mcgonigo
41:35like like those guys are at the very top of this and so like let's see but i do think
41:44this kind of
41:45like this jason dominguez sucks he shouldn't play in the major leagues anymore anthony volpi sucks he
41:50shouldn't play in the major leagues anymore i think you're missing that the major leagues are hard and
41:54if you have multiple high-end talents it is up to your manager and management to shape a roster around
42:01you and then deploy you to the best of your ability it is the joe tory lesson that day with
42:07the person he didn't like in bernie williams all bernie williams is is the cleanup hitter in a dynasty
42:13right here's all the things he can't do it could frustrate you sometimes i bet you it's how nick fans
42:19feel about carl anthony towns right like like you watch all the things he can't do and you could forget
42:25he is one of the probably five or ten best shooting big men of all time all times he is
42:30second in the
42:31league in rebounding like there are he is a playmaking big man is he a winner i don't know
42:37i'm not covering the spoil time i watch games etc but when you when you watch guys every day you
42:43see
42:43the warts and you forget that every team is filled with players with warts the teams that do the best
42:50navigate around the warts by this is when he plays this is who he doesn't play against this is when
42:56i pull him from the game to make sure somebody he doesn't face this guy oh he's a good defender
43:01let's
43:01keep him on the field in big moments that's the art of management and managing it's a delicate
43:08it's a it's a delicate artwork right it's a delicate piece to put together and figure out as you go
43:13week
43:14by week month by month and watch the dodgers who are everybody's favorite team as they should be
43:19because they've won the last two championships excuse me i think i got sunscreen in my eye from
43:23the day today uh but um you know they use a lot of bits and pieces does freddie freeman play
43:30every
43:31day yeah does mookie betts play every day yeah like there's a but there's a lot of enrique hernandez
43:39and uh andy pajas and miguel rojas and it's well orchestrated by their front office to be like
43:48this is a good defensive guy this is the guy who hits the lefties well this is a guy who's
43:53proven
43:53he can handle our marketplace then dave roberts has got the baton like a good head of a orchestra
43:59and he's using guys to their best advantages and that's the dodgers like even on the 400 million
44:06dollar payroll they have a lot of interlocking parts that have worked you know and i think one
44:11of the other things they've done is they've they've kept the number of like bad actors off their team
44:15they have hard-working guys hard-playing guys and guys who accept their role well that's something
44:22we'll see if the yankees can all join together accept their roles limit the mistakes that they
44:27can make and have a good team that they feel about and and look i feel good about this team
44:33and i i know i'm one of the few yankee fans that feel that way just because of the whole
44:37narrative
44:38that's been going around this off season see how it plays out that's all i'm gonna say i can't
44:42wait for these games to get started joe i really can't yeah well we're we we've got a long way
44:46from
44:46here to there i know and you know like there are going to be by the way on all 30
44:51teams some more
44:52injuries unfortunately because you always want to see the best players play uh you know and you you
44:58know how it is it's like the difference between aaron judge playing 150 and 105 is huge massive i mean
45:07we've seen like if he plays the games he's probably going to win the mvp yep that's how good he
45:12is that's
45:12how good he is and if you have the al mvp and multiple cy young award candidates and i think
45:19they might have that uh again and then you do a good job with all the pieces around it with
45:25like
45:25high quality kind of performers and and clubhouse guys and guys who have good baseball iqs like i just
45:33think the yankees have done better at assembling 26 guys you know there's some bullpen stuff like
45:41if i were a betting man and you told me uh on july 30 by july 31st uh jeremy estrada
45:51of san diego
45:52i don't even want to go through the name yeah no they're lucas ursig of kansas city uh like guys
45:59who
45:59i think could move in this marketplace kind of situation yankees are gonna get one of them
46:05like yankees are in it are in like i know oh they don't spend enough they're in they're in and
46:12i think
46:12if we had their executives here on truth serum and we said what do you think they'd say yeah we're
46:18a
46:18bullpen guy short right now we're gonna see if jake bird who we thought was going to be one of
46:23those
46:23answers last year does it if kind of like some of the stuff we're working on keep daval in the
46:29strike
46:29zone is working does it they really like brett hedrick but know that he's had a lot of health
46:35problems and doesn't have a track record can he do it as a power lefty like they might find some
46:40clay
46:41holmes-ish answer internally but i think they're also not delusional they know those are stuff and if
46:49they were all sitting here they'd probably say yeah if you could put a lot of money on if we're
46:53going to get one of the better bullpen guys between now and july 31st we probably think we're a bullpen
46:58guy short right now and they were trying to get it and by the way maybe they'll get it before
47:03march 25th we don't know i'm sure there's still some roster gymnastics and decisions like you said
47:09they're going to be trying to figure out as they they go through this rest i think they're definitely
47:12going to try to get uh a right hand hitting outfielder before it's all said outfielder or catcher
47:19outfielder i think that they're i think the bigger question with the catcher ryan is do they
47:23take two wells and uh rice or do they three uh because i think they would like goldschmidt to play
47:33start against all the lefties at first base but they then would like rice to catch against a good
47:40deal of the lefties really so that they both because i think they think it's important for 2026
47:46because i think they think rice is such a good hitter first of all he had about a 480 slugging
47:51percentage drop of lefties last year he hit low but slugged they think he's going to get better
47:56against lefties and and they think it's important for 2026 in his future so i think he's going to play
48:01a lot against lefties the question is is that at first base or do they mix in the catching i
48:06think
48:06that's a dangerous game yeah because i a is confident as he is as a catcher i think even some
48:13of their
48:13people would say his greatest strength is his framing like most people in the yankee organization
48:19they've populated the sport with outstanding framers uh you know narvaez and trevino and
48:26louis terrens etc like everyone uh higashioka everyone who's alex jackson like they have a ton
48:32of guys out there who came through their program uh they have some guys in their minor leagues who are
48:37well regarded they all frame well be curious with abs if uh what framing means this year though i saw
48:4310 pitchers challenged today and the umpire was wrong on eight of them uh uh i thought enrico palazzo
48:51was uh the umpire today go watch some movies if you don't get it hey it's enrico palazzo
48:57uh but anyway uh uh i think they're comfortable with all left-hand hitting catchers more than they
49:05are about not having a righty compliment for grisham for grisham especially if they put
49:11dominguez in triple a to start the season i think they're going to do that because if i think that
49:17if
49:17they thought dominguez would hit lefty pitching they'd find enough at bats every week for him to try
49:26to keep him sharp and at least begin the season that way i think it's going to be hard to
49:32feel
49:33that confident in him i think the best thing for him without injury is to go to triple a so
49:41that he
49:41does see if he's in the major leagues like let's say hypothetically stanton gets hurt
49:50he'll probably he would probably be next up right now right like spencer jones isn't probably next up
49:55he's next up so he'd play but they probably still not try not to play him against a tough lefty
50:01yeah
50:02so so like in the way that i'm talking about they want to play rice against lefties for the growth
50:07right because there's impact now and growth that will help them in 27 28 29 30 for rice
50:15in trying to win games right now i don't think they see enough out of dominguez so like i think
50:20some
50:20more development stalls here like i know that there's a lot of people who think it's a death
50:25knell for a 23 year old who is a year and a half younger than spencer jones to go to
50:31the minor leagues
50:32and i don't because i think he could be a 2020 guy and i think one of the ways to
50:38get to be a 2020 guy
50:40as a average left fielder which has value when you have have a nice long career and you probably make
50:4680 to 120 million dollars in your career if you do it under in the right years is go to
50:52the minor
50:52leagues and play every day there'll be two left-handed starters there'll probably be a lefty
50:56reliever in the game every day you'll see 12 to 15 real lefty at bats a week plus you'll play
51:03the
51:03left field every day you'll work on the stuff that you're trying to work on i don't think it's a
51:08death
51:08knell i think that there's an opportunity still there for him ryan to be a good major league player but
51:15not the martian you know and that if that means that he's a failure then he's a failure but like
51:23a 2020 player in the major leagues who has a 740 ops and could be an okay left fielder usually
51:30ends up
51:30with a nice long career and has value on good teams and i don't think it's out of his reach
51:36to do that
51:37and i think the easiest way the most logical way for me to see that happening is 150 plate appearances
51:45in the minor leagues where he showed see i got to 12 to 15 plate appearances against lefties i am
51:51a
51:51natural right hand hitter now that i've seen a bunch of them i'm doing much better all the work i
51:56put in
51:56off season and in spring training working on reading the ball better which is what he's doing he's trying
52:02to from what i could tell and from the people i'm talking to instead of bolt movement to try to
52:08read
52:08the ball then move because he has good closing speed they felt he was making a lot of first step
52:13mistakes they're like don't make the first step until you know and then use your great closing speed
52:20on it can he do that to become an average left fielder can that become part of who he is
52:25because he does have good closing speed uh but he often takes bad routes and starts left when he
52:31needs to go right can he learn i'm not like cody bellinger who often or by the way you again
52:40when
52:40people like crap on trent grisham off the bat trent grisham's one of the best readers of a ball you'll
52:45see like he knows where it's going it's one of the reasons he looks smooth and gets there is like
52:51wow
52:52he's not trying oh he caught it is because he could read it off the bat uh it is not
52:58a asset
53:00of jason dominguez to read it off the bat so they're trying to get him to be because you have
53:05closing speed you can go still go get it but you have to be moving in the right direction yeah
53:11go get
53:12it so whatever that nanosecond of recognition of is oh it's over my head go it's in front of me
53:18go
53:19it's left go and so far i've seen one time this spring where he did it exceptionally well
53:29uh there was a ball lying to his right that he did not break like that and you'd think well
53:37that ball
53:37is going to get by him down the line to the whatever and he caught it easy because he didn't
53:42make a misstep and then he had good closing speed to go get it in fact he closed so much
53:47that instead
53:48of catching it outside his body he caught it here that's how much he closed on a ball i thought
53:52was
53:52going to beat him down the line so can he do that over and over and over again which is
53:59what good major
54:00leaguers do i don't know but i think his best chance to do it is to go to triple a
54:05and play yeah there
54:07there's also a comfortability you want to see for him too i think you see it like you said with
54:11grisham you see it with cody bellinger aaron judge there's a comfortability of reading the ball
54:15reacting to the play understanding where you're going to go with it how you're going to catch it
54:19if it's going to be a tough play or it's going to be an easy play so those are all
54:23things what has it
54:23in their mind's eye like andrew jones just got elected to the hall of fame i don't think there
54:28was anyone in the history of the game him and devon white were the two greatest readers of the
54:32baseball off the bat i've never seen like you just sit there and go oh my god they're playing so
54:36shallow and then they all of a sudden because they were moving with the ball and the swing of the
54:41bat
54:41and the anticipation they'd be standing on the warning track camped forget about running full
54:46speed like other people they'd be camped and catching the ball and you'd be like that's an
54:50optical illusion how did that happen uh well he went to his hall of fame that's how it happened
54:55there's again there's people who have rare skills uh and but they don't have all of them they don't
55:01uh joel sherman that's a show that's a heck of a job man we appreciate you as always for hopping
55:05on
55:05here giving us all your insight uh we're looking forward to your coverage as you continue to go
55:09throughout spring training i know you're going to be helping out with the world baseball classic as
55:12well which is going to be fun to cover leaving for arizona in two days there's a world baseball
55:18classic press conferences in arizona on the second and third i believe i believe in a couple of those
55:24days they're playing some exhibition games and am i right is the tournament like the begins the fifth
55:29to the 10th or the sixth of the 10th right in there and then the semi-finals and finals are
55:34the 15th
55:35and the 17th in miami um so yeah i look we just saw it with the u.s uh both
55:42the women and the men's
55:42hockey team uh when it's your country people really get into it and i think if the u.s and
55:48japan end up
55:49on a collision course again uh like they did last time and then have a hollywood ending where trout is
55:54trying to get a hit off of otani uh i think that's a a really great story and i i
56:00hope we get to a great
56:01story me too joel we appreciate your man and uh we're looking forward until the next time we catch
56:06up to you thanks as always all right i always appreciate it you ryan and everybody who watches us
56:10you
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