00:00We're joining us now on the programme live from Beirut is Stephanie Khoury, political journalist for L'Orient Le Jour.
00:05Thanks very much for being with us on the programme.
00:07So five years on, inevitably a time, of course, when many Lebanese are going to remember those who lost their lives.
00:13And also thinking to themselves, just why has no one been held to account?
00:18Yes, it's quite surreal for us here in Lebanon, right after the blast, the authorities vote to uncover the truth about what happened and held officials accountable in a couple of days.
00:35Five years later, we still do not know what happened.
00:40And most importantly, no one has been held accountable.
00:44We don't know who is responsible for getting the ammonium nitrate in the port in the first place.
00:52Those in the government and in the state that were aware that the material was being stocked and that it was a ticking bong for the city are still, no one has been held accountable.
01:05And we don't know who lit up the fire that led to the explosion on August 4.
01:10So, yes, it is quite surreal and very hard to accept for people here five years later that we are almost back to square one.
01:23We heard in the report some of the reasons that may be holding up this investigation.
01:28But what do the people feel about it?
01:30Are there specific individuals or specific cases that people blame for the reasons why there's been no conclusions yet?
01:36There's a lot of capacity around this investigation.
01:42Very little known is known about the content of what the judge has access to and not access to.
01:50There's also a lot of rumors and speculations about what happened.
01:54For a long time, a lot of Lebanese were convinced that it was an Israeli air attack.
02:01Today, we know that there's very, very little chance that the explosion was triggered by an airstrike.
02:10Another part of the country was holding Hezbollah accountable for what happened, saying that it was holding munitions or material that it wanted to get rid of by setting up a fire that led to the giant explosion that we saw.
02:28So the fact that we have very little access to the content of the investigation, the fact that this entire explosion seems up to now very absurd and surreal for the population has led a lot of misinformation, rumors and speculations about what happened.
02:51And we also heard in that report, didn't we, that the new president or relatively new president, President Ahun, who came to power back in January, came to power pledging to push forward, pledging to get this report released.
03:03I mean, obviously, he's failed in that, has he?
03:05Yeah, well, the shift of power that the new president and the new prime minister that arrived at the beginning of the year allowed for the investigation to resume.
03:17The investigation of Judge Bittar, who's in charge of the investigation, was stopped for about two years.
03:24The new power allowed it to resume, so the judge has been able to reopen, restart its hearings.
03:37Everyone now is wondering what is taking so long, why after a month of reopening of the investigation, we haven't seen anything concrete.
03:46It's very hard to tell what's happening inside.
03:50Is he lacking elements to proceed to the accusation?
03:55Is he waiting for the entire fight to be solid?
04:01We do not know what's happening inside.
04:03It is protected by the secrecy of the investigation.
04:06What we know is that the government is steadfast in its willingness to allow for the investigation to proceed and to protect the justice from any political and outside interference.
04:21And just finally, I mean, you mentioned earlier on how different people and different factions within the country are hoping to hear different things.
04:29Whichever conclusion finally does come about, presumably will be disbelieved by a certain proportion of people living there, particularly because there have been these delays.
04:44Will it be disregarded by the population?
04:49I would say it depends how clear the judgment is.
04:52What I mean by that is, if we take the comparison with the judgment that was given after the assassination of Rafiq al-Hairiri, the judgment was given many, many years after the accident happened.
05:11The judgment pointed towards a specific direction.
05:16Specific individuals were named by the verdict.
05:19But no clear political organization was named and held accountable.
05:26If we reach a conclusion similar in the port explosion, meaning some individuals are being accused, but no big political organization or a clear regime or a clear political party is being pointed out.
05:45It might be that the judgment will be misunderstood, misread by the population and perhaps not have a very big impact on the feeling that the Lebanese have in terms of having answers and a sense of justice.
06:01Good to talk to you on the program today.
06:03Thanks very much, Stephanie Koury, political journalist.
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