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00:00:30The Army Air Force has announced that a flying disc has been found and is now in the
00:00:58possession of the Army.
00:01:00Army officers say the missile found sometime last week has been inspected at Roswell, New
00:01:05Mexico and sent to Wright Field, Ohio for further inspection.
00:01:10Late this afternoon, a bulletin from New Mexico suggested that the widely publicized mystery
00:01:15of the flying saucers may soon be solved.
00:01:18Army Air Force officers reported that one of the strange discs had been found and inspected
00:01:22sometime last week.
00:01:23Our correspondents in Los Angeles and Chicago have been in contact with Army officials endeavoring
00:01:28to obtain all possible late information.
00:01:30Joe Wilson reports to us now from Chicago.
00:01:34The Army may be getting to the bottom of all this talk about the so-called flying saucers.
00:01:39As a matter of fact, the 509th Atomic Bomb Group headquarters at Roswell, New Mexico reports
00:01:45that it has received one of the discs which landed on a ranch outside Roswell.
00:01:49The disc landed at a ranch at Corona, New Mexico, and the rancher turned it over to the airport.
00:01:55Rancher W.W.
00:01:56Brazell was the man who discovered the sofer.
00:01:59Colonel William Blanchard of the Roswell Air Base refuses to give details of what the
00:02:03flying disc looks like.
00:02:05In July of 1947, something happened.
00:02:10An event happened outside the sleepy little town of Roswell, New Mexico.
00:02:13It's right after World War II, and the 509th Bombing Group is stationed there.
00:02:18The intelligence officer is Jesse Marcel, Sr.
00:02:21Marcel is told that something has crashed on the outskirts of Roswell.
00:02:26He accompanies rancher Mack Brazell to the crash site, and he gathers up pieces of the
00:02:31wreckage.
00:02:32In Marcel's own words, it was something that he'd never seen before, something from another
00:02:38world.
00:02:39The Roswell Daily Paper published a headline, which went all around the world, and it stated
00:02:45this, Army Recovers Crash Disc.
00:02:48The excitement, obviously, was through the roof.
00:02:52Twenty-four hours later, that article was redacted.
00:02:56That headline was redacted.
00:02:58And instead, we were told that the excitement is not justified by General Ramey.
00:03:03Several days later, Marcel was trotted out to a press conference, and in front of him
00:03:08on the floor were just pieces of a normal weather balloon.
00:03:12In our opinion, Marcel was a patsy, was a fall guy.
00:03:18In this film, Roswell revisited exoneration.
00:03:23You will see evidence that points to the overwhelming fact that Marcel knew exactly what it was that
00:03:31he was handling.
00:03:32Other people come on the record, including Linda Marcel, who's Jesse Marcel, Jr.'s widow.
00:03:38It is our hope that this film exonerates the Marcel name.
00:03:46In 2009, I interviewed Dr. Jesse Marcel, Jr.
00:03:50I first met him at Roswell at one of the conventions there.
00:03:55And I asked him if he would be willing to come on the record for a written interview.
00:03:59In other words, I would send him the questions and he would write his answers.
00:04:02And he said, yes, absolutely.
00:04:05The interview that you're about to hear is a reenactment of those statements, of those
00:04:10questions and answers that I sent to Dr. Marcel, Jr.
00:04:14It is our opinion that this will set the record straight, because what crashed in that desert
00:04:20so long ago was not a weather balloon.
00:04:23Late June or early July, 1947, an unknown object crashed outside of Roswell on a ranch northwest
00:04:38of Roswell.
00:04:40The Army Air Force authorities recovered the debris and sent a portion of it to Fort Worth
00:04:45Army Airfield for their information.
00:04:47General Ramey determined that the debris was of an unknown origin and floated the cover
00:04:55story that this was just a misidentified weather balloon and sent the debris for further study
00:05:00to Wright-Patterson Air Force Base in Dayton, Ohio.
00:05:05Most people who actually saw the debris felt that it was of extraterrestrial origin.
00:05:10I was born 30 August 1936, which would have made me 11 years old.
00:05:28He was an intelligence officer for the 509th Composite Group, which dropped two atomic bombs
00:05:34on Japan to end the war.
00:05:35As an intelligence officer, a part of his responsibilities was to interpret photographs and brief bomb
00:05:44crews on appropriate targets.
00:05:46He was with the 509th at Wendover, Utah, where the crews practiced dropping what they called
00:05:52the Pumpkin, which was a dummy atomic bomb in order to practice their skills on targets.
00:06:00After the war, he received raw intelligence, and it was his job to decipher this intelligence
00:06:05and give briefings to the appropriate personnel.
00:06:14I had been asleep for several hours when my dad came into my bedroom and awakened me.
00:06:18He was very excited and led me into the kitchen, where my mother was standing in the corner.
00:06:24On the floor, there were pre-positioned pieces of metallic foil, beam-like structures, and black
00:06:29plastic fragments like pieces of a broken phonograph record.
00:06:32My dad said, take a close look at this, as you will probably never see anything like
00:06:37this again.
00:06:44The foil was very light but tough, and the beams were metallic, with a peculiar type of
00:06:49writing along their length.
00:06:50The writing resembled hieroglyphics, but not exactly.
00:06:53There were more geometric shapes and figures that were of a purple-violet hue.
00:07:07After my father returned from Fort Worth, he was firm in his instructions never to talk
00:07:12about this again.
00:07:13I think it was at Fort Worth where the cover-up was started.
00:07:16In 1978 or 1979, Stan Friedman, who was given a heads-up about the Roswell story from a fellow
00:07:29radio amateur friend my dad had interviewed him.
00:07:38I think that it was as advertised, the downing of a probe that came from another civilization.
00:07:42Linda Marcel, it is an honor and privilege to be here with you, and thank you for coming
00:07:52on the record.
00:07:53What was it like living with someone that, you know, is as close to the event as you can
00:07:59possibly get?
00:08:01What was that like living with him?
00:08:04It was always very interesting, because he, we didn't talk about it a lot at home in front
00:08:11of the kids, because we had young kids that were terrified.
00:08:15Really?
00:08:16Our youngest, Mackenzie, to this day won't watch E.T., and so she's really fearful.
00:08:24So, at the 50th, you talked about that you went to the 50th.
00:08:28Yes.
00:08:29That was the first time we took them.
00:08:31We went down with friends to Roswell for the 50th.
00:08:36And, of course, when you emerged into the city, it was UFO people and aliens and jeeps.
00:08:45I remember.
00:08:46The window dressings all had alien brides and grooms.
00:08:49And it was real festive, kind of carnival-y like, and, you know, so that lightened it for
00:08:57them a little bit.
00:08:58But she was always afraid that the people dressed like the E.T.'s were maybe possibly
00:09:04real E.T.'s.
00:09:05Wow.
00:09:06So she was afraid.
00:09:07So we didn't talk about it a lot at home when they were around.
00:09:10There was sort of a stigma with Jesse's father, Jesse Marshall Sr., the whole weather balloon
00:09:23fiasco.
00:09:24And to think that he would mistake a weather balloon for a UFO record, we've already talked
00:09:29about this.
00:09:30But it's patently absurd.
00:09:31And it's an insult to the man's intelligence, his integrity, and just who he is as a human
00:09:37being.
00:09:38He was a patsy.
00:09:39He was a setup.
00:09:41We had to follow the ranch around there.
00:09:43Just verbal directions.
00:09:44We'd never have found it.
00:09:47Jesse Marshall Sr., along with another officer, reached the crash site.
00:09:52And what they discovered was a debris field that would cover several football fields.
00:09:58There was so much of it.
00:09:59It was scattered over such a vast area.
00:10:03We found a piece of metal about about a foot and a half to two feet wide and about two
00:10:10or three feet long.
00:10:11That looks like you had nothing in your hands.
00:10:13It wasn't any thicker than the oil out of a speck of cigarettes.
00:10:17The thing about that got me is that you couldn't even bend it.
00:10:21You couldn't bend it.
00:10:22Even though the sledgehammer would bounce off it.
00:10:25Marcel was ordered to bring the debris to Fort Worth.
00:10:28Marcel was then met by Jim Moramey, who told him to keep silent about what he had found
00:10:34in the debris field.
00:10:36They had a whole flock of microphones there.
00:10:39They wanted me to...
00:10:40They wanted to stop comments from me, but I wasn't at liberty to do that.
00:10:45Marcel was trotted into a room, and on the floor in front of him were pieces of a conventional
00:10:50weather balloon.
00:10:51In essence, in our opinion, it was a setup, and Marcel was nothing more than a patsy.
00:10:58All I could do is keep my mouth shut.
00:11:01And General Ramey is the one who told the newspapers what it was and to forget about it.
00:11:07It was nothing more than a weather observation balloon.
00:11:10Of course, which we both knew differently.
00:11:17Jesse Marcel Sr. was accompanied by Colonel Thomas DuBose, who also posed with the fake
00:11:23debris.
00:11:24DuBose stated on the record that he was told to never discuss the true nature of what was
00:11:30actually found.
00:11:31This is the highest priority you could consider, and you will say nothing.
00:11:36More than top secret, as he said.
00:11:38Beyond that, this is the story we're going to tell the public.
00:11:42It was our story.
00:11:44The balloon part of it.
00:11:46In order, we don't have any more inquiries about what we picked up on the desert.
00:11:55How did that affect Jesse?
00:11:57Because Jesse was involved in the military for years.
00:12:00How did that affect him?
00:12:03The military didn't ever tell him not to speak.
00:12:07He always felt that if they did, that would be proving the fact that Roswell really happened.
00:12:14And so they gave him free reign.
00:12:18It bothered him that people didn't believe his dad.
00:12:21And I believe his father was really so honest and so sincere about the whole thing and didn't
00:12:31talk about it because he'd been told, don't talk about it, until Stan approached him.
00:12:36And I think it disturbed him.
00:12:40Especially in the later years, he wanted to go in and write his father's name.
00:12:50Right, sure.
00:12:50And that was the purpose of his book, was to try to make sense of it and to tell the story
00:12:58that as a young boy that he experienced and that his father was telling the truth, that
00:13:06it happened.
00:13:06And I had a big experience with his dad.
00:13:11I was going to ask that.
00:13:12Please tell us.
00:13:12In Roswell, we went down one summer to help them.
00:13:18And I was in the kitchen doing something.
00:13:20And he came and sat in the kitchen with a cup of coffee.
00:13:23And he said, you know, what happened at Roswell really happened.
00:13:29And I said, I know it did.
00:13:30And he goes, he said that, he said, it was, the debris was something not of this earth.
00:13:39And he said, I would have known.
00:13:41I was the intelligence officer.
00:13:43I'd been trained.
00:13:45I knew what was out there.
00:13:46And he talked.
00:13:47I said, well, what was it like?
00:13:49What did you find?
00:13:50And he said, it was like really thin aluminum foil, but that it had a memory.
00:13:56And that always stuck with me.
00:13:58He said, you could crumble it, and then it would open back up.
00:14:02And they tried to hammer it and tear it, and they couldn't.
00:14:06And so I said, well, why would it have exploded like that then, you know, if it was, you couldn't
00:14:13damage it.
00:14:14And he said, well, because it was, you know, some kind of a real force that must have blown
00:14:19it up.
00:14:37I believe there was a lightning storm.
00:14:40That's what I remember.
00:14:41And he was wondering if maybe it wasn't struck by lightning.
00:14:46Did he give you any of her details?
00:14:47I asked him if he saw any people.
00:14:51The bodies?
00:14:52The bodies.
00:14:53And he said, no.
00:14:54He didn't, because he thinks that there were two pieces to that craft.
00:14:59And he thinks maybe the outer part crashed at the Brazil ranch.
00:15:06And then, because there was another craft in another site.
00:15:10Right.
00:15:10He didn't see that site.
00:15:12And he said, and they compartmentalized people.
00:15:15So he didn't get to really talk to the guys from the other side.
00:15:19He knew some of them.
00:15:21And he said they were very credible.
00:15:23So he believes when they said there were beads, that there were.
00:15:27But he didn't see them.
00:15:28So when he goes back to the house, he wakes up his wife.
00:15:34And then he wakes up, you know, your husband, who's 11 years old at the time.
00:15:42What did your husband say about that?
00:15:45What did Jesse?
00:15:46I mean, that's a game changer.
00:15:49Yeah.
00:15:49It's unbelievable.
00:15:51What did he tell you?
00:15:52Well, he said he woke him up and said, come out into the kitchen.
00:15:55I've got something to show you.
00:15:57And it's not of this world.
00:15:58Wow.
00:15:59And so then they spread it out on the floor in the kitchen.
00:16:03And they were trying to see if it would go together in any of the pieces like a puzzle.
00:16:08And he said, no, they were just scraps.
00:16:10Huh.
00:16:11But there was this eye beam that Jess was fascinated with.
00:16:15And he said he picked it up and started looking at it, and it had, like, a purplish writing on it that he thought maybe were hieroglyphics or like it.
00:16:25Right, they looked sort of like hieroglyphics.
00:16:26Yeah, they looked like that.
00:16:29You know, Jesse's a boy, and he sees this, and then General Ramey does the switch, which changes everything.
00:16:40And we sort of covered that with Dr. O'Connor on this, that that sets the precedent for, you know, decades of cover-up, decades of deliberate obfuscation.
00:16:53So the sequence of events, as I understand, and you can, you know, chime in here, but the sequence of events, basically something happens in and around Rosalind, Mexico.
00:17:03There are eyewitnesses, which most of them are dead, but there are eyewitnesses who talk about seeing a disliked object, something happens to it.
00:17:11There's a lightning storm.
00:17:13Was the craft struck by lightning?
00:17:15Some people think it was.
00:17:16We're not sure.
00:17:17But something crashes on Mac Brazel's ranch, and he makes a call.
00:17:23He gets some of the evidence, and he makes a call.
00:17:26And I presume that call comes to Major Jesse Marcel, Sr., who goes out to the ranch, and my understanding is he spends the night there and comes back or whatever the next day.
00:17:38He came back late in the night.
00:17:40Okay.
00:17:41Back to Rosalind.
00:17:43This was actually on the Foster Ranch, the Fosters on the ranch.
00:17:47Mac Brazel was their sort of foreman.
00:17:49Yeah, foreman caretaker.
00:17:50Yeah, yeah.
00:17:51I mean, he was a New Mexico cowboy, you know, and I worked with a lot of those guys when I lived in New Mexico as a kid.
00:17:58I worked out on ranches.
00:17:59Wow.
00:18:00I have a real feeling for what Mac Brazel might have been like.
00:18:03Wow.
00:18:05And so, yeah, he came across the material on the ranch, said there was a terrible stench that was associated with it.
00:18:16We've heard this before from other witnesses that have encountered these entities.
00:18:21Sometimes it's like very heavy sulfur or just people smell it, and they almost become nauseous.
00:18:27Sulfur or ammonia smell to it.
00:18:29Yeah.
00:18:29But he was quite impressed with the smell that was associated with this crash field and the crash debris.
00:18:37But he picked some of it up and took it into Rosalind.
00:18:41And, yeah, as you said, Jesse Marcel, Sr., who was the intelligence officer there on the base, was sent out that day to find it and check it out and determine what it was and report back to the base, which he did.
00:18:59And so, yeah, that's kind of the basic story of Rosalind.
00:19:06Other people that were there that were associated with it, I think one of the people, Walter Hout, who was the public relations officer for the base, who was responsible for, like, sending out these.
00:19:22I don't know, but these were the headlines that were the one that left.
00:19:25Yeah.
00:19:26That's the one that, basically, the switchboard, from what I understand, lit up from all over the world.
00:19:33People wanted to know, you know, what did you guys get?
00:19:37What is this?
00:19:37Yeah.
00:19:38And so he releases that.
00:19:41And then, what, 24 hours later, the next day, Gemma Ramey.
00:19:45And this is what I really want to drill into.
00:19:47I'm excited about this.
00:19:49And Jesse Marcel Sr. is trotted out.
00:19:55And Gemma Ramey's got the press.
00:19:57And from my understanding, Jesse Marcel Sr. did not know that the press was in this room.
00:20:03He was a patsy.
00:20:04He was a fall guy.
00:20:05So he's in another room, and then he's trotted out, and the flash bulbs are going.
00:20:09And in front of him, on the floor, is the alleged weather balloon wreckage that he felt.
00:20:16And what's patently absurd about this, anybody who can investigate this, as the intelligence officer of the 509th bombing group, he saw weather balloons go up every single day.
00:20:30So to trot out to Roswell to the site of this crashed UFO and pick up pieces of a weather balloon is patently absurd.
00:20:40Oh, yeah.
00:20:40I don't think there's any possible way that he would have mistaken a weather balloon or, you know, what they call a Rawin radar target.
00:20:48Which is what he had on the floor there in front of him when those famous photographs were taken.
00:20:56And Jesse Jr. says that his father told him that that material was substituted for the real material that he picked up while he was out of the room.
00:21:06And, you know, the other thing that people need to realize, and look this up, but that photograph has General Ramey holding a telegram in his hand.
00:21:17And the fellow that deciphered what was in that telegram, Rudiak was his name, David Rudiak.
00:21:27And you can read the words, the disc, the victims of the wreck.
00:21:34Right.
00:21:34It's all in that telegram.
00:21:36And Ramey's holding a telegram like this.
00:21:38Right.
00:21:39Marcel's squatting.
00:21:40So even that is a setup.
00:21:42Jesse Marcel is made to look like an absolute fool for thinking, somehow confusing, this is a UFO.
00:21:49No, it's just a weather balloon.
00:21:51Right.
00:21:51I mean, he was a patsy, it was a setup, but the telegram, that's a smoking gun, and you can't refute that.
00:21:59Right.
00:21:59This is what the telegram says.
00:22:01So Jesse Marcel Sr. is the patsy, he's being set up, he's a fall guy, and to think, and I remember talking to Jesse Marcel Jr. about this, about his dad.
00:22:11Could his dad mistake a weather balloon for, and it's beyond absurd.
00:22:17I mean, it really is.
00:22:19Because he saw these things every single day.
00:22:21Yeah.
00:22:21Could he mistake a weather balloon for something that was possibly an interstellar, highly technological craft?
00:22:30No, there's no way.
00:22:32I mean, I believe that you or I could distinguish between a weather balloon and something that one of these craft, you know, is made of.
00:22:41So, no, I mean, that's ridiculous.
00:22:45Testimony that we are about to share with you is true.
00:22:48I met Colonel Hill in, well, 1998, and I worked for him for several years.
00:22:55So, in his last year or so of life, he got sick, and he was over in Wilford Hall, which is on the Lackland Air Force Base for military personnel.
00:23:09And I took care.
00:23:11I went every day, and I sat with him, and I talked with him, and I just became very close to him.
00:23:18Colonel Hill was 90, approaching 90 years of age.
00:23:22And so, this was in 2001.
00:23:27And really, I don't know how it came up, but I just said, Colonel, what about Roswell?
00:23:35Well, and he was kind of sitting like this, and his head came up, and he looked at me, what about it?
00:23:46Almost like, you know, should I tell this?
00:23:49Or, you know, oh, oh, my God.
00:23:55Well, he said, you know, what about it?
00:24:01And I said, well, you know, did it really happen, or was it really a weather balloon?
00:24:06He put his head down, and he thought for a minute, and then he looked me dead in the eye, and he said,
00:24:13it really happened, and it was not a weather balloon.
00:24:18Colonel Hill was an educated officer in intelligence, and he had four degrees that he told me about.
00:24:27He had sociology, theology, psychology, and philosophy, yes.
00:24:34And, of course, he had never really went into any details about what he had done in the military,
00:24:42but it was all intelligence.
00:24:44And he told me that at the time that the Roswell incident happened, that he was in Fort Worth area,
00:24:54and they immediately put him on an airplane and told him to get to Roswell.
00:25:00So he arrived in Roswell right when the crash and the situation was fresh.
00:25:08He said he got there and that they had two bodies.
00:25:14One was still alive.
00:25:17And I said, well, you know, were they like what we've been told?
00:25:21Were they little gray people?
00:25:23And he said, well, they were small in stature.
00:25:26And he said that he tried to communicate with it.
00:25:34He was there with them.
00:25:37And the one that was, they were doing everything they could to try to save the one that was still alive,
00:25:45but was severely injured.
00:25:47And the second one was already deceased.
00:25:50And, um, but he said, he did not go on about saying that the, that he made communication or anything like that.
00:25:59But he was there.
00:26:01He made, you know, contact.
00:26:05He made an attempt.
00:26:07He made an attempt to make contact with them.
00:26:09Yeah.
00:26:10Colonel Hill wasn't a jokester at all.
00:26:12He was, he was military.
00:26:14He was a colonel and, and, you know, I knew him for a couple of years.
00:26:20So I took everything that he's was saying as the absolute truth.
00:26:24He never gave us the impression of like he was going to prank or anything.
00:26:29Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
00:26:32And, um, I mean, he was a good man and, uh, one of my best clients that I've had the privilege to work with.
00:26:40But, um, so I said to him, I said, Colonel, um, if they, if they looked, if they were humanoid and everything, I said, what was special about him?
00:26:51And again, he, the head drops and he thinks, and then he raised his head up at me and he held his hand up just like this.
00:27:00He said, they had six fingers, not five.
00:27:06That's what he said that was special about them as far as their anatomy, that they were six fingered and not five like we are.
00:27:14And we know that he said that, uh, the bodies and all the material that went with them were, uh, backed up.
00:27:20Yeah, they were all moved to Wright-Patterson is what the colonel said.
00:27:24And then to have him validate the fact that, yes, it was true and it was no weather balloon.
00:27:33So, what did, what did Jesse Marcel Jr., did he ever talk about the bodies?
00:27:40Did his father ever see the bodies?
00:27:42Uh, he, he never said that to me.
00:27:45Okay.
00:27:45He never talked about any bodies.
00:27:47Um, all he talked about was, uh, the wreckage.
00:27:51And, you know, he had, uh, replicas like this.
00:27:56Right.
00:27:56Made, uh, which he called an eye beam and incredibly strong on it.
00:28:01It had these, these symbols that were sort of purple, um, almost kind of holographic sort of purplish symbols that he recalled seeing on it.
00:28:12So that was one of the examples.
00:28:13And he, he gave this one, uh, to me, uh, at some point in our relationship.
00:28:18Um, that's a real prize possession.
00:28:21Yeah.
00:28:21Yeah.
00:28:22I mean, it is.
00:28:23It's, it's kind of a historical thing.
00:28:25I mean, it's not the real thing.
00:28:26You know, but, but it's what he recalled seeing.
00:28:29I, I worked with him long enough to know that he, he was never, ever lie about this, make this stuff up, carry on a story that he knew wasn't true.
00:28:39That he just, I know for certain that he would not do that.
00:28:43No, I agree.
00:28:44I agree.
00:28:44Uh, the people who question his story and whether he's telling the truth, uh, let me reassure you.
00:28:51Uh, there's no possible way that this man would be lying about this, uh, for so many years, not just to me, but to the entire world really about what happened.
00:29:01Uh, that's just not possible.
00:29:03So, go ahead.
00:29:04Let me just say, you asked about bodies.
00:29:06So he, he never said anything about bodies.
00:29:08But, um, if you watch the interviews that were done with Frankie Rowe, who was the daughter of, um, a fireman in Roswell, who was with the Roswell Fire Department.
00:29:21His unit was called out to go, when the wreck happened, they went out there.
00:29:28And he, he told Frankie Rowe, his daughter, that, uh, she, that, that he had seen two dead aliens and one live alien at the crash site.
00:29:43We went out there early today, which, I don't know what time that was, but early to him, could have meant they left before dark.
00:29:53And he said, when they got there, they could see that there were two bodies that were laying on the ground outside of this crash.
00:30:03And that there was one, what he called a little person.
00:30:06And he said, there's one little person that was walking around.
00:30:09And he said, they were still alive.
00:30:13So, she asked him, you know, what, what did they look like?
00:30:20Do they look like us?
00:30:21And, and he said, they were very small, about the size of a small 10-year-old child.
00:30:29But the head looked like the little insect that we played with or that we saw around our house called Child of the Earth.
00:30:38But we all knew what that looked like, so nobody asked any questions on, on that.
00:30:42And we assumed that meant that the head was too large for the body and had no hair and it would have large eyes.
00:30:52And we knew that because that's what the child of the earth insect looks like.
00:30:58He said, they looked quite a bit like us.
00:31:02He said, they were a lot smaller than we are.
00:31:06So, he said, a small 10-year-old child, I knew he meant smaller than I was.
00:31:10And I wasn't very big at 12 years old.
00:31:12I was a little small for my age.
00:31:14And he said that the other two were dead and that this one that was alive was very sad.
00:31:22But he emphasized and he kept saying, there's no need for us to be afraid.
00:31:27They're not here to hurt us.
00:31:28And he said, we couldn't help them.
00:31:33And he was more upset with the fact that they couldn't help this little person.
00:31:39And that's something he really felt badly, that he couldn't help this one that was alive.
00:31:45And she said the next day, she was down at the fire station with her father.
00:31:53And she witnessed people handling the metal, the memory metal, they call it, from Roswell.
00:32:01And she also held it in her hand.
00:32:03She said you could wad it up to almost nothing and you could lay it out on the table.
00:32:08And I love the way she described it.
00:32:11You know, you hear people say, oh, it unfolded without any creases or anything in it.
00:32:15The way she described it is when she laid it on the table, it spread out like water.
00:32:19Wow.
00:32:20The state policeman reached into his pocket and he said, I don't think you guys got to see anything like this the other day.
00:32:28And he pulled his hand out of his pocket and it was closed up.
00:32:34He opened his hand over the table and dropped a piece of material that when it hit the table,
00:32:43it was all watered up when it left his hand.
00:32:45And when it hit the table, it spread out like it was water.
00:32:49So I thought that's a very good description because we can all imagine what that would look like.
00:32:54And anyway, she's another person that when I listen to her, I watch her body language and I listen to her voice and I see how sincere she is.
00:33:05I know she's not lying.
00:33:07She's telling us the truth.
00:33:09And to that point, what's the point of the Marcel family creating this story where the ridicule that they endured, and I mean, it got nasty.
00:33:20Yeah.
00:33:20I mean, and it was, they were sort of, especially Jesse Marcel Jr., I mean, senior, he's like, you know, branded essentially as, well, you know, maybe you were drinking or smoking.
00:33:32Were you on peyote?
00:33:33I mean, what's going on here?
00:33:35How could you possibly mistake, you know, a weather balloon for a crashed UFO?
00:33:39So they were really, they were maligned.
00:33:41They were disparaged.
00:33:42Your thoughts?
00:33:43Well, I know Jesse and Linda at their, at their home were all the time getting, you know, prank phone calls and, you know, I don't, I don't think that they were really ever threatened, but I think they were pretty annoyed a lot of, a lot of the time, you know, with people just harassing them kind of about it.
00:34:03And, you know, as you said, the Marcel family really gained nothing from this, this history that they offered the world.
00:34:11You know, it's just like, why, why would you do that if, if it wasn't true?
00:34:17Why would you?
00:34:18What's the point?
00:34:19Why would you make yourself a figure of public ridicule?
00:34:22Which is what they all, what they basically all endured.
00:34:25Yeah.
00:34:25Yeah.
00:34:25Yeah.
00:34:26You wouldn't, none of us would do that.
00:34:28And Jesse wouldn't have done that either.
00:34:30You know, he was a, he was a highly intelligent man, this guy, you know, he was an astronomer.
00:34:34He was a pilot.
00:34:36He was a helicopter pilot in Iraq.
00:34:40He was a flight surgeon in Iraq.
00:34:43He served with the Montana National Guard for years.
00:34:48So, you know, this man was a very high quality individual.
00:34:52He would not invite something into this life, into his life like this, if it were not the truth.
00:34:58Denise, thank you so much for coming on the record.
00:35:01We really appreciate it.
00:35:02And you have a very unique perspective from this whole 1947 Roswell.
00:35:07Was it a saucer?
00:35:09Was it a disc?
00:35:10Was it a weather balloon?
00:35:11Ramey's telegram.
00:35:13And your grandfather, I believe, has trotted out as a Patsy.
00:35:17And he was the intelligence officer of the 509th Bombing Group.
00:35:21Tell us what you remember about it, what he may have shared with you.
00:35:24Well, you know, it's funny.
00:35:27There was a, there's not been a time in my life when I haven't ever thought there wasn't extraterrestrial life out there.
00:35:35Uh, my father, when we moved to Montana, my brothers and I, we were, it was very like in the 1971, 1970 or so.
00:35:44Uh, one of the first things he started to do was build a telescope, but a massive telescope where he, our neighbors were helping out.
00:35:53We were digging this big, we made it, dug it out in a big room in our backyard.
00:35:57We had this big rotating dome.
00:36:00He built a, he built like a computer with it.
00:36:02I mean, this was in the 1970s.
00:36:04This guy was, I have to say, he was a very smart.
00:36:07A lot of people said, yeah, he was, you know, our neighbors even said he missed his calling.
00:36:12He should have been a scientist.
00:36:13Wow.
00:36:13Uh, he would spend his days just reading scientific journals, uh, anything to do with astronomy.
00:36:21So he was, my dad was very impacted by this because I think that was probably one of the
00:36:28reasons why we moved to Montana because he wanted to be able to observe the skies because
00:36:33this had such an effect on him when his father came home from the debris field and said, I
00:36:41think we've got pieces here that are from a flying saucer.
00:36:44And that was the day, I guess the course, the Marcel name kind of took a different path.
00:36:51And, and what amazes me is that he's, uh, your grandfather is sort of trotted out and
00:36:57you, you can see the pictures where he's like kind of looking at General Ramey like, what?
00:37:01Right.
00:37:02Are you serious?
00:37:03Because to think that he would mistake a weather balloon that allegedly would have been out
00:37:08there for a week.
00:37:08It would have been dirt on it, rain.
00:37:10So it would have looked funky.
00:37:12It doesn't look that way, but that, that he would mistake a weather balloon for material
00:37:16from a crash disc is a whole different deal.
00:37:19So one of the things we're trying to do and other people have done it, certainly Stanton
00:37:24Friedman, when he was alive, he was the one that really opened up this whole event to
00:37:29the public.
00:37:30But we were part of it in the film.
00:37:32We're trying to exonerate your grandfather and exonerate your father because they were
00:37:37caught up in something which was beyond their control.
00:37:40Absolutely.
00:37:41Do you think your grandfather was a patsy?
00:37:43A hundred percent.
00:37:44But I think at the same time, when it first happened, of course, he went along with it
00:37:49because that was his job.
00:37:50He was in the military.
00:37:51Yeah.
00:37:51He was told to do this.
00:37:53Yes.
00:37:53And he, you know, he was an intelligence officer.
00:37:55Yes, sir.
00:37:56I will do whatever you want me to do, which is what he did.
00:37:58But I think probably in his mind that he probably thought eventually it would all come to light
00:38:06and you wouldn't have to remain this person that, you know, he took an old, you know,
00:38:10keep secret.
00:38:11They all did.
00:38:12Everybody did.
00:38:12Yeah.
00:38:13Sure.
00:38:13So, and I respect that.
00:38:15I mean, you know, that was his job.
00:38:16That was what he was supposed to do.
00:38:17I want our intelligence to be able to keep secrets if they have to, because, I mean, that
00:38:22may depend on our safety.
00:38:23But I think enough time has passed now where there's no reason for it.
00:38:29We're in a different age than we are in 1947.
00:38:32I completely concur with you.
00:38:35What are your thoughts on Roswell?
00:38:38My thoughts on Roswell is that the Roswell incident is exactly what Jesse Marcel said it was.
00:38:47It was a crashed saucer.
00:38:49He recovered pieces of this saucer.
00:38:51I do believe bodies were also recovered.
00:38:53I do too.
00:38:54And this was the beginning, in some ways, the beginning of ufology.
00:39:00But it was certainly the beginning of a cover up by the U.S. military regarding UFOs, especially
00:39:08crash retrievals.
00:39:09And again, biological entities recovered in these retrievals.
00:39:14Ms. Mace.
00:39:15Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and good morning to our witnesses who are testifying today.
00:39:21I want to thank each of you for being here to discuss a topic of grave importance to our
00:39:25national security.
00:39:27Earlier this year, a Chinese spy balloon was shot down off the coast of my home state of
00:39:31South Carolina.
00:39:32Since the Roswell incident in 1947, many Americans have wondered about the dangers of unknown objects
00:39:39crisscrossing our skies, whether these are UAPs or weather phenomena, advanced technology from
00:39:45American allied or enemy forces or something more out of this world.
00:39:49Mr. Gresh, a couple of questions for you, too, sir, this morning.
00:39:52What percentage of UAPs do you feel are adequately investigated by the U.S. government, of the
00:39:585% that are reported?
00:40:01I can only speak for my personal leadership over at NGA.
00:40:04I tried to look at every report that came through that I could triage.
00:40:08Do you believe that officials at the highest levels of our national security apparatus have
00:40:13unlawfully withheld information from Congress and subverted our oversight authority?
00:40:18There are certain elected leaders that had more information that I'm not sure what they've
00:40:25shared with certain gang of eight members or et cetera, but certainly I would not be surprised.
00:40:31Okay.
00:40:32You've stated that the government is in possession of potentially non-human spacecraft.
00:40:37Based on your experience and extensive conversations with experts, do you believe our government has
00:40:42made contact with intelligent extraterrestrials?
00:40:46It's something I can't discuss in a public setting.
00:40:52Okay.
00:40:53I can't ask when you think this occurred.
00:40:55If you believe we have crashed craft, stated earlier, do we have the bodies of the pilots
00:41:01who piloted this craft?
00:41:03As I've stated publicly already in my News Nation interview, biologics came with some of these
00:41:08recoveries.
00:41:09Yeah.
00:41:11Were they, I guess, human or non-human biologics?
00:41:14Non-human.
00:41:16And that was the assessment of people with direct knowledge on the program I talked to
00:41:19that are currently still on the program.
00:41:21And was this documentary references, video, photos, eyewitness?
00:41:26Like, how would that be determined?
00:41:29The specific documentation I would have to talk to you in a skiff about.
00:41:32Gotcha.
00:41:33Gotcha.
00:41:34Okay.
00:41:35So, and you may or may not be able to answer my last question, and maybe we get into a
00:41:38skiff at the next hearing that we have.
00:41:40But who in the government, either what agency, sub-agency, what contractors, who should be
00:41:48called into the next hearing about UAPs, either in a public setting or even in a private setting?
00:41:53And you probably can't name names, but what agencies or organizations, contractors, et cetera,
00:41:57do we need to call in to get these questions answered, whether it's about funding, what
00:42:01programs are happening, and what's out there?
00:42:04I can give you a specific cooperative and hostile witness list of specific individuals
00:42:09that were in those.
00:42:11And how soon can we get that list?
00:42:13I'm happy to provide that to you after the hearing.
00:42:15Super.
00:42:16And I yield back.
00:42:17So, let me ask you something.
00:42:19So, they had the old guard, General Ramey and the crew.
00:42:23They had a chance.
00:42:24They had a moment in time where the government could have said, okay, they're here.
00:42:28We're not sure what this is.
00:42:30We have a crashing.
00:42:31They could have done that, but they didn't do that.
00:42:33They deliberately obfuscated, and they lied to the American people.
00:42:37I mean, they ball-faced lied.
00:42:38So, all this has changed now.
00:42:40That's the old guard, Ramey and the crew.
00:42:43They're all dead.
00:42:43And now we're seeing this stuff released on Fox News and CNN and all sorts of other media.
00:42:51We have, you know, metal with isotopic ratios not found on this earth.
00:42:55We've got metal from crashed UFOs.
00:42:59They probably would be covered bodies.
00:43:00The Pentagon has crafts in their possession not made on this world, and on and on it goes.
00:43:07What are your thoughts?
00:43:08You know, that's a really good point.
00:43:10That is the pivotal moment when the Pentagon decided to lie about what happened at Roswell.
00:43:21And that really set the stage for, as you said, the rollout of aggressive obfuscation of the UFO phenomenon.
00:43:31Even to the degree of harassing people, persecuting people, and perhaps even killing people for knowing too much or talking too much.
00:43:39I agree.
00:43:39And, you know, and then, of course, it gets into the abduction realm and everything that was happening there.
00:43:46And so the government could have taken a different path and been honest with the American people.
00:43:53And it's very unfortunate that the choice was made to lie.
00:43:58And they told the truth, of course, right out of the gates that they would cover a flying disc.
00:44:05Yeah, right.
00:44:05And they put it in the paper.
00:44:07There was a few headlines.
00:44:09And then, of course, they announced it on the radio.
00:44:12So right out of the gates, we had the truth.
00:44:14And then came the lie.
00:44:16And that lie persisted for decades.
00:44:18And it's finally now beginning to, we're finally beginning to get some kind of admission from the Pentagon that the phenomenon is real.
00:44:28In fact, I would say that the controversy is over.
00:44:31The UFO controversy is over.
00:44:35So this is a copy of the newspaper from Roswell.
00:44:40And we see that this is the original story that they went with, that the Army captured a flying disc.
00:44:48I mean, you can see it.
00:44:49Captures flying saucer in Ranch in the Roswell region.
00:44:53I mean, I'll hold this up with the camera again.
00:44:55You can check it out.
00:44:56So this is the original story.
00:44:58But then, 24 hours later, General Ramey says the excitement is not justified.
00:45:04Yeah.
00:45:04This begins the cover-up, which has lasted literally decades.
00:45:09So our government, because Ramey is getting orders from somebody to silence this whole thing.
00:45:16But the lead story is the truth, I believe.
00:45:19Yes.
00:45:19They did capture, they did get a flying saucer.
00:45:22And, of course, the phones lit up and telegrams and everything else.
00:45:25And then the next day, that's when your grandfather has trotted in.
00:45:28He's the patsy.
00:45:29You can see the photograph where he's going like, are you kidding?
00:45:31I mean, the expression is, are you kidding me?
00:45:34Yep.
00:45:34Are you kidding me?
00:45:36He's the patsy.
00:45:37Hey, did your dad, Jesse Marcello Jr., or your grandfather, did you ever hear them talk?
00:45:42Did they ever talk about that, of the cover-up specifically?
00:45:46Well, I know that when my grandfather got back after going to Fort Worth, and my dad wasn't
00:45:52quite sure exactly the exact time when he said this to him, or when he came out, exactly
00:45:56when he came back.
00:45:57But his words were, treat this as a non-event.
00:46:00Do not talk about this.
00:46:02This didn't happen.
00:46:03You know, basically nothing.
00:46:05So let me ask you something right there.
00:46:07So this is a very smart man.
00:46:09He's the intelligence officer of the only nuclear-equipped bombing group on the planet.
00:46:17So, you know, this isn't Omer Fudd.
00:46:19Yeah.
00:46:19You know, it's not.
00:46:20This isn't the Keystone Cops.
00:46:21This is a very highly trained, highly intelligent man.
00:46:25He's the intelligence officer of the 509th bombing group.
00:46:28If there's nothing to see, why would he come back and say, never talk about this?
00:46:34Exactly.
00:46:35He wouldn't.
00:46:36You know, what the funny thing is, it's like, because they had all of this stuff spread out
00:46:41on their floor, I do not see how a group of three people could misidentify scotch tape.
00:46:51Because they say that's what was on one of the IV, a scotch tape.
00:46:54I'm sorry, but I don't know anybody that would not be able to tell what scotch tape was.
00:47:00I mean, it's a two-year-old would be like, okay, you peel it off.
00:47:03It's scotch tape.
00:47:05But they're trying to say that it sat out in the sun for a long time.
00:47:08So somehow it kind of like, and I think Elmer's glue or something was mixed in with it.
00:47:12And that caused it to infuse with the metal debris or, you know, the wood or whatever they
00:47:18want to call it.
00:47:19It just doesn't hold water.
00:47:21It just doesn't hold water.
00:47:22I agree.
00:47:22And the other funny thing is, too, is there's a gentleman named Sheridan Cabot, who went
00:47:28out with my grandfather to the debris field at the same time.
00:47:32He denied it at first, going out there.
00:47:36He denied, denied, denied.
00:47:37Then the Air Force report interviewed him for the final Air Force report.
00:47:42And he admitted finally, yes, he was out there.
00:47:44But then he's like, oh, but it was a weather balloon.
00:47:47But then we're supposed to believe it's a mogul balloon.
00:47:49So if Sheridan was telling the truth that it was a weather balloon, it doesn't hold water
00:47:54either, because a mogul balloon is huge.
00:47:56There's multiple, multiple balloons.
00:47:59So how could this fit on a single table, which is what he claimed?
00:48:02You know, I sat down with Francisco Carrera, who's head of ExoPolitics Portugal, and I said,
00:48:07you know, what about Roswell?
00:48:08So, you know, Roswell has been, to some people, like the Holy Grail.
00:48:13To others, it was a weather balloon.
00:48:15What say you?
00:48:17Well, weather balloon, I think that's nonsense.
00:48:24You know, it was the 509 cavalry.
00:48:29They were highly trained, highly trained, highly trained officers.
00:48:33They had a high clearance.
00:48:36They dealt with the experience of the H-bomb, the atomic bomb.
00:48:40They were the ones that deployed the tests for the atomic bomb.
00:48:45So, and they would send weather balloons every day, almost every day.
00:48:49So they knew what a weather balloon looks like.
00:48:52Exactly.
00:48:53The crash test dummies, also, Stanton Friedman talked about it,
00:48:56in the sense that they only were invented or put into practice in 1953.
00:49:02So, 1947 is still a long way.
00:49:03Unless they had a time machine.
00:49:05Exactly.
00:49:05The crash test dummies are not going to work.
00:49:07So, any idea, any rebuke, it's nonsense.
00:49:11And why would high patent military generals would be so worried about what happened?
00:49:21I mean, if it was a weather balloon, why keep writing a new book every five or ten years or something?
00:49:27Exactly.
00:49:28But why bother high-ranking generals to just call it?
00:49:33It's a weather balloon?
00:49:33Okay.
00:49:34There would be teams that would deal with it.
00:49:37And that's it about having all those people worried about it.
00:49:41It doesn't make any sense.
00:49:43And Francisco just starts laughing.
00:49:45And he goes, if there's nothing, then why did the Army, you know, every five to ten years come out with another book?
00:49:51Or the Air Force come out with another book?
00:49:52Roswell, case closed, and all this stuff.
00:49:54I mean, if there's nothing to see, but there's nothing to see, who cares?
00:49:57Right.
00:49:57The fact that there's a Texas two-step, even though we're near Mexico, okay?
00:50:02But we're seeing a Texas two-step here.
00:50:05We're getting, oh, we found a crash test, and 24 hours later, nope, nothing to see here.
00:50:10Keep moving on, your grandfather becomes the Patsy, and it trickles down and affects your father.
00:50:15Tell us about that.
00:50:16Well, when we moved out to Montana, like I said, he built his telescope.
00:50:22And he literally just, he was consumed by astronomy because he would always look up there.
00:50:29In fact, most of the weekends, my brother and I, including our neighbors, would camp because we lived in Montana.
00:50:36So we lived in the middle of nowhere.
00:50:37We were in a very rural area where we were at, and we would look up for UFOs.
00:50:44He would have us looking for anything that, see, can you see anything in the sky?
00:50:47Do you see anything?
00:50:48Do you see anything?
00:50:49And we'd be looking sometimes in the telescope, too, and he goes, you know, sometimes when you're looking through that,
00:50:55you may not know this, but somebody could be looking back down at you.
00:50:58Wow.
00:51:00So, it really impacted him.
00:51:02I just, I think for, he was a doctor, he was very, he went, you know, he retired as a colonel in the military.
00:51:09And this is, this is a funny kind of thing, too.
00:51:12If it was, like, what they're saying, it wasn't real, the military never asked my dad to never stop, you know, to stop talking about it.
00:51:22Never.
00:51:23They had their opportunity when it first came out in 1978 to say, okay, let's, you know, let's put the kibosh on this.
00:51:30They could have shown my grandfather at that point proof that it was a mogul balloon or proof that it was something other, nothing.
00:51:37So, why let that story perpetuate, which is what they did.
00:51:42And then they never told my dad after, you know, my, you know, right afterwards, my dad was being approached also to talk about it.
00:51:49And I think he was in that book, The Roswell Incident, I think, I mean, I know my grandfather was, I think my dad did a little interview at that, too.
00:51:57And again, that was a good opportunity for the military to say, you know what, you're not that high up yet.
00:52:03You're still, you know, growing through the ranks.
00:52:05I mean, he was kind of high at that point, but why not ask him to stop?
00:52:09Really, until Stanton Freeman interviews Jesse Marcel Sr., everything, all this information is like under the radar, it's quashed, no one knows about it.
00:52:21Yet, the ridicule is still there in military circles because those who, you know, they all knew, well, this guy thought it was a weather balloon.
00:52:29Which, of course, you know, it's like the old TV series branded, you know, he didn't do anything wrong, yet he's branded.
00:52:36And that's how, you know, Jesse Marcel Sr. and Jr., basically.
00:52:40So, let's go back to the debris field.
00:52:43So, Jesse Marcel Sr. is at the debris field with Mack Brazel.
00:52:46So, did he follow the debris field to the disc, to the saucer?
00:52:50Did he see, did he ever talk about seeing the bodies, anything like that?
00:52:55Not that I'm aware of.
00:52:56Okay.
00:52:56Not that I'm aware of.
00:52:59But he certainly did come up on the debris field, you know.
00:53:02And whether he saw bodies or not, I don't know.
00:53:08But, you know, the man that we were talking about earlier, Walter Hout, the public relations officer for the base.
00:53:16Right.
00:53:16In his, he wrote up with his daughter this affidavit that was his testimony to what he saw.
00:53:29Wow.
00:53:29And this is online, you know, anybody can look this up.
00:53:33But it's, it's called the 2002 Sealed Affidavit of Walter G. Hout.
00:53:38And in this affidavit, Hout states,
00:53:44Samples of wreckage were passed around the table.
00:53:47It was unlike any material I had or have ever seen in my life.
00:53:52Pieces which resembled metal foil, paper thin, yet extremely strong.
00:53:56And pieces with unusual markings along their length.
00:54:00Just like Jesse Marcel said, were handled from man to man, each voicing their opinion.
00:54:08So they're, they're passing this material around a conference table there at the base.
00:54:13Um, I'm assuming Blanchard, you know, Colonel Blanchard was there.
00:54:18Ramey.
00:54:18Marcel was there.
00:54:19Ramey might have been there.
00:54:20Right.
00:54:21Hout was there, you know.
00:54:23And, um, he says no one was able to identify the crash debris.
00:54:29And then, let me stop you.
00:54:30Certainly not the Chi-Cons.
00:54:32It's certainly not the Russians.
00:54:33So, yeah.
00:54:34I mean, this is July 47th.
00:54:36Exactly.
00:54:36Right?
00:54:36Right.
00:54:37Um, I mean, back then they were still, they were still having that question, right?
00:54:42Is this the Russians or the Chinese?
00:54:44Right.
00:54:44Well, uh, you know, back then they might not have known.
00:54:49Today we know this was not the Russians or the Chinese.
00:54:52You know, the Chinese were basically, as Luis Elizondo recently said, they were still using
00:54:58ox carts with stone wheels in 47.
00:55:02And, uh, Russia certainly had nothing like this.
00:55:06And then, then he said, um, before leaving the base, Colonel Blanchard took me personally
00:55:11to building 84, a B-29 hangar located on the east side of the tarmac.
00:55:17Upon first approaching the building, I observed that it was under heavy guard, both outside
00:55:22and inside.
00:55:24Once inside, I was permitted from a safe distance to observe the, the object just recovered
00:55:30north of town.
00:55:31It was approximately 12 to 15 feet in length, not quite as wide, about six feet high and
00:55:38more of an egg shape.
00:55:39The lighting was poor, but its surface did appear metallic.
00:55:44No windows, portholes, wings, tail section, or landing gear were visible.
00:55:50Um, and so, you know, he, the, about the bodies though, he says also from a distance, I was able
00:55:57to see a couple of bodies under a canvas tarpaulin.
00:56:00Only the heads extended beyond the covering and I was not able to make out any features.
00:56:07The heads did appear larger than normal and the contour of the canvas over the bodies suggested
00:56:13the size of a 10 year old child.
00:56:15How many times have we heard that?
00:56:17It's 10 year old, you know, you hear it over and over again.
00:56:20These, these little gray aliens, they're, they're about the size of a 10 year old child.
00:56:24And Colonel Hill and our interview with the Rankin said exactly the same thing.
00:56:29Heads were large, big black guys.
00:56:30He said they had six fingers.
00:56:32Right.
00:56:32That's what he said.
00:56:33And, and, you know, there's, there's other stories where there's only four fingers.
00:56:37So six or four, I don't know, but that's, Hill said six fingers, big black guys.
00:56:42And he said they were wearing, according to his testimony, because he tried to communicate
00:56:46with this thing.
00:56:47That's what his, his job was in the OSS member deathbed confession.
00:56:53And so, you know, Hill said that they were wearing some sort of a single jumpsuit type
00:56:59thing, which was an interesting piece of the puzzle.
00:57:03If you listen to the little girl that was interviewed by John Mack at the aerial school encounter,
00:57:10she, she also, when he, when she was asked, how large was this being that she was standing
00:57:16one meter from.
00:57:17That's really close.
00:57:18One meter.
00:57:19That's really close.
00:57:20She says, uh, a grade six.
00:57:23Okay.
00:57:23So what is that?
00:57:24That's about 12 or 10.
00:57:26You know, how, that's how tall she, that's how she described the height of this being.
00:57:32So, I mean, we're getting this over and over and over again from places all around the world.
00:57:36Chase Klotsky had an encounter.
00:57:38Yeah.
00:57:38That she was terrified.
00:57:40I said, well, what do you mean?
00:57:41And not only, she said fight or flight times a thousand.
00:57:45She said she's never felt fear like this before.
00:57:48So it's interesting.
00:57:49Very, very interesting.
00:57:50Yeah.
00:57:51A huge cornfield.
00:57:53And it was just down the road that his family owned.
00:57:55And when you say huge cornfield, 100 acres?
00:57:56About 100 acres.
00:57:57Okay.
00:57:58And we jumped in the truck and we drove down there.
00:58:02By the time activity started, there were seven of us in the field.
00:58:06And was very excited to show us that the lights were already starting to pop up.
00:58:10Wow.
00:58:11So, you know, he said, well, there's some now.
00:58:13And this is broad daylight?
00:58:15No, this is dusk.
00:58:16Dusk?
00:58:16Okay.
00:58:16It was about dusk.
00:58:17And we literally saw these little lights.
00:58:20They were high in the sky, but they started all popping into the atmosphere.
00:58:25And they would gather together and, you know, kind of form together.
00:58:29And they'd move as a unit.
00:58:30And then they'd separate.
00:58:32What color were they?
00:58:32They were white, red, blue, all these little lights.
00:58:37Our impression was they were individual.
00:58:41It was probably about an hour after we had gotten there.
00:58:44The witness said, you know, oh, my gosh, Chase, here it comes.
00:58:47And he says, here comes that light.
00:58:49And he points up.
00:58:51And sure enough, I see this light starting to head into the atmosphere.
00:58:56But it's closer and closer to us.
00:58:58It's just strange.
00:58:59And then two more pop up.
00:59:01As it's coming, I start realizing these aren't three independent lights or three different craft.
00:59:08You know, like what we were watching earlier.
00:59:10These were on a triangle.
00:59:13And at first it looked three.
00:59:15But then he started seeing where the outline of the craft, it was becoming more and more defined.
00:59:23And it started to block out the stars.
00:59:25Oh, boy.
00:59:26So, and it was.
00:59:26How big was it?
00:59:27It was huge.
00:59:28It was very big.
00:59:30And not.
00:59:30When you say very big, give me an idea.
00:59:32Well, one of the techniques that we used was to hold your arms straight out above you.
00:59:38And if I opened a magazine, it would barely cover the bottom.
00:59:42Wow.
00:59:42Yeah.
00:59:43So, it was very big.
00:59:45As it came forward, it.
00:59:46Any noise?
00:59:47Nothing.
00:59:48Nothing.
00:59:48It never changed direction.
00:59:50It never changed speed, altitude.
00:59:52Was it moving slowly?
00:59:53Very slowly.
00:59:54Very slowly.
00:59:55And it's hard to describe how it moved because you almost want to say it glided, but not quite.
01:00:01It wasn't flying.
01:00:03It wasn't drifting.
01:00:04The exact word and the way the atmosphere changes when you're in the presence of something like this,
01:00:12it's very hard to define because this is not our reality.
01:00:16So, this craft is approaching you now?
01:00:18It's flying right over our heads.
01:00:20And it's very large.
01:00:21It's huge, and that's...
01:00:23What were you thinking when this was going on?
01:00:25I was excited.
01:00:26I was so excited because, you know, as an investigator since 1994...
01:00:31Sure.
01:00:31This is the first time I am looking at something that I absolutely know is beyond us.
01:00:37It has to be, just the way it moves and just the feel, everything about what was going on.
01:00:43And so, I was excited.
01:00:45I'm picking up my cameras, nothing's working, I'm so frustrated because I have all of this equipment.
01:00:50And we've heard this before in UFO encounters, when people encounter, they go to photograph things, the cameras don't work, all the electricity goes off, cars stop running.
01:01:02I mean, this goes with the phenomenon, supposedly.
01:01:04Absolutely, and it couldn't be more frustrating because, as an investigator, this is my one opportunity, my first opportunity.
01:01:12And you're shut down.
01:01:13Absolutely.
01:01:14And it's extremely, extremely overwhelming to have something like this right there, and there's nothing you can do to record it.
01:01:27All of a sudden, there was just this feeling, and I turned around and kind of asked everybody else in the field if they felt like they were being watched.
01:01:37And I said, and I don't mean from up there, I mean from down here.
01:01:42And before anyone could answer, and there was barely any time, there was this fear that just gripped.
01:01:51It was physical L.A.
01:01:53It, like, punches into you almost.
01:01:56It's just really hard to describe.
01:01:57I'm very familiar with that feeling.
01:01:59This is not fight or flight.
01:02:00This is times a thousand.
01:02:04This is every single cell in your body is very aware of a blind terror.
01:02:09We always kind of thought maybe afterwards that whatever was going on in that cornfield, they didn't want us there when they had a job.
01:02:19But, again, we were left with way more questions than answers.
01:02:23So, at this point, you're terrified.
01:02:26Yes.
01:02:27And what happens next?
01:02:28What do you do?
01:02:29I run.
01:02:29And I turn and...
01:02:31With your equipment or without your equipment?
01:02:33I drop my equipment.
01:02:34I literally drop my equipment.
01:02:36And your equipment's worth how many thousands of dollars?
01:02:38Many thousands of dollars.
01:02:39Okay, so you leave your equipment in the field.
01:02:41Yes.
01:02:41So you are genuinely terrified.
01:02:43Absolutely.
01:02:44You don't even know really why you're afraid at this point.
01:02:46No, no.
01:02:47In fact, it makes no sense.
01:02:51The witness was in front of me, and all of a sudden he stops.
01:02:55He moved a flashlight and never so shocked in my life because standing six feet away was this little being about three and a half foot tall.
01:03:05And I just, I was so stunned.
01:03:09And the first thing that hit me was, oh my gosh, this is not that cute little Roswell alien.
01:03:14However, it was gray.
01:03:17It did have the black eyes, but they weren't the real big, you know, wrap around almond.
01:03:23But they were almond shaped.
01:03:24And the first thing I thought of after that was his legs were so tiny, twig-like.
01:03:34And now looking back and doing more, you know, investigation and thinking more.
01:03:41And now that we know what the other witnesses had seen and said and talking, I believe that it was more the reflection of the flashlight.
01:03:48But it just struck me.
01:03:50That's what I was thinking at the time was his little legs were just so rail thin and twig-like.
01:03:56Terrifying.
01:03:56We weren't supposed to be there.
01:03:58And who runs from that?
01:04:00I've been, you know, investigating and chasing these things for, you know, the better part of my adult life.
01:04:08And there it is right there.
01:04:10And it was the holy grail for a ufologist is this little being.
01:04:16But we weren't supposed to be there.
01:04:18We were not supposed to interact.
01:04:20We were not supposed to do anything but get out of that cornfield.
01:04:23What expression did it have on its face?
01:04:24Nothing.
01:04:24Nothing.
01:04:25Absolutely.
01:04:25Did it gesture towards you in any way?
01:04:27No.
01:04:28Did it move towards you?
01:04:29Nothing.
01:04:29It just stood there.
01:04:31And you made eye contact with it?
01:04:33Yes.
01:04:34Yes.
01:04:34What was that like?
01:04:36Terrifying.
01:04:37Terrifying.
01:04:38Terrifying.
01:04:40Anything else in that affidavit?
01:04:43Not, you know, nothing that's earth-shattering.
01:04:45But, you know, I would encourage people to look that up.
01:04:48Walter Hout's 2002 affidavit about what he saw at Roswell.
01:04:52If they don't find that convincing, you know, I don't know what's going to convince people.
01:04:57How many times do we have to hear it from a variety of different people from all walks of life?
01:05:01Professional military people and eyewitnesses, firemen, Glenn Dennis, you know, the coroner,
01:05:08not the coroner, but the funeral parlor guy.
01:05:11I mean, it's just there's too many witnesses.
01:05:13And, of course, the nurse who mysteriously vanishes.
01:05:17This actually happened over 20 years ago.
01:05:20Okay.
01:05:20We were living in Tulsa, Oklahoma at the time.
01:05:23And my husband had to be rushed to the hospital and he was dehydrated.
01:05:27So they were giving him fluids and they kept him in the room for a little bit.
01:05:31And this elderly nurse walks in and she said, may I pray for your husband?
01:05:37And I said, oh, sure, of course, that would be nice.
01:05:40And he agreed to it.
01:05:41So she said a nice little prayer.
01:05:43And when she was done, she looked at me and I looked at her and she said, I'm new here.
01:05:49And I said, you're new here?
01:05:50And she said, yes.
01:05:52She says, I'm new.
01:05:54And I said, well, tell me, where are you from?
01:05:56She said, well, I'm from Roswell, New Mexico.
01:05:59I said, really?
01:06:00And I said, Roswell, New Mexico.
01:06:02I said, you know, I've heard things about Roswell, New Mexico.
01:06:07And then I leaned close to her and I said, any truth to any of that?
01:06:11And she looked at me and she said, oh, she says, I was a nurse there and I arrived not too long after the incident.
01:06:21And I said, have you got some stories you'd like to share?
01:06:24She said, no, I can't talk about them.
01:06:27But she said some interesting information.
01:06:30She said, the nurses who were there during the crash, they're now at a convent in East Tulsa.
01:06:40The National Archives has a YouTube channel, right?
01:06:44And under the Glenn Dennis interview, they had a Glenn Davis interview.
01:06:49And I saw this over and over again.
01:06:52And finally, I called the National Archives or I wrote to them and I said, hey, you know,
01:06:56your YouTube is labeled with the wrong guy's name.
01:07:00And I just always wondered, how could the National Archives of all places get Glenn Dennis' name wrong?
01:07:07And was that deliberate so that people were looking for that information and wanted to listen to that interview?
01:07:12Couldn't find Glenn Dennis because it was listed as Glenn Davis.
01:07:16You know, these are the kind of subtle things that go on as this control over this story has gone on for decades now.
01:07:25You know, and I just wonder if that was just another thing that was done to try to keep it tamped down, keep public interest down about it.
01:07:35So, the old guard, and this is what I believe is my wheelhouse, my, in studying Roswell for, like you, you know, for forever, for decades.
01:07:47It seems like the old guard got together and the powers that be got together in 47.
01:07:54And, you know, Ramey's calling up, up, up the chain of command.
01:07:58What do I do with this?
01:07:59They tell him what to do with it.
01:08:01Marcel becomes the Patsy.
01:08:03The rest is history.
01:08:04But the old guard had a choice.
01:08:07They could have gone with this.
01:08:10They could have said, here it is.
01:08:12Here are the bodies.
01:08:13Here's the craft.
01:08:14We're not sure what this is.
01:08:15We're not sure where it's from.
01:08:16They didn't do that.
01:08:18Instead, they deliberately obfuscated it.
01:08:20They pressed it down.
01:08:21They kept it down.
01:08:22They lied about it.
01:08:23They made Marcel, Marcel Sr. the fall guy.
01:08:27And on and on it goes.
01:08:28What I find interesting, Ramey, I think, was 34 at the time, something like that.
01:08:33Maybe it was a little older.
01:08:34But the old guard who set that paradigm, they're all gone.
01:08:41Right.
01:08:41They're all gone.
01:08:42So, there's a new guard.
01:08:44And all of a sudden, in 2017, you know where I'm going with this.
01:08:48Yes.
01:08:48We see Commander David Fravor on Tucker Carlson with a tic-tac-shaped object.
01:08:54And then they've got what was at one time classified footage of a UFO.
01:08:58Yeah.
01:08:58And they're showing this thing.
01:09:00And it's on, you know, it's all over the internet.
01:09:0360 Minutes picked up on it.
01:09:05CNN, NBC, ABC.
01:09:07I mean, everybody carried the story.
01:09:09Right.
01:09:09That was the beginning of disclosure.
01:09:11What are your thoughts?
01:09:12Why now?
01:09:14Why are they releasing this information?
01:09:16And here's really the question.
01:09:18Do you think at some point they will finally release the color film from Roswell?
01:09:25Because we know that they have it.
01:09:27Your thoughts?
01:09:27Yeah, I think that right now we're in the process of some sort of a dissemination of information
01:09:36about this to the public, that we are being acclimatized to accept the fact that we're not
01:09:45alone on this planet.
01:09:48And, you know, I think David Fravor, Luis Elizondo, Christopher Mellon.
01:09:52But do you think that at some point they'll actually show us the footage from Roswell?
01:09:57I certainly think they have it.
01:09:59Yeah.
01:09:59I do too.
01:10:00I have no doubt that they have that.
01:10:02It's sealed away.
01:10:03I'm sure that there's historians that are keeping close tabs on all of this.
01:10:08Because, I mean, let's face it.
01:10:10500 years from now, all of this is going to be an extremely part of human history.
01:10:15You know?
01:10:15And so all of these materials that have been collected and the films and the pilot reports
01:10:21and all of this stuff, I'm sure that there's an organized effort to keep all of this collated
01:10:26and preserved in a way that it will, for posterity, you know?
01:10:30Yeah.
01:10:33How would Jesse Marcel Jr. react to what's going on right now?
01:10:37Oh, he'd be thrilled.
01:10:40And he always has believed it and known it was true.
01:10:46And I think his biggest joy would be that it would have made his father's story be more real.
01:10:57And it wouldn't have, his father, let me, I don't know how to put that.
01:11:03And, well, it would change his life, I think, and his, and I can't go back there.
01:11:17The kid, and all of our kids' lives, I know our boys have struggled with it.
01:11:22And it would verify that it was the truth and that they weren't, he wasn't just some drunk man.
01:11:30Right, right.
01:11:31Off the deep end, wanting recognition.
01:11:35I guess they felt that he was maybe making up the story to get glorified himself.
01:11:42And that wasn't it at all.
01:11:44He kind of became really reclusive in the later years.
01:11:50And I think it was because of the disdain.
01:11:52Mm-hmm.
01:11:53Mm-hmm.
01:11:55You asked him if there was ever any threats to us.
01:12:00Correct.
01:12:00There were.
01:12:02Um, we had a period of time, once he started traveling, that every time he would leave to go somewhere, we'd get these phone calls wanting to know if he'd left.
01:12:15And they'd, um, and then there were times, this is really bizarre, my mom noticed it most, we'd have a group of people at our house, they'd all be asking him questions about Roswell, and we'd always get these, these phone calls and nobody would be on the phone.
01:12:31It happened.
01:12:32It happened constantly.
01:12:33It happened constantly.
01:12:34It was only during the times that people were talking to us in our home about Roswell.
01:12:38So we felt like somebody was watching.
01:12:40Oh, they were.
01:12:41No, no.
01:12:42No.
01:12:43I was in Albuquerque with the Japanese film group.
01:12:46And he called me one night and he said, is anything going on?
01:12:50And I said, well, we just got the phone call and he goes, well, be careful because we're being followed.
01:12:55And so that was, there was some scary, scary things to us.
01:13:00What year is that when he's with the Japanese film group?
01:13:03I don't remember.
01:13:042010?
01:13:05No.
01:13:06Before?
01:13:07Probably been before that.
01:13:08Okay.
01:13:09But they were going all over down in that area and they were called and told that they were being followed.
01:13:16He went to Washington DC and they threw on something else and they knew he was coming.
01:13:24And so the White House sent a message to the hotel and he gets to his room and it says, will you please call this number?
01:13:32So he calls them.
01:13:33It's the White House and they want to meet with him.
01:13:37Whoa.
01:13:38So he goes, they have him come.
01:13:40He said he goes up the stairs and secret service or somebody meets him.
01:13:44They even, they know what he looks like.
01:13:46They greet him.
01:13:47They take him in.
01:13:48He meets, I think it was centered in a model.
01:13:51And he said, we want to go to, do you want to go to a secure room?
01:13:58And he said, I don't have anything that's secret.
01:14:01I'm not going to tell you anything different.
01:14:03And he said, well, I might.
01:14:05And so they went way down, he said, somewhere in the depths of the White House.
01:14:10And so they went way down, he said, somewhere in the depths of the White House.
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