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00:01Juanita Perryman is suing her sister, Sherry Small,
00:06for vandalizing her property.
00:08Court, come to order.
00:09All rise.
00:12Have a seat, please.
00:13Judge, case 40-06, Perryman versus Small.
00:16You're welcome.
00:18Miss Perryman, the defendant is your sister?
00:21Yes.
00:21Older sister, younger sister?
00:22Older.
00:23You have children?
00:24Yes.
00:25How many?
00:25Three.
00:26How old are they?
00:2720, 22, and 16.
00:30Do any of them live with you?
00:32Yes, one.
00:32The 16-year-old?
00:33Yes.
00:34You have kids?
00:35Yes.
00:35How many?
00:36Six.
00:37How old are they?
00:38I have twins that are 18, 16, 15, 12, and two.
00:44Busy?
00:45Yes.
00:47Do they live with you?
00:48Yes.
00:48This is what I gather from your papers.
00:51Your husband passed away recently.
00:54Tell me when.
00:55In February of last year.
00:57Was it a sudden illness?
00:59Yeah, he had an asthma attack.
01:01How old was he?
01:0239.
01:03Did he have the asthma attack at work or would he?
01:05At home.
01:05What I gather from your papers is you were not comfortable,
01:08which is perfectly understandable,
01:10with going back into the house.
01:12Yes.
01:12For a while.
01:13At about the same time, your sister
01:16was in a relationship with somebody.
01:18Yes.
01:18And that wasn't going well.
01:20Yes.
01:21Your 16-year-old was, in fact, living with you.
01:23Yes.
01:24And this gentleman.
01:25Yes.
01:25And so you needed a place to live.
01:27Yes.
01:28According to your papers, you and your sister made an arrangement
01:32that she would move into your house.
01:34Yes.
01:35And according to you, take care of the bills.
01:37And you were going to be going where with your children?
01:40We had a family member.
01:41Our aunt was renting a place, and I moved in there for a short time.
01:44From when to when?
01:45I moved in in March of 2023, and...
01:50So right after your husband's death.
01:52Yes.
01:52And how long were you there?
01:53I stayed until August of 2023.
01:58And then where did you go?
01:59I went back to my house.
02:01House.
02:02Now, did you and your husband own that house?
02:04Yes.
02:05Did you make an arrangement with her for rent?
02:07Yes.
02:08And what was the rent?
02:09She was supposed to pay the $14.50 per month for rent, and utilities about $170 per month.
02:17Do you have a mortgage on the house?
02:18Yes.
02:19And did that $14.50 cover the mortgage and taxes?
02:22Yes.
02:23Now, when you were living with your male friend, were you living in his apartment?
02:27Yes.
02:28Who was paying the rent?
02:29He was.
02:30Do you work?
02:31Yes.
02:32What kind of work do you do?
02:33I'm a home health aide.
02:34Okay.
02:35Well, it seems that the situation seemed to deteriorate, according to the papers, after
02:40your sister moved into your home.
02:41Yes.
02:42And your lawsuit seeks damages for damages you allege that she caused to your home.
02:50Yes.
02:51And also non-payment of rent.
02:54Yes.
02:54Okay.
02:54So tell me, when did she move in?
02:57In March?
02:57Yes.
02:58Of 2023?
02:58Yes.
02:59And tell me about the rent.
03:01She lived there for how many months?
03:02So, she moved in in March, and she left in June.
03:09When she first moved in, she paid $1,000 versus the $1,450, and she said she was going to pay
03:17the remaining the next month, in April.
03:21She said that her check had been short.
03:22She had been shorted some hours with her client.
03:25And I said that was fine.
03:26She could just, you know, make up the next month.
03:28In April, it was the same thing.
03:30She said that her hours had been cut at work.
03:34She didn't have the full amount.
03:35Well, how much did she pay you in April?
03:37So let's...
03:38In April, she paid $900.
03:39And in May?
03:40She didn't pay anything.
03:41And in June, she left?
03:43Yes.
03:43Okay.
03:44The issue started when?
03:45Towards the end of March.
03:46Like, my neighbors and stuff, like, people were familiar with me.
03:50They would kind of call and be like, hey...
03:51You can't tell me what happened.
03:52You got called from neighbors.
03:54Yeah.
03:54Miss Small, when you and your boyfriend separated back in February or March,
04:00there was anger and acrimony.
04:02Yeah.
04:02Now, when you left the apartment, it was because he told you to leave?
04:06Yes.
04:06Were the police involved?
04:08Um...
04:09That's something you don't have to think about.
04:11Were the police involved?
04:12I didn't make a report, no.
04:13He made a report on her.
04:15Let's answer the question.
04:16Okay.
04:16I don't need her to tell me the truth.
04:18You're supposed to do that.
04:20Tell me how the police were involved.
04:22He called the police to ask him to remove me from his home,
04:26because I did not want to leave.
04:28And they had to come get me to take me to remove me from the home.
04:31Now, did you let him, when you moved into your sister's house,
04:35did you let him come to your house?
04:37Yes.
04:38The answer was yes.
04:40Yes, sometimes I didn't.
04:41How did I know that?
04:42Why?
04:42Because I was still emotionally tied to him.
04:44I wasn't ready to be over with him because we invested so much time.
04:48We was together for four years.
04:50That may be okay, but there was a lot of fighting there when he came over.
04:54Mm-hmm.
04:55True.
04:56And it wasn't quiet fighting.
04:57It was loud fighting.
04:58Mm-hmm.
04:59Yes.
05:00Did either you, he, or the neighbors call the police?
05:04The neighbors, she had nosy neighbors, so I assumed they called.
05:07Okay, so the police were called while he was there.
05:10Yes.
05:11Now, you agree that you gave her $1,000 when you moved in.
05:16Yes.
05:16That was in March.
05:17Mm-hmm.
05:18And that you gave her $900 in April.
05:20Yes.
05:21So there was clearly a rental agreement, an agreement that you were supposed to pay rent.
05:26Not.
05:27However, you did in fact pay $1,000 one month and $900 the next.
05:32I was actually trying to do her a favor and help her out.
05:35She really did never ask me for no rent.
05:37Well, you weren't helping her out.
05:39She was helping you out.
05:40You had no place to go.
05:41Ms. Small, was there ever a time when the boyfriend was staying over at the house?
05:47Um, he always visited me, but he also went home at the same time, too, as well.
05:51You're being vague with me.
05:53I distrust vague.
05:55And later today.
05:56Why do you think you're not responsible for half of this fee?
06:00Because we both agreed to stay through the lease the whole time regardless,
06:03because she left first, like, without me, of knowledge of me.
06:06I have more clarity if you'd like to hear my side.
06:08I don't need any more clarity.
06:09I'm clear as a bell. All you're going to do is muck it up.
06:20Juanita Perryman claims her sister, Sherry Small, vandalized her home,
06:26causing thousands of dollars in damages.
06:29Okay, so you did pay $1,000 and $900.
06:34What did you say to her when you gave her the $900, if you remember, in April?
06:40To be honest, I told my sister, this is what I have. I can help you out with this,
06:45but I'm having problems at my workplace, and I'll pick up later when I pick up a new client.
06:50Okay, so then I have to believe what your sister told me, that you had an agreement to cover the
06:55mortgage and taxes, and you were supposed to pay her $1,450 a month.
07:00And for two months, you paid less. In May, you paid nothing. So at what point did you decide to
07:07put a notice on her door to vacate the apartment? You would have conversations with her.
07:12So when she didn't pay in May, she completely ceased contact with me. When I would call,
07:18she got her number changed. I would come over. I would see a car in the driveway,
07:24and she wouldn't open the door. I would be outside knocking, calling. She wouldn't answer.
07:29I was trying to contact her through other family members. She completely just stopped responding
07:33to me at all. So in June, I put a three-day notice on her door. And it was kind of more so because I
07:40figured that would make her, you know, reach out and give me a call, and we can kind of like
07:44see what was going on. But she didn't. So mid-June, I was talking to her sister, and she was like,
07:50look, you're going to be really, really upset. Just as a result of the conversation, did you go
07:56over to the house? Yes. And this was after you would put the three-day notice to quit on the door?
08:01Yes. Okay. And what did you find when you got there?
08:05The house was completely wrecked. She had bust out windows. She had...
08:11Have photographs for me? Yes.
08:12I'd like to take a look.
08:16Ms. Small, was there ever a time when the boyfriend was staying over at the house?
08:20Um, he always visited me, but he also went home at the same time, too.
08:24You're being vague with me. And when you're vague, I distrust vague, okay? Was he staying with you at
08:34any point in June? Yes.
08:36Was he there when the three-day notice to quit was on the door?
08:40Yes. After the three-day notice was on the door, how long did it take you to move out?
08:46Um, it took me two days. In those two days, was he there?
08:50I asked him, can he help me take me, remove me from my sister?
08:53So what did he do? Did he come and help you?
08:55Yes, he came and help me.
08:56Oh, okay. So he did come and help you. Who made this mess in your sister's house?
09:00I don't know. Maybe she did it.
09:02Oh, no. Never happened. Never happened that she did this in her house.
09:05So let's rethink that. I mean, I read your answer. Your answer was crystal clear. You said
09:11you were pretty angry when you saw the three-day notice to quit. To quote you, you said,
09:15I got a little heated. Yes.
09:17Well, what did you do when you got a little heated? And was the boyfriend there when you got heated?
09:20I just called my boyfriend up to come get me to take my clothes to remove me out of her home,
09:25because she didn't even let me move things inside the home for her to want me to pay rent.
09:29Did you move back into the house?
09:31Yes.
09:31When?
09:32The end of July, after I got everything.
09:35Yeah.
09:35Kevin, I want you to show this picture to the defendant. And I want you to listen carefully,
09:41because you're an intelligent gal. And I'm also an intelligent gal. If you and your six
09:48children are planning to move back into this house because you own it,
09:52could you think of any other reason than being either psychotic or angry to do this to the property?
10:00Just take a look at it. And I'm going to show you some more.
10:08Do you understand what I mean?
10:09Yes.
10:09Okay. Was your 16-year-old there with you?
10:12No, he wasn't. He was over at Fran's house.
10:15Well, who punched the holes in the walls?
10:18I don't know. Maybe she had someone do it.
10:20No, no, no, no. You did this. Either you, your boyfriend, your 16-year-old. There's no question.
10:25She's moving back there with her six children. She is not going to destroy the house that she owns,
10:30that she's moving back to with her six children. That's ridiculous.
10:33Okay. You want to tell me anything else?
10:35Not to mention, she says we didn't have any agreement to pay rent. I have a rental agreement
10:42that we both agreed to with the amount and everything. So that was just a lie.
10:53Well, this is certainly your signature, Ms. Smalls. Kevin, would you show her this document?
11:03Hmm. That's my signature? It sure is. I've compared it to your answer. That was a sworn
11:11deposition. Okay. Did you have a contractor help you? Yes.
11:14Do you have the final bill from the contractor? I think I have some of it in that already,
11:19and this was for... I think I had this stuff up.
11:25And the maximum of your small claim score is $6,000? Yes. The damages exceeded that amount.
11:31I see the damage exceed. House money got nice. What?
11:34She said the house wasn't that nice. The house wasn't that nice, but it had windows,
11:39and it had walls, and it had mirrors, and had glass, and it didn't have any of those things when you left.
11:46Okay. Between the rent that you owe based upon your lease and the damages that you or your son or your
11:55boyfriend or a combination of all three of you did to the house, the damages of foreign exceed the $6,000,
12:02which is the limit of your small claims court. Judgment for the plaintiff in the amount of $6,000.
12:08We're finished. Thank you very much. This court is adjourned.
12:10What she was saying made no sense. I would have never done that to my own property. I really didn't
12:22like the decision at all because I feel like I didn't do all them damages. I was already still
12:27grieving months into a very big loss, and to see our house destroyed like that was horrible. To be
12:32honest, I probably damaged some things, but I didn't damage all them things. She has a lot of
12:39misplaced anger at just the wrong people, I think. I still can't believe just she brought me to this
12:44show to sue me. I hope we can kind of move forward and be in a place where we can at least, you know,
12:49be family again. I would never speak to her again.
12:54So what's your takeaway? I know your philosophy has always been don't be a landlord if you can avoid it,
13:00and I think family members make that more challenging because of the personal relationship,
13:05but also being a landlord, you may vet your tenant as well as you can. Make sure they're a good person,
13:11make sure they're not violent, make sure they have no criminal record, but you never know who they're
13:16bringing into the fold of your home. You can't control everyone's personalities and everyone's
13:20outbursts all of the time, and I felt bad for the plaintiff because, you know, she was already going
13:24through a hard time by losing her husband, just wanted some time away from the place that it happened,
13:30and, you know, she came back to a huge mess that, unfortunately, because of jurisdictional
13:34limits, we weren't able to fully compensate her for, but at least she got what we were able to give.
13:39Did I convince you about being a landlord?
13:42A little. I'm getting there. I'm getting there.
13:45Case number 4009, Heidenrick versus O'Quinn. All parties, please come forward.
13:50Wendy Heidenrick is suing her ex-boyfriend, Jamal O'Quinn, for the fees to break their lease,
13:57moving costs, and utilities. Mr. O'Quinn, I'm going to start with you, sir.
14:02Yes. You have an eight-year-old son.
14:05Yes. You have custody of him?
14:06Full custody. And you met the plaintiff when?
14:09Probably last year sometime. And you became a couple?
14:14Kind of, yeah. You became a couple?
14:16Yeah, of course.
14:16This is what you said in your answer. I endured mistreatment when I couldn't stand it any longer.
14:25I packed up and left with my son. That's what you said in your answer.
14:28That is this whole mumbo-jumbo that you started to tell me before.
14:42Wendy Heidenrick claims her ex-boyfriend, Jamal O'Quinn, owes for the fees to break their lease and
14:49moving costs. Jamal is countersuing for emotional distress and abuse.
14:54Okay. You lived in an inconvenient place. It was geographically unsuitable. So,
15:00according to the plaintiff, it was decided that you get an apartment together. And you were going
15:04to take your hands out of your pockets. I'm sorry.
15:06And you were moving there with your eight-year-old son moving in.
15:09Yeah. When did you move in, into this apartment?
15:11In the house. It was in August of 2023.
15:14Okay. And we signed a year lease.
15:18Okay. And you signed the lease.
15:20Yes.
15:20By the time Christmas time came, or even before, both of you found that this wasn't working out.
15:27That be a fair statement?
15:28A little before.
15:29Before?
15:29Yeah.
15:30Sometime between August and December.
15:32Yeah.
15:33And you decided to go your separate ways, right?
15:37Yes.
15:37Were you working, Mr. O'Quinn?
15:39Always. Yes.
15:40Okay. So you have a job.
15:42Yes.
15:42And when you signed this lease together with a plaintiff in August, in September,
15:48you weren't paying rent anywhere else, right?
15:51Yes.
15:52Were you paying rent on this apartment?
15:54In September?
15:54Yes.
15:55Yes.
15:55Yes.
15:56How much were you paying?
15:57I was paying half the rent. So it was probably around, I don't know, $1,800, if I'm not mistaken.
16:03Okay. So you were paying half the rent.
16:04Yeah.
16:05Was he paying half the rent?
16:06Yes.
16:07Yeah. Great.
16:09And did he pay half the rent September, October, November, and December?
16:12Yes.
16:13Okay. And then you decided to go your separate ways. I'm going to make this case very, very simple.
16:19For me, especially for Sarah. The lease was terminated in January?
16:25The lease was terminated December 28th, 23.
16:27Okay.
16:28And you moved someplace else?
16:30In January, I moved somewhere else.
16:33Okay. And you as well?
16:36Yes.
16:37Can I clarify something, though?
16:38No.
16:39Okay.
16:39That involved breaking the lease because you had a year's lease, correct?
16:44Yes.
16:45Yes.
16:45Yes. And you negotiated with the landlord a break-lease fee that you're going to be able
16:52to prove to me, right?
16:54Yes.
16:54And what was that fee that you negotiated?
16:57The break-lease fee was $1,499. The property went unrented for three months, which accumulated to
17:04$11,400. I negotiated that $11,400 down after they took the deposit.
17:11I'm asking you, what did you negotiate it down to? You have to have proof of it. Just show it to me.
17:18Yes, I certainly do.
17:19Well, tell me what it was. Give me the figure.
17:20So the break-lease fee was $1,499.
17:23No, no, no.
17:23And the final settlement was $3,560.
17:27I asked you a question. You negotiated with the landlord a fee that made the lease go away.
17:36$3,560 was the fee that I paid in addition to the $1,499.
17:40In addition to the $1,499.
17:42Correct.
17:43And you want him to pay half of that?
17:45Correct.
17:46Okay. Does that sound fair to you, sir?
17:48Uh, no.
17:50Why?
17:51Uh, because I thought we agreed. We agreed before. We were, like, when we wasn't dating,
17:56we were fine. We were cool. Like, staying.
17:58I don't want you to make yourself appear stupid.
18:01No, I'm not.
18:02Do you understand?
18:02Totally.
18:02Do you understand?
18:03You paid rent according to her, September, October, November, December, which means
18:07that you shared the lease and you shared the expense. Now, according to both of you,
18:12it wasn't working out. You especially because you have some ridiculous counterclaim,
18:16which I will get to in a moment, but not take me very long.
18:18Okay.
18:19What I'm asking you is, if you both found that it wasn't working out,
18:23since you were on the lease, paid half the rent, left just like she did,
18:28why do you think you're not responsible for half of this fee?
18:31Because we both agreed to stay through the lease the whole time, regardless.
18:34Because she left first, like, without me, of knowledge of me even leaving.
18:38That's not true.
18:39Like, on the 22nd of December, where I was told that...
18:42Just a second. You can't tell me what you were told,
18:44and that's not what you say in your answer.
18:46I have more clarity if you'd like to hear my side.
18:47I don't need any more clarity. I'm clear as a bell.
18:50All you're going to do is muck it up.
18:51Okay.
18:52This is what you said in your answer. I endured mistreatment because she expected certain
18:59favors from you, which is what you're complaining about. When I couldn't stand it any longer,
19:04I told her I couldn't participate in this type of relationship anymore. I packed up and left with my
19:09son. That's what you said in your answer. That is this whole mumbo jumbo that you started to tell me before.
19:15Gotcha.
19:16Gotcha. Good. Very good.
19:17And that was on December 27th.
19:19Don't speak to me.
19:20All right. Okay.
19:21Sarah, add up $35.60, $14.99, and cut it in half.
19:27$2,574.50.
19:31Okay. Now, and that you're absolutely entitled to. That you're absolutely entitled to have the fees that
19:36you paid to terminate the lease. Because whether he left or you left first, it really doesn't make any
19:42difference. You both decided this relationship was over and you shouldn't stay together,
19:46which is probably a very good idea.
19:47The deposit on the house, I put down myself at $43.50.
19:51That's all right. Show me proof that he agreed to pay you back for that.
19:53I mean, he signed the lease.
19:56Show me proof that he intended to pay you back for that. That's not what he says.
19:59He says he was living someplace. He moved in with you because you wanted to be together.
20:02Show me proof that he agreed to pay you back half the move-in fee, which you didn't collect
20:06September, October, November, or December. Correct? He didn't pay you back anything.
20:12Correct. He did not pay me anything during that time.
20:14Right. Right.
20:15He didn't have the resources. I understand.
20:16Well, he has the same resources now. He didn't pay you back then. You're absolutely entitled to
20:22half of the move-out fee. He did leave me to pay the January rent myself.
20:26$25.74. Okay. Now we're going to get to this ridiculous countersuit that you have, sir.
20:32You want to, in 30 seconds, tell me what that is? Or you just want to withdraw it and
20:36leave yourself not looking foolish? Yes. I don't want to look foolish for you.
20:41That sounds like a really good idea. Thank you so much.
20:45Really good idea. Judgment for the plaintiff for the amount of $25.74. Thank you very much.
20:49Thank you so much. This court is adjourned.
20:56I'm totally happy with the decision, and I think this will serve.
20:59I am a little disappointed with the outcome.
21:02I think she's scorned hard. I think because I kind of went the other way. I kind of told the truth
21:06about her, like, when the kind of, like, the film's not there, blah, blah, blah.
21:10You can edit a bad book, but not a blank page. So I was happy to have the experience.
21:14Just do the right thing all the time and follow your heart.
21:18Watch out for the red flags.
21:21My only takeaway from that case was how smart that defendant was, because his counterclaim,
21:26as you know, said that he wanted $10,000 because he felt as if he was being used by the plaintiff
21:33and intimidated during the six months that they were together. And then he was going to have to
21:37explain that. In detail.
21:40And I thought his smile was charming when he said, no, I'll withdraw it.
21:46Yeah. We wish they all were that smart.
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