- yesterday
In a candid interview, Dr. Dhriti Banerjee, the first woman director of the 110-year-old Zoological Survey of India (ZSI), revealed that there was no women's toilet on the executive floor of the headquarters when she took charge. She stated, 'I should not be the only woman for the next 150 years,' underscoring the need for more women in leadership to uplift others. Dr. Banerjee spoke on the critical state of India's biodiversity, highlighting that the nation holds 7% of the world's biodiversity on just 2% of the global landmass. She detailed conservation efforts for stressed ecosystems like mangroves and coral reefs through community-led initiatives and government programs like MISHTI and Amrit Dharohar. The interview also covered the threat of invasive exotic species, using the red-eared slider turtle as an example of how they disrupt local ecosystems and push native species towards endangerment.
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00:00So I'm going to say this with every last bit of well-meaningness in my heart to you.
00:06Please don't ever adopt a turtle.
00:10I made this mistake two years ago when a friend was leaving the country
00:14and she passed on her baby red-eared sliders to me.
00:19And I took it because the other option was she was going to throw it into Sukna Lake.
00:22And I did my research and I realized that these turtles are very harmful for our native wildlife and I kept them.
00:28They were a nightmare.
00:31They need vitamin D for their shells so I had to get these special bulbs
00:36and suddenly I was spending more on bulbs than on my bras.
00:39Then they need special vitamin A supplements.
00:42They need live insects which I was importing from Chennai
00:45and then I was feeding those insects so I could feed the turtles.
00:49And it was like a poop factory had exploded in my house constantly.
00:54No matter how many filters I bought, it was a disaster.
00:57And there was a point at which I genuinely said,
01:00look, it doesn't matter, just release them.
01:03You know, all the turtles have to die anyway, sooner or later.
01:06It's okay.
01:07What will two do?
01:09But the truth is it's a lot more than two that's getting into our systems
01:13in, you know, various parts of the country.
01:15And that's my first question.
01:17With all these exotic pets that are coming into our country, how do we protect our species?
01:22So I'd like to start by asking you, Srinali, what did you do with the turtle?
01:30They died from vitamin A deficiency.
01:33Their eyes burst one day, it was traumatic.
01:36So good they died naturally because otherwise if you had released a turtle in the pond somewhere
01:42near your house, it would have thrown the entire ecosystem of that particular pond out of gear.
01:49And if there were certain indigenous turtles in those small ponds,
01:56that turtle would have definitely pushed it out of the system.
01:59It's as simple as that because the exotic species are so aggressive because they're coming from a different state.
02:08Think about migrants who come over.
02:11When they start in one place and then they're moved out of their own place of residence
02:16and they go back to another place, they survive.
02:19It's not easy surviving in a foreign territory.
02:22So Indians going, suppose students, I've seen Indian students from India when they're going to U.S.
02:29to U.K., abroad, anywhere, the amount of effort, the fight, the resilience they show.
02:37Similarly, any exotic species which is introduced into our system is a lot more resilient
02:42than it's basically it is even in its own country.
02:46So the more resilient species, what happens?
02:49It pushes the indigenous species out of the system.
02:53And introduction of these exotic species have led to the position where
02:57our own indigenous turtles have gone into the endangered list and it has gone into the CITES appendix list also.
03:05Because turtles, when it is you are importing them from any foreign countries and keeping them here,
03:15especially the endangered slider turtles, they grow huge.
03:19And once it grows, as you say, that you can't manage.
03:22So the easiest thing people do is that they don't want to kill them or cull them, as we call it.
03:28They, out of compassion, they release them in a pond, which is nearby.
03:34So they think that doing it is an act of compassion.
03:40But what exactly they're doing is that they're killing the particular ecosystem.
03:45So if you're going to a hotel, the fish on your plate, which once upon a time would have been a mahasir,
03:53once upon a time would have been a bhetki, now all you are eating is a pangas.
03:58You don't know that you are eating pangas because it is so close to the original bhetki and the bhetki hybrids.
04:06It grows in tons and tons.
04:09So gradually you are paying the same price for a fish, which is not,
04:14suppose the fish actually cost 200 rupees and a bhetki cost 1000 rupees.
04:20You are paying 1000, 2000 rupees for eating a 200 rupees fish.
04:25Because the pangas has moved the bhetki out of the system, out of the economics of the country.
04:31So any exotic species, now we are developing legislations for importing these species
04:39and also taking care of these species as well as introducing these species into our system.
04:46Exactly the way you think about refugees entering your country and they are taking over.
04:52We have seen this in UK where the entire East European refugees have gone in and they've taken over.
04:57So it's a lot like that when they basically take over.
05:02And a country like India, which is a mega diverse country,
05:06we have 7% of the global biodiversity in India.
05:12As on date, we have 1,5,416 species in our country.
05:19And we have only 2% of the global land mass.
05:22Still, we have 7% of the biodiversity globally.
05:28And in spite of the fact that we have the highest population in the whole world.
05:32So that we have not eaten everything out.
05:35It goes kudos to us.
05:36We should clap for ourselves that we still have this amount of biodiversity left in us.
05:41So my thing is that we don't bring in more new species, however well they look like, however attractive they are, people are doing it.
05:51But now the government have introduced a positive list where you are including those species which are not ecologically going to push the indigenous species out of the system.
06:03They will try to remain within their carrying capacity, less than their carrying capacity, will not breed.
06:11So that end of the day, like you've heard about the African catfish.
06:15So all you are eating is tilapia, is an African catfish which has basically taken over the local ponds as well as the local markets.
06:23And that is the same thing which goes into your food system because of the excessive development in the food industry.
06:31What fish you are having on your plate you don't know because the way it is now being processed and treated.
06:37And we are Bengalis so we care a lot about fish.
06:39Yes, so I'm speaking, I'm sorry Delhi, I don't think all of you eat fish but because I'm a Bengali so, you know.
06:45It matters.
06:45Yeah, it matters a lot to us that we have the right fish at the right season and the right time on the right plate.
06:52So that's the reason I was, but this is one of the most common examples which I could give so that I can explain since I guess most of you are not a scientist or coming from a background of biology like I am.
07:04So I'm really glad you talked about our biodiversity because it is something to feel proud of and something that's amazing.
07:13But for a lot of this diversity to remain, we need certain specialized land and certain specialized areas and mangroves, coastal reefs, wetlands particularly.
07:26These are very important and open field areas for certain birds as well.
07:31Those are shrinking.
07:33So do you think we'd be able to save some because they really are shrinking at an alarming rate?
07:39We have started, you know, when you said this, yes, I do admit that there is, these ecosystems are stressed out.
07:53The coral reefs, the coastal ecosystems, the mangroves, they are stressed out.
07:57But we are doing our best bit to conserve them.
08:01It's not easy as I go back and say, we have the diversity which we have.
08:07It's difficult and it is a very, what would I say, exhaustive effort on part of the government to conserve this.
08:16And we are doing, trying to do our bit in every possible way.
08:20As on date, we have 82 Ramsar sites, which is the wetlands, you know, they're now Ramsar sites, they're the heritage sites.
08:28And they're also called as now Amrit Dharovars because of the ecosystem services they provide.
08:35Not only like they are, they harbor a unique ecosystem, but also for the ecosystem services they provide.
08:42So these Ramsar sites on 2047 are the Vixit Bharat deadline which we have.
08:48We are supposed to increase it by 100.
08:50So that is a way we are trying to protect them.
08:53For coral reefs and mangroves, there have been extensive work on protecting and conserving both the coral reefs and the mangroves.
09:02These conservation does not start with the ministry or does not start with the scientists who are working in them.
09:10I come from Zoological Survey of India and the Ministry of Environment, Forest and Climate Change.
09:15So our job is to generate, go and do research in the field and generate the baseline data.
09:21On the basis of the baseline data, what we have seen, the ministry forms informed policies for conservation.
09:29What we have seen that in the mangroves, especially in Sundarbans as well as in Orissa Bitarkanika as well as in Pichavaram,
09:37there is a community-led conservation effort which has become one of the major mainstay of conservation.
09:44So conservation starts from protection, even if the ecosystems, specialized ecosystems are stressed out,
09:54but extensive conservation measures are taken up.
09:575,000 square kilometers of mangroves and 5,700 square kilometers of coral reef is what India possesses,
10:05which is a blessing for us because of the services they provide.
10:10It also is a blessing for us in the sense that it raises the stature of India as a protector of biodiversity.
10:18As we know, we play a very important role in the cop for the biodiversity cops also.
10:24And this protection has been taken up very distinctly.
10:28There is for the mangrove, we have the MISTI program for protection of shoreline habitats
10:33and for generating tangible incomes for those communities who are residing in the mangrove areas.
10:39You must have heard of Sundarbans, you must have heard about the conflicts,
10:43about difficult lives of people who are residing there.
10:47In the coastal ecosystem also, especially also coral reef,
10:50we in Zoological Survey of India, we have basically translocated 23,000 coral reef colonies
10:56in the Gulf of Katz to a different area and we have grown them up.
11:01In fact, it is now, I mean, there's no video so I couldn't have shown, you would have been amazed.
11:07Like when, they are like gardens which you create in the sea.
11:10You'll be transplanting the coral reefs on the seabed, on the birocks,
11:15and you could see the reefs growing.
11:17Gradually, once the reef starts growing, the different fishes, they start coming in.
11:21And then, the different other marine fauna also comes inside.
11:25So, these are the activities with the government has taken up along with the different institutions
11:30in our country, like the Zoological Survey of India, the NCSCM, the Ministry of Environment,
11:35Forest, as well as several NGOs who are working together.
11:39That there is a concerted effort in protection.
11:42But, for everybody who is sitting here, we should know that it's important,
11:46you must be going for tourism purposes there.
11:49So, be responsible when you are going there and do your bit for conserving.
11:54There will be a lot of entrepreneurs here.
11:56So, do your bit as a part of the CSR for funding initiatives at the local and the community level.
12:03So, there's these small, small community groups which are protecting these areas,
12:07these fragile ecosystems.
12:09They are, they can take the benefit of the, because the government has a limitation of pumping in funds.
12:15So, we would be looking forward for individuals as well as CSR funds to be pumped into the system.
12:21The more the merrier, jitna gur utna methas, so as you say, the more funds we have,
12:26the better is the conservation efforts.
12:30Sriti, you're not just contributing towards protecting our species,
12:35but also towards challenging gender norms,
12:38because you are the first woman's director of the Zoological Survey of India.
12:46What has your journey been like?
12:49Okay.
12:50So, Zoological Survey of India, we are 110 years old this year.
12:55So, since we were, the inception was in 1916.
12:58And in 105 years, I was the first woman to be selected as a director.
13:08The interesting bit was, when I was selected to be the director,
13:12and when I got my offer letter, it didn't strike me anything unusual at all.
13:17But when it came in the newspapers, then I realized,
13:20oh my God, this is something big.
13:22Then I am the first woman in 100 years.
13:24But as you say, I mean like breaking the glass ceiling or the gender bias,
13:30I would say that my office, the headquarter office,
13:34the first floor is a power center where all the directors,
13:37the finance, the admin, the director, and the admin sits.
13:41There was no ladies' toilet.
13:43So, I first basically constructed a ladies' toilet.
13:48So, think about an organization, 110 years,
13:51but it didn't have a ladies' toilet in the first floor.
13:55So, but interestingly, I have to say,
13:58in 1947, 49, we had a lady scientist.
14:03She was called as Mrs. Mansu Khani.
14:05And the kind of job we do, it's not like sitting in the office and working.
14:09We go out in the field.
14:10We go high up in the Himalayas, from Ladakh to Kanyakumari, as I say,
14:15from the northeast of Arunachal Pradesh to here, Ladakh,
14:19and from down in the sea, under the sea, coral reefs, mountain shores, coastal areas, deserts,
14:26everywhere we go and work.
14:28So, she had been going out and working with men in 1949,
14:33in a team where all were men and she was the only woman.
14:36So, kudos to the family who had allowed her to go there.
14:39Because it is interesting to know that 1949,
14:43a family allowing a lady to go out on a survey for a month
14:47because that time there were no planes, no trains, only buses.
14:51We used to, basically, they used to go walking and into local,
14:54through local buses and local trains.
14:56So, for a survey period lasting for a month,
14:59where you need to stay in camps,
15:02stay in places where there may be only one or two rooms available.
15:05So, you may have to share a room with your men colleagues
15:09and that family had allowed her to go and do that.
15:12So, however much we say that,
15:14okay, we are not as emancipated as we think,
15:17we were more emancipated.
15:19But the only thing is that,
15:21it is surprised that our organization never got to have a female director.
15:28So, that took another 50 years for a lady to be chosen as a director.
15:32So, as you say that, it is very important for a country like ours
15:37that women to be in leadership positions.
15:41Otherwise, you do not pull other women up.
15:45It is very important that women, if they are on the top,
15:49the first thing they would do,
15:51they will be supporting and trying to pull a person
15:53who is lower down the rung up.
15:55So, that they also can create an ecosystem where there will be more.
15:59I have been doing it instinctively,
16:02or I would say just because I think,
16:04they say, okay, madam, you are biased.
16:06I am biased, fine.
16:07But then I also go with that same tagline that,
16:10in 100 years, I am the first woman.
16:12So, the next thing I say,
16:13I should not be the only woman for the next 150 years.
16:17And in the level of field of environment,
16:19I think sustainability always happens in the hands of women.
16:25So, if women are not holding your hands,
16:28you never make this world sustainable.
16:31And also, today, as on date,
16:33India is still a developing country,
16:36how much we say.
16:37So, it is in the hands of you sitting here.
16:40You have to make it into a developed country
16:42in the next 50 years to come.
16:43Maybe in the next 10 years,
16:45before 2047,
16:47it should be the women who will be able
16:48to make India a developed country.
16:50So, that transition has to be done by you.
16:53And, you know, it is a lot more than just the tagline
16:56because, and I thought I would wait till the end
16:59to share this with you,
17:00but my friend's daughter loves earthworms.
17:03And she keeps saying,
17:05what will you do with earthworms?
17:07You know, study math.
17:09And she took a news clipping
17:10of your position
17:12and said, I will be this.
17:15So, it does help.
17:16And thank you.
17:17Thank you so much for sharing.
17:18So, here, I would like to add one line
17:21because there are so many ladies here.
17:22That's a very small example I always give.
17:25That, suppose you are sitting with your family
17:28or barish ke din hai,
17:29you are having pakor on the plate.
17:31So, everybody is instinctively watching TV
17:34and picking up one piece.
17:36And there is only one piece left.
17:39Instinctively, you put your hand,
17:41your daughter also puts your hand.
17:42So, what happens?
17:44The mother will pull her hand back
17:45and allow the son or the daughter
17:47to have the last bit.
17:49This is what sustainability is.
17:51You protect, you preserve your future,
17:55not for yourself,
17:56but for your next generation,
17:58but for posterity.
17:59That is your role
18:00in this country,
18:02in this world
18:03and in this environment.
18:04Thank you so much.
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