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Short filmTranscript
00:00If you talk to me then I will guide you.
00:03Every day, we're being bombarded by scammers.
00:06I've got no money in my bank.
00:09I'm not. I have to pay.
00:11But we are fighting back.
00:13Working with ethical hacker Jim Browning, who hacks into scam call centres,
00:18we can tap into this criminal network and track down the victims to stop the scammers before they steal.
00:26You should not buy those gift cards.
00:27You're gonna lose your money.
00:28What was that? What was that?
00:29I can assure you that nothing they're saying is true.
00:32You're on the phone to a scammer, Malik. You need to hang up the phone.
00:35Hang up!
00:37This is Scam Interceptors.
00:44On today's episode...
00:46You were going to say thanks to me before ending this call.
00:49I will.
00:51...one of the most manipulative scammers we've ever encountered.
00:55Above that! Above that!
00:57Where is she shouting her hub?
00:59I'm trying to find it, but I can't.
01:01Oh, she's getting upset.
01:03Just beside it, do you see? There is a grey circle. Just beside it.
01:10Just below it.
01:12Just beside it. Beside!
01:14Wow, okay.
01:15In the Glasgow hub, we've just tuned in to an incredibly distressing call.
01:20It might be locked.
01:23All right, all right, I've just pressed it. Allow access.
01:26So forceful.
01:28From the scammer's call log screen that our ethical hacker Jim has given us access to,
01:34we can see that the call to this woman somewhere in the UK has already been going on for nearly 19 minutes.
01:41So we've just joined this scam call going on here.
01:45It's really uncomfortable because we can hear them actually shouting at a lady that's clearly confused with what they're telling her to do.
01:51After that, what do you see?
01:54Um, a white circle with the blue bit and then I've got a white circle to allow access.
02:01No ma'am, not on the allow access. Why you're not looking above that? Above that!
02:06Why is she shouting at her?
02:09Just beside it on the right hand side. On the right hand side in the middle of your face, there is a circle.
02:14These scammers are some of the most ruthless we've encountered and are based in a call centre in Kolkata, India.
02:23They're running a very classic tech support scam. So what they've done is they've dressed it up as Skye.
02:29This criminal has told this woman that he's calling from internet provider Skye, pretending that there are issues with her internet connection that he can help fix.
02:39It's a lie. He's simply trying to steal her money.
02:44A small grey colour circle. You see that?
02:47From what we know about how these scammers operate, they're trying to get some sort of remote access to her phone, tablet or computer,
02:54which means they can see and sometimes even control everything she has on her screen.
02:59Now that is incredibly worrying because all sorts of fraud can happen when they've got that access and she will have no idea.
03:07Remote access software is a completely legitimate tool, usually used by IT professionals to assist people with technical problems on their devices.
03:17But scammers misuse this software to commit crime.
03:21Yes, I found it. I found it.
03:24I found it.
03:25Oh, my God.
03:27Yeah.
03:28Now press on that.
03:30Press on what?
03:32Very good, ma'am. Very good.
03:34Is he just laughing at her? Yeah.
03:36Press on verify user. Oh, my God.
03:40Look, I told you, I'm going to spot this phone call in a minute, if you can.
03:46Some of the language this scammer's using is something more shocking that we've heard.
03:49You are slow, madam, and it is completely fine to be slow.
03:54Now, on the very...
03:55Yes, I understand that, but I am not...
03:58You are losing your patience, madam. I don't have any problem. I will tell you a hundred more times.
04:03The scammer seems to be struggling to get the remote access to what we think is the woman's mobile phone.
04:09Now, what do you see? First, tell me, without touching anywhere.
04:14It's got quick support. Show your ID. Join the session to receiving support.
04:21Yes. Now, at the very bottom, do you see? It says, I trust this person and allow immediate access to my device.
04:27Yes. So, I can see that now, yeah. Shall I press?
04:32Yes, madam. Yes.
04:33It's only been possible for Jim to give us access to this scammer's calls, not his computer screen, where we would usually be able to see the scammer's notes.
04:45We're in a difficult situation, because when we can see the scammer's screen, that allows us to pick up a load of personal information about that person, because we can literally see...
04:55You can see what they're writing down. Exactly.
04:57All we've got here is the call. We don't have this scammer's screen, so we're not going to be able to pick up personal info about this woman just by looking at her screen.
05:04All we've got is that phone number.
05:05And despite having the woman's landline number, she's tied up on it with the scammer.
05:12We need to find her mobile number or an address, as our ground interceptors, or GIs, Harriet and Mia, are standing by to help.
05:21What we've got is better than nothing, because we've got a landline telephone number, and at least that gives us some clues as to where she's going to be located geographically.
05:30Exactly.
05:31The team look up the woman's landline dialling code, which tells us the town that she lives in is in Essex.
05:39And I think, at this point, we're going to have to send our Southern GI team out to the area.
05:44Right, let's give them a call.
05:49Hey, both. How you doing?
05:50Morning. Good, Ralph.
05:52So, we can hear a call where a lady, she's been hooked right in by the scammers, claiming to offer some phony tech support from Sky.
06:00We are trying to find more details on exactly who she is, where she lives, but if you can head out in that direction...
06:07OK.
06:09..we will let you know as soon as we get any more, but we need to get to her before they get her money.
06:13OK, we'll head down.
06:15Thank you both. Bye.
06:17Harriet and Mia begin the one hour and five minute journey from East London to the woman's town in Essex.
06:22Oh, this is closed. Diversion.
06:28As we are unable to see the scammers' computer notes, which sometimes give information on their target, all we can do is listen in for any clues on who this woman may be.
06:40Sorry, I pressed the ground.
06:41Do not touch anywhere. Do not touch anywhere. Do not touch anywhere. It's completely fine. It is fantastic, marvellous, fabulous, amazing. You know? Now, do not touch anywhere. Then type over there, S. S for sugar.
06:57Yeah.
06:59The manipulative scammer is still trying to get remote access to this woman's mobile phone.
07:05Then E for England. Then T. T for tangle, right?
07:10C. C for what?
07:12T like tiger. T like tomato.
07:15Yeah, I've done it. I've done it. I've done it.
07:17OK, don't worry. It's completely fine, love. It's completely fine. You're relaxed.
07:20Because my responsibility to explain you everything and guide you for everything.
07:26He's just patronising this lady who's clearly confused.
07:29Yeah.
07:30Now, what do you see, love?
07:31Yeah, you've been very good.
07:33Yes, madam. Thank you so much.
07:35She's totally hooked as well. She just told him how good he is and how kind he is.
07:39She thinks he's actually helping out there.
07:41Now, what do you see, love?
07:43All right. Hang on, hang on, hang on.
07:45Take your time, love.
07:46I see screen broadcast with a circle, team viewer and start broadcast.
07:53Yes, love. Press on that, please.
07:55Yeah.
07:57Always on.
07:59He's got remote access now.
08:01The scammer is now able to see everything on this woman's phone.
08:06It won't be too long till he starts convincing her that because her internet has supposedly been hacked,
08:11he will pay her compensation and she needs to check she's received it by logging into her online bank account.
08:19It's just so horrible, isn't it, when they're in...
08:22Yeah, they're in her device.
08:25She has no idea.
08:27We still have no information as to who this woman is.
08:31The ground team are making their way to her area, but it's rush hour in London.
08:39Morning traffic, not the one.
08:42Harriet and Mia are still an hour away.
08:46We continue to listen in to the call for any clues on who this woman on the line may be.
08:52You can see your name is written over there, Lou?
08:56Yes.
08:58Did you get it?
09:00We have just heard the woman read out her full name.
09:04To protect her identity, we'll call her Mandy.
09:08And check your information is correct or not.
09:12Now, with a name and a rough location, we can try and find an address for Mandy.
09:18Have I done something wrong?
09:19No, no, you are doing completely fine, love, you know?
09:23Now, go to the very top.
09:25He really is playing into that good cop, bad cop vibe of one minute being really nasty.
09:30You have to check your date of birth.
09:32Date of birth.
09:34Date of birth.
09:36We now have Mandy's full date of birth.
09:38We're now piecing together those parts to find out where she is so we can get help to her.
09:43Yes, yes, love, birth on that.
09:45Right, just done that.
09:47I have got an address, and that was on the 2024 electoral rule, so it's an up-to-date address.
09:54Let's do it. Get them there, guys.
09:55The address is in Essex, where the ground team are already heading.
10:00Mark updates Harriet Amir.
10:04OK, we've got an address.
10:07Get that in and see how far we are.
10:10OK.
10:1250 minutes.
10:13The ground team may not be able to get to Mandy in time to stop her from losing money.
10:20So we are still trying to get our hands on an alternative way to intercept her scam.
10:26We've now found two Facebook profiles which we believe could belong to her or her relatives.
10:31In that area?
10:32Yeah.
10:33While we do some more digging on whether those profiles are linked to the woman on the phone,
10:38the scammer is now moving on to the stage where he convinces Mandy that her internet connection has been hacked.
10:45Do you see it?
10:47It says search or enter website, look.
10:50Yes.
10:52Then you have to type over there, my, M-Y, my.
10:57Yeah.
10:59Then give us space, then put number one.
11:02Then P, P like Peter.
11:04Yeah.
11:06So this is the IP address which we have registered under your name just for your use only.
11:12The scammer is using another deceptive trick.
11:15When they're running tech support scams, they like to get people to search something.
11:20So they'll say to them, search for my 1P address.
11:24Now that's an intentional mistake because your IP address is your geographical location in the world on the internet.
11:33By making it 1P address, they've worked out that it hits a particular search result.
11:38And when you then click through to that search result, it shows your IP address as the IP address of the Google server in California.
11:45So he says to her, somebody's hacked your computer, someone's hacked your internet connection.
11:50I will explain you love, let every home have a different postcode.
11:55As the same way, every internet have a different IP addresses for the identification of the customer.
12:01And this is your IP address.
12:03Right now I'm going to explain you something very important, which is going to blow your mind.
12:08Just below the IP address, you can see the country and the state.
12:10Yeah.
12:13And what is the country?
12:15United States of America.
12:17Here we go.
12:19Oh my God. And the state is showing to you California.
12:22Oh my God. Now I understand.
12:24You are living in the UK and you are using our internet in the UK. Is that right?
12:31I am.
12:33This is the location where is the hacker bitch and they are misusing your internet IP from the United States of America, California.
12:42Now you understand that?
12:43Oh my God.
12:44She's so shocked hearing that these hackers in America have got into her device, but we know it's complete rubbish.
12:50That's it. It's just, it's purely a justification to move the scam on.
12:54That's how they get you from tech support issue to give us your money.
12:57Okay. Well, let's see what else we can pick out from this, but I think this lady needs some help.
13:01These people from the America, they can misuse your details for doing any kind of illegal activities without your knowledge and without your permission.
13:09Yeah.
13:11By making Mandy believe that her broadband was hacked, the scammer will soon pretend that he owes her compensation and she needs to check it's been received through her online bank.
13:24This is how the scammer can steal from her.
13:28The ground interceptors are still battling to get to Mandy's home to help.
13:34The GIs are about 45 minutes away.
13:36We might not be able to make this in time.
13:40We can try our best. The traffic seems to be moving quite well.
13:46In the hub, we aren't giving up trying to find another way to contact Mandy.
13:51We're pretty sure that Facebook profile is her, because Erin's found out that the date of birth of Mandy's up with a birthday post that she's put online.
13:59OK.
14:00Unfortunately, there's no mobile number for Mandy on her social media profile. We need other options.
14:07I'm on the second.
14:10What am I supposed to do?
14:11There's no email address there?
14:12No, obviously.
14:13Not that I've seen just yet, but I'm still having a wee gander about...
14:16OK. Top work.
14:17While the team continue their search, the scammer continues to frighten Mandy.
14:23Whatever you are doing, on your internet line, these people can see all the details.
14:28That's why we are calling you to block these people and make your internet safe and secure.
14:33So now you understand what is the reason and how much this is important to block?
14:36Yes, I do.
14:39So right now, madam, the router which you are using right now, it is not compatible.
14:45So we are going to change the router with a new one, OK?
14:48Yes.
14:49One of our engineers will visit your home in order to install the new router and fix all the wire problems.
14:56We're hearing quite sinister work on behalf of the scammer here.
15:00He's saying that there's going to be an engineer turning up at home in two days' time.
15:03And we know that's complete rubbish.
15:05It is, indeed.
15:07It's just more window dressing to get Mandy to eventually log into her online bank account.
15:13And it's giving us more time to get the ground interceptors to her.
15:18So let me check what is the earlier date which we have for the engineer.
15:22The GIs are flying along with them.
15:24They're on the motorway already.
15:26We're having a good run so far.
15:2840 minutes.
15:30Thursday you will be free?
15:31Yes, a.m. or p.m.
15:34Morning at 11.
15:36Yeah, that's absolutely fine.
15:39I want you to be handy with a pen and a paper so I can provide you all the necessary details.
15:43I've got it all ready.
15:45There is no engineer coming.
15:48But Mandy seems to trust that the scammer on the line is helping her.
15:52Now he can move on to setting up the dangerous part of the scam.
15:57Right now, as I can see here on my screen, you are also eligible to receive a compensation.
16:04There we go.
16:05The fraudster has now moved the conversation to money so that he can steal hers.
16:12And the compensation which you are eligible to receive is £204.56.
16:18So I'd like to congratulate you for this amount.
16:22Thank you. Thank you.
16:24And I want to thank you very much for being so patient with me.
16:27He wasn't. That's the thing. He was horrible to her.
16:30It's completely fine, man, but the work hasn't been done.
16:33There is no compensation payment.
16:37With his remote access to her mobile phone, the scammer wants Mandy to log into her online banking so he can help himself to her cash.
16:47While the team continue to hunt for an email address or mobile number for her, the ground team are now 25 minutes away.
16:54This lady is really in deep with this scam already.
16:58My heart is just racing.
17:01So, as I can see here on my screen, madam, you pay your bills by your direct debit through Skye.
17:08Um, yeah.
17:10So our server has sent you a six-digit verification code on your banking statement.
17:14You have to go ahead and check on your phone, have you received the code over there or not?
17:20He's asking her to check her bank details, but we know he's going to see this.
17:23The scammer has not sent Mandy any code.
17:27He wants her to log into her online banking so that with his remote access of her mobile phone, he can help himself to her money.
17:35Have you received or not? Okay?
17:38Oh, I don't...
17:40Hang on.
17:42Sorry?
17:43Yeah.
17:44Like, you have to simply go ahead...
17:46Just see another GI's up.
17:48...and check.
17:49Harriet and Mia are still 20 minutes away.
17:52Time really is of the essence.
17:55Let's just hope we don't hit any roadworks.
17:58Have you caught it or not?
18:00I'm just trying to check, but...
18:02Okay, madam.
18:04Once you log in, then you tell me.
18:06So I will guide you how you can check.
18:08Sounds like she's not entirely comfortable with how to use her online banking.
18:13Yeah.
18:14And he's now trying to push her to go into it as quick as possible.
18:17Um...
18:19I'm on the second short path.
18:22Swipe your screen from right to the left.
18:24That's what I'm telling you, ma'am.
18:25If you talk to me, it will become easier.
18:27I'm working in this company from past four years.
18:30So you understand.
18:31I have a lot of experience.
18:33So swipe your screen from right to the left.
18:34Experience in scamming.
18:35I do understand that.
18:37Yeah.
18:38So you listen, what I'm telling you, it will get that in a few minutes.
18:40And you are going to say thanks to me before ending this call.
18:43Now swipe your screen from right to the left.
18:45I certainly will.
18:46This ruthless fraudster is pulling Mandy deeper into his scam.
18:51And just as we thought Harriet and Mia were making good progress to Essex...
18:56Look at this traffic.
18:58Terrible.
19:00The GIs are 30 minutes away, half an hour.
19:03As far as that? Wow, okay.
19:04I thought it would be closer.
19:05Yeah, so did I.
19:07They must have hit traffic.
19:08Yeah.
19:09This delay is bad news.
19:11We need to find a way to help Mandy soon
19:14as the scammer is pushing on, doing his best to try and steal her cash.
19:19Then you can see your banking application over there.
19:23Yeah.
19:24So press that?
19:25Yes, madam.
19:26You have to press on that.
19:29It sounds like Mandy may be about to log into her online banking, and we still don't have her mobile number.
19:37This lady is in so much trouble.
19:38What do you see on your screen?
19:39It says this is a unique five-digit number you have set up to log on to online banking.
19:49Did you know?
19:50Only you know and not sent via SMS, which I haven't got a clue.
19:56Forgotten details I'll have to put.
19:59It seems Mandy can't remember her online banking login.
20:03This could buy her some much-needed time.
20:07No, no, no, ma'am.
20:08You don't remember your five-digit unique number, like, which you used to always...
20:12No, no, no, no.
20:15So whenever you go online, how do you check your statement?
20:19Well, God knows.
20:20I mean, she's clearly confused.
20:22You've put five numbers.
20:23I don't know what they are.
20:25I don't normally have the five boxes.
20:29He sent her through her internet browser to the bank's website,
20:33because we know that bypass is the thing where apps block out the screen when you've got remote access.
20:38So that's why she doesn't know how to log in, because if she was just using her app,
20:42she's probably got Face ID, it logs in automatically, and that's why she's confused,
20:45and she doesn't know what this code is that she needs to log in.
20:48Okay.
20:49Okay.
20:50On the very top right-hand side, do you see there is a cross?
20:54A cross.
20:55Cross, cross.
20:56Just below that, ma'am, there is a cross on the right-hand side.
21:00There is an X.
21:01Oh, no.
21:02They can cross.
21:03X.
21:05With Mandy edging closer to being robbed, we touch base with the ground team,
21:10who could be our only chance to stop the scam.
21:15Hover calling.
21:16Hi, Mark.
21:17Hi, guys.
21:19I've been at the moment.
21:20It's just trying to get us to log into our bank, so I think it's going to be down to the wire, this one.
21:25So, our ETA is still 10.16, so 26 minutes.
21:28Jason, thanks, thank you so much.
21:31Cool.
21:32Thanks, Mark.
21:33Thanks, guys.
21:34See you later.
21:35See you later.
21:36We can only hope Harriet and Mia are able to get to Mandy in time.
21:41Every second counts.
21:43Fortunately, Mandy's still struggling to log into her online banking.
21:48Oh, she's getting upset.
21:49Okay.
21:50Tell me one thing, madam.
21:51Then, when was the last time you have been into your account?
21:54What?
21:55What?
21:56What?
21:57What?
21:58Into my bank account?
21:59Into your bank account, and you have checked your transactions, madam.
22:01I can't remember.
22:02About two weeks ago.
22:03Okay.
22:04So, at that time, you have entered a security number, which is known as a security number.
22:23Oh!
22:24Drop.
22:25She's gone.
22:27With the scammers' call to Mandy having unexpectedly dropped…
22:32Give her a go.
22:34..this is our chance to try her landline.
22:47The race is on to get hold of Mandy before the scammer gets her back on the line.
22:52Yes?
22:53Hi, is it?
22:55Who's calling?
22:56My name's Ralph Wilding.
22:57I'm calling from a programme called BBC Scam Interceptors.
23:00Oh, right.
23:01The person you were just talking to is not who they claim to be.
23:04I'm afraid there were scammers trying to steal your money.
23:06Really?
23:07Yeah.
23:08Oh, my God, thank you.
23:10Don't worry.
23:10We've been monitoring the activity of a lot of these overseas call centres.
23:14And we know that this call centre pretends to be from Skype
23:17saying that there's problems with your internet.
23:19There's no problems with the internet.
23:21There's no hackers.
23:22The only scammer that you need to worry about was them.
23:25Right.
23:27This is a lot of information for you to take in.
23:29I appreciate that.
23:29Do you have anyone with you or a friend or family member you can talk to?
23:32No, I don't, no.
23:34OK.
23:34Is there anyone you would like me to call for you
23:37to see if we can get you some help?
23:40I can call.
23:42I've got family, you see, a very, very good family.
23:45So I'll get one of my daughters to come over.
23:47Oh, fantastic.
23:49There's something else, though.
23:50Did they ask you to download any apps?
23:52No.
23:52Because the way these scammers work, they put something on your mobile phone, various bits of software.
23:59And what that actually does is it allows the scammer to see, sometimes even control it themselves, wherever they are in the world.
24:06Right.
24:06Actually saying that, I think something similar did happen.
24:10Yeah, I think it's highly likely.
24:12Two of my colleagues, they're from the BBC.
24:15They are quite close to you at the moment.
24:16And if you needed any support, they can happily come and speak to you.
24:20Yeah, OK.
24:21I just want to be confident that that's been removed.
24:23Oh, fabulous.
24:24Thank you very much.
24:26Thankfully, because we've managed to speak to you, your money is now safe.
24:30But if you get any more calls, just put the phone down.
24:32They're nothing to do with Sky, I absolutely assure you that.
24:35Yeah, yeah, yeah.
24:36All right?
24:36I'll just ignore them.
24:38Yeah, absolutely.
24:39Take care.
24:40You take care.
24:40Nice talking to you.
24:41Bye-bye.
24:41Oh, that poor lady.
24:44Good work.
24:45Totally hooked in.
24:46Did they try and get her back?
24:47They tried to get her about three times since you've been on the phone to her.
24:49Wow.
24:50Wow.
24:50I think we just got lucky the call dropped.
24:52Yeah, she genuinely thought I was them calling her back.
24:55The main thing is, though, her money's safe.
24:57That was a long call, and that was close.
25:00At last, after nearly an hour, Mandy is off her call to the scammers.
25:06And we can update the ground team.
25:09Heya, both.
25:10So, um, I've just managed to speak to the lady.
25:12The call actually broke, and it just gave us that window to jump in.
25:16She was very shaken up.
25:17She now understands it's a scam, but Nick and I are very concerned that there's remote access
25:22software still on her device.
25:24She's going to speak to her daughter straight away, but I think it would still be very beneficial
25:29for her to meet both of you to see if we can bottom out what this remote access software
25:36is.
25:37Sure, no problem.
25:38We're 15 minutes away, so we're quite close.
25:41That's brilliant.
25:42Brilliant.
25:44Talk to you later.
25:45Drive safe.
25:45Bye-bye.
25:46She must be going through all sorts of emotions.
25:49She must be going through hell.
25:52Nearly there.
25:54One minute.
25:54Harriet and Mia are able to get to Mandy's home to help her before any of her family.
26:04How are you doing?
26:05We've had a bit of a fright today.
26:07Yeah.
26:09To further protect Mandy's identity, we aren't showing her or her home.
26:13I can see you shaking.
26:16Are you OK?
26:17Yeah, a bit of a shock.
26:18Once the ground interceptors are able to calm Mandy down after her incredibly stressful
26:24morning, they then make her mobile phone safe from the scammers.
26:31I'm going to delete that app.
26:33Good.
26:34Thank you very much.
26:35You're welcome.
26:36Glad we could help.
26:37It's now been five hours since Mandy's scam call began.
26:44It's just great that we've been able to see her in person, remove the software and reassure
26:50her that she is now safe.
26:52Yeah.
26:55What a day.
26:58Mandy's ordeal with the cruelest of criminals is now over.
27:04Good work.
27:05Well done, team.
27:05We have since spoken to Mandy's daughter, who is grateful to us for stopping her mum's
27:11close call with the scammers.
27:13And fortunately, Mandy's money is safe.
27:19We have reported the Kolkata scammers to the authorities, both here and abroad.
27:29If you think you've been scammed, then there are some steps you need to take straight away.
27:34Firstly, call your bank.
27:37The number is usually on the back of your bank card.
27:40Remove any software that scammers have asked you to install on your phone or laptop.
27:46Change your passwords on as many...
27:48Start up with your day.
27:50...
27:52...
27:58...
27:58So, could you expect that you have been getting going to save us, is that you?
27:58See, here it is.
28:00...
28:01...
28:02Here we go.
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