The Penguin: dietro le quinte del gran finale

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Dietro le quinte del gran finale di The Penguin, la serie spin-off di The Batman targata HBO/MAX e prodotta da Warner Bros Discovery e DC Studios.

Transcript

00:00I'm gonna get you out of the east side ma, put you up somewhere real nice

00:07In a penthouse like you want, with a view of the whole friggin city

00:13Colin sent me The Ballad of Redding Jael by Oscar Wilde

00:23And in it one of the quotes is A Greater Little Thing

00:25And it's about how each man destroys the thing he loves

00:28And so given what happens in the finale, I thought it was an apt title for it

00:35The top of episode 8 is Frances' entree

00:38And we finally see some of Frances' backstory

00:41And the fact that she knew what Oswald did to her sons the whole time

00:46I got the devil in my house, Wax

00:48Well then maybe you let him go

00:50What Oz doesn't know is that she's asked Rex to kill him for her

00:55And so she says, we're going out

00:57And then they go to a jazz club

00:58But what Oz sees that as is a celebration of he has his mom back

01:03Oz sits with Frances in a booth and he tells her

01:06I know you miss him ma

01:08And then he turns around and he's so happy to be with his mom

01:12That moment is meant to be just a gut punch

01:16Like something's wrong with this kid

01:19I think it's always a question of nature versus nurture

01:23I know Frances has shaped him

01:25But I also know Oz shaped Frances too

01:28She made a choice when she chose to keep him alive

01:32And so she made a deal with the devil

01:34So there was a darkening by Frances because of Oz as well

01:38Don't give up on me

01:39She's just like, I don't have to do this tonight

01:43And she just takes one step at a time

01:45And then we find them in this knot all those years later

01:49One of the things that Lauren did so brilliantly

01:53Was the idea of the way that Oz understands the story

01:57Versus the way that we come to understand

01:59And this of course becomes a key aspect

02:01That Sophia ends up being able to exploit

02:05Sophia brings Frances back to this run-down jazz club

02:10That has a darkness that we haven't really seen

02:14In any other instance

02:16It's decayed and the chandelier's fallen from the Riddler's bombs

02:19From the shaking

02:20It's almost like an earthquake hit it

02:22I pitched Lauren the theme of the jungle

02:24Gotham is like a jungle

02:26It's a dangerous place

02:27And I felt that the club could play with that theme

02:31But in a fensible way

02:32So it's a very evocative place

02:35Sophia has this very sophisticated group therapy session

02:39Where all he has to do is this one thing

02:41And he doesn't have the cojones to do it

02:44Just say it, tell her

02:45It's just your disease talking, ma

02:47I hate you

02:48I hate you for what you did

02:50I never stopped hating you

02:51All these years the sound has never come out

02:55That's like my babies are dead sound

02:58I shouldn't let Rooks kill you when I had the chance

03:00Colin and Dee Dee are both such beasts

03:03And what they had to do and say to each other

03:05It's like this ultimate unmasking

03:07But that Sophia is witnessing him hearing things from his mother

03:11That he can never unhear

03:12You're the goddamn devil

03:14Is enormously satisfying

03:16There's nothing better

03:17Up until it all sort of goes haywire

03:21Sophia decides to leave Gotham behind

03:32But first before she goes anywhere

03:34She needs to hurt Oz

03:35It all seems great until everything goes to hell

03:39In thinking about where that scene should be

03:41We ended up landing on the idea of an airport

03:43Because it was so great to see Sophia almost get away with it

03:48I have always said this show is a tragedy

03:50And so that's where you really start to feel it

03:53What we wanted to do is Oz drive her towards the water under a bridge

03:59It's the Elliot Bridge that's very emblematic of our class disparity in Gotham

04:05I always knew Sophia would end up back in Arkham

04:07And that there would be a final Oz and Sophia showdown

04:10This is a show about Oz

04:12It's called The Penguin

04:13And you know in some form he's going to rise above in some way

04:17It is a fate worse than death for her to go back to that place

04:25He really turns the tables and there is no worse thing to happen to her

04:29Oz wants to hurt her in the way that she has hurt him

04:32And in his mind, once you mess with his mom, there's no going back

04:36He's going to make sure Sophia's punished

04:39Towards the end of the show, Victor has seen Oz at his most vulnerable

04:48The two of those guys have been through everything together

04:51Someone seeing his vulnerability feels like a weakness

04:54And in Oz's opinion, he cannot achieve what he needs to achieve

04:59If he has those weaknesses around

05:01For him to be betrayed by the person that he considers family now

05:05After we have finally done this thing

05:08We got to the top of the game

05:09It made me, reading the scripts

05:13Go, wow

05:14This guy's worse than I thought

05:17It wasn't for nothing

05:20The fact that he goes to such extremes

05:24Because he's so broken

05:25That's the tragedy of the story

05:27It's Oz really in that moment when he kills Victor

05:30Killing his own heart

05:31And becoming a monster

05:33Oz at the end of this show

05:37He's not the Oz we left in the movie

05:39He's progressed in his criminality

05:41For me, it was always Oz and his mother

05:43Oz needs his mother's love

05:45He will get to the top

05:47But he will not have his mother's love

05:49She ends up in a state

05:50She never wanted to be in

05:52That he knew she never wanted to be in

05:53But he cannot let go of her

05:55The story's about having to fully stare into

05:59What that desire actually gets you

06:02Which is less than nothing

06:05It all plays out through this transactional relationship

06:08Where he's getting people to play the roles

06:11In the story

06:12The way he needs them to be

06:14And you realize just how broken he is

06:17And Eve is an incredibly key aspect to that

06:21Eve and Oz have a very transactional relationship

06:25But I think they understand each other

06:27They're both survivors

06:28She is in this ultimate role play for him

06:32She's really taking on the energy of his mother

06:35Literally taking on the wardrobe

06:38The look

06:38In another situation

06:40It would have been a romantic moment

06:42But in this series

06:43It's a very dark moment

06:44Now the woman who Oz pays to sleep with

06:49He's made her into his mother

06:50By wearing his mother's dress

06:52It was always having Eve dress up like his mother

06:55In that dress

06:56Which we established early

06:57And see that Oz is delusional

07:00That there is something darker in him

07:02Than you might suspect

07:03I knew that the goal of the series

07:08By the end

07:09Was to have him rise to the top

07:10Or get closer to that goal

07:12But when he achieves power

07:15That he's lost a lot of himself as well

07:17I've always sought to make it feel operatic in ways

07:26To have it feel very tragic in the end

07:28So even when Oz succeeds

07:29And even when Oz gets everything he wants

07:30I wanted it to feel tragic

07:32He created his own delusion in that way

07:35It's a very twisted, twisted way to end

07:38Gotham's yours, sweetheart

07:46Nothing's standing in your way now

07:50Nothing's standing in her way now

07:54What can't you do if it's

08:02The lock and window

08:04can relax

08:04It's a veryевич

08:07Grazie a tutti

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