- 11 hours ago
The Tommy Tiernan Show - Season 10 Episode 5 (Full Episode)
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00:00:00Hello there everybody you're all very welcome to the show and I hope you enjoy what happens here
00:00:20over the next hour or so. To find out who our first guest is let me hand you over to our MC
00:00:25for the evening, the beautiful Fred Cook. Thank you Tommy. Well our first guest is Louise James.
00:00:39Now. Hello. Hello. Welcome. Sit down there. Thank you. I don't know you. No. Where are you from? I'm from Derry. Derry. Yes. And what's your line of work like or what do you do?
00:00:53Well I'm a mum. I'm a Zoom. So in 2016 I lost my family in the Bon Canapier tragedy. So I lost my two sons Mark and Evan. My mum, my sister and my partner. And my baby daughter at the time, she was four months, she was the sole survivor.
00:01:20Can you remind me of what happened there please?
00:01:24So I had been away for the weekend with friends. We were on a hem weekend and my mum had the boys and my daughter and my partner Sean had taken them out for dinner on the Sunday.
00:01:40And on the way home they went to the pier to watch the sunset and the car slid in the algae on the pier and the car went under the water.
00:01:55How come your baby daughter survived?
00:02:03A fella swam in and her dad handed her out. And he swam back to shore with her.
00:02:11What year was it did you say? 2016. So it's ten years. It'll be ten years now in March, the 20th of March.
00:02:1920th of March. Yeah.
00:02:22Who told you?
00:02:24I knew. I had a feeling that something was wrong. But my brother was going to break it to me. I had a gut feeling.
00:02:42That you, would you have had those gut feelings before? Yeah. About things and nothing had happened? Yeah.
00:02:54But I had been, I got up on the Sunday and I had phoned Sean and I'd say, do you know what, I just want to come home.
00:03:02You know, I didn't leave the boys much. You know, they were mine. You know, I just had Reena. Reena was four months old.
00:03:09And I phoned him and he said, you know, enjoy, enjoy being away. You know, you're coming home tonight.
00:03:16You know, you'll be fine. You know, the boys will see you when you're home.
00:03:20And so that was fine. Later on that evening, I had phoned Jodie to tell her that my flight had been delayed for an hour.
00:03:29And I said, where are you? And she goes, we're in the park playing. They had just gone for dinner.
00:03:34And I chatted to the boys and Evan said that I just can't wait to get you home. I just want to give you a hug.
00:03:40He loved, he loved his hugs. He loved giving hugs, the two of them did.
00:03:44And Jodie started laughing and she says, I'm just laughing at these things, telling you how much they love you and I can't wait for you to come home.
00:03:51And I hung up the phone. I told her to look after them. I was all like, look after him in the park.
00:03:57Evan had, he was the youngest boy and he had Duchenne muscular dystrophy.
00:04:02So she was all, he's fine. And I was like, Mark, watch your brother. And he was all, Mama, you worry too much.
00:04:08You know, he's fine. Leave him alone. He's having fun.
00:04:12Can you just go through the people again, because I'm a bit overwhelmed.
00:04:16Yes.
00:04:17So who, because I'm getting mixed up with the kids.
00:04:21Yes. So Mark is my oldest son.
00:04:23Yeah.
00:04:24And Evan is my youngest son.
00:04:25Okay.
00:04:26And Jodie is my sister.
00:04:27Okay.
00:04:28So the three of them were playing in the park.
00:04:30And I was talking to Jodie.
00:04:32So she was 14, Mark was 12 and Evan was eight.
00:04:36And my mum and Sean were in the car with Rena.
00:04:41Yeah.
00:04:42And so I was chatting to her on the phone and then I hung up.
00:04:46And I'm going to say it was about 15, maybe 20 minutes later.
00:04:50I literally felt like somebody had ripped my heart out of my chest.
00:04:55That's the only way to describe it.
00:05:00And that happened when?
00:05:02At the airport.
00:05:03Hmm.
00:05:04So I immediately like rang her back and there was nothing, you know, no connection.
00:05:13And I started to panic.
00:05:17And I was like, I know there's something wrong.
00:05:20So this, this feeling of, that your heart.
00:05:23Yeah.
00:05:24Was ripped out of my chest.
00:05:26And there's nothing around you.
00:05:28No.
00:05:29Just something.
00:05:31Hmm.
00:05:32So I phoned, I phoned my brother and he had asked me, was I on social media?
00:05:38And I said no, cause I had taken, I had taken all my, I took everything off my phone because
00:05:44my battery was low.
00:05:46So you turn everything off to save your battery.
00:05:49Hmm.
00:05:50And I said, I said, no, no.
00:05:52And he said, there's been an accident in Bunkranagh.
00:05:56And I, I said, it's them.
00:05:58You know, I have a feeling.
00:06:00I just know.
00:06:01And he said, no, it's, it's a car with, with two men.
00:06:04And I said, and I'm very like, I need to see.
00:06:07So I was like, well, what color's the car?
00:06:09He says, I don't know.
00:06:11It's just, it's just come up.
00:06:12And I went, just tell me the color of the car and you know, I'll be okay.
00:06:15But I need to know the color of the car.
00:06:18And he went, well, you used to drive a Jeep.
00:06:20You know, it's a car that's gone on.
00:06:22So it's gone off the pier.
00:06:24And I says, look, turn, don't go on anything and turn your phone off.
00:06:28And I says, right.
00:06:30Okay.
00:06:31So he hung up.
00:06:33I turned my phone off.
00:06:35And I got on that plane.
00:06:37And as the plane was coming on the land, I had looked across.
00:06:43And a girl had turned on her phone.
00:06:46And it just came up, black SUV has gone onto the pier at Boncana Pier.
00:06:54And I, I don't, I just remember running off that plane.
00:07:00And as I was running, I switched my phone back on.
00:07:04And that's when my brother phoned me to tell me.
00:07:10What did he say?
00:07:11He, he said, are you listening to me?
00:07:15And I said, I know.
00:07:16And he says, I know.
00:07:18I said, are they all gone?
00:07:20And he said,
00:07:22Raina's at the hospital.
00:07:25I said, I don't know what stitch she's in.
00:07:29He said, but she's at the hospital.
00:07:32But yeah, they're all gone.
00:07:34Sorry.
00:07:35Hey.
00:07:37Just in case.
00:07:41Yeah.
00:07:42So we went straight on to see Raina.
00:07:46And my mum always used to say, you know, if, if I die, I'll, I'll show you a sign.
00:07:53You know, and I was like, well, what's your sign?
00:07:56She goes, well, I love elephants.
00:07:58So my sign will be an elephant.
00:08:00So if I ever die and you see an elephant, you know, that's me.
00:08:04And I'd gone on and the nurse said, Louise, I don't know if you give Raina a dummy or not,
00:08:11but I've given her a dummy because she's been crying.
00:08:13And I said, no, that's fine.
00:08:15And on the front of the dummy was a wee elephant.
00:08:19You know, and I just thought, right, that's, that's my sign.
00:08:24My mum's here and she's okay.
00:08:26What, can you remember what your body felt like?
00:08:39Numb.
00:08:41I felt like I was just drifting.
00:08:45You know, I just felt like I was existing.
00:08:49I wasn't here.
00:08:51How long did that last?
00:09:10That, that...
00:09:11Still here now.
00:09:13Still here.
00:09:16You know, you laugh all day.
00:09:19You carry on.
00:09:20You cry all night.
00:09:22You know, you feel guilty for loving.
00:09:25You feel guilty for telling jokes, laughing, being involved, going to parties.
00:09:31But then that's not fair on Raina.
00:09:34You know, I still have to live a life for her.
00:09:37How's she getting on?
00:09:43She's fantastic.
00:09:44You know, she's our two brothers mixed into one.
00:09:48Along with a wee punch of her.
00:09:50She's, aye, she's my everything.
00:09:52I exist for her.
00:09:57So she might be...
00:10:00She has no weight of grief.
00:10:02I hope not.
00:10:03When it comes to asking questions about it.
00:10:06No.
00:10:07So I'm imagining that she might have often been asking questions in a very happy way.
00:10:14Oh, yes, aye.
00:10:15And you're...
00:10:16You know, she'll be like, oh, do you want to go to the pier?
00:10:18Do you just want to go down and, you know, have a look or just to see?
00:10:22And she'll...
00:10:23No.
00:10:24I'll say aye, okay.
00:10:25I'll never say no.
00:10:26We can't.
00:10:27You know.
00:10:28And we do.
00:10:29She went down, she'll put a dairy set of scarf on the...
00:10:32On the gate.
00:10:33And she writes their name on it.
00:10:35You know.
00:10:36And then she goes, can we go back down there and make sure that scarf's still there?
00:10:40You know.
00:10:42What...
00:10:43What do you reckon she makes of it?
00:10:47I don't know.
00:10:48I've never...
00:10:49You know, she knows it's hard.
00:10:51She...
00:10:52Like, she misses them.
00:10:53She'll tell you...
00:10:54You know, she misses...
00:10:55She misses the fact that she had two big brothers and they're not here.
00:10:59You know.
00:11:00She goes, that's not fair that they got to know me but I didn't get to know them.
00:11:04And I went, but you do know them.
00:11:06Because they're basically you.
00:11:09Hmm.
00:11:10Is the house covered in...
00:11:12Not covered.
00:11:13I do have...
00:11:14I'm not that morbid.
00:11:18Are there photographs everywhere?
00:11:22In my hall.
00:11:23I've got photographs in the hall of them.
00:11:25And that's...
00:11:26And maybe two in the lovely room and then that's it.
00:11:28But it's...
00:11:29It's not a shrine.
00:11:30Was that a decision as well?
00:11:32Well, it's photos that was there anyway.
00:11:34You know.
00:11:35It's photos that I had.
00:11:36I just never took them down.
00:11:38Hmm.
00:11:39You know.
00:11:40And it's photos that...
00:11:41Some photos have been taken away and she's been in their place.
00:11:45Hmm.
00:11:46You know, but there's still some photos there.
00:11:49To let her know that they're still...
00:11:51They're still part of our family.
00:11:52We still talk about them.
00:12:00What's the...
00:12:01Journey...
00:12:05From that...
00:12:07Moment like?
00:12:09Very hard.
00:12:11Very hard.
00:12:12You know, you exist.
00:12:14You don't love.
00:12:15You exist.
00:12:16You know.
00:12:17From a busy household to...
00:12:20You're on your own.
00:12:22With a four month old baby.
00:12:24The person that you want to talk to is no longer there.
00:12:27The person that you want to give you a hug.
00:12:30To tell you everything's going to be okay.
00:12:32Is no longer there.
00:12:33You know.
00:12:34You think that can be your partner.
00:12:36Or your mum.
00:12:37Or your mum.
00:12:38But when the two of them's gone.
00:12:39You're left standing going, what do I do?
00:12:41Who do I turn to?
00:12:42Who do I talk to?
00:12:43You know.
00:12:44You're left...
00:12:45You're left talking to a four month old baby.
00:12:48Crying in the middle of the night or whatever.
00:12:50Yeah.
00:12:51Sometimes I didn't sleep.
00:12:52I walked the floors.
00:12:57How important was the...
00:13:02Were the three or four days of...
00:13:06Grieving before they were buried?
00:13:08That was hard.
00:13:10Because the house didn't empty.
00:13:12Like there was...
00:13:13Thousands of people came.
00:13:15They pay their respects.
00:13:17The house never emptied.
00:13:18You know.
00:13:19We didn't get a chance to...
00:13:21To breathe.
00:13:22You know.
00:13:23If there wasn't people and there was media.
00:13:25Trying to take pictures.
00:13:26You know.
00:13:28It was tough going.
00:13:30You know.
00:13:31You felt like you had no privacy.
00:13:33You were just invaded.
00:13:35With people trying to take pictures of the coffins.
00:13:39You know.
00:13:41It was hard.
00:13:42And were you aware of that?
00:13:44Yeah.
00:13:45Can you talk to me about those feelings and what they're like?
00:13:50Tough.
00:13:52They're heart-wrenching.
00:13:55They're sick.
00:13:57You want to throw up.
00:13:59You don't want to let them go.
00:14:01You just want to keep them forever.
00:14:04You can't.
00:14:05That lad has to go in that coffin at some stage.
00:14:08And that's...
00:14:09That's the bit you don't want to do.
00:14:13Taking them to the cemetery is...
00:14:15It's terrible.
00:14:17You don't want to leave the cemetery then.
00:14:19Like it's hard having a wake for one.
00:14:22But when you're having a wake for five.
00:14:24It's a different story.
00:14:26This is exactly what you know.
00:14:32Did you...
00:14:33Choose everybody's clothes?
00:14:35I did.
00:14:36I did.
00:14:37What did you put them in?
00:14:38I put them in their Derry city rugs.
00:14:41Of course.
00:14:42Had to be they're red and white.
00:14:47And your mam and your sister.
00:14:49Yeah, I puck up a nice dress for my mum, my sister, and my mum had a nice skirting top.
00:14:56Were you in the room when they closed the coffins?
00:15:00Yeah. Yes.
00:15:08Do you remember what you did?
00:15:10I gave them a kiss.
00:15:14Told them night-night.
00:15:19All of them?
00:15:20Yeah.
00:15:25Yeah, it was hard.
00:15:28But I had to.
00:15:32Are you apart from Rena much now?
00:15:34No, only when she's at school.
00:15:36She's nearly stuck to my side.
00:15:40What do you think of... I know you feel the guilt.
00:15:43Yes.
00:15:44What do you think of that?
00:15:50What do you think about feeling guilty?
00:15:54I feel guilty every day and then I feel guilty for feeling guilty because of Rena.
00:15:58You know, I just feel guilty for going away, for being away.
00:16:04Because I go, you know, it might not have happened if I had been there.
00:16:08You know, but then you have to stop and tell yourself that what's happened's happened and you can't change it.
00:16:14And you can't feel guilty forever.
00:16:16You know, at some stage you have to draw a line and say, you know.
00:16:22And be brave.
00:16:23And be brave.
00:16:24And be brave.
00:16:25And go.
00:16:26Yeah, enough's enough.
00:16:28This is me.
00:16:29This is my new chapter.
00:16:31So it's ten years now in March.
00:16:34And I'm doing a charity event.
00:16:38The charity event is in Boncana.
00:16:41So it's a walk.
00:16:42It's going to start at the park where they were last playing.
00:16:45Where they were last having fun.
00:16:47And it's going to go over towards the RNLI station.
00:16:50And the RNLI men are going to have the booked out and let people see what they actually do in remembrance of them.
00:17:01The money that I raise is going towards the RNLI.
00:17:05This is the...
00:17:07I want to celebrate their life.
00:17:09Celebrate them in the walk and a gala ball.
00:17:14I'm doing a gala ball in Everleton Hotel.
00:17:17And the money that I raise is all going to the RNLI.
00:17:22Do you think it's possible to have a bit of crack at something like that?
00:17:28Of course, yeah.
00:17:30I don't want it to be doom and gloom.
00:17:32You know, I'm definitely not a doom and gloom person.
00:17:35You know, I do like to have a bit of crack.
00:17:38I'll cry when I go home.
00:17:39You know, I'll bawl my eyes out for having a bit of crack.
00:17:42But of course, yes.
00:17:43You know, I do like a bit of fun.
00:17:47How about dating?
00:17:50Well, that hasn't taken off yet.
00:17:55With a big yet.
00:17:57Maybe someday.
00:18:01You're just getting yourself organised.
00:18:07Oh, maybe I'm a wee bit too much for someone.
00:18:10Too much baggage.
00:18:14No, but your body has...
00:18:18needs.
00:18:20Do you mean?
00:18:21Yeah.
00:18:22She's a good person.
00:18:23Yes.
00:18:24You know, um...
00:18:25Yeah, of course.
00:18:26You want to meet someone.
00:18:28Of course you do.
00:18:29You know, I don't want Rena growing up and saying,
00:18:32I'm going to get my mum a cat.
00:18:34You know, because she's on her own.
00:18:37Don't want to be on my own forever.
00:18:39You know, I want her to be...
00:18:41To know that life is about having someone there.
00:18:45Being in a relationship with someone.
00:18:49Yes, of course.
00:18:50Do people ask you advice about grief?
00:18:56Sometimes, yeah.
00:18:58But I can't give...
00:19:00I can't give them that answer.
00:19:02I know.
00:19:03Everybody grieves in different ways.
00:19:04At different stages.
00:19:06You know, all I can say is just be patient.
00:19:09Be patient with somebody that's grieving.
00:19:14You know, you think the first...
00:19:16Everybody thinks the first year's the hardest.
00:19:18It's not.
00:19:19That's the easiest.
00:19:21For me, it was...
00:19:23The second and third.
00:19:25The reality of...
00:19:27You know, everybody getting back to normal.
00:19:29And then no longer being involved in people's lives.
00:19:33You know.
00:19:35They're friends still calling to me.
00:19:37They're amazing.
00:19:38They're wee friends.
00:19:39They're mommies.
00:19:40Should all be so proud of them.
00:19:41Because they're amazing.
00:19:42You know, they still call in and check on me and check on Reina.
00:19:46And they're so lovely.
00:19:48And they tell me that they're memorable.
00:19:50I'll live on forever with them.
00:19:52How remarkable.
00:19:53I don't want anybody to forget them.
00:19:55How old are these young fellas now?
00:19:57Because how old are...
00:19:58Well, some of them would have been eight at the time.
00:20:00And some of them would have been twelve.
00:20:02So Evan's friends would have been eight.
00:20:04Mark's friends would have been twelve.
00:20:06So now you have, like, eighteen to twenty-two-year-olds.
00:20:09Eighteen and twenty-two-year-olds coming into me.
00:20:11With tattoos.
00:20:12And driving their cars.
00:20:13And their girlfriends.
00:20:15All tell me.
00:20:16They all look what I've done.
00:20:17And say, like, when they do something, they come on to get my approval.
00:20:20You know.
00:20:21But they're amazing.
00:20:22You know.
00:20:23And Jodie's friends as well.
00:20:24You know, I see Jodie's friends and they want to meet me for coffee.
00:20:27And they might chat to me.
00:20:29They might talk to me about the fundraising.
00:20:31They want to get involved.
00:20:32They're like, right, is there a Facebook?
00:20:34You know.
00:20:35And there is.
00:20:36Yes.
00:20:37The Bunkranapier tragedy.
00:20:40That's the Facebook page and the Instagram page.
00:20:43For donations.
00:20:44If anybody wants to go on and support us with the foundation.
00:20:48I just want to raise as much awareness for the RNLI.
00:20:52And Mark and Evan and Jodie's friends are helping with that.
00:20:56And they're remarkable.
00:20:57They're amazing.
00:20:58You know.
00:20:59And I love seeing them.
00:21:01What did you write on their tombstones?
00:21:05I wrote all.
00:21:06Well, it's quite a big one.
00:21:08Is it one big one?
00:21:09Yeah.
00:21:10They're all in together.
00:21:11So, my mum and Jodie's on one side and Sean and the two boys are on the other.
00:21:16And then I had a girl in between.
00:21:19I had a baby daughter in between the two boys.
00:21:22And she is now in with the boys and her dad.
00:21:26She died 17 hours after she was born with fluid in the lungs.
00:21:31So, I have a wee prayer.
00:21:32I have the angel of God prayer on their headstone.
00:21:37Because we said that every night before we went to bed.
00:21:40How does that go?
00:21:41Very really.
00:21:42Angel of God, my guardian dear, to whom God's love commits me here.
00:21:47Ever this day be at my side.
00:21:49To light and guard, to rule and guide.
00:21:51Amen.
00:21:52Yeah.
00:21:53So, that's on their headstone.
00:21:57What was your daughter's name?
00:22:02Oh, Jessica.
00:22:04It's too easy a thing to say.
00:22:11I hope that there is, that you can leave a lot of stuff behind you.
00:22:23Yeah.
00:22:24That the 10 years thing is alright.
00:22:27It's nearly like, I wanted to be, you know, I wanted to be a celebration of their life.
00:22:34You know, and thank every individual that was there that night that helped.
00:22:41You know, there's so many of them that I don't know.
00:22:44And I want them to know that I'm grateful.
00:22:46I want them to know that, you know, I appreciate everything that they did.
00:22:51And for me, this is, it's 10 years.
00:22:55And I do want to do, you know, the fundraising.
00:22:59But it's nearly like, this is the closing of a chapter.
00:23:03And open up a new chapter with me and Reina.
00:23:06And it's like a fresh start.
00:23:08In a way, no, we'll never move on, but we can move forward.
00:23:13What date in March is the walk?
00:23:18The anniversary is the 20th.
00:23:21And the walk we're doing is on Sunday the 22nd at 11 o'clock at the park in Boncana.
00:23:31And then on Friday the 8th of May, which is my mum's birthday, that's when I'm doing my gala ball in Everington Hotel.
00:23:40So I don't know really what you were thinking in terms of coming on to the show, but I just want to thank you very much for being so open and talking to me about what happened.
00:24:07I know this is my first ever interview.
00:24:11I've never done one before.
00:24:13This is the first time I've spoke publicly about it.
00:24:16I talk about it all the time.
00:24:17You know, I talk to friends and family and, you know, people who ask.
00:24:21If people ask me, I'll openly talk about it.
00:24:24No, I'm not afraid.
00:24:25People think if they bring it up they're upsetting me, but, you know, they're not.
00:24:30But, you know, I actually don't mind.
00:24:33I like knowing that I've helped people.
00:24:36Some people say, you know, you've helped me, you're three.
00:24:38And that's nice to know.
00:24:39You know, but the whole reason for me doing this was to promote the fact that I want to make as much awareness for the RNLI as possible in Boncranet.
00:24:51OK.
00:24:52Yeah.
00:24:53Thanks, Louise.
00:24:54Thank you so much.
00:25:15Welcome back to the second half, everybody.
00:25:17Freddie, who's next?
00:25:18Tommy.
00:25:19Our next guests are Cormac and Brandon O'Biogli.
00:25:34Now, you're a man I often think of.
00:25:40Good way or bad way?
00:25:42Well, in a very inspirational way.
00:25:44Yeah.
00:25:45I'd be very inspired by you, Brandon, and your attitude to life.
00:25:50And the last time I was talking to you, you were on with Seamus.
00:25:54But I think after that I bumped into you somewhere and you were just about to drive across Mongolia in an old banger of a car.
00:26:03There's something about the attitude of saying yes to things, though, that's very inspiring.
00:26:11Did you get any of that?
00:26:14Well, I'm here.
00:26:16What could be more dangerous than this?
00:26:21So for people who don't know, you're father and son.
00:26:24Are you a good dad, do you reckon?
00:26:27I'm full of faults.
00:26:30I've made mistakes.
00:26:32I might have been too hard at times.
00:26:34I wish there wasn't.
00:26:35And I just gave it my best shot.
00:26:39I gave it my best shot.
00:26:44I made mistakes.
00:26:45Everybody makes mistakes.
00:26:46Yeah.
00:26:47And...
00:26:53When did...
00:26:55This isn't a therapy session, but I could wake over it.
00:26:59Was there...
00:27:00When did you realise that you'd be able to work with your dad?
00:27:05Um...
00:27:08Work with him...
00:27:11I don't know.
00:27:12I don't really see music as work.
00:27:13Like...
00:27:14I kind of grew up with it.
00:27:15Um...
00:27:16But I guess working on...
00:27:17I suppose the TV programme, She In The Middle East.
00:27:20And...
00:27:21That's a bit...
00:27:22That's kind of work, I suppose.
00:27:23But...
00:27:24Um...
00:27:25I guess when I was asked, he was very excited to work with him.
00:27:27And...
00:27:28Like...
00:27:29Like...
00:27:30The question you asked him...
00:27:31How...
00:27:32Uh...
00:27:33How he was as a father.
00:27:34Like...
00:27:35I'd say I'm probably in the best position to ask that.
00:27:37Answer that, maybe.
00:27:38Um...
00:27:39But...
00:27:40He's a great father.
00:27:41And...
00:27:42Uh...
00:27:43Great musician, singer.
00:27:44Very loving.
00:27:45He did his best for all of us.
00:27:46And...
00:27:47Uh...
00:27:48Learned a lot from him.
00:27:49And...
00:27:50I wouldn't be here without him.
00:27:51Like, in terms of music, what I'm doing...
00:27:53Uh...
00:27:54In my life.
00:27:55So...
00:27:56Yeah, I'm very grateful to be...
00:27:58To be born into the family I have been.
00:28:00What...
00:28:01What have you learned from him?
00:28:02Um...
00:28:04Music and honesty, I think.
00:28:06I think that connection.
00:28:08And...
00:28:09How he...
00:28:10Um...
00:28:11How he plays.
00:28:12He's a very emotional player.
00:28:13And a very honest player.
00:28:14And...
00:28:15Um...
00:28:16I've grown up with him playing.
00:28:18And...
00:28:19I literally wake up in the morning to hear him playing the accordion for years.
00:28:22And then I'd go down and I'd associate that with how he was.
00:28:25It was formless.
00:28:27So I can tell what form my dad's in just by playing a few notes.
00:28:31There was one time I came home from the Hillgrove, the nightclub in Lingle.
00:28:34Came in late.
00:28:35And I could hear my dad playing.
00:28:37And I went down the hallway and I looked into two holes in the door in the kitchen.
00:28:42And I knew from the millisecond I walked in the door that he was crying.
00:28:45And playing.
00:28:46So I walked in.
00:28:47And sure enough looked in and he was playing in the air and streaming.
00:28:51So...
00:28:52Crying.
00:28:53So there's a...
00:28:54There's a big...
00:28:55Like there's a lot of honesty in the man.
00:28:56And...
00:28:57I kind of grew up in that.
00:28:58Um...
00:28:59And I learned that from him.
00:29:00I think.
00:29:01Um...
00:29:02I've learned a lot more from him as well as I can...
00:29:04But...
00:29:05How long have we got?
00:29:06Any practical things like fixing punctures or...
00:29:09Bleeding radiators.
00:29:12He hates my car.
00:29:13Oh, his car, don't you?
00:29:15He's one wiper.
00:29:17I should be...
00:29:18One wiper.
00:29:19Uh...
00:29:20You're driving at night.
00:29:21Um...
00:29:22The window steams up.
00:29:23You press the...
00:29:24You try to press the heater to clear the window.
00:29:27It takes five minutes to clear it.
00:29:28There was a bulb gone there last week.
00:29:30Um...
00:29:31Sticky seats.
00:29:32Sticky seats.
00:29:33So...
00:29:34You have no class, though.
00:29:38But the first priority of a car is to get you where you're going.
00:29:42She's never let me down.
00:29:43Yeah, yeah.
00:29:44That's my father's thing as well.
00:29:46A car is just to get you from A to B.
00:29:48That's all there is to it.
00:29:49Um...
00:29:50It's an interesting word to use in terms of music, isn't it?
00:29:52Honesty.
00:29:53In terms of a tune.
00:29:55Um...
00:29:56I'm very taken with that idea of...
00:29:58Uh...
00:30:01The full range of human emotions.
00:30:03Are...
00:30:06Can be found in a musical instrument.
00:30:09Yeah, they're in the tunes.
00:30:11Like, because...
00:30:12Tunes don't grow on trees.
00:30:14They come from people's...
00:30:16And people's experiences and composers.
00:30:18And...
00:30:19Musicians generally.
00:30:21Uh...
00:30:22The good ones are very sensitive.
00:30:23And...
00:30:24They put their...
00:30:25Heart and soul and their experiences into these tunes.
00:30:28And I see tunes as...
00:30:29They're kind of like blockchains.
00:30:30Like they...
00:30:31They capture...
00:30:32Um...
00:30:33They capture meanings.
00:30:34Uh...
00:30:35Feelings.
00:30:36And also historical events in them.
00:30:38And...
00:30:39I think the...
00:30:40The goal of an artist or musician or singer is to unlock that meaning.
00:30:44And to apply it.
00:30:45Like...
00:30:46We play...
00:30:47Lots of old tunes.
00:30:48But to apply that to...
00:30:49Nowadays.
00:30:50And to your own experiences.
00:30:51And...
00:30:52Um...
00:30:53That's why it's...
00:30:54It lasts...
00:30:55As long as it has.
00:30:56Yeah.
00:30:57Is there a...
00:30:58A living...
00:30:59For you in the music, Cormac?
00:31:00There is.
00:31:01Yeah.
00:31:02Yeah.
00:31:03How...
00:31:04How do you put that together?
00:31:05Um...
00:31:06Well...
00:31:07To make a living...
00:31:08Uh...
00:31:09In...
00:31:10Traditional music anyway.
00:31:11I think...
00:31:12The main way to do is to play solo.
00:31:13So...
00:31:14I play...
00:31:15I play gigs.
00:31:16I play...
00:31:17At this stage I'm playing about...
00:31:18Doing 10-20 gigs a year.
00:31:20Um...
00:31:21Ireland and internationally.
00:31:22I play...
00:31:23I think...
00:31:24Well I play in different projects.
00:31:26Um...
00:31:27Play with...
00:31:28Play duets and...
00:31:29And trios and...
00:31:30Um...
00:31:31The family.
00:31:32Myself and...
00:31:33My dad and my sister Clina are recording.
00:31:34At the moment.
00:31:35Um...
00:31:36But it's mostly solo.
00:31:37To make a living...
00:31:38From it.
00:31:39Doesn't sound like an awful lot of gigs in fairness.
00:31:40Does it 10 or 20?
00:31:41No but...
00:31:42At this stage...
00:31:43In terms of a living and in terms of you know...
00:31:44Um...
00:31:45Yeah well it's kind of supplemented as well.
00:31:46Cause at...
00:31:47At home in...
00:31:48In Dingle.
00:31:49I got a...
00:31:50I bought a guest house two years ago.
00:31:51And I'm...
00:31:52Setting that up as a school.
00:31:53Like a week long courses and...
00:31:55Various...
00:31:56Um...
00:31:57Instruments or dancing or...
00:31:59Music.
00:32:00And...
00:32:01I've artist residency there as well.
00:32:03So...
00:32:04I spent about 14 years on the road.
00:32:06Playing.
00:32:07Like in various different...
00:32:08Like...
00:32:09Projects.
00:32:10Um...
00:32:11At this stage...
00:32:12Less is more.
00:32:13And...
00:32:14Um...
00:32:15I have to mind...
00:32:16The love for the...
00:32:18Music.
00:32:19And the playing.
00:32:20Cause overdoing it.
00:32:21Um...
00:32:22I was at a...
00:32:23At a point where I was probably playing too much.
00:32:25And losing the...
00:32:26Losing the...
00:32:27To grow for it.
00:32:28So...
00:32:29Trying to...
00:32:30Trying to keep the core of it.
00:32:31Sometimes you might overbook...
00:32:33A tour.
00:32:34Um...
00:32:35And...
00:32:36Maybe sometimes you come off the stage and you're like...
00:32:39You're getting through it.
00:32:40Like...
00:32:41Yeah.
00:32:42Going through the motions.
00:32:43On some level.
00:32:44But like...
00:32:45I'd rather...
00:32:46Do...
00:32:47Three or four really good gigs.
00:32:48Than...
00:32:49To do...
00:32:50Twenty gigs.
00:32:51And...
00:32:52Yeah.
00:32:53Yeah.
00:32:54Totally.
00:32:55Those kind of tours can be relentless.
00:32:56And...
00:32:57Yeah.
00:32:58If you don't really...
00:32:59Feel that tune.
00:33:00Like...
00:33:01I mean...
00:33:02Unless you're really hard...
00:33:03Hard up.
00:33:04And you need the money.
00:33:05You're prepared for the heart first.
00:33:08And I think...
00:33:10The...
00:33:11The money will follow.
00:33:12If you...
00:33:13If you stick with that.
00:33:14That all sounds...
00:33:15Um...
00:33:17Ideal.
00:33:18And...
00:33:19Attractive.
00:33:20How does it tie into...
00:33:23Paying bills?
00:33:24I think...
00:33:25You cut your cloth.
00:33:26I think...
00:33:27I...
00:33:28I lived in a campervan.
00:33:29In Galway for about seven, eight years.
00:33:30Toured around Payne.
00:33:31In a campervan.
00:33:32Whereabouts did you park up?
00:33:34On campus.
00:33:35What?
00:33:36On campus.
00:33:37Outside the Crane Bar.
00:33:38Really?
00:33:39You did...
00:33:40Seven years of that?
00:33:41I did, yeah.
00:33:42I did.
00:33:43Can you describe the...
00:33:44The back of the campervan to me?
00:33:48Well...
00:33:49Er...
00:33:50It was a...
00:33:51It's an old British Railway.
00:33:52Short wheelbase.
00:33:53High roof.
00:33:54Four transit.
00:33:55And so it had a bit of electrics in the back.
00:33:57So I had a Birko in the back of it.
00:33:58For the hot water bottle.
00:34:00I had a...
00:34:01I had...
00:34:02I had...
00:34:03I had...
00:34:04I had a microwave.
00:34:05And I had a...
00:34:06An electric blanket.
00:34:07I feel like I was paying it forward.
00:34:09Like you...
00:34:10Like you live for very little.
00:34:11Yeah, yeah.
00:34:12And...
00:34:13Save money.
00:34:14And then...
00:34:15Yeah.
00:34:16And I'm sure Dad was proud of it.
00:34:18But what did...
00:34:19What did Mum think?
00:34:22Mum...
00:34:23Isn't a fan of...
00:34:24Dad's car.
00:34:26Or my...
00:34:27Or my type of campervan.
00:34:28Like...
00:34:29Er...
00:34:30Um...
00:34:31You separated...
00:34:32Did you yourself and...
00:34:33Yes.
00:34:34And...
00:34:35And Cormac's mum.
00:34:36We did.
00:34:37And we're still good friends.
00:34:38Right.
00:34:39And I think if you really love your children...
00:34:40You'll be good to their mother or their father.
00:34:42Mmm...
00:34:43That...
00:34:44That...
00:34:45That...
00:34:46That was...
00:34:47The golden rule number one with me.
00:34:48And things I...
00:34:49I simply let go.
00:34:50Er...
00:34:51Was...
00:34:52Er...
00:34:53Was it more important for me to show that I love my children.
00:34:54So...
00:34:55I mean...
00:34:56The best way to do that is to be good to their...
00:34:57Father or their mother.
00:34:58Simple enough I think.
00:35:00But easier said than done.
00:35:04Looks good.
00:35:05Erm...
00:35:06Will you play me a tune?
00:35:07I'd love to, yeah.
00:35:08Yeah.
00:35:09Whatever flows out of you.
00:35:10Yeah, we'll do the tunes, yeah.
00:35:11Yeah.
00:35:13What are you doing?
00:35:14What are you doing?
00:35:15What are you doing?
00:35:16What are you doing?
00:35:17Oh yeah.
00:35:18Oh yeah.
00:35:19This song was written...
00:35:21In 1880.
00:35:22There are 13 verses...
00:35:23At least one or two.
00:35:25And...
00:35:26It was a celebration of a Naivóig...
00:35:28From...
00:35:29The Great Basket that won a regatta in Ventry.
00:35:31And...
00:35:32Erm...
00:35:33People use the Irish language now...
00:35:36Use Irish words for being cool.
00:35:38That time they used English words for being cool.
00:35:40So they were so happy with the boat.
00:35:42The Naivóig, they called it the beauty.
00:35:44The beauty dance they know it.
00:35:45Mm.
00:35:46Mm.
00:35:47Mm.
00:35:48Mm.
00:35:49Mm.
00:35:50Mm.
00:35:51Mm.
00:35:52Mm.
00:35:54Mm.
00:35:55Mm.
00:35:59Mm.
00:36:00Mm.
00:36:01Mm.
00:36:12Yeah.
00:36:13ready to draw star that in the cool godless you hold the gym all the head
00:36:28I don't know
00:36:33Oh
00:36:35Lord hello
00:36:39Oh
00:36:41Oh
00:36:43Oh
00:36:45Oh
00:36:47Oh
00:36:49Go down those
00:36:53Satsang with Mooji
00:37:23Satsang with Mooji
00:37:53Satsang with Mooji
00:38:23It clashes with the way we're living
00:38:25There's something about that that is
00:38:29It feels
00:38:31I was imagining a fella
00:38:37Listened to something like that
00:38:39And then tried to go into an office
00:38:40Do you know what I'm trying to say?
00:38:43That there's something that that music is suggestive of
00:38:46another way of being in the world or something?
00:38:50Well, without a doubt, it's from the land.
00:38:53That's from the sea and the land.
00:38:56And whatever I have, I learned from the people before me.
00:39:00And Cormac was inspired by his neighbours and by me.
00:39:03And that's how it's that's the natural way.
00:39:08Hmm.
00:39:09Can you tell me about the time after
00:39:12Seamus passed and how you traveled through that as a family?
00:39:20Well, it is very difficult when you lose a sibling.
00:39:23And I lost my brother John in 2000 and 15.
00:39:27He was 62 and then Seamus when he was 73.
00:39:33And recently, I lost my sister.
00:39:35She was 74.
00:39:37But I'm at that stage of life.
00:39:39I do my crying.
00:39:40I do my emotion.
00:39:42And I, I just get through it.
00:39:45I was born in an island that that
00:39:49faced birth and death in almost the same way.
00:39:53Your first breath and your last breath, your life is that between those two breaths.
00:39:58And I just it's a natural part of life.
00:40:01And without accepting it, I think you that's where the problem starts.
00:40:09Because you're kind of prioritizing your own pain.
00:40:12You just have to let the pain live it and play your way to run your way to swim your way to it and just accept it.
00:40:19It does nothing.
00:40:20It's, it's, it's, it's the most natural thing in the world.
00:40:23Again, easier said than done.
00:40:26Do you go for checkups and stuff like that?
00:40:28Like, did they, did they, did they pass the similar things or was it, or was it?
00:40:32Every year I go for my NCT.
00:40:34If you do it with your old car, why would you do it yourself?
00:40:36And so far so good anyway.
00:40:38Yeah, I look forward to your doctor's report that says there's only one wiper working and the seat is a bit sticky.
00:40:48You open two eyes, there's only one light, one full light going.
00:40:54Will you play me another tune?
00:40:56I'd love to, yeah.
00:40:57We will, yeah, yeah.
00:40:58We'll play three pokers.
00:40:59Please.
00:41:00Three pokers from West Kerry.
00:41:02The first one is called We Won't Go Home in the Morning.
00:41:04Got that from Pa Den Biog.
00:41:06And the second one, Downies.
00:41:08And then the third one.
00:41:09For Maureach.
00:41:10Maureach.
00:41:11Yeah, yeah.
00:41:12And the third one called Nellie.
00:41:13Yeah.
00:41:14Yeah.
00:41:15Yeah.
00:41:16Yeah.
00:41:20Yeah.
00:41:22Yeah.
00:41:24Yeah.
00:41:25Yeah.
00:41:26Yeah.
00:41:27Yeah.
00:41:28Yeah.
00:41:29Yeah.
00:41:30Yeah.
00:41:31Yeah.
00:41:32Yeah.
00:41:33Yeah.
00:41:34Yeah.
00:45:24These days.
00:45:26My father is my father's brother's daughter.
00:45:27That's it.
00:45:29How are they all not alone?
00:45:30Yeah.
00:45:32Yeah.
00:45:33We're all good.
00:45:35get anything from being a Tiernan. One of the things I get from the Tiernans is their sense
00:45:45of sociability. So our, so your dad, my dad, that elder kind of tribe of five, what I am
00:45:56very inspired by in terms of them is the ability to be social, the ability to have pints with
00:46:03one another, the ability to tell stories. So that's the thing that I'm very, that I feel
00:46:10part of or something like that. I'm just curious, is there, do you get the same?
00:46:14I'm not the same kind of storyteller as you. So I don't think that's coming through for me
00:46:20as evidently, but I think it's the, the weirdness and the abstractness and the alternative oblique
00:46:31point of view that would, you know, be expressed in my, what I do.
00:46:37So I, I always thought that I had got that from my mother. So it's interesting to say that,
00:46:44no, it's, it's, you think it's on the Tiernan side as well. I always thought that my mother
00:46:48was, my father was the social creature and that me mother was the dark whip of strangeness.
00:46:55That could be true, but I think it's probably, it can be on both sides. Yeah. Um, cause I
00:47:01have a, a kind of a, on my mother's side, which you don't have, a kind of a, a political kind
00:47:14of self-righteousness that some, I guess maybe it's sometimes it's good in comedy. Maybe it's
00:47:20a bit too much sometimes as well, but. Just so the people know they're from Cork. They're
00:47:25from Cork. So that might be explanation. Well, yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. My mother
00:47:30is still furious that she left Cork 40 years later. Yeah. I think you've got a very peculiar
00:47:41type of intelligence, a kind of a fearless, uh, that I, that I don't see so much, like when
00:47:53we're yapping, it's you're just social and you're, you're the crack, but in your standup,
00:47:59a kind of a kind of, I'm not going to play down to the audience. Oh yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah.
00:48:08You know that I'm, I'm a really smart woman. And if you don't get these jokes, I don't really
00:48:15feel too bad about that. That was my sense of watching you. Right. Yeah. Yeah. How is
00:48:21the, that's the self-righteousness though, that I'm kind of, uh, alluding to. Yeah. Um, so
00:48:29your story in, in standup is interesting to me in that you decided at a particular time,
00:48:38okay, I am for whatever reasons, I don't know, but I'm, I'm going to move to London and I'm
00:48:43going to work the circuit there. There's any amount of gigs, uh, any amount of travel, but
00:48:48there's any amount of gigs. Yeah. Um, how is all that? So the circuit in the UK, it's bloody
00:48:56brilliant. You can work and you can go into rooms and, uh, be on with some of the talent
00:49:06and the intelligence that you're talking about. Uh, I get to be on bills with some of the,
00:49:13like the best talent in the world. And it's just brilliant to be holding my own in that
00:49:19world. And, uh, I, you know, I, I have nights where, you know, I do sets in the comedy store,
00:49:29the comedy store, central London, you know, there's no, like you couldn't, you wouldn't
00:49:36be asking. It's like a high speed broadband in terms of the electricity in the room and
00:49:41with the crowd. Uh, and, uh, I come off and you might have another gig to go to straight
00:49:48away afterwards. And you're walking through the tube station and you just feel like I'm
00:49:55fucking here in this city. No, but you can't say I wasn't here tonight. I fucking did it.
00:50:00I laid it out and it's just the, like, and I, I, I'm going over the top here because I,
00:50:06I think the club comedy circuit is kind of maligned in a way. And it's because in a sense,
00:50:12it doesn't, it's an outsider of the whole, the thing we talk about a lot, which is the economy
00:50:18and the neoliberal kind of whole circus and funneling that happens to comedians, which
00:50:25is where you go and you build your own brand and you're selling out shows everywhere. And
00:50:29that's the, the high thing. But I think the club comedy circuit is, it's a very psychologically
00:50:34healthy space. So it's more anarchic. It's an art. Yes, it is. Yeah. There's, there's more
00:50:39that can happen. And, uh, and I guess in the UK, whatever you say about it, it's very politically
00:50:46alive. And, uh, it's, uh, I think that fearlessness is, is all around me over there. And I'm, I,
00:50:56you know, it's, it's there to be come, come with us, come over and do more club comedy gigs.
00:51:01Is it, um, is it demanding in terms of travel and money and no pension and you only get paid
00:51:12if you get on the train to Cardiff? Absolutely. Yeah. The rewards are not there in terms of,
00:51:18you know, comfort or, you know, future planning for yourself. But yeah, I guess, you know, that's
00:51:26the world where, uh, the world is changing and all that stuff is happening in every aspect
00:51:32of life. Uh, so we're not kind of different there, but. And so that there's, you're not
00:51:37going to be saving money. Absolutely not. No, no. So it's, you kind of have to really enjoy
00:51:43it and love it if you're, if you're going to do it and get your goods that way. I, but
00:51:49actually since I started doing, so I, um, went and did a master's, uh, uh, to kind of change
00:51:58things up and be like, introduce new, uh, reading and stuff into, uh, what I was looking at.
00:52:05And, um, I think I probably do see like more just myself doing more of that because of what
00:52:13you're talking about, but, uh, it has actually made me like just realise and appreciate the
00:52:20comedy circuit an awful lot more. Just the very fact, because actually when I went into
00:52:25the master's was in sustainability and I was, the whole thing was like, oh, this is
00:52:29unsustainable. So it made a lot of sense in the end. And it wasn't a master's with a view
00:52:36to getting employment as a sustain abiliter. No, I wasn't really, I mean, I couldn't even go into,
00:52:45you know, uh, kind of a company now and be their sustainability manager. You know, it wouldn't be,
00:52:52uh, uh, it just wouldn't work really. I don't think, but, uh, I think I, I, it has definitely given
00:53:00me a new, I guess, point of view on the world. And, uh, um, yeah, it, it, it, it, it, it's
00:53:11gave me like the, the answers to a lot of the questions I had about like, what the hell
00:53:15is happening here? So, uh, so what is happening? So, um, our whole society, uh, is caught up
00:53:25in this paradigm of neoliberal trying to extract, extract, extract from the ground and the trees
00:53:34and the animals. And, um, I don't, I don't believe until we get right with the natural
00:53:39world, we're going to be able to, we're going to keep doing the same thing.
00:53:44I get that. Yeah. Yeah, totally. Why do you use the phrase neoliberal? Is there a definition
00:53:51of it? There's, it's, yeah, but it's long. Go on, sorry. Yeah. So it's like you have capitalism
00:54:00and then that capitalism is fine because it can operate in discrete small ways. But neoliberalism
00:54:09is like taking over everything and it wants to interact with yourself and change yourself
00:54:15so that you are in and under it. And the system is so big that you'd wonder how to act against
00:54:24it. Yeah. But that idea of the type of standup that world that you operate in is where it's
00:54:37not about people turning themselves into a product because they're, nobody knows who they are in
00:54:42a sense. They are where they are tonight. This is not part of a career move in a sense.
00:54:51It's, uh, I get that. Um, what do you find yourself writing jokes about?
00:55:01I actually like probably I'm funniest about, uh, like very mundane stuff. Uh, I, yeah, like
00:55:15household bits and just the frustration of that. I think it goes against because, you know,
00:55:21I kind of, here I am on television talking about neoliberalism, but you know, if I, you know,
00:55:26go on about the grade of cardboard in the box of the washing powder and how that's, you know,
00:55:31so good these days that actually, it's so good. Yeah. Yeah. They're getting stronger and stronger.
00:55:38I can't throw them out. That's the, yeah. Uh, just that kind of, uh, stuff that I guess I don't,
00:55:50I like, I think I'm kind of too good to be talking about, but actually that's, that's really funny,
00:55:55that stuff. And how do you feel then coming home to us in terms of the stimulation of England?
00:56:04And what have you noticed about the English that you'd kind of think, God, you're so unusual and you,
00:56:10you've no idea. It's really funny because when I do your show, you know,
00:56:14how do you support for you in the UK? Yeah. And the, uh, you know, there'd often be,
00:56:20I would think more Irish than English in the audience. And there is a sense in the room, I think,
00:56:27and I, I have this in my head, whether it's true or not, but that everybody in, in the room is an Irish person
00:56:35who's been holding stuff in that they wanted to say about England. But that you have, because you're an immigrant,
00:56:42you have to mind your manners a bit and, you know, be kind of go, okay, no, no, that's absolutely normal.
00:56:47You put water on the toast before you give it to me. That's, no, it's grand, it's grand.
00:56:52This kind of thing, uh, it's, it's a great feeling. And I, I, I like it as a show when we do it together
00:56:58because I do that thing, but then you're, you know, obviously doing, you know, the full set and everything.
00:57:05So that's brilliant. Do you, so what stereotypes do you think that they have of you?
00:57:10Yeah, they could, they probably think I'm, I'm very overwrought about religion. Uh, and yeah, that, um, uh, you know,
00:57:21if you, if you say you don't drink over there in an Irish accent, that's something that has to be explained.
00:57:30Wow. Do you still not drink? Yeah, I don't drink, no. How long are you off it now?
00:57:35I'm off, uh, I haven't drank in 18 years any alcohol. Yeah.
00:57:39Why did you give up the drink?
00:57:41I gave up the drink. I was sad. It was making me sad. And, uh, I, it was weird.
00:57:50I didn't know how else to, like, I had to take steps to get off the drink.
00:57:55In that, like, I just, I couldn't do it on my own. So I went to, you know, uh, uh, I went to meetings and, uh, yeah, acted on it.
00:58:08Hmm. Yeah.
00:58:11So I never had a sense of you of someone who's a problem drinker.
00:58:14See, it was all kind of internal, kind of, I never, like, was, you know, acted out.
00:58:20And that was a little hard, actually, when I went to meetings first, because I was comparing myself to people who, you know, had also were at the same, you know, um, struggle, you know, and trying to stop.
00:58:33And they, but like, they kind of maybe had wake up calls, like they had, uh, crashed a car or something like that, that, that kind of thing.
00:58:41And I, um, uh, would be kind of saying, but I'm not that, I didn't do that, you know, but it's, it's absolutely nothing to do with that.
00:58:49If you want to stop drinking, it's about your internal, how you feel about yourself. And is this impacting my mental health? And yeah.
00:58:58Yeah. Um, did it make sense to you when you, I don't know if you did, but standing up at a meeting and going, my name is Eleanor Tiernan and I'm an alcoholic.
00:59:07Did that, did that, so yeah, you've named it there now.
00:59:10Um, I, I had to work at that. Uh, and I wasn't sure I ever really got there, but yeah, I guess that was, the words are another step, aren't they?
00:59:22Like sitting in the room felt right. So that was, that was, that was enough.
00:59:29Hmm. Um, I have a, uh, a sense of you as well as, uh, there's no definition of you that is accurate.
00:59:45So sometimes, and sometimes people want identity. Sometimes people say, I'm a this or I'm a that.
00:59:52But the truth of their lives is, it's a lot, it's those categories.
00:59:58Yeah. Yeah.
00:59:59So I don't know when you came out as gay, maybe, what was that?
01:00:06Maybe 10 years ago or something or maybe a bit more.
01:00:09Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
01:00:10And the next time I met you then you were going out with the fella.
01:00:13Yeah.
01:00:14So what, what was that experience? What was that?
01:00:17Um, yeah, I felt just found it very hard to be, uh, uh, yeah, really land on something that made sense.
01:00:29Hmm.
01:00:30And I guess you're kind of presented with a few categories and line up in one of those.
01:00:36Hmm.
01:00:37And, you know, I was stressed about that for a very long time.
01:00:40And I said, well, I have to say something, you know, just to kind of move on and move forward.
01:00:45And, you know, whatever happens afterwards, at least it won't be inside me all the time.
01:00:50And just me on my own with this thing.
01:00:53So I kind of did it and, and, uh, spoke to people and, you know, uh, and, um, then, uh, yeah, just kind of went away then.
01:01:08It was all kind of.
01:01:10So can you talk to me about that a little bit?
01:01:15Just like that sense of having to say something in order to get beyond it.
01:01:20Yeah.
01:01:21So it was a, it was a declaration of, of what, of not being.
01:01:28I'm not being straight.
01:01:29I'm not straight.
01:01:30Yeah.
01:01:31Yeah.
01:01:32Yeah.
01:01:33But that was as far as I, I did go with it.
01:01:35You know, I was, uh, yeah, like you say, like, I, I do find it very difficult to say I am something.
01:01:44Hmm.
01:01:45In that sense, but also other senses as well.
01:01:48Uh, but, yeah.
01:01:51Did you, now, did you go home to Athlon and say, I have something to tell you?
01:01:55Yeah, I did.
01:01:56Yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:01:57And how did that go?
01:01:58Uh, they were delighted.
01:02:00Yeah.
01:02:01Yeah.
01:02:02They were like, you know, kind of going, where's the gate here?
01:02:04And then, bingo.
01:02:08Like, were they washing the dishes and, and they kind of went, oh, great.
01:02:14No, I kind of, yeah, no, I said, come into the sitting room and, uh, cause that's where things are said.
01:02:20And, uh, they came in and, um, I, I just, no, I just said, here, listen for a second.
01:02:31Here's some information.
01:02:34And, uh, they were just grand, like, yeah, fine, no bother.
01:02:41Were you, how did you feel about their reaction to it?
01:02:45I, yeah, no, maybe I felt like a little bit more of a struggle would have been, would have, would have honored my silence for, my decades of.
01:03:02Wow.
01:03:03Yeah.
01:03:04Yeah.
01:03:05Yeah.
01:03:06Was there, um, I bet you if John had said he was gay, there'd be a lot more of a fuss.
01:03:11Yeah.
01:03:12Well, that's true.
01:03:13That's just true.
01:03:14Oh, jeez.
01:03:17Yeah.
01:03:18No, my mother would have been out, you know, buying rainbow stuff.
01:03:23Um, what do you see yourself getting up to over the next while?
01:03:27Is it to decide on?
01:03:29I want to get up in the morning more.
01:03:31I want to just experience the morning and experience, uh, yeah, birds and, uh, as much nature as I can.
01:03:40And, you know, just, I feel that's really good for your head.
01:03:44Um.
01:03:45I'm not going to end this interview formally.
01:03:51Because we're blood-like, so.
01:03:54Yeah.
01:03:55I'll be talking to you.
01:03:58That's all from us this week, ladies and gentlemen.
01:04:01Thank you very much for watching.
01:04:05Did you tell mom and dad you were going to be on?
01:04:07No.
01:04:08No.
01:04:38No.
01:04:40No.
01:04:41Don't do it.
01:04:43No.
01:04:47No.
01:04:48No.
01:04:53No.
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