- 8 months ago
Malaysia faces a growing waste crisis, with plastic making up 13.2% of household waste. Despite a 35.38% recycling rate in 2023, nearly one tonne of recyclables was lost, costing RM291 million. Landfills are nearing capacity and may be full by 2050.
The plastics industry, valued at RM61.44 billion, drives economic growth but worsens environmental harm. Only 24% of key plastic resins were recycled in 2019. Many businesses export waste, shifting the problem rather than solving it.
Decentralised solutions offer promise. The Bukit Tagar WTE plant processes 2,500 tonnes daily, generates 12 MW, and adds RM25 million to the economy annually. Innovations like The Asher and the Circular Economy Blueprint aim for 40% recycling by 2025, pushing for sustainable, local action.
The plastics industry, valued at RM61.44 billion, drives economic growth but worsens environmental harm. Only 24% of key plastic resins were recycled in 2019. Many businesses export waste, shifting the problem rather than solving it.
Decentralised solutions offer promise. The Bukit Tagar WTE plant processes 2,500 tonnes daily, generates 12 MW, and adds RM25 million to the economy annually. Innovations like The Asher and the Circular Economy Blueprint aim for 40% recycling by 2025, pushing for sustainable, local action.
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NewsTranscript
00:00Hello and welcome to Niaga Spotlight with me, Tamina Kausjee.
00:13Niaga Spotlight goes through the week in Economic Analysis and Future Affairs.
00:17Well, this week on Future Affairs, we're taking a deep dive into rethinking waste management for sustainability in Malaysia.
00:25Now, a couple of facts and figures before we get started, of course.
00:28Plastic waste constitutes 13.2% of Malaysia's household waste, with single-use plastics being a significant contributor.
00:36Despite a recycling rate of close to 40% in 2023, nearly one tonne of recyclable materials were discarded, costing the nation close to RM300 million.
00:46The plastics industry, which is valued at close to RM62 billion in 2023, faces a huge paradox.
00:54While it drives economic growth, it also exacerbates environmental degradation.
01:00So, Malaysia's landfills are also nearing capacity.
01:03Projections are indicating potential exhaustion as quick as 2050.
01:07The recycling infrastructure is indeed struggling to keep pace, processing only 24% of key plastic resins in 2019.
01:16So, such inefficiencies are resulting in significant economic losses as well as environmental harm.
01:21Most businesses prioritise waste relocation over elimination, often exporting waste to countries with less stringent regulations.
01:30Such an approach externalises environmental costs and also undermines sustainable practices.
01:36So, overall, plenty to discuss, a lot to chew on.
01:41I have the absolute pleasure of welcoming to join me in the studios today live for this very critical discussion.
01:46Pang Suile, who is co-founder and executive director, The Asher by Pamerai, Sundarian, Berhad.
01:52Joined with Adjunct Professor Anthony Wong Kim Hui, an environmentalist and owner of the Frangipani, Langkawi.
01:59A very good morning, gentlemen.
02:00Thank you so much for making time for Niagara Spotlight.
02:02Good morning, Tamina.
02:03Yeah, very fine.
02:04Thank you for having us today.
02:07Fantastic.
02:08So, Pang, perhaps I could get started with you leading us into the fact that Malaysia, of course, has long treated waste as a liability.
02:17So, what would it take, in your opinion, to economically and politically actually flip that paradigm and treat it as an asset class instead?
02:26Something which would then actually bring us closer towards reshaping and rethinking how we manage our waste.
02:35Well, not just in Malaysia, but all around the world.
02:39Sure.
02:40In every single country, they are raising each other in terms of urbanisation, infrastructure development, modernisation, etc.
02:49And with that, you can't run away at the fact that waste is going to be more and more and more, right?
02:57And then human population, the world population, is set to pick at 9 billion in decades to come, if not centuries.
03:05And with more people on Earth, that means there are more produce, more productions, more manufacturing, and, of course, more consumptions, more post-consumptions, etc.
03:16So, that part of that liability that you look at it, looking at it, it is not a risk or a liability to the human race.
03:33I think the human race is the liability to the problem, in this case.
03:40Because the reason I say that, I give you an example, in the case of the plastic straw in the nostril of the turtle,
03:49one of the most shared image when it comes to plastic issues, environment, protecting the life, the habitual life,
03:59that's the most commonly used photos.
04:04And in that photos, we, as human race, pathetically, as usual, when there's an issue, the first thing that we react to is, we point finger.
04:17It's always other people's fault. It's not our fault.
04:20In this case, more pathetically, the one that we are pointing finger to is the plastic.
04:28The plastic is the one that's not going anywhere.
04:31We are pointing to that.
04:33But that plastic came from who?
04:36Where?
04:37The consumption.
04:38It's us, a human race.
04:39Conveniently use a plastic straw and then just irresponsibly discarded it.
04:45Either, even if you, and I say irresponsibly discarded, discarding the plastic straw, it's not just you putting it into the bin
04:54and then that bin was collected by a garbage collector and then it goes to, maybe just drop off at some dump sites,
05:03illegal dump sites, or maybe to the landfill, or maybe into the drain.
05:08And even if it is going to the landfill, it is an irresponsible discard.
05:13In the context of waste management, Malaysia, all around the world, the definition of waste management,
05:25I just want to pick your brain.
05:29What do you understand of waste management, the spectrum of waste management?
05:35Well, waste management, the way in which consumers at the end responsibly conduct it is by separating your waste.
05:43But, and I think this is something which increasingly many of us are noticing,
05:47even within our own lifestyles, that condominium, residential areas, yes,
05:53that when the garbage pickup comes, they take it out of the carefully separated bins
05:59and they actually put it into one garbage truck.
06:02So, I think there's a fundamental disconnect, right, Pang?
06:05So, let's talk about looking at how exactly we can actually get out of this bind
06:13and perhaps move more into boosting not only recycling rates,
06:18but doing this a little bit more responsibly, a little more logically,
06:23because clearly the system cannot continue.
06:25Great, Tamina.
06:27You see, logically, in my words, I will use effectively and also in the most practical manner,
06:36because I'm an engineer by training, because for me, being effective, being practical is important, right?
06:42You can have all the rings, the bells and decos, the musics, the gimmicks,
06:48but you have to be effective and practical, right?
06:53Now, according to WHO, right, the most preferred strategy when it comes to waste management
07:00is treatment at source.
07:04And when I say treatment here, it's we eliminate or reduce,
07:10and or in my favourite phrase is making it disappear.
07:14Right.
07:15At source.
07:15Okay, at source.
07:17At source.
07:17Most importantly, yeah, not transporting it here, there, et cetera.
07:21So, when I ask you, what is your idea of waste management?
07:25For me, the definition of waste management that is currently being practised
07:28in Malaysia, all around the world, anywhere around the world,
07:31whether it's developing countries or developed countries,
07:33the waste management that they are doing is relocate, relocate, hide.
07:40Hide.
07:41That's right.
07:41So, in this hiding, and the hiding place is either a, well, level one, level two, level three, level four landfills,
07:48it could be, or the dump site, or illegal dumping ground, or the river, or the drain.
07:55So, it's relocating, relocating, relocating, and hiding.
07:58And this system has worked for centuries, and it has been so irresponsibly effective.
08:08Because why?
08:10Because public has no issues.
08:12I'll give you an instance yourself.
08:14You wake up in the morning, you get ready, you come to work,
08:17you are not affected by the fact of how waste are being managed.
08:22Everywhere you get from, you get out from your house, you get to your car,
08:25you drive out, and then you go on the road, you arrive at office,
08:28you don't see rubbish piling up anywhere.
08:32Maybe you see some pieces by the roadside,
08:34some hooligan just chug after they have a cigarette, etc.
08:38Probably you have that, but overall, you don't see garbage being piled up everywhere,
08:43around the country.
08:44And when people come to the country, foreigners come to the country,
08:47they say our country is clean.
08:48Because we have been very effective at relocating and hiding.
08:55Exactly.
08:56So moving the discussion into a different sector,
08:58thanks very much, Pang, for those insights.
09:01Prof. Anthony, you've also led sustainability initiatives
09:03within the hospitality sector, one which is not traditionally a focus.
09:08So how can policymakers perhaps make more effectively integrated
09:13tourism-driven waste streams?
09:15Tell me a little bit about your experience over the past few decades.
09:18As a naturalist and environmentalist, you cannot get rid of all waste.
09:24And I totally support Pang.
09:26You must do it on site.
09:29The tourism industry is one of the biggest industries in the world,
09:33and they are one of the most polluting.
09:35Because they use a lot of energy, they eat a lot,
09:39and there's a lot of packaging.
09:41Single-use packaging.
09:43Yes, single-use plastic.
09:44So policy has to be policy plus enforcement.
09:50It has to be...
09:53Because our country, we have plenty of policy,
09:57but enforcement is very lacking.
09:59So I believe I represent the hotel industry.
10:05I'm the secretary of hotel owners' association.
10:10Now, the policy is they don't teach in hospitality school.
10:16They don't teach you to separate the waste.
10:18No school teachers.
10:19I believe part of the hospitality, you should learn how to separate.
10:24But I believe we have to go a bit more back.
10:28Sure.
10:29From primary school, kindergarten, secretary to university,
10:33must have section on waste separation.
10:35But you cannot get rid of all waste.
10:37At least the organic waste can be looked after, done on site.
10:42All schools have got garden.
10:45So if you do it on site,
10:47because 40 to 50% of waste dump is organic waste.
10:51So making sure that you're composting,
10:54your zero-waste kitchens are actually integral.
10:56So you just do it on site.
10:57Don't take it to dump site.
11:00Then sewage is a waste that people don't talk about.
11:06There are technology that is nature-based solution.
11:09Yeah, we call them constructed wetland.
11:14I have developed one of the most efficient systems.
11:17I've been doing it 20 years at French Planet Langkawi.
11:21I've done it 30 years in Jungle Lodge in Gombak.
11:25So there are technology, and the government has acknowledged it.
11:29It was approved in 2017.
11:31I pushed it through, approved by Environment Ministry.
11:34And then Parliament Act encouraged this use from 2021-2025 Act.
11:40Use nature-based solution to treat human waste.
11:44If you have space.
11:45If I may add, whatever Prof. Anthony has said on the constructed wetland,
11:50he may have left out.
11:52It was also mentioned in RMK 12.
11:55It was mentioned in RMK 12 that constructed wetland is one of the preferred solution
12:03when it comes to treating waste water as well.
12:07And what Prof. Anthony has said,
12:09your footways can go to the garden, that part,
12:12and then you have your sewage water that goes to a constructed wetland.
12:15Then the non-organics, everything, everything else, come to me.
12:18Yeah, that's right.
12:19Exactly.
12:20So there's actually a very harmonious ecosystem that exists.
12:23It's just about, I think, expanding that reach.
12:25And how about, because you've been so long in the tourism industry, Prof. Anthony,
12:29I wanted to ask you about what is currently a bit of a missed opportunity, right?
12:33Waste as a tourism differentiator.
12:36If enough facilities, not just eco-resorts,
12:40but even the huge ones which are urban-based,
12:43take on the same mandate,
12:44that would actually be a huge selling point for Malaysia.
12:47Yes, in fact, I think the ASEAN Summit has brought up,
12:54which is taking place this week in Kuala Lumpur,
12:58and they have looked at sustainability as one of the key factors
13:02for ASEAN to move forward,
13:04because waste is a big issue.
13:07Okay, I won't talk about.
13:09Most people go to beach resort,
13:12and most of the popular beach resort,
13:14sad to say, whether it's Phuket or Bali or Krabi or Boracay,
13:23it smells of shit,
13:25because the wastewater treatment is not sufficient.
13:29So it's discharged into it,
13:32and they are mostly class two.
13:33That means you cannot actually swim.
13:34Fortunately, our government understands,
13:39so they are possible doing the first thing in Pantai Tengah Langkawi,
13:45they are building a $40 million constructed wetland
13:51to treat the waste from Inda water and grey water
13:56using the system I developed.
13:58Right.
13:58Yeah, and UNDP is also helping redang,
14:03because it's too far away from Inda water treatment,
14:09so they are using this system there,
14:11but acquiring land takes a bit of time.
14:14So natural waste is easier to get rid of,
14:19or can be solved,
14:21but it is the plastic waste and the other...
14:23The non-organics.
14:24The non-organics, that's much more difficult.
14:27Absolutely.
14:28And speaking about the non-organics,
14:29back to you, Pang.
14:30So of course, much of the policy focus
14:32is naturally on post-consumer waste,
14:35but at the same time,
14:36what economic blind spots are we then ignoring
14:38a little more upstream manufacturing and supply chains?
14:43And these economic blind spots then, of course,
14:45entrench inefficiency as well as profit
14:48from waste into the system.
14:50Well, the issue that we are looking at
14:55is uncontrollable amount of waste produced.
15:01A daily barrage, yeah.
15:03So it's a challenge for all,
15:06and the reason behind for that immense generation
15:11is because of human beings are consuming more,
15:15and there are more human beings alive.
15:16And businesses' goal is to produce more
15:20and sell more, produce more and sell more.
15:23And from, of course, from the productions,
15:25then they are, through their production,
15:28they are looking at cost efficiency,
15:30how do they get the cheapest material,
15:32the fastest way to get it out,
15:33and then market it and then sell it
15:36at the highest profit possible
15:38for whatever product that they do.
15:39So in that context,
15:42the alignment of the business
15:46is all about cost efficiency.
15:48It's not about how is my business
15:52responsible for the entire cycle of this.
15:56So they do not source for the right material,
16:00they do not intend to make the product
16:04to last longer.
16:05Most of the products are designed
16:07intentionally to last a certain period of time
16:09so that you buy more.
16:11If I'm going to build you
16:11a very hardy and good quality product,
16:16you're going to use it for 15 years,
16:18and then that change over for purchase
16:19is going to be after 15 years.
16:22So then you have more products
16:24being produced, being consumed,
16:27and then spoiled,
16:28a new one,
16:30and then the spoiled one
16:31is going to be discarded.
16:32So the approach for waste management,
16:36I always tell people,
16:37first, it's about reduction.
16:39Reduction in terms of our consumption
16:41as individual.
16:43And waste management is not,
16:45it is a service,
16:47public service by the government,
16:49but it's not the government's responsibility.
16:53It's every single one of us
16:54responsibly,
16:56responsible for the waste
16:59that is being produced every day.
17:02not just from your house,
17:04even when you are going
17:05to the shopping mall
17:06or to the cafe.
17:07I want to share with you
17:09a story about myself,
17:10Camina.
17:11I throw out zero rubbish
17:15from my house
17:16and from my consumption.
17:19I do not throw out any rubbish
17:21from my house
17:22and from wherever that I go.
17:25So if I'm going to eat out,
17:27I'm served with a plastic straw,
17:29I have serviettes,
17:29and I have probably
17:30some other packaging.
17:32I bring a rubbish bag with me,
17:34I just pack it,
17:35I bring it home.
17:36Once a week,
17:37once every two weeks,
17:38I bring it to my factory
17:40where we have our Asher
17:41in operations,
17:42poof,
17:43I make it disappear there
17:44into ash.
17:45Into ash.
17:46So I do this,
17:48even my mother,
17:51who is 84 years old this year.
17:53That behavioural change actually.
17:55Is doing that.
17:56Is doing that.
17:57So once a week,
17:58she will tell me,
17:59I see it once a week,
18:00every week.
18:01Then she will tell me,
18:02okay,
18:02that's the bag of garbage
18:03that you can take with you
18:04for your demonstrations
18:06or for your R&D.
18:07So I just bring it back
18:08and then use it
18:09in our machine
18:10and turn it into,
18:11using the Asher
18:12and turn it into ash,
18:13safely,
18:13environmentally,
18:15friendly,
18:15and also effectively.
18:16So now imagine to me now,
18:1933 million Malaysian
18:21can do the same.
18:24Can you imagine
18:25the power of that
18:26to our drains,
18:29to our river,
18:31to our forest,
18:33to our ocean,
18:34to our tourism spots?
18:36Our personal health as well
18:38as more people
18:39are becoming concerned
18:40about microplastics
18:41in the water,
18:42et cetera.
18:42Imagine that
18:43waste can be made,
18:45disappear,
18:46safely,
18:47effectively,
18:48environmentally friendly,
18:50at source,
18:50or as close as possible,
18:54it can be at source.
18:56And this is a Malaysian technology
18:58that we are talking about.
18:59100% made,
19:01built,
19:01and invented by Malaysian
19:02that can change
19:04the entire spectrum
19:05of the world.
19:06But to change
19:07the whole economics
19:09of waste management
19:09is very difficult.
19:11Exactly.
19:11Because people,
19:13many, many people
19:14have been enriched
19:16by,
19:17made rich from it.
19:19It's also a profit model.
19:20And I'd just like to pick up
19:21on something which Pang
19:22just mentioned,
19:23looking at the behavioural levers,
19:24but connecting it
19:25to the tourism industry,
19:27right?
19:27There is also an opportunity
19:29to turn,
19:29of course,
19:30tourists who are
19:31short-term visitors,
19:32but affecting them
19:33into agents
19:34of long-term change.
19:36Is there anything
19:37particular which is done,
19:38especially at Franjipani,
19:40for example,
19:40that encourages
19:41recycling mindset
19:43and consciousness
19:44around consumption?
19:46Very,
19:46very simple way
19:48is you put out
19:49bins,
19:51plastic,
19:53paper,
19:53bottle,
19:54organic.
19:55Making that distinction,
19:57the organic.
19:58That's right.
19:58So you leave this
20:01all over the property
20:02and it normally
20:05are the Europeans,
20:06a more developed country.
20:07They will actually
20:08put the waste
20:09in the separate bin.
20:10Right.
20:11Yeah.
20:11And then,
20:12of course,
20:12we also have got
20:14activity
20:14on ecology,
20:18on organic farming.
20:20So the guests
20:21are aware
20:22that we are
20:23a sort of
20:24a green resort.
20:25Now,
20:26I've been teaching
20:26this in the hotel industry
20:28and the container
20:31of separation,
20:33you don't need
20:34to buy.
20:36Everybody has
20:37swimming pool,
20:38those who are hotel,
20:39and you've got
20:39always a container
20:40of chlorine.
20:42It's a 20-liter container.
20:44It's a large container.
20:45Reuse it.
20:46Yes.
20:46So you just,
20:48you will label it
20:49paper,
20:50plastic,
20:50metal,
20:51organic.
20:52And it lasts you
20:5320 years
20:53till the way
20:54we started.
20:55Exactly.
20:56Again,
20:56going back to,
20:57you know,
20:57that profit model,
20:58there will be someone
20:58who creates
20:59those special bins,
21:00et cetera,
21:01using other resources.
21:02Yes.
21:02Exactly.
21:02That's what you call
21:03a circular economy.
21:05If you can look
21:06at a circular economy,
21:08as much as you can,
21:10you can't do everything,
21:11that will reduce
21:13a lot of waste.
21:13So you look at the end
21:15in mind first.
21:17Absolutely.
21:18Thank you very much
21:18for the discussion so far
21:19and the insights.
21:20We take a short break now.
21:22Don't go anywhere.
21:22We'll be right back
21:23with Niaga Spotlight.
21:43Welcome back to Niaga Spotlight.
21:47Still with me,
21:48Tamina Kausji.
21:48And today,
21:49of course,
21:49we are discussing
21:50rethinking waste management
21:52for sustainability.
21:54Right.
21:54So going straight back
21:55into the discussion.
21:56Prof. Anthony,
21:57now,
21:57of course,
21:58we were discussing
21:59a little bit
22:00about how current
22:01waste frameworks,
22:02they are just prioritizing
22:03infrastructure
22:04over any kind
22:06of behavioral economics.
22:08Are there any
22:09policy-related instruments,
22:11perhaps subsidies,
22:12etc.,
22:13which could actually
22:14help to shift
22:15this more towards
22:16behavioral?
22:17I think the government
22:19has got privatized
22:21like e-idaman.
22:22They have started
22:23to give incentive
22:24for people
22:25if you put bottles
22:27one side,
22:27plastic one side,
22:29paper one side.
22:30They are doing it.
22:32But that is not enough.
22:34Not enough push
22:36to change the behavior.
22:39Behavior is the most difficult.
22:43When I started the hotel
22:4420 years ago,
22:46when I started waste,
22:48separation,
22:49and composting,
22:51you know,
22:52the staff say
22:53you should not eat
22:54from composting,
22:55composting,
22:58natural fertilizer,
22:59because it's dirty
23:01because they see
23:01the worms
23:03and the maggots
23:04coming out.
23:05Good compost
23:06comes from
23:07a plastic bag.
23:09Or get
23:09artificial chemicals.
23:12So,
23:13they don't understand.
23:15You know,
23:15so knowledge
23:16and education
23:17is key to it.
23:19The most difficult
23:20is behavioral change.
23:21I have to agree
23:22with Prof.
23:24Despite the age gap,
23:27my partner,
23:28Datuk Umarazid,
23:29who is also
23:30the executive chairman
23:31of the company,
23:32for many years,
23:34he has been telling me,
23:35Pang,
23:37you want to change
23:37the behavior
23:38of the human being?
23:40Good luck.
23:41Maybe it's about
23:43financial incentives, right?
23:45South Korea
23:46has a PAYT,
23:48pay-as-you-throw system,
23:49and that happened
23:50to cut household
23:51waste by close
23:52to 30%
23:53under two years.
23:54And Malaysia,
23:55we're spending
23:55over RM2 billion
23:57annually on
23:58waste infrastructure,
23:59but we're still
24:00falling short.
24:01I think it's
24:03more than that,
24:03and that is
24:04for the concessions.
24:05It's not for
24:07infrastructure,
24:07it's more on
24:08paying the service
24:09to the concession
24:10to collect,
24:11relocate,
24:12and hide the waste.
24:14So,
24:14now,
24:14the human
24:17actions
24:20are driven
24:21by two channels,
24:23right?
24:23If I can
24:24simplify it.
24:25Sure.
24:26It's carrot
24:26and stick.
24:28It's either
24:29the carrot
24:29or the stick.
24:30In the case
24:31of Malaysia,
24:33the policy is there,
24:34but there's no carrot
24:35or stick
24:36that actually
24:36activate the policy.
24:38Right.
24:38So,
24:39even like
24:39the
24:40MyHijal
24:43Green
24:44Certificates,
24:44right?
24:45So,
24:46they push
24:47companies,
24:48businesses,
24:49to adopt
24:51technologies
24:51or products
24:52or services
24:52that have
24:53MyHijal
24:54Certificates.
24:54Then,
24:55the clients
24:56that have
24:57this MyHijal
24:58Certificate,
25:00we want to
25:00supply to
25:01some other
25:01businesses.
25:03And with the
25:03intention,
25:04that businesses,
25:04when they subscribe
25:05to that services,
25:06they get some
25:07form of tax
25:08deduction,
25:08tax allowance,
25:09etc.
25:09But that is not
25:10forthcoming.
25:13It's difficult
25:14for businesses
25:15who actually
25:16want to apply
25:17for tax allowance,
25:20tax incentive,
25:20etc.
25:21when they actually
25:21do this.
25:22And of course,
25:23when they apply
25:24and then they
25:25engage a
25:26service provider
25:27that is MyHijal
25:28Certified,
25:29they can't be
25:29cheap.
25:30Because for them
25:31to do anything
25:32better,
25:33more effective,
25:34more green,
25:34it's got to be
25:35more expensive.
25:36It is impossible
25:37that it is
25:39cheaper.
25:40So when they
25:41do this,
25:42they spend
25:43more trying
25:44to be more
25:45responsible
25:45towards the
25:46environment.
25:47Then with
25:48the expectation,
25:49the government
25:50is going to
25:50give me some
25:50form of
25:51subsidies or
25:51incentive,
25:52etc.
25:53But no,
25:53it's not
25:54coming.
25:55So there are
25:56ways that it's
25:56being not...
25:57Then there's
25:58that corporate
25:58exhaustion cycle
25:59and you lose
26:00the opportunity
26:01to convert.
26:03Then the
26:03business eventually
26:04they just feel
26:05this is too
26:05much work.
26:06let's just
26:07do the
26:09most effective
26:11and efficient
26:11way,
26:12but probably
26:13not the
26:13right way.
26:15Interesting,
26:15interesting insights
26:16indeed.
26:16Because actually,
26:17again,
26:18going back
26:18into the
26:19fact that
26:19there's few
26:21structural
26:23things which
26:24actually reward
26:25waste reduction
26:26by design.
26:28So that,
26:28of course,
26:29then just means
26:29that basically
26:30it's alright
26:31to produce as
26:32much waste
26:32as you are.
26:33it's part
26:34of this
26:34industry,
26:35whichever one
26:35that you're
26:36in,
26:36consumerism,
26:37consumers,
26:38or is it
26:38hospitality,
26:40but just
26:40recycle it.
26:41But that
26:41doesn't also
26:42happen.
26:43So,
26:43Pang,
26:43tell me about
26:44when it
26:45comes to
26:45your work
26:46with the
26:46Asher,
26:47have you
26:47observed
26:48anything
26:49interesting
26:50about informal
26:51waste
26:51economies,
26:52scavenging
26:53or community
26:54led
26:54recycling?
26:56In my
26:58opinion,
26:59this,
26:59Kevin,
27:00it's very
27:02sad to
27:03look at
27:03the current
27:05waste
27:05practice
27:07business,
27:08operationally,
27:09formally,
27:10or informally.
27:11I have
27:12witnessed myself
27:12formal
27:13operations,
27:14formal
27:14operations,
27:16a waste
27:17collecting
27:17company,
27:18I will not
27:19mention the
27:20name,
27:21waste
27:21collector,
27:22hired
27:22these
27:24are not
27:24locals,
27:25these are
27:25foreign
27:26workers.
27:28So,
27:28they ride
27:29on the
27:29dump truck,
27:30I'm sure
27:31you have
27:31seen this,
27:31instead of
27:32sitting in
27:32the vehicles,
27:33they are
27:33riding at
27:34the back
27:34of the
27:34dump
27:34trucks,
27:35hanging on
27:36it,
27:36and then
27:36on the
27:36road,
27:37with the
27:37smell
27:38coming from
27:39the dump
27:39truck,
27:40and then
27:40when they
27:40arrive at
27:41the refuse
27:41area where
27:42they collect
27:42the garbage,
27:44and this
27:44is like a
27:45low-cost
27:45housing area,
27:47so the
27:47bins are
27:48not properly
27:48maintained,
27:49the refuse
27:49rooms are
27:50not properly
27:50maintained,
27:51and the
27:51residents do
27:52not discard
27:53their waste
27:53properly,
27:55they just
27:55chuck,
27:56and in fact
27:57some of
27:57them just
27:57throw it
27:58from the
27:58top floor
27:58and just
27:59boom,
27:59drop it
28:00there,
28:00and then,
28:00so,
28:01and this
28:01collection
28:02happens
28:02maybe,
28:03in the
28:04pants,
28:04probably like
28:05twice a
28:06week,
28:06so the
28:07garbage
28:07that's
28:07accumulated
28:08there,
28:09is probably
28:10two or
28:10three days,
28:11it has
28:11manifested,
28:12you have
28:12wastewater,
28:13you have
28:13smell,
28:13you have
28:13vermins,
28:14you have
28:14all sort
28:15maggots or
28:16all sort
28:18of species
28:18of that,
28:19it's
28:19smelly,
28:20I observe
28:21this
28:22operation,
28:2315 meters
28:24away,
28:25I can't
28:26stand the
28:26stench,
28:28this
28:28fellers,
28:29I was
28:29supposed to
28:30collect the
28:30garbage and
28:31put onto
28:32the dump
28:32truck,
28:33and it's
28:33a compactor,
28:34so it's a
28:35hydraulic
28:36collection machine,
28:37but the
28:37machine cannot
28:38work because
28:39the garbage
28:39is not in
28:40the bins,
28:41it's all
28:42over the
28:43floor,
28:43wet,
28:44so it
28:44has to
28:44be of
28:45course
28:45physically
28:45then
28:46transferred
28:46into the
28:47bin by
28:48the migrant
28:49workers,
28:49I want you
28:50to guess
28:50what kind
28:50of technology
28:51that they
28:51use to
28:52transfer the
28:52garbage from
28:53the pile of
28:54garbage on
28:54the floor,
28:55smelly with
28:56all this
28:56wastewater into
28:58the dump
28:58truck,
28:58I want you
29:00to give
29:00it a guess,
29:01what kind
29:02of technology
29:02that they
29:03use to
29:04do that,
29:04I'm going
29:04to say
29:04it's buckets
29:05and manual,
29:06that's very
29:06advanced,
29:07that is
29:08very advanced,
29:09you know what
29:10they did,
29:11they lay
29:11a sarong,
29:12on the
29:14floor and
29:15then push
29:16the garbage
29:16onto the
29:17sarong and
29:18they clip
29:19all corners
29:21of the
29:21sarong and
29:22flip it
29:22into the
29:23blocks,
29:23just imagining
29:27the disease
29:29vectors,
29:29etc.,
29:30not only for
29:31themselves but
29:31the surrounding
29:32area too.
29:33Going back to
29:34the scavengers,
29:35how many
29:35scavengers
29:35have actually
29:36died at
29:38dump sites
29:39of landfill
29:39because of
29:40arsons or
29:41because of
29:42some risk
29:44of infectious
29:45and also
29:47some collapse
29:48bury them
29:51at the
29:51landfill
29:52and only
29:52people find
29:53out months
29:54later that
29:54this guy
29:54actually is
29:55buried there
29:56and what
29:56kind of
29:56value
29:57can they
29:58extract from
29:58that
29:59scavenging?
30:00A couple
30:00of cans,
30:01a couple
30:01of plastics
30:01which last
30:02them what?
30:03So there's
30:04no dignity,
30:05there's no
30:06value in
30:07doing that
30:08job.
30:09See,
30:11the best
30:11way,
30:11like I
30:12said,
30:12the best
30:13way if
30:13you want
30:14to have
30:16a really
30:17effective
30:17social
30:18economic
30:18impact
30:19when it
30:20comes to
30:20waste
30:20management
30:21is taking
30:22the approach
30:23of treatment
30:24at source
30:24because when
30:26we treat
30:26waste at
30:27source,
30:28the whole
30:29operations
30:29become so
30:30simple,
30:31become so
30:32easy and
30:35so clean.
30:36So if
30:36anyone that
30:37is going to
30:38be working
30:38there,
30:39trying to
30:40manage the
30:41machine to
30:41treat waste
30:42at source
30:43coming from
30:44400 units
30:45of homes,
30:46apartments or
30:46300 units
30:48of double
30:49storey homes
30:49in a
30:50site,
30:51that person
30:52is going to
30:53be working
30:53in a clean
30:54and safe
30:55environment
30:55with dignity
30:58and if I'm
30:59the son of
31:00the person
31:00that's working
31:01that machine,
31:02I can easily
31:03tell my
31:04friends,
31:04my father
31:05is a hero
31:05that had
31:06helped waste
31:07go disappear
31:08at source
31:09for that
31:09taman,
31:10for that
31:11condominium.
31:12That's right,
31:12exactly.
31:13I think
31:13there's a lot
31:15to unpack
31:16in what you
31:16shared but
31:17I also do
31:17remember
31:18distinctly,
31:19some time
31:19ago I
31:20happened to
31:20be on a
31:22study tour
31:22in Estonia
31:23in the
31:24capital
31:24Tallinn,
31:25observing,
31:26just walking
31:26around how
31:27waste management
31:28was exactly
31:28what you said,
31:29primarily
31:30treating at
31:30source but
31:31also it
31:32was actually
31:32qualified
31:33hygiene and
31:35biology
31:35engineers in
31:36charge of
31:37the waste
31:37management.
31:38absolutely
31:39no surface
31:40level or
31:41air contamination,
31:42everything is
31:43a closed
31:43system.
31:44Fantastic,
31:45thanks for
31:46sharing that.
31:46Prof. Anthony,
31:47I'd like to
31:47expand that
31:48lens and
31:49ask you
31:50about how
31:51can we
31:51actually then
31:52integrate
31:52local
31:53communities
31:54into being
31:55economic
31:56stakeholders in
31:57the waste
31:57value chain.
31:59Any ideas
31:59around that?
32:00What models
32:01could Malaysia
32:02perhaps adopt
32:03to empower
32:04community-based
32:05waste economies?
32:06It takes
32:08leadership
32:09in that
32:10community
32:11to do
32:11things.
32:13You need
32:13a little
32:14community
32:14and that
32:16once you
32:17have that
32:18leadership
32:18to move
32:19you can
32:21do
32:21things.
32:22This is
32:23the thing
32:24is a lot
32:24of Malaysian
32:25they are
32:26not willing
32:27to go
32:29the extra
32:29mile
32:29normally.
32:31So
32:32you need
32:33to gather
32:33people around
32:34and
32:36the government
32:38has to
32:39give
32:39incentive
32:40and they
32:43have to
32:43use
32:43enforcement
32:44use a
32:45stick.
32:45You've
32:45got to
32:45have
32:46this
32:46both.
32:47A good
32:48balance
32:48of both.
32:49That's right.
32:50Like now
32:51in regards
32:52to
32:52inorganic
32:54waste
32:54I've been
32:55doing this
32:56many years
32:57I want
32:57to develop
32:58a community
32:59of artists
32:59we call
33:01waste
33:02to art.
33:02So every
33:03year
33:04I allocate
33:0512,000
33:05ringgit
33:06but I
33:07used to
33:08do it
33:08for adult
33:09but now
33:10I only
33:10do it
33:10for school
33:11so waste
33:12could be
33:12turned
33:13to art
33:13and then
33:14hopefully
33:15a small
33:16group
33:17of young
33:18entrepreneur
33:19can develop
33:20it
33:21and
33:21the hotels
33:23can sell
33:23it in
33:24their
33:24showcase
33:25and they
33:26can give
33:27awards
33:27school
33:28can give
33:28awards
33:28from
33:29recycled
33:29art.
33:30So you
33:31can be
33:32more
33:32creative
33:33to get
33:34rid of
33:34waste
33:35and people
33:35pay to
33:36take it
33:36away.
33:37But you
33:38need to
33:38create that
33:39community.
33:41Perhaps
33:41even
33:42localising
33:43waste
33:44credits
33:44there are
33:45various
33:46models
33:46around the
33:46world
33:47that have
33:47worked
33:47in
33:47pockets.
33:48You
33:48need to
33:49have
33:49accommodation
33:49of
33:50everything.
33:52So
33:52then
33:53you
33:55have to
33:55engage
33:55the local
33:56authority
33:56and this
33:57is where
33:58the challenge
33:58come in.
33:59you have
34:00a lot
34:00of
34:00volunteers
34:00who
34:01are
34:01willing
34:01to
34:01do
34:01this.
34:02But to
34:03get
34:03the
34:03local
34:03authority
34:04involved
34:04like
34:06there's
34:07one
34:07community
34:07NGO
34:08called
34:09Trash
34:10Hero.
34:11It
34:11started
34:11from
34:12Phuket
34:12and
34:13it
34:13moved
34:13to
34:13Langkawi
34:14and
34:15now
34:15there
34:15are
34:16about
34:1617
34:16or
34:1722
34:17groups
34:18all
34:18in
34:19Bali
34:19or
34:19you
34:21know
34:21that
34:21on
34:23weekend
34:23half
34:23a day
34:24you
34:24know
34:24they
34:25collect
34:25waste
34:26but
34:27the
34:27local
34:27kampung
34:28people
34:29ini
34:29orang
34:30bodoh
34:30these
34:30are
34:30stupid
34:31people
34:31collecting
34:32rubbish
34:32you
34:33know
34:33so
34:34this
34:34is
34:35the
34:35mentality
34:35change
34:36so
34:37I
34:38believe
34:39it is a
34:41combination
34:41of
34:41local
34:42government
34:43NGO
34:44partnership
34:44has to
34:45take place
34:46in that
34:47local
34:47community
34:48or it
34:48cannot
34:49work
34:49or else
34:50the
34:50government
34:51will even
34:51say
34:51why are you
34:52doing
34:52this
34:52who
34:53allow you
34:53to
34:54do
34:54collection
34:55have you
34:55got a
34:56license
34:56to do
34:56collection
34:57sometimes
34:57it will
34:57come back
34:58to you
34:58and
34:59to collect
35:00waste
35:00you actually
35:00need a
35:01license
35:01perhaps
35:02it needs
35:02to be
35:03one certain
35:04adun
35:04in Malaysia
35:06that can
35:06maybe
35:06license
35:07a community
35:08waste
35:09recycling
35:10or reduction
35:10initiative
35:11we have
35:12to protect
35:13the
35:13concessions
35:14exactly
35:15so when
35:15you can't
35:16negotiate
35:16on that
35:17you're
35:18unable
35:18to
35:18actually
35:19reduce
35:19waste
35:19from
35:21there
35:21Pang
35:22I want
35:22to go
35:22into
35:22looking
35:23at
35:23waste
35:24colonialism
35:24as we
35:25go out
35:26the
35:26conversation
35:27where of
35:28course
35:28we've
35:28had
35:29a couple
35:29of
35:29incidents
35:30that were
35:30highlighted
35:31in the
35:31media
35:31richer
35:32nations
35:32offloading
35:33their
35:33recyclables
35:34into
35:34countries
35:35like
35:35Malaysia
35:35so from
35:36an
35:36economic
35:37sovereignty
35:38standpoint
35:39let's
35:39look at
35:39how
35:40Malaysia
35:40could
35:41be
35:41combating
35:42this
35:43would it
35:43be via
35:44perhaps
35:44pricing
35:45mechanisms
35:45or how
35:46do we
35:46also
35:46decline
35:47this
35:48completely
35:49with no
35:50room
35:50open
35:51for
35:51it
35:52coming
35:52in
35:52sometime
35:53in
35:53the
35:53future
35:53or
35:54at
35:54a
35:54reduced
35:54amount
35:56I
35:59would
35:59not
35:59decline
36:00it
36:00ASEAN
36:02Chairman
36:03Okay
36:04alright
36:04let's
36:04zone
36:05in on
36:05that
36:06imagine
36:07you are
36:08PMX
36:09I am
36:10the
36:10Premier
36:10of
36:11Vietnam
36:13alright
36:14you say
36:16to me
36:16you have
36:17waste
36:18problem
36:18in
36:18Vietnam
36:18Malaysia
36:20can
36:20help
36:21you
36:21send
36:22it
36:22to
36:22Malaysia
36:23Canada
36:24you
36:25got
36:25plastic
36:25problem
36:26no
36:27problem
36:28Malaysia
36:28can
36:28help
36:28you
36:29imagine
36:29PMX
36:30in front
36:31of
36:31United
36:31Nations
36:32telling
36:32the
36:32entire
36:33premiums
36:33the
36:33whole
36:34world
36:34the
36:34premiums
36:35of
36:35the
36:35world
36:35you
36:36have
36:36waste
36:36problem
36:37come
36:37to
36:37Malaysia
36:37we
36:38can
36:38help
36:39you
36:39solve
36:39it
36:39because
36:40in
36:40Malaysia
36:40we
36:41have
36:41a
36:41technology
36:41that
36:42can
36:42make
36:43waste
36:43disappear
36:44safely
36:44effectively
36:45environmentally
36:46friendly
36:46coming back
36:49to the
36:50earlier
36:50question
36:51you
36:51said
36:51about
36:52waste
36:53management
36:55and you
36:56call it
36:57waste
36:58colonization
36:58it's
37:00again the
37:02same thing
37:02it's relocate
37:03relocate
37:04and hide
37:05until you
37:06run out
37:07of
37:07places
37:07to
37:07hide
37:08so
37:08now
37:08you
37:09try
37:10to
37:10hide
37:10it
37:10in
37:10Malaysia
37:12but
37:13you
37:13got
37:13out
37:14of
37:14hand
37:14and
37:14boom
37:15it
37:16becomes
37:16another
37:16big
37:17story
37:17for
37:17around
37:18the
37:18world
37:18and
37:18China
37:18came
37:19into
37:19play
37:19and
37:19they
37:20still
37:20banning
37:20it
37:21is
37:21not
37:22less
37:27than
37:2740
37:28billion
37:29USD
37:29business
37:30so
37:33from
37:33a
37:33conic
37:33standpoint
37:34if we
37:35homegrown
37:37technology
37:38in
37:39Malaysia
37:39can
37:40take
37:41a
37:41chunk
37:41of
37:41this
37:42that
37:42means
37:43revenue
37:43for the
37:44country
37:44for the
37:45nation
37:45it means
37:46job
37:47creation
37:47for the
37:48country
37:48we can
37:49solve
37:49the
37:49world's
37:50problem
37:50and
37:51we are
37:51the only
37:52business
37:52I say
37:53this
37:53in terms
37:54of
37:54business
37:55we are
37:55the only
37:55business
37:56business
37:56model
37:57wise
37:57business
37:58we are
37:58the only
37:59business
37:59my
37:59company
38:00we are
38:00the only
38:00business
38:01I can
38:01say
38:01this
38:01we are
38:02the only
38:02business
38:02where
38:03when we
38:04produce
38:05more
38:05when we
38:05sell
38:06more
38:06when we
38:06deploy
38:07more
38:07the better
38:08the world
38:09is
38:09no other
38:10business
38:11can say
38:11that
38:11the only
38:12way I can
38:12see that
38:13working
38:13is if
38:13it's
38:14for sure
38:14that every
38:15bit of
38:16waste
38:16which lands
38:17on
38:17Malaysia
38:17from
38:18overseas
38:18actually
38:19ends up
38:20disappeared
38:20great point
38:22I can't argue
38:23with that
38:24Prof Anthony
38:24let's talk
38:26about corporate
38:27greenwashing
38:27for a tick
38:28now this
38:29of course
38:30presents a
38:30huge challenge
38:31regulatory
38:32credibility
38:33what more
38:34needs to be
38:34done
38:34from your
38:34perspective
38:35to bring
38:36it up
38:36to scale
38:37with on
38:37ground
38:37realities
38:38today
38:38well
38:40the only
38:42way you
38:42can do
38:43it
38:43is
38:43certification
38:44yeah
38:45people can
38:46say
38:47they are
38:47green
38:48but how
38:49do you
38:49quantify
38:50yeah
38:52define
38:52there are
38:53also
38:53many
38:53certification
38:54company
38:55yeah
38:56many
38:57many
38:57200
38:58green
39:00certification
39:01company
39:01globally
39:02but what
39:03we need
39:04to do
39:04is
39:04education
39:05why
39:06you have
39:08to educate
39:08them
39:09you can
39:09you can
39:11have ways
39:12to reduce
39:12your waste
39:13yeah
39:14how to
39:15save energy
39:16how to
39:16save water
39:17how to
39:17save your
39:19organic waste
39:20how to
39:20recycle
39:21stuff
39:21so I
39:22think
39:22showing
39:23people
39:24the how
39:24is better
39:26than
39:26just
39:27certification
39:28all this
39:29certification
39:30don't tell
39:30you how
39:31don't give
39:32you the
39:32solution
39:32just checking
39:34the box
39:35so we
39:36at
39:37hotel owner
39:38association
39:38I developed
39:39this system
39:40we have
39:40close to
39:41250 ways
39:42to save
39:42so all
39:43this
39:43certification
39:44company
39:44I can
39:45show you
39:45how to
39:46save
39:46how do
39:46you get
39:47certified
39:47you kind
39:49of tell
39:49me
39:49if you
39:50tell me
39:51energy
39:52water
39:52waste
39:53guideline
39:54I can
39:55go to
39:55check
39:56GBT
39:56or
39:57deep
39:57they
39:57can
39:57give
39:58me
39:58all
39:58the
39:58guidelines
39:59pretty
40:00much
40:00yeah
40:00so I
40:01believe
40:02we
40:02go
40:03for
40:04certification
40:04but
40:05you
40:06must
40:06give
40:06them
40:06solution
40:07and
40:08then
40:09the
40:09first
40:09step
40:09is
40:10give
40:11them
40:11all
40:11the
40:11300
40:12ways
40:13or
40:13so
40:13then
40:14up
40:14to
40:14them
40:14to
40:15decide
40:15self
40:16certification
40:17that
40:18means
40:18they
40:18can
40:18show
40:19you
40:19your
40:19water
40:20bill
40:20your
40:20rubbish
40:21bill
40:21your
40:22energy
40:23bill
40:24say
40:24now
40:26six
40:27months
40:27time
40:27you
40:27show
40:28me
40:28your
40:28bill
40:28again
40:28show
40:30me
40:30your
40:30weight
40:31comparison
40:32side by side
40:32compare
40:33six months
40:35back
40:35then
40:35then you
40:36can
40:36show
40:36one
40:36year
40:36so
40:37this
40:38could
40:38be
40:38a
40:38way
40:39of
40:39getting
40:39people
40:40to
40:40move
40:40it
40:40and
40:41then
40:41they
40:41get
40:41incentive
40:42yeah
40:43so I
40:44believe
40:44learning
40:46is like
40:47learning
40:47how to
40:48do it
40:48because
40:49they
40:49want
40:49to
40:49go
40:50green
40:50but
40:50they
40:50don't
40:50know
40:50how
40:51and
40:51they
40:51think
40:51it's
40:52expensive
40:52exactly
40:53so
40:54Prof. Anthony
40:55as well
40:55as Pang
40:56thank you so
40:56much for
40:56the insightful
40:57discussion
40:57today
40:58I think
40:58it's
40:59quite
40:59clear
40:59that
40:59treating
41:00waste
41:00the
41:00source
41:00is
41:01not
41:01merely
41:01an
41:02environmental
41:02necessity
41:03but
41:03that's
41:04actually
41:04the
41:04way
41:04we
41:05make
41:05a
41:05dent
41:06in
41:06the
41:06waste
41:07scenario
41:08that
41:08we
41:08have
41:08well
41:09that's
41:09all
41:09we
41:10have
41:10time
41:10today
41:10for
41:11on
41:11Niaga
41:11Spotlight
41:12with
41:12me
41:12Tamina
41:12Kausji
41:13we look
41:14forward
41:14to
41:14sharing
41:15more
41:15economic
41:15analysis
41:16and
41:16insights
41:16next
41:17week
41:17here's
41:18to
41:18a
41:18productive
41:18week
41:19ahead
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