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As 'Narcos' season three approaches, the show's stars Francisco Denis and Pepe Rapazote discuss what fans can look forward to from the Netflix show.
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00:00Hi I'm Jackie Strauss and I am here for THR's in-studio interview with two of
00:06the new villains of Narcos, Francisco Dennis and Pepe Reposote. I'm gonna let
00:10you guys introduce yourself in character so the viewers can meet you if you're
00:14up for that.
00:15Sorry, the other word ran, right? Yes.
00:23No, from the beginning, from the beginning, okay.
00:26I am Chepe Santacru, Londoño, and I am Chepe Santacru, Londoño, and I sell you the drug that you want in New York.
00:40Now that's a little bit of a taste of what we're gonna be seeing when the third
01:00season comes to Netflix September 1st, which is pretty soon. Are you guys
01:04excited to release the Cali Cartel onto the world?
01:08Well, the Cali Cartel is like everybody else. They are not different from maybe
01:14your father, your uncle. They are like a businessman. So you will see not dangerous
01:24guys, not in front of everybody. They are like everybody, but they are businessmen.
01:32It's amazing what you just said. Are you excited for releasing the Cali Cartel like mad dogs, right?
01:38Rawr! Releasing the Cali Cartel. Yes, yes, we are excited, but it's true what Francisco
01:45said, which is, it's incredible how smooth these stories go as they grow up. It's just like any
01:57other trade. You know, you start selling some marijuana, no big deal. Then you start selling
02:02some cocaine because it's a lot of, a lot more money. And then some people want your money and
02:08you're gonna have to start killing them. That's, it's really smooth. It's natural. So it could be your dad, yeah.
02:16I'll tell him you said that. Okay. So this is now in the post Escobar world. And a lot of people know the story of Pablo Escobar.
02:24They knew he was going to die. They knew more details about him than probably about Cali, which as Netflix describes them, the drug cartel, you probably have never heard of.
02:35So you play two of the Godfathers, there's four, and you are described as the brains behind the operation. And your brother is the number,
02:43numero uno, we would say, right? He's the, he's the main boss of the four of you. Would you break it down like that?
02:48Yeah, Gilberto is the main boss, but you're gonna, you're gonna see, there's some changes in, during the, the series in,
02:59in, one, in Momento Dado, and. At a certain point? I, I, I take the, I take the. Control. Control of the cartel. Okay.
03:10So Miguel is, at the beginning, like somebody who is looking what is, what's happening, a little bit backstage.
03:18But in the middle, he, he turns his character in, maybe a monster. Oh wow. Yeah. And you were, we've met you in previous seasons.
03:29But Pepe, you're new to the series, and we haven't met Chepe yet. So how would you describe him, and how would you describe his role amongst the four Godfathers?
03:40Um, well, uh, they used to call him the student, because he, uh, he took seven semesters of, uh, chemical engineering in college.
03:49Um, I don't know if by then he was already thinking about cocaine and cutting cocaine, because he was a, he was a master at cutting cocaine as well.
03:57Uh, so he loved the whole process. What is new about this guy? He was the, uh, as old as Gilberto was. So this was the little brother.
04:08Uh, the relationship about these two, uh, between these two was, um, pretty cool, because this is a very acid person.
04:17Uh, it burns everything around him. He's really mean and, uh, quiet, but he's really mean. Uh, I would say that the meanest of them all, because, uh, you know, he goes quiet.
04:29Uh, the other ones are a little louder. Uh, but, so, Chepe was the only one, uh, who could call him limon, lemon.
04:39Yeah, that's true.
04:40That's true. That's true.
04:41That's true like, true like.
04:42He wouldn't like anyone else, but it was Chepe. So, um, uh, so it was like this, you know, he won't say a word. Probably he didn't like it.
04:51Mm-hmm. But it was Chepe, kind of his older brother. And he was the big and loud character. Chepe is the big and loud character. So, yeah, he comes into place and, um, uh, when he comes back from the, well, he goes back and forth to, um, into the U.S., uh, New York.
05:10Right, because he runs the New York operation of the drug company.
05:13And Chepe Santa Cruz was, uh, one of the first big, uh, drug leaders, dealers, dealers, dealers, in, uh, here, in New York.
05:23In America.
05:23In America. So, he was really new here.
05:27Probably the, the most successful narco ever to live in the U.S. because, uh, he was, uh, he had, uh, alias, uh, um, by the name of Victor Crespo. Everyone thought he was, uh, working on real estate.
05:40But, about the character, he's really colorful. He's really happy and really colorful. So, he comes to the other three and, uh, well, he's really happy to see them, to be with them.
05:53And he loves what he does. So, you can, you're gonna be able to see a lot of color, uh, that Chepe can bring to, to the cartel.
06:01But, uh, it's important to say that, uh, these guys, they were like, uh, business gentlemen.
06:07So, they, uh, you will not see, uh, these guys, these guys with the guns killing people.
06:13They ask to another people to, to do that, no?
06:16Right.
06:16They always stay with, uh, or with, uh, with, uh, the big families.
06:23Okay, the big families. Yeah, the important people, high-end people.
06:26So, they, they both, they don't get their hands as dirty.
06:29They both, all, all the country. They both, uh, senators. They both, uh, a president.
06:34They put a president in, uh, on the government.
06:37They put a puppet president, uh, in the government.
06:40We, uh, elected, well, not elected, you know.
06:43So, anyway, they bought the, the general attorney as well.
06:47So, uh, the story goes that, um, some of the meetings, uh, were taken in, uh, the general attorney's office.
06:57Business meetings.
06:58You know, that was, that's how dirty it was.
07:01Well, so that's the biggest difference between Pablo and Callie, where Pablo was one man, and he was quite vicious.
07:08But Callie is described as more of an organization.
07:10And, and, and, and it's amazing that by then there were the authors of, uh, probably the first to have, well, maybe not the first, but probably the, the best, the very best, the very well-organized, uh, um, uh, in what regards, uh, the, um, justice and politicians and all that.
07:28They had it all under control.
07:31So, that's, that's the main difference.
07:33It was a huge organization and very powerful.
07:35You know, the, the objective with the cartels is not that you are going to sell all the drugs yourself, but you know how to do that, how to create, uh, the routes.
07:48And they sell the routes to other people.
07:51So, maybe that, that you have a route between, uh, from, from Colombia to Panama and then to Panama to Mexico and Mexico, Miami, New York, Europe.
08:01So, they, they, they have all control, all these, uh, routes in, in his, their own control and they, uh, they, uh, they sold the routes.
08:14Yes, absolutely.
08:15That, which is, you, you, you get to learn in the end that, um, one of the biggest assets, uh, about, uh, drug smuggling is the routes.
08:24Mm-hmm.
08:25You, you, you were in control of that, uh, airport of those planes, of those trains, those boats, the way you smuggled the trucks.
08:33That's the, it's like trying to launder money.
08:36Mm-hmm.
08:36If you know the guy who launders the best, he's, he's priceless, right?
08:42They have 10 billions.
08:44If he can save you 6, um, billion, uh, you know, of clean money, that's going to be great.
08:49And Pedro Pascal returns as Javier Pena, and he is once again leading this hunt, and viewers will meet the agent who was responsible for taking down Callie.
09:00Um, not to spoil anything for viewers who don't know how that story ends, um, but how would you describe the hunt for Callie?
09:08How would you compare it to the hunt for Pablo?
09:11Because season two was so focused on the final days of Pablo, and it was really, you know, an intimate look at those, kind of the end.
09:19Very intimate, yeah.
09:20Whereas we're coming in at Callie as, you guys are very happy with yourselves when we meet you.
09:25It seems like you're really still on your rise, even though you're nearing this.
09:30Uh, the beginning of the downfall, right?
09:33Mm-hmm.
09:33Uh, that's it.
09:34Well, um, the hunt for the Callie cartel would be very different, I believe that.
09:40Pablo was Cobar, and he brought it to, uh, himself.
09:44You know, the hunt was a real hunt, you know, just like a, uh, uh, an animal, yeah.
09:49Um, um, as for the Callie cartel was, it had to be brighter.
09:54Uh, they had to take him down, um, through, uh, the law and, uh, sorts of, uh, lawsuits and, uh, you know, investigations and all that.
10:03Mm-hmm.
10:04They couldn't take them down just because, you know.
10:06I'm here, okay, I'm not going to arrest you or shoot you because I don't have any evidence.
10:11So they had to, and they had everything under control, you know.
10:15Right, it wasn't about finding them, they were.
10:17That was a huge big one.
10:17Yeah, and, um, the, um, when, when you are going to see the first episode,
10:23you're going to see that, uh, this is the end of the cartel, because they want to surrender.
10:28Mm-hmm.
10:28So everybody says, okay, we have six months, make a lot of money, and then we are going to surrender and happy end.
10:36Mm-hmm.
10:37That's a problem because they didn't want to come here to, in jail, in the United States,
10:44because if, if, uh, they come here, they know that this is the real end.
10:49Mm-hmm.
10:49So if, uh, they surrender, or maybe they have, uh, one year or two years in the prison, jail in Colombia,
10:57Mm-hmm.
10:58Not, not, it's not too much, you know.
11:00Mm-hmm.
11:00Uh.
11:01He's been there.
11:03But the problem, the problem is, it's a political problem, because, uh, everybody was implicao.
11:10Todo Colombia está implicao.
11:12Oh, yeah.
11:13Uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, everyone was in the business one way or the other.
11:18So it was a lot easier to, you know, I'm going down, you're coming down with me.
11:25And how did you two research your characters in order to portray them?
11:31And how much, I guess, I don't know if you could put a percentage to it,
11:34but how much liberty do you take when it comes to their personality
11:37and when you're going beyond just the facts of the things that they did?
11:42Well, I began to read many books about the Cali Cartel.
11:46And there is one book that I read that talk about how he was,
11:53how he was his character of Miguel.
11:56And Miguel, he didn't like parties.
12:00He didn't like to be exposed to the people.
12:04He was always...
12:06He was an introvert.
12:07Yeah.
12:08So I worked my character like this.
12:11But at the end of the shooting, we were in Cali.
12:20And the director told me, hey, Francisco, this is the nephew of Miguel.
12:26He was a guy working in a nephew.
12:29Oh, wow.
12:29The nephew.
12:30Sorry.
12:31The nephew of Miguel.
12:32Do you want to talk to him?
12:34And suddenly...
12:35He was part of the crew.
12:35He was an assistant, and we never knew.
12:37Wow.
12:38He kept that until the end, I guess.
12:39And I thought maybe if I don't...
12:41If I didn't...
12:43The role like it was Miguel.
12:46So I was a little bit scared, no?
12:48To talk with him.
12:50And we began to talk, and then he told me,
12:53Francisco, I'm really scared because you are exactly like my uncle.
12:58Wow.
12:58So that was really...
13:01That's crazy to hear, right?
13:03I was going to ask if you had heard from any family members,
13:07or if you anticipate to hear from any family members in your case,
13:10about the portrayal.
13:11I mean, you've been on the show,
13:12so obviously there's an ample opportunity to...
13:14I found two or three nephews in Cali, in a bar, in a bar,
13:21when we were talking.
13:22Like...
13:24But they are a little bit...
13:26Siempre están un poco como preocupados de que sepa que son familiares.
13:32Okay, they don't want anyone to know that they're a family.
13:35Right.
13:35It's kind of a...
13:36You know, it's a lot of weight on your shoulders.
13:38Right.
13:39It's a stamp on your forehead.
13:40They're trying to move forward and not to...
13:44Oh, about me.
13:47About me.
13:48There wasn't that much writing about Chepe.
13:51I don't know if it was...
13:53Probably it was because he was living in New York for 15 years.
13:57So maybe that should be a book about Chepe in New York.
14:01Well, he had a lot of amazing, incredible stories here in New York.
14:06He was one of the most powerful and richest guys here in New York.
14:10No one knew anything about him.
14:12The story goes that he couldn't speak English,
14:14and people would have to address to him in Spanish.
14:18You know, kind of a power.
14:19Learn Spanish before you talk to me.
14:22And...
14:22But...
14:24So, I had a lot of stories.
14:27Some books about the Cali cartel, of course,
14:29but nothing special directed to...
14:34I mean, about Chepe Santa Cruz.
14:37Because probably the other members of the cartel were in Colombia,
14:40so it's part of the Colombian folklore folk.
14:44Like, you know, it's part of the story, part of the...
14:46But Chepe, people told a lot of different and funny stories about Chepe.
14:53So I had to build the character through what was given and written to me,
14:59and very generally...
15:02Well, very general things about the character I got to know.
15:08But it was like wearing a glove for the first time,
15:15and you always think, well, you're going to wear a glove in a store.
15:18You want to buy a pair of gloves.
15:20And you're going to say, well, probably these are not the...
15:23Well, it's your first pair of gloves.
15:25Probably this is not the size.
15:27This is not the fabric I want, whatever.
15:30It was so smooth because it was very easy to do this larger-than-life guy,
15:36a guy who's not afraid of anything, who's in for the action.
15:40He wants to be part of the action.
15:42And as Francisco said,
15:45the only guy who really wanted to stop all this
15:48and make a deal with the government was Gilberto.
15:50The other three were having a thrill, the time of their lives.
15:57They really loved this.
15:58It had nothing to do with the amount of money they made.
16:02After $50 billion, probably, you stopped counting, I would say, before that.
16:09But so they loved the ride.
16:12They loved the ride, and that's why they wanted to keep doing it.
16:16But as I usually say,
16:18if there's something to learn about drug smuggling and drug cartels,
16:22it's you'll never die of old age.
16:26Right.
16:27I mean, for the viewers who are not as familiar with how your stories end,
16:33do you think it's most interesting to watch this season
16:37knowing ahead of time the current status of your characters?
16:41Do you think it's interesting to Google along the way,
16:44or would you say watch it and then read up everything you can?
16:47Well, if I am somebody who is going to watch the series,
16:51maybe I prefer to learn about it and to know,
16:56because this is a series of television.
16:58This is not reality.
16:59Right.
16:59The reality maybe is worse.
17:03There are no jokes there.
17:06For example, I want to say that Miguel and Gilberto,
17:09they are in jail in this moment.
17:11And they have 30 years in jail.
17:15They have 80 years old, maybe.
17:17Well, no.
17:1775, 80 years old.
17:1980 years in jail.
17:21That's not a happy end.
17:23No.
17:23But how they get there.
17:26That's the series.
17:27How?
17:28Have you tried reaching out to them at all?
17:32Sorry.
17:33Yeah, no, yes.
17:36But I talked with Netflix production,
17:39and they told me, no.
17:41They're not.
17:42It's not possible.
17:43It's not possible.
17:44They are not.
17:45They don't want.
17:46Yeah.
17:47They don't want.
17:47But I asked the nephew to talk to Miguel,
17:50and I think they talk together.
17:54That's interesting.
17:55And Miguel wants to see the series.
17:57And we know Narcos has been renewed for four seasons.
18:01They spent two seasons on Escobar's story.
18:03We don't know if Callie will be a chapter in season three,
18:07if it will go on to season four.
18:09But how would you describe the ending of this season
18:12and what it builds towards?
18:15Well, at the end of this season,
18:19I can't do that.
18:20I can't do that would be a huge spoiler.
18:23Or something to get everyone excited without spoiling.
18:26A tease.
18:27Something I want to say is that
18:29I don't know what happened in this season,
18:32but the actors who play in there,
18:37now we are really, really together.
18:41Yeah.
18:42That's something I wanted to say, too.
18:43Because I think that this, this, este equipo,
18:47this cast, it's really good.
18:50Well, it's interesting because your characters
18:52never wanted to all be together for, you know,
18:55safety reasons.
18:56Yeah.
18:57So, yeah.
18:58And besides, we had some different operations
19:00and different things to do,
19:02different responsibilities within the cartel.
19:05But this is one of the amazing things.
19:08We're Latinos, right?
19:10Not Latinos.
19:11Just like, let's not forget that Latins
19:13could be Italian, French, Portuguese, Spanish,
19:16all South America and Central America, right?
19:18And Romanians.
19:19That, those are the Latin countries, okay?
19:21Even Romania is a Latin country
19:23because it comes from Latin.
19:25That's it.
19:26So, I'm Portuguese.
19:27I'm from Europe.
19:29There's Alberto Aman, Pacho Herrera,
19:31who was born in Argentina
19:32and lives in Spain, Venezuela,
19:35Damiano Alcazar, Mexican.
19:37So, we're hot-blooded, okay?
19:41Warm-blooded.
19:42It's very easy for you to, you know,
19:46it's not that easy if you don't find the right people.
19:48But what happened is,
19:50till today, we have this cheesy name
19:52for a WhatsApp group,
19:54which is Narcos Never Forget.
19:58And we write to each other every day
20:02and we miss each other a lot.
20:04And that was so good because
20:06the story goes that the cartel members
20:09were very, very, very close.
20:11They were brothers.
20:13We were born next door
20:15and we grew up together.
20:18And finally comes Pacho Herrera,
20:20who was an homosexual,
20:23which was amazing.
20:25In Colombia, he really had to fight for his...
20:27At that moment, 30 years ago.
20:30Yes, 30 years ago, he really had to.
20:32He was my protege.
20:33Everyone loved him.
20:34And we became four brothers.
20:36And it's easy because they were loyal to the end
20:40and they had some business offers
20:45in order to betray the others.
20:49Never happened.
20:50And that is beautiful.
20:52That is really beautiful.
20:53And we came together
20:54and now we make love every day.
20:57I mean, that must help you guys find the humanity
20:59when you're portraying these,
21:01you know, essentially villains, bad guys,
21:05drug lords, terrible people.
21:06Does that help you to find the ways
21:08that they're relatable
21:09and that they're really,
21:10why they're really fun to watch
21:11for 10 episodes a season?
21:13I always say that these guys,
21:15you know, the difference between
21:16sell cocaine and sell whiskey,
21:22I don't know where is it,
21:24the difference.
21:25In business.
21:25It's a business operation, right.
21:26They are not a normal people,
21:31like everybody.
21:33But in this business,
21:35maybe you have to kill somebody.
21:36Right.
21:37That's the way.
21:39Yeah, that's it.
21:40You've got to kill someone
21:41in order to protect your business.
21:45But it's like any other,
21:47sometimes people think,
21:48I understand your question.
21:49I question myself a lot about some things.
21:51How can people do these amazingly violent crimes
21:56and it's step by step?
21:58You know that you start with white
22:00and you want to stay pure forever.
22:02You don't want to be a corrupt human being.
22:04I think of that myself.
22:07But it's like everything.
22:08It's just one day,
22:10it's just that, you know,
22:12dirty white,
22:13that pearl color would suit you.
22:16Okay, it's just pearl.
22:18And then light gray
22:19and then medium gray
22:20and then dark gray.
22:21And once you find out,
22:23suddenly you never thought
22:26you were going to be black
22:27and you're black.
22:27You're mean.
22:28You did it.
22:29It's so smooth, the transition.
22:31So it's just like any other business,
22:33but you become mean.
22:35Not mean,
22:35but you're doing mean things.
22:37You don't think they're mean anymore,
22:38which makes you mean.
22:39Yeah.
22:40I think it's always about power.
22:43When you have power,
22:44you need more power.
22:45And if you have to do bad things,
22:47you're going to do it.
22:48You are not going to think too twice.
22:51You just do it
22:52because you want more power
22:54and more and more.
22:55It could be politicians,
22:56it could be drugs dealers,
22:58it could be anything
22:59that have to be with power.
23:01And how did Cali open up
23:03the drug war to,
23:05I mean,
23:05completely change the game
23:06by being,
23:07you know,
23:08Pablo was more insular
23:09and it was more isolated.
23:11And Cali now brings it to America
23:13and the routes that you're using,
23:15it kind of opened up the world
23:17to the drug trade.
23:18Yes, absolutely.
23:21Cali at a certain point,
23:22they were responsible for
23:2480% of the cocaine
23:26brought into the U.S.
23:28after Pablo Escobar died
23:29and 90% into Europe.
23:32That is an incredible amount
23:34of cocaine.
23:37What was the question?
23:39What comes up in its place?
23:42What comes up after Cali?
23:43The legacy, I guess,
23:45Cali leaves behind.
23:45Well, I don't think
23:48there was ever a cartel
23:50as organized,
23:52as gentle,
23:54as in gentlemen,
23:56after the Cali cartel.
24:00Many of these cartels,
24:03there was a lot to learn,
24:04but not that part,
24:06not that clever part
24:08of trying to dominate
24:09and undermine
24:10all the powers,
24:12you know,
24:13media,
24:14justice,
24:15politics,
24:16you know,
24:16never again.
24:18They were good.
24:19Wow.
24:19Well, they are in Mexico now.
24:21Right.
24:22But a different kind.
24:23A very different kind.
24:25Yeah.
24:26All right.
24:26Well, thank you so much,
24:28you guys.
24:28Thanks for having us.
24:30Season 3 of Narcos,
24:31September 1st,
24:32releases the full season
24:33on Netflix.
24:34You will get to see
24:35these guys
24:36doing what they do
24:37and thank you
24:38for watching us.
24:39Thanks, guys,
24:39for coming.
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